View Full Version : Do Some Escorts Only "Hang Out"? aka Nothing Sexual
Eric Stoner
02-28-2012, 11:27 AM
[/B]
Ohh okay, I said the phrase "right place at the right time" as you quote me as saying, but it seems you misunderstood me. What I meant is...It certainly is not like found money, which is always money that one did nothing for except to happen to be at the right place at the right time to pick it up. :)
Anywayzlies..now that I know you have only been joking about everything all along then...:D:D You're funny!!! :joke:
...but Im bored with this now.
Lets agree, to disagree, even though we agree :D and call it a day.
We agree. You're right. Let's stop now.
$tripperbabe
02-28-2012, 07:22 PM
Really ? I know of one former Miss USA and two former Miss Universe's who got $25,000 an hour but they all had to suck and fuck to get it.
I don't know. When I hear someone talk the way you do, I get the feeling that you are guessing and/or have an issue with it. I still have to finish reading these threads but quite honestly, as someone from PEC back in the day, I never did either of those things and made minimum $3000 a dinner OTC. My naivate' served me quite well after having to make it from coast to coast as a stripper w/o extras and still maintain I was in the top 3 earners at many of the major Vegas strip clubs so I HAD to learn to hustle.
The term escorting means just that and yes their is a market for it, many guys are intimidated and degraded by the sex aspect of it all still. Not that I'm judging here, I have had my share of crossovers since all this transpired but being in just about every aspect of the adult entertainment biz for about 20 yrs I can tell you this and I will stand by it till I die, there is a ton of money to be made not having sex with guys. I would say as much as any good stripper makes at least and with that you see residuals and security; something you don't see in selling sex as often.
As much as sites like What's Your Price say they do not approve of escorts, what they are providing IS very purely escorting when using the term correctly. Considering I made a good amount of money there when it was new I would add that as evidence that strongly suggests their still is money in escorting. I also have seen customers OTC for money and sex was never even mentioned. I'm quite certain I'm not the only stripper to do this.
$tripperbabe
02-28-2012, 07:34 PM
Also, I think the disconnect here comes from lacking the understanding of how one markets themselves as a non-sexual escort. In that respect you would not put an ad out with a high price and expect hardly any returns BUT in the right context of stripping and sugar dating a TON of non-sexual escorting naturally occurs and there I think is what you fail to see Eric because it's not actually given much emphasis or thought any more than receiving a generous tip. I would not say if I was a limo driver or valet in Vegas Will Park Car for $200. No, you valet or drive the car for a small fee and then often earn a 10,000% tip and I'm quite sure that the limo driver or valet guy did not fuck or suck as you say to get that money.
Eric Stoner
02-29-2012, 08:28 AM
Also, I think the disconnect here comes from lacking the understanding of how one markets themselves as a non-sexual escort. In that respect you would not put an ad out with a high price and expect hardly any returns BUT in the right context of stripping and sugar dating a TON of non-sexual escorting naturally occurs and there I think is what you fail to see Eric because it's not actually given much emphasis or thought any more than receiving a generous tip. I would not say if I was a limo driver or valet in Vegas Will Park Car for $200. No, you valet or drive the car for a small fee and then often earn a 10,000% tip and I'm quite sure that the limo driver or valet guy did not fuck or suck as you say to get that money.
1. I am the first one to say that it is a BIG World out there with all sorts of possibilities.
2. Considering that some guys are known to drop hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars for little more than having dancers sit and talk with them, it is not hard to believe that you , and others, on occasion hit the jackpot and had a high paying, non sexual date. Nobody ever said it wasn't possible. Is there a "TON" of it going on out there ? Not that I know of. Is it "possible" ? I suppose so but I still tend to doubt it.
3. The escorts that I know TELL me ( their words ) that anywhere from about a quarter to a third of the time, the men they meet with do NOT have sex with them. Either they can't or they just want someone to be with and talk to.
4. We are NOT talking about the occasional OTC date or Sugar- Daddies. Both have plenty of threads devoted to them. I certainly have experience with the former but have never bothered with the latter. Not that there's anything wrong with it lol . But other than you, most of the ladies who have opined based on their own REAL WORLD experiences seemed to make it pretty clear that non-sexual dating was just an occasional thing. I don't think they were depending on it to pay their rent.
5. Regarding the former Miss USA and the two former Miss Universes ( one of whom is still VERY active btw ) I know that for a FACT. I KNOW the agency they worked with as Super-UTR's reserved for "whales". The owner is a friend of mine. The Miss USA is now retired and afaik is happily married. One of the Miss Universes is also out of the game afaik. So what ? The high end numbers have dropped over the last ten years or so. Playmates USED to get $5000. Now they're lucky to get $2000. The high end ladies used to get 100 k and up. Not so much anymore. Again, so what ?
6. As for dancers at PEC and other high end clubs, for as long as I can remember, some dancers dated for money OTC and most did not. And most of those did have sex for cash. So what ? That's them. Afaic it's a free country and they can do whatever they think is best for them. It's certainly not for me to judge and I most certainly do not.
7. You claim that you have found success OTC on a non sexual basis. I think that's great ! But are you seriously saying that it is a serious possibility for any dancer ? For most dancers ? For a lot of dancers ? You're not claiming it just fell into your lap , are you ? Didn't you have to use charm and maybe a few feminine wiles to make such a lucrative hook-up ? Are you saying that ANY dancer, regardless of ability and experience can do likewise ?
$tripperbabe
02-29-2012, 12:25 PM
1. I am the first one to say that it is a BIG World out there with all sorts of possibilities.
2. Considering that some guys are known to drop hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars for little more than having dancers sit and talk with them, it is not hard to believe that you , and others, on occasion hit the jackpot and had a high paying, non sexual date. Nobody ever said it wasn't possible. Is there a "TON" of it going on out there ? Not that I know of. Is it "possible" ? I suppose so but I still tend to doubt it.
3. The escorts that I know TELL me ( their words ) that anywhere from about a quarter to a third of the time, the men they meet with do NOT have sex with them. Either they can't or they just want someone to be with and talk to.
4. We are NOT talking about the occasional OTC date or Sugar- Daddies. Both have plenty of threads devoted to them. I certainly have experience with the former but have never bothered with the latter. Not that there's anything wrong with it lol . But other than you, most of the ladies who have opined based on their own REAL WORLD experiences seemed to make it pretty clear that non-sexual dating was just an occasional thing. I don't think they were depending on it to pay their rent.
5. Regarding the former Miss USA and the two former Miss Universes ( one of whom is till VERY active btw ) I know that for a FACT. I KNOW the agency they worked with as Super-UTR's reserved for "whales". The owner is a friend of mine. The Miss USA is now retired and afaik is happily married. One of the Miss Universes is also out of the game afaik. So what ? The high end numbers have dropped over the last ten years or so. Playmates USED to get $5000. Now they're lucky to get $2000. The high end ladies used to get 100 k and up. Not so much anymore. Again, so what ?
6. As for dancers at PEC and other high end clubs, for as long as I can remember, some dancers dated for money OTC and most did not. And most of those did have sex for cash. So what ? That's them. Afaic it's a free country and they can do whatever they think is best for them. It's certainly not for me to judge and I most certainly do not.
7. You claim that you have found success OTC on a non sexual basis. I think that's great ! But are you seriously saying that it is a serious possibility for any dancer ? For most dancers ? For a lot of dancers ? You're not claiming it just fell into your lap , are you ? Didn't you have to use charm and maybe a few feminine wiles to make such a lucrative hook-up ? Are you saying that ANY dancer, regardless of ability and experience can do likewise ?
Thank you for taking the time to listen and reply. To answer your questions:
2. I think the "TON" of it going on out there is in various forms and any non-sexual transaction in the vip rooms is in fact non-sexual escorting. Is it going on a lot outside of the clubs? Maybe? I've done pretty well with it over the years to know it's not an accident and that has been more profitable than my owning my own business and kept me afloat for 10 years. Help during emergencies and gifts worth several thousands of dollars and up are important to note as well. I hear this happen all the time for women yet gets somewhat overlooked.
3. Yes, that is absolutely true. I've been brought in on calls to hang out and party all night with clients intending to do things, the high rollers have no problem bringing in 5-10 women for dinner or hotel parties and due to their own personal drug use usually, have no desire for sex and as the hours roll by, it just seems more normal and natural. I have had one guy spend $18k on me in one night because he did not want to be alone. He was in no condition to have sex but probably thought he was. :-D Yeah, I've had my share of guys especially pre-recession spend a lot of money for companionship and so sex. Something I think most women agree on, the cheaper the client the more they want. The richer and more generous the clients are the ones that want sex the least maybe because they plan on marrying Playmates etc. Us "lesser" girls are just to amuse them basically. LOL Really I have gotten a lot of respect from gorgeous guys who own just about everything in NY and they have/had beautiful wives but just want someone to feel free with and party. No sex. Also, never underestimate the power of someone who wants to marry a stripper/escort/sex worker. They will go to the ends of the earth to impress her for a long time financially before asking for sex.
4. Why aren't we talking about the OTC or SD? I think the OTC and Sugar Daddie is way more common than you give it credit. Maybe you divide things up into categories and we have learned to see each relationship for what it is rather than what category we put it in perhaps?...between client/friend/SD/etc. so it's not cut and dry it's more like shades of color that change throughout the years depending on how long you know the person. When you start putting labels on it, some men lose interest they like to think of this naturally spontaneous and organic. Some relationships get more platonic over time and are still based on spending money on the woman because tradition dictates that and others die eventually without the sexual connection.
5. I think I know what you are saying, but not sure what your point was. Would you please explain it to me differently? I get that they are UTR and not making as much money as pre-recession but not sure what you trying to get across to me.
6. PEC from what I hear inside has become an extras club full service. I opened it and we were not allowed to touch their shoulders if our top was not on even to balance ourselves and as time went on it progressed. No judgement just saying I believe you are right. That is where I met a man who spent WOW amount of money on me, no sex, over a year's time plus big time gifts. He probably wanted a wife, yet he knew that to see me it was not free. To marry a stripper who has their head on straight is the ultimate to some men and to others they would never have a stripper for a wife much less take her seriously. Honestly I have not seen the same money from sleeping with men as I have seen not sleeping with them.
7. Yes, why not? Lots of dancers have had guys take them gambling, shopping, dinners etc and paid for their night off work. Probably a lot more than I have. They just don't come here on forums and talk about it. In fact I never even knew forums like this existed till a few weeks ago and I don't think a lot of women do. I know thousands of people over 20 yrs in the industry across the country and no one I know has ever mentioned this site to me. OTC non-sexual happens a lot in Vegas, where I spent most of my time, that's for sure. I wish I had done it sooner instead of believing I had to sleep with them. What do you mean "have to use charm, feminine wiles etc...?" You do understand that our job is to be charming and feminine and good at sales, no? Seems to me you are under the impression or implying that I am doing something underhanded, which I'm not. I'm not sure what you mean but anything in the adult industry takes some sales skills, charm and feminine wiles I guess you could say as does any sales profession.
Eric Stoner
02-29-2012, 01:13 PM
Thank you for taking the time to listen and reply. To answer your questions:
2. I think the "TON" of it going on out there is in various forms and any non-sexual transaction in the vip rooms is in fact non-sexual escorting. Is it going on a lot outside of the clubs? Maybe? I've done pretty well with it over the years to know it's not an accident and that has been more profitable than my owning my own business and kept me afloat for 10 years. Help during emergencies and gifts worth several thousands of dollars and up are important to note as well. I hear this happen all the time for women yet gets somewhat overlooked.
3. Yes, that is absolutely true. I've been brought in on calls to hang out and party all night with clients intending to do things, the high rollers have no problem bringing in 5-10 women for dinner or hotel parties and due to their own personal drug use usually, have no desire for sex and as the hours roll by, it just seems more normal and natural. I have had one guy spend $18k on me in one night because he did not want to be alone. He was in no condition to have sex but probably thought he was. :-D Yeah, I've had my share of guys especially pre-recession spend a lot of money for companionship and so sex. Something I think most women agree on, the cheaper the client the more they want. The richer and more generous the clients are the ones that want sex the least maybe because they plan on marrying Playmates etc. Us "lesser" girls are just to amuse them basically. LOL Really I have gotten a lot of respect from gorgeous guys who own just about everything in NY and they have/had beautiful wives but just want someone to feel free with and party. No sex. Also, never underestimate the power of someone who wants to marry a stripper/escort/sex worker. They will go to the ends of the earth to impress her for a long time financially before asking for sex.
4. Why aren't we talking about the OTC or SD? I think the OTC and Sugar Daddie is way more common than you give it credit. Maybe you divide things up into categories and we have learned to see each relationship for what it is rather than what category we put it in perhaps?...between client/friend/SD/etc. so it's not cut and dry it's more like shades of color that change throughout the years depending on how long you know the person. When you start putting labels on it, some men lose interest they like to think of this naturally spontaneous and organic. Some relationships get more platonic over time and are still based on spending money on the woman because tradition dictates that and others die eventually without the sexual connection.
5. I think I know what you are saying, but not sure what your point was. Would you please explain it to me differently? I get that they are UTR and not making as much money as pre-recession but not sure what you trying to get across to me.
6. PEC from what I hear inside has become an extras club full service. I opened it and we were not allowed to touch their shoulders if our top was not on even to balance ourselves and as time went on it progressed. No judgement just saying I believe you are right. That is where I met a man who spent WOW amount of money on me, no sex, over a year's time plus big time gifts. He probably wanted a wife, yet he knew that to see me it was not free. To marry a stripper who has their head on straight is the ultimate to some men and to others they would never have a stripper for a wife much less take her seriously. Honestly I have not seen the same money from sleeping with men as I have seen not sleeping with them.
7. Yes, why not? Lots of dancers have had guys take them gambling, shopping, dinners etc and paid for their night off work. Probably a lot more than I have. They just don't come here on forums and talk about it. In fact I never even knew forums like this existed till a few weeks ago and I don't think a lot of women do. I know thousands of people over 20 yrs in the industry across the country and no one I know has ever mentioned this site to me. OTC non-sexual happens a lot in Vegas, where I spent most of my time, that's for sure. I wish I had done it sooner instead of believing I had to sleep with them. What do you mean "have to use charm, feminine wiles etc...?" You do understand that our job is to be charming and feminine and good at sales, no? Seems to me you are under the impression or implying that I am doing something underhanded, which I'm not. I'm not sure what you mean but anything in the adult industry takes some sales skills, charm and feminine wiles I guess you could say as does any sales profession.
2. VIP is VIP and happens AT the club with all that entails. Especially the house cut and house fees.
3. It seems to me that what YOU are talking about is having a SD. That's fine. Isn't everything worked out in advance ? Aren't the parameters clearly established beforehand ? Try doing that as an "escort" and let us know how you made out.
4. Again you are talking about something other than escorting. "Party girl" , "hostess" , "arm candy" etc. Again, how much of that do you seriously think is going on out there ? Some ? Sure. I've seen enough of it. So what ?
Likewise, I am not talking about being a SB. You are. Question : How many i.e. what % of SB's are expected to have sex with their SD's ? My guess , and it is admittedly a GUESS ( not having been either a SB or SD myself ), is a LOT.
5. I'm sorry but YOU springboarded from my original quote about the highest paid of high end ladies. You brought it up first. Not me. You questioned MY knowledge and experience in this area. Not the other way around.
6. Please define your terms. Are you including money made INSIDE the club ? With extras or without ? Again, it seems you are talking about being a SB.
7. I am not accusing you or anyone else of anything. I just question how viable this model of "non-sexual" dating really is for most dancers. If there is so much demand for it, then why aren't more dancers doing it ? MY answer is that for the most part "non-sexual escorting" is a fantasy and under some circumstances can even be a delusion. It's just not out there as an everyday thing for most dancers. What you have been describing is clearly atypical in the opinion of just about everyone else who has chimed in on this subject. So you can leave me totally out of it and what you are claiming is still subject to serious skepticism.
$tripperbabe
02-29-2012, 02:30 PM
2. VIP is VIP and happens AT the club with all that entails. Especially the house cut and house fees.
3. It seems to me that what YOU are talking about is having a SD. That's fine. Isn't everything worked out in advance ? Aren't the parameters clearly established beforehand ? Try doing that as an "escort" and let us know how you made out.
4. Again you are talking about something other than escorting. "Party girl" , "hostess" , "arm candy" etc. Again, how much of that do you seriously think is going on out there ? Some ? Sure. I've seen enough of it. So what ?
Likewise, I am not talking about being a SB. You are. Question : How many i.e. what % of SB's are expected to have sex with their SD's ? My guess , and it is admittedly a GUESS ( not having been either a SB or SD myself ), is a LOT.
5. I'm sorry but YOU springboarded from my original quote about the highest paid of high end ladies. You brought it up first. Not me. You questioned MY knowledge and experience in this area. Not the other way around.
6. Please define your terms. Are you including money made INSIDE the club ? With extras or without ? Again, it seems you are talking about being a SB.
7. I am not accusing you or anyone else of anything. I just question how viable this model of "non-sexual" dating really is for most dancers. If there is so much demand for it, then why aren't more dancers doing it ? MY answer is that for the most part "non-sexual escorting" is a fantasy and under some circumstances can even be a delusion. It's just not out there as an everyday thing for most dancers. What you have been describing is clearly atypical in the opinion of just about everyone else who has chimed in on this subject. So you can leave me totally out of it and what you are claiming is still subject to serious skepticism.
Escorting can mean anything from a paid dinner date to a sex worker to a bodyguard or soldier. It simply means you accompany someone. All those things you mention are escorts. VIP girls, party girls, hostesses, arm candy, sugar babies, sex workers, soldiers, bodyguards,...anytime someone accompanies someone else for money. They are all escorting someone for money.
Do men pay big bucks to be escorted without sex? YES Apply your own logic, they pay outrageous amounts in the champagne rooms for overprices alcohol and lap dances every day of every year in just about every state of the country. Right now some guy is pay thousands of dollars for lap dances so why not pay $1000 for dinner alone with a girl if they think they are getting closer to her?
It seems like I explained this before and we are going in circles and you are even getting a little defensive. I did not mean for you to feel that way. I'm sorry I really do not know any better way to explain it than I already have.
6. Over 20 yrs I've worked just about every aspect of the adult industry. To answer you question about non-sexual escorting outside of the club. YES I made a ton of money outside the club non-sexual escorting enough to do nothing and stay home from strip clubs for years at a time. The problem is you have to find a way to meet these guys and charge them that comes from stripping, online SD sites, or advertising online, or word of mouth like my neighbor who was hitting on me and refused to quit, I told him he knows my rates in the club if he wants to pay for my time $500 hr I'm willing to go to dinner. He does so occasionally but now sticks to just helping me out when I need it with bills and emergencies. No sex. No hand holding. No fllirting.
"Why aren't more dancers doing it?" Like I said, they ARE, but you refuse to see that I already told you that. I'm sorry that more women don't chime up about it here, this is not the center of the Adult Entertainment Universe like a lot of guys think. Most women I know never heard of this site...perhaps they don't want to get into these discussions with sex workers and customers calling them liars and unicorns and don't feel they have to dignify their situation to anyone. I know I sure as hell don't need to expose myself like this but I am speaking up because I am seeing too many people speaking for others here who only know their own experiences. They should stick to talking about their own experiences and not speak for anyone else. They should know that there are all sorts of ways of making money and can pick and choose whatever they like.
You can be skeptical all you want. I'm speaking my truth and that's all that matters. People can speculate all they want. You have to remember sex workers advertise a price and assume they must offer a sexual product and that's fine but don't expect them to be the ones to tell you other women are making the same with no sex because they don't want to hear that. I'll give you an example: I don't ask my hair stylist about my nails because he hasn't done nails probably since school, I go to the nail salon and ask them about pedicures. If I have a foot problem I don't ask my nail lady I ask a podiatrist or a chiropractor with experience.
Let's suppose you never heard of BDSM and I just told you that some guy pays me to beat him up. Would you believe me? Probably not. But yet people do ALL the time. It's like that. Go to the source for your alternative info and ask around. :-D peace.
Eric Stoner
03-01-2012, 10:16 AM
We are arguing in circles. If you want to corrupt the lexicon and expand "escorting" to include all sorts of things not commonly known or understood to be part of the escort biz, go ahead. Afaic, a lot of what YOU are talking about is apples and oranges.
We agree. Some men are willing to pay big bucks for non-sexual encounters with dancers. I know several dancers that have done it. I know just as many who have sex for cash. How many of those guys willing to pay big for "no sex" dating do you think there are ? As I have said, YOU are really talking about SD-SB relationships which is fine.
I repeat. Leave ME out of the discussion and just READ what some of the ladies here with REAL World experience have had to say about "social escorting". Thus the skepticism about SOME of what you have to say. Not so much about your own experiences. I'm willing to take those at face value. It is more your claim that there are a LOT of "social escorting" opportunities out there that have me reaching for the salt shaker.
BlkSharpie
03-01-2012, 10:39 AM
Leave ME out of the discussion and just READ what some of the ladies here with REAL World experience have had to say about "social escorting".
:highfive:
Eric Stoner
03-01-2012, 11:54 AM
A little more food for thought and perhaps skepticism for SOME of what Stripperbabe has had to say : Wall St. bonuses declined for the second straight year.
The Average Wall St. bonuses since 2005 are as follows :
2005 - $149,000
2006- $ 191,360
2007 - $ 177,830
2008 - $ 100,850
2009 - $ 140,620
2010 - $ 138,940
2011- $121,150
Point being there is now even less cash to shower on dancers, with or without sex.
$tripperbabe
03-01-2012, 02:19 PM
A little more food for thought and perhaps skepticism for SOME of what Stripperbabe has had to say
BWAAHAHAHAHAHA! Anyone who actually read my posts will note the pre-recession and post recession differences I have made. I only need to look at all the posts here from ladies telling you, don't belong here and are being negative to know that arguing with you is a waste of time and does not matter. I already said what I had to say so people can choose who they want to listen too from the following. A) Did not try something. B) Failed at it. C) Had no experience in it. D) Someone successful at it for over a decade. And I don't intend to convince anyone. I am just posting my two cents. You seem to take issue with that for whatever reason but it matters not what you think but that someone interested can see both our opinions.
"People who say it can't be done should stop interrupting those who are doing it."
~Henry Ford
They haven't got the time or inclination to read this page only because they're too busy already doing what's contained in these paragraphs.
Just remember your own words "The credit belongs the man who is actually in the arena..."
You have the floor dear. So if you still want to keep regurgitating negativity... Spew away! Peace. :-D
Eric Stoner
03-02-2012, 08:06 AM
BWAAHAHAHAHAHA! Anyone who actually read my posts will note the pre-recession and post recession differences I have made. I only need to look at all the posts here from ladies telling you, don't belong here and are being negative to know that arguing with you is a waste of time and does not matter. I already said what I had to say so people can choose who they want to listen too from the following. A) Did not try something. B) Failed at it. C) Had no experience in it. D) Someone successful at it for over a decade. And I don't intend to convince anyone. I am just posting my two cents. You seem to take issue with that for whatever reason but it matters not what you think but that someone interested can see both our opinions.
"People who say it can't be done should stop interrupting those who are doing it."
~Henry Ford
They haven't got the time or inclination to read this page only because they're too busy already doing what's contained in these paragraphs.
Just remember your own words "The credit belongs the man who is actually in the arena..."
You have the floor dear. So if you still want to keep regurgitating negativity... Spew away! Peace. :-D
I wish you the best of luck in all your endeavors.
goddesskali
03-02-2012, 03:51 PM
Oh my goodness....let it die already.
CFMNH44
03-03-2012, 09:06 AM
...<snip> Not like the whole table is going to applaud if you use all the right forks and spoons, or give you the side eye if you dont. Well, unless you use your ice tea spoon to eat your dessert...that would be kinda funny though :D
This made me laugh. I can see BlkSharpie pulling a 'Julia Roberts / Pretty Woman' using her ice tea spoon to eat someone else's desert when they're not looking... :)
BlkSharpie
03-03-2012, 09:50 AM
This made me laugh. I can see BlkSharpie pulling a 'Julia Roberts / Pretty Woman' using her ice tea spoon to eat someone else's desert when they're not looking... :)
I totally would be tempted! Lol!
Seriously though...sometimes when I'm at a really posh dinner, I think of twirling my hair with my fork and it makes me smile heehee!
I'm no Ariel though, so I don't think I should...
Not til I can blame it on senility anyway... I'm going to totally amuse myself when I'm old!