PDA

View Full Version : seriously zimmerman?



Pages : [1] 2 3 4

JoJoX
04-10-2012, 05:31 AM
Is he really asking people to help him pay for the bad decisions HE made?


http://www.therealgeorgezimmerman.com/Home_Page.php (http://www.therealgeorgezimmerman.com/Home_Page.php)

socialreject
04-10-2012, 05:45 AM
Is he really asking people to help him pay for the bad decisions HE made?

I'm not going to touch that with a 20 foot pole...

Sophia_Starina
04-10-2012, 10:17 AM
That guy ended two lives with one bullet.

Melonie
04-11-2012, 02:09 PM
I'm not going to touch that with a 20 foot pole...

I'm not going to touch that with someone else's 20 foot pole.

At any rate, the media coverage ... or lack thereof ... is entertaining to say the least - from


http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSY6fO6CMG-AkcE0eLkXPIDBejJ388i5fIcaXLxjSEmOHqC1UotUw


(snip)Tampa, Florida - It was an emotional interview for Michelle Williams.

As a community activist and chief of staff for the New Black Panther Party, Michelle is used to addressing many issues. But when it comes to her passion in the Trayvon Martin case, she gets especially upset and tearful.(snip)

(snip)Michelle said during that interview, "Let me tell you, the things that's about to happen, to these honkeys, these crackers, these pigs, these pink people, these ---- people. It has been long overdue. My prize right now this evening ... is gonna be the bounty, the arrest, dead or alive, for George Zimmerman. You feel me?"

Bubba addressed her saying, "Michelle, really? You are so much better than that, honey."

"My words that I spoke were very passionate, passionate anger of an activist, of an advocate, of a leader who sat by and watched so much destruction happen. Melanie, my back is against the wall," she told us.

Michelle is putting out an open invitation to any group - the Ku Klux Klan, black, white, mayors, cops - anyone out there, who wants to talk about keeping peace in the Martin case, she's willing to listen.

"This whole Trayvon Martin case has been an injustice that America is watching unfold. I feel like I'm reading a Nancy Drew novel right now, because of all the twists and turns. 'Oh wait a minute, we have him here, no wait, we have him here,'" she said.

In a candid moment during her 10 News interview, she said, "Do I want to see George Zimmerman dead? No. Do I want to see him brought to justice? Hell yes."

Michelle assured us that she doesn't want to have anyone out there pick up a gun. "I don't want violence, I don't promote violence. That's why I told you, my words were out of anger."(snip)



I continue to look at the bright side ... the Ruger and Smith&Wesson shares in my investment portfolio are at record highs !!!

missjzone
04-12-2012, 07:47 PM
Please..this is so overblown..

Optimist
04-13-2012, 01:48 AM
I thought his father was rich? What happened to the money and connects?

Melonie
04-14-2012, 07:37 AM
here's the likely result of one of those 'connects' ...




(snip)"God save me from my friends; I can take care of my enemies.

That thought must be coursing through the mind of President Obama right now as his White House rigs for silent running in the murder trial of George Zimmerman.

Obama foolishly inserted himself into this volatile case weeks ago, and injected the issue of race. Expressing empathy with the family of Trayvon Martin, Obama flashed a signal of racial solidarity:

"If I had a son, he would look like Trayvon."

Obama also implied that he shares the liberal perspective that America is a country where black kids must walk in daily fear of white racist vigilantes.

"All of us have to do some soul-searching to figure out how does something like this happen. And that means that we examine the laws and the context for what happened, as well as the specifics of the incident."

Translation: The death of Trayvon tells us something is wrong with America.

To most Americans, this is a slander against their country, refuted by the statistics on interracial crime. Obama, however, buys into it.

Angela Corey, the special prosecutor, says that the charge against Zimmerman of second-degree murder was based on evidence and not influenced by the weeks of demonstrations, demands and threats from black leaders.

Perhaps. But from what the pubic knows, a charge of second-degree murder, which carries a sentence of 25 years to life, does not seem to stand up.

To convict, prosecutors must convince all 12 members of a jury that not only was Zimmerman in no danger of bodily harm, he did not believe he was in danger of bodily harm. He simply killed Martin in a "depraved" state of mind.

Nothing revealed so far seems to support that theory.

Zimmerman saw a tall stranger, hooded and acting suspiciously. He called the cops. He did not tell them the man was black. They had to ask him whether the suspect was black, white or Hispanic.

"He looks black," said Zimmerman.

The CNN report that Zimmerman, on the call to the cops, used a racial slur, "(bleeping) coon," has been withdrawn. What Zimmerman said was that it was "(bleeping) cold" outside.

Came then the fight. Two eyewitnesses say they saw Zimmerman on his back being beaten and screaming for help.

A cop at the scene said Zimmerman had a bloody nose and a gash on the back of his head. Zimmerman's family says Trayvon banged George's head on the sidewalk. Film of Zimmerman entering the police station that night shows bruising on the back of his head.

Trayvon was found lying face down. If Zimmerman had been on top and shot him, would not Trayvon have been found on his back?

Zimmerman's family says Trayvon started the fight with a fist to the nose, and George went down. Trayvon is not here to tell his story. But a natural question arises:

Why would Zimmerman, with a holstered gun to protect himself, close with and start a fistfight with a teenager half a head taller? A grown man with a gun his adversary does not know he has – would he not more likely stand some distance away, to pull it out if needed?

The prosecutors must have discovered new evidence to indict for murder. For all of the testimony from Zimmerman's side and the eyewitnesses seems to create more than a reasonable doubt that he committed a murder.

Where is Obama's political problem?

With the election on, the case has begun to divide the nation along racial lines. And Obama's allies are doing it. It is Jesse Jackson and the Black Caucus crying that Trayvon was "hunted down like a rabid dog in the street," that he was "murdered and martyred," that it was a "hate crime."

"It's a disgrace that man (Zimmerman) hasn't been shot yet," says Mike Tyson. The New Black Panther Party has put out a poster offering a $10,000 reward that reads, "Wanted: Dead or Alive."

The face on the poster is George Zimmerman.

Trayvon is the victim here, but George Zimmerman is beginning to look like a victim – of lynch law and mob rule.

With the Panthers and Tyson calling for vengeance and vigilante justice, where is Attorney General Eric Holder? Out congratulating Al Sharpton for bringing political pressure on Florida to indict.

Is this how justice is advanced in Obama's America?

Mayor Michael Bloomberg has denounced Florida's "Stand Your Ground" law – which may be Zimmerman's defense – as "a license to murder" and an excuse for "vigilante justice."

Bloomberg seems about to lead a crusade against the National Rifle Association and for repeal of stand-your-ground laws in the two dozen states that have enacted them.

Given their huge emotional investment in this case, how will black leaders and black America react if Zimmerman walks?

And how will the rest of America react to that reaction?

And if Zimmerman, Trayvon, race, guns and stand-your-ground become voting issues this fall, how good is that for Barack Obama?

April 14, 2012

Patrick J. Buchanan is co-founder and editor of The American Conservative"(snip)



... the media circus continues !!!! ... clearly starting to involve issues of race and politics interspersed with actual facts now that previous media reports of 'phony' facts have been discredited and both 'sides' are starting to get mainstream media coverage ( thus I'll refrain from making additional posts on this topic. since the media focus is increasingly political / racial in nature )



However, I will point out that the stock share price of Sturm Ruger Firearms can be linked almost to the day that the Zimmerman case first hit mainstream media ... which perhaps says something about how 'average' Americans are reacting !


http://chart.finance.yahoo.com/z?s=RGR&t=3m&q=l&l=on&z=l&a=v&p=s&lang=en-US&region=US

eagle2
04-14-2012, 10:12 AM
Why are you posting commentary from a white supremacist and nazi sympathizer?

eagle2
04-14-2012, 10:46 AM
I continue to look at the bright side ... the Ruger and Smith&Wesson shares in my investment portfolio are at record highs !!!

You think there's a bright side to a teenage boy being killed?!

Melonie
04-14-2012, 11:13 AM
A. in direct reply to a question about Zimmerman Senior's supposed 'connections', with author Pat Buchanan's content being free from that particular website. However it's noted that no similar objections were raised when I previously posted actual racist remarks made publicly by the New Black Panther party chief of staff. I also tried to drop further discussion of this subject now that both 'sides' are getting media exposure, which you are now apparently trying to keep alive.

B. what's done is done - Trayvon cannot be resurrected. As to whether or not increased firearms sales in the aftermath comprises a bright side or not depends on one's personal viewpoint ( and investment portfolio )

eagle2
04-14-2012, 11:23 AM
I assume your quote of the Black Panther party chief of staff was meant to portray her in a negative way.

bem401
04-14-2012, 11:26 AM
This whole case, tragic while it may be, is nothing but a ploy by the racists on the Left....Sharpton, Jackson, apparently Obama, the New Black Panthers, and NBC.... to try playing the race card. If the guy is guilty, he ought to be convicted. If he was defending himself, he ought to be acquitted. Either way, those five racist clowns ought to step back and let the justice system do its job without running their mouths and trying to skew perceptions. Any he appears to have been overcharged as far as Murder 2 is concerned.

Kellydancer
04-14-2012, 11:36 AM
I will admit I have mixed feelings on this. If he is guilty, throw the book at him. However, the media slant is bothering me. The media actually changed part of the calls to make it look like Zimmerman said things he did not. Also, they made Zimmerman look like an evil man and Martin like an angel, when neither case is completely accurate. Yes Zimmerman might be a bad guy, but the more I hear about Martin the more he looks like he could be a thug and gang banger and if that is the case I don't care he's dead. If he's not a gang member and was cruelly killed then yes it is sad and shameful.

Finally, everyone is making this out to be a race thing and I don't think it is. I suspect at best it's a case of mistaken identity and at worst it's a case of a gun happy nut wanting to shoot anyone. Yes there is race killings and assaults everyday but they cut across all lines. Incidentally many years ago I was attacked by a group of black teen boys while I was minding my own business. They threw rocks at me and called me names like honky in my then neighborhood. I had to move because of thugs like them taking over my neighborhood. As a result I always laugh when people talk about how white people attack black people because I've seen just as many white kids attacked by black kids. It is NEVER right to attack anyone based on race.

Djoser
04-14-2012, 11:44 AM
What annoyed the hell out of me was everyone wearing 'hoodies' to 'show support'.

But I can tell this thread is probably going to have to be closed, and probably sooner than later.

For right now, it's being moved to Games and Puzzles, in an effort to avoid censorship. But keeping the peace here is the main priority.

There is nothing that anyone can say on Stripperweb that will change the fact the kid is dead now. And nothing anyone can say that will magically reveal the guilt or innocence of zimmerman.

ArmySGT.
04-14-2012, 04:02 PM
I assume your quote of the Black Panther party chief of staff was meant to portray her in a negative way.

You don't think that having said all that portrays her in a negative way? Really?

eagle2
04-14-2012, 04:10 PM
Where do you get the idea that what I said doesn't imply she was portrayed in a negative way? Really?

ArmySGT.
04-14-2012, 04:35 PM
Where do you get the idea that what I said doesn't imply she was portrayed in a negative way? Really?

Your spirited defense! Where else?

idgaf_luvr
04-14-2012, 04:36 PM
Just for the record, The New Black Panther Party and the Black Panther Party are 2 completely different organizations. The later does not associate with the former.

kandie_kitten
04-14-2012, 04:38 PM
I would contribute to his defense. I don't know if he's guilty or not, but he deserves a fair trial, and how he's been portrayed in the media is just appalling.

eagle2
04-14-2012, 04:43 PM
Your spirited defense! Where else?

How was I defending her?

eagle2
04-14-2012, 04:45 PM
I would contribute to his defense. I don't know if he's guilty or not, but he deserves a fair trial, and how he's been portrayed in the media is just appalling.

Why would you contribute to his defense? Does it matter to you that he killed an innocent person? Who said he's not going to get a fair trial?

bem401
04-14-2012, 06:14 PM
Why would you contribute to his defense? Does it matter to you that he killed an innocent person? Who said he's not going to get a fair trial?

How do you KNOW he killed an "innocent" person? Neither you nor I was on the scene at the time. There are corroborated reports out there that Martin, a 6'2" inch teenager, all "thugged out", confronted Zimmerman as he returned to his car, broke his nose, and was slamming his head to the ground . How is it you are capable of deciding who is or isn't guilty here? You are just letting your buttons be pushed by the race-baiters....Sharpton, Jackson, Obama, New Black Panthers, and NBC. Justice should be properly served in this and any other case, give it time before passing judgement.

kandie_kitten
04-14-2012, 07:35 PM
Who says the guy was "innocent"? The videotape of Zimmerman in the station shows him bloodied, with damage to the back of his head. I fully believe it was an altercation that escalated out of control, to the extent Zimmerman thought his life was in danger and shot him.

I don't believe that it is murder. Do I think Zimmerman is a saint? No, but I don't think he's an awful person who went around aiming to kill black kids.

I live about 10 miles away from where it happened. Al Sharpton and the media have whipped this area into a crazed frenzy; there's no way in hell this guy gets a fair trial out of any jury in Seminole county.

From editing audio to make Zimmerman sound racist to photoshopping images to make Zimmerman look like a thug and Trayvon look like a saint, it's truly appalling how this has been handled.

eagle2
04-14-2012, 07:55 PM
How do you KNOW he killed an "innocent" person?
It's well established that Trayvon Martin did nothing more than go to the convenience store for some Skittles and iced tea.



Neither you nor I was on the scene at the time. There are corroborated reports out there that Martin, a 6'2" inch teenager, all "thugged out", confronted Zimmerman as he returned to his car, broke his nose, and was slamming his head to the ground . How is it you are capable of deciding who is or isn't guilty here? You are just letting your buttons be pushed by the race-baiters....Sharpton, Jackson, Obama, New Black Panthers, and NBC. Justice should be properly served in this and any other case, give it time before passing judgement.

Looks like you're the one playing the race card and letting your buttons be pushed by the right-wing racist race-baiters, with your talk of Trayvon Martin "all thugged out". If that's not racist, I don't know what is.

Regardless of what happened with any type of altercation, Zimmerman should not have followed Martin, confronted him, or even got out of his vehicle. He's not a police officer. Trayvon Martin was not doing anything illegal. At least one witness has stated that the shooting was not self-defense.

Kellydancer
04-14-2012, 07:59 PM
Completely agreed. I don't know if Martin was a good kid or not but am tired of people talking how an "innocent" 17 year old was killed. If he was a gang member I have no qualms about him being killed. I despise gang members and they destroyed an area I grew up in so screw each and every one of them. Yes, most of them appear to be "innocent" teenagers but they aren't. I don't know if he was into a gang but on the other hand none of us really know how good of a kid he was either. Want to read about a truly good kid who lost his life (and who was a black teen to boot), read about Blair Holt. This was an innocent kid killed by a gang member. Yet because it was a black kid killed by a black kid it didn't get the attention this did.

kandie_kitten
04-14-2012, 08:02 PM
^And the case weeks ago where two black teens set a white boy on fire didn't get a blip in the media.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-03-04/news/31122324_1_white-boy-fire-tv-station

Kellydancer
04-14-2012, 08:05 PM
Exactly, and that's why this story bothers me. Plus the fact that the media twisted it to fit the race baiting agenda really bothers me tremendously. Makes one wonder why they did it (though I think we all know why).

eagle2
04-14-2012, 08:30 PM
Who says the guy was "innocent"? The videotape of Zimmerman in the station shows him bloodied, with damage to the back of his head. I fully believe it was an altercation that escalated out of control, to the extent Zimmerman thought his life was in danger and shot him.

As I said in my previous post, Trayvon Martin was doing nothing more than going to the convenience store for Skittles and iced tea. There never would have been an altercation if Zimmerman acted appropriately. He should never have followed or confronted Martin. He should never have even gotten out of his vehicle. If he didn't, none of this would have happened and Trayvon Martin would be alive today.

Please tell me how you would feel if you were walking home alone at night, and some strange man started following you.



I don't believe that it is murder. Do I think Zimmerman is a saint? No, but I don't think he's an awful person who went around aiming to kill black kids.


Whether or not he's "an awful person who went around aiming to kill black kids" is irrelevant. Even if Zimmerman was the most pro-black person and a member of the NAACP, it doesn't change the fact that he killed Trayvon Martin. The main issues are whether or not he was justified in following and confronting Trayvon Martin, and whether or not he was justified in shooting him. At the minimum, this was a wrongful death. Zimmerman went beyond his duties as self-appointed neighborhood watch, when he followed and confronted Trayvon Martin. If he thought Trayvon Martin looked suspicious, he should have done nothing more than call the police from his vehicle.




I live about 10 miles away from where it happened. Al Sharpton and the media have whipped this area into a crazed frenzy; there's no way in hell this guy gets a fair trial out of any jury in Seminole county.


If the Sanford Police had handled this appropriately, and especially if Zimmerman didn't exceed his authority as neighborhood watch, none of this would be happening. When a teenage boy goes to the convenience store for some Skittles and iced tea, and ends up getting shot and killed; and nothing is done about it; some people tend to get quite outraged.



From editing audio to make Zimmerman sound racist to photoshopping images to make Zimmerman look like a thug and Trayvon look like a saint, it's truly appalling how this has been handled.

And it's truly appalling the way the right wing media, and their followers have been going all out in trying to demonize Trayvon Martin and rally around his killer.

eagle2
04-14-2012, 08:43 PM
Completely agreed. I don't know if Martin was a good kid or not but am tired of people talking how an "innocent" 17 year old was killed. If he was a gang member I have no qualms about him being killed. I despise gang members and they destroyed an area I grew up in so screw each and every one of them. Yes, most of them appear to be "innocent" teenagers but they aren't. I don't know if he was into a gang but on the other hand none of us really know how good of a kid he was either. Want to read about a truly good kid who lost his life (and who was a black teen to boot), read about Blair Holt. This was an innocent kid killed by a gang member. Yet because it was a black kid killed by a black kid it didn't get the attention this did.

As far as I know, Trayvon Martin does not have any history of violence or being a member of a gang.

The main reason why this killing has got so much attention isn't because an African-American was killed by a white, but because the killer was released by the police without any charges brought against him.

eagle2
04-14-2012, 08:46 PM
^And the case weeks ago where two black teens set a white boy on fire didn't get a blip in the media.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-03-04/news/31122324_1_white-boy-fire-tv-station

Your link to the New York Daily News contradicts your post.

kandie_kitten
04-14-2012, 08:51 PM
It was a blip in the news. It was in two, three outlets, and that was it; there has been no follow up, no protests, no celebrities or politicians speaking out. It is just a nothing story, despite the fact that it was a hate crime.

Kellydancer
04-14-2012, 08:53 PM
As far as I know, Trayvon Martin does not have any history of violence or being a member of a gang.

The main reason why this killing has got so much attention isn't because an African-American was killed by a white, but because the killer was released by the police without any charges brought against him.

I don't know if he is in a gang or not either but the media isn't being truthful about this. That's why it bothers me. However I had read that he did have a history of behavior problems. If that is the case it could play a part in why this happened.

eagle2
04-14-2012, 10:28 PM
It was a blip in the news. It was in two, three outlets, and that was it; there has been no follow up, no protests, no celebrities or politicians speaking out. It is just a nothing story, despite the fact that it was a hate crime.

You don't seem to understand, the main reason people began to protest is not because Zimmerman killed Martin, but because no charges were brought against him. There wasn't much media coverage of the Trayvon Martin killing at first either. It was only after many people started to protest law enforcement's response.

bem401
04-15-2012, 02:32 AM
It's well established that Trayvon Martin did nothing more than go to the convenience store for some Skittles and iced tea.

Well established by who? Al Sharpton? The fact is we just don't know what happened and I've said that. You, on the other hand, have been manipulated to accuse, try, convict, and essentially sentence Zimmerman by the media because it serves other purposes for them. You should be offended by the way they act like scavengers around his dead body trying to turn it to political hay. There are approximately 100 young Black men killed each week in this country, the overwhelming majority by other young black men, but none of the people I mentioned care about that. They only want to involve themselves with situations that benefit them. Sharpton, Jackson, Obama, nothing but hucksters.



Looks like you're the one playing the race card and letting your buttons be pushed by the right-wing racist race-baiters, with your talk of Trayvon Martin "all thugged out". If that's not racist, I don't know what is.

Ha, I've worked in the inner-city with hundreds of young Black guys over the years and have remained friends with several of them after the fact. The bottom line is that they wear the hoodies and dress the way they do to project a certain image, that of a tough guy or gangbanger.



Regardless of what happened with any type of altercation, Zimmerman should not have followed Martin, confronted him, or even got out of his vehicle. He's not a police officer. Trayvon Martin was not doing anything illegal. At least one witness has stated that the shooting was not self-defense.

See, you're just repeating Sharpton's talking points. The story that appears more likely to be true is that a neighborhood watchman saw a suspicious man in community with a recent history of housebreaks, started following him, reported him to the authorities, was sent back to his vehicle by the authorities before he was confronted and assaulted by Martin. He defended himself by shooting him during a struggle. The only eyewitnesses to the incident support this version of the story.

One of the biggest problems with this whole case is Sharpton's involvement....Remember Tawana Brawley? The Duke lacrosse rape case? People should tell him to shut up and go home and let the justice system run its course.

Chgojoe
04-15-2012, 04:35 AM
You don't seem to understand, the main reason people began to protest is not because Zimmerman killed Martin, but because no charges were brought against him. There wasn't much media coverage of the Trayvon Martin killing at first either. It was only after many people started to protest law enforcement's response.

The reason he wasn't charged was because under Floridas stand and defend law Zimmerman was deemed to be within his rights. He was only charged to quiet the shitstorm propogated by NBC who purposely skewed the story, Jackson and Sharpton who are looking for attention, Obama who used it to divide the races for his own relection campaign and others with their own self serving race baiting motives.

Every negative story about Zimmerman and his conduct I initially heard has been modified or retracted. I have heard everything about Treven from him being an angel to a thief and thug. I don't know the real truth about Treven, his motives for being there, or what actually happened between the two of them, and I doubt that you do either. Id like to see this just play out in the court system. None of the people complaining about the rush to judgment in the OJ case are crying about it here, why is that?

Melonie
04-15-2012, 04:45 AM
I'll make one additional comment. The early purpose of this thread was NOT to discuss the merits of Trayvon / Zimmerman, but instead to discuss the mainstream media coverage it has received.

To date there have been more than a few attempts by mainstream media to 'manufacture' evidence ... or at least to selectively edit / misquote in a manner that allows for a uni-directional misinterpretation. As these attempts to 'manufacture' evidence have been discredited, media outlets have instead shifted to covering very 'polarized' comments ... no, I'll come right out and say it ... racially charged comments, from a host of prominent black organizations / leaders / celebrities calling for everything from prosecution of Zimmerman to vigilante 'justice' upon Zimmerman. At the same time, mainstream media has done minimal reporting of eyewitness statements, police statements, etc. which might be of opposite 'polarity'.

As pointed out above, like the Duke lacrosse rape case, it appears increasingly probable that mainstream media is again attempting to 'manufacture' a white on black racially motivated crime scenario that never actually existed. As also pointed out above, that 'manufactured' scenario is arguably being used by prominent black organizations / leaders / celebrities to gain media exposure for the furtherance of agendas that actually have very little to do with Trayvon/Zimmerman per se.

As to the Zimmerman indibtment news coverage, mainstream media did finally present a tidbit or two of counterbalance ...

(snip)Harvard University law professor Alan Dershowitz appeared on MSNBC’s Hardball where fill-in host Michel Smerconish asked him his opinions of the arrest warrant issued and carried out for alleged Trayvon Martin murderer, George Zimmerman. Dershowitz called the affidavit justifying Zimmerman’s arrest “not only thin, it’s irresponsible.” He went on to criticize the decision to charge Zimmerman for second degree murder by special prosecutor Angela Corey as being politically motivated.

You’ve seen the affidavit of probable cause. What do you make of it,” Smerconish asked. “It won’t suffice,” Dershowitz replied without hesitation.

“Most affidavits of probable cause are very thin. This is so thin that it won’t make it past a judge on a second degree murder charge,” Dershowitz said. “There’s simply nothing in there that would justify second degree murder.”

Dershowitz said that the elements that would constitute that crime are non-existent in the affidavit. “It’s not only thin, it’s irresponsible,” said Dershowitz.

Dershowitz went on to strongly criticize Corey’s decision to move forward with the case against Zimmerman. “I think what you have here is an elected public official who made a campaign speech last night for reelection when she gave her presentation and overcharged. This case will not – if the evidence is no stronger than what appears in the probable cause affidavit – this case will result in an acquittal.”

Smerconish identified the total lack of any mention of the supposed fight that occurred between Martin and Zimmerman prior to Martin being shot. He said he was disappointed that he did not see any mention of that conflict that led to Martin’s murder.

“But it’s worse than that,” said Dershowitz. “It’s irresponsible and unethical in not including material that favors the defendant.”

“This affidavit does not even make it to probable cause,” Dershowitz concluded. “everything in the affidavit is completely consistent with a defense of self-defense. Everything.” (snip)


Viewed another way, Alan Dershowitz was making a direct comparison of the actions taken by prosecutor Angela Corey to actions taken by Duke lacross rape case prosecutor Mike Nifong.

Where the majority of Americans are concerned, I would argue that an old proverb is applicable. 'Fool me once - shame on you'. 'Fool me twice - shame on me'. The huge spike in recent firearms sales would tend to support this conclusion as well.

mtn_031
04-15-2012, 07:09 PM
I understand there's emotion on both sides.
But the facts are: Trayvon Martin was a 17 year old who was visiting his dad; he was watching the NBA all star game and during halftime he went to the 7-11 to buy ice-t and skittles. On his way back home from the store he had an altercation with a 26 year old man with a gun, and he was killed.
All this talk about teenage "thugs" and "race-baiters" is irrelevant. Justice for Trayvon Martin had not been served: Zimmerman wasn't arrested until the Black leaders started bringing attention to the case.
Having said that; the NRA "stand your ground" law in Florida will probably ensure that Zimmerman will not serve much time (if any).

Melonie
04-16-2012, 02:28 AM
^^^ that's one version of the 'facts', served up by particular media outlets. There are many additional versions of the 'facts', some of which have never been mentioned by particular media outlets. Additionally, there have been 'manufactured facts' promoted by particular media outlets that have subsequently been exposed as being 'manufactured'.

No, the fact is that nobody outside of local LE has been exposed to all of the actual facts ... actual facts which apparently led to an initial determination by local LE that there was insufficient basis for bringing charges. This is the reason that early thread discussions did not attempt to discuss the actual merits of Trayvon/Zimmerman, and instead limited itself to discussing the media coverage ( or lack thereof ). Indeed, as a result of the high profile 'agitation' provided by black organizations / leaders / celebrities, there will now be official court hearings of those facts. It must be assumed that media outlets will thus be forced to report all of the facts which are disclosed in that courtroom.

mtn_031
04-16-2012, 06:00 PM
There are many additional versions of the 'facts' Can you provide an example?
It seems to me like the confusion is only over what happened during the fight (or “altercation” as I wrote in my initial post).
Then again, I don't know a whole lot about the case.

eagle2
04-16-2012, 06:27 PM
The reason he wasn't charged was because under Floridas stand and defend law Zimmerman was deemed to be within his rights. He was only charged to quiet the shitstorm propogated by NBC who purposely skewed the story, Jackson and Sharpton who are looking for attention, Obama who used it to divide the races for his own relection campaign and others with their own self serving race baiting motives.


Zimmerman wasn't standing his ground. He was following Trayvon Martin. He was charged because most people, who aren't racists, have a problem when African-American teenage boy goes to the convenience store for some Skittles and iced tea, and ends up getting shot, and the shooter is let free with no charges being brought against him.



Every negative story about Zimmerman and his conduct I initially heard has been modified or retracted. I have heard everything about Treven from him being an angel to a thief and thug. I don't know the real truth about Treven, his motives for being there, or what actually happened between the two of them, and I doubt that you do either. Id like to see this just play out in the court system. None of the people complaining about the rush to judgment in the OJ case are crying about it here, why is that?
No it hasn't. It definitely hasn't been modified that Zimmerman got out of his vehicle and followed Trayvon Martin before shooting him. If you'd like to see this "just play out in the court system", why are you complaining about people protesting because the D.A. originally made the decision to not have the court system handle it?

Nina_
04-16-2012, 06:30 PM
^And the case weeks ago where two black teens set a white boy on fire didn't get a blip in the media.

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-03-04/news/31122324_1_white-boy-fire-tv-station

Every murder doesn't get nation-wide murder coverage; the reason this one has is because, uniquely, the person who pursued/stalked and killed an unarmed minor did not get arrested and/or charged with anything.

eagle2
04-16-2012, 06:32 PM
^^^ that's one version of the 'facts', served up by particular media outlets. There are many additional versions of the 'facts', some of which have never been mentioned by particular media outlets. Additionally, there have been 'manufactured facts' promoted by particular media outlets that have subsequently been exposed as being 'manufactured'.


No, I have not heard anyone dispute that Trayvon Martin was visiting his dad, and was walking back from the convenience store when he was shot.



No, the fact is that nobody outside of local LE has been exposed to all of the actual facts ... actual facts which apparently led to an initial determination by local LE that there was insufficient basis for bringing charges. This is the reason that early thread discussions did not attempt to discuss the actual merits of Trayvon/Zimmerman, and instead limited itself to discussing the media coverage ( or lack thereof ). Indeed, as a result of the high profile 'agitation' provided by black organizations / leaders / celebrities, there will now be official court hearings of those facts. It must be assumed that media outlets will thus be forced to report all of the facts which are disclosed in that courtroom.

As always you're making stuff up. It wasn't determined by local LE that there was insufficient basis for bringing charges. At least one of the arresting officers thought charges should be brought against Zimmerman.

Nina_
04-16-2012, 06:38 PM
^^^ that's one version of the 'facts', served up by particular media outlets. There are many additional versions of the 'facts', some of which have never been mentioned by particular media outlets. Additionally, there have been 'manufactured facts' promoted by particular media outlets that have subsequently been exposed as being 'manufactured'.



Is there another version of the facts? No. The facts ARE the Trayvon was walking home from the store unarmed; he was then followed by Zimmerman, who got out of his car and approached Trayvon. We don't know what happened between then and the gunshot, but we do know the Zimmerman initiated all contact and that Trayvon was just walking to his dad's house.

We do know that one witness, a woman, said that she heard Trayvon screaming for his life; another fact is that the police persuaded a 13 year old boy into saying that he saw Trayvon on top, beating up Zimmerman.

We also know that on the 911 calls, you can hear someone begging for their life and crying for help right before you hear the bullet that ended Trayvon's life. Were the cries Zimmerman's or Trayvon's? Whichever one of them was begging for their life was obviously in a position of needing protection. Zimmerman said it was him crying for help, thus that's why he's claiming self-defense. However, two forensic voice experts analyzed Zimmerman's voice and concluded that it is most definitely NOT Zimmerman crying for help. That means Trayvon was crying for help, which ruins Zimmerman's self-defense claim completely. Those are facts.

bem401
04-16-2012, 07:55 PM
No, I have not heard anyone dispute that Trayvon Martin was visiting his dad, and was walking back from the convenience store when he was shot.

He may have been there to visit his dad and he may have been walking back from the convenience store but that doesn't mean he didn't confront and assault Zimmerman after Zimmerman called off following him and returned to his vehicle. The bottom line is none of us know the facts, but then again nor do any of the race baiters




As always you're making stuff up. It wasn't determined by local LE that there was insufficient basis for bringing charges. At least one of the arresting officers thought charges should be brought against Zimmerman.

It was determined by the local prosecuting attorney (who overrules the cops) decided there wasn't sufficient evidence to warrant prosecution.

mtn_031
04-17-2012, 08:24 AM
This "race-baiter" term bothers me.I'm White/Latino (like Zimmerman) and I haven't felt like I've been the victim of verbal attacks by Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson.
I heard about this story early on and I just felt really bad for Trayvon's mom when she talked about what happened.
Then I watched Trayvon's dad "conducting his own investigation" to gather evidence so the cops would arrest his son's killer, and I just felt sorry for the man. The dude is a truck driver and there he was trying to be a crime investigator.
I thought ; what would I do in that situation?.
Later on, the case turned into a celebrity cause and a political fight , but whatever.
I'd like to think I would use any means necessary too to get the killer of my teenage son arrested (If I had a son).

Chgojoe
04-17-2012, 09:38 AM
Zimmerman wasn't standing his ground. He was following Trayvon Martin. He was charged because most people, who aren't racists, have a problem when African-American teenage boy goes to the convenience store for some Skittles and iced tea, and ends up getting shot, and the shooter is let free with no charges being brought against him.


No it hasn't. It definitely hasn't been modified that Zimmerman got out of his vehicle and followed Trayvon Martin before shooting him. If you'd like to see this "just play out in the court system", why are you complaining about people protesting because the D.A. originally made the decision to not have the court system handle it?


If the dead boy wasn't a minority and the shooter portrayed as white would you be just as passionate about this? How do you know that he was there only for skittles and iced tea, could you read his mind or were you there? You do know that he jumped a fence into a gated comunity, ......right? Seems weird to jump 2 fences just to save a few steps to buy skittles and iced tea, doesn't it? Black get killed by blacks every day, why aren't you so outraged about them?


He got out of his car and followed him because he was a overzealous neighborhood watch guy. If you were not aware a NBC producer was fired for editing the transcripts to better fit the racist execution story they were portraying this as.



The people who know the most real facts origionally decided not to prosecute. No matter how much of the facts you know, don't know, or choose to ignore, you don't know what was in either of their minds or all of what really happened and why.

bem401
04-17-2012, 11:03 AM
This "race-baiter" term bothers me.I'm White/Latino (like Zimmerman) and I haven't felt like I've been the victim of verbal attacks by Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson.
I heard about this story early on and I just felt really bad for Trayvon's mom when she talked about what happened.
Then I watched Trayvon's dad "conducting his own investigation" to gather evidence so the cops would arrest his son's killer, and I just felt sorry for the man. The dude is a truck driver and there he was trying to be a crime investigator.
I thought ; what would I do in that situation?.
Later on, the case turned into a celebrity cause and a political fight , but whatever.
I'd like to think I would use any means necessary too to get the killer of my teenage son arrested (If I had a son).


Where has anyone found fault with any action on the parents' parts, other than perhaps trademarking his name? Sharpton and Jackson are two of the most despicable public figures in the country, interested only in lining their pockets and elevating their profiles at the expense of any sense of potential racial harmony.

mtn_031
04-17-2012, 05:30 PM
interested only in lining their pockets and elevating their profiles at the expense of any sense of potential racial harmony.

You can say that about anybody with a high profile who is involved, or reporting on the case. There’s Al and Jesse on the left, Sean Hannity and Bill O’ Reilly on the right.

lestat1
04-17-2012, 05:31 PM
"Man, I could kill for some Skittles right now." - George Zimmerman





It's not still "too soon," right?

ArmySGT.
04-17-2012, 05:37 PM
"Man, I could kill for some Skittles right now." - George Zimmerman





It's not still "too soon," right?
http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j218/ArmySGT_photos/Makes%20me%20laugh/Likedthis.jpg