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Doc Holliday
12-07-2011, 05:27 PM
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Doc Holliday
12-07-2011, 05:33 PM
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StripClubPsych
12-07-2011, 05:43 PM
On a serious note though, if you have 250k sitting around and want to open a strip club.. come out to AZ. There are plenty spaces available.

And if you pay me $100,000 a year I will gladly listen to whatever ideas you have and handle all the books and day-to-day stuff in your vision.

It will close within the year the way you're describing it... but I'm happy to make 100k in a year even if the business does fail. It's not my money anyway.

Doc Holliday
12-07-2011, 05:57 PM
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unbeleavable
12-07-2011, 06:04 PM
Lesson number 1, they will spend it ...to see;) do not let this guy beat you.

All Good Things
12-07-2011, 06:09 PM
The $20K will buy you a decent night at a club in Vegas.

You should look up some SW dancers who work there. They will help you spend it.

They should get paid for having to actually read this thread.

Doc Holliday
12-07-2011, 06:10 PM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

kikidejavu
12-07-2011, 06:12 PM
^ hahahahahahahaha! Filming? Really???!! U amuse me lol

StripClubPsych
12-07-2011, 06:14 PM
I can't pay you $100k if I'm paying the dancers a salary. I'm also inclined to hire dancers with 5+ years experience and who share my vision for 50% of the management staff.
Shit! I also don't even have 20k in savings ATM, but my ten year goal will easily reach that mark if the economy dosen't fall even further and I stop spending $6k a year on strip clubs.

Serious questions:

1. How much were you planning on paying your entertainers and what would the terms of the contract be?
1a. Would you set a minimum performance level for each entertainer, and how would you go about determining that amount of money? You would obviously need each entertainer to bring in enough business to support their salary - would you penalize the dancer in the case the club under delivers?
1b. Would there be a set guideline to determine the amount of money an entertainer should earn per her salary agreement?

2. Would there be a termination-clause in the contract stipulating various rules that if broken would result in immediate termination and negation of remaining terms of the contract?

3. How do you plan on structuring the other areas of the business in order to profit? I've seen no less than 5 clubs go under in the last year, and they paid everyone the minimum.

Doc Holliday
12-07-2011, 06:34 PM
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unbeleavable
12-07-2011, 06:48 PM
Keep blowing the pimp & MAYBE YOU WILL GET CLOSER

KS_Stevia
12-07-2011, 06:59 PM
B. Why is men throwing money a bad thing?


Yup, this part confused me.


But you should care, dammit! There needs to be mutal respect between the dancers, the customers, and the job. Instead, management runs SC like dogfights pitting dancers against customers and promising one will get what they want as long as they destroy the other.

Where the dancers should get a fair wage and the customers should expect nothing more than a tease, an honest exchange of goods and not a poker match. Of course, that will never change as management makes far more money with with the current system of leading the two parties on with greater expectations as long as they beat the other.

This is the case at some clubs, but not across the board. And I've highlighted the part that you're missing. Because not enough customers have realistic expectations. If prostitution was legal and more readily available versus in the dark at the clubs...the dynamic would be different. It works in Australia.....

unbeleavable
12-07-2011, 07:08 PM
Yup, this part confused me.



This is the case at some clubs, but not across the board. And I've highlighted the part that you're missing. Because not enough customers have realistic expectations. If prostitution was legal and more readily available versus in the dark at the clubs...the dynamic would be different. It works in Australia.....

expectations is the key. The problem is there are a group of males that look for prostitution in the club that think they are above the standards..

Mailinator2
12-07-2011, 07:49 PM
"I think deep down I secretly resent them all for being there."

Can you expand on this more? I'm curious to hear more about your perspective - it gets to the heart of many treads on this forum.

unbeleavable
12-07-2011, 08:11 PM
"I think deep down I secretly resent them all for being there."

Can you expand on this more? I'm curious to hear more about your perspective - it gets to the heart of many treads on this forum.

Zero resentment my friend}:D I just want the rules to be set so you & you friends don't bitch..lol

rickdugan
12-07-2011, 08:16 PM
But you should care, dammit! There needs to be mutal respect between the dancers, the customers, and the job. Instead, management runs SC like dogfights pitting dancers against customers and promising one will get what they want as long as they destroy the other.

Where the dancers should get a fair wage and the customers should expect nothing more than a tease, an honest exchange of goods and not a poker match. Of course, that will never change as management makes far more money with with the current system of leading the two parties on with greater expectations as long as they beat the other.

Doc, the problem here is that you are trying to romanticize what is, at its core, an industry predicated upon lust and greed (or need, or call it what you will), which are very powerful base motivations. Strip clubs exist solely because some guys are willing to pay good money to see and interact with hot, naked women, and because some attractive women are willing to take off their clothes and deal with a variety of issues in order to get that money. Simply put, problems on both sides of the customer/provider equation are inevitable when the respective motivators are what they are.

Now some people are simply more decent than others and their base motivations are tempered by moral and other considerations, but it should come as no surprise that an industry like this is also going to attract, on both sides of the fence, a certain number of predatory types as well.

Now good clubs can, and do, put mechanisms in place to help control how these motivations are acted upon ITC, but no club can completely eliminate these issues with the powerful dynamics involved. A certain % of guys will look to have their lust satisfied and a certain % of girls, with big $$$ in their sights, will try to take as much as they can off of their customers. Now in both situations, a certain % will also try to achieve these goals while giving up as little as possible to the other. None of this is new, nor are these issues specific to any club. They are simply the natural by-products of the motivational elements that support this type of industry.

But if you like, you can continue to imagine fields of daisies with hot, yet kind hearted women selflessly tending to the needs of polite and respectful down on their luck guys. After all, I wouldn't want to get in the way of a good story. ;)

The Jackal
12-07-2011, 09:51 PM
Doc Holliday,

I reject the spirit of your message on the grounds of sincerity. Let me expand on what I mean by this. I always discuss what my salary is going to be up front when I am first contacted by a recruiter for a job. Money is just as important as job satisfaction for most people. We live in a world where our worth is often measured by how much money we make. It is hard to then not keep your focus on money. There are some people who are lucky enough to have jobs where the satisfaction of performing duty is so great that it takes the focus away from money. But in the real world, most people have jobs which do not provide internal satisfaction, not only that, people often face circumstances at their work that are trying. Keeping this in mind, it is not hard to see that it is the money which keeps you going. You keep telling yourself that once you put up with hardship, there will be reward at the end.

Your line of thinking is further flawed by your expectation. You expect strippers to act like social workers. But social work does not carry a stigma in the society like striping does. Have you wondered then, what motivates strippers in continuing with their jobs? The answer is money for it could be nothing else.

I think it is dishonest to expect a stripper to make a lonely guy excited when her mind is occupied with how she is going to avoid eviction this month.

lifetravelergirl
12-10-2011, 01:22 AM
Is the movie going to be about how much strippers love their jobs?

Now that would be selling a fantasy ^_^ !

Doc Holliday
12-11-2011, 03:17 AM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

lifetravelergirl
12-11-2011, 03:40 AM
When I am working I avoid movies about strippers. A friend suggested I watch some zombie strippers movie. That was torturous. I would prefer to see a movie about a woman who meets a great guy and is able to leave the stripping scene behind. Or something like 'Closer' with Natalie Portman, not about strippers or stripping but involving it and basically how it's the only way some of us can earn a living. I think a movie about a stripclub or strippers would only generate ticket sales based on the naughty factor. It would have to have a lot more going for it than that though. It's a cute fantasy though.

StripClubPsych
12-11-2011, 06:23 AM
Serious questions:

1. How much were you planning on paying your entertainers and what would the terms of the contract be?
1a. Would you set a minimum performance level for each entertainer, and how would you go about determining that amount of money? You would obviously need each entertainer to bring in enough business to support their salary - would you penalize the dancer in the case the club under delivers?
1b. Would there be a set guideline to determine the amount of money an entertainer should earn per her salary agreement?

2. Would there be a termination-clause in the contract stipulating various rules that if broken would result in immediate termination and negation of remaining terms of the contract?

3. How do you plan on structuring the other areas of the business in order to profit? I've seen no less than 5 clubs go under in the last year, and they paid everyone the minimum.

*Ahem*

sexy_celeste
12-11-2011, 07:41 AM
the whole reason I strip/ped was because *I* was responsible for my own income.Nothing worse than working your butt off, while another person is paid the same amount for sitting on theirs!
And I worked, made money and left the industry. Now I want more money, so Im getting back into it again.
I DO enjoy the work, but mainly cos Im paid what Im worth, what I EARN not what a manager thinks is a good wage.

Doc Holliday
12-11-2011, 06:20 PM
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unbeleavable
12-12-2011, 12:37 PM
We need more spreadsheets...lol

Kellydancer
12-12-2011, 03:48 PM
*Shrug* I use Excel all the time and for everything. Right now I am working on a spreadsheet for my CDs and all my bootlegs. I can create one in a matter of minutes and did for many jobs.

KS_Stevia
12-12-2011, 05:08 PM
Hey, pro forma projections are fun, but if you don't even have $20K saved up, what's the point? The value of money and possibly the entire market will have changed within the next few years, by the time this thing becomes feasible.

Doc Holliday
12-12-2011, 05:31 PM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

rickdugan
12-12-2011, 06:50 PM
Hey, pro forma projections are fun, but if you don't even have $20K saved up, what's the point? The value of money and possibly the entire market will have changed within the next few years, by the time this thing becomes feasible.

What he posted was absurd. I doubt that many dancers would be willing to give up such a large % of their LD/VIP money to a club. Nor, IMHO, would many of the better dancers be thrilled about being forced to do frequent stage sets in order to earn some (but not all) of the absconded LD/VIP money back from the club.

IMHO the girls most willing to work under this type of pay grid would be those who are less able or willing to sell LDs, while the hottest and most fun girls will be working elsewhere. Deadweight dancers + low customer interest = unprofitable club.

All of this was just crap on a sheet to begin with. Not only does he have no idea if he could average those sales for each dancer, but any serious profitability projections would need to include a ton of research in order to estimate gross revenues (which would be based upon estimates of customer counts and average spending per customer on different activities), variable expenses relating to the servicing of that customer count (employees, inventory, etc.) and fixed costs (rent or mortgage, taxes, utility costs, etc.).

Anyway, I don't even know why I bothered with this nonsense, but there it is.

yoda57us
12-12-2011, 07:17 PM
Anyway, I don't even know why I bothered with this nonsense, but there it is.

Rick, this is customer convo. We thrive on nonsense here....

unbeleavable
12-12-2011, 07:45 PM
Hey, pro forma projections are fun, but if you don't even have $20K saved up, what's the point? The value of money and possibly the entire market will have changed within the next few years, by the time this thing becomes feasible.

I was laughing at his effort of a fantasy & he's real which is even more funny.

camille27
12-12-2011, 08:09 PM
what the fuck did i just read?

Doc Holliday
12-13-2011, 06:05 PM
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rickdugan
12-13-2011, 06:56 PM
^Doc, in all honesty I'm just not motivated enough to slice up all of the assumptions built in there in more detail, but beyond those assumptions the simple fact is that those numbers will not work for the best dancers. The house just takes too much of the upside. And your theoretical numbers are about as good as the example can get from a balance standpoint. If a girl either dramatically undersells or significantly oversells on the dance front, then the numbers start to skew.

But putting aside the questionable profitability metrics or the payout fairness, it is just too complicated to execute. First, you have to track all of this, for each dancer, over a week and stay on the dancers when they are flagging. Also, try explaining this structure to the girls working for you. Not every dancer is as sophisticated as the girls of SW and you would have a hell of a time applying this in the real world setting. Just try telling a dancer that she gets nothing today from the string of 20 lapdances that she just sold, but that she should just keep selling and she might, just might, see a good chunk of it at the end of the week. See how that works out for you. ;)

You would also be cutting yourself out from using part time dancers almost altogether. How could a girl make good money under this model if she only wants to work 15-20 hours per week?

Anyway, I could go on, but I won't. The reason why most clubs use the model that they do today is because it works. Since the clubs do not pay the dancers and the DJ and bartenders work mostly for tips, the employee expenses per shift are limited, while at the same time the clubs have a certain level of locked in income by virtue of house fees. And this works for the dancers because, theoretically, their earning power is limitless. While the dancers also take some of the downside risk, they get most of the upside as well.

Your model exposes a club to the downside risk of dancers who do not sell while at the same time taking a disproportionate share of the earnings of the ones that do. See the potential problems here?

Doc Holliday
12-13-2011, 09:16 PM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

pinups4
12-14-2011, 05:25 AM
I don't have the time to break it all out...but the weekly gross income is $1150? Even if rent is free, and you ONLY lose half that to other costs, why would you do all this for a COMPANY profit of $500/week (25k/yr)

And why burn hours on a business plan basedon UNeducated guesses? Ill take an educated guess that an uneducated businessplan will crash and burn

KS_Stevia
12-14-2011, 06:24 AM
I don't even know how nude clubs stay in business here, all of the ones I've been to are in pretty bad condition, except for one in Houston, which was ok.

Alcohol sales is where its at man, despite the cost and hurdles of the license.

Doc Holliday
12-14-2011, 10:12 AM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

Vyanka
12-14-2011, 10:25 AM
Doc, here's the thing: it's ALL about money, pal. Why do you think dancers put up with grabby hands, roaming fingers, licking, biting, tweaking, hitting, slapping, cocks whipping out, would-be rapists, emotionally abusive assholes, cum stains, self-important floaters, annoying DJs, terrible management, cold as shit air conditioning, drunk college kids, cheapskate millionaires, PUA wannabes, unfair tip-outs, long hours with no customers, and wannabe saviors?

It's a fucked up world we live in with fucked up customers.

Best you can do: don't be a fucked up customer. Dancers are there to make money. The better ones who have perfected the art form of sensuality and hustle make more. That's why they put up with all our shit. Accept it and move on or else find another hobby.

I heart you.

To the OP, I only say this to men who ask me out on dates and want me to sit on his table for a long time while not paying me. Um, no. Don't waste my time. Time is money, and I am there to make money.

Doc Holliday
12-14-2011, 10:33 AM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

Vyanka
12-14-2011, 10:51 AM
Thanks! I've never heard the words in real life. Hearing it here for the first time made me feel like no one liked their job and only did it because they had to. Which made me a sad panda because I <3 strippers! I've since learned the error of my ways and I should read more. Me culpa.

As long as you're not one of these guys asking for dates and holding onto a dancer without paying her, you prob won't.

I don't hate my job. I'm very fortunate and grateful to able to do this.

I just hate cheap, disrepectful douchebags and time wasters.

Doc Holliday
12-14-2011, 04:03 PM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

whirlerz
12-14-2011, 04:56 PM
what the fuck did i just read?

I can barely follow any of it!::)

Kellydancer
12-14-2011, 05:17 PM
No offense, but I would never work in a club where the manager gets excited by the thought of boobies.

I've worked for managers like this and they were all douchebags.

rickdugan
12-14-2011, 05:26 PM
That is one dancer's pay and guessing I'd have 30 on staff.

Doc, there is no way that even 5 dancers could do enough stage dances in a night to earn what your pay grid indicates that they will from stage pay, unless you are running more than one stage. You do realize, do you not, that a club can run a max of 20 songs per hour (and usually less)?

And keep in mind that, with even one stage, you are talking about a cash burn rate of $100 per hour if you are paying $5 per stage song. So if your club is open even just 10 hours, then you're in the hole for $1000 before the word "go." If you run two stages, $2000 in the hole, $3000 for 3 stages, etc. You had better hope that those dancers are selling their asses off, even though your LD/VIP pay grid gives them little incentive to do so. :)

Again, this is just one of the many assumptions that I did not bother to tackle before, and frankly there are others like it which I'm not going to get into. Now I'm all in favor of a little fun fantasy budgeting, but the one you posted above just needs to be scrapped and you need to do a little more research if you want to put forth something that is credible.

Doc Holliday
12-14-2011, 05:35 PM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

yoda57us
12-14-2011, 06:40 PM
It's fun when people who are not in the night club business, or even own a business, try to come up with a "better way"...

The best hustlers in the world can't sell dances to an empty room. In most clubs you get a crowd maybe three nights a week. Days? Maybe Friday afternoons. The rest of the times it's dancers hustling for a shrinking client base with shrinking disposable revenue. You can't build a realistic spread sheet for that sort of thing. You unlock the doors and hope for the best.

Kellydancer
12-15-2011, 01:02 AM
I hope Doc posts here what he did in blue about dancers respecting men who budget their money and how wrong it is to lead customers on in all cases. To me this tells me he is one of those guys who thinks he knows the business but does not. I'm guessing from his comments he's one of those frat boys who come to the clubs and annoy the hell out of dancers. I despised frat boys, even while in college myself.

Doc Holliday
12-15-2011, 02:22 AM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .

Kessler
12-15-2011, 03:46 AM
Doc, you got your heart broken by a dancer, huh?

Doc Holliday
12-15-2011, 10:05 AM
if any content is published here, you need the permission of both the author and the publisher (the owner of this site) to use it elsewhere. . . . . .