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Aniela
03-28-2013, 05:02 PM
Jesus jetskiing Christ, stereotype much?

Judging a person's morals based soley on their clothing choices makes abt as much sense to me as making those same judgments based soley on their choice of profession ::cough::*Kelly*::cough::

I agree w/ Firemaiden who pointed out the tackiness of having slogans like JUICY written across your bum - I think sporting bottoms like that screams "desperate for attention" & is asking for a goose from sm opportunistic assclown who thinks he's God's gift to comedy, I know I see plenty of those types at work every nite.

But ripping girls for wearing yoga pants to school? They're comfortable, can be layered w/ tights when it's cold, cover everything while providing ease of movement, & particularly in hotter climates, they're breathable. Kelly, if you think yoga pants are the mark of a harlot, you might as well be calling for a burka, I'd hate to hear what you call the girls who have the gall to wear shorts in public. As for your church assistant reporting abt how *everyone* in her school is sleeping w/ each other, etc, if she's anywhere near as high up on herself as you are, I'd take her report w/ a grain of salt. IME there's just as many self-righteous haters in church as there are in strip clubs.

Now all this being said, I tend to run a bit conservative myself where clothes are concerned, but I think there's a big difference between, say, an outfit that fits well & *ahem* follows a woman's shape, & one that is so bloody tight you can count her ribs thru the fabric. The latter, I would find vulgar.

Kellydancer
03-28-2013, 06:59 PM
Jesus jetskiing Christ, stereotype much?

Judging a person's morals based soley on their clothing choices makes abt as much sense to me as making those same judgments based soley on their choice of profession ::cough::*Kelly*::cough::

I agree w/ Firemaiden who pointed out the tackiness of having slogans like JUICY written across your bum - I think sporting bottoms like that screams "desperate for attention" & is asking for a goose from sm opportunistic assclown who thinks he's God's gift to comedy, I know I see plenty of those types at work every nite.

But ripping girls for wearing yoga pants to school? They're comfortable, can be layered w/ tights when it's cold, cover everything while providing ease of movement, & particularly in hotter climates, they're breathable. Kelly, if you think yoga pants are the mark of a harlot, you might as well be calling for a burka, I'd hate to hear what you call the girls who have the gall to wear shorts in public. As for your church assistant reporting abt how *everyone* in her school is sleeping w/ each other, etc, if she's anywhere near as high up on herself as you are, I'd take her report w/ a grain of salt. IME there's just as many self-righteous haters in church as there are in strip clubs.

Now all this being said, I tend to run a bit conservative myself where clothes are concerned, but I think there's a big difference between, say, an outfit that fits well & *ahem* follows a woman's shape, & one that is so bloody tight you can count her ribs thru the fabric. The latter, I would find vulgar.

Obviously you are lacking in reading comprehension by thinking I said women should wear burkas. No teen girls should wear yoga pants to school. My 17 year old assistant would think of dressing like that. Yes she has class and is a proud virgin, imagine that. Sure we are both high on ourselves because we don't approve of slutty behavior. Teens shouldn't be engaging in that behavior. She's going to be a doctor and is saving herself for marriage (which is what many should have done so there wouldn't be as these illegitimate children).

Djoser
03-28-2013, 07:00 PM
OK I don't have the time right now to clean this thread up--I might come back later if I can though.

For now:

Kellydancer Lemmiwinks was not 'checking out' his daughter, so stop calling him a pervert. Sounds like she's doing better than 95% of the kids I see her age, so who cares if she's wearing yoga pants for chrissakes? You can see 16 year old cleavage all over the place, like at the fucking beach, for instance. Telling them what to wear (or worse yet what NOT to wear) is pointless, so long as it isn't see through shit or whatever.

Who the fuck cares whether 16 year olds are wearing VS? It's just the media making a mountain out of a molehill (again). No disrespect to the OP, I think that's the point she was trying to make anyway. It's got nothing to do with why a lot more strippers are sucking dick in VIP.

I think wearing anything with anything written on the ass is dumb as fuck at any age, though I have seen a few stripper outfits like that that were pretty funny.

I remember this exact argument about 20 years ago when all the young girls were supposedly copying Madonna's 'slutty' stage look.

unbeleavable
03-28-2013, 07:11 PM
^ the best responce is Djoser

FasaCorp
03-28-2013, 07:23 PM
I still think it is sleazy to dress appropriately

This is the funniest statement I've read all week. Thank you, Kelly :)

ArmySGT.
03-28-2013, 07:30 PM
This is fabulous.

Nothing really to add.

inb4 locked.

safado
03-28-2013, 07:33 PM
I still think it is sleazy to dress appropriately in school and I stick by that.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/mj-laughing.gif

Kellydancer
03-28-2013, 07:39 PM
This is the funniest statement I've read all week. Thank you, Kelly :)

It was supposed to be inappropriately. There is no reason for a girl to dress slutty. Compare Debbie Gibson and Tiffany in the 80's to Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera and tell me which group is nicer dressed and also which group has more problems. Sure Debbie Gibson and Tiffany have faded for the most part but they didn't dress like sleaze. The other two do.

temptingmodel
03-28-2013, 07:43 PM
Welcome to 2013 , a lot has changed since the eighties
It was supposed to be inappropriately. There is no reason for a girl to dress slutty. Compare Debbie Gibson and Tiffany in the 80's to Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera and tell me which group is nicer dressed and also which group has more problems. Sure Debbie Gibson and Tiffany have faded for the most part but they didn't dress like sleaze. The other two do.

temptingmodel
03-28-2013, 07:51 PM
I think most markets target younger buyers & I would have to have a discussion if I had a young daughter before I bought.
THIS! Yes! TY!

Talking with kids and letting them know the risks of dressing scantily clad can cause unwanted issues that they are not aware of. Talking with kids about "proper" dress attire outside of the home is very important.

ArmySGT.
03-28-2013, 07:51 PM
33161

Mean while at the beach.

Kellydancer
03-28-2013, 08:05 PM
Welcome to 2013 , a lot has changed since the eighties

Of course, which is why trashy reality shows are popular and porn stars make less money because now anyone with a camera can make a porn.

Djoser
03-28-2013, 08:25 PM
I don't really think all that much has changed since the 80s. 16 year old girls and girls a lot younger have been trying to dress provocatively as they are allowed (and more so) since well before 1985. Parents have been freaking out about it for the same length of time.

And I suspect that if they had come up with Reality TV in the 80s, people would have sucked it right up with all the other shitty, vapid crap they were spewing out on television since its popularity began in the 60s.

OK I tried to clean this up a little, starting on this page.

There will be no more calling people perverts because they let their daughters wear yoga pants. Thank you that is all.

Kellydancer
03-28-2013, 08:35 PM
But it's fine when people say his daughter is out of my league, got it.

Djoser
03-28-2013, 08:58 PM
But it's fine when people say his daughter is out of my league, got it.

No it's not fine, you have both been warned. No points awarded.

But you started it by calling him a pervert for saying he told his daughter she looked nice.

Now unless you want some points, I suggest you fucking drop it right now.

yoda57us
03-29-2013, 02:11 AM
I went to jr high school in the early 70's. Back then the girls were wearing bell bottom, low rise jeans that were so tight around their ass that they couldn't sit down in a chair without their butt crack being exposed. Mini skirts and tight tops were also very common. The girls at the Catholic schools in town had to wear uniforms of course but the jr high and high school girls still managed to hem their skirts short enough to give the boys what we lustily refereed to as "panty shots". The first girl I ever "made-out" with was a Catholic school girl. A bunch of us 14 year olds were in a cornfield past our curfew with a bag of pot, a case of beer and a bottle of apple wine. Her uniform was hanging from a corn stalk so it wouldn't get dirty and my hand was shoved all the way down her waist-high very full cut white cotton panties. Her bra would qualify as a flack vest nowadays but somehow we managed to get her big and bouncy 14 year old titties out for me to play with. Where there is a will there is a way and a horny kids are horny kids. It should be noted here that I'm 55 now and no longer attracted to 14 year old girls but I still look back on that night in the cornfield with very fond memories...and wonder what ever happened to Maureen with the big tits...:)

My daughter is in her mid 20's now but I survived many years of taking her "back to school" shopping when she was in her teens. The fact is we looked forward to it as a yearly bonding ritual. Fashion is fashion. During those shopping trips we spent very little time talking about what she was buying. Most of our conversations revolved around things that actually mattered like drugs, teenage drinking, classes, college. Hemlines and necklines just didn't seem all that important to me. A good kid is a good kid. If some total stranger may have judged my daughter and her friends based on what they were wearing to school that's their problem.

Marketing is marketing. Companies like VS are taking the heat now but The Gap was selling tight jeans to teenage girls long before the thong existed so many girls just didn't wear underwear at all. I don't believe that clothing choices determine one's future.

bunny8558
03-29-2013, 03:01 AM
I guess my existence is impossible.
I had a 160+ IQ at 13 after multiple testings, got an academic scholarship to college based on winning state in debate/science/engineering competitions, and was a published writer before hitting puberty. I was fat until I hit about 16, so I got teased. My parents were super-religious and considered showing my shoulders, wearing a bikini, or showing leg more than an inch or two above the knee as immoral and wrong-- so I DEFINITELY got teased.
Do you want to know what was on my mind in the midst of childhood?
1. Getting the heck away from my religious parents due to being beaten based on their good ol' Christian values
2. Getting out of my small town using my smarts
3. Fitting in, including dressing like a normal person and being attractive.

I wanted a career, but getting away from antiquated Victrorian/Progressive Era female and childhood expectations and getting away from uneducated, small-minded, and/or mean Christians-in-name-only were on my mind.
I have a degree now, and I dress slutty by American-Christian social standards. Why? I feel like my femininity is powerful. I feel like I should NEVER be expected to divorce my intellect from my body. My body created and fed a little person... my body is powerful and flexible... my body does A LOT more than have sex or attract partners. Dressing in a way to showcase my awesome body (and every body is awesome in its own way) should not be seen to reflect on my personality or character. The way I dress comes from my personal issues and disagreements with social and cultural beliefs that are sold to us as religious and moral. I don't want my little girl to see her naked body as sexual and wrong, so I do this SO SHE WILL RESPECT HERSELF AS A PERSON WITH MANY DIFFERENT ATTRIBUTES.
If you hold onto Platonic views that the body and acts involving the body are evil and wrong, then go ahead. Just don't start a theological argument on it with someone, because that someone might have a library including books on the history of the church, various social movements attached to the church, and various philosophies added to the church to sell it to various groups over time. This someone might also be a Christian, just not of the American tradition. My body is not dirty in and of itself, and no one can convince me otherwise (i.e. that my body may incite others to lust even though I cannot force someone into lust).
So, to recap: I am intelligent, I have done much with my life, and I dress "slutty."
Oh, and btw folks, slut-shaming comes from one's inner issues with the feminine.

Sophia_Starina
03-29-2013, 09:11 AM
I think wearing anything with anything written on the ass is dumb as fuck at any age.

My sentiments exactly.

Vamp
03-29-2013, 09:16 AM
Everyone is thinking of this as a moral issue. VS sees it as a business move.

The reality is that older women are harder to market to. They are more likely to budget funds, competitive shop, and less likely to impulse shop based on ads alone.
Younger women buy into branding. Branding is when you take products and turn them into a lifestyle. Remember in high school how only cool kids wore (insert popular brand here).
But here is the kicker....... the one thing older women do chase is... being younger. So if younger women are buying your products and it is seen as a "young" thing; older women
who want to be seen as young and hip will also buy your product. It is a win win for VS.

Vamp
03-29-2013, 09:21 AM
The thing i find interesting about this discussion across the internet.....

How many of the people who have said girls should or shouldnt wear this or that.... also think that what women wear isnt an excuse to rape them? How is it a different discussion?

Why does a woman's perceived worth or morality depend on what she wears at all?

Sophia_Starina
03-29-2013, 09:33 AM
Why does a woman's perceived worth or morality depend on what she wears at all?

We live in a superficial society.

Vamp
03-29-2013, 09:43 AM
We live in a superficial society.

It is beyond just being superficial.

When society says what a woman wears determines her worth or morality; what it is really saying is.... It doesnt matter what your actions are.
It is a way to dehumanize women and turn them into objects.

Women need to own the fact it doesnt matter what they wear, in all situations. That is how society changes.

GlamourRouge
03-29-2013, 10:07 AM
Why? I feel like my femininity is powerful.

Its literally the most powerful thing EVER. That's what makes it so awesome. And think about it. Sex symbols are iconic and looked up to by men, women, and children decades after death! Marilyn Monroe anyone? I've personally always been a Jayne Mansfield fan, and to this day I find her femininity stronger than any other any other character/person I've come across. Probably because she oozed sexual energy, was so motherly, and so girly (her love of hearts and the color pink).

On the other hand, I also find that androgyny is just as powerful due to shock value and intrigue. But at the end of the day, the most powerful thing in the world will always be femininity because its the only thing that gains control over a patriarchal society. I find it no coincidence that the less sexuality is seen as taboo for women, the less patriarchal our society becomes. And that's awesome.



Oh, and btw folks, slut-shaming comes from one's inner issues with the feminine.

I agree. If someone else has a problem with how I dress or whatever I do for that matter, its due to an issue THEY HAVE with themselves. An insecurity. Because... why the fuck would you care about someone else you supposedly dislike or don't even care about in the first place? lol

I also notice its usually WOMEN who have a problem with how women dress. Men don't give a shit. Its insecure women.



We live in a superficial society.

I don't understand why people even try to argue this fact. Its a fact. Without it, there would be no sex. There would be no reproduction. Men ideally want to fuck who they are attracted to. Women too. Attraction just is. I don't know why we try to fight it so hard. Anyone can be "attractive" if they work hard to get in shape and have good style.

Sophia_Starina
03-29-2013, 01:10 PM
It is beyond just being superficial.

When society says what a woman wears determines her worth or morality; what it is really saying is.... It doesnt matter what your actions are.
It is a way to dehumanize women and turn them into objects.

Women need to own the fact it doesnt matter what they wear, in all situations. That is how society changes.


I'm not arguing with you... but how many strippers do we know that will automatically gravitate towards the guy that walks into the club with a flashy watch and a nice suit?

The enlightened sorts will realize that the guy in the rumpled shirt could be the big spender of the night. The wealthiest customers are confident enough to wear whatever they feel like wearing... It's happened often enough that I've stopped judging customers based on their clothing (with the exception of guys wearing sweat pants... they can all go to Hell). LOL.

I agree 1000% that women are objectified and judged if they wear this and/or that. People are lazy. Judging a book by its cover is de rigueur. The sad truth is that if these notions are perpetuated by the self-righteous types (especially young women and peers) it's going to be very hard to change people's minds. It's an uphill battle. I say it with a great deal of disappointment but breaking established norms is difficult.

It would be nice if ladies could wrangle away the reins from narrow-minded individuals and regain control over their image regardless of the clothing they choose to wear. I hope one day that women will be able to escape the yoke of preconceived notions, generalizations, bias, and stereotypes. But it has been (and will be) a complicated path to progress.

Djoser
03-29-2013, 01:42 PM
Wow am I ever glad I didn't close this thread a little while back when it was getting heated--look what great things have come into play in the discussion! Some of the best posts I have read on SW in all my 11 years here.

As far as people being judged by what they wear, my pet peeve was always the women judging men by their shoes. I remember for a while growing up as a teenager, every Playboy Playmate would write in her 'profile' (possibly before the PB PR guys started just making shit up for them, but who knows?) "I judge a man by his shoes".

I always thought to myself 'WTF??' I would never in a zillion years judge a woman by her fucking shoes, that is just absurd. Of course we could talk about how I was judging the PB Playmate but that's for another post maybe haha.

Then you get into the car thing. As a man in his 20s I ran into that a lot, trust me! I didn't mind so much being judged by my motorcycles when I drove only those, but after I quit bikes (and was an artist and so couldn't afford a nice car) I thought it was the most shallow possible way to judge someone. Again, the very last thing in the world I give a fuck about when considering a woman is how she gets to work or the clubs.

It seems both sexes have a lot of shallow means of measuring a person's worth--and sexual potential--and apparently it starts at a very early age. And it's been that way since Egyptian girls wore little semi-transparent cotton outfits, I am sure.

Sophia_Starina
03-29-2013, 02:18 PM
Wow am I ever glad I didn't close this thread a little while back when it was getting heated--look what great things have come into play in the discussion! Some of the best posts I have read on SW in all my 11 years here.


You're welcome.

Hah! j/k


;)












I couldn't resist.

eagle2
03-29-2013, 11:29 PM
It was supposed to be inappropriately. There is no reason for a girl to dress slutty. Compare Debbie Gibson and Tiffany in the 80's to Britney Spears and Christina Aguilera and tell me which group is nicer dressed and also which group has more problems. Sure Debbie Gibson and Tiffany have faded for the most part but they didn't dress like sleaze. The other two do.

Debbie Gibson and Tiffany both posed nude in Playboy.

eagle2
03-29-2013, 11:32 PM
From what I remember, Whitney Houston always dressed nicely in the 80's.

Djoser
03-30-2013, 12:16 AM
You're welcome.

Hah! j/k


;)












I couldn't resist.

I was serious, and your post was included. Thanks!

Vamp
03-30-2013, 10:28 AM
I agree 1000% that women are objectified and judged if they wear this and/or that. People are lazy. Judging a book by its cover is de rigueur. The sad truth is that if these notions are perpetuated by the self-righteous types (especially young women and peers) it's going to be very hard to change people's minds. It's an uphill battle. I say it with a great deal of disappointment but breaking established norms is difficult.

It would be nice if ladies could wrangle away the reins from narrow-minded individuals and regain control over their image regardless of the clothing they choose to wear. I hope one day that women will be able to escape the yoke of preconceived notions, generalizations, bias, and stereotypes. But it has been (and will be) a complicated path to progress.

Im not arguing either... just discussing my thoughts....

It isnt just narrow minded people. We do it to ourselves too. As women we are our worst enemies now.
When we judge ourselves so harshly that our insecurities never die. When we judge other women harshly so their insecurities never die. When we are so insecure that it becomes easy to believe our only value is how we look. It is a vicious cycle.

Sophia_Starina
03-30-2013, 11:09 AM
Im not arguing either... just discussing my thoughts....

It isnt just narrow minded people. We do it to ourselves too. As women we are our worst enemies now.
When we judge ourselves so harshly that our insecurities never die. When we judge other women harshly so their insecurities never die. When we are so insecure that it becomes easy to believe our only value is how we look. It is a vicious cycle.

Truth!!!!! So true!

Kellydancer
03-30-2013, 12:33 PM
Debbie Gibson and Tiffany both posed nude in Playboy.

True but both were adults by then.