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Elvia
09-26-2009, 06:38 PM
no one is interested in being your secret friend.

Cyril
09-26-2009, 06:45 PM
no one is interested in being your secret friend.

It is regrettable. Because I am kind, sensitive, caring, giving, loving, and a nice person.

Elvia
09-26-2009, 06:51 PM
and also clueless as to how one treats a "friend" apparently.

Cyril
09-26-2009, 06:54 PM
and also clueless as to how one treats a "friend" apparently.

Can you substantiate your claim about I being clueless?

Elvia
09-26-2009, 06:56 PM
I'm pretty sure there's an entire thread where everyone already explained this too you. Why don't you just go read that one again.

Cyril
09-26-2009, 06:57 PM
I'm pretty sure there's an entire thread where everyone already explained this too you. Why don't you just go read that one again.

I do not recall seeing a thread about I being clueless.

verfolgung
09-26-2009, 08:10 PM
^^^ Really?

Here's one of several ...

"Project: Even More Dreamier Dream Girls"
http://forum.stripperweb.com/showthread.php?t=134337

chris91
09-27-2009, 12:18 AM
I don't think you understand my comparison. Read it again.

The point was that even if a woman is just making out, rubbing her breasts on the guy, whatever, for money, she should pay taxes. Just as masseuses should pay taxes if they give a backrub in private, just as plumbers should if they come to your home and provide a service. Therefore it is not relevant to why people draw their lines as they do in their heads. They are not thinking about taxes. They are thinking EWW it's sexual, for money!

Your sense of it is just different but fundamentally the same in terms of what motivates it.

Yes, people should pay taxes on their income no matter what they do for it. I only brought up tax forms as an example of why we need words to describe our jobs. I also used apartment applications as an example, so I don't know why you're focusing on taxes.

I don't care why people draw the lines in their heads where they do. I only care that they have been drawn. In this case, general public defines prostitution as sex for money. This is evidenced by the fact that when people go to hookers, they expect sex.



It's the use of the word "whore" - it suggests stronger emotions then pure objectivity.



That part I understand. I'm fine with the word prostitute though the legal definition and that of the common person is not as clear cut as your personal definition.

But the problem is when people throw around the word "whore" it is often like how they throw around the word "fag"; it has tremendous negative connotation and usually there is a lot of negative emotion behind it. Usually too they deny it if confronted cause it's not PC to admit anymore, but still it leaves people wondering. If you don't want to leave doubt, prostitute definitely carries less negative connotation (even if the definition remains a matter of legal and personal debate).

Ok, I officially no not know what you're talking about anymore. All I'm saying is that, in America, the general public defines prostitution as sex for money, and you keep throwing all this crap at me about how the government should stay out of our business, and I shouldn't judge people, and blah blah blah. What does this have to do with my point? Nothing.

JayATee
09-27-2009, 02:32 AM
Some realities need to be changed. Would you not agree?

LoL. This isn't the Matrix.



I do not recall seeing a thread about I being clueless.

Excuse me mr. epic novel writer, the corect word would be me. "I do not recall seeing a thread about me being clueless." I mean you really just said that for real?? Wtf....

Djoser
09-27-2009, 02:33 AM
Actually, the concept of acting is very misunderstood on this forum. When you deceive others, it is not called acting. It is called deception. Actual acting is a very difficult craft. Once you really give it a try, only then you realize how difficult it is. That also lets you know why some movie stars make millions.

It is unfortunate to even compare the art of deception with the art of acting.

Have you ever done any acting?

I have. I can tell you deception is the essence of acting. The more your audience is transported into the plot, the more you grip their hearts or get them to laugh, the better it is.

Everyone knows its really just a bunch of assholes on the stage, what really gets them is your ability to temporarily suspend their disbelief and sweep them up into the tale. Tolstoy also believed that true art was unattainable without a live audience. That it requires active participation, if only through the emotions of the audience. Of course Tolstoy was kind of a hardass about What is Art, etc..

In the dancing, the customers get to play a role as well, the suave studs, etc., which makes it even better of course. Plus the heroine is always their type and rubs all over them. He always gets the lead, the best part--or thinks he does. The more talented the actress, the more he is swept up into the play.

What more could a reasonable man ask?

ETA this is interesting:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_Is_Art%3F

Djoser
09-27-2009, 02:59 AM
Chris, xdamage, I like you both, you both have interesting points, and Imma let you finish...

:rotfl:

Sorry, just trying to inject a little humor. It seems to me you are maybe just focusing on different aspects of the dilemma. But I just got off work and didn't read all of it, maybe I'm missing something.

Cyril
09-27-2009, 07:47 AM
Have you ever done any acting?

I have. I can tell you deception is the essence of acting. The more your audience is transported into the plot, the more you grip their hearts or get them to laugh, the better it is.

Everyone knows its really just a bunch of assholes on the stage, what really gets them is your ability to temporarily suspend their disbelief and sweep them up into the tale. Tolstoy also believed that true art was unattainable without a live audience. That it requires active participation, if only through the emotions of the audience. Of course Tolstoy was kind of a hardass about What is Art, etc..

In the dancing, the customers get to play a role as well, the suave studs, etc., which makes it even better of course. Plus the heroine is always their type and rubs all over them. He always gets the lead, the best part--or thinks he does. The more talented the actress, the more he is swept up into the play.

What more could a reasonable man ask?

ETA this is interesting:



Yes, I have done acting. That is why I disagree with you strongly. But let me clarify one thing first. I do believe that some strippers are good actresses although it is not required by their job. And, all of them do not engage in deception.

The issue here is, can stripping be called acting? In a limited sense yes, especially on the stage act of a stripper can be called acting. But the problem is lots of women on this forum are confusing lying and deception with acting. A person can tell lie with conviction but that does not mean she is an actress. Here is why. In real life, we are taught to conceal our emotions. When we are sad, we put out a brave face. When we are angry, we try to act calm. When we are happy, we try to moderate it as well. So, telling a lie or deceiving someone in real life does not require whole lot of skills. It simply requires a lack of ethics.

When you get on the stage, however, you are required to show emotions in its full flare. You are supposed to act angry when you are angry, you are supposed to cry when you are sad, etc. Unless you do that audience will not know how you feel.

Coming back to Tolstoy:
Emotions do play a role in the art of acting. Sometimes actors feed from each others' emotions. I recall in my first acting class, my teacher paired me with a girl. My task was to call her names. That is it. Simple. But, I had hard time doing it. I just could not bring myself up to call this girl names. So, my teacher, she turned towards the girl and asked her to call me names. The girl was a bit more experienced than me in the craft of acting. So, she had no problem calling me names. And she did it with such conviction and flare that it got me angry. Now, I was ready to call her all sorts of names. So, emotions do play a vital role but your analogy is not correct. Because PLs are not playing any role. They are simply there looking for love or lust.

xdamage
09-27-2009, 07:48 AM
Ok, I officially no not know what you're talking about anymore. All I'm saying is that, in America, the general public defines prostitution as sex for money, and you keep throwing all this crap at me about how the government should stay out of our business, and I shouldn't judge people, and blah blah blah. What does this have to do with my point? Nothing.

I guess my main point is this:

If you decided to just make out with a guy but NO INTERCOURSE for love, dinner, fun, some people might turn up their nose, but there is no law against it.

If you decided to have sex with a guy for love, dinner, fun, some people might turn up their nose, but there is no law against it.

If you decided to just make out with a guy for a direct payment, seemingly everyone cares. There are laws against it. A few places have zoned it to be okay; we call them SCs these days though not so long ago you couldn't even touch others in those places because doing so was a prostitution offense. In some places it still is a prostitution offense to touch a customer even if you don't have intercourse with him.

If you decided to have intercourse with guy for a direct payment, seemingly everyone cares. There are laws against it. So far only one city in the USA has zoned it to be okay; we call them Brothels vs SCs but the bottom line is they mostly don't exist because the majority go EWWW... and feel it's their right to have an opinion about what others do sexually, for money.

You're concerned about the difference between brothels and strip-clubs and reasonably so given your job, my only point is that other people here who see a continuum issue are also correct... that fundamentally society has a lot of people who are very concerned about what others are doing with their bodies for money, and SCs are just somewhere in the gray on a line that greatly restricts people's choices to entirely frees them.

The ironic thing is that the laws which keep "hookers" and "whores" out of SCs exist due to the very same mindset that has the government telling people you can't strip or tease wherever you want to if you do it for money. It is the very same thing except to a matter of degree. In some parts of the USA there are now areas zoned that allow some touching for money, but those areas exist today only because there were people who wanted those freedoms despite that others have reasons why they don't want you to have the freedom to choose for yourself. Still many people turn up their noses at SCs and still many people think of them as whores (sad but true). But...

There are people, even the extras girls, who want even greater freedom. Who want the government not to arrest them for having sex for money and to drop the zoning laws that prohibit it. For your business that would be bad since it would allow the girls who have intercourse (or whatever they want) to do so legally side by side, like in RI, and you'd have to compete, but from a human rights continuum point of view it's good - it's more of the same matter on a continuum of freedoms. That people should be able to do what they want with their bodies, even yep, have intercourse (as long as they pay their taxes of course (j/k) ;)).

xdamage
09-27-2009, 07:53 AM
Coming back to your question:

My mind is not impressionable. So, my chances of getting harmed is very unlikely. But what about some teenagers who are in the process of self discovery?

Well so far I've seen fairly dramatic changes in social norms in about 30 years time in regards to how people feel about casual sex, pornography, stripping, and yes even prostitution. There have also been 100s of other dramatic social changes as well.

Your reply here is basically that there could be some impact, some way it influences them. I'll change the question then, how are they harmed?

Societies change and there is simply no stopping that. Some of it is positive some negative but living in fear that change is fundamentally bad is it's own kind of decay and rot, it's own negative because it stifles positive changes as well, so...

What I'm asking you is putting aside the common fears that we have that things will change if prostitution becomes more accepted as NONE OF OUR BUSINESS, what specifically are you worried will happen?

Cyril
09-27-2009, 08:00 AM
LoL. This isn't the Matrix.




Excuse me mr. epic novel writer, the corect word would be me. "I do not recall seeing a thread about me being clueless." I mean you really just said that for real?? Wtf....

You should thank me because I gave you a reason to type a post. :P

Cyril
09-27-2009, 08:08 AM
Well so far I've seen fairly dramatic changes in social norms in about 30 years time in regards to how people feel about casual sex, pornography, stripping, and yes even prostitution. There have also been 100s of other dramatic social changes as well.

Your reply here is basically that there could be some impact, some way it influences them. I'll change the question then, how are they harmed?

Societies change and there is simply no stopping that. Some of it is positive some negative but living in fear that change is fundamentally bad is it's own kind of decay and rot, it's own negative because it stifles positive changes as well, so...

What I'm asking you is putting aside the common fears that we have that things will change if prostitution becomes more accepted as NONE OF OUR BUSINESS, what specifically are you worried will happen?

Of course there is a harm. If we start weighing worth of everything in terms of money. This will promote a selfish outlook. People will stop joining military. Police officers will refuse to confront armed criminals. Everybody will stop and ask what is in it for me?

WiseGuy_TX
09-27-2009, 08:12 AM
They are simply there looking for love or lust....this invalidates your argument and theory, as again, your basis is thru your knowledge of hollywood movies and stereotypes. Go get a lap dance Cyril and report back.


What I'm asking you is putting aside the common fears that we have that things will change if prostitution becomes more accepted as NONE OF OUR BUSINESS, what specifically are you worried will happen?...X, rephrasing is futile.

xdamage
09-27-2009, 08:18 AM
Of course there is a harm. If we start weighing worth of everything in terms of money. This will promote a selfish outlook. People will stop joining military. Police officers will refuse to confront armed criminals. Everybody will stop and ask what is in it for me?

Okay this is about the most stupid thing I've read yet. I'm sorry but seriously Cyril. Your fear about this is typical of people who are brought up with fear without even the slightest in depth thought or study of societies where prostitution is occurring.

People already expect to be paid for thousands of different kinds of matters and society hasn't stopped because we don't do those jobs for free. Societies even need law enforcement, fire fighters, medical people to help the sick, and guess what? We pay them and things work fine.

Look, if having sex with strangers for money fundamentally goes against our human nature then we don't need to worry. Few will do it, or do it for long. It will self-regulate.

But if in fact many end up doing it, what really will change?

All those other jobs will remain because the need for them is exactly the same regardless of whether or not some women (or men) are being paid directly for sex.

People are having sex all the time and they are not telling you when or for what, and no harm has come to you.

I think the real worry is that men worry that women are somehow going to become increasingly aware that sex is a valuable commodity, and things are going to fall apart. I believe they won't. That if the terms become unlivable men will adjust too, and you may well be surprised that future generations of men change in positive ways as well, less focused on sex, more on other goals in life. Who knows? But things change, all the time. I look forward to seeing how our future plays out but I'm absolutely sure that our government telling people they can't have sex for dollars is wrong. That is not my governments business and not yours either.

chris91
09-27-2009, 09:33 AM
I guess my main point is this:

If you decided to just make out with a guy but NO INTERCOURSE for love, dinner, fun, some people might turn up their nose, but there is no law against it.

If you decided to have sex with a guy for love, dinner, fun, some people might turn up their nose, but there is no law against it.

If you decided to just make out with a guy for a direct payment, seemingly everyone cares. There are laws against it. A few places have zoned it to be okay; we call them SCs these days though not so long ago you couldn't even touch others in those places because doing so was a prostitution offense. In some places it still is a prostitution offense to touch a customer even if you don't have intercourse with him.

If you decided to have intercourse with guy for a direct payment, seemingly everyone cares. There are laws against it. So far only one city in the USA has zoned it to be okay; we call them Brothels vs SCs but the bottom line is they mostly don't exist because the majority go EWWW... and feel it's their right to have an opinion about what others do sexually, for money.

You're concerned about the difference between brothels and strip-clubs and reasonably so given your job, my only point is that other people here who see a continuum issue are also correct... that fundamentally society has a lot of people who are very concerned about what others are doing with their bodies for money, and SCs are just somewhere in the gray on a line that greatly restricts people's choices to entirely frees them.

The ironic thing is that the laws which keep "hookers" and "whores" out of SCs exist due to the very same mindset that has the government telling people you can't strip or tease wherever you want to if you do it for money. It is the very same thing except to a matter of degree. In some parts of the USA there are now areas zoned that allow some touching for money, but those areas exist today only because there were people who wanted those freedoms despite that others have reasons why they don't want you to have the freedom to choose for yourself. Still many people turn up their noses at SCs and still many people think of them as whores (sad but true). But...

There are people, even the extras girls, who want even greater freedom. Who want the government not to arrest them for having sex for money and to drop the zoning laws that prohibit it. For your business that would be bad since it would allow the girls who have intercourse (or whatever they want) to do so legally side by side, like in RI, and you'd have to compete, but from a human rights continuum point of view it's good - it's more of the same matter on a continuum of freedoms. That people should be able to do what they want with their bodies, even yep, have intercourse (as long as they pay their taxes of course (j/k) ;)).

Really?::)

chris91
09-27-2009, 09:34 AM
It seems to me you are maybe just focusing on different aspects of the dilemma.

That's what I keep saying!

Djoser
09-27-2009, 10:09 AM
Yes, I have done acting.

Like what kind, and don't tell me about a couple classes, that does not count. What productions staged before an audience on multiple occasions, and what roles?


I do believe that some strippers are good actresses although it is not required by their job. And, all of them do not engage in deception.

The issue here is, can stripping be called acting? In a limited sense yes...

Aha! Progress is being made...


...telling a lie or deceiving someone in real life does not require whole lot of skills.


But then there is this. Sure, if you are lying to stupid people. Actually, lying to someone who is intelligent and perceptive is extremely difficult, and requires the utmost in acting skill.


The girl was a bit more experienced than me in the craft of acting. So, she had no problem calling me names. And she did it with such conviction and flare that it got me angry. Now, I was ready to call her all sorts of names.


This I have no trouble believing at all.


...but your analogy is not correct. Because PLs are not playing any role. They are simply there looking for love or lust.

Jesus, have you never engaged in sexual role-playing? What the fuck is a fantasy but playing a role in your head? The more convincing the actress, the more the guy trying to play the stud believes his own fantasy, the more money he spends.

It's quite simple, or would be if you had spent ten years working the clubs as I have, and also had real acting experience in a number of large productions.

I am about ready to give up on this. ;D

JayATee
09-27-2009, 12:23 PM
Jesus, have you never engaged in sexual role-playing? What the fuck is a fantasy but playing a role in your head? The more convincing the actress, the more the guy trying to play the stud believes his own fantasy, the more money he spends.

It's quite simple, or would be if you had spent ten years working the clubs as I have, and also had real acting experience in a number of large productions.

I am about ready to give up on this. ;D

Im surprised it took you this long! ;)

No he has not ever done any kind if role playing. If you go back and look at any number of his posts from the very beginning he says as much. He admitted to being very ignorant about EVERYTHING. Now it seems by having some 1000 posts on this site he has decided he is an expert in all things even though he's never experienced any of it least of all anything to do with SC's. How and where his opinions are formed is anyones guess and arguing with him is truly asinine.

laurcon
09-27-2009, 12:41 PM
I think the real worry is that men worry that women are somehow going to become increasingly aware that sex is a valuable commodity, and things are going to fall apart. I believe they won't. That if the terms become unlivable men will adjust too, and you may well be surprised that future generations of men change in positive ways as well, less focused on sex, more on other goals in life. Who knows? But things change, all the time. I look forward to seeing how our future plays out but I'm absolutely sure that our government telling people they can't have sex for dollars is wrong. That is not my governments business and not yours either.

i completely agree. great paragraph!
legal prostitution would be liberating for women. and intelligent men.

Djoser
09-27-2009, 12:47 PM
I wasn't here much for a while, so it's almost like getting to know everyone again sometimes. There's a lot of people that are completely new to me.

:hat::beer2:

KiwiStrawberry Splenda
09-27-2009, 11:16 PM
I want to meet Cyril. That would be an interesting cup of coffee.

Elvia
09-27-2009, 11:19 PM
I hope to God I never meet Cyril.

Christyismyalias
09-27-2009, 11:52 PM
Touching the girl's vag (under the thong or without a thong) is ok in > 50% of privates. Is this prostitution?

Finger banging. Prostitution?

Touching the guy inside his pants?

Mouth to penis but not actually sucking off?

Blow jobs?

What is the line in your mind?

I consider all this prostitution. Dancers are to dance, not to be touched intimately, otherwise, since money is being exchanged, it is selling sexual acts for money. Period.
Yes some states consider prostitution any touching whatsoever during a dance, even on the shoulder. If that is the law then as others stated, that is prostitution.
The other is just my personal opinion.

Christyismyalias
09-28-2009, 12:00 AM
I'm trying to gain some clarity on the common complaint (both here and in person) that "prostitutes" don't belong in the club.

They don't belong in the club because it makes it more difficult for girls who simply want to dance. In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with prostitution, but escort services are available for that reason. Many dancers ONLY want to dance, not perform sexual acts and when girls are giving men extras, it makes it that much harder because the men expect that all strippers put out, and when we don't, they can be quite evil towards us.

Djoser
09-28-2009, 03:57 AM
The clean clubs are plenty tough enough on the dancers as it is. Bringing prostitution into the clubs, as is being done all over the country--even if it's in small ways and being done gradually--just makes the business more and more brutal.

When I came down here and saw how much better the clubs were it was like a breath of fresh air. Not that it's tame down here! It's full nude/full contact, and some (not all) dancers let the guys feel their breasts right at the tiprail, even. But absolutely no finger-fucking, 'stick-shifting', kissing, etc. And the grinding has to be done in certain ways--one foot on the floor at all times and keep it changing I think.

It's still hard on the women. But much more tolerable than it was in Daytona.

Elvia
09-28-2009, 04:31 PM
Yes, I have done acting. That is why I disagree with you strongly. But let me clarify one thing first. I do believe that some strippers are good actresses although it is not required by their job. And, all of them do not engage in deception.


I guarantee you, if she has any capacity to perform the job at all, every dancer engages in deception/acting while on the job. Would it be better if we let it be known how bored we are with many of the conversations we end up in? Would it be better if we let it be known how unattractive we find many of our clients?



When you get on the stage, however, you are required to show emotions in its full flare. You are supposed to act angry when you are angry, you are supposed to cry when you are sad, etc. Unless you do that audience will not know how you feel.


1) You do realize that not all acting is method acting, right? and 2) Your post seems to imply that it's impossible to engage in method acting in a club environment. That's simply not true. I have a technique that I employ often in the club, and I know a lot of other dancers do as well. Sometimes, when I'm focusing on a customer and trying to suck him into the fantasy, I'll make up a story about him. I'll make up an imaginary personality for him, or a little story. Give him some interesting qualities in my head. Or I'll borrow some qualities from a SO or a crush and intentionally project them onto the customer. It helps me look at them in a more seductive way, or feel more engaged in the dance. It's still acting of course, because I know the scenario I've invented is just in my mind.

xdamage
09-28-2009, 09:07 PM
I guarantee you, if she has any capacity to perform the job at all, every dancer engages in deception/acting while on the job. Would it be better if we let it be known how bored we are with many of the conversations we end up in? Would it be better if we let it be known how unattractive we find many of our clients?

If you did that the customers would not be happy either; the truth would suck, they'd have a bad time, you'd make no money, they no fun. Since you can't win 100% making everyone happy all the time in all things, go on acting, the customer has some fun, you make some money. Seems like a duh which of course Cyril doesn't get because he again he never actually goes to SCs.

yoda57us
09-29-2009, 02:33 AM
I hope to God I never meet Cyril.

As long as he stays out of strip clubs and you stay away from Never Neverland I think you are safe...

Cyril
09-29-2009, 04:09 PM
I want to meet Cyril. That would be an interesting cup of coffee.

If you hold cordial disposition towards me then I do not see why we cannot meet.

What part of US are you in?

Cyril
09-29-2009, 04:23 PM
But then there is this. Sure, if you are lying to stupid people. Actually, lying to someone who is intelligent and perceptive is extremely difficult, and requires the utmost in acting skill.



When you are tasked to determine whether someone is lying or not you do not rely on the quality of the acting being displayed. Instead you rely on techniques of interrogation.

Once again in real life no one expects theatrics as a result human emotions remain flat lined most of the time.

But on the stage, it is the opposite. You need to cry. You need to shout. You need to laugh. Whether you feel like it or not. The strange aspect of this business is you have to feel the emotions that you actually do not possess. This is very hard for rational people to accept. But nevertheless is a reality of this business.

You do not seem to understand this glaring difference between cheating in the real life and acting on the stage. But that does not mean I do not accept your claim about your personal accomplishments.

Cyril
09-29-2009, 04:30 PM
I guarantee you, if she has any capacity to perform the job at all, every dancer engages in deception/acting while on the job. Would it be better if we let it be known how bored we are with many of the conversations we end up in? Would it be better if we let it be known how unattractive we find many of our clients?



1) You do realize that not all acting is method acting, right? and 2) Your post seems to imply that it's impossible to engage in method acting in a club environment. That's simply not true. I have a technique that I employ often in the club, and I know a lot of other dancers do as well. Sometimes, when I'm focusing on a customer and trying to suck him into the fantasy, I'll make up a story about him. I'll make up an imaginary personality for him, or a little story. Give him some interesting qualities in my head. Or I'll borrow some qualities from a SO or a crush and intentionally project them onto the customer. It helps me look at them in a more seductive way, or feel more engaged in the dance. It's still acting of course, because I know the scenario I've invented is just in my mind.

I do not disagree with major portion of your post. However, I would like to clarify this. I do not believe that you ladies engage in anything evil while working at a strip club. It is part of your job to act as if you are interested in the client. It is art of deception. But it is not evil. At the same time, it is not acting either.

You do seem to possess some acting skills, based on your post.

Cyril
09-29-2009, 04:32 PM
I hope to God I never meet Cyril.

You do not have to worry about that. We are not going to meet unless you came looking for me. :D

WiseGuy_TX
09-29-2009, 06:42 PM
I do not disagree with major portion of your post. However, I would like to clarify this. I do not believe that you ladies engage in anything evil while working at a strip club. It is part of your job to act as if you are interested in the client. It is art of deception. But it is not evil. At the same time, it is not acting either.

You do seem to possess some acting skills, based on your post....baseless pearls of wisdom from Cyril.

JayATee
09-29-2009, 07:10 PM
^^We're acting we're just not acting. But then again I have trouble following anything that runs over a line. ::)

Cyril stop double, triple and quadruple posting. Especially when you have no clue WTF you're talking about.

laurcon
09-30-2009, 12:20 AM
ya how bout cyril stop posting.

Elvia
09-30-2009, 01:05 AM
I think we would all love that.

Earl_the_Pearl
09-30-2009, 01:08 AM
^^^Not I as I have not figured out if he is for real or not. :thinking:

princessjas
09-30-2009, 08:48 AM
Any stance no matter how immoral it is can be defended and similarly any stance no matter how moral it is can be attacked. The excerpt above exemplifies it.
Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.


As soon as you sit on someone's lap for money, you are no longer an actress.
I'm an immoral prostitute and you are a jackass. Whatever. ::)


Lap dancing is where prostitution begins.
If you've never had a lapdance your opinion is completely irrelevant and making such a statement just shows what a judgmental, closed-minded person you really are.


Actually, the concept of acting is very misunderstood on this forum. When you deceive others, it is not called acting. It is called deception. Actual acting is a very difficult craft. Once you really give it a try, only then you realize how difficult it is. That also lets you know why some movie stars make millions.

It is unfortunate to even compare the art of deception with the art of acting.
How are we decieving anyone? When a guy hands us cash to spend time with him you don't think thats a hint that we aren't really interested in him and are just acting? We aren't chasing down random guys on the street and leading them on. ::)


One can always keep it discreet. We've already explained multiple times how damn insulting that is. No one is lining up to be your dirty little secret.


It is regrettable. Because I am kind, sensitive, caring, giving, loving, and a nice person. And your posts above belie this statement.


I hope to God I never meet Cyril.
Me too! I'd end up in prison....or maybe not, if any of the jury had ever encountered him, maybe they'd understand why I couldn't stop myself from doing him serious bodily harm.


I do not disagree with major portion of your post. However, I would like to clarify this. I do not believe that you ladies engage in anything evil while working at a strip club. It is part of your job to act as if you are interested in the client. It is art of deception. But it is not evil. At the same time, it is not acting either.

You do seem to possess some acting skills, based on your post.
So a few quotes up you say we are not acting but deceiving men and are prostitues, now you change your stance? You really are ridiculous. Are you 12? :banghead:

xdamage
09-30-2009, 10:08 AM
FWIW Disneyland refers to the employees in costume as "cast members".


The premise being that the Disneyland experience is just a show, an interactive one versus the more traditional non-interactive entertainment, but Disney management regards the whole thing as "a show" in which the employees are part of the act.

Likewise in SCs, the cast members do not wear street clothes but erotic costumes; their behavior is unlike anything a PL(TM Cyril) would experience in a standard Nightclub or Bar; sensual pole dancing not something seen in normal day to day life sans paid-go-go dancers; the primary form of entertainment, the lap dance, unlike anything one experiences in normal venues.

That should be enough hints that it is a "show" without outright handing out information pamphlets or putting up signs.

In the end though it doesn't matter how one defines it because nobody is forced to go to a SC. If anyone finds it offensive for whatever reason the solution is simple. Don't go. Otoh if one does go then the rules are pretty simple. The dancers act like they like the customers; the customers pay money because the act makes them feel good. In theory it is a win-win if everyone is happy with that simple idea.

Everyman
09-30-2009, 11:23 AM
Revisiting the thread after a few days, I should make it clear the thread deals with "contact" strippers. Non-contact does not equal prostitution. So maybe I was just asking, when does naked contact become sexual activity for money?

The answer is not easy, but I've already given mine.

bem401
09-30-2009, 01:56 PM
Gee PJ, we're beginning to agree more and more.



If you've never had a lapdance your opinion is completely irrelevant.

I've said essentially this to him at least a half-dozen times and yet he won't stop pontificating on what goes on in SC"s.



How are we decieving anyone? When a guy hands us cash to spend time with him you don't think thats a hint that we aren't really interested in him and are just acting? We aren't chasing down random guys on the street and leading them on. ::)

There is no deceit taking place when talking about random guys just passing through the club. Guys who visit regularly to see a particular girl or who possibly have standing appointments to visit may be a different story though. Some of these guys might not be so clueless as to think they are much more than a stack of twenties to the girl, but others actually are that clueless. I've seen both scenarios. If girl sizes a customer up as being that clueless and exploits that, deceit is probably involved.

bem401
09-30-2009, 02:17 PM
Back on topic ( sort of ).

The RI General Assembly failed to reconcile the two differing bills closing the prostitution loophole. The issue won't be revisited for at least another month now.

My club of choice, presently one of the two cleanest clubs in the city, just reinstated restrictions on what type of dancing could be done right at the stage or stageside. Girls were giving full contact lapdances right at the stage for whatever tips they'd get (certainly not as much as a dance). That's over. Not sure exactly what is allowed, but the club wants them to take it to the booths, where they usually get a cut.

I don't know if this is in anticipation of the law change but management hopes the new laws will bring some of the customers back who'd left for the whorehouses the other clubs reportedly turned into over the last few years.

Cyril
09-30-2009, 03:02 PM
^^^Not I as I have not figured out if he is for real or not. :thinking:

That reminds me, we have to hit the strip club one of these days but I think I am still few hours of drive from you.

Cyril
09-30-2009, 03:28 PM
ya how bout cyril stop posting.

I have read your posts. The quality of my posts is definitely as good as yours if not any better.

Elvia
09-30-2009, 05:38 PM
I do not disagree with major portion of your post. However, I would like to clarify this. I do not believe that you ladies engage in anything evil while working at a strip club. It is part of your job to act as if you are interested in the client. It is art of deception. But it is not evil. At the same time, it is not acting either.

You do seem to possess some acting skills, based on your post.

In other words...no, you are not aware that there are other forms of acting besides "the method." Meaning you clearly haven't studied acting at all or you would know that. We can only assume that, as per usual, everything you have to same on the subject had been delivered directly from your ass.

Cyril
09-30-2009, 05:48 PM
In other words...no, you are not aware that there are other forms of acting besides "the method." Meaning you clearly haven't studied acting at all or you would know that. We can only assume that, as per usual, everything you have to same on the subject had been delivered directly from your ass.

How did you reach on that conclusion?

(I am baffled by your logic.)