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Bambalina
09-09-2011, 12:03 PM
Oh look! Another polite message filled with legitimate critiques, that doesn't talk DOWN to me one bit...

Another post from Sam filled with bullshit drama, negativity and nastiness, that is I don;t answer as if it is legit, will be called names.

How refreshing...

Yes...YAWN! Same ol' assinine Sam starting drama, being negative, talking about crap no-one said and completely making up stuff...

HUGE Surprise. Time for the "Mean Girls" to get this thread shut down...


YAWN!
Love how Bam disses SM about the 35%. Now if you are depending on the same girls who complain about that 35% but do nothing to market themselves and get the other 40% from the links SM provides for you , equalling 75%. Yet her business model depends upon these girls to do their own marketing.


Yeah, because doing ALL the work and getting only 75% is fair...Yeah, because MOST girls on SM make fucking 75%...RIGHT!

Who's fucking with statistics now?

I state for the record that anyone who defends SM paying women 35%, EVER, is a shill and an enemy to cam-models everywhere.



SM gives us the opportunity to up our own money. I love the extra 40% plus 20% on SM.


Yeah yeah, keep shilling for the female traffickers, for the content thieves, for the people who think 35% is fair, for the people who cheat their affiliates, for people who work with pirates and tube sites...Your credibility is fantastic.



Once again the same stuff from Bam put into a different and once again lengthy post. Going on and on with anyone who disagrees with her. Yet Bam thinks she can run a fair business with mulitiple partners.


Which post are you talking about?

And are you stupid? Or do you just not READ? I. DO. NOT. RUN. A. COOPERATIVE. It is a COOPERATIVE. I know that is a tough one. But obviously when you talk about someone RUNNING a cooperative, then you obviously have NO business in this thread.

Go read up on Wikipedia, the definition for COOPERATIVE is in this thread.



Bam spends more time writing these post than actual work in my opinion. Cant imagine the replies when it comes to customer service. That is hilarious.


Well, drama-causing. Baiting. Lying about a member. Wonder what the mods will do? We'll see.

Because THIS doesn't belong on SW and does not deserve to be graced with a response. You don't know me at all, and you also have no IDEA how much I work.


But what would I know, I already run a successful solo site.


Want a Gold Star perhaps?


Does BaM? Does a girl who doesn't own a site and have actual proof of sales someone you trust?

I think people should make their own choice. At least I'm not someone who makes excuses and shills for people who traffic in underaged women.



Yes, Bam is good at posting statistics. Oh yeah, I took statistics in college and know you maniputilate them.


Again, no proof, no example, nothing to show I did anything even remotely amiss, just a vague accusation of wrong-doing. That is your way, isn't it?



Can 10 people, 20 people, 100 people(because male or female makes no difference) all devote the same amount of time and efforts to be equal partners in a business?


Well the many successful cooperatives say that (first off you ask a meaningless question, since it isn't just time and effort, it is support of the business, and it isn't always 100% equal either...sometimes people put more into it because they WANT to.), YES, it is quite do-able.

Do you all understand that a corporation if looked at as it stands in reality, and law...that a corporation is a business owned by thousands of people who own shares and vote and decide the direction for the company? You know that, right? ANd you also know it is THE MOST POPULAR FORM OF BUSINESS IN THE WORLD. A democratically run business, run by sometimes THOUSANDS (or even over a MILLION) of people.

So, before you start saying a bunch of people can't own a business and operate it and make it happen, with some people who do stuff and organize it (CEO) and others who manage finances (CFO) and others who run day to day operations (COO)...maybe look at how businesses actually work...Microsoft is a COOPERATIVE...workers receive shares in the business as compensation and most workers at MS are also OWNERS.

This is not Mars thinking here or fucking rocket science. Sheesh.



Is the porn industry mysogenistic? YES, am I not a female with charms to work those very same men? Yes


Will it every change with people Sam battling to keep the MEN in control? NOPE!

Will it change if ONE collective/cooperative of women SUCCEEDS?! YES!

So pick yer pony:


Sam

or

B

Bambalina
09-09-2011, 01:14 PM
The only real proof I'm wrong will be making a site WORK, and be successful for the LONG TERM, and doing so for $10k or less. Until that day, all this is just speculation and hot air.


Nonono...this isn't about that, and you can CHANGE the parameters of the discussion all you want.

You said I cannot have a CAMSITE for under $20k...nothing about being successful or Long Term...You said I can;t have a cam-site programmed for under $20k...PERIOD.

There are many reasons a business can fail, there are many reasons that a site won't work, if all the people involved are not ready to make that happen.

So if you want to argue about the future, and not about what you ORIGINALLY asserted and now are back-peddling on, then say so...

You said I can't have a cam-site built for under $20k and that it is likely to be $100k. YOU said that.

Not this other shit you are now asserting up there. At least give me the respect of sticking with your argument here....sheesh.

Just because I post something that makes you look bad and look wrong and look like you're just badgering me, is no reason to now just jump ship on your argument and run to "You have to be successful, before I am wrong"...when the reality is that even if I could get the BEST cam-site in the WORLD done for $89, if I run it wrong and fail, YOU would still be wrong in saying I couldn't get a good site written or running for under $20k.

I mean, I am saying I can do it for under $5k...but YOU become "Wrong" in this argument if it costs me $15k...You said it cannot be done for under $20k and you have researched it and KNOW this to be the case.

Backpeddling, it's beyond you Supa...Either stand behind your words, or eat them and admit you were WRONG.



Insisting it can be done over and over, tossing out manipulated numbers and blind projections is just...pointless.


This would be a 'zinger' if we were arguing in ANY way that I can do this for $10k...That remains to be seen. But that isn't the argument. In fact I have admitted there may need to be infusions of money somewhere along the line, and that the original $10k statement was to get a cam-site "up and running"...But if 50 girls are involved, and each gives $400 more at some future time when the site is up and running (maybe $100 per month for the first 4 months) and has women on it...that will be 2% ownership in a working bigbox cam-site for a TOTAL of $500, and that will have brought us $25k.

No-one ever said it can be done, guaranteed for $10k and not ONE DIME MORE. That was never said, so why do you insist on putting words in my mouth?

In fact, in chats we have discussed MANY different arrangements for doing this, and none of them are being discussed here, because they are for the people truly involved.

$10k will get the site built, the LLC done, the hosting started and possibly the say 3 months paid, and at least the first month of promotion and at least 250k hits of good quality traffic that first month.

It MAY last 3 months or even 6...not sure...and it MAY very well last forever, if the traffic and women are there and the site takes off even minorly.

Would you deny the truth of any of that?



Where is any proof of your business experience to back up your claims? All we have here is talk.


Well, people can read my words...all of them...the threads on promotion, the threads on SEO, the threads that have helped HUNDREDS of women, including and admittedly YOU, in the past...And if those don't speak volumes about my knowledge and abilities, and if you can't tell someone who knows what the hell they are talking about...Then just DON'T get involved, and I won;t miss you one bit. If I haven't proven myself to you people, as someone you want to be aligned with, then there is little else I am willing to do to "prove myself" to you.



Self-proclaimed experience and know-how that has so far been backed up by nothing but talk.


Funny, this is the only thing this always comes down to...You, roast, nico-n-justine, and a few others...obsessed with knowing more about who is behind the Forum Name "Bambalina"...On a forum where people are absolutely encouraged to maintain their anonymity, it always comes up that I should "out myself" for you.

On a forum, where, if I connect my SELF to this name, MFC will almost assuredly INSTANTLY remove me and several working cam-girls from their site, where SM will do the same, and where I will instantly lose a very powerful "persona" with which I fight the powers that be. I need to do this, WHY?

So I can have YOU as a member of the cooperative? Supa, honestly, if you could be a team player, I' sure love to have you, because you're definitely interesting, creative and smart...but seriously, I don't think any of the OTHER women would have you, and seeing how you respond in this message, all hostile and kind of nasty, when I just replied to what you last said...I don't want you either.

There are a minimum of 6 women on this board, who...we won't TAKE your money and you aren't welcome to join. Of those 6, there are 2 who I truly feel bad about, because I'd love to have them, and you are one of them.



What people are really going to invest ANY of their time and money into something setup by someone who presents literally NOTHING (except a lot of talk) to show who they are or what experience they have in ANY business? LOL


Well some people can read between the lines and can understand that I present who I am and what experience and what sense I have, in my writing.

On top of this, you become tedious and useless to talk to. Because to be honest, you SAY you understand what a collective or cooperative is...and then you say:


something setup by someone

Which means you are useless to talk to and DON'T understand what a cooperative is.

It is obvious from the original thread that over 50 women signed on, so that negates you argument, and also shows that **I** won't be the "someone" who "sets up" a cooperative, which by definition is not set up by one person.

So, it looks like we'll be wrapping this discussion up, since I don;t want to waste time on replying about things that have nothing to do with THIS PROJECT.

Nice try at trying to avoid being wrong though...but if I can build a cam-site for under $20k, you are WRONG.



Spend some of the time it takes to write out these absurdly long posts on actually making something tangible happen and perhaps the "skeptics" will start to believe :)


I don't want the skeptics to believe. I want them to have their say, so those who aren't voicing concerns, but may feel them, get their concerns answered. I don;t want skeptics involved at ALL, and I don;t have time or inclination to change their minds...the only one I even cared a bit about investing some effort in, honestly, was you.



As for those cheap pre-packaged camsite deals - I wouldn't touch either of them. One needs something unique to pull customers in the current market. Buying some boxed site that looks like every other camsite out there and offers nothing new in the way of services or offers = waste of time/money.


Well, that just shows how you DON'T think outside the box.

For $269, or whatever, because there are several deals...One can buy the rights to a script which is CODE...all the base code needed for a cam-site...and then I can hand that to any decent developer and give them $2500 and they will give me the cam-site of my dreams by using that base script, and customizing it like crazy.

The FACT that a $269 cam-site exists, shows one can get that customized for say $200, and it would no longer resemble LJ, but whatever you want....$500 more to add Group Mode, and other custom stuff....$500 more and you have a REALLY secure payment gateway that is UNIQUE.

Are you honestly saying that couldn't be done??? Are you honestly going to sit there with you bald face hanging out and LIE to these women and say there is a dozen good programmers on the freelancer site that would JUMP at customizing this thing for $2500???

If so, who is untrustworthy now?


What about this will convince customers to move there from where ever they currently spend their money, or to choose this small site over SM/MFC where there are hundreds of hot chics online at any given time, on familiar "trusted" sites?


Well, it all depends HOW you customize it...For $269, that sure leaves a LOT of room before we reach $5k....DAYUM! We could have pretty interesting camsite...but you'll never admit that a tru Flash/Red5 web developer would ever customize it....pfft.


Outside of loyalty to whatever girls they may follow (which is hardly reliable), not a damn thing.


Well, you first diss the women in camming here....since the loyalty of their customers is a very very powerful thing, and you just showed how much YOU actually understand the dynamics of camming....Anyway...

Promotions, advertising, creative traffic management, using the FACT that 20, 50, 100 willing naked girls can advertise you...In general, everything else used to get people on a cam-site...

Are you telling me the fucking busk ugly MFC is popular because it is so uniquely a design gem? Or because they have a good idea for bringing in customers?



Again I say, you get what you pay for.


And if that was true, the Jeep, the Volkswagen Beetle....total failures and ONLY Mercedes and Rolls Royce would be worth buying...VCRs and DVD players today, would be FAR less able to "do stuff" than their $1000 predecessors of 5-10 years ago...and $2000 laptops from years ago, would be "better" than the $399 version today...

Lastly, MFC wouldn't be popular and be slowly rooting out SM from the cam market, if what you said is true...since MFC is FREE, and SM is what you "pay for"...

Custom programming from a master developer in Flash/Red5, done on a base which is proven and works in the field.

THAT is the way to get a good cam-site. And I don't know a developer who wouldn't be willing to do that work for WAY under $5k on any base camsite.

So yet again, you can change the subject and try to squirm it around to being something other than what it was...but you're wrong.



If I thought this $10k business plan were viable I'd have done it ages ago myself without asking anyone else for $contributions :)


Aw, how your condescension and backhanded diss show so clearly what I am talking about...


$contributions :)

Cute smiley face as you completely twist a noble idea to do something truly different and just ignore fact, and that I have said ANYONE else can control the escrow for this, and anyone is welcome to find a developer or do any job I am doing now, if they believe they can do it better...I mean you just IGNORE the reality and take a swipe with that belittling little:


$contributions :)

But obviously for anyone to be taking contributions, they would have to OWN the cam-site, right? I mean, this just shows you up.

You officially have your membership card in "Mean Girls" club now.

Belittling 50+ women, and treating their efforts, work, monetary input...trying to make a difference to camming...as if they are stupid suckers who contribute to Bambalina owning a cam-site, even though I have repeatedly stated that escrow would be used, we've ALL been designing how the site will function, and I will own no-more than anyone else.

I thought a LOT better of you Supa.


But what do I know? I'm just a dumbass jaded sex worker with no business experience or knowledge whatsoever. haha

Nope, just a 'Mean Girl' who makes up lies, dodged her responsibility and won't admit she's wrong, and generally just plays mean for the hell of it...

Sad...

B

Bambalina
09-09-2011, 01:30 PM
Insisting it can be done over and over, tossing out manipulated numbers and blind projections is just...pointless.

Lastly....

I challenge you and hereby call into question your honor, your dignity on this site, and your honesty.

Where did I insist over and over that I guarantee a successful cam-site LONG-TERM for $10k?

If you cannot show "over and over" that I did that, then you're lying...outright, and people on here can just ignore you and everything you write. Right?

And while you may be tempted to try and find 2 times I said I think this venture can be successful, that 2 times technically would be 'over and over', but if you can't show SEVERAL times I ***INSISTED*** that I can guarantee a successful camsite LONG-TERM for $10k, with no further investments...then you're lying. Right?

Show me the Manipulated Numbers? What do you even MEAN by manipulated numbers, since there is no real numbers for THIS SITE, yet.

If you're talking about prices for cam-sites, I showed you a site for $269 and others as well for far less than $20k, and others have showed you MANY different sites for under the $20k you claim as Minimum and yet you STILL insist on being right...ChatGF, who is a cam-site owner has said you are wrong on the pricing of web development for a site...yet you still insist you are right and argue the point...

Or are you willing to say you are WRONG now??

And lastly, where did I toss out blind projections for this site? You make very little sense...you say negative things that SOUND like viable critiques, but they have NO substance...

Say what you mean, spit it out....use the ACTUAL blind projections if you are going to claim they exist, show me the fudged numbers, and the crazed insisting we'll all be rich and successful...SHOW ME. Isn't that what YOU said to me in PM?

You diss me pretty hard in that last message, but if people really read it, you don;t substantially actually SAY anything....you don't give me any reasonable critiques of facts or things I SPECIFICALLY said...

So, if you wonder why I now classify you as "Mean Girl", THAT is why...ZERO substance, just negative and nasty...

B

Bambalina
09-09-2011, 01:37 PM
Now, for anyone else who is reading this...

Is this drama that has been brought...this de-railing of the discussion and off-topic shit, is this what you were hoping to read when you came here and read this thread?

If not, Ask Some Real Questions....I'd love to answer them as best I can as ONE member of this cooperative.

Because I believe that some of you out there hold the keys to making this happen and making the difference that will change the whole face of camming. And we NEED you.

So, don't be afraid to speak up, and if you think I'm WRONG about something, don't be shy, say so, but be specific and let me know how you think we in the cooperative could improve it.

B

PS. If, like several others, StripperWeb and the "Mean Girls" scare you and make you not want to post...feel free to PM me...I am HAPPY to get PMs from people who are interested and want to discuss the whole thing, and I promise to treat your PM with respect and answer you as best I can...

roast
09-09-2011, 01:53 PM
IDK I don't want to rehash what I've said before orwhat anyone else just said so can I just say that Sam & Supa are established online sex industry performers. Loveshooks is wellknown in the indie world. None of those critiquing this project in this thread (or some of the other threads even) are *just* SW famous. They have brand recognition. They have fan bases, followings, they have been able to establish and sustain mostly independent businesses in a tough industry in a tough economy. They legitimately know what they're talking about when it comes to launching camming projects. Constantly undermining their (free! no less! free!) critiques because they're not saying what you want to hear is just... a missed learning opportunity. Also the fact that other wellknown camgirls don't really engage in these threads (some used to, but some very obviously never ever touched it) is also important to think about. I'd want girls with names to love this project, wouldn't you? Because having brand recognition means free traffic. Free traffic means less work for my lazy mercenary ass. And if that benefits the collective - even better.

It is like a bootleg apprenticeship whenever wellknown girls post. It is a free consulting service.

Since she is so public - have you googled Samantha 38G? She was on TMZ for fuck's sakes. Or looked at her site's traffic? Or any of her profiles? Whenever she gives advice I make a point to pay attention. Not out of arbitrary respect - but I want her wisdom and if she is just going to hand it out, even if it hurts, I'll take it.

The perspective on SW is more independent - so of course this project is going to be heavily criticized by independent models. Not because they are haters or short-sighted but because they are established online sex performers.

Can we give some respect to where it is due? Not just because it is a nice thing to do, I'm being 100% selfish here: we need to keep a somewhat even ratio of newbies : shortterm cammers : midlevel cammers : wellknown cammers to keep this forum informative.

I think it is great people are still committed to a collective project despite how ridonkulously competitive camming is becoming. BlankStare I want your optimism, I think your drive is admirable. To keep it positive - I'd say that just building a 'collective' indie listing site would be the cheapest, quickest, and most efficient way to go since everyone is just charged with taking care of their own profiles and won't need to splitcam or invest too much of their time or CPU into it. I'd even commit $ to that since it is generally low energy and I won't have to commit to weekly chats. But... ok, megasite with streaming chat applications it is? B why not cancel your indie listing project as being a personal endeavor and pour it into this?

Seriously guys - do a collective indie camsite listing. More people would buy into it.

But, B - why continue to drop your pants for a SW ritualistic beating? Especially if you can't deal with it (forget the debate element of it, I mean like emotionally and health wise (http://forum.stripperweb.com/showthread.php?t=158558))? I'm not naive - I know that SW's traffic is great and most of the interest in it was launched here and SW cam members need to be poached to give the site legitimacy (CGU has a *lot* of male registrants - are they some of the pledgers? oy)... but c'mon. Start delegating. Get that capital. Put it in escrow. Shake some tambourines. Do something. Or don't give updates here and just give updates on the forums that are in full support of this. Why give non-updates when you know ThePlastics will be like "oh this again?" (I am implicating myself as a Plastic here btw). Each time you give an non-update you lose more and more people to come to your defense.

So many threads about the collective have been locked due to people raising issues. The issues would not be raised if people didn't see so many holes or problems with it. At least pretending to take the feedback (even if it is harsh) would attract less harshness. I'd say that the tone of the threads devolve into "drama" probably because respect isn't given where it is due and people's opinions are ritualistically dismissed. B, you are an equal part of why your threads get shut down - why you keep restarting them, idk? Your masochism must have a limit? What is your safeword already?

Why not give substantive updates or change your dismissive tone if you're trying to prove something here? I mean you clearly are, right? Do you need more recruits because you're saying you're all set. Because other forums LOVE this idea. They do. You claim to have ~50 committed pledgers - that is impressive! You also got CGN, you've already got many people registered for CGU, you have a bunch of followers on twitter, even ChatGF in OtherWork is your cheerleader- go forth into the abyss!

IDK B, you leapt at the chance to join the AmyLynne pile-on but you two behave like fraternal twins when it comes to your projects. (http://forum.stripperweb.com/showpost.php?p=2192629&postcount=39) You're just... savvier.

The Collective is indeed *your* project - you have to establish some kind of foundation first before responsibility is diffused. Even if it becomes wildly successful, people will call it B's project. Even if it becomes a big fail whale, it will (especially) be called B's project.

This project will also be the benchmark for your other projects that you plan to actually profit from (indie listing, panty site), so this isn't really a selfless enterprise - it is a form of promotion, let's keep it real, ok? And that is fine - we're all mercenaries.

But fledging mercenaries should at least pretend to take what established mercenaries say. It is just good business practice.

AngelCummings
09-09-2011, 02:54 PM
Omg.... so many words... I swear I have to do less reading for my college classes than I do in this thread lol. We need Spark Notes.

BustyAmeera
09-09-2011, 03:06 PM
Omg.... so many words... I swear I have to do less reading for my college classes than I do in this thread lol. We need Spark Notes.

This! LOL :D

Sam38g
09-09-2011, 03:54 PM
Sam... are you serious? A lot of companies (especially most out here in the 'real world') take investors.. especially when a larger amount of money is involved, and especially when it's a 'collective' site..or a business with more than one 'owner'. I understand your opposition to Bambalina... but really.

NOT in the porn world.
Friend Finder is the ONLY company to go public & even it is failing financially.

In order for people to get investors they need a proven track record of sales. They need a sound business plan. NOT constant RANTINGs on a forum.

Has there been investment companies for porn before? Yes, All SCAMS! LOL

There are over 1million adult related sites on the web. Over 100 new adult related sites go up every single day. Less than 1% will ever make money.

I know strong affiliates like Rabbit's Reviews. Which the owner is is fan & friend of mine. Bam is NO where close to being that kind of affiliate. Nor can she supply the amount of traffic needed.

NOT once has she put up her conversion rates for her stuff already out there. Many can buy traffic. But everyone in adult knows buying traffic is crap.

Where is Bam's experience? Her success?
I have built a brand, a name, a career in an industry that most porn careers last only 6 months. Got 12 years in and still being shot by top companies. I shoot for the Score Group on Monday.

I have shot for and KNOW the owners of some of the top porn companies on the web. These people advise me when I need it. NOT one single one of them have INVESTORS!

Someone who hides who they are is supposed to be an open book with how the money is spent & managed. The very same person who says she would be a success if so many tragedies hadn't befallen her.

Broke my leg last year. Yet my site was still updated and I cammed the entire time. A driven person works and gets things done no matter what.

The amount of time & efforts Bam puts into numerous threads about the Same subject and replies she could have gone to school & built the site out by now. But she doesn't.

Can a person build a successful cam site? yes, but not someone who spends hours in writting replies to others who point out the flaws in their plan. She has an agenda, to get all of us out of the cam business so she can have less competition. I do believe she is a cam girl, hence why she won't disclose who she really is.

Sam}:D

I love being the devil's advocate.

Sam38g
09-09-2011, 04:04 PM
LMAO
Calling me a mean girl when you Bam do all the name calling.

Yes, I do make 75% off many custies on SM. :) I put in the work, time and efforts into marketing.

Sam

laurielegs
09-09-2011, 04:53 PM
Man alive. I wish every single person in this thread who appears to be getting angry would step back and take a chill pill. There is so much good info here and lots of valid points on both sides (why take sides anyway, geez)! I know we can do better than this - please let's try to have some mutual respect and at least try to get along?

ukmissy
09-09-2011, 06:14 PM
Seriously guys - do a collective indie camsite listing. More people would buy into it.



Couldn't agree more with this.

BlankStare
09-09-2011, 07:04 PM
BlankStare I want your optimism, I think your drive is admirable. To keep it positive - I'd say that just building a 'collective' indie listing site would be the cheapest, quickest, and most efficient way to go since everyone is just charged with taking care of their own profiles and won't need to splitcam or invest too much of their time or CPU into it. I'd even commit $ to that since it is generally low energy and I won't have to commit to weekly chats. But... ok, megasite with streaming chat applications it is? B why not cancel your indie listing project as being a personal endeavor and pour it into this?

I am always optimistic. I have much respect for those who are veterans; but it seems as if some people here come into these threads to simply be demeaning and try to constantly undercut someone.

Why come into a thread to just belittle, start endless arguments that go all the way from point A to Z- without any intent of providing valuable feedback or information, just because you have an itch to scratch with someone? - it's ridiculous.

And I agree with you, an indie site would be the cheapest, quickest, and less hassle way of going about it. But beings that this is supposed to be a 'collective' site, I'm sure that either people will or will not buy into the idea. If there are enough people that believe in it, that want to take the risk, so be it.



NOT in the porn world.
Friend Finder is the ONLY company to go public & even it is failing financially.


Sam, do you honestly believe that not one person (let alone many) in the adult industry has taken an investment from friends, relatives, or.. business *partners* in order to start a business? That is ludicrous.

As far as for everything else you said or asked about Bambalina.. I don't have anything to do with any of that.

Sam38g
09-09-2011, 09:20 PM
Most started out being affiliates. Bangbros/Reality kings was started by college students with a online marketing company called Sublime.

My business partner who own www.plumperpass.com had no investors.
the Score Group didn't have any either.

So Yes, since I do talk to many adult site owners. Most did it on their own. I can imagine the conversation... LOL "Hey Mom, can you loan me some money to start a porn site?"

Most started out small and built from there. They didn't do or need huge investments, they did all the work themselves.

Once upon a time it was way easier to make money in porn with dvd deals & adult sites. The market got over flooded then tube sites killed it.

I remember working for many major companies when they were just a start up. They shot the stuff in their own apartments, used buddies as male talent, did all the coding, filming, editing & such themselves.

No, you dont need a huge investment of money to do this. But you do need to know how to do all the building of it and the back end yourself. You need to have a new & original spin to be a success along with a strong marketing background.

I dont get angry or upset about any of this. Nor do I take it seriously. Because I do work hard and put in the hours it takes to run a business. Over the past few months learned alot from sw, so I post advice & my opinion. Really dont care if others disagree with me.

When a con artist tries to find victims they often do get highly upset and super defensive when questioned about what they are up to.

I am not here trying to make money off of anyone. I have no hidden agendas or hide who I am. Never have I asked cam girls to boycott or quit working for any cam company.

Several years ago people wanted CCBilling to go public, they refused. They liked being privately owned.

Tell me what bank is going to loan a person money to start a porn company?
What investment group is going to put up the money for a porn company?

If you read the articles about companies, all of them started out small, had original ideas and grew their business. 10 years ago you could shoot a boy/girl scene for $500 to $1500 then sell it as content for $1000 to $500 to many other companies and make back that money in spades. That business model no longer works in porn. Some companies got their start doing this kind of thing.

Porn is full of ex-cons & con artist. Yes, people have invested in it. None of them made money, they got conned.

Danni.com was started by a big boob gal. Who bought a book on html and learned who to do it herself. At one point she was making about $5 million a month with live web cams according to Forbes. She sold the company several years ago for a fortune. She didnt have any investors at all.

Can I say absolutey no money was borrowed, no. But I have talked to and read many succes stories where it wasn't.

Sam

Sam38g
09-09-2011, 09:24 PM
Oh I forgot. Playboy is a publicly traded company.
But last time I heard Hefner was trying to buy it back.
For it has not paid out a dividen in a long long time.
Nor has Playboy turned a profit in the past 5 to 6 years.

Sam

BlankStare
09-09-2011, 09:38 PM
Sam, this is not a one person owner type of deal from what I am understanding. It is a collective, in which each person would own equal share... where one would invest into the whole idea and own their share. It's a common practice among businesses where there is more than one owner. Like when you buy stock in Microsoft, you own .002% of stock in that company.

I'm sure plenty of people have asked mommy and daddy for money to start a porn company. Whether they disclosed such information to their parents is another subject. Also, you and I both know that with a viable plan, background, and future projection- a bank will most certainly loan you money. They are in business as well.. and will take high risk investments if they so please. Friends, and others who share your interest in starting a company and owning a part of that company, will invest in it.

Sam38g
09-09-2011, 10:30 PM
You are to cute blank stare.
Banks have board of directors, in which most are christain & would never invest in porn.

Most site owners never tell their parents or family members they are in the porn industry. :)

Bam you can check me out anytime you want. Since you want to call me out.

http://www.xlgirls.com/modeldir/model/Samantha-994.html?nats=MTAwNC45LjcuNy4yOS4wLjAuMC4w
www.Samantha38g.com
http://www.plumperpass.com/t1/showgal.php?g=groups/386/2_1&s=13
http://www.bignaturals.com/main.htm
http://www.bangbros.com/t2/pps=bbonet/profiles?m=Samantha-38G1

http://www.hotmovies.com/top_rated_stars.php?star_view_pref=photos&star_gender_pref=ALL Yes, I am #25 out of thousands

Also have worked for Vivid, Naughty America, Channel 69, Penthouse, Porn Pros, Gent,Evasive Angles & Evil Angel/Manuel Ferrara & Shane Desiels DVD line.

What have you done? Bam? Where is your success? Where is your work?

Where are your magazine covers? Dvd covers? Website?
Do the biggest best male talent know your name? Request to work with you?

Have you ever googled my name and seen how many things pop up?

Proof is in the pudding as they say....
What have you done?
Because I would love to see your list of accomplishments?

I have put in the work. I have put in the time and networking in the adult industry.
When was the last time AEBN did a story on you? Mine was in July?

My integrity, My work is actually seen all around the world. There is my proof of doing what I need to do to make money each and everyday. You are not coming at a girl who thinks she can make it in porn.

Oh, and I shoot for Score again on Monday. What you want to bet I get another magazine & DVD cover?

What top list are you on?

http://www.tmz.com/2010/11/27/sister-wives-spoof-family-fun-vivid-entertainment-tlc-porn-parody-kody-brown-lehi-utah-mormon/

http://www.spike.com/video/who-has-worlds/3307769
This was my fav, because I was flipping channels and saw it when first aired on tv. Then all of my fans emailed me about it with excitement.

Have you been mentioned on Manswers?

Do you have Hustler emailing you asking why they have never shot you?
Do owners of major porn companies take you out to dinner? Because I do all the time.

:)
www.Samantha38g.com
www.myspace.com/Samantha38g
www.twitter.com/sam38g

Where are your links to show traffic? To show where you have been a success on the web and can get these girls to the next level?

I dont have to go on boards and beg the owners of adult sites to answer my emails.

BlankStare
09-09-2011, 10:40 PM
Sam, really.. I am well aware of your popularity and longevity; as in most of your postings you point them all out, and humbly so.

There are many banks that are just greedy as well, and have bank CEO's that love their deep pockets, Sam. :)

How exactly I 'called you out' in any previous posting.. I'm not sure. But, I apologize if you feel that way.

Sam38g
09-09-2011, 10:46 PM
blank you missed the part where I put "bam">
Only the first part was you.
Bam called me out on integrity and honesty.

None of that was directed at you at all. Sorry about the misunderstanding honey.

Sam :)


Sam, really.. I am well aware of your popularity and longevity; as in most of your postings you point them all out, and humbly so.

There are many banks that are just greedy as well, and have bank CEO's that love their deep pockets, Sam. :)

How exactly I 'called you out' in any previous posting.. I'm not sure. But, I apologize if you feel that way.

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 01:14 AM
You are to cute blank stare.
Banks have board of directors, in which most are christain & would never invest in porn.

Most site owners never tell their parents or family members they are in the porn industry. :)

Bam you can check me out anytime you want. Since you want to call me out.

http://www.xlgirls.com/modeldir/model/Samantha-994.html?nats=MTAwNC45LjcuNy4yOS4wLjAuMC4w
www.Samantha38g.com (http://www.Samantha38g.com)
http://www.plumperpass.com/t1/showgal.php?g=groups/386/2_1&s=13
http://www.bignaturals.com/main.htm
http://www.bangbros.com/t2/pps=bbonet/profiles?m=Samantha-38G1

http://www.hotmovies.com/top_rated_stars.php?star_view_pref=photos&star_gender_pref=ALL Yes, I am #25 out of thousands

Also have worked for Vivid, Naughty America, Channel 69, Penthouse, Porn Pros, Gent,Evasive Angles & Evil Angel/Manuel Ferrara & Shane Desiels DVD line.

What have you done? Bam? Where is your success? Where is your work?

Where are your magazine covers? Dvd covers? Website?
Do the biggest best male talent know your name? Request to work with you?

Have you ever googled my name and seen how many things pop up?

Proof is in the pudding as they say....
What have you done?
Because I would love to see your list of accomplishments?

I have put in the work. I have put in the time and networking in the adult industry.
When was the last time AEBN did a story on you? Mine was in July?

My integrity, My work is actually seen all around the world. There is my proof of doing what I need to do to make money each and everyday. You are not coming at a girl who thinks she can make it in porn.

Oh, and I shoot for Score again on Monday. What you want to bet I get another magazine & DVD cover?

What top list are you on?

http://www.tmz.com/2010/11/27/sister-wives-spoof-family-fun-vivid-entertainment-tlc-porn-parody-kody-brown-lehi-utah-mormon/

http://www.spike.com/video/who-has-worlds/3307769
This was my fav, because I was flipping channels and saw it when first aired on tv. Then all of my fans emailed me about it with excitement.

Have you been mentioned on Manswers?

Do you have Hustler emailing you asking why they have never shot you?
Do owners of major porn companies take you out to dinner? Because I do all the time.

:)
www.Samantha38g.com (http://www.Samantha38g.com)
www.myspace.com/Samantha38g (http://www.myspace.com/Samantha38g)
www.twitter.com/sam38g (http://www.twitter.com/sam38g)

Where are your links to show traffic? To show where you have been a success on the web and can get these girls to the next level?

I dont have to go on boards and beg the owners of adult sites to answer my emails.

Bambalina's venture is hugely different to anything you have done Samantha . Your post is very clear in showing how successful you and your business has done , but it's a lengthy post resembling your CV, and all positive contribution to the thread is now lost.

This thread seems to be turning into a bragging competition, which is sad.

I think critique of all kind should be welcomed by Bambalina, and while she may struggle with constructive criticism ( at times ) , there's a huge difference in 'constructive' criticism, and outright telling her the whole idea will never work , based on facts like ... no adult company thus far has relied on investors..... Where I have no idea if Bambalina's venture will take off or not, statements like the above do not prove either way and are ludicrous to say the least . Being hugely successful does not equal instant access to everyones business and financial affairs. I know personally of 2 friends in the industry who have invested considerable amount of monies in the field and profited greatly as a result.

I understand peoples frustration regarding how long this seems to have dragged on for , with no real materialization of anything including figures or dates, however it's no reason for being nasty , and that's where I believe this thread has unfortunately been taken .... To, - nasty.

Hopefully we can have a bit more positivity and the people who think the whole idea is basically shit can back out a little - I am on neither side, but watching people pop in to tell B why it's never in a million years going to work , is starting to get tedious and could be argued to and fro all night .

Missy .

Sam38g
09-10-2011, 01:51 AM
Here is why it won't work. I thought it would be obvious, but okay.

You need a contract.
Contract takes a lawyer & a retainer. How exactly is that paid for?
Then each of you will need to consult a lawyer to make sure the contract is fair to you. Just getting the contracts done can cost $10,000 for such a complicated matter.


Then who is the trusty, because not everyone can be running everything. Is there an election process? Is it for a term of a year? Who overseas the election to see it is done fairly & honestly?

Who's has access to the banking? Because someone will have to write the checks for cost of the business? Who over sees them to be sure there isn't any money used for personal use?

If you are all equal partners, what happens when someone breaks the law on cam like having a child on there? ARe you all held legally responsible? Since they are an investor then what? How do you fire an owner?

Bang bros was sued for spamming. That settlement was $600,000 not to mention lawyer fees. What if one of the "collective/owners" does that? How is that paid off? Cost covered?

What if one of the "collective/owners" files for bankruptsy? This would be an asset in the eyes of the law.

Who moderates? How will offenders be dealt with? They paid money to invest.

What state or country do you file corporation papers in? Since cam gals are from all around the world?

Do you have corporate meetings to deal with issues? Who pays for all of that?

Before you go into partnership with anyone, shouldn't you know exactly who they are?

Who handles the chargebacks?

Ya'll do realize if the chargebacks are over a certain percentage that the billing company will pullout. Customers can do a charge back up to 6 months back. There is no fighting charge backs in adult, the credit card companies always back the guy. How do you know if that charge back was legit and not the person who does the payouts just keeping the money.

If someone does a chargeback is their ip address blocked? What about their name, address? How will that customers be dealt with?

What if someone cammed for a minor?

Who determines the pay of the CEO? Who pays them?

Where does the 2257's & the actual office you will need to for it at? Who pays the rent on that office?

This person will have your real name, your address and social security number. Along with copies of your IDS.

How do you chose a webmaster?
How much does he get paid? Who pays?

Tech support? Who will handle that or pay for it?

What if that $100 initial investment now needs to be upped to $1000 and you dont have it? then what? Will your original investment be for a part of the profit? Or do you just lose out on the money?

What if the webmaster takes 1 year instead of 6 months to build out the site? What if he was a total failure at building it out right?

What if one of the initial investors goes through a hard time and needs her money back?

Does a girl who invested the $100 but never once cammed get the same payout or residual as someone who brought in tons of converting traffic & cammed many hours a day to help get it all started? How is that fair?

Then there is the cost of office supplies and equipment, phones. Does everyone chip in and pay for those? What if one person disagrees about what is needed and what isn't. I know when I asking advice before I started my site, some told me I needed special computers to do editing and such when I didn't.

A business partner who is shady can get you into alot of debt & legal problems. Ya'll want to go into business with someone who has never verified who she is.

Papers will have to be filed with someone's name and that name will have to be public. Now who will that be?

You have to file a DBA, Doing business AS.


Who determines the price per minute? How cheap will the lowest price be? How high the most expensive? Since you are all equal is it one set price?

Will you have an affiliate program? Who will over see it? Who will recruit new affiliates? Determine how much affiliates are paid or the percentage?

How does the listings go? By alphabetical order, order of cam score, order of sales?

Do you get paid for recruiting new models?

Do you get a percentage of the money if you bring in a new customer who spent money?

What if another model poaches your customer? How will that be dealt with?

What if another company wants to buy it? Then who profits?

Are you going to pay the $100 to somone's alias or will you need a real name?

What if the billing company steals all the money? That has happened two or three times in the adult business. Ibill being a prime example.

Do you get paid by check? money transfer? bank transfer? wire?

What happens when you think your check is less than it should be?

What if the company is turning a major profit? How is the tax issue dealt with? Will there be a need to hire an accountant?

Ponder all of those issues.

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 01:52 AM
and back on topic , B - Someone , ( I think Roast ) suggested an indy style site for the collective. This seems like an excellent idea , a much cheaper option to start . ( if you say you can do it within your budget, I am not disputing it , but we can agree it would be much cheaper ?) leaving more funds to go towards promotion , which ultimately is the second half of your battle . The first being getting girls to co-operate and join . While people have poo poo'd the idea of going into business with someone over an internet forum , I believe the forum stands on your side. For all the people who are adamant the idea won't work , there's a few of us on the fence, and willing to gamble 100$ , ( business brain aside ) , to watch a venture like this unravel.

I remember a few years ago , David from XXXcambabes was trialing a pay per minute system for his indy site. I'm not sure if that ever took off, I Have not been back to that site in a while but it seems you would be a healthier position to make that transition if you already had a trusted base of both fans and girls .

I know very few people bother to steal traffic from Ashlee and David , because not only was it highly policed , it also had a relatively high payout and made stealing barely worth while. Which I've heard you say before, is your way to go .

I'm not a dreamer, and believe me I've seen these ideas come and go more times than you could imagine . Each time I see the same positivity , drive and determination shown by yourself, and I am yet to see something of this scale and set up, materialize into much more than a dream and a good idea'.

That's not to say I don't believe it *could* happen , and based on that I'm happy to throw ideas around , and contribute where possible . And like my Buddhist pal keeps reminding me, if nothing else ... it's all good fun! :)

Missy

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 01:54 AM
Sorry - I wrote at the same time as Sam and didn't see the above post when I posted ! Did not mean to undermine the above.

Missy

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 02:01 AM
What if that $100 initial investment now needs to be upped to $1000 and you dont have it? then what? Will your original investment be for a part of the profit? Or do you just lose out on the money?


Does a girl who invested the $100 but never once cammed get the same payout or residual as someone who brought in tons of converting traffic & cammed many hours a day to help get it all started? How is that fair?


Ponder all of those issues.
The fact is , 100$ is very little - I barely consider it an investment . We easily spend more than that on a meal over here . In fact that's a cheap meal for us . I understand you won't be investing Sam, but you can see why some girls will be ? Based on that , B is onto something .

And if it becomes more of a project between friends, all throwing a 100$ into a pot and bringing in some shared advertising - Maybe it could work , slowly grow , risk is minimal . She could reduce risk further by making a second option to be listed and pay a monthly smaller fee instead ... Either way , I believe girls will come ... I'm just not so sure the site will :P It's been a while B !!!!! :-*

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 02:11 AM
The girl who invested 100$ and never cammed is a silly girl who invested and paid towards traffic she didn't utilize ! I think the plan would be , we'd be re cooping our investment through shared traffic , as opposed to through revenue ... I could be wrong.

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 02:27 AM
Bam you can check me out anytime you want. Since you want to call me out.


I am not doubting you are a huge porn star. So what? That gives you a FART worth of expertise in starting cam-sites, cooperatives, how to fix the porn industry (in fact I see you as the quintessential old-guard, status quo porn star). You fuck people on video and are a model and have websites about it. You are not a cam-site owner, you haven't started a cam-site like we're discussing. You OBVIOUSLY know nothing whatsoever about Cooperatives and Collectives, and so you are eminently un-qualified to give any opinion on THIS venture.

Especially since you really add NOTHING of value to the discussion, and are just a drama starter and a shit stirrer here.

You obviously, by repeatedly speaking completely wrongly about the structure of it, show you don;t even understand the fundamentals of what the venture IS.

You are useless here. Go read about what a COOPERATIVE is on Wikipedia.

Talk about a complete waste of typing out your fucking ego for the whole world to see....seemed like you had enough TIME to type all that shit out...

B

PS. You are EXACTLY the kind of person whose advice I *DON'T* want. You are an example of everything wrong with porn today. From your oh so chipper opinions about Streamate, who are hideously misogynistic and bordingon evil, to your attitude that will just keep things going down the fucked up road they are on...your negative attitude and attacking, aggressive stance make you one of the few people wh I honestly don;t even care about the content of your posts whatsoever. So yes, you're a "Mean Girl" and I think you have an agenda as well.

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 03:01 AM
Now, for anyone else who is reading this...

Is this drama that has been brought...this de-railing of the discussion and off-topic shit, is this what you were hoping to read when you came here and read this thread?

If not, Ask Some Real Questions....I'd love to answer them as best I can as ONE member of this cooperative.

Because I believe that some of you out there hold the keys to making this happen and making the difference that will change the whole face of camming. And we NEED you.

So, don't be afraid to speak up, and if you think I'm WRONG about something, don't be shy, say so, but be specific and let me know how you think we in the cooperative could improve it.

B

PS. If, like several others, StripperWeb and the "Mean Girls" scare you and make you not want to post...feel free to PM me...I am HAPPY to get PMs from people who are interested and want to discuss the whole thing, and I promise to treat your PM with respect and answer you as best I can...

LOTS of real questions have been asked, and valid points made. You just refuse to answer them and dismiss anything we say that isn't in agreement with you as ignorance or "mean girl" crap. How about giving some real answers, or showing some real work, rather than going off on these horrendously long emotional tirades?

Several people have brought up ways they think you are wrong, but rather than take it as suggestions or ways to adapt/improve, you go ballistic with emotional garbage and rhetoric that really answers/shows nothing but that you lack stability, level-headedness and professionalism.



As for ChatGF, I do believe he is actually mocking this whole topic, rather than supporting anyone here. Also how long will he be allowed to post about stuff discussed in the section for camgirls before he gets the hammer??? Isn't it against the rules to take topics from one section where you're NOT ALLOWED, and discuss it elsewhere on this site? HELLO. I remember a time when the boys were told, in no uncertain terms, that they were NOT allowed to take Ladies Only discussions into other areas because that was just circumventing the site rules and drama-causing.

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 03:49 AM
They legitimately know what they're talking about when it comes to launching camming projects. Constantly undermining their (free! no less! free!) critiques because they're not saying what you want to hear is just... a missed learning opportunity.

Nice ass kissing, and seems ALMOST logical, except none of these people has ever started or run a cam-site, nor have they worked in a cooperative environment (and OBVIOUSLY keep saying they get it, as do you, but OBVIOUSLY don't). So no roast, their advice is fucking worthless. It is like saying that a guy who made money and did well being a race car driver, that his advice is really valuable about starting a new car company selling electric cars. Just because he DROVE cars does not make him any sort of expert on marketing them or running a manufacturer.

The very fact that you don;t pipe up and call bullshit to Sam saying there are NO COMPANIES in PORN with INVESTORS, just shows you complete bullshit bias...You know fucking full well what a bone-headed and completely WRONG statement that is. Yet you will call me out and sit by while absolute shit gets posted...

I call bias. I call agenda. I call you a fucking lying bullshitter.


other wellknown camgirls don't really engage in these threads

No, but they have signed up for the cooperative. Several...Top 20 MFC Girls, and women with VERY successful web sites. And when I have asked them why they do not participate here...they say because the drama that goes with it...In other words they don't participate because of YOU and SamG and LAChloe and one or two others.

Which brings me to the roast Reality Check.

There are a total of 5-6 really negative posters who have bad shit to say about my topics, threads, ideas and question my identity, don;t respect my privacy, and ignore that I am an advocate, whistle-blower, and general trouble-maker for those who hate women and use them, and that my identity needs to be at least pretty darn secure.

Ever notice that? 5-6 total, and they pop up thread after thread, and always find everything I say wrong and attack it. Kinda weird that you talk about these 5-6 very vocal assholes as if they are a majority I should be paying attention to. You are nothing. You're little group of ragtag Mean Girls is nothing. There is 5-6 of you, and 55 girls signed up to the cooperative and on the mailing list right now. 5 vocal assholes who follow me obsessively and ruin threads. 5 vocal Mean Girls, who post off topic stuff and lies in threads where it doesn't even make sense.

You've been called out you fucking stalker. So leave me alone like the mods told you to. Since even they saw your fucking stalkerish behavior.

KaiaRose, I hope you're seeing this and you keep your word to me.


I'd say that just building a 'collective' indie listing site would be the cheapest, quickest, and most efficient way to go...B why not cancel your indie listing project as being a personal endeavor and pour it into this?

Seriously guys - do a collective indie camsite listing. More people would buy into it.

This was masterful...GREAT de-rail attempt, while also attacking a site I've worked on for over a year. Fucking Bravo!

But I am already opening an indy listing site that I own/manage which has STRONG cooperative ties and tendencies. It will be $20 for those who are early adopters and will allow unlimited promotion of self, online/offline status, an image gallery, and will be adding aspects of c4s and other goodies as time goes on. SO, too late...already happening.

But this is isn't the point, because while that site will be awesome, and I don;t need ANYONE to "invest in it" to make it happen, it is another straw man...it shows a bit of your agenda as well I think...Since the idea of creating a cooperative TRUE cam-site (can't be called BigBox yet, only potentially so) is that there already indy sites, and they aren't evil rip-off bastions to the male-dominated Adult Entertainment world. Could they be better? Sure, and I'm doing my indy listing site for just that reason.

The real point here is that RIGHT NOW there is NO alternative for cam-models who want a bigbox style cam-site, and want to retain control. For women who want control of their content, for women who want control of how the cam-site is run and how they are depicted, for women who want control of the reins of their camming experience and who don;t want to be locked out because they work for traffickers and under-age pimps and people who support piracy.

The WHOLE point of the collective is to have a REAL cam-site. One that offers all the amenities yet allows women to shine. And allows women to show they have the tenacity and staying power, and business sense and wit, and much more creativity than the Male dominated cam-world that exists today. And the fact that you attack that and are against it happening shows a LOT about your character.



But, B - why continue to drop your pants for a SW ritualistic beating?


Seriously offensive, baiting and drama causing. I will otherwise ignore it.


I'm not naive - I know that SW's traffic is great and most of the interest in it was launched here and SW cam members need to be poached to give the site legitimacy

The idea was born here. The idea owes much to SW and SW will be definitely honored in the creation of this site.

So to talk so negatively of poaching, when the idea was presented and over 50 women just jumped all over it and asked to be part of it...well, again shows you lack of honesty, respect, integrity, etc.


(CGU has a *lot* of male registrants - are they some of the pledgers? oy)...

First...Shit stirring, since the Cooperative has a closed board that must be requested for entrance, while CGU has an open registration policy, JUST LIKE STRIPPERWEB (although we require registration to read ANY of the boards with cam-girl content)...So what are you trying to say here?

What lie is this you're trying to spin?



but c'mon. Start delegating. Get that capital. Put it in escrow. Shake some tambourines. Do something.


This from the girl who admits she "Just some cam-girl" and hasn;t really done SHIT herself so has no clue what is required to get a major site off the ground..

Easy to throw shit at others and have nothing to show for yourself...All you past talk of being a feminist and an activist and so on, yet you DO NOTHING to really truly HELP other cam-models have a BETTER shot at bsuiness and attack the one person on here who DOES do things and has ideas and brings new life to this stale patriarchal, male owned, Male-dominated profession.

Seems maybe you should pull up your panties, because your agenda is showing...



Or don't give updates here and just give updates on the forums that are in full support of this. Why give non-updates when you know ThePlastics will be like "oh this again?" (I am implicating myself as a Plastic here btw)

First, try Mean Girl or maybe Shit Stirrer, it suits you. Secondly, with all due respect (literally, i give none because you deserve NONE) Fuck off and don;t tell me how to post, what to post and why to post. None of that is your damn business, and you should mind your own as far as what I choose to do or post. And third, this is a very legit update since we are doing a very strong push to organizing final principles and also because those who think giving $100 and doing nothing else is making them an equal part of the cooperative to those who are giving blood sweat and tears to it, are being put on notice that they are incorrect.


. Each time you give an non-update you lose more and more people to come to your defense.

So many threads about the collective have been locked due to people raising issues.

First, please list all the Cooperative/Collective Update Threads. I challneg you to do so, since there aren;t really any...there is ONE original thread that actually discusses the collective...“” and I'd like you to show me all the other threads created for the purpose of discussing or updating people on the collective. SO MANY THREADS ABOUT THE COLLECTIVE! That is what you say. So show me all those threads about the collective, or AGAIN admit you're an outright liar like all the other times.

Oh wait...you mean the thread about MFC changing their policies and the activism involved there, that was de-railed by you and a few others talking shit OFF-TOPIC about the collective??? You couldn't mean that could you???? No, since that thread was a completely different subject where a few shit stirrers ruined it and dragged it off-topic. Funny, you were there, and Sam38G was there! Or maybe the Everyone should verify their identity even though we're in the Adult Entertainment field where such a request is considered EXTREMELY rude thread?? That one, where the collective is again brought up off-topic i believe....Oh wait, and YOU were there, and LAChloe was there! Was Sam38G at that party too?

So predictable...so full of lies and slander...half truths, and made up trash...you are a joke...but I take you seriously, because your tendencies to follow me from thread to thread and attack me are not funny...I am feeling quite stalked, and like your obsessive behavior is just not right...

I sincerely hope the mods take care of this, and read this peaceful thread that was AGAIN disrupted by YOU and Sam38G and LAChloe who all have a history of attacking me and following me around.

Also, let it be said...Supa-byotch and I are in complete disagreement on some things, and while I feel she treads awfully close to the "Mean Girls" line and often even crosses it, thusfar, I think she is just a caustic person...it's her nature, and that's ok...and Loveshooks, I have nothing negative to say about, since she has concerns and wants more transparency from me. I understand that, although I disagree that transparency from me is of any concern for a collective/cooperative where I will own maybe 5% and others will probably have MORE say in the outcome than me...Why do I need to be transparent?

Name all of the owners of Streamate...On your marks, Get set..GO!

Yet you still work there...so why do you need to know who I am?

Sorry, most of the women involved want to keep themselves MOSTLY anonymous from all the others. It is a tough part of putting this together and having it be fair, cooperative and legal.

Speaking of which...Streamates is NOT a sole proprietorship and is a multi partner venture with investors. Ahem...just sayin'

B

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 04:06 AM
LOTS of real questions have been asked, and valid points made. You just refuse to answer them and dismiss anything we say that isn't in agreement with you as ignorance or "mean girl" crap. How about giving some real answers, or showing some real work, rather than going off on these horrendously long emotional tirades?

Several people have brought up ways they think you are wrong, but rather than take it as suggestions or ways to adapt/improve, you go ballistic with emotional garbage and rhetoric that really answers/shows nothing but that you lack stability, level-headedness and professionalism.


First off, I'm sorry you see people outright breaking the rules, going against agreement made with mods, and so on as "horrendously long emotional tirades"...I believe I should be able to come here, and post and not be baited, attacked, called names, lied about, or have person or persons systematically stalk and try to destroy every thread I start or get heavily involved in.

I think if you were really fair, you'd stand up for the underdog here, and try to get the air as clear as possible so that REAL discussion COULD take place.

Why is it you jump all over me, but extremely rude shit, or absolute nonsense like "No Adult Companies use Investments", you just let pass? Why do I not have a right to question your M.O.? You all question me, who I am, what I accomplish, but the minute I question why you behave the way you do on a supposedly civil forum, you bristle and whine about how I am emotional and ranting...seems pretty ridiculous, and others see it that way too...

So...for the sake of argument, if you feel any friendship for me at all...I had a car accident way back, and it scrambled the fuck out of my brain...still smart, but multi-tasking is at a minimum and sometimes I truly miss communications others see as obvious...REALLY bad concussion....I have ALWAYS said I am not a great communicator, even though others seem to think otherwise...great ideas, and I am a crazy hard worker, and I love to work with others and change things and so on...but personal communication...not my absolute long suit...Anyway...see? There I go...off blah blah blahing again...So, I ask you...to please list the legitimate, specific points that I am NOT answering here. Please, will you do that for me? Because I am missing them. I'm not trying to dodge them, I just missed where they were posted.

Please.

B

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 04:40 AM
Sorry, most of the women involved want to keep themselves MOSTLY anonymous from all the others. It is a tough part of putting this together and having it be fair, cooperative and legal.


B

:) Lol , I can imagine this is a VERY tough part, seen as the women investing are going to be appearing on the same camsite together ;) Those wanting to to remain anonymous from all the others, better stay in bed ::)

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 06:08 AM
Here is why it won't work. I thought it would be obvious, but okay.


Now this is actually the best post on here for working on issues that we bring up CONSTANTLY in our chats. This is also why we want more ACTIVE partners and fewer "silent investors" or silent investors are going to become a different class of investor. We are working that out right now.

But, your negativity to start the post is astounding, and the absolute lack of business understanding some of your questions shows make it hard to answer them straight faced.

Lastly, SOME few questions, I cannot answer because they contain proprietary information which I am not privy to divulge.



You need a contract.


As does any partnership. Please read the Wikipedia entry on Partnerships and Cooperatives.

This will be reffered in the rest of this, as "SEE ABOVE", because it is a stupid space wasting question that is the same answer for every ONE of them, and that is that it works JUST LIKE any other partnership. To my knowledge, SM had at LEAST 4 partners and several investors when it started and for the first few years, how did they do it if it is so impossible???



Contract takes a lawyer & a retainer. How exactly is that paid for?
Then each of you will need to consult a lawyer to make sure the contract is fair to you. Just getting the contracts done can cost $10,000 for such a complicated matter.
Getting contracts done CAN cost $10,000, but it CAN also cost $500-$1000 from a few already contacted Adult Entertainment Attorneys.



Then who is the trusty, because not everyone can be running everything. Is there an election process?
Please read the wikipedia entry on the operation of cooperatives, and also see partnerships in wikipedia as well.

Also, for reference in future answers:


A cooperative is a owned and democratically controlled by its members. Members often have a close association with the enterprise as producers or consumers of its products or services, or as its employees.


Also;


Cooperatives are based on the cooperative values of "self-help, self-responsibility, democracy and equality, equity and solidarity" and the seven cooperative principles:


Voluntary and Open Membership
Democratic Member Control
Member Economic Participation
Autonomy and Independence
Education, Training and Information
Cooperation among Cooperatives
Concern for Community

Cooperatives are dedicated to the values of openness, social responsibility and caring for others. Such legal entities have a range of social characteristics. Membership is open, meaning that anyone who satisfies certain non-discriminatory conditions may join. Economic benefits are distributed proportionally to each member's level of participation in the cooperative, for instance by a dividend on sales or purchases, rather than according to capital invested. Cooperatives may be classified as either worker, consumer, producer, purchasing or housing cooperatives. They are distinguished from other forms of incorporation in that profit-making or economic stability are balanced by the interests of the community. Co-ops can sometimes be identified on the Internet through the use of the .coop gTLD. Organizations using .coop domain names must adhere to the basic co-op values.


Now that should give you a basic answer...for more see Wikipedia. There are many different articles that you should read, since you show so much interest in the entire plan.

However, since you are too lazy, oft-times a governeing board is elected for a term of one year and that board runs day to day business and also brings important decisions to the full membership for a vote. Important decisions are those which can materially be shown to affect the future operating capabilities or ideals of the business. This is where we've been leaning thusfar. However, we stalled a bit because we wanted to make a further call for those who signed their money in, to have a chance to truly weigh in.



Is it for a term of a year? Who overseas the election to see it is done fairly & honestly?
See above for terms. It will be a public election and since the most present would be 100, it will not be hard to tally.



Who's has access to the banking? Because someone will have to write the checks for cost of the business? Who over sees them to be sure there isn't any money used for personal use?
SEE ABOVE. There is no difference here between this venture and ANY corporation, partnership, or co-op. This is also private information, and would only be available to members of the co-op.

There will also be a significant presence of a trusted book-keeper/accountant/auditor.



If you are all equal partners, what happens when someone breaks the law on cam like having a child on there?
The cam-site will be owned equally by however many women are partners. The cam-site as an entity then hires performers as "Independent Contractors" like any other cam-site in that respect. So owners are not "Camming" as owners, but as independent contractors. This is a common concern in Cooperative culture, but is easily and legally workable, and if you read the wikipedia article on Cooperatives, and on BECs you will have you answers.

Thus when I say those who attack this have NO FUCKING CLUE about Cooperatives. I can PROVE it, since these questions are easuily answered by ANYONE who understands business, and especially by those who understand cooperative ventures.



ARe you all held legally responsible? Since they are an investor then what? How do you fire an owner?
The answer to this "non-question" is contained above, also this is a meaningless and irrelevent question. Because people can easily wear two hats. Being an owner has NOTHING to do with the camming aspect of your work. If I buy a bunch of stock in McDonalds, and own some of McDonalds, does McDonalds get shut down or "go to jail" if I then rob a bank? This is a non-question.



Bang bros was sued for spamming. That settlement was $600,000 not to mention lawyer fees. What if one of the "collective/owners" does that? How is that paid off? Cost covered?
Well since you don't read the wikipedia entry clearly referenced several times in this thread, and then ask questions clearly answered there, let's try another one...first, go read how a cooperative actually works...

Secondly, how did Bang Bros. handle it? How does any partnership or company, or corporate structure handle it?

If one person was responsible, the cooperative would hold them responsible as would the law, since it is clearly written covering such situations. If a worker at McDs sends racial e-mails to people, McD's is not going to lose a lawsuit, even if the person represents themselves as McD's.

If the entire voting body voted for it, then we'd lose as a cooperative and probably go out of business, just like any other business would.



What if one of the "collective/owners" files for bankruptsy? This would be an asset in the eyes of the law.
their share would be, but that would have little to do with the business. Just as, if I own stock in Boeing, and I go bankrupt, they don't take Boeing's airplanes.

Another Non-question.



Who moderates? How will offenders be dealt with? They paid money to invest.
Moderation is done by a team of the owners who agree to do time as moderators, and upon profitability will be paid for that time.

Depends on the offense. Obviously.

When they are on as cam-models (and lest you don't realize this, the site will be able to hire as many models as the co-op feels it can support, just like ANY OTHER CAM-SITE.) they will be treated as cam-models, and income from cam-modeling and from ownership are QUITE separate.


What state or country do you file corporation papers in? Since cam gals are from all around the world?
Probably LLC in Nevada. Many BECs take the form of an LLC as it is an advantageous way to create a legal entity.

I don't understand how the question relates as far as models being from all over...how does it relate to ANY cam-site, we'd be no different. We'd also be no different than any company with foreign investors or partners.


Do you have corporate meetings to deal with issues? Who pays for all of that?
Well, as an LLC we do not have to hold meetings, but probably will for those who wish to attend, and attendance will be available via internet since this isn't 1912, and also, those who choose to come will pay their way and the meetings will be held somewhere where cost will not be a major issue.


Before you go into partnership with anyone, shouldn't you know exactly who they are?
Most of the women in the cooperative thusfar prefer to stay as anonymous as possible from all the other members. So the "board" would probably be privy to this and those who elect them would know this in advance, but every other girls would not know the legal identity of every other girl...No.



Who handles the chargebacks?
Non-question. Who handles them in ANY cam company? It will be the same.


How do you know if that charge back was legit and not the person who does the payouts just keeping the money.
Accountant/Auditor. Do you really have to ask insultingly simple and ridiculous questions? It makes me feel like you really don't know the answers...embarrassing. Don't you have an accountant?



If someone does a chargeback is their ip address blocked? What about their name, address? How will that customers be dealt with?
How does every cam-site handle this? Why do you even ask this question as if it is different for THIS SITE, when it is a simple problem that every cam-site deals with (in differing ways, but overall, in one of a VERY few known and obvious ways).


What if someone cammed for a minor?
Then we will cooperate with law enforcement, and they will probably be arrested...like any other cam-site, since they will be a independent contractor.


Who determines the pay of the CEO? Who pays them?
Well, LLCs/BECs/Co-ops don't necessarily have the same corporate structure, but I will try to answer this anyway. Those who receive pay for doing the day to day work of the system, will be voted upon just like anything else, and the accountant, and treasurer would generally be responsible for paying those who function within the company, just like any other company anywhere in the world.



Where does the 2257's & the actual office you will need to for it at? Who pays the rent on that office?
I think you can figure this stuff out without me, now that you understand it works like any other cam-site anywhere in the USA. Also, very likely we'd use a 2257 service since it is cheaper than an office, quite legal and keeps the 2257 data private. Oh, and it's $200ish per month once we get to over 500 girls, cheaper before that. Already checked.



This person will have your real name, your address and social security number. Along with copies of your IDS.
Yes, and NONE of it will be stored on any publicly reachable server. It will all be generally stored with a 2257 storage company designed for security.

This co-op will take women's personal data VERY seriously.



How do you chose a webmaster?
How much does he get paid? Who pays?
See above answers, and use your powers of reason to answer this.


{Continued}

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 06:09 AM
{Continued from perevious}



Tech support? Who will handle that or pay for it?
Same as moderation, see that answer.



What if that $100 initial investment now needs to be upped to $1000 and you dont have it? then what? Will your original investment be for a part of the profit? Or do you just lose out on the money?
We are working on solutions to this problem...some likely choices include:

1. using the corporate alternative, where voting powers expands percentages. therefor, you never lose your investment so long as the value of the company remains the same or increases, however you percentage of ownership may change.

ie. The company is valued at $10k, and 100 women own 1% each. meaning they own $100 of the companies value. So we decide to sell 100 more shares at $100, and this means each $100 owns .5% of a company valued at $20k, or $100 value.

2. Where only a small percentage of the company is parceled out at any given time, with profit sharing and other incentives included. ie. Initial Co-op is for 51% of the company, split equally or by contribution between members, and with a value of $10k or there-abouts. Later offerings as the valuation and concrete nature of the company proceed, can be at higher valuations. So, as opposed to $200 per percentage point for original investors, or $100 per .5%, the second offering may be for 10% total orf the company and percentage now sells for considerably more (since we have a site and running and a company functioning, those who jump in THEN may have to pay a much higher premium) say $100 per .1%, third offering when the company is approaching profitability may be .01% for $100, etc. With dividends given out to faithful members who were there from the beginning.

The co-op model almost ALWAYS favors initial adopters HEAVILY. And this will be no different.



What if the webmaster takes 1 year instead of 6 months to build out the site? What if he was a total failure at building it out right?
Then we sue her...or him...but generally since we will be working with someone with an already existing site of SOME KIND, we will have a tangible asset to begin with.


What if one of the initial investors goes through a hard time and needs her money back?
It is a coop...not a corporation...investment will not be in actual stock shares, so it would be contigent on the voting body whether we would buy back that percent and how it would be re-distributed.


Does a girl who invested the $100 but never once cammed get the same payout or residual as someone who brought in tons of converting traffic & cammed many hours a day to help get it all started? How is that fair?
camming money and ownership money are separate, as stated above and many other places.

We will have women working for the site camming, who are NOT owners at all. It will function like any other cam site that way. Just governed by WOMEN who are also CAM-Models, ex-cam-models, etc. In fact, we're thinking of possibly opening it up to all Adult Entertainment WOMEN.



Then there is the cost of office supplies and equipment, phones.
None of those costs is relevant at start-up. Hosting will be done outside, and why else, please, would we need an office at the start?



Does everyone chip in and pay for those? What if one person disagrees about what is needed and what isn't. I know when I asking advice before I started my site, some told me I needed special computers to do editing and such when I didn't.
A coop is a democratic body and no ONE person can block it.


A business partner who is shady can get you into alot of debt & legal problems. Ya'll want to go into business with someone who has never verified who she is.
This is where you seem to show you know nothing about business. As a member of an LLC I will be legally signing my name to all the contracts just like anyone else. Also, LLCs were created for JUST this reason...to protect the members from the actions of the company or other members. Corporations do the same.

I will also verify myself to anyone who is actually there, money in hand to join the group. I intend to be a member of the board, if the ladies will have me, and every member of the board will be willing to not worry about identity, and possibly we willing to submit to a background check as well. And I will make that info available about myself to all co-op partners.

Not to YOU though, or the general rabble on StripperWeb, sorry.



Papers will have to be filed with someone's name and that name will have to be public. Now who will that be?
those who are willing to put their names up-front on the LLC papers. I am willing, but it hasn't yet been decided who will be on the paperwork.



You have to file a DBA, Doing business AS.
a trivial ting and generally ALMOST free. Your point with that one?



Who determines the price per minute? How cheap will the lowest price be? How high the most expensive? Since you are all equal is it one set price?
Generally, this is already answered above...it will be voted upon by members. But thusfar we are going on a sliding scale model like MFC for tokens or chips or whatever. Since those involved thusfar see this as the best model for attracting customers and keeping whales happy.



Will you have an affiliate program? Who will over see it? Who will recruit new affiliates? Determine how much affiliates are paid or the percentage?
Sorry, classified. There will be some form of rewards/affiliate/incentive program...can't say anything further.

Most of your question can be answered with "SEE ABOVE".



How does the listings go? By alphabetical order, order of cam score, order of sales?
Classified and only available to those who need to know. We have some very unique ideas here and don't want them stolen.



Do you get paid for recruiting new models?
haven't discussed that yet honestly...now that's a question I'll thank you for...



Do you get a percentage of the money if you bring in a new customer who spent money?
models will have incentives for greater performance...best I can answer you right now...



What if another model poaches your customer? How will that be dealt with?
I don;t think I need to answer this, tell me otherwise if I am wrong, because i am assuming this is being asked from the perspective you seem to have had that all models are also owners.

Also, please define "poaches", as you use it.



What if another company wants to buy it? Then who profits?
If the ownership voted to sell for the price offered, it would be percentage of ownership.



Are you going to pay the $100 to somone's alias or will you need a real name?
You will pay the $100 into escrow, and the LLC will be the beneficiary. I will never control the money, it is not a job I desire or will take if offered. I had a major concussion in the past and don;t really like to deal with the purse-strings. I love accountants!



What if the billing company steals all the money? That has happened two or three times in the adult business. Ibill being a prime example.
Well, the billing company can't steal "All the Money", they can only steal the money for THIS pay period. Obviously we would be liable and would have to have a portion of profits held back for just such emergencies. this would be from profits ONLY and have nothing to do with the paying of cam-girls.



Do you get paid by check? money transfer? bank transfer? wire?
All the common methods used by all the cam-sites out there...Some of these seem like you asked just because you wanted as many questions as possible...



What happens when you think your check is less than it should be?
What happens at EVERY camsite? You complain, offer proof and get it resolved either way.


What if the company is turning a major profit? How is the tax issue dealt with? Will there be a need to hire an accountant?
Accounting will be important from day one. I have found several firlms where accounting grown with the business and allow for pretty darn cheap services for the start-up...and VERY intense services for a large profit making company.

If it turns a profit, that profit after all cam-girls are paid, hosting and any mods and such are paid, accountants, lawyers and such...whatever else is left is split according to the ownership of the company.


Ponder all of those issues.We do, every week in chat...twice a week even...

B

ukmissy
09-10-2011, 06:14 AM
In which case my above joke doesn't hold much worth . I didn't realize the site will be open to girls who haven't contributed financially .

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 06:16 AM
:) Lol , I can imagine this is a VERY tough part, seen as the women investing are going to be appearing on the same camsite together ;) Those wanting to to remain anonymous from all the others, better stay in bed ::)

Honestly this is what I thought as well...

But one of our ladies brought this up...that we're buffered.

I mean it is absolutely true that few will be privileged to the info of who is who, for 2257 purposes and such. But generally say we have a woman who has the real name, um...Jenny Johnson, well, JJ signs the paperwork and is on the LLC and so on, and then when she gets to the cam-site she is TaniaTits, and other than 2257 paperwork, how do YOU know those two are the same person?

REAL you owns the camsite, CAM-You works for the site camming as an independent contractor.

yup.

B

ps. Your turn now. I love your questions....you rock!

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 06:26 AM
Bamb, nice show of professionalism. Errr....not. You expected AmyLynne to take your questioning of HER business plan in stride, and give details of HER business plan, but you go crazy defensive and emotional, play the victim, name-call and plain out ignore the point when YOU are questioned. You jumped all over AmyLynne for not responding appropriately and some of us backed you, but you don't practice what you preach.

Not once have I called you or anyone else here any names. I didn't see anyone else name-calling in this thread either - except you calling some of US names. You play the victim really well, all while doing exactly what you accuse others of.

The only thing you want to call a "real" discussion is people agreeing with you and jumping on board with you. Anything else, you dismiss as "bullshit" or just completely ignore. There have been a TON of absolutely valid points raised in this thread, which you just flat ignore or evade. That makes you look incompetent at best. I am not saying you ARE incompetent. I'm saying your BEHAVIOR appears that way, which isn't helping your cause.

As it is, you have given nothing but rhetoric and emotional appeals to make your case. You'd make a great politician LOL. But this ain't politics and we aren't just potentially voting on which asshole might do the least damage in public office. Businesspeople need solid plans and details about anything we might invest in. If you expect people to join you and invest their money and priceless time on blind faith and ideals, well I feel sorry for you and anyone who jumps in THAT pool.

If you can't take a bit of questioning from the very people you are trying to recruit for your business plan and answer them professionally (and succinctly), then how are you going to handle REAL business issues? If your partners want you to justify how you've spent the marketing budget for the last few months because maybe traffic wasn't what they'd hoped for, are you just going to call their questions "useless bullshit" and call them "rag-tag mean girls" then?

By the way, just because some of us may share the opinion that your plan is...lacking, doesn't mean we've been shit-talking you or secretly plotting to discredit you. As far as I know nothing could be further from the truth.

But I'd have to agree with roast's point that the fact several well-successful businesswomen here see major flaws in your plan ought to be an indication we're not all just spewing "useless bullshit". We aren't race car drivers. We are businesswomen, which means we know a thing or two about business, specifically the camming business.

After seeing the way you handle business questions and critiques, any interest I had in your plan is completely and utterly shot. No way in hell would I join up with someone so utterly lacking in professionalism as you have shown here.

I'll be interested to see how many of those 50+ girls you have "signed up" actually go through with it and send the money then spend the time to make it work. Playing along during the planning stage and actually ponying up the money/time are 2 wholly separate animals.

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 06:30 AM
and back on topic , B - Someone , ( I think Roast ) suggested an indy style site for the collective. This seems like an excellent idea , a much cheaper option to start . ( if you say you can do it within your budget, I am not disputing it , but we can agree it would be much cheaper ?) leaving more funds to go towards promotion , which ultimately is the second half of your battle . The first being getting girls to co-operate and join . While people have poo poo'd the idea of going into business with someone over an internet forum , I believe the forum stands on your side.
Missy

Well, because what we lack in the world of camming is a fair and decent site that any girl can come join and get paid fair and treated with honor and respect. I mean, I am working on a hybrid sort of site right now that is exactly the indy listing concept (and since she was around for the thread, roast knows it, and has attacked me about it VERY recently), where for a single monthly price you get a fully operative area to have a profile that lists EVERYTHING you do, in a camsite listing type of thing, and lists you as Onlin/Offline as well, and allows for full indy usage. It is with the developer right now, and has been 50% paid for (the other 50% on delivery)...Those who are curious can e-mail me for a sort of poor quality preview of how the site will be...

But like I said, in reality this will be a adjunct, as will the panty site and others I have in development...all of this will be subordinate to what we TRULY need in camming.

ONE fair site that proves exactly how much a cam site can pay, and what it can offer and how awesome WOMEN can do this. If you think to yourself...Man if I ran a cam-site I could make it ROCK!..Then this project is for you....If you think, damn, a camsite would be so cool if it only had this ONE feature...well, come propose it, and you just might have a camsite with that ONE feature you always wanted...

I mean, we don't need an indy site to BE a collective to work...any one of us can make one of those...we NEED a collective to do a real camsite and use our numbers and our sexy charm and our wildly creative feminine streak to make something totally unique and cool that rocks the cam-world, and in the process makes everyone involved REALLY FUCKING WEALTHY....if all goes well...

I just see it that instead of sitting around whining and naysaying and dissing, people should be proposing and joining and LEADING. And for being prt of that movement Missy, I truly say thank you from the bottom of my heart.

B

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 06:51 AM
Bamb, nice show of professionalism. Errr....not.

Bllah blah blah...


Why even waste time writing this? I specifically asked you to present me with the questions and concerns as you see them and the ones you specifically see me dodging.

I even said please.



The only thing you want to call a "real" discussion is people agreeing with you and jumping on board with you. Anything else, you dismiss as "bullshit"


Nice way to ignore my discussion with ukmissy, or diss her...one or the other...

Also nice how you ignored all the answers I just posted to Sam.

Do you even read before you type?


More blah blah blah...and non-points and no actual questions or real "critiques" to answer..

If your partners want you to justify how you've spent the marketing budget for the last few months because maybe traffic wasn't what they'd hoped for, are you just going to call their questions "useless bullshit" and call them " rag-tag mean girls" then?


Ad again you obviously show your absolute lack of understanding for what a cooperative IS. You SAY you know, but you OBVIOUSLY don;t. Since I wouldn;t be spending their marketing budget, unless I was duly elected as the promotions person, and if I blew the money and didn;t get results, they would vote me the fuck out and I wouldn't have fuck-all to say about it.

It's a fucking cooperative, what part of that do you not understand??? I control NOTHING. I will be a 1%-5% vote...period...nothing mor and nothing less, unless the voting chooses it, and I may not accept, we shall see.

And I am the type who will say that if I was elected as the promotional head of the site, I would give a hard number for traffic and if that wasn't reached I would offer my resignation at the end of one month, or 3 or whatever.

But once again...Wikipedia is your friend...quit lying and actually go learn what a cooperative is so you don;t look dumb here (not saying you ARE dumb, but you sure look it when you OVER AND OVER post stuff that is absolutely WRONG and has nothing to do with this site...also...$20k minimum and $100k for a good site...still standing by that number??? I won't forget or drop it...)


After seeing the way you handle business questions and critiques, any interest I had in your plan is completely and utterly shot. No way in hell would I join up with someone so utterly lacking in professionalism as you have shown here.

S'ok, I SERIOUSLY doubt I would be involved in the cooperative if I even remotely hinted that you will be allowed in...I have specific marching orders from EVERYONE involved not to ask or allow any drama starting, shit stirrers. So, I am seriously doubting most of those here who are being the biggest jerks and ruining the thread would even be allowed, even if I begged.

:)

B

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 06:53 AM
After seeing the way you handle business questions and critiques, any interest I had in your plan is completely and utterly shot. No way in hell would I join up with someone so utterly lacking in professionalism as you have shown here.

Who wants to bet she keeps on posting though....hahaha

I mean the definition of a "Mean Girl"...Look at the posters here who have de-railed this thread (as well as several others they have gotten closed)..and it's a commonality of purpose...Has absolutely "no interest" in the project, would never dump a dime into it, says I waste all my time talking about it, and should do some work, and spends multitudes of time posting, talking about it, picking at it, attacking my character, attacking my motives, attacking my identity, calling me a man, or whatever can further their nasty little shit...repeatedly says I am un-businesslike after spending all this time attacking someone who has done nothing to them...And overall, they never make any argument with any REAL substance...it's all farts in the wind...

$20k...STILL standing by that??? Or is it $100k?

B

PS. For now, I don't want to waste time on anymore off-topic crap...

ETA: PPS, she edited the hell outta that message...eh?

One addition for her editing. I have at least 3-5 women, who are going to do this and who are willing to put MUCH more than $100 in and own a MUCH higher percentage. So, we can make it happen...100 women, or 10, a cooperative is still in the works.

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 07:16 AM
Oh yeah. the best thing in this thread in my opinion:


I believe I should be able to come here, and post and not be baited, attacked, called names, lied about, or have person or persons systematically stalk and try to destroy every thread I start or get heavily involved in.

To which Supa replied:


Not once have I called you or anyone else here any names. I didn't see anyone else name-calling in this thread either...

hahahaha...reminds me of movies where the guy says "You're a lying philandering cheating, two-faced dirty back-stabbing snake and you wear an ugly hat!" and the guy in questions comes back with "I like my hat!"

Good one Supa!

B

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 07:17 AM
I specifically asked you to present me with the questions and concerns as you see them and the ones you specifically see me dodging.

I even said please.


Really Bam, you quote every point then type a lengthy response. You haven't missed any points so I don't need to point them out. You just change the subject, type rhetoric or emotional crap, or simply give a non-answer to a LOT of them.


As for the rest, talking and doing are 2 different things, as I've said before. As I and others have said before, if you spent less time typing out huge long responses here and more time working, I'm sure you'd see a much more positive reception from us "mean girls" :)

It's business questions from a forum, words on a screen, not personal attacks. yeeesh.

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 07:26 AM
Oh yeah. the best thing in this thread in my opinion:



To which Supa replied:



hahahaha...reminds me of movies where the guy says "You're a lying philandering cheating, two-faced dirty back-stabbing snake and you wear an ugly hat!" and the guy in questions comes back with "I like my hat!"

Good one Supa!

B
Off the top of my head, you have referred to people here as:

mean girls
rag-tag mean girls
jerks
shit stirrers


Oh and the advice of successful businesswomen in the camming industry is "fucking worthless", according to you, because we (to your knowledge) haven't started group camsite of our own. Not only that, but according to you we are as ignorant as race car drivers when it comes to running a business. That comparison, while not a direct name-calling is still an insult, even though it is wholly inaccurate and plain out laughable.


Quote ONE instance where anyone besides you has name-called in ANY WAY in this thread.

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 07:44 AM
It's business questions from a forum, words on a screen, not personal attacks. yeeesh.


Really? When LAChloe puts "she" in quotes and more or less accuses me of being a man? That is businesslike, and a business question?

Here a few more from this thread:


Bam spends more time writing these post than actual work in my opinion.

tossing out manipulated numbers and blind projections (You never showed where I did that)

a website that looks like my 12 year old sister decided one afternoon to jump on my Mom's computer and make a website.

This whole idea she is talking about is a waste of breath.

why continue to drop your pants for a SW ritualistic beating?

Your masochism must have a limit? What is your safeword already?

She has an agenda, to get all of us out of the cam business so she can have less competition.

When a con artist tries to find victims they often do get highly upset and super defensive when questioned about what they are up to.

you go ballistic with emotional garbage and rhetoric that really answers/shows nothing but that you lack stability, level-headedness and professionalism.

Very professional business women.

B

PS. Being called a masochist who likes to be beaten? Not name calling? Professional and Businesslike?

Bambalina
09-10-2011, 07:47 AM
Just keep de-railing the thread with more and more bullshit. I am sure the mods won;t see your continual posting in a thread you ruined and say you care nothing about as baiting and rude...I'm sure you will all be treated to a nice party for this behavior...keep going...keep ruining the thread. I'm sure you are impressing....someone...

B

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 08:02 AM
drama starting, shit stirrers. So, I am seriously doubting most of those here who are being the biggest jerks



bone-headed and completely WRONG statement that is. Yet you will call me out and sit by while absolute shit gets posted...

I call bias. I call agenda. I call you a fucking lying bullshitter.


You've been called out you fucking stalker.



Seems maybe you should pull up your panties, because your agenda is showing...



First, try Mean Girl or maybe Shit Stirrer, it suits you. Secondly, with all due respect (literally, i give none because you deserve NONE) Fuck off


shit stirrers


you are a joke...



Supa-byotch and I are in complete disagreement on some things, and while I feel she treads awfully close to the "Mean Girls" line and often even crosses it





what part of that do you not understand???



quit lying and actually go learn



Insult much?





Especially since you really add NOTHING of value to the discussion, and are just a drama starter and a shit stirrer here.


You are useless here.

you're a "Mean Girl" and I think you have an agenda as well.


Also when I was searching the thread, I did a "find" for words like "shit" and "fuck" and out of 28 instances of "shit" found on 1 page alone, guess who was responsible for the VAST majority? Bambalina. In fact you dropped almost ALL of it. Same with the word "fuck". I ran 2nd on use of the word "shit" because I was quoting Bambalina. Not that any of us really care if someone curses on an adult site, but the point is that you, Bamabalina, resort to cursing and insulting, smartass remarks a LOT in response to others' questions and points. That in itself is much more drama-licious than anything others have posted here.

The hypocrisy. It's over-whelming.

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 08:09 AM
Nonono...this isn't about that, and you can CHANGE the parameters of the discussion all you want.

You said I cannot have a CAMSITE for under $20k...nothing about being successful or Long Term...You said I can;t have a cam-site programmed for under $20k...PERIOD.

There are many reasons a business can fail, there are many reasons that a site won't work, if all the people involved are not ready to make that happen.

So if you want to argue about the future, and not about what you ORIGINALLY asserted and now are back-peddling on, then say so...

You said I can't have a cam-site built for under $20k and that it is likely to be $100k. YOU said that.

Not this other shit you are now asserting up there. At least give me the respect of sticking with your argument here....sheesh.

Just because I post something that makes you look bad and look wrong and look like you're just badgering me, is no reason to now just jump ship on your argument and run to "You have to be successful, before I am wrong"...when the reality is that even if I could get the BEST cam-site in the WORLD done for $89, if I run it wrong and fail, YOU would still be wrong in saying I couldn't get a good site written or running for under $20k.

I mean, I am saying I can do it for under $5k...but YOU become "Wrong" in this argument if it costs me $15k...You said it cannot be done for under $20k and you have researched it and KNOW this to be the case.

Backpeddling, it's beyond you Supa...Either stand behind your words, or eat them and admit you were WRONG.



Wait, what?????

If you can't get a successful camsite off the ground for $10k, then when I said I didn't believe you could do it, I was wrong?????? Where is the logic here? :O

And where in the HELL do you get that I'm backpeddaling in that one line you quoted from me? Holy crap talk about making a giant leap into oblivion.

Absolutely nonsensical.

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 08:27 AM
Sorry, this one really deserves its own post, it is that rich.


Nice ass kissing, and seems ALMOST logical, except none of these people has ever started or run a cam-site, nor have they worked in a cooperative environment (and OBVIOUSLY keep saying they get it, as do you, but OBVIOUSLY don't). So no roast, their advice is fucking worthless. It is like saying that a guy who made money and did well being a race car driver, that his advice is really valuable about starting a new car company selling electric cars. Just because he DROVE cars does not make him any sort of expert on marketing them or running a manufacturer.
This is just completely laughable. Yes, we have zero actual business experience or knowledge in the camming industry. Because running our own camming business involves ZERO business or marketing skill, in the camming business. LOL!

Oh and you have NO IDEA whether any of us have worked in a corporate environment (I have, actually, and successfully I might add). Nor do you have any idea whether any of us have started a camsite. You really are talking right out of your ass there.

And the part about us being the equivalent of race car drivers in business? LMFAO. Really :rotfl:

But, on your own logic, added to the fact you say you have never started or run a camsite, then YOUR advice is "fucking worthless" too.

roast
09-10-2011, 09:28 AM
This should be obvious and it is kind of dickish for me to highlight it since it'll give people ideas, but Ill just say it:

Since nothing tangible exists about this beyond a lot of very public and detailed business planning for almost 9 months - I give some stonecold entrepreneur ~6months to launch a collective cam site. Itll probably indie listing since it'll be cheaper.

And they'll do it with their own funds and solicit contributions to cover the cost and figure out a way to profit off of it.

And I wouldn't fault them. Nothing real exists so far, they see the interest - so they can do what they want.

There is a reason girls don't post in too much detail about ways they earn money or strategically sidestep the public "help me!" posts. Talking about things like this so openly means your idea is going to be poached. Without even a blueprint it is inevitable. Every thought you have is just vomited all over the screen in a 9month chronicle of free project development.

This is just naivete and idealism gone awry. I'd suspect after a few months all of te constant planning would stop but apparently not. Someone is going to steal it and make it way better - and they'll quietly launch it and then drum up interest after the fact.

I'm not saying this for your health since I think you read posts from certain users with a blind hotrage... I'm saying this to the people who have invested so much time in this: if you think this is a great idea and have lots of ideas, just launch it yourself. You probably have most if not more of the tools - not sure what you're still waiting for. It is a "collective" - so the pledges, thoughts, planning ... none of that technically belongs to anyone, right? This is the sex industry, integrity isn't what's for dinner. Just find her leads, fill in her holes (lol) and launch the thing.

B, it is clear you don't respect established camgirls - ok that's typical of most non-camgirls launching a camming business, that's fine. You also don't have the personality or people skills for collective ownership, that's fine. Many others have already commented on your capacity for accountability and authenticity, so that's fine... so when someone has those things launches this, all I can see are months of even more depressing threads.

Or even anger at the collective (probably) and a lot of "how did this happen - don't join guys! why are you joining? this was MY idea - sorry I mean OUR idea. Theft! Theft! Theft of MY idea! I mean OUR idea! Whatever, stop joining!"

This is the sex industry, people are kinda lazy about innovation. They also tend to have more money than your average entrepreneur. Above all, they generally don't give a fuck. You can only sit on an egg long enough before the sucker hatches.

Ms.Lacey
09-10-2011, 10:27 AM
I was trying to play catch-up but this thread is a novel... (walking away slowly)

cherryblossomsinspring
09-10-2011, 11:08 AM
So when is this going to happen again?

The original thread started 08/08/2010
The projected date for opening was 01/2011 but you disappeared and returned in 05/2011 taking about some issue with a web designer or programmer etc.

Somewhere in that time you wrote about SM and MFC respecting models and "change". Also the Leo Letters. You also launched a place for cam girls to be verified and chat privately with you site. "A site for camgirls" yet they were verified by you yet still no one knows who you are. Now that's ok you don't have to be verified if you don't want to , but I noticed how you felt left out when an actual cam model did the same.

Then another post in 07/28/2011 by you said it would be up in about a month. You had everything ready to go just about.

Now the prices of what you needed models to invest went from $20.00 to $50 and now it's $100.

Now I saw helpful advice from major women in the industry but you shot them all down when their "experience" didn't mesh with your way of doing things.

I don't really see how this is a "collective" if everyone's view are being knocked down unless they agree with your own. What makes it worse is that your knocking horns with women who have DONE IT ON THEIR OWN WITH THEIR OWN MONEY.

Now I understand you're great pals with ChatGF. If I remember correctly, this was the same man that required his models to get nude for him as an audition before being allowed on his site. He got alot of flack for that but stated he would only hire "clueless models"So I understand people in the industry learn from one another but the women who wanted to be by your side respecting cam models and having a proven tract record of success were ignored or talked down to.

Then you went over to CGN which is also male dominated and oriented place. To me they are all laughing at the stupid women that can't get their shit together. Hell If I was a guy I would be busting up laughing at how we're all in our own way.

I mean what woman kisses the ass of a bunch of men and ignores advice from successful women in the industry?

In other words this is not a new special site. It's the same site like all others. So launch YOUR SITE. Whether you're a man or women makes no difference now.

I wish you success with this undertaking but perhaps you should just own it all. Why take small contributions from women when you actually have large amounts from Men that want to help you get it off the ground?

Yes they will own it not the cam girls. I do hope YOUR site does well. The energy you put into all of this writing for the last year+ = at least a very good first starting year.

I'm positive that something great will come out of this. I just don't know who will have a voice in decision making when this is all done? I'm betting on the men. But that's just my view thus far.

Avamonet
09-10-2011, 11:28 AM
You are to cute blank stare.
Banks have board of directors, in which most are christain & would never invest in porn.

Most site owners never tell their parents or family members they are in the porn industry. :)

Bam you can check me out anytime you want. Since you want to call me out.

http://www.xlgirls.com/modeldir/model/Samantha-994.html?nats=MTAwNC45LjcuNy4yOS4wLjAuMC4w
www.Samantha38g.com
http://www.plumperpass.com/t1/showgal.php?g=groups/386/2_1&s=13
http://www.bignaturals.com/main.htm
http://www.bangbros.com/t2/pps=bbonet/profiles?m=Samantha-38G1

http://www.hotmovies.com/top_rated_stars.php?star_view_pref=photos&star_gender_pref=ALL Yes, I am #25 out of thousands

Also have worked for Vivid, Naughty America, Channel 69, Penthouse, Porn Pros, Gent,Evasive Angles & Evil Angel/Manuel Ferrara & Shane Desiels DVD line.

What have you done? Bam? Where is your success? Where is your work?

Where are your magazine covers? Dvd covers? Website?
Do the biggest best male talent know your name? Request to work with you?

Have you ever googled my name and seen how many things pop up?

Proof is in the pudding as they say....
What have you done?
Because I would love to see your list of accomplishments?

I have put in the work. I have put in the time and networking in the adult industry.
When was the last time AEBN did a story on you? Mine was in July?

My integrity, My work is actually seen all around the world. There is my proof of doing what I need to do to make money each and everyday. You are not coming at a girl who thinks she can make it in porn.

Oh, and I shoot for Score again on Monday. What you want to bet I get another magazine & DVD cover?

What top list are you on?

http://www.tmz.com/2010/11/27/sister-wives-spoof-family-fun-vivid-entertainment-tlc-porn-parody-kody-brown-lehi-utah-mormon/

http://www.spike.com/video/who-has-worlds/3307769
This was my fav, because I was flipping channels and saw it when first aired on tv. Then all of my fans emailed me about it with excitement.

Have you been mentioned on Manswers?

Do you have Hustler emailing you asking why they have never shot you?
Do owners of major porn companies take you out to dinner? Because I do all the time.

:)
www.Samantha38g.com
www.myspace.com/Samantha38g
www.twitter.com/sam38g

Where are your links to show traffic? To show where you have been a success on the web and can get these girls to the next level?

I dont have to go on boards and beg the owners of adult sites to answer my emails.

I know this has nothing at all to do with the point of this thread but damn Sam you just inspired the hell out of me. I so admire a hustler. Sigh I'm getting off the couch now and going to work on some clips. :)

SupaByoch
09-10-2011, 11:53 AM
So when is this going to happen again?

The original thread started 08/08/2010
The projected date for opening was 01/2011 but you disappeared and returned in 05/2011 taking about some issue with a web designer or programmer etc.


I remember being skeptical of her plans before, and people being rather unfriendly toward me because I wasn't convinced and said so then. My experience told me then something was amiss, and it's telling me the same thing now.

When the first plan didn't work out she disappeared then came back with excuses and different plans. At this point I'd almost like to take bets on how long before we see a repeat performance from her.

I would like to believe in Bam, really I would, but the behavior displayed just raises one giant red flag after another.