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Caprica6
10-21-2009, 11:43 AM
I must be one of those strange dancers that actually enjoys stage time. I don't have to harrass guys to buy shit from me, they just throw money (or they don't).

At my club it's 3 song set and the songs have to be between 3-5 min (which sucks because Muse - Uprising beats 5min and I want to dance to it so bad!), so AT MOST a girl would be up for 15 minutes. Doesn't seem all too bad to me.


As for you, if you are that picky about your girls then I don't know what to tell you... You're never going to be satisfied. Sounds to me like you just want to complain about everything. Or you're one of those cheap asses who just wants a free show, in which case stay home and watch a porno.

KiwiStrawberry Splenda
10-21-2009, 04:02 PM
^I'm not in Canada or the US.

Ok, so WHERE are you? The reason I ask is that stage rotations often vary by regions. If you tell me your country, I might be able to think of nearby clubs that don't have such long stage rotations.

I have danced at places from stage sets as short as one single 3 minute song..to having 2 songs on main stage, then dancing on top of the bar, all the way across it, for another 30 minutes, until each cust sitting at the bar had a chance to see a short show, and tip.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 12:22 AM
I must be one of those strange dancers that actually enjoys stage time. I don't have to harrass guys to buy shit from me, they just throw money (or they don't).

At my club it's 3 song set and the songs have to be between 3-5 min (which sucks because Muse - Uprising beats 5min and I want to dance to it so bad!), so AT MOST a girl would be up for 15 minutes. Doesn't seem all too bad to me.

It is if I don't like the dancer. Like I said, it's not the length of the dance, it's the number of dancers I get to see in the time I'm there. I'd prefer it to be more.


As for you, if you are that picky about your girls then I don't know what to tell you... You're never going to be satisfied. Sounds to me like you just want to complain about everything. Or you're one of those cheap asses who just wants a free show, in which case stay home and watch a porno.

Should I not be picky? I have been satisfied, just not every time I go. To me an LD is a luxury, not a routine, and I like to spend my money on something good, and only as much of it as I need. Sorry if that makes your life difficult, but I don't spend money to fill other people's pockets.

I started this thread to find out why sets are this long, not to complain. But I don't like it and I can't say so and not complain.

My earlier posts in this thread made it clear that I do have LDs and that this is one reason I would like to be able to check out more girls on stage. Even if I don't get an LD, I tip dancers who's stage shows I like. How did you get from "wants to see more stage shows" to "must be a cheap-ass"?

Also, I like stage shows. Dancers can move on stage in ways that they can't on my lap.

Video isn't the same as live in a club and I don't like porn films. Strip shows are not the same thing as porn films.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 12:28 AM
Ok, so WHERE are you? The reason I ask is that stage rotations often vary by regions. If you tell me your country, I might be able to think of nearby clubs that don't have such long stage rotations.

I have danced at places from stage sets as short as one single 3 minute song..to having 2 songs on main stage, then dancing on top of the bar, all the way across it, for another 30 minutes, until each cust sitting at the bar had a chance to see a short show, and tip.

I prefer not say where I live on the internet. (Thanks anyway.) I've been to all the clubs near me. Some don't have this problem, but most do. I posted here to find out why.

J.D.
10-22-2009, 12:43 AM
^^^ Uhhh, so you are scared to list the country in which you live? That's a bit extreme.

laurcon
10-22-2009, 01:02 AM
um this guy is pissing me off.
hopper, if you only tip the girls you like, but watch others (most) naked for free for 15 mins, and possibly get 1 or 2 LD's, then yeah we consider that cheap and don't really care about what you have to say. its like a dude with a hundred bucks asking to talk to an asset manager at Goldman Sachs. ::)
and you're hilarious to not say what country you're in but act flattered as if a girl really wanted to stalk you. please.

J.D.
10-22-2009, 01:05 AM
^^^ I know, right! It's like, he must be Brad Pitt handsome or have a huge dick, because he is one cocky mofo.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 01:25 AM
^^^ Uhhh, so you are scared to list the country in which you live? That's a bit extreme.

Who needs to know? It's my choice what I tell people. Reason is that the dancers in the strip clubs I go to might also be here at this stripper site.

No need for attitude.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 01:32 AM
um this guy is pissing me off.
hopper, if you only tip the girls you like, but watch others (most) naked for free for 15 mins, and possibly get 1 or 2 LD's, then yeah we consider that cheap and don't really care about what you have to say. its like a dude with a hundred bucks asking to talk to an asset manager at Goldman Sachs. ::)
and you're hilarious to not say what country you're in but act flattered as if a girl really wanted to stalk you. please.

So I should tip dancers I don't like? If all customers did that then any girl and her dog would be stripping. The question is do I enjoy watching them? Or if I don't watch them, how do I know if I like them? It would be rude to ignore them. And I did pay cover to get in. I also buy drinks and tip waitresses and buy drinks for dancers who approach me.

Like I said, I don't want to sit around in your club taking up too much space for the amount of money I spend. I don't enjoy being there any longer than I need to. That's why the set lengths are a problem at least for me.

A strip club doesn't equate to Goldman Sachs. If you don't like how much I spend, raise your prices or lengthen the minimun LD time. Then you can focus on all your corporate CEO customers. It's not as if I take any more of a dancer's time than I pay her for. I don't tie them up with conversation.

Not only girls go to internet forums.

Again, no need for attitude. Lighten up.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 01:37 AM
^^^ I know, right! It's like, he must be Brad Pitt handsome or have a huge dick, because he is one cocky mofo.

Look who's talking. It's not about being cocky, it's about privacy. Why shold I tell you anything about me you don't need to know? Why does it upset you? Why do you want to know?

J.D.
10-22-2009, 01:38 AM
So I should tip dancers I don't like? If all customers did that then any girl and her dog would be stripping. The question is do I enjoy watching them? Or if I don't, how do I know if I like them? It would be rude to ignore them. And I did pay cover to get in.

Like I said, I don't want to sit around in your club taking up too much space for the amount of money I spend. I don't enjoy being there any longer than I need to. That's why the set lengths are a problem at least for me.

A strip club doesn't equate to Goldman Sachs. If you don't like how much I spend, raise your prices or lengthen the minimun LD time. Then you can focus on all your corporate CEO customers. It's not as if I take any more of a dancer's time than I par her for.

Not only girls go to internet forums.

Again, no need for attitude. Lighten up.

First, yes you should if you are sitting at the tip rail. You chose to sit there, we don't work for free. I have been known to not take my clothes off at all if guys aren't tipping.

Second, you keep contradicting yourself.



often I CAN tell if I like a girl just from talking or even from across the room. Depends on how she dresses - if it shows off her body/face the right way or shows enough of it.

laurcon
10-22-2009, 01:46 AM
Like I said, I don't want to sit around in your club taking up too much space for the amount of money I spend. I don't enjoy being there any longer than I need to. That's why the set lengths are a problem at least for me.

A strip club doesn't equate to Goldman Sachs. If you don't like how much I spend, raise your prices or lengthen the minimun LD time. Then you can focus on all your corporate CEO customers. It's not as if I take any more of a dancer's time than I par her for.


actually, all the goldman guys come to my club and spend lots of company money (shhh!). and my prices are damn high, you couldn't come close to even paying for drinks at my club. well that is if you can even buy drinks, because on weekends its bottle service only if you want to sit down. i work at the nicest club in nyc, so please don't tell me anything about my club. trust me, every guy is in a suit and no one pays attn to stage because everyone has a girl or 2 in their lap. you'd get laughed out of the club if you could even get in, so we don't have to worry about crossing paths. }:D

and strip clubs are a luxury, not dances. >:(

sorry for letting him bait me, but i'm drunk :-\

Hopper
10-22-2009, 01:47 AM
First, yes you should if you are sitting at the tip rail. You chose to sit there, we don't work for free. I have been known to not take my clothes off at all if guys aren't tipping.

Second, you keep contradicting yourself.

I don't sit at the tip rail. I tip dancers after they come off. I don't like going to the stage to tip. You will probably ridicule me for that too the mood you are in. Generally dancers strip enough without first being tipped.

I said often, not always, not even most of the time. Why are you trying to find fault? You have the whole rest of the internet if you don't agree with me. I haven't said anything offensive, so go and be pissed off somewhere else.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 01:53 AM
actually, all the goldman guys come to my club and spend lots of company money (shhh!). and my prices are damn high, you couldn't come close to even paying for drinks at my club. well that is if you can even buy drinks, because on weekends its bottle service only if you want to sit down. i work at the nicest club in nyc, so please don't tell me anything about my club. trust me, every guy is in a suit and no one pays attn to stage because everyone has a girl or 2 in their lap. you'd get laughed out of the club if you could even get in, so we don't have to worry about crossing paths. }:D

and strip clubs are a luxury, not dances. >:(

sorry for letting him bait me, but i'm drunk :-\

Being drunk is never an excuse and I didn't say anything to bait you.

I didn't know anything about your club and I don't see why it is relevant to this thread, since I am of course talking about clubs that I CAN get into. Nice to have some elitist snobs around here though.

If dances aren't a luxury, then why are the clubs a luxury? Is it the dirinks or the decor?

J.D.
10-22-2009, 01:56 AM
Look who's talking. It's not about being cocky, it's about privacy. Why shold I tell you anything about me you don't need to know? Why does it upset you? Why do you want to know?

I don't care about your personal life, and nothing upsets me, I was trying to get a better insight so that I could answer the OP.

J.D.
10-22-2009, 01:58 AM
I don't sit at the tip rail. I tip dancers after they come off. I don't like going to the stage to tip. You will probably ridicule me for that too the mood you are in. Generally dancers strip enough without first being tipped.

I said often, not always, not even most of the time. Why are you trying to find fault? You have the whole rest of the internet if you don't agree with me. I haven't said anything offensive, so go and be pissed off somewhere else.

Huh? I'm not pissed, just can't figure out your posts ::)

laurcon
10-22-2009, 01:59 AM
Like I said, I don't want to sit around in your club taking up too much space for the amount of money I spend. I don't enjoy being there any longer than I need to. That's why the set lengths are a problem at least for me.

A strip club doesn't equate to Goldman Sachs. If you don't like how much I spend, raise your prices or lengthen the minimun LD time. Then you can focus on all your corporate CEO customers. It's not as if I take any more of a dancer's time than I pay her for. I don't tie them up with conversation.



Being drunk is never an excuse and I didn't say anything to bait you.

I didn't know anything about your club and I don't see why it is relevant to this thread, since I am of course talking about clubs that I CAN get into. Nice to have some elitist snobs around here though.

If dances aren't a luxury, then why are the clubs a luxury? Is it the dirinks or the decor?

perhaps trying using third person rather than second. then i won't take it personal. and its not an excuse for anything? lame! i think people understand dancing on a subway when you're drunk but would be a little more curious if you did it sober, although i would totally give props.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 02:06 AM
I don't care about your personal life, and nothing upsets me, I was trying to get a better insight so that I could answer the OP.

Okay. But where I live is not essential for that. I thought when you called me cocky you were complaining about something I said.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 02:07 AM
Huh? I'm not pissed, just can't figure out your posts ::)

Tell me what you don't understand and I'll explain it.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 02:15 AM
perhaps trying using third person rather than second. then i won't take it personal. and its not an excuse for anything? lame! i think people understand dancing on a subway when you're drunk but would be a little more curious if you did it sober, although i would totally give props.

I don't see why those comments are offensive in first, second or third person. I wasn't saying I don't want to be in your club (or any other club I go to), or that I don't enjoy it. I said that I don't want to be there any longer than I need to (i.e. to see a few good stage shows and possible an LD or two) and don't have any interest in being a waste of space by hanging out there.

I wouldn't mind if you danced on a subway, but I would mind you bitching at me for no reason on a subway.

J.D.
10-22-2009, 02:23 AM
I really don't feel like arguing over wording and semantics.

Hopper
10-22-2009, 02:31 AM
^That wasn't all my fault.

KiwiStrawberry Splenda
10-22-2009, 02:04 PM
He must live in Greenland or the Falkland Islands. Some place so low in population, we could find him. LOL

The only reason I ask is because you are complaining about an aspect of clubs that differs in regions of the world. I'm not coming after you for your $20. Idiot.

Elvia
10-22-2009, 02:43 PM
So I should tip dancers I don't like? If all customers did that then any girl and her dog would be stripping. The question is do I enjoy watching them? Or if I don't watch them, how do I know if I like them? It would be rude to ignore them. And I did pay cover to get in. I also buy drinks and tip waitresses and buy drinks for dancers who approach me.



I don't understand this.

Yes, if you're going to watch someone's stage show, you should tip them. It's only $1 a song. If a new girl comes up to the stage and you figure you probably don't like her enough to gamble a whole dollar on the next song, you should leave the tip rail or turn away and stop watching the stage.

It is much more rude to sit there for the full 10 minutes or so and watch the stage set and not tip, than to "ignore" us. We don't care if you ignore us. It's not a talent show. We do care if you watch the stage show and give us nothing for it. We pay to be there, probably a lot more than you paid to get in. The least you could do is tip us if you're going to watch the show.

J.D.
10-22-2009, 02:45 PM
Okay. But where I live is not essential for that. I thought when you called me cocky you were complaining about something I said.

Dude, it's like this. You are asking a question, "Why are stage sets so long?" that cannot be properly answered by us dancers unless we know what region of which you are speaking. We ask where you live, so that we can get a better understanding of the clubs work over there, and you tell us it's private, in a way that suggests you are too VIP or don't want dancers looking you up or something. First of all, slim chance that would happen, and it does come across as you sounding cocky. :D

Hopper
10-23-2009, 02:48 AM
He must live in Greenland or the Falkland Islands. Some place so low in population, we could find him. LOL

The only reason I ask is because you are complaining about an aspect of clubs that differs in regions of the world. I'm not coming after you for your $20. Idiot.

Idiot?

I already explained why I don't want to say where I live, not that I am obliged to give a reason. You already explained why you asked. I don't see what it would have to do with "my $20".

Hopper
10-23-2009, 03:00 AM
I don't understand this.

Yes, if you're going to watch someone's stage show, you should tip them. It's only $1 a song. If a new girl comes up to the stage and you figure you probably don't like her enough to gamble a whole dollar on the next song, you should leave the tip rail or turn away and stop watching the stage.

It is much more rude to sit there for the full 10 minutes or so and watch the stage set and not tip, than to "ignore" us. We don't care if you ignore us. It's not a talent show. We do care if you watch the stage show and give us nothing for it. We pay to be there, probably a lot more than you paid to get in. The least you could do is tip us if you're going to watch the show.

As I said, I don't sit at the tip rail. I don't need to be that close to watch the show. I tip them later if I get a chance to, and I do go out of my way. I don't like going to the stage. I'm a wallflower.

Is it okay for me to watch if I'm not taking up tipper seating at the stage? The only way I can ignore you (and that you can be sure I am) is by turning my back. At least, that is what Paris said to bem401 today in another thread whenhe claimed he doesn't watch stage shows. Her reasonning is that the eye is involuntarily attracted by moving objects. Patrons turning their backs to dancers would not reflect nicely on her.

And again, how do I know I like the dancer's show unless I do watch at least some of it? And if don't like it at the start, I may change my mind part of the way through the dance.

Seems to me "don't like, don't watch" makes no sense. And I can't afford to tip every dancer in the club.

As for the dancer paying more to be there than me, she is also making more money from being there than I am (none), and more than she is paying, or else she is making a loss.

Hopper
10-23-2009, 03:07 AM
Dude, it's like this. You are asking a question, "Why are stage sets so long?" that cannot be properly answered by us dancers unless we know what region of which you are speaking. We ask where you live, so that we can get a better understanding of the clubs work over there, and you tell us it's private, in a way that suggests you are too VIP or don't want dancers looking you up or something. First of all, slim chance that would happen, and it does come across as you sounding cocky. :D

I appreciate that you want to know where I live so you can answer my question or learn about how clubs work here.

I don't know how I suggested that I'm VIP. It's common knowledge that many people don't like giving out info about themselves on the net simply for the sake of caution. I already explained that the reason is that I don't want dancers I talk to in clubs I go to, who may be at these forums, connecting me to my posts here. I expect that the attention of dancers here who work in in my town would be partularly drawn to customers who live in their town posting here.

Would it help if I just told you the country anyway? It could vary between regions or towns.

laurcon
10-23-2009, 12:10 PM
.

Seems to me "don't like, don't watch" makes no sense. And I can't afford to tip every dancer in the club.

As for the dancer paying more to be there than me, she is also making more money from being there than I am (none), and more than she is paying, or else she is making a loss.

i'd say save your money and don't come if that's the case. and i don't understand, if you're not tipping dancers, how do you expect dancers to be making money? you expect every other customer to pick up the slack? the dancers are also doing more work than you are (none). and yes, sometimes we do go home negative!

J.D.
10-23-2009, 12:49 PM
I appreciate that you want to know where I live so you can answer my question or learn about how clubs work here.

I don't know how I suggested that I'm VIP. It's common knowledge that many people don't like giving out info about themselves on the net simply for the sake of caution. I already explained that the reason is that I don't want dancers I talk to in clubs I go to, who may be at these forums, connecting me to my posts here. I expect that the attention of dancers here who work in in my town would be partularly drawn to customers who live in their town posting here.

Would it help if I just told you the country anyway? It could vary between regions or towns.

Yes, but I seriously doubt that you will.

Elvia
10-23-2009, 01:05 PM
As I said, I don't sit at the tip rail. I don't need to be that close to watch the show. I tip them later if I get a chance to, and I do go out of my way. I don't like going to the stage. I'm a wallflower.

Is it okay for me to watch if I'm not taking up tipper seating at the stage? The only way I can ignore you (and that you can be sure I am) is by turning my back. At least, that is what Paris said to bem401 today in another thread whenhe claimed he doesn't watch stage shows. Her reasonning is that the eye is involuntarily attracted by moving objects. Patrons turning their backs to dancers would not reflect nicely on her.


I can see that in order to respond to this, I'm mainly going to be repeating myself.

If you're watching the show, even if you're not at the rack, you should be tipping the minimum. Yes, it is rude. I've never worked in a club where girls didn't bitch endlessly about guys who do this.

And yes, in the clubs I work at, guys do turn around, or to the side, if they do not want to watch (and tip) the stage show. That's fine. That does not bother us. Once again MUCH more rude to watch and not tip. If you want to tell yourself that you're just watching the stage show without tipping because you're such a nice guy and you just don't want to offend anyone, well...I'm here to tell you no. It would be much preferable for you to turn around.





And again, how do I know I like the dancer's show unless I do watch at least some of it? And if don't like it at the start, I may change my mind part of the way through the dance.

Seems to me "don't like, don't watch" makes no sense. And I can't afford to tip every dancer in the club.


If you don't know if you'll like her stage show, then Jesus Christ, go ahead and gamble a whole damn dollar. If you don't like it after the first song, you don't have to keep watching and tipping. If you can't afford to gamble a whole dollar, then don't watch to begin with. She's putting on a show up there. It's extremely rude to act like it's not even worth a dollar to you, even though you're going to watch the whole thing. The vast majority of the men who come into the club seem to be able to manage this etiquette. When I go to the clubs, I tip for every song that I watch. When I don't want to keep tipping, I move away so it's obvious I'm not watching the show at all. It's really not that hard.

Elvia
10-23-2009, 01:08 PM
i'd say save your money and don't come if that's the case. and i don't understand, if you're not tipping dancers, how do you expect dancers to be making money? you expect every other customer to pick up the slack? the dancers are also doing more work than you are (none). and yes, sometimes we do go home negative!

Sadly, this mind frame seems to be becoming more and more common. When I went in for a nightshift the other day, the dayshift girls told me they were leaving with $5-$10 each. And no, the club had not just been super dead. They said a few large groups had come in and not tipped anything. So I'm not really surprised by Hopper's attitude.

KiwiStrawberry Splenda
10-23-2009, 02:57 PM
I'm still curious about the country. I've danced in and patronized SC all over the world, and its just a personal interest. There are like 6 billion people on earth, what's the likelihood someone will know.

Anyway, since the stage rotation is loose and disorganized, with girls going up whenever, switching, randomly jumping on stage, etc...then they might have the ability to shorten the sets, but don't want to because they make decent money onstage versus on the floor?

laurcon
10-23-2009, 04:33 PM
^ AUSTRALIA! must be. lemme warn all aussie dancers to watch out for Hopper. }:D

Cyril
10-23-2009, 06:53 PM
I would like to chime in.

Let me start off with a request. Please do not pressure Hopper for any personal information he does not feel comfortable revealing. I have revealed tons of information about myself and I wish I had not done that. It is just not a good idea for various reasons.

Now, let us tackle the topic at hand.

What I am seeing here is what I call a classic case of disconnect between PLs and strippers. Project Dream Girls attempted to answer some of these quandaries. But that is water under the bridge now.

A problem has been posed: the customer is not happy to put up with a girl for fifteen minutes because she is not his type. We have two options: a) Find the solution for the problem b) Bitch about customers

I think option b is counter productive and does not help any of the actors involved; this includes strippers, PLs and owners.

I think clubs should do a better job at screening girls from beauty angle. Once again importance of through screening was pointed out in the Project Dream Girls.

Elvia
10-23-2009, 07:01 PM
What I am seeing here is what I call a classic case of disconnect between PLs and strippers. Project Dream Girls attempted to answer some of these quandaries. But that is water under the bridge now.


Yeah, let's keep it that way.

Cyril
10-23-2009, 07:15 PM
Yeah, let's keep it that way.

“Every age, every culture, every custom and tradition has its own character, its own weakness and its own strength, its beauties and cruelties; it accepts certain sufferings as matters of course, puts up patiently with certain evils. Human life is reduced to real suffering, to hell, only when two ages, two cultures and religions overlap.”

- Herman Hesse

Elvia
10-23-2009, 07:20 PM
Whatever Cyril ::)

Perhaps it would help you for me to be more specific in my criticism:

1) this is the problem of one customer. As has been mentioned, many customers also bitch when the stage shows are "too short."

2) your "screening for beauty" doesn't solve the problem of a girl not being a customers type. Clubs often hire a variety of girls so as to cater to a variety of tastes. So, he's likely still going to have to put up with girls who are "not his type."

Cyril
10-23-2009, 07:36 PM
Whatever Cyril ::)

Perhaps it would help you for me to be more specific in my criticism:

1) this is the problem of one customer. As has been mentioned, many customers also bitch when the stage shows are "too short."

2) your "screening for beauty" doesn't solve the problem of a girl not being a customers type. Clubs often hire a variety of girls so as to cater to a variety of tastes. So, he's likely still going to have to put up with girls who are "not his type."

It is a simple problem of process engineering.

Both items #1 and #2 can be solved by conducting a survey consisting of two questions:

1. Gentlemen, do you prefer short or long stage show?
2. What is your type as far as a woman is concerned?

Club owners should make the business decision based on their client base.

Hopper
10-23-2009, 11:21 PM
i'd say save your money and don't come if that's the case. and i don't understand, if you're not tipping dancers, how do you expect dancers to be making money? you expect every other customer to pick up the slack? the dancers are also doing more work than you are (none). and yes, sometimes we do go home negative!

Reading further down, I can see one cause of confusion here. I have read people here saying that the usual stage tip is $1. That seems a small tip to me. In clubs I go to, waitresses and bar and door staff ask for $2 minimum. Dancers sometimes ask stage tips of around $5 or $10 a peice to take one item of dress off. Customers also buy dancers drinks - $6 and up. If I gave each girl in I didn't like a dollar tip in the clubs here, they would probably be offended.

I thought maybe everyone was tipping $1, since it is so small, and that made up for the low tip amount, and some guys in the stage seats might tip more than once per set, but a dancer here said she doesn't take off one piece of costume unless she is tipped, which indicates not many tips are given in one set.

Also, LDs here start are between $50 to $90 depending on the club. Did you say it is $20 in your clubs?

Anyway, I can see why I seemed like a cheapskate when I said I only tip some dancers. When I do tip, it is about $20. Do you think that's too big? I'm not an executive like all the patrons at laurcon's club. I figure that it is no small thing for a girl to take her clothes off in front of me. I'd have to pay more outside of a SC. Of xourse I would not offer to pay a girl I don't fancy to strip.

Yes, the dancers do more work than me - because I am a customer and they are doing business. That's usually the case in any business. Whatever you pay to be there and whether you make a profit or loss on that, is absolutely none of my outlook. If you're not happy with what you make, do something else.

Hopper
10-23-2009, 11:31 PM
I can see that in order to respond to this, I'm mainly going to be repeating myself.

I know that feeling.


If you're watching the show, even if you're not at the rack, you should be tipping the minimum. Yes, it is rude. I've never worked in a club where girls didn't bitch endlessly about guys who do this.

Read my reply to laurcon's post above.


And yes, in the clubs I work at, guys do turn around, or to the side, if they do not want to watch (and tip) the stage show. That's fine. That does not bother us. Once again MUCH more rude to watch and not tip. If you want to tell yourself that you're just watching the stage show without tipping because you're such a nice guy and you just don't want to offend anyone, well...I'm here to tell you no. It would be much preferable for you to turn around.

I don't watch the whole show when a girl I don't like is on - just the occasional glance. I'm usually talking to somebody anyway. Not paying attention is sort of the same as not watching at all.


If you don't know if you'll like her stage show, then Jesus Christ, go ahead and gamble a whole damn dollar. If you don't like it after the first song, you don't have to keep watching and tipping. If you can't afford to gamble a whole dollar, then don't watch to begin with. She's putting on a show up there. It's extremely rude to act like it's not even worth a dollar to you, even though you're going to watch the whole thing. The vast majority of the men who come into the club seem to be able to manage this etiquette. When I go to the clubs, I tip for every song that I watch. When I don't want to keep tipping, I move away so it's obvious I'm not watching the show at all. It's really not that hard.

Again, my reply to laurcon. In clubs here, many dancers can make at least twice what I do with or without stage tips. I think their main source is LDs. And remember, I said I don't sit at the stage - usually not even close to it - I couldn't move further away.

Elvia
10-23-2009, 11:32 PM
Reading further down, I can see one cause of confusion here. I have read people here saying that the usual stage tip is $1. That seems a small tip to me. In clubs I go to, waitresses and bar and door staff ask for $2 minimum. Dancers sometimes ask stage tips of around $5 or $10 a peice to take one item of dress off. Customers also buy dancers drinks - $6 and up. If I gave each girl in I didn't like a dollar tip in the clubs here, they would probably be offended.

I thought maybe everyone was tipping $1, since it is so small, and that made up for the low tip amount, and some guys in the stage seats might tip more than once per set, but a dancer here said she doesn't take off one piece of costume unless she is tipped, which indicates not many tips are given in one set.

Also, LDs here start are between $50 to $90 depending on the club. Did you say it is $20 in your clubs?

Anyway, I can see why I seemed like a cheapskate when I said I only tip some dancers. When I do tip, it is about $20. Do you think that's too big? I'm not an executive like all the patrons at laurcon's club. I figure that it is no small thing for a girl to take her clothes off in front of me. I'd have to pay more outside of a SC. Of xourse I would not offer to pay a girl I don't fancy to strip.

Yes, the dancers do more work than me - because I am a customer and they are doing business. That's usually the case in any business. Whatever you pay to be there and whether you make a profit or loss on that, is absolutely none of my outlook. If you're not happy with what you make, do something else.

Well, in my opinion you should spread your stage tips out a little more, if you're only tipping some of the girls, but watching the stage shows of a lot of girls. Tipping a dollar per song is probably not offensive (I say probably because, while I can't think of any area where that would be offensive, you don't want to tell us what country you live in. Who knows. Maybe things are very different in...Andorra. Or Botswana. or where ever the hell you're from). I do think it's a little strange that you think it would be rude to only tip a dollar, but you don't think it's rude to watch and not tip anything. What?

If your behavior is indeed rude, as per the social mores of where you are (and I'm pretty certain it is) it doesn't really excuse your behavior to just say "well, if you don't like it, work somewhere else." It kinda just makes you look like even more of a douche.

Hopper
10-23-2009, 11:35 PM
Sadly, this mind frame seems to be becoming more and more common. When I went in for a nightshift the other day, the dayshift girls told me they were leaving with $5-$10 each. And no, the club had not just been super dead. They said a few large groups had come in and not tipped anything. So I'm not really surprised by Hopper's attitude.

Harsh. Perhaps many people who have not often been to clubs think they are places to drink while girls dance. So you get big parties of merry-makers arriving and taking up seating for no good reason. Strip clubs seem to have "crossed over" into popular culture, so many more people are going just because it is trendy and a bit risque, and probably don't know what is expected of them. Can't say anyone ever explained it to me.

Elvia
10-23-2009, 11:36 PM
In clubs here, many dancers can make at least twice what I do with or without stage tips. I think their main source is LDs. And remember, I said I don't sit at the stage - usually not even close to it - I couldn't move further away.

I very much doubt you know what the dancers are making. Guys are always making all kind of assumptions about these grand amounts of money we're supposedly making, often while refusing to tip. It's not that uncommon for dancers to leave owing the club money.

Hopper
10-23-2009, 11:38 PM
^ AUSTRALIA! must be. lemme warn all aussie dancers to watch out for Hopper. }:D

What is this, Twenty Questions?

Hopper
10-23-2009, 11:43 PM
...

I think clubs should do a better job at screening girls from beauty angle. Once again importance of through screening was pointed out in the Project Dream Girls.

Agree with Elvia on this. It's something the market should sort out. One person can't decide what beautiful is for everyone else. The really unattractive ones would be screened out automatically by failing to make money.

I know that some types of girl I like are not universally liked. I would hate to miss out because of some official standard. I don't even watch Miss Universe contests any more - those girls bore me.

Hopper
10-23-2009, 11:56 PM
Well, in my opinion you should spread your stage tips out a little more, if you're only tipping some of the girls, but watching the stage shows of a lot of girls. Tipping a dollar per song is probably not offensive (I say probably because, while I can't think of any area where that would be offensive, you don't want to tell us what country you live in. Who knows. Maybe things are very different in...Andorra. Or Botswana. or where ever the hell you're from). I do think it's a little strange that you think it would be rude to only tip a dollar, but you don't think it's rude to watch and not tip anything. What?

I think that's considered a low tip where I am. Like I said, regular staff in SCs here ask for $2 minimum. If I tipped a girl $1 it would be like actually telling her I don't like her. I'd look like a jerk or a bum. She'd probably throw it away.


If your behavior is indeed rude, as per the social mores of where you are (and I'm pretty certain it is) it doesn't really excuse your behavior to just say "well, if you don't like it, work somewhere else." It kinda just makes you look like even more of a douche.

We don't disagree on tipping fairly, only on what fair tipping is. I was only criticising your argument based on imagined entitlement. I think I should tip girls I like and let others pay girls they like. But I'll take your comments under advisement. If there are 20 girls in the club at one time and I tip them a part-way respectable $5 each, I'm giving away $100.

Hopper
10-24-2009, 12:00 AM
I very much doubt you know what the dancers are making. Guys are always making all kind of assumptions about these grand amounts of money we're supposedly making, often while refusing to tip. It's not that uncommon for dancers to leave owing the club money.

I'm going on what they have told me personally in clubs and what dancers working in my town have said at these forums. I realise not all dancers make this much, but obviously some do, which must say something about the ones who don't. Either they are not liked by enough customers, they don't hustle, or are doing something wrong.

carmenlove
10-24-2009, 12:14 AM
well, maybe this dude is from uk, thats why he spells it "realise" unless thats his foil to throw us off the track. its like he just needs the last word so bad.

Hopper
10-24-2009, 12:27 AM
^Sorry I thought this was a discussion forum.