View Full Version : Do SC men = all men?
Phil-W
10-08-2009, 10:46 AM
Now tell us how many customers have you developed a friendship with OTC. Now I wonder what the reason for that is. :thinking:
I think dancers need a sense of psychological separation between job and private life. As soon as the line between job and private life starts being blurred by OTC friendships with customers, dancers in effect start bringing their work home with them.
Put simplistically; if a girl has danced for you in the club, maybe ground on you, maybe let you touch her, why should she want a relationship with you outside of the club?
You have - for money - been allowed far inside of the dancer's "real life" boundaries. That's a powerful incentive not to allow you - a customer - cross the boundary between the special environment in which she is prepared to allow that to happen and her private life.
Phil.
Earl_the_Pearl
10-08-2009, 12:03 PM
You have - for money - been allowed far inside of the dancer's "real life" boundaries. That's a powerful incentive not to allow you - a customer - cross the boundary between the special environment in which she is prepared to allow that to happen and her private life.
Exactly a customer is looked down upon by dancers and must give her money to even talk to her.
JayATee
10-08-2009, 12:06 PM
Exactly a customer is looked down upon by dancers and must give her money to even talk to her.
<cookie> Now shut up.
jack0177057
10-08-2009, 12:20 PM
Exactly a customer is looked down upon by dancers and must give her money to even talk to her.
But most professionals also charge money to talk to clients and they don't look down on their clients... (Well,... with some clients I do...)
I must admit that a lot of the postings on this forum do make me feel like dancers "look down" on their customers,... but maybe, they are just venting some frustration... If the customers are obnoxious jerks, they deserve to be looked down upon... I have never felt looked down upon by a dancer, but I have always been respectful towards them... But, who knows... Maybe the dancer I bought dances from last month didn't like me, the bank teller I use doesn't either and the restaurant waitress who seems friendly to me harbors a secret contempt towards me... Which of these makes me a PL?
Also, most dancers I've dealt with will not demand money just for talking to them... However, the do hope that it leads to some profit, either that you'll buy them drinks, buy dances or tip them.
JayATee
10-08-2009, 12:26 PM
I must admit that a lot of the postings on this forum do make me feel like dancers "look down" on their customers,... but maybe, they are just venting some frustration...
Jack it's been said 100x's. This forum is for US to VENT. We do not have to worry about the customers here. We don't have to be strippers here. This is where we come to relax and talk and get support from our fellow dancers bc they understand what we're going through. Assuming that we hate our customers bc we vent about ones that pissed us off is silly. Im sure if there was a forum for lawyers that you frequented ppl reading your posts would think you hated your clients too. Why can't you guys seem to grasp this concept???
jack0177057
10-08-2009, 02:12 PM
Jack it's been said 100x's.
I know.
This forum is for US to VENT. We do not have to worry about the customers here. We don't have to be strippers here. This is where we come to relax and talk and get support from our fellow dancers bc they understand what we're going through. Assuming that we hate our customers bc we vent about ones that pissed us off is silly. Im sure if there was a forum for lawyers that you frequented ppl reading your posts would think you hated your clients too. Why can't you guys seem to grasp this concept???
I can grasp it, I'm not whining about it... But, while I do think that 95% of you are just "venting", there is probably at least 5% that really look down on us... It, happens,... its called becoming jaded and burnt out... Its like the criminal defense attorneys that start out believing that many innocent people are going to jail, but after a few years,... they hate all their clients and believe that all their clients are liars and scum.
JayATee
10-08-2009, 02:30 PM
I know.
I can grasp it, I'm not whining about it... But, while I do think that 95% of you are just "venting", there is probably at least 5% that really look down on us... It, happens,... its called becoming jaded and burnt out... Its like the criminal defense attorneys that start out believing that many innocent people are going to jail, but after a few years,... they hate all their clients and believe that all their clients are liars and scum.
I've been doing this for awhile already. I dont hate ALL of my customers. You're getting a skewed view.
Phil-W
10-08-2009, 02:49 PM
...I must admit that a lot of the postings on this forum do make me feel like dancers "look down" on their customers,... but maybe, they are just venting some frustration...
I get on well with the great majority of dancers I know. To do that I follow a few simple rules:
(a) I never forget they are working - and may well behave very differently in real life.
(b) I do not ask any questions about dancing - most dancers are fed up to the back teeth with them.
(c) I don't make personal remarks about the more intimate parts of a dancer - I stick to general compliments.
(d) I am invariably polite and well behaved.
(e) I do not try for phone numbers, OTC meetings, etc. (I do see dancers outside of work - but generally they suggested it, not I).
Do the above and there's little chance that dancers will vent about/look down on you personally.
Phil.
jack0177057
10-08-2009, 03:06 PM
I've been doing this for awhile already. I dont hate ALL of my customers. You're getting a skewed view.
I know... But also, you're not jaded or burnt out... It's easy to tell... I'm sure there are many dancers that dance all their adult lives and never become jaded or burnt out. I've met "older" dancers (late 30s, even early 40s) that have been dancing for many many years and have the nicest and sweetest personality.
But, on the other hand, there are dancers that become jaded and burnt out after only a few years. I'm not blaming them for that, because as a dancer, they see the worst in men and are exposed to abusive jerks, stigma, etc... I'm just saying, there are some.
jack0177057
10-08-2009, 03:36 PM
Do the above and there's little chance that dancers will vent about/look down on you personally.
I agree with your suggestions as far as SC etiquette, and professionalism, but,... whether or not a dancer "looks down" on you personally... you will probably never know, if she is good at her job... She can "look down" on you if you're married because you're looking for for sexual arousal outside of the marriage, or you're spending money on lap dances instead of buying something for your wife and kids... She can "look down" on you if you're middle-aged and single, because she thinks a "normal" guy your age should be married... She can "look down" on you if you spend too much money, because it makes you seem lonely and desperate,... or if you spend too little, because it makes you seem cheap.
Dancers are just like all other people,... they have opinions and value judgment and they are judging you on some level, even when they are doing business with you.
My point was that, maybe the dancer I bought dances from last month didn't really like me, and maybe the bank teller I use doesn't really like me, either, and maybe the restaurant waitress at my favorite restaurant, who seems very friendly to me, actually harbors a secret contempt towards me... None of this makes me a PL, unless I start obssessing over it or become an obnoxious jerk.
I treat everyone with courtesy, respect and professionalism, but, some people are going to "look down" on me for any one of a hundred reasons. That's just normal when you deal with people.
Golden_Rule
10-08-2009, 04:18 PM
If I ever even think about signing the papers again I want somebody, anybody to place my testicles on a slab of marble and drop an anvil on them. :yikes:
My first wife and I worked things out amicably.
I was the one with the cause when all was said and done but I don't hold grudges. It takes too much energy. I did assume our combined debt, and she liked plastic, so that was a bit of a problem for me at first but I dealt with it. I also set her up in her new digs and started her off on her new life. After that no alimony. No deductions from my pension or annuities. Nada. She went her way and I went mine, though we are still friendly when there is reason to speak to each other.
Given the freedom to be myself though and not have to constantly rob peter to pay paul because I had a wife with a plastic fix that needed filling I quickly bounced back financially. In the end it pays off better to have a quick, clean, break even though it might cost a bit.
With my second wife its all good. She's a long standing friend that I fell in love with. Friends do make better lovers. She knew me very well BEFORE we became romantically involved so she knew what she was getting herself into. :) Same the other way around. I'd not trade her in on another model no matter what I was promised. We've been together quite some time now and I am more glad of it today than I was the day we said, "I do".
The point is, if you are careful, you can get it right the second time around.
Golden_Rule
10-08-2009, 04:32 PM
... some people are going to "look down" on me for any one of a hundred reasons. That's just normal when you deal with people.
One of the reasons it was kind of fun to be a cop sometimes is you don't lose may of those kind of exchanges. You know, even as a traffic cop if someone mouths off you can always find legit reasons to issue extra tickets they wouldn't have gotten if they hadn't talked their way into them.
That aside, the comment above is certainly true but that doesn't mean you have to reward them for it, or not make them aware that they have no right to be looking down on anyone.
Most people live in some very glass houses. If you know how its not hard, if they give you good and proper reason to [its not fair to do it just for sport], to put them in their place. The vast majority of the time its not worth the effort though. I've found that kind of person is their own worst enemy.
I use to think people were rotten because they lived rotten lives. I've since found out that most of the time people have rotten lives because they are rotten people just getting back what they give.
JayATee
10-08-2009, 05:21 PM
I know...
You say you know... but I don't think you know... Anyway. W/e really.
minnow
10-08-2009, 05:54 PM
I agree with your suggestions as far as SC etiquette, and professionalism, but,... whether or not a dancer "looks down" on you personally... you will probably never know, if she is good at her job... She can "look down" on you if you're married because you're looking for for sexual arousal outside of the marriage, or you're spending money on lap dances instead of buying something for your wife and kids... She can "look down" on you if you're middle-aged and single, because she thinks a "normal" guy your age should be married... She can "look down" on you if you spend too much money, because it makes you seem lonely and desperate,... or if you spend too little, because it makes you seem cheap.
Dancers are just like all other people,... they have opinions and value judgment and they are judging you on some level, even when they are doing business with you.
My point was that, maybe the dancer I bought dances from last month didn't really like me, and maybe the bank teller I use doesn't really like me, either, and maybe the restaurant waitress at my favorite restaurant, who seems very friendly to me, actually harbors a secret contempt towards me... None of this makes me a PL, unless I start obssessing over it or become an obnoxious jerk.
I treat everyone with courtesy, respect and professionalism, but, some people are going to "look down" on me for any one of a hundred reasons. That's just normal when you deal with people.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I think we may have found a good intro paragraph to "Catch 22- In The Stripclub". I promise not to look down on you if you can laugh at lawyer jokes. ;D
xdamage
10-08-2009, 07:20 PM
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I think we may have found a good intro paragraph to "Catch 22- In The Stripclub". I promise not to look down on you if you can laugh at lawyer jokes. ;D
Okay stealing this last line for siggy ;D
Elvia
10-08-2009, 07:34 PM
I must admit that a lot of the postings on this forum do make me feel like dancers "look down" on their customers,...
I'm honestly not sure how guys come to this conclusion here. Whenever I hear a dancer ranting against a customer/s, it always seems clear that there's some specific inappropriate behavior that she's venting about. I don't understand why guys think we're talking about customers in general when we're clearly talking about customers that are grabby, don't follow the rules or the etiquette, say rude things, etc.
jack0177057
10-08-2009, 07:37 PM
You say you know... but I don't think you know... Anyway. W/e really.
I do know... Most of the dancers on this forum are awesome, even when they "vent"... I wouldn't be on this forum otherwise... And to be fair, us blues do say provocative things sometimes (okay, more than sometimes)...
vmurphy252
10-08-2009, 07:57 PM
I'm honestly not sure how guys come to this conclusion here. Whenever I hear a dancer ranting against a customer/s, it always seems clear that there's some specific inappropriate behavior that she's venting about. I don't understand why guys think we're talking about customers in general when we're clearly talking about customers that are grabby, don't follow the rules or the etiquette, say rude things, etc.
To play EtP:
Because we're all insecure PLs who are narcissistic as well and assume everything is about us.
jack0177057
10-08-2009, 07:57 PM
I'm honestly not sure how guys come to this conclusion here. Whenever I hear a dancer ranting against a customer/s, it always seems clear that there's some specific inappropriate behavior that she's venting about. I don't understand why guys think we're talking about customers in general when we're clearly talking about customers that are grabby, don't follow the rules or the etiquette, say rude things, etc.
You're right, for the most part.
I guess the comments that come across as "looking down" are those to the effect that you don't care if your customer gets hit by bus on his way out of the SC, as long as he paid for his dances.
If a customer spends a lot of money on you and appreciates the work that you do, you should at least wish him a safe ride home (as long as he was a gentleman and not a rude grabby bastard).
Its like if a customer says, "As long as the dancer gave me a good grinding lap dance and showed me her T & A, I don't care if she gets hit by a bus later on her way home." That is not a nice thing to say.
lopaw
10-08-2009, 08:08 PM
^^^^Some customers have egos so frail that maybe it's best for them not to go to stripclubs at all. If they can't have as thick a skin as the dancers must have, they ought to stay home and save themselves the anguish of wondering what the dancers really think of them.
Why do so many people have to make adult entertainment so complicated?
Go in, have a drink,chat a bit, have some dances, go home.
Repeat as needed.
JayATee
10-09-2009, 01:47 AM
I do know... Most of the dancers on this forum are awesome, even when they "vent"... I wouldn't be on this forum otherwise... And to be fair, us blues do say provocative things sometimes (okay, more than sometimes)...
Ok... so that gives you the impression that we "look down on you" why again???
jack0177057
10-09-2009, 07:27 AM
Why do so many people have to make adult entertainment so complicated?
Go in, have a drink,chat a bit, have some dances, go home.
Repeat as needed.
I agree. Sounds like a good prescription to me.
xdamage
10-09-2009, 07:48 AM
That is not a nice thing to say.
And some customers do think such things, but life goes on.
I think the main thing is that we humans are essentially self-serving, but it varies in degree from the criminal sociopath to the apparent altruist (who arguably still does what they do because it makes themselves feel good), so being self-interested really doesn't bother me.
The only thing I find troublesome is the following:
I may not always like my customers, but I need them.
I'm not trying to tell you I'm in it for them. That would be B.S., but I do need them. And I realize in the big picture that we are fortunate they do business with us. It is because they do that I enjoy my life, that I make money, my lively-hood is what it is. I'm thankful for that as it could easily be otherwise.
Now before I make my key point, I think we humans are very instinctive when it comes to reading each others feelings. Not necessarily consciously, but unconsciously. We do it constantly when in public and give it no more thought then breathing, but on some level we read others pretty well. Actors being the exception as they consciously try to project artificial feelings, but most people find intentional acting tiresome except in small degrees.
Anyway, the key point for me is this.. if I deal with you and I sense instinctively (or you put on a damn good act) that on some level you appreciate my business, I'm likely to go back to you. The reason is that your appreciation is also what is good for me. You're more likely to treat me fairly, to cut me a little slack, to do a bit more to keep me as a customer. I always sense on some level that you're sense of appreciation means you're likely to generally not entirely be self-absorbed, and probably less likely to screw me. So it still is about me, but we humans benefit from grouping, and groups are about how we balance our personal wants in ways that generally benefit the majority.
Likewise if you project feelings that you hate being at work, feel no appreciation that I'm a customer, it raises in me feelings that you are not a group player. That you're likely to screw me in our dealings, and if there are others who do appreciate my business, I'm far more likely to want to go on doing business with them because it is better for me.
The key point then is that individuals who feel no appreciation for those they do business, both buyers and sellers, are likely to project those feelings, and are contributors to their own situation. Antagonism breeds antagonism, both ways. If I feel it too much from a seller, I'll avoid them. Likewise if I project it too much as a buyer, it will be picked up on by the seller.
p.s., but keep in mind we honestly can't determine that from this forum as it is a support forum and so the emphasis is on venting steam, not on how people actually feel/behave once back on the job.
jack0177057
10-09-2009, 08:28 AM
Ok... so that gives you the impression that we "look down on you" why again???
Okay, JayATee... I won't argue with you about what I think to be the case (which I admit I do often). How about you tell me the actual truth - what percentage of customers do you respect and what percentage do you look down on?
jack0177057
10-09-2009, 08:36 AM
I think the main thing is that we humans are essentially self-serving, but it varies in degree from the criminal sociopath to the apparent altruist (who arguably still does what they do because it makes themselves feel good), so being self-interested really doesn't bother me.
It doesn't bother me either.
Here is my most cynical revelation - (which I don't personally practice, but I believe others do) - The dynamics of the customer/dancer relationship are such that the dancer needs to "look down" on the customer to be very successful. The more naive, lonely and insecure he is, the more she can profit from him... On the other hand, the customer needs to "look down" on the dancer to get the most "mileage" from her. He has to "push the envelope" at the risk of offending her, to get the most from the experience. And he has to keep his interest purely sexual, to avoid developing any feelings for the dancer, like the lovesick John below. (I can sincerely say that I have never touched a dancer's boobs, unless she placed my hands there or rubbed them in my face... But, I've got friends that like to brag about the touching that "they got away with".)
Here is a common scenario... John (single, mid-30s, no GF) goes to the SC for the first time and meets the dancer, Thia, who is gorgeous. Thia is really nice to him, tells him he's cute, asks him personal questions and appears to be fascinated with his answers. She flirts with him mercilessly and, finally, sells him lap dances. He didn't plan on spending too much money, but she kisses him on the face and a few times on the lips,... and he ends up going to the cash machine twice and buys a total of 10 lap dances, and maybe even goes to the VIP room with her. John fantasizes about her that night and thinks about her all day the next 3 days and is very distracted at work. He wonders if its possible that he has a shot at romance with Thia and gets on the internet and googles sites related to the personal lives of dancers. He finds SW and asks the infamous question, "Does she like me? -- She laughed at all my jokes, told me I'm cute, kissed me on the lips,... yada... yada...yada..." It doesn't take long for the comments to start pouring... They are ruthless... Ofcourse she doesn't like him, she moved on to another customer the second he left and he did not even leave a trace in her life... not even a blur... But, here he is three days later pondering whether she is his soulmate... The dancers cheer for Thia, she banked... John is officially declared a PL by the SW chorus...
xdamage
10-09-2009, 08:58 AM
It doesn't bother me either.
Here is my most cynical revelation - (which I don't personally practice, but I believe others do) - The dynamics of the customer/dancer relationship are such that the dancer needs to "look down" on the customer to be very successful. The more naive, lonely and insecure he is, the more she can profit from him... On the other hand, the customer needs to "look down" on the dancer to get the most "mileage" from her. He has to "push the envelope" at the risk of offending her, to get the most from the experience. And he has to keep his interest purely sexual, to avoid developing any feelings for the dancer, like the lovesick John below. (I can sincerely say that I have never touched a dancer's boobs, unless she placed my hands there or rubbed them in my face... But, I've got friends that like to brag about the touching that "they got away with".)
Could be there is some truth in there. Again though it makes me wonder. In the early 80s we went to see women "strip" - we didn't touch them. They didn't pretend to be our GFs or like us. They just danced, at a distance, and while there was some eye-to-eye game playing, the lack of contact and limited socializing (or none) when not on stage made it clear to the vast majority. It was just Playboy live.
It may be true to some degree that if people engage in physical contact, act like GF/BF, that it moves into a matter that runs too deep in our human wiring to reasonably expect all humans to see it as an entertainment no different then going to a live play. That in reality people's emotions do get involved, and so to protect them, many also ?have to? develop feelings of antagonism to manage the other feelings.
It may not help any that dancers are there 40+ hrs a week, and have a lot more time to learn how to manage their feelings in the situation then customers who visit rarely. But again the white elephant is the conflict of interest; that customers who do confuse fantasy with reality may spend more then those who don't, and that as a seller there is a conflict of interest between the financial goals and wanting customers to be cognizant enough that they don't act like asses.
We often have conflicts of interest. Such is life.
JayATee
10-09-2009, 10:59 AM
Okay, JayATee... I won't argue with you about what I think to be the case (which I admit I do often). How about you tell me the actual truth - what percentage of customers do you respect and what percentage do you look down on?
You're really missing the point here. It's not about how we feel about you. It's not about whether or not deep down inside I hate you or like you or any other emotion you can think of. This is about me making you feel like you're king of the world and in so doing that, making you want to give me all your money. Why do you care what I think of you as a person? Why should I think of you in anyway at all besides in the business relationship we are entering into for those few min (or hrs). My initial response to customers is all the same. I feel NOTHING towards you. If you do something that pisses me off, or repulses me, or whatever than I feel those emotions towards you. But the idea that I look down on you instantly bc you're a customer in a SC is ridiculous. Now are there some girls who hate men and hate their customers? Sure. But I would venture to say that most girls do not give a damn as long as they're making money.
Now my regs? Those are all guys I happen to like. That's why they're my regs.
But also remember that you're getting a personality (most likely even different from the one the guy sitting next to you got) and in turn you can tell me you're James Bond for all I care and I'll take you at your word bc I just don't care. Pay me well and we can talk about your shiny Aston Martin and whether or not that bulge in your pocket is that adorable little Walther PPK that I love so much.
It's business ITC. ALWAYS BUSINESS. Now on this website? On this website there is no onus on my part to be anything other than who I am. Im going to come here and talk about how bad my night was bc the girls here will commiserate with me and make me feel better. It does not mean that I hate all my customers or even a large amt of them. Think of this as the after work hang out for dancers and you're peeking through the front windows. Is that an accurate portrait? Of course not! When you go out with your boys after work and bitch about a client do they think you hate ALL your clients? No of course not. You're annoyed about one particular jerk who did one particular thing and you're blowing off some steam. It's the same thing here. And honestly this has been explained a hundred times. It's not rocket science.
In short (I know too late) IT DOESNT MATTER WHAT I THINK OF YOU. IT MATTERS HOW I DO MY JOB.
femmefatale88
10-09-2009, 11:30 AM
OK ladies, time to play amateur anthropologist:
Do the types of guys who frequent the SC make a representative cross-section of the general male population, or are there some definite differences in the type of guy that frequents the SC, in their attitudes, behaviors, beliefs?
Thoughts?
I didn't read through the posts so excuse me if I repeat something said earlier. I don't think that SC goers are representative of the general male population. The guys go who to SC's go for specific reasons, ie, unsatisfying relationship, need for attention that they don't get IRL, getting over a break up, etc, many reasons. But then again all men love naked women (heterosexual ones at least) and its very stress relieving.
chris91
10-09-2009, 11:49 AM
It doesn't bother me either.
The dynamics of the customer/dancer relationship are such that the dancer needs to "look down" on the customer to be very successful. The more naive, lonely and insecure he is, the more she can profit from him...
Wrong. I make the most money from traveling businessmen who are confident and know exactly what the deal is when it comes to strippers.
On the other hand, the customer needs to "look down" on the dancer to get the most "mileage" from her. He has to "push the envelope" at the risk of offending her, to get the most from the experience.
Wrong again. My customers will get better dances and have more fun in general if they do not push the envelope. Guys who try to get the most "mileage" end up at best, getting nothing more than a lame air dance, or at worst, getting a hard punch in the face.
jack0177057
10-09-2009, 11:56 AM
You're really missing the point here. It's not about how we feel about you. It's not about whether or not deep down inside I hate you or like you or any other emotion you can think of. This is about me making you feel like you're king of the world and in so doing that, making you want to give me all your money.
I totally agree, I don't go to the club to make friends for life.
Why do you care what I think of you as a person?
I only care if I've talked to you (and bought dances from you) on many occasions and consider you a friend and you lead me to believe I am your friend... (By "friend" I mean loosely ITC friend, not OTC friend.)
In short (I know too late) IT DOESNT MATTER WHAT I THINK OF YOU. IT MATTERS HOW I DO MY JOB.
But, I want you to like me.
KiwiStrawberry Splenda
10-09-2009, 01:15 PM
I must admit that a lot of the postings on this forum do make me feel like dancers "look down" on their customers,... but maybe, they are just venting some frustration... If the customers are obnoxious jerks, they deserve to be looked down upon...
If any men on here reads the stripper's rant, and feel that it applies to them personally, then yes, we DO look down upon you. If you are grabbing and groping, begging for sex or dates, bragging that you are friends with the manager and don't have to pay, etc, etc....then you are an asshole. No matter where you are, if you behave in a disrespectful manner, you are an asshole and people will hate you and bitch about you when you leave.
However, if you're respectful, you can treat the experience as a business transaction or something more visceral, in the end, the strippers will like you and want you to come back. Simple, logical.
JayATee
10-09-2009, 01:44 PM
I only care if I've talked to you (and bought dances from you) on many occasions and consider you a friend and you lead me to believe I am your friend... (By "friend" I mean loosely ITC friend, not OTC friend.)
How can you consider me a friend? This is where you're still having a problem. I AM A STRIPPER! Nothing I tell you, from my age to my name is real. NOTHING. You don't know me. And I know nothing about you. You can tell me you're a lawyer. Do I really know? No. You can tell me you're single and in reality you left your wedding band in the car. There is no "friendship". Why can't you understand this?
But, I want you to like me.
You want a complete and total stranger, who is also a completely and totally fake personality to like you?? Ookay.... ::)
Elvia
10-09-2009, 01:59 PM
You're right, for the most part.
I guess the comments that come across as "looking down" are those to the effect that you don't care if your customer gets hit by bus on his way out of the SC, as long as he paid for his dances.
If a customer spends a lot of money on you and appreciates the work that you do, you should at least wish him a safe ride home (as long as he was a gentleman and not a rude grabby bastard).
Its like if a customer says, "As long as the dancer gave me a good grinding lap dance and showed me her T & A, I don't care if she gets hit by a bus later on her way home." That is not a nice thing to say.
Ok, I can see how that can be an upsetting thing for a customer to read. Maybe it's just because I'm on the other side of this, but I don't take it that literally. In most cases when dancers express such sentiments, I don't think they really mean they want the customer to get hit by a bus. I think the message they're trying to get across is that the dancer doesn't care about the custie as much as she has to pretend to in the club. I know I can't definitively speak for other dancers here, but that's the impression I've always taken away from statements like that.
Along those lines, I also don't think it's necessary for the dancer to look down on the customers, but I do think it's necessary to keep an emotional distance. Even the customers who's company I enjoy will never be on the same level as my friends. I feel the same way towards my customers that I felt towards people who regularly patronize other businesses I worked in. If I found out that one of them had been hit by a bus on the way home, I would probably say "Wow, really? Damn, I was just talking to him. That's terrible. What a shame." then shake my head and get back to work. I kinda care, but it's not really going to have a significant emotional impact on my life. I deal with so many people everyday, I just can't develop much of an attatchment beyond that of a typical mild aquaintancship. Maybe that's why it also doesn't bother me to hear customers say something similar, except in situations where there's something else about the guy that seems creepy and angry and leads me to believe that he has real resnetment/anger and actually actively wants bad things to befall us.
vmurphy252
10-09-2009, 02:01 PM
Ok, In most cases when dancers express such sentiments, I don't think they really mean they want the customer to get hit by a bus. I think the message they're trying to get across is that the dancer doesn't care about the custie as much as she has to pretend to in the club. I know I can't definitively speak for other dancers here, but that's the impression I've always taken away from statements like that.
I agree. Kind of "I could kill that guy". Very few people actually mean that when they say it...
Phil-W
10-09-2009, 02:33 PM
...Now on this website? On this website there is no onus on my part to be anything other than who I am...Think of this as the after work hang out for dancers and you're peeking through the front windows...
Wherein lies the 'problem' with a website like this - it is a peep behind the curtain.
Most men are intrigued by dancers - I've lost count of the number of times I've heard 'experts' sounding off in pubs and bars. But IRL, they'll never have a chance to have get to know a dancer OTC. This website provides a surrogate for that - you can eavesdrop on conversations between dancers.
However, as soon as any guy comes onto this site, he has to come to terms with the contradiction between the illusion in the strip club and the reality of the peep behind the curtain here.
Which is why you get relatively few guys posting long term on here. It's easy to spend money in a strip club when your illusions are intact - but once reality intrudes you start to think "what's really going through the dancer's mind". And once you start to think that, it reduces your motive to go to the club and buy dances.
I think a lot of the "do you like me" threads on here are guys trying to resolve that contradiction - in their own minds at least.
Phil.
laurcon
10-09-2009, 02:53 PM
^ honestly, any guy that is into strip clubs enough to come onto this site wouldn't interest me as a customer anyway, so i don't really care if guys read our posts and lose their fantasy and stop going to SCs. that might be offensive but its how i feel. i'm sure lots of the guys here are good customers for certain dancers. just like there are all different types of dancers and men have preferences, there are all types of customers and i have preferences. sure some girls don't care and money is money, that's one type of dancer. would be nice to be like that but i'm still too emotionally attached or something. so my type of customer is way too focused on his job to be spending time on the internet concerned with mine.
Earl_the_Pearl
10-09-2009, 03:39 PM
Now my regs? Those are all guys I happen to like. That's why they're my regs.
If a "reg" lost his job and could not tip you except for a few dollars how long would you keep him as a reg? What if he promised he would make it up to you as soon as he got a new job?
JayATee
10-09-2009, 03:40 PM
If a "reg" lost his job and could not tip you except for a few dollars how long would you keep him as a reg? What if he promised he would make it up to you as soon as he got a new job?
Get over it Earl. It's fucking old already.
Elvia
10-09-2009, 03:44 PM
Personally, I would still be friendly to him, have fun dancing for him on stage (I assume that's what you mean by the "few dollars" tip), and maybe even sit for a drink when I had the time. But then I would get back to selling dances. I am at work after all. Decent regs understand it.
Just because you're not willing to sabotage your entire work day or dance for free for someone doesn't mean you don't like them.
Having a whiney, needy "but you don't really like me!" attitude is the fastest way to make me really not like you.
Earl_the_Pearl
10-09-2009, 03:56 PM
Most men are intrigued by dancers - I've lost count of the number of times I've heard 'experts' sounding off in pubs and bars. But IRL, they'll never have a chance to have get to know a dancer OTC. This website provides a surrogate for that - you can eavesdrop on conversations between dancers.
This site my be a look through the window but to "know" and know dancers OTC is a trip through the looking glass.
When logic and proportion
Have fallen sloppy dead
And the coquette is talking backwards
And the Red Queen's "Off with his head!"
Remember what the PL said
Earl_the_Pearl
10-09-2009, 04:01 PM
Having a whiney, needy "but you don't really like me!" attitude is the fastest way to make me really not like you.
I know you don't love me, I know you don't want me but I know you need me; one out of three ain't bad.
Explanation; I use me to represent all PLs.
Elvia
10-09-2009, 04:08 PM
from what I understand, you go to whorehouses, and at most deign to give anyone who's not offering extras the bare minimum of stage tipping. So no, I don't need you. And I don't keep PL's as regulars.
Earl_the_Pearl
10-09-2009, 04:22 PM
from what I understand, you go to whorehouses, and at most deign to give anyone who's not offering extras the bare minimum of stage tipping. So no, I don't need you. And I don't keep PL's as regulars.
Your understanding is not in accordance with the facts. My avocation takes to many and varied clubs. I just enjoy some more than others.
You may be pleased to know as I was leaving a Newark club at closing time I got suckered punched buy a punk they wouldn't let in; yes my face hurts I pay for my sins.
jack0177057
10-09-2009, 04:23 PM
How can you consider me a friend? This is where you're still having a problem. I AM A STRIPPER! Nothing I tell you, from my age to my name is real. NOTHING. You don't know me. And I know nothing about you. You can tell me you're a lawyer. Do I really know? No. You can tell me you're single and in reality you left your wedding band in the car. There is no "friendship". Why can't you understand this?
I specifically said I am using the word "friend" very loosely... Just like I am "friends" with anyone I have done business with on a regular basis... Maybe acqaintance is a better word.
You want a complete and total stranger, who is also a completely and totally fake personality to like you?? Ookay.... ::)
Okay, I guess an illustration is necessary...
I meet a dancer, Sandy, for the first time, and we talk for a long while, and she does the flirting and the flattery... And gives me lapdances, etc... No, she is not my "friend"... She acts like she is, but that's just part of her job.
Now, fast forward to 12-months later. I've met Sandy a total of 24 times in the past 12-months. Aside from the lap dances, we've had a lot of drinks together and talked a lot about personal stuff. I know about her 8-year old child. I know about her ex-boyfriend who was a jerk to her and I also know about her new boyfriend who seems like a nice guy. I know about where she grew up and about her family. She knows about my ex-wife and my current GF. (Maybe we've lied to each other about a few things, but so what, "friends" tell each other lies, too - don't they? ) We've exchanged relationship advise. Whenever she sees me, she greets me and comes right over to my table, even though I'm not a huge spender. After I buy all the dances for the night, she lingers with me, until I leave. I don't expect our "friendship" will ever extend OTC, but I think that over a period of time, we've become "friends" - and again, I'm using the word "friends" very loosely -- as in, caring for someone just a little.
I've had one dancer "friend" like this (only one in my lifetime), and yes, I did consider her a "friend". We knew each other for a long time. Something very tragic happened to her and it made me very very sad for a long time. I would hope that, had I been the one who was killed in a car accident, she would have felt at least a little bit of sadness for me. It seems like you're saying she wouldn't have cared in the least bit, because dancers are incapable of forming any "friends" in the club, even if they've known that customer for a very long time. That's cold.
Earl_the_Pearl
10-09-2009, 04:29 PM
It seems like you're saying she wouldn't have cared in the least bit, because dancers are incapable of forming any "friends" in the club, even if they've known that customer for a very long time. That's cold.
Her sadness would be in direct proportion to the amount of money she would be out because you are dead.
JayATee
10-09-2009, 05:18 PM
dancers are incapable of forming any "friends" in the club, even if they've known that customer for a very long time. That's cold.
Ugh. No this is not what Im saying, and the fact that this is what you think Im saying means that you're completely clueless and as usual no scenario I give you will help you to understand bc you don't want to. W/e. I've had enough. This is absurd. ::)
SteveSmith
10-09-2009, 05:33 PM
So the dancer may or may not like her customer:
http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/4571/bfd2.gif
chris91
10-09-2009, 06:08 PM
Her sadness would be in direct proportion to the amount of money she would be out because you are dead.
You are an idiot.
Elvia
10-10-2009, 12:36 AM
Now, fast forward to 12-months later. I've met Sandy a total of 24 times in the past 12-months. Aside from the lap dances, we've had a lot of drinks together and talked a lot about personal stuff. I know about her 8-year old child. I know about her ex-boyfriend who was a jerk to her and I also know about her new boyfriend who seems like a nice guy. I know about where she grew up and about her family. She knows about my ex-wife and my current GF. (Maybe we've lied to each other about a few things, but so what, "friends" tell each other lies, too - don't they? )
Well...no, not to the same extent. You really have no idea if any of those things are true. There's good reason to lie about almost everything to custies. Sometimes it's a safety precaution. Sometimes it's because the truth would be a fantasy-killer. Sometimes it's just an attempt to keep emotional distance between work life and OTC life. I don't think I'd lie to a real friend about things like what school I'm going to (or even lying about whether I go to school or not), what my day job is, where I live, whether I have kids or not, etc.
Earl_the_Pearl
10-10-2009, 12:38 AM
You are an idiot.
May I suggest a more dynamic and powerful medium?