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View Full Version : I wonder if this is anything like how it is for them



Morty the Mortal
11-13-2012, 05:28 PM
A couple of nights ago I had a pleasant evening at Deja Vu in Kalamazoo. I had nice conversations with a couple of dancers and bought a lapdance from one of them. This was only my 5th lapdance ever, so I'm not sure I fully understand what constitutes "high mileage", but there was a lot of grinding on my crotch.

She seemed comfortable enough with it all, and gave me a nice hug afterwards, but I can't help wondering what it was like for a lithe, willowy 23-year old to dry-hump a middle-aged guy like me (yes, I know, there are lots of threads that get into this, but bear with me).

(Actually it wasn't dry for me; she was quite focused, and I haven't had any in a while and was pretty wound up. I started to tell her to pause for a moment, but I was a split second too late. Fortunately, it happened almost exactly when our time was up, and I was wearing two pairs of boxers just in case this happened, so it didn't soak through.)

Anyway, as I say, I was wondering. But today it occurred to me that I may have had an experience comparable to hers. When I was around 24, I spent a year teaching English overseas. I had a female boss in her mid 30s who was just a bit nutty. One time we were all partying with some other expats and the booze was flowing freely. People started dancing. This was the year that the Lambada was everywhere. So my boss pulls me out on the floor and starts dancing the Lambada with me. Though I was drunk, when her crotch hit my thigh I had enough presence of mind to bend my knees and keep some air between us, but she pulled me back up and proceeded to grind away with abandon. She seemed to be really enjoying herself, and afterwards, she gave me a shit-eating grin and one of those chummy NYC slaps to my cheek like mobsters do to each other in the movies. The next day when I sobered up, I wondered, did my boss whack off on my thigh last night? I decided I'd had a fun evening, whatever it was. She wasn't very attractive, and she was probably an alcoholic, but she was smart, pretty good at her job, and fun to be around when she wasn't in a weird mood, and if I was able to give her some pleasure at no cost to myself, then it was ok with me.

shanna dior
11-13-2012, 05:34 PM
That's... Not at all comparable. I don't even understand how you think those are the same situation at all. Lap dances are just part of the job for strippers, and your dancer's mind was probably a million miles away, even if her body language would indicate otherwise. After a while, it's basically second nature to give a lap dance, and girls don't even have to think about it. You may be jizzing, but she's making a grocery list or thinking about her homework or debating what to do that weekend.

yoda57us
11-13-2012, 05:40 PM
^^If she is thinking about it at all it is either "can I get this guy to buy another dance" or "just don't fucking get any on me!"

ChefKitty
11-13-2012, 06:56 PM
Never once have I gotten turned on by a lapdance. Even with guys that I was attracted to.
For me, the dance is a close-up performance, I am getting compensated by the song so it's in my best interest to give a good dance, the literally last thing I want is for the guy to nut in his pants because a) I feel like his orgasm (due to me) is worth more than my measly $20 per song that I keep maybe $15 of, and b) that means the "fun" is over" .

It is our job to entertain you and make your experience at our club (read: work) the best it can be. Don't expect to go into a place where girls are being paid to act a certain way, and find girls who like it so much they'd do it for free. If they'd do it for free, they wouldn't require payment and thus would not be working in a strip club.

tuesdaymarie
11-13-2012, 07:03 PM
I can kind of see how it's comparable. You were younger than your opposite sex boss and she used you in a sexual way that didn't turn you on at all. The dancer was younger than you and probably didn't care much about the experience that sexually exited you. The only differences are that the dancer was paid and, if it were me, I probably would dislike some guy finishing in his pants more than you disliked the possibility of your boss pleasing herself against your thigh.

Morty the Mortal
11-14-2012, 07:15 AM
Never once have I gotten turned on by a lapdance. Even with guys that I was attracted to.
For me, the dance is a close-up performance, I am getting compensated by the song so it's in my best interest to give a good dance, the literally last thing I want is for the guy to nut in his pants because a) I feel like his orgasm (due to me) is worth more than my measly $20 per song that I keep maybe $15 of, and b) that means the "fun" is over" .

It is our job to entertain you and make your experience at our club (read: work) the best it can be. Don't expect to go into a place where girls are being paid to act a certain way, and find girls who like it so much they'd do it for free. If they'd do it for free, they wouldn't require payment and thus would not be working in a strip club.

That wasn't my point at all. I didn't get turned on by my boss, either.

I would hope that our experiences were similar in this way: I didn't feel dirty or violated afterwards, and I didn't think less of my boss.

shanna dior
11-14-2012, 08:10 AM
I would hope that our experiences were similar in this way: I didn't feel dirty or violated afterwards, and I didn't think less of my boss.

Gotcha. I've never felt dirty or violated after giving a dance or leaving the club, but I've also never had a customer jizz in his pants while I was dancing for him, so I'm not sure if/how that would change my perspective. On the one hand, I'd think that I might feel a little dirty and violated since the purpose of dancing is a tease, not to get the customer off, but then on the other, I mean, I guess it happens sometimes and it's not always done on purpose. I suppose I'd never know if it was done on purpose or not, but I guess that would be the main way to determine if I felt used or not. Someone cumming accidentally =/= sweatpants boner man going to the club with the intention of getting off.

rickdugan
11-14-2012, 08:16 AM
That wasn't my point at all. I didn't get turned on by my boss, either.

I would hope that our experiences were similar in this way: I didn't feel dirty or violated afterwards, and I didn't think less of my boss.

You are trying to analogize how you felt after your boss got a little frisky with you in a bar to how a girl should feel after a guy nuts in his pants from a LD. It isn't remotely the same thing.

They do this specifically because they are paid and if they don't do the dances, they don't eat. Not only are many of their individual experiences much more intense than what you experienced at the bar, but the number of occurrences that they deal with can have a cumulative effect that builds up over time. Net-net, an attempt to analogize a one-off pass made by your boss, who wasn't that much older than you anyway, to the feelings engendered in girls who have to deal with much older and, in some cases, disgusting and badly behaved, guys who are looking to get off, is really off base IMHO.

This is just another spin on the classic need of some SC customers to feel ok with what they do or, at the very least, that the girls do not dislike what is happening. Well, the reality is that some of these girls are indeed disgusted by guys who nut in their pants, nevermind the guys who do all sorts of other interesting things, and some do indeed feel dirty and/or violated. Some of them simply don't want to be used for that sort of thing and believe that they are selling dances, not orgasms (or fingers in the ass or vagina, or access to their bodies with your mouth, etc.).

IMHO trying to unravel how a dancer feels about what she is doing is a pointless exercise and, in some cases, will be counterproductive to your own entertainment. You'd probably be better off simply worrying about being a good customer and in ensuring that whatever happens includes mutual consent.

But if you really want to explore more about how some of these things make dancers feel, there is ample material on the pink side of the board. In fact, you'd probably find some of the pink posts to be quite eye-opening.

Morty the Mortal
11-14-2012, 10:30 AM
^rick, thanks for contributing, but have YOU given a lapdance? If not, I'll reserve judgment on your analysis, especially since you profess to be uninterested in how dancers feel (though I suspect you do care about their feelings after all). Your references to filthy behavior by other guys is beside the point and a straw man; that's not what I did.

My orgasm is really secondary to this question. Suppose I hadn't had one? There are many people who would regard just grinding on a stranger's clothed cock as a disgusting thing to do. I would hope that the dancers I've had don't feel that way. But even at my first trip to the rail I could see that not all dancers are at peace with what they are doing. That's one of the reasons I need to have a conversation with the dancer before I have a lapdance. I need to get an idea of who I'm dealing with and establish some kind of rapport.

Yes, I DO need to know that the dancers are not exploited (I'll get the exploitation issue on another thread) or degraded, and that what we do together in the club can take place in an atmosphere of mutual respect.

But as long as we're talking about my orgasm, I don't buy the idea that selling lapdances and selling orgasms are mutually exclusive. I lurked here for a while before registering, and I've done some research elsewhere, so I know that there are differences of opinion on this point, both among dancers and customers. Frankly, I don't have much sympathy for the dancers who are shocked! shocked! that some customers come during lapdances, or even do so on purpose, though it is perfectly reasonable for them not to want to come in contact with ejaculate, and I think customers ought to be considerate and discreet (my two-boxer solution seems to work). Based on the few lapdances I've had, I find it hard to believe that some dancers are not deliberately trying to give guys happy endings. I have even less sympathy for the guys who think that just because they don't come during a lapdance that they are somehow better than those who do. If you're buying a lapdance at all, then you're a PL just like the rest of us. But I agree that mutual consent needs to be established if anything beyond one-way touching (and maybe some nuzzling or motorboating? is that a given?) is to occur. In the case above, I asked if I could put my hands on her waist during the dance, and she readily consented. But I'm not convinced that mutual consent covers whether I have an orgasm or not. My bottom line is this: what happens in MY pants is MY business, as long as it stays there. But if that's what I was after, I would much rather get a dance from a dancer who doesn't have a problem with it. I would rather not get a lapdance at all if the experience is going to be negative for either of us.

yoda57us
11-14-2012, 11:38 AM
Any conversation about what goes on in clubs, what dancers will allow or what they will encourage has to include some reference to regional customs. If you walk into most clubs in Providence RI you will be hard pressed to find a dancer who hasn't caused and encouraged explosions in a lot of guy's pants...even outside of their pants. On the other hand, if you are fifty miles away in downtown Boston the girls will be two feet away from you pretty much all the time. Drive forty miles west to Webster Mass and you will find a little of both...

To be honest, I have trouble comparing anything that happens outside of a strip club to anything that happens inside of a strip club. At the club the woman's sole interest is in making a living. That doesn't mean she can't be friendly, kind and down-right nice to guys who treat her with generosity and respect but it is not and will never be the same thing as a casual quasi sexual dance at a social event.

None of this really has anything to do with our ability to enjoy our visits to the clubs or a dancers ability to earn a living in them. Granted, reading here on SW or SCJ may strip away some of the "fantasy" aspect of going to a club but, in my opinion at least, there's noting wrong with that. I prefer going through life with my eyes wide open...

rickdugan
11-14-2012, 05:47 PM
Morty, you really could have spared us the vigorous defense of why it is ok for you to nut in your pants during a LD. ;) In fact, it was a little weird. My only points were that: (1) it is not remotely the same thing as a civilian woman getting frisky with you; and (2) some dancers very much do not like it. I deal with a lot of dancers each year - understanding this is not rocket science. I think you will find ample commentary to the same effect on here as well.

Now having said this, Yoda makes a good point that there are girls who do indeed try to create this very effect, but that is far from universal. However, IMHO you are on the right track by thinking in terms of mutual consent.

I did want to spend a moment on this other piece of your commentary though:


There are many people who would regard just grinding on a stranger's clothed cock as a disgusting thing to do. I would hope that the dancers I've had don't feel that way. But even at my first trip to the rail I could see that not all dancers are at peace with what they are doing. That's one of the reasons I need to have a conversation with the dancer before I have a lapdance. I need to get an idea of who I'm dealing with and establish some kind of rapport.

Yes, I DO need to know that the dancers are not exploited (I'll get the exploitation issue on another thread) or degraded, and that what we do together in the club can take place in an atmosphere of mutual respect.

What do you mean by exploitation? Unless you believe that she is a human sex slave being forced to work against her will, you should probably assume that she is a grown adult who makes her own decisions and establishes her own boundaries as she sees fit. Mutual consent is one thing, but trying to get in the head of your entertainer is quite another. The reality is that, if she is doing her job right, you will never really know how she feels about dancing for you, but you will make her job that much harder if you are trying to psychoanalyze her as she's trying to pitch her services to you.

IMHO you should let it be enough that she tells you that it is ok with her if you blow your load in your pants. This seeming need for the girl to be truly happy about grinding you to completion is really your issue, not hers. It is not fair to make your need for validation her problem.

Anyway, just my :twocents:

Morty the Mortal
11-14-2012, 06:32 PM
Aaaand there's my new sig. Thanks!

As I said, I'll get to the exploitation issue on another thread. I think it's more complicated than asking whether a woman has been trafficked or is free to quit and walk away.

I don't expect them to like doing lapdances per se. But stripping clearly takes a psychological toll on some people, and I don't want to be part of that. Look, I don't expect my dental hygienist to get off on cleaning my teeth, but I don't want her to have nightmares about it or despise me for making her scrape off my tartar, either.

Thanks for the advice, but I think I'll keep on trying to get in their heads. I know I'll never get in their pants; getting into their heads is the next best thing (better in some cases).

yoda57us
11-14-2012, 08:05 PM
Thanks for the advice, but I think I'll keep on trying to get in their heads. I know I'll never get in their pants; getting into their heads is the next best thing (better in some cases).

Better keep a tight grip on your wallet Morty. Once you start trying to figure them out you are opening up yourself to be a sucker for their head games...Trust me, your no match for these girls.

rgbg
11-15-2012, 04:55 AM
As for the 'just the job' point, I remember one masseuse saying she could mentally balance her checkbook while finishing a guy off. Probably true.


^.... Based on the few lapdances I've had, I find it hard to believe that some dancers are not deliberately trying to give guys happy endings....

I guess it depends on the place but at one of my regular haunts that result (and of course the subsequent tip) are obviously part of the target. The fact that the very same girls will recognize me the next time and immediately work to get my attention before someone else does suggests that they know exactly where they are taking it.

lopaw
11-15-2012, 10:01 PM
As much as some pink's here don't like or agree with it, there are plenty of dancers whose main goal is getting guys (and girls) off for the price of a few lapdances plus tip. And in this still-shitty economy it seems to be happening more & more lately. Many are very brazen about it too....no more beating around the bush, (pun intended) ;D.

rickdugan
11-17-2012, 03:00 PM
As I said, I'll get to the exploitation issue on another thread. I think it's more complicated than asking whether a woman has been trafficked or is free to quit and walk away.

Well, count me as one who is eager to read your upcoming thread about exploitation. ;D In fact, you've provided several teasers for it and I'm disappointed that we haven't seen it by now.