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JayATee
09-19-2009, 02:38 AM
Sheol then.

Sheol does not mean hell either. It was mistranslated.

vmurphy252
09-19-2009, 02:44 AM
^I wasn't going for a direct comparison; just the closest thing I know of in Judaism... isn't it more equivalent to purgatory?

JayATee
09-19-2009, 02:49 AM
^Not at all. The actual translation means underworld.

vmurphy252
09-19-2009, 02:51 AM
I meant conceptually, not literal translation. And I'm not saying I'm right, that's just how it's been used in the places I've come across it.

JayATee
09-19-2009, 02:52 AM
^ It depends on who you're talking to, I'll happily say more, but not on the board.

vmurphy252
09-19-2009, 02:56 AM
Not a biggie. Probably an over analysis of a very off-the-cuff comment...

vmurphy252
09-19-2009, 03:09 AM
^Of course, if you'd like to discuss in a different forum, I'm more than happy to oblige...

princessjas
09-19-2009, 01:34 PM
One hundred bucks; in Patterson FS is now $40, $20 to the dancer. Don't shoot the messenger; I report you decide.

Jeezus!! Is that FS by a toothless 80 year old? I know the economy has tanked but 5 years ago it was $175 to the dancer. Had a girl ask me for a condom and several were bitching because some fugly chick was doing otc for a bit less, maybe $130...can't remember exactly. This was the incident that caused me to leave that particular establishment after only 3 nights, so it sorta stuck in my memory. I was just freakin stunned that someone would fuck a stranger for only $175. :O

ETA - Seriously Earl, I worked all around Northern NJ and most of what you post just smacks of extreme exaggeration. Yes there are some whorehouses, some cheap ones even, but I find it really difficult to believe most of what you post lately. Every other post is about cheap sex and dancers whipping out your dick and jacking you off right at the bar. C'mon, I call bullshit.

Elvia
09-19-2009, 07:43 PM
I will not feed the trolls

bem401
09-20-2009, 11:09 AM
Jeezus!! Is that FS by a toothless 80 year old? I know the economy has tanked but 5 years ago it was $175 to the dancer. Had a girl ask me for a condom and several were bitching because some fugly chick was doing otc for a bit less, maybe $130...can't remember exactly. This was the incident that caused me to leave that particular establishment after only 3 nights, so it sorta stuck in my memory. I was just freakin stunned that someone would fuck a stranger for only $175. :O

ETA - Seriously Earl, I worked all around Northern NJ and most of what you post just smacks of extreme exaggeration. Yes there are some whorehouses, some cheap ones even, but I find it really difficult to believe most of what you post lately. Every other post is about cheap sex and dancers whipping out your dick and jacking you off right at the bar. C'mon, I call bullshit.

Earl's reliability (or lack thereof) notwithstanding, I've heard rumors of similar prices in the RI clubs.

bem401
09-20-2009, 11:44 AM
RI appears to be on the verge of enacting some sort of law to outlaw prostitution shortly but one has to wonder how aggressively that law will be enforced.

http://www.projo.com/news/content/police_and_spas_09-20-09_8PFLRRA_v245.2af21fd.html

xdamage
09-20-2009, 01:45 PM
Earl's reliability (or lack thereof) notwithstanding, I've heard rumors of similar prices in the RI clubs.

Sad reality is that FS sex is 50-75 Euros in some parts of the world now (about $100) for 15 minutes with an 18 something from somewhere in Europe. This is likely the inevitable value of sex in societies that value sexual liberalism and legality.

As with all things related to societies, economies, and complex systems, people have to accept that what they want for themselves, multiplied * the majority, often comes with trade offs they don't want, including dramatic devaluation.

That includes matters like sexual liberalism, decreased stigma, no laws against selling sex, etc. Sex is not a rare resource whose value is based on limited supply. The value of sex is entirely in our heads, it is a renewable resource, constantly being renewed by a younger generation.

I'm fine with it being worth whatever people want but I don't get why people are incapable of looking 2-3 moves ahead. In a society where all mystique is removed, where all stigma is swept aside, where no laws prohibit the sales of sex, and men are are looking for bargains... is it any wonder sex can be had cheaply?

bem401
09-20-2009, 02:15 PM
I'm fine with it being worth whatever people want but I don't get why people are incapable of looking 2-3 moves ahead. In a society where all mystique is removed, where all stigma is swept aside, where no laws prohibit the sales of sex, and men are are looking for bargains... is it any wonder sex can be had cheaply?

I think when you combine a buyers' market with the lack of stigma and you get a situation where it becomes more and more about the value of the girl's time and less about anything else.

The ante has definitely been upped around here the last few years. Girls who once swore they'd never lower their prices are dancing on $10 dance days. Others have had to change their limits to remain competitive. Few of them seem happy with the current state of affairs.

yoda57us
09-20-2009, 02:33 PM
I can't speak for the clubs in NJ other than to say that I know dancers from Boston and Providence who have gone down there to try and work only to return disgusted...

Lowest price I've been offered for FS ITC in RI is $60 plus $40 to the club. The woman smelled like the peep show booths I remember from when I was 18 and she had to weigh 200 pounds. She works in a club where "dancers" regularly have their pimps sitting at the bar during their shift. I rarely indulge in strip club sex anymore and situations like this are part of the reason.

I don't know what the end result of legalizing or decriminalizing prostitution would be as afar as how it would effect strip clubs. I have a feeling it would take years after any law change to find out though I'm not really thinking too much about it since I doubt the status quo will change soon.

RI's situation was brought about sort of by accident but I think it's fair to say that what has happened in the clubs down there would most likely happen in any US city at first. Over time however I believe the girls would set the tone as they do in most clubs.

xdamage
09-20-2009, 03:22 PM
I'd guess it has been 20-30 years in NL since prostitution started to become well sanctioned, about half a person's life time. I wouldn't hold out any cake eating and wanting it too hope things would be any different here. Some things, limited resources, have value that is related to the limits, but sex is a service, and everyone from dumb animals to developmentally disabled to the rest of us have it. It's value is whatever we define it to be. No more or less.

It's like I told my kids. There are only two kinds of jobs that pay well:

#1 - Those jobs nobody else wants to do.

#2- Those jobs nobody else knows how to do.

The 'dream' (girls?) jobs that everyone knows how to do and wants to do cannot last.

It is as inconceivable to us today that people would look on sex with a stranger as worth $100 or less as it was to my grand parents that people would have multiple random sex with strangers for $0. The shock and appall is no different. Yet some people do, and more people probably will if our current social trends continue.

I don't really care myself how it turns out, but I'd warn against anyone that is hoping for the value to stay high, stigma and legality to decrease. Cake = we want it and eat it, but cake doesn't last forever.

miabella
09-20-2009, 11:57 PM
Sheol does not mean hell either. It was mistranslated.

its etymology is unclear/unknown, so there is actually no honest way of knowing whether it means hell, the grave or anything else. the choices of translation are opinions, but none are rooted in uncontestable fact. it could as well be 'hell' as not.

vmurphy252
09-21-2009, 05:56 AM
^Not Jewish at all, so I was completely going of when I'd come across it in fiction... no comment on the religion=fiction thing... ;)

JayATee
09-21-2009, 06:57 AM
its etymology is unclear/unknown, so there is actually no honest way of knowing whether it means hell, the grave or anything else. the choices of translation are opinions, but none are rooted in uncontestable fact. it could as well be 'hell' as not.

W/e. Im not touching this. All it's gonna do is turn into something stupid. I know what sheol doesn't mean and it doesn't mean hell. If you wanna believe something else go for it. ::)

vmurphy252
09-21-2009, 07:04 AM
^Hey! Look! Some worms. Coming out of a can. That's been opened.

KiwiStrawberry Splenda
09-21-2009, 11:56 PM
But even in Amsterdam you don't see a lot of escorts or street walkers... they exist, but the market for them is weak when there are safer, cheap, legal options. The red-light district is surely not the same as privacy in one's own room, but their business is targeted at the average population of people who make average wages, looking to spend as little as possible.

Holland still has escort agencies and brothels. Not everyone is close enough to the red light district, or wants to be seen walking the alleys looking for a girl. But since they aren't criminalized businesses, I imagine that they are much safer work environments, as a legal prostitute would have nothing to fear about reporting crimes against her.

kittygirl
09-22-2009, 05:09 AM
I did research (OK in books and conversation) a few years ago.

Yeah don't punish women for selling sex - mofo I don't HAVE to do it for free like y'all want.

But, places where it's decriminalized like Europe, there are still illegal streetwalkers for less money.

Nothing makes it safe unless you train boys to respect all women including those who have sex with you.

Prostitution will die a slow death when we can make as much money as men and get as much respect for being relative jackasses. Just my personal experience.

But until then I want an unlimited supply of STRAIGHT men who think it would be cool to have sex and get paid, I want them tested biweekly, and I want it cheap. I have needs too.

Almost Jaded
09-22-2009, 10:34 AM
^I like you, lol. The last part of your post is a little odd though, as any attractive woman can get laid as often as she wants, really. With 1/10th the effort that even a well off, good looking, intelligent man has to put forth, you'd have dates lined up for the next 30 days solid, and 2 a day if you wanted too.


^Hey! Look! Some worms. Coming out of a can. That's been opened.

ROFLMAO!

vmurphy252
09-22-2009, 11:44 AM
^At least SOMEONE appreciates me...

miabella
09-22-2009, 04:34 PM
W/e. Im not touching this. All it's gonna do is turn into something stupid. I know what sheol doesn't mean and it doesn't mean hell. If you wanna believe something else go for it. ::)
nobody knows what it means, including yourself. ancient languages are rife with that problem of words' meanings having to be derived from context and even then there still being several reasonable options.

there is no established meaning for that word (among numerous others in many languages from antiquity), as there is no linguistic finding to indicate preference for one meaning over the several that are typically attached to it.

so the honest linguistic reality is that the word does not clearly mean hell or not-hell (i.e., graveyard, death, process of decay, etc).

vmurphy252
09-22-2009, 05:06 PM
Go to Kralizec?

Otoki
09-23-2009, 09:13 PM
I'm down with that...

I'm not sure if I already said this or not but I am in favor of decriminalization rather than legalization which would mean regulation. The last thing I want is to have sex regulated by city, county or state ordinances.

Legalization and strict regulation will simply cause many girls to work underground in order to avoid what would most likely be overbearing regulations regarding everything from std testing to zoning for where they would be allowed to work. The fact is most acts of prostitution already take place discretely and behind closed doors. The vast majority of escorts practice safe sex, get tested regularly and are responsible adults. The ones that choose to work in an irresponsible manner will not change their ways due to any legalization process. They will simply continue to work illegally as they have for years.

One would think that the legal brothels in Nevada would be jammed with girls wanting to work and that there would be lines of men going out the door looking for sex. Such is not the case. One would think that the state of RI, which currently has no law against indoor prostitution, would be flooded with escorts and men from all over New England would be flocking to RI to get laid. Such is not the case. In fact, very few escorts work in RI compared to MA and CT. Very few touring escorts bother to visit Providence where they can ply their trade legally. Instead they opt for stop-overs in Boston and Hartford where their chosen profession is illegal but profitable.

The fact is women who are successful at escorting already know how to do it well without endangering themselves, their customers or the public at large. They don't need the help of the government to get it right.
In my ideal world, legalized, regulated prostitution would look more like what they have in OZ. But decriminalization would still be a step in the right direction, except I really, really don't like the idea that it can become non-criminal in a SC. Then again, if there is zoning or something they can at least enforce "no prostitution in SCs" or something. Overall, I think regulation is a lot better for the workers, because their occupation would become LEGITIMATE in the eyes of the law, and customers and workers would be safer from disease and violence.


I did research (OK in books and conversation) a few years ago.

Yeah don't punish women for selling sex - mofo I don't HAVE to do it for free like y'all want.

But, places where it's decriminalized like Europe, there are still illegal streetwalkers for less money.

Nothing makes it safe unless you train boys to respect all women including those who have sex with you.

Prostitution will die a slow death when we can make as much money as men and get as much respect for being relative jackasses. Just my personal experience.

But until then I want an unlimited supply of STRAIGHT men who think it would be cool to have sex and get paid, I want them tested biweekly, and I want it cheap. I have needs too.
I don't think prostitution will ever die off completely. As long as there are people who want companionship and aren't getting it, prostitution will have plenty of demand and there will be people willing to supply the services.

xdamage
09-24-2009, 05:33 AM
...But decriminalization would still be a step in the right direction, except I really, really don't like the idea that it can become non-criminal in a SC. Then again, if there is zoning or something they can at least enforce "no prostitution in SCs" or something.


Once decriminalized entirely, I can't imagine how zoning would work.

But I can imagine that sex in public places would remain illegal just as it is illegal now to have sex in a grocery store aisle.

The only thing is strip clubs that rent out private booths, rooms, etc might need to close those as it is unclear if those are private places or public places. But then it remains unknown if that is the club owners choice.



I don't think prostitution will ever die off completely. As long as there are people who want companionship and aren't getting it, prostitution will have plenty of demand and there will be people willing to supply the services.

Besides the premise is wrong. There are plenty of poor men who would not have become prostitutes when they were younger in life nor later across multiple cultures. Given the imbalance of females/males as sex workers/customers across multiple cultures it becomes reasonable to start asking for some socio-biological investigation (or proof that it is purely a social factor).

Also prostitution appeals to people when they are younger, when they are weighing choices of how much they can make at 18-early-20s, not how much they are going to earn in their 40s+ where the largest differences in pay are occurring.

At 18ish a lot of us took jobs that paid crappy wages and made high demands. We could have made more prostituting ourselves out to other males but there was no pay on earth that would have caused us to do that. Likewise females wouldn't pay us for it, so it was a non-option. But had females been willing to pay us several times more then we would have made at 18 working in normal crappy wage job, you might well see more male prostitutes at those younger ages when money is hard to come by for both sexes.

Earl_the_Pearl
09-24-2009, 05:40 PM
Every other post is about cheap sex and dancers whipping out your dick and jacking you off right at the bar. C'mon, I call bullshit.
Would you like an all expense paid tour of some of the better clubs in Paterson, Newark and Irvington? Being the good driver that I am I’ll take the bullet if necessary; all I ask is that you press your soft lips to mine as I breathe my last. :puckerup:

P.S. I take extreme umbrage with you questioning my veracity.

Earl_the_Pearl
09-24-2009, 06:01 PM
Earl's reliability (or lack thereof) notwithstanding, I've heard rumors of similar prices in the RI clubs.
I have been to RI, Paterson is my friend; RI is no Paterson. Did I tell my story about the lady, the pack of Newport's and the bushes on Broadway and 3ed in Newark? She was not unattractive and Brazilian waxed to the max.

It's better to burn out than to fade away-Neil Percival Young; who ain't dead yet.

yoda57us
07-18-2013, 04:38 PM
please do not bump old threads