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sapphiregirl
09-12-2008, 01:18 PM
I agree with you on parental abdication vs parental involvement.

I disagree with the entire premise of Hillary's bullshit book " IT TAKES A VILLAGE" because decades of governmental involvement /interference in child rearing and education have directly led to disaster

I fault teacher's unions and education professionals for the lousy state of our public schools.



You blame teachers for what? Would you do what they do for their pay?


uggggggggg.....mini rant......we pay athletes millions of dollars to hit a baseball and teachers nothing but they still do it.


The United States is becoming so warped in their thinking. Even other countries are passing us on social progress. With all the complex problems and issues in our world, people need to stop being so narrow minded and start thinking outisde the box.


.......ok.....mini rant over....:soapbox:

Eric Stoner
09-12-2008, 01:41 PM
Its very popular ES to blame the teachers for the problems in education today. We are an easy target and to be honest I don't particularly care much for the people I work with but the real problem lies with the politicians, school boards, and administrators.

I just want to go in every day and teach some math to kids who can handle it. Instead I am pretending to teach Alg II and Pre-cal to students who don't even known their multiplication tables so it looks good for the papers. Every June, I face the same dilemma: passing kids who don't deserve credit or failing kids ( and delaying their graduation by a year) in a class they had no business taking and never wanted in the first place. It's a no-win situation for the students and for me. That problem is caused by politicians, scool boards, and administrators and its not fair to the students. By the time the students find out they're fucked, they're no longer the school district's problem. It sucks but it's all a political show, just like these campaigns we're watching.

I did NOT blame TEACHERS. Many individual teachers care as much as you obviously do and can and would do a fine job in a better environment. I blamed the NEA; teacher's unions and so-called Schools of Education.

bem401
09-12-2008, 01:48 PM
I did NOT blame TEACHERS. Many individual teachers care as much as you obviously do and can and would do a fine job in a better environment. I blamed the NEA; teacher's unions and so-called Schools of Education.

In my district my union has lost all its clout since I began teaching in '90.

The administrators, politicians, and school boards have become more powerful.

We get weaker and weaker every year and the student achievement decreases year after year after year. Each year a new program is thrust upon us ( proof that change, change, change is not necessarily a good thing) and it just gets more and more ridiculous.

For example, when we pointed out to the administration how bad the pre-cal students were, their solution was to expand calculus classes the next year. WTF?

Eric Stoner
09-12-2008, 01:51 PM
You blame teachers for what? Would you do what they do for their pay?


uggggggggg.....mini rant......we pay athletes millions of dollars to hit a baseball and teachers nothing but they still do it.


The United States is becoming so warped in their thinking. Even other countries are passing us on social progress. With all the complex problems and issues in our world, people need to stop being so narrow minded and start thinking outisde the box.


.......ok.....mini rant over....:soapbox:

I'm very sorry but many teachers in very poorly performing school districts are fairly well paid. Washington D.C. spends the most per pupil and has the worst student performance.

Catholic schools do a much better job with far less money and their teachers are usually paid about half what their public school counterparts get.

The problems are many but ONE biggie is that most middle and high school teachers are NOT masters in their fields. They "teach" history without knowing it; English while being poor spellers with lousy grammar etc.etc.

The teacher's unions have made it impossible to fire incompetent teachers.

The Education programs at many universities have become a joke where academic merit has been supplanted by political indoctrination.

Successful programs like charter schools; vouchers and KIPP are fought against by the teachers and their political toadies. Proven failures like Bi-lingual Ed. are continued and proven alternatives like English As A Second Language or English Immersion are kicked to the curb.

Most principals are powerless to do little more than arrange the lunch room schedules.

Eric Stoner
09-12-2008, 01:54 PM
In my district my union has lost all its clout since I began teaching in '90.

The administrators, politicians, and school boards have become more powerful.

We get weaker and weaker every year and the student achievement decreases year after year after year. Each year a new program is thrust upon us ( proof that change, change, change is not necessarily a good thing) and it just gets more and more ridiculous.

For example, when we pointed out to the administration how bad the pre-cal students were, their solution was to expand calculus classes the next year. WTF?

There is plenty of room to include the administrators and most school boards are nothing but cesspools of corruption and patronage.

Optimist
09-12-2008, 08:32 PM
In the optimal case, it doesn't take a village, it takes a family. Unfortunately, the optimal cases are becoming increasingly rare. "It takes a village" is just another way of saying we need big government to provide for us and people needn't be responsible for the consequences of their actions.

Sorry bem, not so good at reading my mind. Sometimes a village is a village.

In the optimal case it does take a village because children need many views from many people to be well cared for, well socialized, and well educated. My two parents could tell me about their specific experiences but the village has experiences of many people communicated in many ways. There are things a child simply may not have in common with their parents but have it in common with others.

We live in the real world not Utopia. As you know parents have mental and physical illnesses, substance abuse issues, and emotional issue that prevent them from being capable parents. Should those children be raised by wolves or the village?


First off, its not a "tradition". That would mean it is what everyone does or aspires to do.

Traditions are beliefs or customs taught by one generation to the next. Worldwide people are taught to take in extended family, neighbors etc.


While it is a beautiful thing that many people (of whatever sexual orientation) are willing and able to raise children needing a home, let's not fool ourselves that its a good thing that kids find themselves in this situation in the first place. Such situations generally arise out of tragedies ( death of parents ) or parental irresponsibility (parents drug-addicted or in jail ) or indifference ( parents just don't want the responsibilty of being parents ). That doesn't diminish the kindness of those willing to provide a home.

Any person or persons, straight or gay, willing to make the sacrifices necessary to raise a child, particularly a child that is not biologically their's should be praised for their unselfishness.

Who's fooling themself?