Log in

View Full Version : Then why do you come here??



Pages : 1 [2] 3 4 5 6

rickdugan
11-01-2011, 07:03 AM
lol to the woman who said freeloader men end up lonely and miserable. Thats the dumbest thing I have ever heard, the men who watch stippers and rink beer in a club get good value for money and have fun.

The men who pay strippers in a club end up broke and alone. The strippers who answered this post already said that men who pay strippers dont end up with stipper gfs.

Your comment implies if you pay strippers you will get a gf lol, thats bullshit, you will just end up broke. So be smart, watch for free in club and get good value for money, dont be an idiot and throw away your money on the other hand to a stripper.

lol. You sound bitter and defensive. What happened, did some big, bad stripper take you for a ride on the pay-me-go-round one night? :D

And as you've stated in other posts, yes, we know that sex can be had with lower-end escorts for far cheaper than the cost of a string of lapdances. That is not exactly a revelation. Guys go to clubs for a variety of reasons and not all of us need to shop in the clearance racks. ;)

Idk, but imho sitting in a strip club staring at titties hour after hour gets kind of boring. The interaction is where the fun is, at least for me. If I just wanted to get laid as simply and cheaply as possible, I doubt that I'd even bother going to the club beforehand.

skwadim
11-01-2011, 11:07 AM
"Idk, but imho sitting in a strip club staring at titties hour after hour gets kind of boring. The interaction is where the fun is, at least for me."

That's fair, but I could also see someone duckin into a strip club with friends just to escape the world a bit and be in a "fantasy" land, but not really want to blow big bucks on lapdances or the more expensive private options.

Kellydancer
11-01-2011, 11:22 AM
This freeloading business really hit home for me last week during an after hours "VIP" party at a local nude club. It was by invitation only, although the management of this club seemed to be giving out invites to anyone and everyone that came into the club - and sometimes they handed people several to give to their friends. It was a party offering free food and booze - yes FREE BOOZE. Long story short - the night of the party the club was packed with looky-loos that didn't spend a dime but they took up every seat in the place and basically pushed out all of the regulars who came to spend (like me). Man, was I pissed. Every time I went off to VIP for dances, my seat would be taken by some fat slob feeding his face and guzzling free beer who never so much as put a dollar on the stage. It was pathetic. Needless to say the dancers weren't too happy either. Boy, did I give the manager an earful that night before I left (with much $$$ still in my pocket, BTW). I recommended to him that in the future he might want to consider charging a hefty admission (that would apply towards LD's) to help weed out the riff-raff. Apparently he was getting complaints from alot of the folks that had come to spend money.

Unfortunately, freeloaders are like cockroaches and congressmen.......you can never completely get rid of them ;D

I wish all customers had your view. But yep, when clubs run these types of specials this is exactly what happens. One of the clubs used to run these specials and we would get a packed house full of them. I despise non paying customers and the "friends" of the owners, etc seem to be the worst.

kdogg247
11-01-2011, 05:48 PM
I wish all customers had your view. But yep, when clubs run these types of specials this is exactly what happens. One of the clubs used to run these specials and we would get a packed house full of them. I despise non paying customers and the "friends" of the owners, etc seem to be the worst.

I can't stand going to a club when this is going on.

Kellydancer
11-01-2011, 08:45 PM
I can't stand going to a club when this is going on.

Sadly, these non paying customers turn off decent customers. I saw this at one club I worked at. Of course we all know the downward spiral when this happens because decent girls leave.

KS_Stevia
11-03-2011, 06:26 PM
Yeh, i worry about guys who buy into it as well.

As long as you don't buy into it and realise, the stripper doesn't care about you and is simply trying to get as much of your money as possible and is lying to your face, you can remain objective.

If you are objective and know the stripper is just lying to you and still want to pay her a large amount thats fair enough but if you are objective and realise that, then for the majority of people you will realise, you gain a lot more from 4 hours of watching naked girls for free and 1 lap dance thus a total of say 30 dollars for a whole night instead of 10 lapdances for 200 - 250 dollars and 10 dollars entrance fee for 30 minutes.

Also with the huge amount of money saved, you can buy so much more stuff for yourself or even get hobbies where people talk with you genuinely.

You can do that. But not stripper is going to get up close and personal with you. Have you ever been close to a sexy woman, smelled her, felt her, enjoyed a casual flirt?

One can look at naked women at home, for free too.

And I must say, any stripper stupid enough to spend a long time with a non-paying customer...that's a learning experience. I learned the hard way, and every stripper must.

VERY few men are adept enough at pulling this off, you might think you can but its going to end. Once enough girls in a club see you sitting there not spending, word gets around and you'll get ignored.

Yes, you have the right to sit there, watch for free, and not spend. That's just an occupational hazard strippers face. IF you don't give a shit that everyone in the club wants to slowly painfully extract your balls from your scrotum without anasthetic, that's fine. Hot women are used to be oggled and stared at everywhere. We just faze you out as non-existant, maybe a particularly awesome chick will walk by and spill your drink all over your pants. Its fine. But, seriously, fuck you, and all who are like you in this world.

Yes, strippers want your money. They are willing to exchange physical contact, flirting, sexy dancing, whatever, for that money. If you go into a club thinking otherwise then you deserve what's coming to you.

Who walks into a car dealership thinking that the car salesman is their friend? Who walks into a department store thinking the person selling them suits is their friend?


Now..I have many good friends I've met through various sales jobs I've had...friendship that grew naturally and organically. But if you are coming into a merchant's territory, prepare to get prospected.

Dumbfuckstickshitbag.

KS_Stevia
11-03-2011, 06:29 PM
Btw you have to be smart about this. Here where I am, having an escort for sex for 30 minutes costs 40 pounds and in general 1 stripper dance for 3 minutes costs 20 pounds so why would anybody spend 40 pounds for 6 minutes with a stripper who wont even have sex with you when:

1. You can watch the strippers for free and
2. You can have sex with an escort for 30 minutes for the same price as 2 dances.

Not everyone is in the market for sex, for a multitude of reasons. If you can't handle the tease, then stick with your escorts, they work hard for what they do. Leave the clubbing for those who prefer that type of environment and attention.

Its quite simple, really.

skwadim
11-03-2011, 07:10 PM
Yes, you have the right to sit there, watch for free, and not spend. That's just an occupational hazard strippers face. IF you don't give a shit that everyone in the club wants to slowly painfully extract your balls from your scrotum without anasthetic, that's fine.

well, it's not watching for free, if one's paid a cover to enter. and not everyone in the club wants the colorful surgical procedure you described to take place.... maybe the girls do, but the SC management doesn't seem to care, or else wouldn't they put a stop to it ?


Hot women are used to be oggled and stared at everywhere. We just faze you out as non-existant, maybe a particularly awesome chick will walk by and spill your drink all over your pants. Its fine. But, seriously, fuck you, and all who are like you in this world.

I don't get it, fuck these guys because they dont spend, or fuck them because they ogle?


Who walks into a car dealership thinking that the car salesman is their friend? Who walks into a department store thinking the person selling them suits is their friend?

No one. but how many car salesman and department store salespeople are selling them a fantasy, however brief, that they ARE their friend- in fact even MORE than their friend? Sure they may act friendly, but mostly they're asking questions about what you as a customer are looking for in a car.

Comparisons to these other sales jobs break down, because in those instances the product and salesperson are separate. I can walk in and if I know my shit regarding cars and whatever other product Im being sold, the "salesmanship" amounts to exactly dick.

With strippers, the product/service and the salesperson are inseparable. And that product - really amounts to making the guy feel better about himself (however brief, feigned and manufactured it is)


Now..I have many good friends I've met through various sales jobs I've had...friendship that grew naturally and organically. But if you are coming into a merchant's territory, prepare to get prospected.


That's fair. If a guy gets annoyed that women come up and try to sell dances, etc... that makes very little sense.

All Good Things
11-03-2011, 08:22 PM
With strippers, the product/service and the salesperson are inseparable. And that product - really amounts to making the guy feel better about himself (however brief, feigned and manufactured it is)

So if you go to a movie, say, for entertainment, wouldn't you agree that it too is "brief, feigned and manufactured?"

The same is true of many forms of entertainment: live theater, concerts, opera, etc. A lot of people are working to entertain you through various forms of acting -- most of whom actually keep their clothes on -- and they should be compensated for it.

I think you would agree that if you were to occupy a seat in any of these venues without paying (cover doesn't count -- it's just an imperfect door filter, and it goes to the club and not the dancers, anyway), you would be denying that paying seat to another customer who does pay for the service, and sometimes pays quite a lot. It's this exclusionary principle that is not immediately obvious to customers but understandably drives dancers crazy, particularly when it happens en masse.

At the risk of stating the obvious, it's also helpful to remember that the interests of the club and the interests of the dancers only intersect at certain points, but otherwise do not overlap. In many cases they diverge dramatically. That's why it's usually not helpful to suggest that "if XYZ practice were hurting dancers, the club would change it."

skwadim
11-03-2011, 08:57 PM
So if you go to a movie, say, for entertainment, wouldn't you agree that it too is "brief, feigned and manufactured?"

The same is true of many forms of entertainment: live theater, concerts, opera, etc. A lot of people are working to entertain you through various forms of acting -- most of whom actually keep their clothes on -- and they should be compensated for it.

I think you would agree that if you were to occupy a seat in any of these venues without paying (cover doesn't count -- it's just an imperfect door filter, and it goes to the club and not the dancers, anyway), you would be denying that paying seat to another customer who does pay for the service, and sometimes pays quite a lot. It's this exclusionary principle that is not immediately obvious to customers but understandably drives dancers crazy, particularly when it happens en masse.


Of course I agree with the movie comparison, I'm the one who talked about suspension of disbelief, and I don't disagree with the need for compensation.

That's why tickets are charged for shows, movies, and exactly those things you're talking about.

So I don't see where the "without paying" comes in with your analogy?


At the risk of stating the obvious, it's also helpful to remember that the interests of the club and the interests of the dancers only intersect at certain points, but otherwise do not overlap. In many cases they diverge dramatically.

And that's the customer's fault ?

All Good Things
11-03-2011, 10:29 PM
So I don't see where the "without paying" comes in with your analogy?

The first sentence in your post: "It's not watching for free [in a strip club] if one's paid a cover to enter."

I believe that it is watching for free because the cover is on its face so absurdly small as compensation for the level of entertainment provided that it's broadly understood to function as a coarse door filter and nothing more.

I think you would agree that the covers you pay at regular dance clubs (which are often higher) do not remotely entitle you to expect a string of free topless or all-nude dance shows by all the civilian girls in the club that goes on as long as you can nurse your one beer. Because strip clubs deliver a much higher level of entertainment, there is an accompanying expectation that the customers will provide compensatory remuneration to a degree that accounts for that higher level of entertainment at stage. Personal attention in the form of laps, etc. are another level beyond that, etc.

Within this culture there is really no rightful place for a perpetual space-occupying non-tipper -- while not strictly illegal by club rules, it's still considered crude, exploitative and boorish, sometimes even by the other customers. As you've seen, the dancers (rightfully) consider it to be a lot worse than that.


And that's the customer's fault ?

The club environment is a self-contained culture with its own rules and practices and conventions. It's nobody's "fault" that the cover goes to the club and not the dancers, or that the club and dancers may have diverging interests. Both are simple realities that are intrinsic to this particular culture, and understanding them is essential if one is to behave properly while operating within the culture. Those entering the club need to be aware of the undeclared conventions of the environment and learn them well, not only to be in a position to behave properly, but also to be in a position to have the most fun possible. :)

Kessler
11-04-2011, 02:50 AM
Skwadim: to quote Inigo Montoya, "I do not think that word means what you think it means".

Like my quote analogy, your film analogy feels a little shy of the bullseye. You say guys are paying for suspension of disbelief. That getting aroused, or liking "hotter" dances, is rooted in attention or emotional validation. And that this suspension of disbelief, the fantasy, is why guys enjoy themselves at SC.

Aside from being a little confused as to how this relates to guys not wanting LDs, I'm pretty sure that "emotional" need isn't linked to arousal all the time, as you suggest. If I'm not mistaken, in the state of Hawaii, most SCs don't allow LDs - the girls are nude, but separated by a rail. It's nearly impossible to talk beyond a few lines, let alone feel "accepted" behind a foot of mahogany. And yet, men still go, women still make money, and aside from the random crackhead, everyone's happy.

Could it be that some men enjoy a beautiful, nude woman on a purely visual and physical level? Maybe I'm the only one, but you get a loud "damn skippy" from me. I don't need to feel validated for me to say, "Dyaaaamn, she fine". I say it just like that. Try it - it's cathartic.

As for the movie analogy, on the physical side of it, there's no suspension of disbelief when a beautiful nude dancer is in front of you. Unless the lighting is whacked, she's really beautiful, she's really nude, and she's really there. And hopefully, she's really grinding, dancing, etc. That's the anti-thesis of most film sex scenes, actually.

That's why guys would rather see a SC in person than on film - emotional connection aside, they like the reality that the girls are really there. On a physical level, there is no suspension of disbelief!

skwadim
11-04-2011, 05:44 AM
The first sentence in your post: "It's not watching for free [in a strip club] if one's paid a cover to enter."

I believe that it is watching for free because the cover is on its face so absurdly small as compensation for the level of entertainment provided that it's broadly understood to function as a coarse door filter and nothing more.

Well, I'm not sure why you get to arbitrarily set the goalpost and decide what's "broadly understood" and what amount of money is appropriate for what amount of "entertainment value" It's interesting how you just get to make the decisions as to what's what.

By any objective measurement, you are paying to enter. So it's not free. Some clubs I've been to have ground rules, ie if you sit by the stage, you tip, and in some clubs you have a 2 drink min, or have to buy 1 drink per hour, etc.


I think you would agree that the covers you pay at regular dance clubs (which are often higher) do not remotely entitle you to expect a string of free topless or all-nude dance shows by all the civilian girls in the club that goes on as long as you can nurse your one beer.

No, but you expect to get a club with dance music, with a professional staff, with hot girls there that you can try and dance with.. etc etc.. Plus there guys may feel they have a chance to socially interact, meet a girl, whatever...

Ultimately, people deem it's worth paying the $20 or $30 or $100 (or whatever it costs to get in)


Because strip clubs deliver a much higher level of entertainment, there is an accompanying expectation that the customers will provide compensatory remuneration to a degree that accounts for that higher level of entertainment at stage. Personal attention in the form of laps, etc. are another level beyond that, etc.

Who's saying its higher? again, just an arbitrary measurement on your part. It's a different form of entertainment, but depending on what you're interested in, it's not higher or lower. If you're just searching for sexual stimulation then a strip club is your place, but if you want a chance at talking to a hot girl and dancing with her, then a SC is significantly lower.

All your fancy words really amount to this (loosely):

"If you walk into a store selling jaguars, you get to see jaguars, so you're obliged to buy a jaguar because you got a chance to see them, which you wouldn't get to see elsewhere"

Don't get me wrong, if you walk into a jaguar store, I have no problem with people trying to sell them jaguars. That's what they're there for, but to freak out and get pissed at customers when people don't buy them?


Within this culture there is really no rightful place for a perpetual space-occupying non-tipper -- while not strictly illegal by club rules, it's still considered crude, exploitative and boorish, sometimes even by the other customers. As you've seen, the dancers (rightfully) consider it to be a lot worse than that.

Ok, that's your opinion. But laying the responsibility on the customer to me is pretty ineffective. I'm kind of like Mr. Pink in Resevoir Dogs when it comes to tipping. I've lived in different parts of the world where tipping isn't expected, they just write gratuity in the bill, it's just part of the price. That's the way to do it, if you ask me.

Because, as a business if you make any expenditure discretionary, then it's just that.. at the customer's discretion, going on about societal expectation and cultural norms won't really change anything.


The club environment is a self-contained culture with its own rules and practices and conventions. It's nobody's "fault" that the cover goes to the club and not the dancers, or that the club and dancers may have diverging interests. Both are simple realities that are intrinsic to this particular culture, and understanding them is essential if one is to behave properly while operating within the culture. Those entering the club need to be aware of the undeclared conventions of the environment and learn them well, not only to be in a position to behave properly, but also to be in a position to have the most fun possible. :)

The point of asking whose fault was rhetorical, it's saying that blaming the customer for not acting in accordance with some kind of "unwritten rules" is not going change anything. A customer wants the best "bang for his buck" just like the stripper wants to get as much money as possible. If you're within the rules of the club, to me, that's fair game.

But if you're going to decide things like "undeclared norms" and "intrinsic to our culture" there's not really much one can say other than if it's so important to the parties involved, these norms should in some way be declared.

skwadim
11-04-2011, 05:54 AM
the girls are nude, but separated by a rail. It's nearly impossible to talk beyond a few lines, let alone feel "accepted" behind a foot of mahogany. And yet, men still go, women still make money, and aside from the random crackhead, everyone's happy.

But wouldn't you say those people would (or could potentially) be made happier with the interaction, feigned interest, contact, etc.. ? Have you ever seen videos of the people in North Korea freakin out and crying when their president takes the street? They seem pretty happy to me, but thats just because they really haven't experienced anything else.


Could it be that some men enjoy a beautiful, nude woman on a purely visual and physical level? Maybe I'm the only one, but you get a loud "damn skippy" from me. I don't need to feel validated for me to say, "Dyaaaamn, she fine". I say it just like that. Try it - it's cathartic.

This is a valid point, but a huge part of going to a live person environment (in my view), even if there is no contact allowed, is the human-human interaction. So even in your Hawaiian case, the guys behind the rail are there (even if it's a small amount) for an interaction. A smile, a smile back. Bang. Beautiful woman, enjoyment, emotional validation.



That's why guys would rather see a SC in person than on film - emotional connection aside, they like the reality that the girls are really there. On a physical level, there is no suspension of disbelief!

I agree that the susp of disbelief does not occur on the physical level, but I disagree that a guy goes into a real live situation, with real people, only for physical, if a girl stands in front of you, in real life, speaking and interacting, it's not possible to completely separate physical vs emotional the way you have.

KS_Stevia
11-04-2011, 05:57 AM
well, it's not watching for free, if one's paid a cover to enter. and not everyone in the club wants the colorful surgical procedure you described to take place.... maybe the girls do, but the SC management doesn't seem to care, or else wouldn't they put a stop to it ?

Many clubs have free cover, during the day, or with coupons. I keep a few around the house so that we don't have to pay $40 to get in when we go. Most regulars and cheapos do this as well. Hell, the clubs have free cover coupons one can cut out of the back of the paper.


I don't get it, fuck these guys because they dont spend, or fuck them because they ogle?

Fuck them because they sit there for hours, obviously interested and engaged, and don't spend a penny, not even a few small tips here and there. Now, a guy comes in, has a beer, doesn't see anything he likes, well....I can understand that perspective, why spend if there is not quality talent and/or the atmosphere is bad. But I don't think you've spent enough time in clubs to know of the particular bridge dwellers I speak of.


No one. but how many car salesman and department store salespeople are selling them a fantasy, however brief, that they ARE their friend- in fact even MORE than their friend? Sure they may act friendly, but mostly they're asking questions about what you as a customer are looking for in a car.

Comparisons to these other sales jobs break down, because in those instances the product and salesperson are separate. I can walk in and if I know my shit regarding cars and whatever other product Im being sold, the "salesmanship" amounts to exactly dick.

With strippers, the product/service and the salesperson are inseparable. And that product - really amounts to making the guy feel better about himself (however brief, feigned and manufactured it is)

So you're impressionable when it comes to the service that the stripper is selling, but you know your shit about cars, so a sales person can't sway you with any fantasy of status, comfort, security, etc. See, I'm the opposite....I see very clearly what's going on in the club, obviously. But take me to a car dealership, and I want to be sold something awesome! Sure I'm not going to be a sucker and not do my research, but I don't really know which particular car I want until I've driven it, felt it, fallen in LOVE with it..and then I know. Same thing goes for shoes, hehe.....


So, again, just because you cannot separate the product/service for the person in the sex industry doesn't mean that others cannot. Its all still sales. Oh, and not every stripper does the "more than friends" hustle. It just always seems that guys take it that way.

Over my life, in and out of the club, I've had so many guys approach me thinking we had a "moment" or I sent them some kind of "signal" when it was the furthest thing from my mind. You believe what you want to believe, half the time the stripper isn't even doing anything but being present and pleasant.



That's fair. If a guy gets annoyed that women come up and try to sell dances, etc... that makes very little sense.

Exactly. Thats the entire point. Custies who sulk and say "you're only here for the money" are fucking muppets. Of course a stripper is there to make money. How hard is it to understand? Even if its a job one loves, even if they would do it for free, at some point bills must be paid and food must be put on the table.

rickdugan
11-04-2011, 06:06 AM
The club environment is a self-contained culture with its own rules and practices and conventions. It's nobody's "fault" that the cover goes to the club and not the dancers, or that the club and dancers may have diverging interests. Both are simple realities that are intrinsic to this particular culture, and understanding them is essential if one is to behave properly while operating within the culture. Those entering the club need to be aware of the undeclared conventions of the environment and learn them well, not only to be in a position to behave properly, but also to be in a position to have the most fun possible. :)

Now I agree with a lot of what was said in your post, but I do not believe that dancers' and club owners' interests are as divergent as some folks on here seem to believe.

While I could never be a non-paying, non-tipping club patron, those types do serve a function in that they help clubs stay profitable. They pay cover charges and buy drinks, even if they are not paying the dancers. While this obviously helps the club, it also provides indirect benefits to the dancers by ensuring the existence of a sufficient number of clubs to dance in as well as in maintaining lower house fees. Simply put, most clubs could not survive on dancer house fees alone and, indeed, there are some clubs that take in relatively little in house fees on any given night.

For these reasons, and as I stated in another thread, while I certainly understand the "pay me or gtfo" mentality of some dancers and I do not condone guys taking in free shows, every customer that spends something in the club provides a direct and/or indirect benefit to both the club owner as well as the dancers in that club. Now this point may seem to be a bit esoteric, but just try kicking out every guy in a club who does not buy dances or tip the girls and see how fast things turn bad for everyone involved.

Anyway, just my :twocents: fwiw.

Aurora_Sunset
11-04-2011, 08:27 AM
So, again, just because you cannot separate the product/service for the person in the sex industry doesn't mean that others cannot. Its all still sales. Oh, and not every stripper does the "more than friends" hustle. It just always seems that guys take it that way.

Over my life, in and out of the club, I've had so many guys approach me thinking we had a "moment" or I sent them some kind of "signal" when it was the furthest thing from my mind. You believe what you want to believe, half the time the stripper isn't even doing anything but being present and pleasant.





Yes, exactly. I never tell guys I'll meet them OTC, but they think that me not storming off immediately upon them suggesting it must mean I'm totally interested in seeing them after work for free... But you know what? When it didn't happen within the week - guess what? They usually stopped spending on me and moved on to trying to work another girl. I don't try to mind-fuck my customers - I give them (mostly) what they want in the club, and if they don't like where it leads/doesn't lead, they are capable of walking away, and many have done so when they realized I was never going to be friends with them anywhere but in the club. I'm hot, I'm flirty, but I'm not some mystical fucking siren - I can't put a spell on customers to make them fall in love with me and be forever blinded by it.

Just because I'm nice and I do what strippers are supposed to do (you know, be pleasant to potential customers), that doesn't mean I'm trying to sell the idea that we are "more than friends." It means I'm trying to sell you the idea that it'll be fun to have me (a hot lady) dance all over you. Doesn't make us "more than friends" - it doesn't even make us friends (are you friends with every girl you've ever grinded on in a club?). But I'm not going to be a stoic little stripper-bot that just walks up without a smile and says "wanna dance?" Even if you get it that I'm not actually interested in your friendship, nobody wants a dance from a stripper that doesn't act like she's happy to see you. And you know what? I am happy to see customers. They're the reason I make money. No customers = no money, so why wouldn't I be happy when I walk up to a new person? Why does me acting like a pleasant human being mean that I'm trying to trick you into thinking I'm gonna go home with you or that we are anything more than dancer--customer? I'm pleasant and talk to customers at my serving job. I've never had a customer flag me down when he's done with his meal and be like "Ok, you ready to go home with me, now? What do you mean no? You were totally flirting with me my entire meal!" Just because stripping taps into a more sexual part of your brain, doesn't mean that you can't understand that pleasantness is pleasantness to make your experience, well, you know, pleasant, but it's not an invitation to go fuck you OTC...

This continued implication that any man who goes into a SC can't distinguish the fantasy of a hot girl rubbing herself on him from the reality that she wouldn't do it for free, and he will be screwed over by it is really rather insulting to the intelligence of men... Sure there are some strippers who try to convince you that "no, really, we're more than friends and I'll date you OTC!" Most don't... We're nice to customers because why the hell wouldn't we be? Idk, I guess I just have this silly notion that most people who walk into a SC are intelligent human beings that understand that me shooting them a smile is part of my job to make their experience fun, and not me thinking "I wanna hop on your dick!" It's not some sort of evil calculation as to how I can make them totally believe that we're more than friends. ::)

skwadim
11-04-2011, 08:33 AM
So you're impressionable when it comes to the service that the stripper is selling, but you know your shit about cars, so a sales person can't sway you with any fantasy of status, comfort, security, etc.

No- the point is the product and the sales person are different in those cases. It's not about being impressionable or not, it's about separating the two. With strippers, you can't separate them. It's similar to an actor or politician in that way, they are selling themselves- (in different ways than a stripper) but the sales person and the product are one and the same.

With strippers everyone is 'impressionable' (even if they are suspending belief and ultimately cerebrally know its all an act)



See, I'm the opposite....I see very clearly what's going on in the club, obviously. But take me to a car dealership, and I want to be sold something awesome! Sure I'm not going to be a sucker and not do my research, but I don't really know which particular car I want until I've driven it, felt it, fallen in LOVE with it..and then I know. Same thing goes for shoes, hehe.....

Right, well you're an emotional buyer, where as others are more functional. With strippers I don't think you can be a functional buyer, because the product/service is by definition catering to one's emotions.


So, again, just because you cannot separate the product/service for the person in the sex industry doesn't mean that others cannot. Its all still sales. Oh, and not every stripper does the "more than friends" hustle. It just always seems that guys take it that way.

I disagree, when other's "separate" them what they are really saying is they ultimately "know" it's an act, and once they leave the club they "know" the stripper doesnt care about them, intellectually.

And again, I don't contest that at all. What Im saying is emotionally they're playing along, even if just for a second, because its the interaction that's important, and that's where I say they can't separate.


And c'mon, every stripper that has approached me has approached with a variant of "hey sexy", "hey baby", or something of the like, you're telling me that's not feigning interest in "more than friendship" ? C'mon let's be intellectually honest here, strippers are indeed catering to male emotions... (exclusively)



Exactly. Thats the entire point. Custies who sulk and say "you're only here for the money" are fucking muppets. Of course a stripper is there to make money. How hard is it to understand? Even if its a job one loves, even if they would do it for free, at some point bills must be paid and food must be put on the table.

Sure I think its silly for guys to have different expectations, but I also think it's silly for women to expect guys to automatically spend because it's "inherent to the culture of the club" or "undeclared norms" Me personally, I spend when I feel like it

All Good Things
11-04-2011, 11:53 AM
Well, I'm not sure why you get to arbitrarily set the goalpost and decide what's "broadly understood" and what amount of money is appropriate for what amount of "entertainment value" It's interesting how you just get to make the decisions as to what's what.

I'm not deciding, I'm describing.

There are certain prevailing customs in any culture -- or a subculture, in the case of strip clubs -- and you ignore those customs at your own peril. As you know, it's your choice to ignore customs in other countries, but doing so will come across to the inhabitants in the same way -- you will appear to be crude, dismissive or even hostile. (Note the tone of the responses you are getting from dancers in this thread.) In my mind, hiding egregious penny-pinching behind the customer's prerogative in a strip club is akin to marching around the world as the ultimate ugly American. It's not illegal, it's just incredibly bad behavior.


All your fancy words really amount to this (loosely): "If you walk into a store selling jaguars, you get to see jaguars, so you're obliged to buy a jaguar because you got a chance to see them, which you wouldn't get to see elsewhere"

Well, the strip club isn't selling jaguars to drive away at the end of the night like the Jaguar dealer is. A closer analogy would be to a car show where you pay a nominal entry fee to get in and see all the shiny new models without the expectation on your part that you are going to be able to drive one home at the end of your visit. However, like all analogies on this subject, this one is only a crude approximation because unlike a car show, the dancers are actually animate and sentient human beings, are working to make a living, and are entirely dependent on customer tips and fees to be able to pay their daily bills, often including those for their children, and survive. This takes us full circle back to the stage theater performers and other actors who are paid to act as a form of entertainment for you.

You should pay the actors for their work to entertain you. It doesn't get much simpler than that.


I'm kind of like Mr. Pink in Resevoir Dogs when it comes to tipping. I've lived in different parts of the world where tipping isn't expected, they just write gratuity in the bill, it's just part of the price. That's the way to do it, if you ask me.

Actually, your position does remind me of the thinking of certain Mr. Pink, except you are decidedly less hostile, derisive, sarcastic and openly confrontational. (Sorry, an inside SW joke).

I'm glad you brought up Mr. Pink from Reservoir Dogs because his refusal to tip causes all the other characters (as you know, they are all male) to immediately jump all over him with this sort of merciless ferocity, all in an attempt to help him see the light of day on how tipping is essential to the survival of their waitress (God bless them -- it's the only humane thing they do in the movie). If I'm not mistaken, a few of them use the same points I am making here. Mr. Pink refuses strictly on the grounds of what he sees as "principle," but in fact ignores the valid points everybody else is making. The problem with standing "on principle" while ignoring all the countervailing evidence around you is that at the end of the day, there is no "principle," only raw stubbornness. And this raw stubbornness turns out to be the undoing of all the characters in the movie.

One of the advantages of participating in this forum is that it exposes you to important other viewpoints that are offered from experienced customers and far more experienced dancers whose honest views are often not visible to customers at any time by virtue of the fact that they are always acting or otherwise performing in front of men in the club.

It may make sense for you to consider those opinions in determining your future behavior in strip clubs. It's a valuable window of insight and a shame to simply throw away. This is just a suggestion, but in my experience there is always value and merit in the views of people with substantially more experience or a unique perspective, especially in the case of dancers who are in every measure insiders in a subculture that is commonly misunderstood, dismissed or unfairly stigmatized by the larger culture, usually for reasons having to do with the insecurities or fears or ingrained prejudices of the latter.

Kellydancer
11-04-2011, 12:14 PM
So you're impressionable when it comes to the service that the stripper is selling, but you know your shit about cars, so a sales person can't sway you with any fantasy of status, comfort, security, etc. See, I'm the opposite....I see very clearly what's going on in the club, obviously. But take me to a car dealership, and I want to be sold something awesome! Sure I'm not going to be a sucker and not do my research, but I don't really know which particular car I want until I've driven it, felt it, fallen in LOVE with it..and then I know. Same thing goes for shoes, hehe.....

Maybe it's me but when it comes to buying a car I investigate my options. Back in 2005 I was looking for a car, and knew I wanted a Ford Focus because I liked the price and safety standards an all of that. I knew I wanted the second least expensive package and that I wanted a new car. So I took my dad with me to check into the car I wanted and he helped me negotiate the car I wanted. The result was I got the exact type of car I wanted, and I got it cheaper than I expected. I also got the more expensive package at the price I wanted. A complete win win for me. I still drive the car.

With clubs though I always looked at it more of an impulse buy. Maybe this is me though.


Now I agree with a lot of what was said in your post, but I do not believe that dancers' and club owners' interests are as divergent as some folks on here seem to believe.

While I could never be a non-paying, non-tipping club patron, those types do serve a function in that they help clubs stay profitable. They pay cover charges and buy drinks, even if they are not paying the dancers. While this obviously helps the club, it also provides indirect benefits to the dancers by ensuring the existence of a sufficient number of clubs to dance in as well as in maintaining lower house fees. Simply put, most clubs could not survive on dancer house fees alone and, indeed, there are some clubs that take in relatively little in house fees on any given night.

For these reasons, and as I stated in another thread, while I certainly understand the "pay me or gtfo" mentality of some dancers and I do not condone guys taking in free shows, every customer that spends something in the club provides a direct and/or indirect benefit to both the club owner as well as the dancers in that club. Now this point may seem to be a bit esoteric, but just try kicking out every guy in a club who does not buy dances or tip the girls and see how fast things turn bad for everyone involved.

Anyway, just my :twocents: fwiw.

I know you are a good customer because several dancers here have mentioned this, but unfortunately, many are not. The problem many of us have run into is that not that these guys are paying a cover and not giving more money, but that some are coming in free, not spending any money (or little)then expecting a free show. At one club I went to a manager and asked him why they were allowing in men for free and not expecting them to pay drinks and his response was they "might" spend money. Great but when there are too many of these guys, that often discourages the spending guys to come in. Also, many clubs charge a cover charge, and while they get a lot of non spenders, I haven't seen clubs charge less because of this. In fact many clubs that charged the most for admission fee, charged the most for dancers under the assumption if the guys could afford the fee they would spend. This sometimes backfired because some guys think they won't spend money because they spent a lot on cover charges.

rickdugan
11-04-2011, 12:55 PM
I know you are a good customer because several dancers here have mentioned this, but unfortunately, many are not. The problem many of us have run into is that not that these guys are paying a cover and not giving more money, but that some are coming in free, not spending any money (or little)then expecting a free show. At one club I went to a manager and asked him why they were allowing in men for free and not expecting them to pay drinks and his response was they "might" spend money. Great but when there are too many of these guys, that often discourages the spending guys to come in. Also, many clubs charge a cover charge, and while they get a lot of non spenders, I haven't seen clubs charge less because of this. In fact many clubs that charged the most for admission fee, charged the most for dancers under the assumption if the guys could afford the fee they would spend. This sometimes backfired because some guys think they won't spend money because they spent a lot on cover charges.

Well, I'm a decent customer at best, but I know what you are saying about the non-spenders. In fact, I would agree that in many of the clubs I visit, only a small percentage of the guys seem to be doing much spending on the girls. Hell, in the clubs I frequent when I travel down south, the stages are often so far removed from the tables and bars that a guy can easily sit there all night and watch girls without ever feeling any pressure to tip. This is not so much the case in my local haunts, where the bars surround the stages and tip walks place a lot of pressure on guys to tip, but it should not take this type of setup to get guys to open their wallets a bit. Unfortunately we know the reality of this, which is a shame and sucks for the dancers.

Now it may simply be a function of the clubs that I normally frequent, which are mid-tier joints far removed from downtown city locations, but I doubt that many of my local or road clubs could survive without the bums who spend solely on cover charges and alcohol, but not on the girls. Heck, many of these clubs are charging girls less than $50 per night to dance and some will discount that amount even more if the girls come in early, work certain shifts, etc. In fact, my favorite local club waives house fees altogether for girls that also work part of the day shift. Net-net, these clubs just cannot survive without enough customers coming in the door, regardless of whether these guys buy from the girls.

So my only point was that these gawkers and bar hangers are probably a necessary evil and, without them, there would likely be fewer clubs to dance in.

Kellydancer
11-04-2011, 01:03 PM
In some cases they probably are, but I've dealt with the guys who don't spend money at all, even on drinks. These guys are the ones who dancers resent because they do want something for nothing.

I did work at a club years ago where most of the seats were around the stage. If I recall (it's been 15 years)most of the guys spent money there on tips but most guys didn't buy dances. They did buy drinks though (we hustled drinks as well as dances). Plus the club charged a cover charge. We didn't pay a house fee because they did make a lot on drinks.

JoJoX
11-04-2011, 04:14 PM
I'd visit if friends who I no longer did dances with were working ...

i love how these guys who i am referring to call dancers their friends. lol

All Good Things
11-04-2011, 08:43 PM
For these reasons, and as I stated in another thread, while I certainly understand the "pay me or gtfo" mentality of some dancers and I do not condone guys taking in free shows, every customer that spends something in the club provides a direct and/or indirect benefit to both the club owner as well as the dancers in that club. Now this point may seem to be a bit esoteric, but just try kicking out every guy in a club who does not buy dances or tip the girls and see how fast things turn bad for everyone involved.

I wanted to respond to your most salient points following your exchange with KD -- and I think it's still the ones above.

My intent was not to suggest kicking out the non-tipping squatters who excel at taking up valuable room and displacing actual tipping/paying customers, all the while slowly sliding down in their chairs in a futile attempt at disappearing from view.

After all, you can't punish boneheaded gawkers for breaking rules that don't actually exist. But I do feel that they need to be called out on persistently bad behavior, especially when 1) they are too young or inexperienced to know what is expected of them in a strip club environment; 2) they know all about the tipping culture in the club, but develop highly selective spatial blindness when a dancer at stage draws near, or 3) they have what appears to be a strange sense of entitlement under which strip clubs become an extension of their own living rooms and where they can pay what is essentially a toll fee to watch dancers all night long trying to make a living while they quietly nurse a single beer.

I do understand that if the club is a dive, the talent a mess or the atmosphere a joke that a customer has the right to take action -- but that action should be to bolt to another club, not sit around like a broken appliance that's too heavy to move. :)

Kellydancer
11-04-2011, 08:58 PM
The sad thing is the one club I've mentioned with these squatters who didn't even pay admission wasn't really a dive. It was a nice set up with two stages and a DJ and the dancers were attractive until these guys became the only ones there. They weren't even young guys either.

I have worked a few clubs with what I call the "Norm" of the club (Norm being the character on Cheers). In most of these clubs these were guys who were going there before it became strip clubs then kept coming, usually to drink or play pool. Most of them didn't really buy dances but would often tip on stage. I'm sure every dancers has worked with these guys, they are often the ones who will become friends with dancers and drive them around if needed. A few of them have given me money when I was short on paying my house fees (not often but sometimes). They also tend to be pretty cool and often if they were the only guys there we often wouldn't dance because they really didn't care.

Vyanka
11-04-2011, 09:07 PM
I wish clubs would kick out wastes of space/time killers who wont spend a damn dime on anyone in less than an hour.That would be great. Ahhh, to fantasize. :cloud9:

skwadim
11-04-2011, 09:08 PM
I'm not deciding, I'm describing.

There are certain prevailing customs in any culture -- or a subculture, in the case of strip clubs -- and you ignore those customs at your own peril. As you know, it's your choice to ignore customs in other countries, but doing so will come across to the inhabitants in the same way -- you will appear to be crude, dismissive or even hostile. (Note the tone of the responses you are getting from dancers in this thread.) In my mind, hiding egregious penny-pinching behind the customer's prerogative in a strip club is akin to marching around the world as the ultimate ugly American. It's not illegal, it's just incredibly bad behavior.

Then you have yet to explain why most strip clubs haven't forced men to purchase LD's at a certain frequency ? (say 1 per hour) If something is so ingrained as standard, expected behavior, why not make it official ? I know one club that does have something like that, they charge a $30 cover which includes a single LD.

First of all the customs of countries and cultures have no monetary (or rarely do) association with it - these are rooted more in line with philosophy of the people, or other external conditions of the region that brought about a cultural belief (ie shaking hands, rooted historically in the desire for people to communicate to each other they are unarmed) Also, in most cases these cultural customs serve a purpose of group acceptance, and camaraderie. I think we've gone over ad nauseum, that the last thing on a stripper's mind is to forge any kind of camaraderie with customers.

Strip clubs are a business, are they not? In most cases a business can (and usually does) make strict delineations as to how their business will operate, and not rely on "sub cultural norms"

This is just indicative of a selective interpretation: when it benefits the stripper, then it's perfectly well to compare strip clubs to "cultures" or countries, or even communities, where unwritten norms must be observed or we risk ostracization, which has clear emotional impact (ie when certain cultures shun people that violate customs you're talking about)

but any time the guy interprets the strip club as anything but a place of business where financial transactions take place and the girl is just providing, "a service", he's met with the harshest fury imaginable: It's my job! I just care about the money! why would you think it's any different! DumbMotherfuckingShitDouchebag!


I'm glad you brought up Mr. Pink from Reservoir Dogs because his refusal to tip causes all the other characters (as you know, they are all male) to immediately jump all over him with this sort of merciless ferocity, all in an attempt to help him see the light of day on how tipping is essential to the survival of their waitress (God bless them -- it's the only humane thing they do in the movie).

Actually, Mr. Orange says "give me my dollar back, he's convinced me"

Nice Guy Eddie is just dumbfounded, but doesn't jump all over him

Mr. Blue just says, "what's something special, take you in the back and suck your dick?"

Mr White is the one that argues the most using points:

"Waitressing is the #1 job for non college educated females, its the one job anyone could get and the reason they can make a living is based on your tips" etc etc...


If I'm not mistaken, a few of them use the same points I am making here. Mr. Pink refuses strictly on the grounds of what he sees as "principle," but in fact ignores the valid points everybody else is making. The problem with standing "on principle" while ignoring all the countervailing evidence around you is that at the end of the day, there is no "principle," only raw stubbornness. And this raw stubbornness turns out to be the undoing of all the characters in the movie.

Well, the discussion at that table isn't as nearly as intellectual, no one is talking about 'cultural norms' and restaurant tipping is a whole different animal - it's well beyond 'unwritten rules' Because the govt taxes based on tips, they're considered income, not discretionary "gifts" given by customers. So in effect they're really not tips. Really what restaurants should do is just tack on an extra 15% to each bill and call it a day. (and for large parties, they do)

Mr. Pink doesn't ignore any valid points, in fact he counteracts the "they depend on your tips" argument by asking why we as a society don't feel the need to tip, say fast food cashiers, they take your money, they're serving you food - but society says "tip these people" but "don't tip those"


It may make sense for you to consider those opinions in determining your future behavior in strip clubs. It's a valuable window of insight and a shame to simply throw away. This is just a suggestion, but in my experience there is always value and merit in the views of people with substantially more experience or a unique perspective, especially in the case of dancers who are in every measure insiders in a subculture that is commonly misunderstood, dismissed or unfairly stigmatized by the larger culture, usually for reasons having to do with the insecurities or fears or ingrained prejudices of the latter.

Well I don't really get your conclusion, I don't hesitate to spend in SC's out of stigma or anything like that, for me its just a matter of preference, LD's are discretionary, so I'll pick them up based on my discretion. Since I know you're a fan of simple statements, it doesn't get any simpler than that.

Vyanka
11-04-2011, 09:08 PM
A cheapass is a cheapass is a cheapass.
Cheapskates can try and rationalize their stinginess all they want, but it is what it is, and they are unlikely to change anytime soon. Arguing with them just gives them an arena to try and justify their behavior.

In the club the best thing dancers can do is ignore these dregs, and fawn all over the spenders ;).

:yes: .....

KeithDoxen
11-04-2011, 09:59 PM
Maybe this is a dumb question, but why don't dancers simply identify the time-wasters and then ignore them? I mean, I'm a customer, and I can pick out the guys who are just there for a peep show within 10 minutes of being in the club. They're usually guys who are there with friends, sitting near the stage, but not leaving any tips. And they tend to brush off the dancers who come over. If I can pick them out, surely the dancers can, probably far more quickly. So why not just ignore them?

yoda57us
11-04-2011, 10:34 PM
Maybe this is a dumb question, but why don't dancers simply identify the time-wasters and then ignore them?

They do Kieth. This is a dancer support site. The ladies come here, in part, to vent about some of the things at work that annoy them...

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 12:14 AM
Maybe this is a dumb question, but why don't dancers simply identify the time-wasters and then ignore them? I mean, I'm a customer, and I can pick out the guys who are just there for a peep show within 10 minutes of being in the club. They're usually guys who are there with friends, sitting near the stage, but not leaving any tips. And they tend to brush off the dancers who come over. If I can pick them out, surely the dancers can, probably far more quickly. So why not just ignore them?

The problem is that these guys are often most or even all of the customers. When this happens you have a lot of angry dancers and of course then management gets angry. When it comes to the guys sitting at a table you can ignore, but when they are at stage not tipping it is infuriating. I always felt awful when this happened, especially when they have money sitting at the tip rail and not giving it to you.

Kessler
11-05-2011, 05:23 AM
This is so true, unfortunately. The last time I visited an SC, of the guys sitting at the rail, maybe 30% were tipping regularly. Of the total club population, probably only 20-30% were getting dances. What's worse, the rail was full and the club was packed. The other guys were bumps on a rather boring log.

I understand wanting to sit for a bit and enjoy the stage shows or even just admire the girls walking around, but frankly, if you're not paying for a dance or tipping, you're getting free eye-candy. And that's not fair to the girls. The door fee, drinks and valet all go to the club. AND WE DON'T GO TO THE CLUB TO SEE THE CLUB.

What if I went to a barbershop, got a haircut and didn't pay? I'm not there for the barbershop or crappy magazines while I wait. I'm there to see the barber. I pay him accordingly for his services.

Even if you're just looking at the women, they're still providing you with a service (eye-candy which you normally wouldn't get anywhere else). WE GO TO THE CLUB FOR THE WOMEN. Whether it be for emotional, physical or whatever satisfaction - it's for the women. Compensate them accordingly. Or get out and let someone who's more appreciative take your seat.

Kessler
11-05-2011, 05:33 AM
But wouldn't you say those people would (or could potentially) be made happier with the interaction, feigned interest, contact, etc.. ? Have you ever seen videos of the people in North Korea freakin out and crying when their president takes the street? They seem pretty happy to me, but thats just because they really haven't experienced anything else.

Isn't this a hypothetical?

This is a valid point, but a huge part of going to a live person environment (in my view), even if there is no contact allowed, is the human-human interaction. So even in your Hawaiian case, the guys behind the rail are there (even if it's a small amount) for an interaction. A smile, a smile back. Bang. Beautiful woman, enjoyment, emotional validation.

I'll totally concede that they're there for the interaction. However, "emotional validation" feels too strong a term. I don't think, "How's your night been? Good? Cool, cool," really counts as emotional validation. Unless, you know, you're like Comic-Con isolated. Which is true for some of the men, but definitely not all.


I agree that the susp of disbelief does not occur on the physical level, but I disagree that a guy goes into a real live situation, with real people, only for physical, if a girl stands in front of you, in real life, speaking and interacting, it's not possible to completely separate physical vs emotional the way you have.

I agree that most guy want to talk to the pretty lady, and it's impossible to separate the physical and emotional (or maybe "interaction" is a better word). But you were stating that the sole reason guys go to SCs and get aroused is because of the suspension of disbelief. I was just disagreeing, saying that guys also get aroused because they're around real, live, hot naked women.

If "emotional" connection was 100% necessary, then the porn industry would be dead.

skwadim
11-05-2011, 06:44 AM
I agree that most guy want to talk to the pretty lady, and it's impossible to separate the physical and emotional (or maybe "interaction" is a better word). But you were stating that the sole reason guys go to SCs and get aroused is because of the suspension of disbelief. I was just disagreeing, saying that guys also get aroused because they're around real, live, hot naked women.

If "emotional" connection was 100% necessary, then the porn industry would be dead.

You're proving my point. What differentiates going to a SC, interacting with a real live hot naked woman vs just sitting at your home watching porn ? The emotional interaction (and really feedback loop - ie, you smile say something, she smiles, laughs back etc etc...) that you have, however brief, with the dancer.

If guys didn't get aroused further by that (or really, if it didn't add any further value), then guys would just sit at home and watch porn all day, it's helluva lot cheaper.

I wasn't implying that hot, naked, women weren't arousing, I was saying that in a SC, it's the emotional interaction/connection/validation (however brief) WITH a hot, naked, woman that makes it arousing.

I mean, even when watching porn, isn't that what most guys have to manufacture themselves - a fake emotional interaction ?

ie. when guys watch, aren't many imagining the girl they're watching is actually having sex with them ? Isn't that what some of these "POV" style video's are trying to evoke?

I sure am.. otherwise, who gives a shit that this hot chick is banging this other guy ?

yoda57us
11-05-2011, 09:15 AM
If "emotional" connection was 100% necessary, then the porn industry would be dead.


You're proving my point.

Actually he's not, he is making his own point and it's been proven out in threads all over this board in the past. The dancer who started this very thread wants to know why guys who don't buy dances go to clubs. Well, guys who don't buy dances don't have social interaction with dancers, they just stare at them and, since they clearly annoy the ladies, there is no approval of any sort going on.

I agree with you that there are definitely guys who go to a strip club looking for an emotional connection or escape. Sometimes, as is happened with me more than once, you find a connection when you least expect it. What I don't buy into is your notion that we are somehow looking for approval when we give a woman money to take her clothes off. That may be what you want, it's not what I want.

Vyanka
11-05-2011, 09:50 AM
You cheap ass MF'ers should be embarrassed by your cheapness. OMG. I bet even at a regular bar and restaurant you prob don't even tip either...& if you do, it's prob mega lousy. Damn penny pinchers. Lol. If you don't like supporting strip clubs, just don't go and don't even come to a SUPPORTIVE stripping website either. Useless.

yoda57us
11-05-2011, 11:03 AM
Maybe we should charge a cover to keep out the riff raff and the looky loos...

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 11:07 AM
Yes. What I don't get is why these cheapasses not only go to the clubs but they come here spouting their cheapassness (new word). It's almost like they are "proud" that they are cheap twice, in the club and online.

Vyanka
11-05-2011, 11:14 AM
Yes. What I don't get is why these cheapasses not only go to the clubs but they come here spouting their cheapassness (new word). It's almost like they are "proud" that they are cheap twice, in the club and online.

Lmfaooo. Yes! Seriously, don't they get embarrassed? Shit, I would. I can't even hang out with cheap fucks bc it's embarrassing to be seen associating with them. Ppl will think I'm cheap too. Plus it would irritate me being the only one shelling out.

Embarrassing. Thank God I was taught not to be a cheap fuck and to be fair.

So question for you who don't tip at all.... are you NOT embarrassed and ashamed at all be known as a penny pincher/useless???? Fuck, if I had a few ppl staring at me like a waste of space i'd be out. Doesn't it make you feel uncomfortable???

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 11:21 AM
I hate cheap fucks no matter who they are. My parents always told me to be generous no matter what and I am. I always tip waitresses, hairdressers. masseuse, etc and don't get those who don't. I had a friend who was cheap and would leave a $1 tip (if that)for a lobster dinner. Drove me nuts. Even when I've gone to clubs (as a customer, not dancer)I always tipped dancers and told my guy friends to do so (and often gave them money for dances).

yoda57us
11-05-2011, 11:23 AM
Yes. What I don't get is why these cheapasses not only go to the clubs but they come here spouting their cheapassness (new word). It's almost like they are "proud" that they are cheap twice, in the club and online.

Cheap-ass customer are defiant in their cheapness. They see it as a combination of beating the system and it being their God-given right to look but not pay or to try and monopolize a girl's time without compensating her for it ITC.

I've even seen it spread to OTC. One of the funniest and yet most pathetic cheap-ass stories I've ever heard comes from a long time fav of mine. She met a customer for an innocent OTC lunch. He had carefully orchestrated the meeting but, when the bill came, he had no money! Coincidently, his spending ITC began to drop-off and eventually became non-existent. This is the kind of stupidity that really cracks me up. This loser tried to put himself in the "potential boyfriend" zone by getting cheap with a woman that he was trying to make some time with. Honestly, when does ever work with any woman in or out of the strip club? He ended up in the "waste-of time in or out of the club" zone...

Vyanka
11-05-2011, 11:29 AM
I hate cheap fucks no matter who they are. My parents always told me to be generous no matter what and I am. I always tip waitresses, hairdressers. masseuse, etc and don't get those who don't. I had a friend who was cheap and would leave a $1 tip (if that)for a lobster dinner. Drove me nuts. Even when I've gone to clubs (as a customer, not dancer)I always tipped dancers and told my guy friends to do so (and often gave them money for dances).

I don't even understand how cheap ppl even have friends. LOL.

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 11:32 AM
Cheap-ass customer are defiant in their cheapness. They see it as a combination of beating the system and it being their God-given right to look but not pay or to try and monopolize a girl's time without compensating her for it ITC.

I've even seen it spread to OTC. One of the funniest and yet most pathetic cheap-ass stories I've ever heard comes from a long time fav of mine. She met a customer for an innocent OTC lunch. He had carefully orchestrated the meeting but, when the bill came, he had no money! Coincidently, his spending ITC began to drop-off and eventually became non-existent. This is the kind of stupidity that really cracks me up. This loser tried to put himself in the "potential boyfriend" zone by getting cheap with a woman that he was trying to make some time with. Honestly, when does ever work with any woman in or out of the strip club? He ended up in the "waste-of time in or out of the club" zone...

I wish I could say I had never heard of a situation like that but I have. I know a dancer who was actually told that because he spends a lot of money in the club SHE should pay for the meal. I mentioned in another thread when a guy mentioned being cheap OTC, that it never works to be cheap. I have gone on dates with guy (not guys I met ITC)who pulled this "I have no money" and I never went out with them again. It's not being a gold digger at all, but rather that cheap asses are not valued in any aspect. I wonder where some guys got this idea that being cheap means finding a girlfriend because it doesn't unless he's really hot and she's desperate.

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 11:35 AM
I don't even understand how cheap ppl even have friends. LOL.

I'm no longer friends with her for many reasons, but yes her cheapness got to me. I tried helping her (and would often leave a bigger tip because of her paltry tip. I also dated a few cheap guys very briefly, as in one date and out. I will not tolerate cheapness with boyfriend.

Vyanka
11-05-2011, 11:53 AM
I'm no longer friends with her for many reasons, but yes her cheapness got to me. I tried helping her (and would often leave a bigger tip because of her paltry tip. I also dated a few cheap guys very briefly, as in one date and out. I will not tolerate cheapness with boyfriend.

I will not tolderate cheapness with anyone either, friends of BFs.

If you're a generous person, good karma will give it back you twice if not three times as much when you least expect it. I'm a firm believer in that. :)

yoda57us
11-05-2011, 11:59 AM
I wonder where some guys got this idea that being cheap means finding a girlfriend because it doesn't unless he's really hot and she's desperate.

LOL, the last part of your sentence answers the first part! Never underestimate the the ability of a guy with a huge ego and out-of-control libido to imagine himself to be "a catch".

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 12:12 PM
True, but to me being generous is so important, more than looks. My best exboyfriend was very generous and so were most of the guys trying to impress me. Guys that are cheap aren't guys I pay attention to, no matter how hot he is. I'm a generous person, sometimes too much but I feel that I this is important. I've been known to treat people to activities who have been good to me and have given many generous donations of time and money to varios places.

The funny thing is that many of the guys who were cheap were unattractive inside and out. One guy was obese, another was balding, on drugs and started fights. These guys think they were too hot for average women yet they are still single. I know I posted the story of my one date with the balding guy because he was extremely cheap and wanted me to pay for him (I declined).

Vyanka
11-05-2011, 12:18 PM
LOL, the last part of your sentence answers the first part! Never underestimate the the ability of a guy with a huge ego and out-of-control libido to imagine himself to be "a catch".

AMEN.

yoda57us
11-05-2011, 01:01 PM
I'm siggied! (is that a word?) By one of the cool chicks even!

Thanks V! :hat:

Kellydancer
11-05-2011, 01:19 PM
You need to post more often in off topic threads like in the lounge. You are way too cool to just post in this section.