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rickdugan
10-30-2013, 11:15 AM
I certainly understand the various reasons why these types of surveillance exist, but IMHO it is a sad state of affairs when grown men feel obligated to watch other grown men in the backrooms of strip clubs. All good reasons notwithstanding, the thought of one of these goofballs monitoring my behavior irritates me enough to keep my out of the back rooms of a majority of clubs.

Fortunately for me, there are still enough strip clubs without cameras or bouncers in their backrooms that I still have the option of enjoying my time ITC in some of my travel cities. And in some of the clubs that do put someone in the back, a little grease will make him get lost for the duration of my experience.

I think that this is one of the things that drives me to tip for time as opposed to buying more dances/VIPs. It is too bad as, in some clubs, I'd like to have other ways to reward girls who have entertained me in one way or another, but I just become irritated when I see an eye in the sky or a dipshit ready and waiting to stare at me while I'm trying to enjoy my time with my dancer of choice. In a rare departure from the norm, I recently took a dancer back for LDs in a club in CT and there was a guy staring at us almost the entire time. I stopped after 2 and wished I hadn't bothered.

Anyway, it is what it is I suppose.

Aurora14
10-30-2013, 12:09 PM
In my club we aren't even allowed to have cell phones on the dancefloor. There are certain areas that customers, dancers, and employees are allowed to have the phone out. This is because the owner caught someone taking pictures one night. Confiscated the phone, and there were over 100 photos from multiple visits between our club and another local club. Pics are deleted, customer banned, rule made.

I know you arrange what you are going to do, but there are too many asshats that believe EVERY stripper wants to be finger banged in the back room and proceed to try and assault women. It's those guys that ruin it for the rest. While I agree it is unfortunate that this has to happen, it's all about protecting the girls. Some club owners really do care about our safety. Some have alternate motives. Perhaps it's an extras rampant club and they are trying to cut it back for legal reasons. Or they do it to catch the extras and fine the dancer to make more money. On my side, it makes me feel better to know that if someone goes too far that 5 bouncers will run in and carry them out.

I do understand how it ruins things on your side though. For something that can be an intimate or arousing situation, it's just weird to have a third party watching (unless you're into it). Perhaps when you are going to a club that you know has serveillance, you can go at a time that is a bit busier. I have customers that do this. Won't get a dance unless there are at least 5 other dances going on. That way, yes, you will be watched, but the bouncer has to divide his time between multiple people so his eye isn't constantly on you.

It's been said on the pink side that the SC industry is dying a slow death. The fact that clubs need to do things like this is just further proof.

AmyLynne
10-31-2013, 04:55 PM
for the most part the customer base has too many expectations and thinks we can all be fucked in the champagne room for nearly nothing! I predict in 10 years we wont even have a customer base or an industry! Too many assholes!

safado
10-31-2013, 05:49 PM
for the most part the customer base has too many expectations and thinks we can all be fucked in the champagne room for nearly nothing! I predict in 10 years we wont even have a customer base or an industry! Too many assholes! So if they offer enough money you are game?

rickdugan
11-01-2013, 06:48 AM
Aurora, my issue isn't about the faux intimacy aspect as much as it is about self dignity. Also, being perfectly honest, I may also have control issues with this as the thought of one of these clowns (no, i don't have much respect for most club bouncers) trying to micromanage what I do pisses me off as a matter of principle. Now most girls find me to be a very respectful customer who doesn't remotely push a girl's limits, but that is a function of communication between the dancer and I, not because another grown man is monitoring the situation.

I understand that many dancers are going to fall on the other side of this issue and they probably have good reasons for doing so. I'm just expressing one guy's view of the world. Perhaps I'm in the minority, but in all honesty most of my money stays in my pocket ITC when I see this stuff going on. :shrug:

AmyLynne
11-01-2013, 12:46 PM
So if they offer enough money you are game?

define enough money! very few customers have the money it would take to spend even a minute OTC with me!

AmyLynne
11-01-2013, 12:46 PM
So if they offer enough money you are game?

define enough money! very few customers have the money it would take to spend even a minute OTC with me!

Jamiexxx
11-02-2013, 09:13 AM
I'm grateful for the cameras. It does make me feel safer. I don't offer any kind of extras, not for a million dollars (I am serious), and if a guy held me down and shoved a finger up my vagina, I would consider it assault. Knowing it is being monitored and I'm not trapped in a room with a guy who can do whatever he wants with me is a good thing. I don't give a shit about how intimate or private the experience is for the customer.
Because here's the thing: Most of them gross me out, I want to give a lapdance with as little contact as possible and get my $$, that's it.

Aurora14
11-02-2013, 11:18 AM
While I agree with the dancer side of cameras are great (I love them), you have to see it from Rick's point of view also. He has been visiting the club longer than a lot of us have been dancers (Assuming from the posts). There was actually a time when men went to the clubs to be ENTERTAINED by a dancer. We are kind of on a cusp. Some customers are throwbacks from the good times, but as the values of society degrade, so does the customer quality. (In all fairness, the same could be said about dancer quality) It has been the transition of men that view clubs as brothels that has brought this on. Men that don't try to assault women are having to deal with increased security even though they didn't do anything wrong.

They pay for privacy that the backroom offers, but actually get less than they used to. People don't want to be watched in a "private" room. It can been seen as money down the drain from a customer perspective. In a way, this thread is making me see another reason why so many men ask for OTC...

oldster
11-02-2013, 04:15 PM
I'm grateful for the cameras. It does make me feel safer. I don't offer any kind of extras, not for a million dollars (I am serious), and if a guy held me down and shoved a finger up my vagina, I would consider it assault. Knowing it is being monitored and I'm not trapped in a room with a guy who can do whatever he wants with me is a good thing. I don't give a shit about how intimate or private the experience is for the customer.
Because here's the thing: Most of them gross me out, I want to give a lapdance with as little contact as possible and get my $$, that's it.


jeezus jamie, anyone who would not consider that assault is a sub human.

I do not like being watched even though I am well behaved. I am a guy, I like to touch a beautiful woman, but only under her terms.

I know she needs protection from the real assholes, so whatever needs to be is

simone87
11-02-2013, 04:30 PM
the cameras freak me out too. because the managers are much more concerned with making sure i keep my shoes on or don't sit on their laps than with what the customers are doing. i don't offer extras but i have this thing where i hate being on film or having my picture taken by other people, and it also drives the guys off. if i need a bouncer, ill call for one

Jamiexxx
11-02-2013, 05:35 PM
The thing is, I don't know if a guy is nice and well behaved or a grabby asshole. I've had customers who were being perfect gentlemen on the floor, as soon as I closed that curtain and started dancing they tried to finger my ass.
It's like having a one night stand and not using protection, because some people don't have STD's. Yeah, but some do and you never know.

The Woman King
11-04-2013, 10:44 PM
Being filmed is much more preferable to me than being watched because it feels less invasive in the moment, even though it's not. The camera is not a distraction for me in the slightest and I often have to remind myself that my actions are being monitored by the all-seeing eye. I think it's a great way to keep everybody in check- dancers and customers alike.

By comparison, the grumpy-looking man perched on the bar stool eight feet away from me who has his eyes trained on my every movement is very, very distracting.

Then again, if I was in your position I might feel differently about the cameras because I would have more to lose if that footage somehow made its way onto the internet or fell into the wrong hands. I think that would be my primary (albeit irrational) concern if I was married and cheating on my wife. I don't think the solution is no oversight whatsoever though. Even the cleanest strip club would become a brothel and a drug den overnight if there was no monitoring system in place... which would be great for you, but not so good for me.

AmyLynne
11-18-2013, 05:52 PM
I dont like working when cameras are on me.. I'd be so out the door if I found out I was being filmed or my customers were. It's a violation of their privacy.

rickdugan
11-29-2013, 08:31 AM
Would that be better for you, OP?

No. In situations like that, I usually stroke the monkey (er, I mean "gentleman" ;) ) a little extra to get lost. 8 times out of 10 it works. When it does not, I may still go through with the VIP, especially if I pre-paid, but the likelihood that I'll be reaching deep into my pocket to tip anyone heavily afterwards is low.

Moff
12-01-2013, 05:46 PM
A CI DV booth has more privacy than a SEA DV VIP room costing 5 times more. If she says, 'Let's go back here, it's more private' and chooses a specific booth, things look good. No point tipping anyone before that. And after that, she'll tip the bouncer. You don't have to.

rickdugan
12-02-2013, 11:26 AM
Rick- Is that because, lets be honest, you usually go in wanting extra curricular activities that could be of a more personal nature? I understand that you may not want someone to watch that, but I was under the impression you were talking about dances.
I would personally be horrified if my gentleman monkey wandered off thanks to a tip. Honestly, Id be fuming. I pay the club 40% of my earnings specifically so that I am safe and looked after. If I didnt want to be watched I'd do private parties, not work in the club. And since you'd never notice you were being checked on anyway, what does it matter?

Gypsy, of course I'll know that he's there peeking in and, frankly, even if I happened not to spot him do it, the concept of it is irritating on its face. If a dancer needs to have another man monitoring me in order to feel safe dancing for me then I'm on to the next one. Now that is not to say that he shouldn't be close enough to hear if she gets in trouble, but to actually have him sitting there and watching me is just intolerable from my perspective.

Tipping the monkeys has generally been an effective way for me to deal with this. It only went kinda' bad on me once, when a girl got so messed up when she saw that the bouncer was nowhere to be seen that she not only stopped halfway through the first dance, but mumbled some comment about not wanting to rip me off because she doesn't get nude (I never asked her to, though it was supposed to be a nude LD area), and by way of apology actually tried to refund me the tip to the bouncer! LOL. Of course I told her to keep it and even paid her for the dance, but there it is.

I understand how you feel about this, but I guess for me it is just an issue of strong personal preference.

Djoser
12-22-2013, 05:41 PM
I'm grateful for the cameras. It does make me feel safer. I don't offer any kind of extras, not for a million dollars (I am serious), and if a guy held me down and shoved a finger up my vagina, I would consider it assault.

God help the guy that tries that shit on one of the women I work with.

I understand where you are coming from Rick, but not only is it a kind of protection for the women, it's also good for keeping the dancers in line in the clean clubs. Especially if--as in the case of Key West--you have a nearby city (in this case Miami) where extras are being freely offered in most of the clubs. There are a lot of women who think nothing of it, which morally doesn't bother me, but it definitely makes it WAY harder on the other women in the club if it gets out of hand. And it also leads to situations where the drunk pushy assholes who expect to be able to finger the girls or whatever will then force the issue.

I have had to watch cameras in two clubs, even though I am a DJ and only a bouncer in emergencies. In one club because the dancers were impossible to track down for stage without the fucking cameras lol, and we were supposed to skip them when they were in the VIP/Champagne Rooms. But in that club maybe 2% of the girls would tell you when they were going up. And I mean literally 2%. So without the cameras, we'd be playing their songs & calling their names & they are NOT going to show up, and guess who gets in trouble then? Of course, that club really did kind of suck to work in lol.

Then in another club I have had to watch the cameras because it was part of the DJs' job there. I didn't like it, but I liked the job so I did it.

Golden_Rule
01-26-2014, 02:35 PM
While I agree it is unfortunate that this has to happen, it's all about protecting the girls.

Aurora I write this only because 1) I absolutely know what I am talking about here and 2) dancers ought to know what I am about to impart:

As a former bouncer, ass't club manager, police detective, former private party promoter and last but not least, current private investigation firm owner, I can tell you one thing... who's getting protected is who's paying the bill.

If a dancer gets protected by a bouncer the club is paying it is circumstantial. Never presume the bouncer is there to protect you first. It could get you in harms way. The bouncer is there to protect the club's, who pays his salary, interests first and foremost. You are an afterthought. If a situation comes down to you or the club, the club wins and you're screwed: always.

It's harsh, but it is true.

Golden_Rule
01-26-2014, 02:46 PM
Aurora, my issue isn't about the faux intimacy aspect as much as it is about self dignity. Also, being perfectly honest, I may also have control issues with this as the thought of one of these clowns (no, i don't have much respect for most club bouncers) trying to micromanage what I do pisses me off as a matter of principle. Now most girls find me to be a very respectful customer who doesn't remotely push a girl's limits, but that is a function of communication between the dancer and I, not because another grown man is monitoring the situation.

I understand that many dancers are going to fall on the other side of this issue and they probably have good reasons for doing so. I'm just expressing one guy's view of the world. Perhaps I'm in the minority, but in all honesty most of my money stays in my pocket ITC when I see this stuff going on. :shrug:

Rick, if the guy has his hand out I totally agree with you as there are many bouncers in extras clubs that get up in your face to make it clear they need a tip to 'take a break'.

However, most legit bouncers aren't trying to micromanage your goings on. They are just doing a job they have been given specific criteria to work with in doing. A liquor license is worth 10's of thousands of dollars in most areas. In big cities you are talking as much as a quarter million dollar asset that can be taken away in a heartbeat and needs to be protected.

How much "micromanaging" of a customer's intentions would you ask your bouncers to do if you had a $1/4M asset that could go away with the swipe of an ABC investigator's pen?

The legit club owner could give a damn about what you are doing with the dancer at his club other than ONE very important thing... He needs his various licensing: alcohol, certificate of occupancy, etc and so forth, to conduct his business and what you and the dancer might be up to are a potential threat to his ability to make $$$$$.

The bouncer is his first line of defense against the poorly intentioned to make sure no one fucks up his ability to continue to make a buck. [given that though I have no idea why they hire 'roid heads with limited skills who wind up fighting and causing more trouble than they solve... I always managed to at least get it outside, but 99.99% of the time I solved the problem with my brain, not my hands].

OrangeCountyCalifornia
04-07-2014, 04:46 PM
The Library in Westminster, Orange County, California is a perfect example of a club I would never return to again. It's a very nice club and they have pretty and attractive dancers, but that's it. All for looking only. They have "private" back rooms, but there's a bouncer(s) peering into the monitor. And they don't allow non-sexual touching of any kind, even touching of hands is forbidden. I briefly touched a dancer's hands and this asshat bouncer ruins the experience for me by coming up to me and telling me I can't do that. At least the dancer was pretty and friendly, but that in itself was a very tiny consolation.

The no-touching rules are either the club's rules or a city ordinance (or both). I was there only once and that's going to be it for me.

kirakonstantin
05-26-2014, 01:30 AM
For those who object to monitoring in private dance areas, I would like to make two points.

First, consider this from a dancers perspective. I am meeting, propositioning and engaging in erotic dancing, often within minutes of meeting said customer. I don't know him, whether he's actually a nice person, whether he has a criminal record or a history of sexual violence, whether he has mental health or drug issues that would cause him to be unstable or a litany of other issues that could put me at risk. In the real world, before I'm alone with someone in a potentially sexual situation, I've known him for at least a month, I know his full name, where he works, where he lives, who he associates with. We've discussed STD's and been tested, if necessary. I have a basic knowledge of the person that I've chosen to be alone with. Obviously, I can't take the time to do this ITC, so to mitigate the potential risk, there are cameras installed and bouncers posted.

This is also for your protection. How well do you know the dancer you're taking into a private room? Truth be told, custys know virtually nothing and what little they do know may or may not be true. What's to stop her from threatening to cook up a story about how you tried to sexually assault her, unless you give her a generous tip? Or, if she agrees to extras and gets caught, tries to paint it as rape? Or tries to pocket your valuables? Or tries to claim that shes high because you spiked her drink? Or flips out and assaults you?

From the clubs perspective... they have the most potential liability and the most to lose. They also have the most unknowns. They don't know the customer or the dancer. There is no application process to be a customer. You show your id and pay your cover. In many clubs, there's not much of an application process to dance. In my club, there's a short application, they check id and that's it. They have no idea whether the dancer has a criminal record, drug problem, mental illness, etc.

However, if there's drug dealing, prostitution etc going on in VIP and there's a raid, the club stands to lose it's license, the management could face arrest and prosecution. It also protects the club from fraudulent accident claims, assault claims, accusations or criminal activity, all of which the club could be held liable for. It's not cheap to open a club and owners are very interested in protecting their investment. Managers have a vested interest in protecting their freedom. Are you willing to trust your freedom or your million dollar investment to the judgement of two intoxicated people that you barely know? I'm certainly not.

And, really, most businesses have video surveillance, from the grocery store, the gas station, movie theaters, restaurants, etc and few would complain. I get that this is a business of a sexual nature, but it's still a business that has a need and a right to ensure the saftey of it's workers and it's assets.

OrangeCountyCalifornia
05-29-2014, 12:24 PM
For those who object to monitoring in private dance areas, I would like to make two points.

This is also for your protection. How well do you know the dancer you're taking into a private room? Truth be told, custys know virtually nothing and what little they do know may or may not be true. What's to stop her from threatening to cook up a story about how you tried to sexually assault her, unless you give her a generous tip? Or, if she agrees to extras and gets caught, tries to paint it as rape? Or tries to pocket your valuables? Or tries to claim that shes high because you spiked her drink? Or flips out and assaults you?

Thanks for your comments. After reading what you wrote, I may think twice before the next time I go into a private room that doesn't have adequate monitoring measures. There was a club in the southeastern part of Phoenix called A Class Act (since closed down) that I used to frequent in 1996-2000. They had private rooms that didn't have anybody monitoring them. Although I did not experience what you described, the thought that I could have causes me to have second thoughts before going to such clubs again.

OrangeCountyCalifornia
05-29-2014, 12:34 PM
I'd like to add at the same club, now that I think of it, there was once instance when after I had a private show in an unmonitored room, the dancer I thought was joking told me if I didn't give her a generous tip, she would chase me out of the club whacking me on the head with her high heel. I didn't think of anything over what she said and I was going to give her a generous tip anyway even before her "threat." She was happy with the tip by giving me a hug and kiss and that was it, but now I start to wonder if she wasn't kidding.

kirakonstantin
05-29-2014, 01:45 PM
I'd like to add at the same club, now that I think of it, there was once instance when after I had a private show in an unmonitored room, the dancer I thought was joking told me if I didn't give her a generous tip, she would chase me out of the club whacking me on the head with her high heel. I didn't think of anything over what she said and I was going to give her a generous tip anyway even before her "threat." She was happy with the tip by giving me a hug and kiss and that was it, but now I start to wonder if she wasn't kidding.

Situations like this really make you wonder, don't they? I'm not a fan of having a bouncer as the means of surveillance, as they are human, they can be bribed, they can be fallible, etc. Video cameras are quite unobtrusive, they can't be bribed into showing something that didn't really happen.

A situation involving a semi regular of mine is a good case in point. He came in, saw I wasn't working and got a couple of dances from another girl. She tried to charge him more than the club rate, without telling him beforehand that she charged more. He refused to pay the extra and paid her the standard rate for a table dance. She ran to club management and lied about how much she was paid. A quick trip to the office to review the footage showed that he paid her the going rate for dances and she was asked to leave. Now, had there not been footage, perhaps management would have believed her and banned a perfectly good, honest customer, simply because a dancer thought she could get away with lying.

I can also point to the cameras if a customer tries to go too far and let them know that someone is watching, so please stop trying to assault me. It usually calms them down long enough for me to finish the song, get paid and get the hell out of there.

threlayer
05-29-2014, 01:48 PM
After a while in clubs that have cameras and fairly strict rules, I came upon the idea of finding an out-of-the-limelight table and paying the $20 (fee for 'VIP' room as they call it here) to a dancer I like and am familiar with. She gains by keeping the whole fee, while I do not lose activity possibilities is a strict club. In fact I get more than the 3 minutes (or the song). And I am not monitored/recorded in any kind of detail. Works for me in such a club.

I've been in clubs years ago with no monitoring except by the room supv. and I've done several fun things (and have described many of them here) that would be illegal under local laws in such clubs. The clubs I've gone to in recent years, except one, have monitoring. I don't know how the rules are enforced any more but the monitoring turns me off. I'm for privacy when it comes to eroticism.

If there is a camera is present, to me it is worse if the activities are recorded, rather than just occasionally glanced at. What a tedious job it would be to actively monitor room activity by camera the whole working night. Worse yet would be to review the tape later, each night, each room, each dance.

Cheo_D
05-29-2014, 08:51 PM
If there is a camera is present, to me it is worse if the activities are recorded, rather than just occasionally glanced at. What a tedious job it would be to actively monitor room activity by camera the whole working night. Worse yet would be to review the tape later, each night, each room, each dance.
I dunno if that latter part is really so often the case. ISTM the more frequent practice would be to have the tape be kept around for a determined time but only actually reviewed if there is an allegation or any cause to suspect that something went on that was not right; or if it's obvious something DID happen, to find out who was at fault. And maybe the ocassional random sampling for general quality control and to keep people on their toes.

yoda57us
05-29-2014, 09:30 PM
If it's a newer system there is no "tape". Everything is on a digital hard drive nowadays and the size of the drive (determined by price of course) will determine how much gets recorded and how long it is saved for. Recording in VIP rooms is intended primarily as protection-for the club first and the dancers and staff second. If there is an incident the video can be reviewd that night or the next day. Quite often the drives will be reformated and recorded over on a cycle of a few days or maybe a week-again, it depends on how much the owners want to spend on hard drives.

I've had this conversation with a few club managers, bartenders, house mothers and dancers and it's pretty unusual for the club to waste time paying a staff member to monitor CR's cameras in real time. What IS much more likely is that the manager or assistant manager will be spending a lot of time watching the cameras that are pointed at every single cash register in the club. The dressing room will also have at least one camera in it as well.

On the whole management is much more concerned about cash loses at point of sale locations and theft and drugs in the DR than they are with dirty dancing in the CR.

threlayer
05-30-2014, 05:51 AM
I'm out of date for sure, but the effect is much the same on us. Twice we were caught at some minor infraction by live camera I knew about. To me and the dancer it was harmless, though not innocent, private fun with no LE around to see.

When I am at a club, I don't usually pay attention to the level of technology used. I do that when I am working.

i fully agree that dancers need security, especially when the 'curtains are closed.' Dancers I've been with then knew they had no threat at all from me. It was the club's caution and paranoia.

Dominic.2
12-17-2015, 06:18 PM
I can see what the OP is saying. I don't get out to large clubs in large cities but for those I was under the impression that those rooms might use a female chaperone (i.e., the waitress, which you tip $20 to grease) versus the male counterpart (bouncer). I understand and can appreciate not having some dude watching, since what man wants another man there? I get it.

My experience:

I had a conversation with a dancer and let her know up front my earlier experience with a bouncer (small interruption), she sided with me that I wasn't I in the wrong and it didn't make any sense to her, unless the earlier dancer had called him over to intervene. This dancer let it be known to me that the BOUNCERS WORK FOR the DANCERS and that she will handle him. And she did. For most of the night, the bouncer had his back towards me or wasn't there (except for the few times another customer was back there too).

I guess much like customers can control their space, she can control her space. Bravo.

Plus I am pretty harmless. It wasn't like I was going to try anything. I think that is pretty well established.

Come to think of it, that might have also been why we couldn't seem to get the waitress to come over with drinks on a timely basis (https://www.stripperweb.com/forum/showthread.php?205607-A-little-too-much-fun-with-drinks) either. ;)

Tourdefranzia
01-13-2016, 10:57 AM
In Oregon, it's the law. Mostly, the clubs have the cameras there to cover their own asses in case of a bust. Usually the bouncers don't care what happens, they care about getting their club shut down due to illegal activity.

This also works for civil law suits. Should a customer spend way too much money and try to get his money back, the club has a record of his time in the club and can show the time stamp on the video footage to justify the fees and credit card charges.

rickdugan
01-15-2016, 07:50 PM
In Oregon, it's the law. Mostly, the clubs have the cameras there to cover their own asses in case of a bust. Usually the bouncers don't care what happens, they care about getting their club shut down due to illegal activity.

This also works for civil law suits. Should a customer spend way too much money and try to get his money back, the club has a record of his time in the club and can show the time stamp on the video footage to justify the fees and credit card charges.

Yet another good reason to avoid the back rooms in Portland clubs. ;)

miss.a.p1600
01-15-2016, 10:27 PM
Well this topic is similar to another thread here about surveillance and privacy. There was a thread where Melonie mentioned the strip club is not really private and no one has any real privacy. Not even in the 'private' rooms.

If you expect true privacy - avoid the strip club.

Dominic.2
01-15-2016, 10:37 PM
^ I’ve been desensitized to surveillance or being escorted in security areas via my vanilla computer jobs. So, I don’t really care if I’m being watched in person or on camera. It ceased bothering me a long time ago. So true privacy is not an expectation I have. Your post makes a lot of sense.

miss.a.p1600
01-15-2016, 10:46 PM
I know right! Now that I know the club has cameras in the 'private' rooms, I just assume Im under surveillance wherever I go in the club. I don't know where all the cameras are but I know where most of them are.

And If its not the cameras and whoever is behind the cameras looking and watching you - its the other dancers/bouncer/manager/etc. surveilling you, looking and staring with their big beady eyes.

I do wonder if the surveillance is video only or do the have audio listening devices. I can't imagine audio being able to pick up anything people are saying given the music is thumping loudly.

miss.a.p1600
01-16-2016, 10:03 AM
Do you guys and gals think it makes a difference and the club should inform everyone they're being recorded?

The club here has signs the parking lot is under surveillance but I don't recall seeing any signs that the main floor, private rooms, or dressing rooms are being recorded.

Tourdefranzia
01-19-2016, 12:40 PM
Yet another good reason to avoid the back rooms in Portland clubs. ;)

Indeed. If you are there to break the law, then I can understand why you would have issues with cameras.

This makes you a smart criminal and not likely to get caught. Thank you for being honest, as I would hate to get caught up in some kind of illegal activity.

miss.a.p1600
01-19-2016, 01:20 PM
Indeed. If you are there to break the law, then I can understand why you would have issues with cameras.

This makes you a smart criminal and not likely to get caught. Thank you for being honest, as I would hate to get caught up in some kind of illegal activity.

I could be wrong but rickdugan doesn't strike me as a jail bird. He don't want that footage to somehow land in the hands of his wife. He's more scared of her than going to jail lol! A woman scorned ain't gonna be a pretty site.

Dominic.2
01-19-2016, 06:05 PM
Do you guys and gals think it makes a difference and the club should inform everyone they're being recorded?

No. Because despite the video equipment and digital recorders being there, I at least tend to think of that footage as my/our ace-in-the-hole. I want to be able to know that it's there for protection (either mine, or the dancers', of the club, I guess.). If I'm robbed, or a dancer drugs me, etc. That's what I want to footage to be used for. I don't feel like I need to give explicit consent for that. It's more of a last resort thing.

I would be worried that seeing notices that I am being recorded could mean that I am tacitly giving consent for who knows that reason over the video footage. Maybe I am jaded over the whole social media "we can (re-)sell your personal information we have at any time." I am not looking forward to the day a strip club can do that.

Now in some cases, knowing that the video footage is there is a nice bit of protection. I dancer left her cash with me when she went on break and later on the stage. She didn't accuse me of taking any money, but if she had, it would be nice to know there is video footage (possibly) to prove my side of the story.

I would not be thrilled about audio recording though. I can't see the upside to consenting to be audio recorded. Like you, I see the technical limitations would be a hurdle in such an environment. I really don't see the upside.

I would be worried that some of my actions may technically be against the law just because Ohio is very restrictive of what sex businesses can do. I would not be thrilled if local vice squad can get a court order to review footage that might include me. That sounds like a fishing expedition.

You bring up a good point about wives. I am sure my wife, although understanding of what I do, might have find it emotionally difficult to watch footage of me in the club with a dancer. It's one thing to have some awareness of what might be going on. It's entirely another to have her nose rubbed in it or have her dignity taken from her over it. Right now, she says, or at least she feels like she believes, that she is OK with me going to the club to see dancers. It's hard to predict how she might act when the action become real to her.



Footnote: She has a sort of bad memory of strip clubs. I'm her second husband. Her first husband 1. starting going to strip clubs, 2. started doing drugs, 3. starting f*cking at least one dancer (unclear if he paid or not), then eventually the marriage ended, and 4. he later married the dancer and they moved in together and had a child together .. which Facebook was kind enough to show her one day with "people you might also know." They live in a trailer home in Ohio together, BTW.

I amazed she's even OK with me going given the history. The first time I came home in September with dancer body spray/perfume on me, you know what they say about scent being powerful for memories? It brought back a float of negative memories about her ex. On an intellectual and rational level, she's OK with the SC idea. But on an emotional level, it can be hard for her to cope sometimes. I think video footage, if out there and shown to her, might elicit the same emotional response from her.

RiotGrrlTease
01-25-2016, 10:53 AM
Agreed. While video may have some positives to it, the negative aspects seem to outweigh these. Cameras creep me out, and I really couldn't imagine how my significant other would feel if he viewed footage of my dances... Or if footage did leak from the club and a future employer came across it. I'd be livid!

miss.a.p1600
01-25-2016, 05:14 PM
^^^you can say that again! For the longest time Melonie and her talk of google glass freaked me out and I would not approach dudes with glasses thinking they could be covertly recording my face and everything. And I get pissed when I see guys trying to slick record on their camera phones.

rickdugan
01-26-2016, 04:16 AM
Indeed. If you are there to break the law, then I can understand why you would have issues with cameras.

This makes you a smart criminal and not likely to get caught. Thank you for being honest, as I would hate to get caught up in some kind of illegal activity.


I could be wrong but rickdugan doesn't strike me as a jail bird. He don't want that footage to somehow land in the hands of his wife. He's more scared of her than going to jail lol! A woman scorned ain't gonna be a pretty site.

Every girl who has ever escorted breaks the law. For that matter, most high contact LDs are violating some state laws and/or local ordinances as well. So perhaps we should leave the Law and Order blurb for the dipshit club customer who starts asking about what he can get in the back or expresses disappointment when you tell him to put it away during the dance. ;)

My issues are twofold: (1) I get irked at the notion of being watched by other grown men (as I laid out early on in this thread) and (2) I don't want whatever I do (illegal or otherwise) to be stored in perpetuity by some scum bag club owner.

miss.a.p1600
01-26-2016, 08:24 AM
Every girl who has ever escorted breaks the law. For that matter, most high contact LDs are violating some state laws and/or local ordinances as well. So perhaps we should leave the Law and Order blurb for the dipshit club customer who starts asking about what he can get in the back or expresses disappointment when you tell him to put it away during the dance. ;)

My issues are twofold: (1) I get irked at the notion of being watched by other grown men (as I laid out early on in this thread) and (2) I don't want whatever I do (illegal or otherwise) to be stored in perpetuity by some scum bag club owner.

Law and order?!? Don't let the ball rubbers fool you, not everyone gets down like that. To each her own though no judgement here. I still have respect for the girls who are escorts because they share their body intimately with many guys and their job is not easy because there are a lot of entitled disrespectful dipshits. I personally don't dance for dipshit type customers. And I signed up for dancing only and that's all these dudes will get, nothing illegal here.


I don't understand though. Are you saying your fear is of a gay man watching your image on film? You're not even doing anything interesting or sexual according to you so that would probably be the worst gay porn film in history.


Why would anyone waste resources to store your club activities on film unless they were going to actually do something with said stored footage like turn it in to law enforcement or show it to your significant other for revenge or something?

Tourdefranzia
01-26-2016, 11:46 AM
Every girl who has ever escorted breaks the law.

Escorting isn't illegal. Having sex with a consenting adult isn't illegal. Getting PAID/ PAYING FOR sex is illegal. The sex is free, I've never charged anyone for sex. It is 100% up front that I do not sell sex. You'll never get me to say how much I charge for ________, because I don't sell sex. Besides, the men I see have way, way more to lose should something come out about our activity.


My issues are twofold: (1) I get irked at the notion of being watched by other grown men (as I laid out early on in this thread) and (2) I don't want whatever I do (illegal or otherwise) to be stored in perpetuity by some scum bag club owner.

I get it. You can't get over your neurosis long enough to enjoy a dance in a club that has less-than-totally-private dances. Trust me, you aren't that important in the eyes of the club owner. The club owner doesn't know who you are. Even if you are part of Obama's Secret Service Detail, the club owner doesn't know this and doesn't care. He cares about how much money he's making off of your business. Pretty much everyone on the planet is more hung up on themselves than what other people are doing. No one is thinking about you. Ever. Get over it.

And to be perfectly clear, I have no issue breaking laws I find stupid. I just like to be the one who decides my law breaking activity. I don't want to be an unwilling accomplice in any circumstance. I like to know where the line is, when I've crossed it and by how much. It's stupid people who don't know where the line is who always get caught.

Gia2608
01-26-2016, 12:15 PM
I agree with Rick that I do not like being monitored. The whole 1984/ Big Brother shit, I feel like it violates my rights. In fact, I am probably being monitored right now. Fuck you NSA!!! However, in theory it is not you the customer they are trying to watch but the dancer's safety. They are supposed to be also watching out for illegal drug use. Sexual things aside, as a club owner you risk losing everything is someone is caught using drugs or buying and selling them on your property. However, that being said it was a well known fact at a club I used to work at (if you were in the inner circle of vets/friends with the managers) that the owner's brother used to go over to the owner;s house to watch the cc security at the clubs. That is just disturbing! This is also the reason I would never, ever work at a club where they have live feeds for the stage (or worse, the dressing room!).

22lligm
01-26-2016, 03:32 PM
If I saw a customer tip the bouncer to leave before I gave him a dance I would see him as a creep and give him an air dance. If you don't want anyone to see what you're doing then hire an escort and take it to a hotel room where you have all the freedom to break laws in privacy. The cameras are there for the club's safety and nobody gets off on watching customers receive a lap dance. And like tour said you are just a random customer to the club.. fortunately you aren't important enough to be recorded and have the footage stored in some secret vault somewhere lol. Stick to the rules of the club or don't get any lap dances I'm sure they have enough customers who are okay with the lack of privacy.

Gia2608
01-26-2016, 04:55 PM
I think the ramifications for drug sales and use are far worse than if an individual dancer or customer solicits/ engages in prostitution. At least in the county where I live anyway. I can't speak for anyone else but drug charges can be tried federally where prostitution is only treated this way in cases of trafficking.

I am speaking about one particular club and yes I am sure they were watching the women. Or maybe they were closet gays, who knows. All I know is it is 100% true, we know a few of the owner's friends pretty well at the time.

Gia2608
01-26-2016, 04:58 PM
Do you guys and gals think it makes a difference and the club should inform everyone they're being recorded?

The club here has signs the parking lot is under surveillance but I don't recall seeing any signs that the main floor, private rooms, or dressing rooms are being recorded.

In many places it is the law to inform someone they are being recorded, but I am not sure if this only applies to audio taping and admissibility as evidence; not sure how much so for "surveillance" purposes.

Dominic.2
01-26-2016, 05:39 PM
^I think the parking lot signs are just to be proactive to deter the theft from happening. I don't really want to lose a passenger side window just because some crackhead wants to fence stuff he finds in my car, even if the footage ultimately nabs him or her.

Plus in the lot, you might get some people out in public so it would be polite to inform them of the video "monitoring". That's my two cents.

For me, I'd made peace with the bouncers, video cameras, the dancers, and myself. I was never really out there to cop a feel, it happened, I felt bad, and made a post about it. That's one of the reasons why I stayed here. It's really been eye opening to see how all of the touching ITC has affected the personal lives of some of the dancers. I suspected it was the case but I didn't understand the full extent (like wednesday, but I hate to single her out, because she was nice to me when I arrived here, I'm grateful for her feedback). Maybe ethical treatment of dancers can be a thing now? That and I don't see myself returning to a back room any time soon. I rather the $$ go to the dancer via tips on the floor instead of club getting a big cut, and for doing what? Going to some "some scum bag club owner" as rick called them? No thanks. I think rooms are a bad deal. The less the owner gets the better. :D



ETA:

When I starting going back to the clubs, I asked the baby stripper who one suited guy walking back and forth was (bouncer or manager). She said bouncer. I asked her, is any customer supposed to tip him (it was a serious question, since like everyone has his or her hand out for tip these days)? She said "I don't see what good it would do." Now that I think about this discussion some more, maybe I caused my own problem by even (innocently) asking that. Like 22lligm, maybe she took it the wrong way? I dunno.

rickdugan
01-26-2016, 07:54 PM
I knew going in that my position would not be popular with the ladies who need the camera and/or hovering bouncers in order to feel safe. I guess I just happen to interact best with ladies who don't need those supports (and I m not talking about so-called extras girls per se) and that's fine. I'm not going to criticize those who do need the added comfort as I don't have to deal with the issues that you do.

But all arguments notwithstanding, I'll continue to say no thanks to cameras. I've met too many scumbag owners and dipshit managers/bouncers in my visits to 200+ clubs in the last 15 years to buy the notion that they are all seasoned pros who never find amusement in something that they see in a room. Equally important though, and perhaps even more so, is that stored data lasts forever and I don't trust club "management" to properly secure and destroy the data in a timely manner.