View Full Version : Two infuriating questions.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 05:22 PM
BTW, I've also been known to make sure that every dancer ITC knows when a certain custie isn't tipping, so honestly, not spending any money only hurts you. We're not asking for much here. All we want is to be paid for our work, and we deserve that payment.
In these trying times I can not tip all dancers equally. I do tip the ones that I find entertaining more then the ones I don't. This still causes friction.
Elvia
07-03-2009, 05:27 PM
^^^ If you continue to expect something from the ones you're not tipping (like continuing to watch their stage show, or expecting them to stop and chat with you, or getting touchy) then I think it's understandable that that would cause friction.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 05:38 PM
^^^ If you continue to expect something from the ones you're not tipping (like continuing to watch their stage show, or expecting them to stop and chat with you, or getting touchy) then I think it's understandable that that would cause friction.
We don't have stage shows there is a stage with a bar around it. I have to sit at the bar and will tip every dancer at least a dollar per set.
Now there may be 20 dancers so that is a dollar a minute. I can not tip every dancer five or even three dollars per set so I say no. Many PL can't say no so they leave. This is particularly brutal this time of the year as the Russian simmer invasion is in full swing. Very pretty collage exchange summer dancers. They really piss me off as they parade by and hold their bra strap out for a tip. No titty no second tip.
I expect the ones I'm not tipping to leave me alone but they don't as there may be more dancers then customers.
JayATee
07-03-2009, 05:50 PM
In these trying times I can not tip all dancers equally. I do tip the ones that I find entertaining more then the ones I don't. This still causes friction.
Im talking about NOT tipping, and NOT buying dances from anyone. Not not tipping well.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 06:07 PM
Im talking about NOT tipping, and NOT buying dances from anyone. Not not tipping well.
Oh I hardly ever buy dances because I'm taken advantage of every time; I become the perfect PL. Newark knows this so private dances are forbidden there by law.
The blue moon time I do in other towns it makes the other dancers wonder what hustle got him back there and causes more friction.
There are dancers that like me as a customer; many as a matter of fact. :crowded:
tripletranny
07-03-2009, 06:23 PM
Whats with this pick up artist crap? I mean i know some strippers (some here) pick up guys at work and/or have relationships with them but its either because the guys are hot or have something special. Pick up artist techniques are just stupid, the only thing which can benefit these assholes is that they save a bit of money in which case why bother coming to a strip club?
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 08:48 PM
You're ITC. You don't work there, that makes you a customer. Whether or not you spend money is obviously up to you. How a dancer views you (good, bad, decent w/e) is also up to you. If you're not spending you're still a customer, but now you're a loser customer.
BTW, I've also been known to make sure that every dancer ITC knows when a certain custie isn't tipping, so honestly, not spending any money only hurts you. We're not asking for much here. All we want is to be paid for our work, and we deserve that payment.
I assume everyone knows I was being sarcastic. And we may want to change the term customer to patron. That takes care of the definition because they are a patron regardless of if they've paid a dancer or not.
Almost Jaded
07-03-2009, 09:10 PM
I think the subject has been properly beaten by now, everybody who's going to get it get's it; I really cannot fathom why there are still a few that don't.
Vmurphy - I dig your POV, and I don't think I've commented on your sig yet. So to properly thank you for your posts here, I say Thou art God, and may those here who aren't thy brothers drink deeply of your grokking. ;)
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 09:27 PM
I share water.
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 09:31 PM
I assume everyone knows I was being sarcastic. And we may want to change the term customer to patron. That takes care of the definition because they are a patron regardless of if they've paid a dancer or not.
Heh, I don't think this type of distinction is necessary. It's not like an auto dealership where someone can just pop in and browese. Basically everyone who enters is a customer of someone, even if it's the club.
I think most dancers are aware that there are customers who do not necessarily patronize them personally.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 09:32 PM
I think most dancers are aware that there are customers who do not necessarily patronize them personally.
They may know it but they do not accept it.
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 09:35 PM
I was proposing it more for clarification for the guys in this thread who are saying they aren't a customer if they haven't paid. I think the general consensus by the rational people is that if a guy patronizes a SC, he should be tipping the dancers at least a minimal amount. Anyway, I agree with AJ that this horse has been beaten to death.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 09:41 PM
I think the general consensus by the rational people is that if a guy patronizes a SC, he should be tipping the dancers at least a minimal amount.
Even this one?
She was significantly overweight, short, and unattractive both in face and body. In short, not stripper material at all.
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 09:43 PM
^Dancers in the club, not a specific dancer. The different viewpoints on this particular girl are addressed in that thread.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 09:57 PM
^Dancers in the club, not a specific dancer. The different viewpoints on this particular girl are addressed in that thread.
That is not what you said here.
I think the general consensus by the rational people is that if a guy patronizes a SC, he should be tipping the dancers at least a minimal amount.
THE dncers that means ALL dancers. There is not a single dancer that doesn't think should be tipped. I disagree and am pleased you agree with Earl_the_Pearl. :P
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 10:02 PM
^I'm glad you think you can use what you consider logic to try and do what you think is outsmarting me. Your words != coming out of my mouth.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 10:04 PM
^I'm glad you think you can use what you consider logic to try and do what you think is outsmarting me. Your words != coming out of my mouth.
So you don't agree that one does not have to tipp every dancer.
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 10:09 PM
I don't think an individual patron has to tip every dancer himself.
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 10:13 PM
I don't think an individual patron has to tip every dancer himself. And I can refer to "the dancers" generally without meaning every individual dancer. And I'm done.
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 10:20 PM
I think most dancers are aware that there are customers who do not necessarily patronize them personally.
They may know it but they do not accept it.
That's a fairly lame generalization.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 10:21 PM
And I can refer to "the dancers" generally without meaning every individual dancer.
We need a grammar troll to decide this.
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 10:25 PM
That is not what you said here.
I think the general consensus by the rational people is that if a guy patronizes a SC, he should be tipping the dancers at least a minimal amount.
THE dncers that means ALL dancers. There is not a single dancer that doesn't think should be tipped. I disagree and am pleased you agree with Earl_the_Pearl. :P
Since when does "THE" = "ALL"?
If someone says that they eat "the" hambugers at McDonalds, do you take that to mean that they eat every single hamburger made?
If someone said they went to "the" movies last night, did they see every movie in the theater?
::)
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 10:29 PM
That's a fairly lame generalization.
Oh a tag team.
It may be lame but it is true. Name a dancer that doesn't think every PL should tip her just because she is there.
For the record my standing on the issue has been stated; I will tip at least one dollar per set to every dancer. I would even have tipped the one that should never have been dancing.
Many PLs are driven out of the club by the relentless dollar parade. They can't say no to any dancer so they leave after dropping $100 in a half hour and not even seeing a nipple.
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 10:35 PM
... It may be lame but it is true. Name a dancer that doesn't think every PL should tip her just because she is there. ...
Since you are such a stickler for grammer and logical values are you going on the assumption that every customer who enters a SC is a PL, thus "every PL" means "every customer"?
Second, there would not be enough room for me to list all of the dancers I know who reasonably accept that not every customer will tip them. No, they do not ALL feel entitled to a tip by every customer.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 10:37 PM
If someone says that they eat "the" hambugers at McDonalds, do you take that to mean that they eat every single hamburger made?
If they eat the hambugers they don't discriminate as they will eat any hambuger. If one tipps the dancers they do not discriminate as they will tip any dancer.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 10:42 PM
Since you are such a stickler for grammer and logical values are you going on the assumption that every customer who enters a SC is a PL, thus "every PL" means "every customer"?
I stated my thoughts on that.
That is what dancers think of all customers. If a PL thinks otherwise he truly is a PL.
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 10:44 PM
If they eat the hambugers they don't discriminate as they will eat any hambuger. If one tipps the dancers they do not discriminate as they will tip any dancer.
You've been proven wrong already, why keep trying to hold this position?
Per your logic "THE dancers" = "ALL dancers" = "ANY" dancer? NO NO NO
Again, ANY does not equal ALL. Even if a guy were to say that he would accept a dance from "any" dancer in there, it does not mean he got a dance from every dancer.
Your premise that vmurphy advocating someone should "tip the dancers" means that someone has to tip "every" dancer is invalid.
Geesh.
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 10:51 PM
I stated my thoughts on that.
That is what dancers think of all customers. If a PL thinks otherwise he truly is a PL.
How come you didn't say "the" dancers if you mean that all dancers think this way? ::)
Well just like you said, you are a PL.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-03-2009, 10:55 PM
Since you are such a stickler for grammer and logical values are you going on the assumption that every customer who enters a SC is a PL, thus "every PL" means "every customer"?
Second, there would not be enough room for me to list all of the dancers I know who reasonably accept that not every customer will tip them. No, they do not ALL feel entitled to a tip by every customer.
What do dancers call PLs that don't tip them? Loser, time waisting PL; so every customer is a PL to the dancers.
yoda57us
07-03-2009, 10:57 PM
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:
At the Verf & Earl show...I haven't had this much fun since Punk & Jenny bailed....
vmurphy252
07-03-2009, 10:58 PM
^Yeah, I feel bad for contributing to its continuation and the drifting from the OPs original question...
verfolgung
07-03-2009, 11:02 PM
What do dancers call PLs that don't tip them? Loser, time waisting PL; so every customer is a PL to the dancers.
While I concede that there are some who may think this way. I know for a fact that not all do. Perhaps you have never encountered an exception to your premise, fine. I have, so I know that I don't have to accept your generalization.
At the Verf & Earl show...I haven't had this much fun since Punk & Jenny bailed....
Heh, glad to be of service Yoda.
vmurphy252
07-04-2009, 08:10 AM
^Also, when I've seen the term PL used by the dancers, it is usually referring to a custie that doesn't understand the line between fantasy and reality and is "falling in love" with a dancer, not a general patron of the club.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-04-2009, 08:39 AM
^Also, when I've seen the term PL used by the dancers, it is usually referring to a custie that doesn't understand the line between fantasy and reality and is "falling in love" with a dancer, not a general patron of the club.
That is how dancers hustle; they encourage these feelings. Most dancers hold customers in contempt; especially the so called strip club junkie.
vmurphy252
07-04-2009, 08:39 AM
^However, I did just check the glossary wiki, and it does say it's a general, sometimes affectionate, term for a customer. My bad. Although the usage I've seen is more about when a patron falls in love...
firemaiden04
07-04-2009, 09:07 AM
I have never treated the customers like PL's, or thought of them as PL's. If customers didn't come into my club, I wouldn't make any money, and I would have to find a different job. So contrary to your beliefs, Earl, most dancers don't sit around feeling contempt for the same guys they're dancing for. The only customers I've ever heard dancers discussing in a negative way were drunk guys trying to pick us up, or grabby guys who think tipping $50 means they deserve a blow job. The normal guys that just sit there and tip, and act respectful, deserve just as much respect right back. I appreciate every guy who sits in there and tips me well, and treats me well. I don't laugh at them behind their back. And I've never really heard any other girl doing that, either.
So stop generalizing about how dancers feel about customers. You're not a dancer, you've got no clue.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-04-2009, 09:55 AM
So stop generalizing about how dancers feel about customers. You're not a dancer, you've got no clue.
Look at my signature; one can observe a lot by listining. Perhaps my life is filled with dancers. You do know that men can read all of Stripper Web. They can prentend to be dancers on the sites that are restricted to dancers only.
You are correct; if a PL opens his wallet then sits quietly on his hands dancers will not curse him out. He will be one of the faceless nobodys.
Many dancers don't like men, customers or not; all men are PLs to them.
mediocrity
07-04-2009, 10:15 AM
You're ITC. You don't work there, that makes you a customer. Whether or not you spend money is obviously up to you. How a dancer views you (good, bad, decent w/e) is also up to you. If you're not spending you're still a customer, but now you're a loser customer.
BTW, I've also been known to make sure that every dancer ITC knows when a certain custie isn't tipping, so honestly, not spending any money only hurts you. We're not asking for much here. All we want is to be paid for our work, and we deserve that payment.
I do the same. "See that fuckface in the red shirt? He isn't tipping anyone! What a jerk!"
I think most girls do this.
mediocrity
07-04-2009, 10:24 AM
Look at my signature; one can observe a lot by listining. Perhaps my life is filled with dancers. You do know that men can read all of Stripper Web. They can prentend to be dancers on the sites that are restricted to dancers only.
You are correct; if a PL opens his wallet then sits quietly on his hands dancers will not curse him out. He will be one of the faceless nobodys.
Many dancers don't like men, customers or not; all men are PLs to them.
From what you have insinuated, you don't cart around dancers as much as low tier prostitutes.
Sometimes I wonder if you're a pimp of some sort, honestly.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-04-2009, 10:42 AM
From what you have insinuated, you don't cart around dancers as much as low tier prostitutes.
Sometimes I wonder if you're a pimp of some sort, honestly.
They would be insulted at that remark. I drive for the experience and just get gas money. Most are supporting families; I have socialized with them, their children and even their husbands. One just lost a $750,000 house to foreclosure.
If I am a Pimp I’m not a very good one as I spend more money then I bring in driving. I even spent a day with a dancer’s son in Queens while she was getting some procedure done. It involved sheep fetuses; I really didn’t want to know more.
mediocrity
07-04-2009, 10:48 AM
What kind of husband lets his wife give handjobs at a grotty bar where "a beer comes with a coaster and a napkin"?
Earl_the_Pearl
07-04-2009, 10:56 AM
What kind of husband lets his wife give handjobs at a grotty bar where "a beer comes with a coaster and a napkin"?
She didn't dance there and they are the ones that lost their house. Besides a husband doesn't let his wife do anything she is her own women and makes her own choices.
Elvia
07-04-2009, 12:55 PM
Please. I've never met any dancer who thinks she's entitled to a tip from everyone in the bar. If someone shows zero interest and me and doesn't tip me, I leave them alone. As for most of the girls I work with. I take issues with guys who sit at or close to the rack, watching my sets and making a big show of the fact that they're watching (commenting, clapping, etc) and never tip me or buy dances. I take issue with customers who come in regularly and never tip me or buy dances and get pissy because I don't want to sit down and "hang out" with them. If they're tipping other girls and leaving me alone, I'm happy to leave them alone and tend to MY customers. In my experience, this is the way it always goes, with all the girls, in every club I've been in. If you're regularly getting bitched at, maybe you need to reconsider if your behavior has been as acceptable as you'd had us believe. The other guys on this board don't seem to be experiencing as much animosity at the clubs as you report.
Almost Jaded
07-04-2009, 01:11 PM
What kind of husband lets his wife give handjobs at a grotty bar where "a beer comes with a coaster and a napkin"?
Careful there, you're using language that got Earl and Commander chewed in half in the other thread, lol. I believe a whole bunch of us got pretty upset at use of the term "let" as it applied to a husband and his wife's career choice. If my girl is working in a low rent shitty club giving extras because I've failed to provide for us and she feels it's necessary or heaven forbid I'm MAKING her do it - string me up by my balls along with every other piece of shit that's left his girl (wh hasn't left for some reason) in this situation. However - if she's working there and doing that because for whatever reason she WANTS too - well, I'll either support her decision or decide I canot and therefor shouldn't be with her..
mediocrity
07-04-2009, 01:31 PM
Careful there, you're using language that got Earl and Commander chewed in half in the other thread, lol. I believe a whole bunch of us got pretty upset at use of the term "let" as it applied to a husband and his wife's career choice. If my girl is working in a low rent shitty club giving extras because I've failed to provide for us and she feels it's necessary or heaven forbid I'm MAKING her do it - string me up by my balls along with every other piece of shit that's left his girl (wh hasn't left for some reason) in this situation. However - if she's working there and doing that because for whatever reason she WANTS too - well, I'll either support her decision or decide I canot and therefor shouldn't be with her..
Agreed. I just can't see being in a healthy marriage when the wife jerks off old random dudes all day for $20.
I suppose Earl is not a pimp. Just the creepy old guy.
Earl_the_Pearl
07-04-2009, 01:39 PM
If you're regularly getting bitched at, maybe you need to reconsider if your behavior has been as acceptable as you'd had us believe. The other guys on this board don't seem to be experiencing as much animosity at the clubs as you report.
I have explained this before. I go to a club and the bar is around the stage; I have to sit at the bar. There could be as many as 20 dancers and 5 customers. A set lasts 20 minutes and I can't tip most dancers more than a dollar a set, $60 an hour. Some of these women come by ever three minutes and hold out their bra strap. I tell them I gave you a dollar for this set, do they smile and say OK. No they get bitchy. Now the dancers that show a little nipple will get another tip.
I don’t want anything form a dancer that she is not willing to give; I expect the same from them. It is a business and I will not be brow beaten into bad business practices. Many PLs are brow beaten and they leave because they can’t say no. Now there are even less customers.
Agreed. I just can't see being in a healthy marriage when the wife jerks off old random dudes all day for $20.
I suppose Earl is not a pimp. Just the creepy old guy.
mediocrity this does beg the question "Is it OK to jerk off random young dudes?" I do think there is ageist prejudice here to an extent. Being of the old persuasion and not a cheap ass I do sometimes wonder if strippers with that mind set know which side of their bread is buttered.
FBR
mediocrity
07-04-2009, 01:56 PM
mediocrity this does beg the question "Is it OK to jerk off random young dudes?" I do think there is ageist prejudice here to an extent. Being of the old persuasion and not a cheap ass I do sometimes wonder if strippers with that mind set know which side of their bread is buttered.
FBR
Oh for sure there is a prejudice, I totally agree. I amend my statement to "I can't see a healthy marriage where the wife jerks off guys all day for $20".
Because honestly I wouldn't jerk anyone off for $20, $200, or $2000. Young or old.
JayATee
07-04-2009, 02:48 PM
I assume everyone knows I was being sarcastic. And we may want to change the term customer to patron. That takes care of the definition because they are a patron regardless of if they've paid a dancer or not.
I see no problem with the term "customer". Truly. That is what you are. It's irrelevant whether or not people have an issue with it because it doesn't change what they are. You walk into any store in the world and you are instantly a customer. I still don't understand the problem with being called a customer.
vmurphy252
07-04-2009, 02:57 PM
^Don't make me get in an argument with you. ;)
I don't disagree. I was just trying to provide a clarifying term for one of the sticking points in the debates happening. People were saying that they weren't a customer because they hadn't paid. Just trying to take that out of play.