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CuriousSeeker
09-15-2008, 10:37 PM
He heard me out in full, said I'm fine to work still (though he recommends EXTREME caution- said another club was raided this weekend and they may hit us more yet)

This frustrates me because it sounds like you were using extreme caution on the night of the bust.

MysteriousMisty
09-15-2008, 11:16 PM
Hugs to you. I'm so sorry that happened to you. Cops are VERY dirty and are notorious to make trumped up charges against clean girls. Instead of going after those who are truly guilty of hurting others such as rapists, car thieves, etc. Its easier for them to hang out in strip clubs to go after girls regardless of the fact that most of us have bills to pay and little ones to support. Definately fight this thing. In Vegas, your sc is revoked once you're arrested in a club. A lot of people are under the false impression that if you ask an undercover whether or not he's a cop, he has to tell you. Unfortunately they don't have to tell you a thing. A couple of girls were arrested at one club on their first night while they were in VIP simply for saying yes when asked out to lunch or dinner. It's considered prostitution to see a customer away from the club whether you intend to have sex or not. At another club, two girls were arrested for soliciting and for all anyone knows, they probably weren't really prostitutes. They were probably just the type to say what they think a customer wants to hear. In CA, a girl was arrested for prostitution simply for giving a customer a kiss on the cheek for tipping her!!!! I don't know what became of her case but she said that when she was at the station, one of the cops asked "So are you gonna dance anymore?" She quit shortly after being arrested.

Otoki
09-16-2008, 12:11 PM
Thanks so much to everyone who's commented here and/or sent me PM's about this- your support encourages me SO much! A million thanks :}

Updates... Last week I contacted some attorneys, have talked to two and one I feel good about. He quoted me $1500, or $1000 if we 3 girls all use him; in any case I feel like I could talk him down a bit more. I also finally talked to my bf about it (he'd been out of town with a broken cell) and he's utterly floored by the situation, but also totally supportive and willing to help me any way he can- he'll prolly be up here tomorrow. Ditto my local grandmother, but I lied to her about how I got the charge (she doesn't know I dance), so I prolly won't want to involve her any further.

I also reconnected with girl B from the raid and we'll keep in touch, but Girl A's number wasn't valid- I don't know if that was intentional or if the guard just wrote her number down wrong. Hopefully it was just a mistake and I can get a valid number for her from my club. Also spoke to txchick, who was really sympathetic (thanks girl!), and we brainstormed about other dancing options since both of us are wary of Men's now.

Finally, spoke to Men's owner on the phone and he was very supportive, YAY! He heard me out in full, said I'm fine to work still (though he recommends EXTREME caution- said another club was raided this weekend and they may hit us more yet), and he said they're shopping attorneys for us. That surprised me b/c I figured they'd already have one, but he said no not for this- said they've never had a pros charge before in there (dunno if I believe that but w/e). Still looking for one of my own in case we all don't see eye to eye.

And just a funny aside- my roommate's bf is a Dallas cop (who had no idea this was coming, she dances too), and it turns out he's friends with one of the cops that transported me to jail. harhar
I'd be very wary of the lawyer the club hires. Also, I don't know how good an idea it would be to have the same lawyer as the other two girls, since they have different charges than you do. Anyone able to weigh in on this issue?

Melonie
09-16-2008, 04:40 PM
I'd be very wary of the lawyer the club hires

yup ... keep in mind who would be paying the bulk of this lawyer's fee. I have heard of a lot of instances where a lawyer paid by the club has worked behind the scenes to trade dancer plea bargains in exchange for LE attention on the clubowner being dropped !


I don't know how good an idea it would be to have the same lawyer as the other two girls, since they have different charges than you do

it probably can't hurt at the local yokel trial level ... but it will definitely hurt if things have to be pushed to the appellate level and all three girls don't agree to pay for an appeal.


Also this is one of the few occasions when I personally KNOW of a local attorney with a successful record with exactly these sort of charges ( see previous post ), since he handled similar cases for a couple of feature dancers I have worked with in the past.

Otoki
09-18-2008, 11:44 AM
yup ... keep in mind who would be paying the bulk of this lawyer's fee. I have heard of a lot of instances where a lawyer paid by the club has worked behind the scenes to trade dancer plea bargains in exchange for LE attention on the clubowner being dropped !



it probably can't hurt at the local yokel trial level ... but it will definitely hurt if things have to be pushed to the appellate level and all three girls don't agree to pay for an appeal.


Also this is one of the few occasions when I personally KNOW of a local attorney with a successful record with exactly these sort of charges ( see previous post ), since he handled similar cases for a couple of feature dancers I have worked with in the past.
Thanks for your response. I'm waiting for an update with bated breath.

CuriousSeeker
09-18-2008, 08:02 PM
Also this is one of the few occasions when I personally KNOW of a local attorney with a successful record with exactly these sort of charges ( see previous post ), since he handled similar cases for a couple of feature dancers I have worked with in the past.

Is it possible to start a sticky with the names of lawyers (arranged by state) whom dancers can personally recommend? It's important to get a lawyer with experience in these issues; even lawyers with a general crim background may not be the ideal candidate for this type of situation.

phairestofthemall
09-20-2008, 09:05 PM
Melonie, can you please tell me who exactly to ask for at the firm you recommended?

In other news, my bf came up and we revisited the lawyer I liked, and went back to my club for the first time to provide them with the paperwork I'd accumulated from my arrest. Both went really well, and at the club the owner's right hand man was in and we had a lengthy positive convo. My fav housemom was also in so I spoke to her too- she was aghast I'd been taken, but glad to have real info to pass around in leiu of the rampant rumors that've been swirling since.

I was really worried about how I'd feel going back to the club- expected to be uncomfy and maybe catch some flack. But everyone was just golden... b/c of that, I'm glad that if this had to happen somewhere, it happened there. And, I've been on the fence about what to do for work now- whether I should switch clubs or ditch DFW and/or dancing altogether or what. Txchick has given me a good non-dancing option I'll surely follow up on, but as far as dancing goes... Right now I'm thinkin this was just a shitty fluke, and Men's is/has been great, and Dallas is the devil I know, so I may well try to return this week. Fingers crossed for me please.

Otoki
09-22-2008, 11:31 AM
Melonie, can you please tell me who exactly to ask for at the firm you recommended?

In other news, my bf came up and we revisited the lawyer I liked, and went back to my club for the first time to provide them with the paperwork I'd accumulated from my arrest. Both went really well, and at the club the owner's right hand man was in and we had a lengthy positive convo. My fav housemom was also in so I spoke to her too- she was aghast I'd been taken, but glad to have real info to pass around in leiu of the rampant rumors that've been swirling since.

I was really worried about how I'd feel going back to the club- expected to be uncomfy and maybe catch some flack. But everyone was just golden... b/c of that, I'm glad that if this had to happen somewhere, it happened there. And, I've been on the fence about what to do for work now- whether I should switch clubs or ditch DFW and/or dancing altogether or what. Txchick has given me a good non-dancing option I'll surely follow up on, but as far as dancing goes... Right now I'm thinkin this was just a shitty fluke, and Men's is/has been great, and Dallas is the devil I know, so I may well try to return this week. Fingers crossed for me please.
Good luck! I hope all goes well. Keep us posted.

420bUnNy
09-23-2008, 02:10 AM
E. If you decide to go to trial and are found guilty, there is then the option of filing an appeal. At the appellate level, there isn't any jury of angry housewives or bible thumping retirees involved, just a panel of judges who will look at the transcript of the previous local trial and make a decision based on the LAW and FACTS not personal impressions. At this point, unless the cop has actual HARD EVIDENCE against you (like a video tape of his own), odds are that the charges will be dismissed. However, to file an appeal usually requires at least several thousand dollars in legal fees, and the club is NOT going to help in financing an appeal.

~
Appellate level doesn't re-examine the facts of a case. The panel of judges only has the power to determine whether the lower court properly applied the law. An appeal -- all defendants found guilty are entitled to at least one -- shouldn't cost you anything if you're using a court-appointed lawyer. Big but: You get what you pay for.

Otoki
09-23-2008, 10:29 PM
Appellate level doesn't re-examine the facts of a case. The panel of judges only has the power to determine whether the lower court properly applied the law. An appeal -- all defendants found guilty are entitled to at least one -- shouldn't cost you anything if you're using a court-appointed lawyer. Big but: You get what you pay for.
To an extent. I agree that you shouldn't get the cheapest lawyer, but just because they cost money doesn't mean they'll be good for this specific case. DEFINITELY do your research on their specialty.

Thanks for clearing up the confusion over appellate court.

Oksana23
09-24-2008, 12:27 PM
"Public Lewdness"?? isn't inside a club private property since it's owned by someone, and you have to pay to enter?

phairestofthemall
09-25-2008, 03:10 AM
I don't get it either Oksana :/

Anyway, I tried to go back to work on Monday but chickened out. Tonight I made it in though, and it was so-so. I forgot my shoes, but luckily the nice boutique girl let me borrow hers so I wouldn't have to shell out for new overpriced ones. Still, it meant I was kinda wobbly all night in a-bit-too-small shoes, and on top of that I just felt stiff and awkward from being away since the incident. Mentally I wasn't all there either- I felt like I had ADD or something b/c keeping focus and convo's going was difficult, and when one guy asked me about VIP I just froze up with paranoia and promptly ran off, and a couple times I was so preoccupied I intro'd myself by my real name lol. And then my fav belt broke too. >.<

I think it's ironic that I recently said here that dancing helps me when I'm having a hard time b/c it provided a lil mental escape. In this case though, since my prob is b/c of dancing, that doesn't apply lol. But, on the bright side, everyone was nice and very glad to see me back. And the money wasn't great by my usual standards, but I wasn't the worst off, and considering everything I'm OK with it. And obviously I made it home safely, which I don't take for granted anymore. Looking forward to moving on & gettin my groove back, XOXO

Otoki
09-25-2008, 04:09 PM
I don't get it either Oksana :/

Anyway, I tried to go back to work on Monday but chickened out. Tonight I made it in though, and it was so-so. I forgot my shoes, but luckily the nice boutique girl let me borrow hers so I wouldn't have to shell out for new overpriced ones. Still, it meant I was kinda wobbly all night in a-bit-too-small shoes, and on top of that I just felt stiff and awkward from being away since the incident. Mentally I wasn't all there either- I felt like I had ADD or something b/c keeping focus and convo's going was difficult, and when one guy asked me about VIP I just froze up with paranoia and promptly ran off, and a couple times I was so preoccupied I intro'd myself by my real name lol. And then my fav belt broke too. >.<

I think it's ironic that I recently said here that dancing helps me when I'm having a hard time b/c it provided a lil mental escape. In this case though, since my prob is b/c of dancing, that doesn't apply lol. But, on the bright side, everyone was nice and very glad to see me back. And the money wasn't great by my usual standards, but I wasn't the worst off, and considering everything I'm OK with it. And obviously I made it home safely, which I don't take for granted anymore. Looking forward to moving on & gettin my groove back, XOXO
Don't worry, you'll do better when you're less freaked out. The running off from VIP thing cracked me up! I used to do that when I started dancing because the VIPs at that club were so dirty, and when someone brought them up I didn't know how to persuade them to just do dances:D

I hope you can start doing VIPs soon. It's understandable that you don't want to put yourself in a position to be fucked over by the "family values" police again.::)

phairestofthemall
09-27-2008, 06:54 AM
Finally some good news- last night started out a real drag, but ended up GOLDEN! I'd planned to go visit my bf in Austin but couldn't b/c all the flights were sold out (some event there this weekend apparently), so I reluctantly went into work instead with very modest goals. Hit the floor at 10 and caught the right guy's eye immediately, scored VIP from then till close and set a new earning record! Perfect timing to catch such a lucky break- greatly restored my shaky confidence :}

Also, there are a couple fliers up at work now relating to the raid. The first one clarifies our VIP policy, b/c apparently saying you have to buy a bottle to enter is illegal; instead we must say something like, anyone can go in, but *tables* are reserved for bottle service. I believe this applies anywhere in Dallas BTW. The second is about an upcoming mandatory dancer meeting with vice representatives... ugh >:[

txchick008
09-27-2008, 04:20 PM
^^

I wonder if they're still inside the club on occasion, or if they're going from club to club...

MeanGirl
09-27-2008, 04:21 PM
^^My sources said they were only to be at Mens, but we have the fliers too.

Miss Jessica
09-27-2008, 04:38 PM
A guy in a wheelchair is not going to be a cop, but as far as them having to be fit, that is simply not true. There are A LOT of overweight and out-of-shape cops. So don't let that guide you.

Where I'm from most are out of shape and overweight! You wouldn't think so, there's plenty of crime/people they should be chasing *ahem, excuse me* waddling after.

Melonie
09-27-2008, 04:41 PM
Appellate level doesn't re-examine the facts of a case. The panel of judges only has the power to determine whether the lower court properly applied the law

exactly ... which in such circumstances usually amounts to the panel of judges deciding that the unsubstantiated and uncorroborated testimony of a single vice cop may constitutes a lack of sufficient hard evidence of guilt to sustain a conviction.



Melonie, can you please tell me who exactly to ask for at the firm you recommended?

as posted earlier the attorney's name is Everett Newton. The firm has a website at



b/c apparently saying you have to buy a bottle to enter is illegal; instead we must say something like, anyone can go in,

this is a result of a recent US supreme court case re the rights of individuals to participate in sexual acts in a 'private' setting free of gov't interference. The notice is meant to clarify the legal fact that NO part of a strip club is considered to be a 'private' setting.

Just amateur legal speculation of course, but the fact that your club's VIP room was treated as a 'private area' prior to the posting of this notice MAY provide for an innovative approach to a defense !

anelia
09-27-2008, 04:50 PM
this is just so crooked. it makes me sick. there are real criminals out there happily beating and raping and dismembering innocent people because the cops are too busy in the VIP room trying to pester some hard working stripper into saying the wrong thing, or brushing up against his cock.

fuck all this makes me want to go break expensive glass ware.

CuriousSeeker
09-27-2008, 04:52 PM
upcoming mandatory dancer meeting with vice representatives... ugh >:[

This is rare, no?

Has anyone else sat through such a meeting with vice at the SC?

austinatalie
09-28-2008, 01:39 AM
I'd planned to go visit my bf in Austin but couldn't b/c all the flights were sold out (some event there this weekend apparently)

ACL!!

lildreamer316
09-28-2008, 10:55 AM
This is rare, no?

Has anyone else sat through such a meeting with vice at the SC?

I have, numerous times at the G'boro Christies Cabaret.
It's not that unusual.

CuriousSeeker
09-28-2008, 11:37 AM
^Was that in response to a raid at your SC, or was it a preventative thing initiated/arranged by the club owners?

*wondering if that has ever gone on at my club*

Honey71783
10-25-2008, 11:12 AM
Update please... Thanks...

Julez
10-26-2008, 03:06 AM
I'm really sorry to hear that happened to you. It seems like they'd have a bus load of hoes to take to jail down on Harry Hines, why dont they go dick around down there instead of messing with one of the nicest clubs in Dallas? I also work in Dallas, and just a couple weeks ago I thought I'd check out the men's club. During my orientation the manager really made a big deal about not giving prices for extras, not saying you'll meet them outside the club, etc. He probably talked about it for a good ten minutes. They were also going to have a member of vice come out to the club and teach the ladies how to spot them and not go to jail. If you dont attend one of the two meetings they were going to have you had a pay a big fine, $100 I think. So theyre really getting serious and making sure this doesnt happen again.
Anyway, I ended up not working there, I cant do the mandatory day shifts. Good luck with everything, I hope it all works out. And please dont forget to keep us updated.

BlakkMagik
10-27-2008, 03:31 AM
I don't know when this was posted and you may have already had this issue resolved, but it is very horrible and unfortunate nonetheless. Being subjected to jail for anything like this is ridiculous !!!!

I'm not that familiar with Texas law so I will be speaking more in general terms...

The first thing which you already know is that being a stripper/escort or anything involving the "sex-related" industry is, in legal terms, even worse than being a black or latino minority...in that you will almost NEVER get the benefit of the doubt in a court of law.

And whatever the police say, the Judge is going to beleive them 9 times out of 10 unless you have rock solid proof otherwise.

You were charged with "public lewdness" on a first offense which is probably a misdemeanor and so the chances of you doing any real jail time is not that great, but anyone who has been charged with a crime knows that this isn't much consolation because it is the charge itself that creates the biggest injury.

Now because of the charge you have a public record that is already easily accesible by family, friends, and potential employers and even if you are found innocent, a record of the court action will still exist unless you can get it expunged (erased).

Then you have to worry about defending the charge which can be a huge headache in and of itself.

Normally what you should first do is do some internet research and find out all you can about public lewdness and what the the penalty in Texas is for that crime...I would imagine that its not that severe so that is a good thing.

Then you need to decide wether to use a public defender or hire a private attorney...

The public defender will usually tell you to plead guilty...but for something small like public lewdness, then you can still probably use the PD because it is not that serious...probably just plead guilty, pay a fine and go home

But get a free consultation from a private attorney anyways and find out his assesment and what he thinks could happen...obviously they are motivated by money so they may be inclined to give you a worst case scenario to try and scare you into hiring them.

Here you have to use your own discretion but if it seems like, for whatever reason, that your case may have you in danger of some jail time then you would probably want to go with the private attorney...plus also they could help you more if you wanted to fight the charges and get your record expunged. A private attorney should probably charge between $500 and $1500 for something like this assuming the attorney has to make a court appearance.

The key is to be patient and go thru the steps to get it taken care of the right way...the first inclination is to panic and do whatever you can to get rid of the case immediately, but once you get charged there usually really is not a quick way to get it resolved...you just have to let the process run its course. And make sure you don't mis your court dates.

It's a shame that exotic dancers, escorts etc. are constantly harassed by the police for victimless "crimes"...but unless some of the hypocritical attitudes and laws change, it will probably always be like this...at least in America...because in America its all about money.

And State governments use the decency and prostitution laws to shake down the strip clubs to generate revenue for the the state, the police and the legal system...meanwhile the politicians and the police can make themselves look good by appearing to be "moral" and by being "tough on crime" ::) .

Anyways, you unfortunaley already did some jail time, so it seems like the worst is over...anything else will probably be just a fine.

But I know the biggest long-term threat is your psychological state because something like this can easily make you want to quit dancing or hate men...but you have to try and resist that temptation and focus on the positives because you weren't in the wrong and the people who arrested you were just doing there jobs (eventhough their jobs suck)...

It's just a corrupt flawed system that doesn't care who it hurts. You have to try and not take it personal, eventhough thats very hard...but just let the experience make you stronger and smarter...but try not to hold grudges because that is mentally destructive in the long-run.





I went in to dance Monday and just now got home. Vice had undercover cops workin and they raided us (Men's Club in Dallas) around midnight- they gave everyone a hard time, and they took me and 2 other girls to jail. The girls hauled in with me got prostitution charges- they danced a song or two each for the undercovers and allegedly gave a price when asked for extras. They vehemently deny this, and I didn't see it or know them well but neither had a bad record or reputation. I danced a couple for an undercover, then sold him a hour with me in VIP for $300 plus the $100 bottle, and turned him down flat for extras at least 3 times. Still, about 20 mins into our hour they pull me and charge me with a lesser 'public lewdness', then when I was booked they took the $300 back. They never told me exactly what I'd done to earn that charge, and even now I still don't know, but technically the law states that not maintaining a half foot buffer is a crime (which is to say all dancers in Dallas are perpetually guilty) so I'm guessing that's it, but still, apparently arrest for my lesser charge is atypical (officers in the jail were surprised I was taken in for it), and I have no priors of ANY kind...

In retrospect, my feeling is that vice wanted their $300 back, and also wanted to have something to show for the $140 spent on my bottle and dances (they spent much less on the other girls), so they charged me with what they could to take me in. >:( And then jail was just hell... not even going there, anyway my pals bailed me out as fast as they could, but even so I was incarcerated 24 hours total, and part of it in 'real' jail (where you wear stripes). The other girls got out too- one before me and one after, but they seperated us so I didn't know that while I was in. I stayed with a pal nearby and she helped me tie up loose ends today, just now home and trying to get my head around all this and figure out what's next

I called my club and was told the owner wants to speak with me, and girl B did same and heard same- we hope he'll be understanding and supportive, but are worried we may just be formally fired as examples. I think her and girl A's situation is more dire than mine since their charge is worse, but ultimately none of us have any experience with this and we're wondrin the same things: If we're fired, what are other options- would other clubs hire us if the charge sticks? Do we have a chance in hell of shaking it? If we need to fight it, can we find good lawyers and afford the cash and time it'll require? What are the chances this will happen to us again? WTH was vice doing in our club to begin with?! No place is perfect right, but any occassional shadiness there is NOTHING compared to what happens regularly at some other places in town. >.< %^@#$^#!!! Just, insane shit, and reeling over it all...

send hugs and advice please!! :'(

venusace138
10-27-2008, 02:36 PM
They were also going to have a member of vice come out to the club and teach the ladies how to spot them and not go to jail.


Thats really weird that vice would come in and teach girls how to beat them at their game.......

Honey71783
10-27-2008, 08:38 PM
Thats really weird that vice would come in and teach girls how to beat them at their game.......

I would really like to know how that vice meeting went... Or if there is anyone on SW that has had a vice meeting and what was said?

CuriousSeeker
10-27-2008, 10:28 PM
I have, numerous times at the G'boro Christies Cabaret. It's not that unusual.

Lil'dreamer, can you describe what happened at this vice meeting? I'm assuming that the club owners, and not vice itself, initiated this meeting?

threlayer
10-29-2008, 10:20 AM
I'm not that familiar with Texas law so I will be speaking more in general terms....

A lot of your advice runs contrary to the educated opinion of the most experienced here.

threlayer
10-29-2008, 10:23 AM
Seems like an ex-vice cop would start up a business on giving advice to dancers, etc about how to stay out of trouble while still being in the business.

Probably never happens because so many of them are corrupt exploitative bullies.