View Full Version : how to make it clear I just want to be friends?
Doc Holliday
03-11-2014, 07:19 PM
OK, I read everything again. Yeah, the underlying problem is the leap from being basically acquaintances for three years without him making the slightest signal he was interested in you... to jumping to a date to Spain! It would have been different had you flirted at NYE and he made a move then.
That's really the guy's problem, he's known you all this time and his big move was a trip to Spain and not at kiss a NY's.
Doc Holliday
03-11-2014, 07:24 PM
As far as where to go from here, be cordial but do not be nice. He'll mistaken that for interest. Be honest with your friends. Find a way to make it up to him later on when the dust settles. And last, for fucks sakes, you're a 24 yo LA girl in London, date a bunch of limeys who'll think you're the greatest thing ever and get over your ex :P.
Djoser
03-11-2014, 07:25 PM
Wow. It saddens me that you are apparently so fixated on fucking women that you are completely unable to form friendships with them. You know, we make up 50% of the human population and we're good for more than just sex and dating!
I get what you are saying, but from the sounds of it you are crazy to even think of going on a trip with this guy.
If a guy has told people he has a crush on you, and then asks you to take a trip to Spain or wherever, he isn't doing it to just be your friend. And if you are also attracted to him it's playing with fire.
There are a few guys I would trust to hang around with an SO & not try shit, but by far most guys wanting to hang around with a good looking women are definitely not being altruistic. Of course, if you really trust a woman it doesn't matter whom she hangs out with--but only women who crave attention hang out with these types of guys, after they figure out the guy is pretending to be friends just to try to get some.
Not saying you are this type, or that your friend is that craven (the guys who do this with attached women are usually a lot more devious/manipulative)--just saying it sounds like a really bad idea.
audrey_k
03-11-2014, 07:49 PM
OK, I read everything again. Yeah, the underlying problem is the leap from being basically acquaintances for three years without him making the slightest signal he was interested in you... to jumping to a date to Spain! It would have been different had you flirted at NYE and he made a move then.
That's really the guy's problem, he's known you all this time and his big move was a trip to Spain and not at kiss a NY's.
I agree, the reasoning was strange and certainly flawed... and it's odd as well because he had a such a perfect opportunity to make a move on NYE! I remember he sat with me on a balcony while I was smoking for like 25 minutes, why he didn't try to kiss me then I don't know. I mean I assumed at the time it was because of the Jewish/Catholic thing and that I was a no-no, because we were definitely flirting that evening... but I flirt with everyone, I mean one of my exs stormed out of the Apple store a year ago because he said I was "excessively flirting with the Apple store guy" when I was buying a computer and I wasn't even interested in him in the slightest..
I'm definitely going to give him lots and lots of space... I'm in no rush to talk to him again!
I am now thinking over all my failed attempts to be friends with exs though and wondering how I could have been so blind to think this trip could work.
gocanucks
03-12-2014, 06:29 AM
I agree, the reasoning was strange and certainly flawed... and it's odd as well because he had a such a perfect opportunity to make a move on NYE! I remember he sat with me on a balcony while I was smoking for like 25 minutes, why he didn't try to kiss me then I don't know. I mean I assumed at the time it was because of the Jewish/Catholic thing and that I was a no-no, because we were definitely flirting that evening... but I flirt with everyone, I mean one of my exs stormed out of the Apple store a year ago because he said I was "excessively flirting with the Apple store guy" when I was buying a computer and I wasn't even interested in him in the slightest..
I'm definitely going to give him lots and lots of space... I'm in no rush to talk to him again!
I am now thinking over all my failed attempts to be friends with exs though and wondering how I could have been so blind to think this trip could work.
Well, the only thing you can do now is give him space. He clearly saw you as a romantic interest for a long time, so guys who are in this class rarely stay friends after the bubble's burst - especially since you are so far away. Guys can remain friends with women they are attracted to, but not if their main goal was romantic from the get-go, which it sounds like right now. Guys just aren't wired to stay friends with a failed romantic interest 98+ percent of the time (especially if they are the ones who are dumped/rejected). If you approach him now, he'll only see it as a pity reachout, or worse yet, that you are still interested - when you are not.
FWIW, reading the NYE details and his feelings he expressed to you on the trip, and the type of guy he is (smart, but shy/socially awkward), the simple explanation for NYE was that he was too shy to make a move, but the time you 2 spent together gave him enough courage to ask you out for the trip the next time. It's too bad it ended the way it did - not being able to perform is literally the #1 insecurity a guy can have sex-wise. I'm guessing by your description he hasn't dated a lot of girls in HS/college, but as he's become more successful, he's starting to get more interest, and is blooming late. He will not have any trouble finding someone to address his single status - single male 20-something doctors are an endangered species. ;D Hopefully he can overcome his performance anxiety with his next SO/hookup (and there will be others, don't worry about him).
On the flip side, once you get your life in order (a place to live, work settling) - for goodness sake, as been said - start dating again. You're 24, attractive, and can speak intelligently - some UK guy will make you forget about your ex if you just get out there. It's more likely to make you forget your ex than going on trips with friends who have feelings for you but where you're not reciprocating - unless the guy's incredibly skilled, patient (or both), your hookups are never going to be as memorable as your ex's without some type of other connection. I do think you need to be open about the type of guy you are looking for - it's clear you 2 didn't have "it" between you, but you never know who will turn your crank the next time.
Consider this a life lesson learned for all.
Good luck!
Dear Audrey, Thanks for the update. C'est la vie
Dear Doc,
That's really the guy's problem, he's known you all this time and his big move was a trip to Spain and not at kiss a NY's.
Well it worked didn't it,,, or did she not give it up on the first night?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=70eiPAom-Ng
audrey_k
03-12-2014, 06:02 PM
^we never had sex...
And I hate that term, I didn't "give anything up."
hey don't get me wrong ,, I admire your "open mindedness" about hooking up with the guy,, but let's not kid ourselves .... one does not simply discover he can't get it up, unless the penis is out of the pants.
Djoser
03-12-2014, 06:37 PM
hey don't get me wrong ,, I admire your "open mindedness" about hooking up with the guy,, but let's not kid ourselves .... one does not simply discover he can't get it up, unless the penis is out of the pants.
Maybe I missed something, and I haven't gone back & reread the OP, but I do not recall her saying she let him pull his dick out. In which case you are out of line.
I think you missed the part about them not being able to hook up due to his flaccid penis ...
MarvelGirl
03-13-2014, 06:37 AM
I'm sorry it went bad.
I'm not one of those people who believes men and women can't be friends either though. I've become very close friends with some of my husband's friends from childhood to the point where we've hung out solo many times. I don't believe they're just waiting for their chance to fuck me. Not every guy out there is a piece of shit who only thinks about his penis. I feel sorry for how jaded some of the people on this thread are.
gocanucks
03-13-2014, 07:19 AM
I'm sorry it went bad.
I'm not one of those people who believes men and women can't be friends either though. I've become very close friends with some of my husband's friends from childhood to the point where we've hung out solo many times. I don't believe they're just waiting for their chance to fuck me. Not every guy out there is a piece of shit who only thinks about his penis. I feel sorry for how jaded some of the people on this thread are.
There's a difference between friends of a SO and friends who secretly want a romantic relationship. I agree friendship with members of the opposite sex can happen - but not if the primary motivation is a desire for something more. When that is the basis of the start of friendship, it seldom lasts once the bubble bursts.
I have 2-3 female friends - married, and I know we will only be friends. I also started the friendship that way - when it starts with a secret crush, though, harder for that not to come to the forefront, especially on a trip alone together, with no attachments at play.
In any case, better it be dealt with now - Audrey's friend was bound to make an attempt to let his feelings be known. It's too bad it went down that way (not the way a guy wants to fail at all), but at least everyone can move on. He will be fine in the long run.
gocanucks
03-13-2014, 07:29 AM
hey don't get me wrong ,, I admire your "open mindedness" about hooking up with the guy,, but let's not kid ourselves .... one does not simply discover he can't get it up, unless the penis is out of the pants.
I'm guessing the point being made is that having sex (or trying to) isn't "giving it up" for a woman - it's a decision or desire by both people. The woman isn't giving anything away, she is a willing and (hopefully enthusiastic) participant. The saying makes it seem like only the guy is getting something out of sex, or that the woman is "putting out", or giving something that shouldn't be freely given (a guy "scores" but a girl "gives it away" - same kind if thinking that says a guy who sleeps with 3 women in a weekend is a player but a woman who does so is a slut).
Strong modern women don't view sex as giving something away but as a choice they make of free will. A GF in my Uni days told me this a long gone ago, but it made sense then, so take it FWIW.
Djoser
03-13-2014, 08:06 AM
Yeah it's the old myth of the 'Golden Pussy'. The Grand Prize that guys will fight and compete for, and women will hold out for some theoretically more deserving studmuffin type. So tiresome...a relic of the fucking stone age that refuses to die as long as stupid people buy into that shit. Television definitely does not help matters, either.
Really, if I wanted to play that game I would just periodically pay a couple of girls 100$ each to catfight over me in a crowded singles bar, & I guarantee you I'd be getting laid by dumb women regularly for months.
DreamsInDigital
03-13-2014, 10:43 AM
Painful but truthful answer ... you probably can't !!!
^This, exactly. I see you decided to go on the trip anyway. I mean, I can't really blame you....who wouldn't want to go to Spain??
But, having been nearly identical situations several times (minus being attracted to the guy), I can honestly say that GUYS DON'T LISTEN. Really. You may have directly said, "We're just going as friends, I don't want anything more." but what he actually heard was some version of, "I really want you, but I'm playing some sort of game where I'm only pretending I just want to be friends so that you have to try harder to get me." Sadly, I can count on one hand the number of guy friends that I managed to keep after they realized FOR SURE that I was not interested in them that way. It's okay though - lesson learned, right? :)
tempest666
03-13-2014, 01:38 PM
I really hope that "brother" part wasn't meant literally....
Lol hell no. My real brother is a bit of a self righteous prick. This guy is fucking awesome. We can't choose our family but we can choose our friends.
starlily
03-13-2014, 01:44 PM
I can honestly say that GUYS DON'T LISTEN. Really. You may have directly said, "We're just going as friends, I don't want anything more." but what he actually heard was some version of, "I really want you, but I'm playing some sort of game where I'm only pretending I just want to be friends so that you have to try harder to get me."
^^^^^^^
This thread has made me so fed up and ticked at men all over again. Despite working at a strip club I try to give them the benefit of the doubt and think "well not ALL of them just want sex," but nope, even according to THE MEN THEMSELVES that's all they want. Apparently y'all don't care about anything a woman has to offer if she isn't willing to have sex with you first. I don't care if that's "natural," I don't care if you "can't help it," it's fucking dumb and annoying. I'm not your plaything, and I'm not going to associate with people who only talk to me because they think it will make me willing to have sex with them (aka, apparently all men, YOUR words guys.)
Audrey I'm glad things were cut short. He sounds like a passive aggressive doucher who was trying to sneakily manipulate you into dating him, so don't feel bad, you're not beholden to do anything sexual or romantic with him just because he's been "friends" with you (if you can even call it friendship when there's been such a selfish ulterior motive the whole time.)
^This, exactly. I see you decided to go on the trip anyway. I mean, I can't really blame you....who wouldn't want to go to Spain??
That's the problem with this whole thing. She didn't listen to anybody who told her it was a bad idea because she wanted to go to Spain either way. It's like a guy you don't like asking you out on a date and going just because you are hungry even if you have zero interest in him. It wasn't the guy doing the not listening here.
starlily
03-13-2014, 02:41 PM
That's the problem with this whole thing. She didn't listen to anybody who told her it was a bad idea because she wanted to go to Spain either way. It's like a guy you don't like asking you out on a date and going just because you are hungry even if you have zero interest in him.
The only problem here is men who believe that because they do nice things, they're entitled to sex. You're treating it like a contract, when actually a contract needs both parties to know the terms and agree before proceeding. For example, if a woman has sex with a man first, and THEN she says "Well we had sex so now you have to take me out to an expensive dinner" the man would be like "Hell naw! I never agreed to that!"
It wasn't the guy doing the not listening here.
Except when it was, when she told him she wasn't interested beforehand.
If you are not interested in a guy you don't go on a romantic getaway to spain with them, it is not complicated.
starlily
03-13-2014, 03:08 PM
If you are not interested in a guy you don't go on a romantic getaway to spain with them, it is not complicated.
I think the reason it seems this straightforward to you is that you can't comprehend spending that much time with the opposite sex unless you think you're going to score. Most women don't think that way. They can actually like men without wanting to screw them. So pardon us if we get invited to Spain and think "Oh nice! This awesome friend wants to hang out and go on a once-in-a-lifetime trip with me and it's gonna be RAD!" instead of "No, I have no right to spend time with a man unless I'm going to fuck him." Because that last thought is YOUR thought, not ours. Like I said it's a one-sided contract.
Just say "At this point I'm looking for a relationship/hookup and don't want to spend that much time with you and fall for you if it's not going to amount to anything. So let me know whether or not you're interested in me." It is not complicated. Seriously, that would have been a lot less complicated for the guy than biding his time for years and planning a "romantic getaway" (or as I would have thought of it, a "super fun vacation") and just hoping/assuming that she'll like him if he does nice things for her.
She even told him exactly what she thought of the idea of a relationship. He decided to keep going anyway!
I think the reason it seems this straightforward to you is that you can't comprehend spending that much time with the opposite sex unless you think you're going to score. Most women don't think that way. They can actually like men without wanting to screw them. So pardon us if we get invited to Spain and think "Oh nice! This awesome friend wants to hang out and go on a once-in-a-lifetime trip with me and it's gonna be RAD!" instead of "No, I have no right to spend time with a man unless I'm going to fuck him." Because that last thought is YOUR thought, not ours. Like I said it's a one-sided contract.
Just say "At this point I'm looking for a relationship/hookup and don't want to spend that much time with you and fall for you if it's not going to amount to anything. So let me know whether or not you're interested in me." It is not complicated. Seriously, that would have been a lot less complicated for the guy than biding his time for years and planning a "romantic getaway" (or as I would have thought of it, a "super fun vacation") and just hoping/assuming that she'll like him if he does nice things for her.
She even told him exactly what she thought of the idea of a relationship. He decided to keep going anyway!
I understand women don't think that way, that's why we explained it to her. Not just men but women who know better also. And of course the guy couldn't back out of it at that point, he would've got the same exact reaction you are giving me for pointing out the obvious truth. You don't go on a romantic getaway with someone you have no romantic interest in, I'm not sure what you find controversial about that.
starlily
03-13-2014, 03:29 PM
And of course the guy couldn't back out of it at that point, he would've got the same exact reaction you are giving me for pointing out the obvious truth.
What reaction? The reaction of "Um if you wanted to make this about us dating, why didn't you just say so before you invested all these feelings and money in me?"
You don't go on a romantic getaway with someone you have no romantic interest in, I'm not sure what you find controversial about that.
The controversy is that he decided it was going to be a romantic getaway and she just thought it was a trip to Spain. I could go to Spain with my mom. I could go to Spain by my own damn self. Going to Spain doesn't mean there are any strings attached.
Right, but plenty of people explained it to her. There should've been no confusion after that.
cherryblossomsinspring
03-13-2014, 04:01 PM
What happened I expected to happen. So the end result isn't surprising at all. The Op was told ahead of time days in advance. Even the hotel booking was messed up because with being fully aware he had feelings for her she actually let him book a hotel room for them both to share. Sorry this wasn't really a " ooh no look what happened". This was really an obvious ending. Also the "I messed up". No she messed up when she accepted this trip. She also messed up leaving the booking of a hotel on him.
Also the term "putting out" is old. However this man didn't jump through romantic bliss hoops and try to set up her "putting out" for nothing. Why do you think he got pissed off at her for not fucking him on the 2nd try? In his mind he earned that pussy and that's why he felt ENTITLED to it.
When people want to get away from the old adage of "putting out" , men that are paying to be entitled to a woman's vagina will be long gone. Obviously this practice is still very alive as seen by this post.
To me the "friend" set up bait to get her alone to make his move especially having one room to share. If that's not creepy I don't know what is. The problem is that we all knew what was going on here and she was well aware of this crush he had.
I remember going through this like clockwork around New Years. My phone would blow up and apparently every guy seemed to be using the same con. " I have an extra VIP ticket to this NYE event that normally cost upwards of $170 + a have a fully decked out room booked". They would always offer me to come with them and that I didn't have to pay. Thinking hmm so I'm going to have to share a room with you after you're hoping I get shit faced? Nope not looking for the rapey times with you! Pass!
I remember a friend of 3 years invited me over to his Halloween party. Everyone at work said they didn't even know he was having one. I get there all dressed up and his place is empty. No evidence of anyone even being there either. Surprise Surprise another con.
^ I could go on and on with more examples but this behavior isn't uncommon nor a shocker at all.
I've been through similar situations in the past. I made more mistakes at this because I didn't want to believe this was the case. Funny thing is that I haven't had any male friends recently that approach me for friendship that weren't attracted to me. Those relationships fail fast because they may not make a play for me in a month or a year but someday it will happen and it always ruins the FAKE relationship that I thought I had with them. This is really what the "friend zone" is all about. Some guy that's around to earn pussy points that he's expecting to cash in at some point. Also since everyone is doing FWB now this is more likely to happen than ever. I remember when men suggested FWB most women laughed in their face. Now of course it's sweeping the nation lol.
The only friends that you could really have is a guy that you think is incredibly hot but you wouldn't fuck him with your friend's vagina. A guy that finds you so unattractive that he wouldn't fuck you even with the lights off. <--These men are rare.
Anyways this is exactly why I enjoy the adult industry because it seems to be honest in so many ways. You get the same exact games but they are laughable at best so you don't take any guy too serious.
Doc Holliday
03-13-2014, 06:14 PM
The only problem here is men who believe that because they do nice things, they're entitled to sex.You're right, this is absolutely wrong. I agree with you. But, it happens. The problem is a lot of men are insecure and can't come right out and say, 'Hey, I'm interested in a girl.' So, they do things for them and try to prove their worth that way; then they make a move too late or too big -- a full paid trip to Spain, like it's a game show. And because they put too much effort into it only to get rejected, they get real butt hurt about it. A lot of men work that way. The opposite are the annoying guys who hit on women first thing out the door and even with rejection, they keep at it. They are too secure and too stupid to realize if it didn't work the fifth time it won't work the sixth, seventh, and eighth. Few are the men who act reasonably somewhere in between, express their interest subtly, attempt to win them over subtly, and walk away.
Except when it was, when she told him she wasn't interested beforehand.Except in the opening post, she said she was attracted to him and could see a relationship forming if not for the long distance thing. She never would have went if not for subconsciously wanting to take that risk, for it to maybe work out and things click. ..but they didn't.
The controversy is that he decided it was going to be a romantic getaway and she just thought it was a trip to Spain. I could go to Spain with my mom. I could go to Spain by my own damn self. Going to Spain doesn't mean there are any strings attached.Yes, but parents often pay for a child's way and a person often pays their own way. A man paying for a trip to another country for woman whom he is just acquaintances with (albeit acquaintances for three years), is not just 'friendly'. It's intentionally romantic. It's a dick move on his part. But, she should have seen this. If they had really known each other over those three years, had they spent a lot of time together, gone out and done things, had sleep overs with no sex, etc. It would be totally different. They would have been two real friends and one genuinely doing something nice for the other. But it wasn't.
The guy is not terrible. He's just insecure and inexperienced with women and can't come out and express how he feels in a more direct manner. I only wanted audrey to realize this before getting herself in an awkward and painful situation.
Sure guys can be friends with women, they can even be friends with women they are attracted to, what they can't do is repeatedly (or overly) do things for women whom they only want to be friends with and not desire anything more to happen. Can you honestly say you'd spend a month or more of your pay for someone you barely knew to join you on an exotic trip and not want some magical Hollywood romance to happen?
audrey_k
03-13-2014, 07:24 PM
Wow OK I'm surprised people are still posting in this thread!
First of all... this was not some super romantic getaway, and I paid for my plane ticket. All he paid for was the hotel room.
In regards to the last few posts... he never acted like he expected sex from me. Yes we spent a romantic evening together on Sunday and he made the first move (which was stroking my hair, which led to use making out of course) but it was my choice to take it farther... he never acted like because he paid for the trip I owed him something. I've known many guys like that-- take you out to a nice dinner and if you refuse to let them feel you up in the car you're a bitch-- but he isn't like that. Like Doc_Holiday said he's just an inexperienced, shy guy, but he is is a wonderful, kind and caring person, not a manipulative douchebag so I feel like I need to defend him a bit here.
Honestly, I don't regret going on the trip, I got to go to an awesome country and I enjoyed getting to soak up the culture and go to a few museums. I do feel bad that what happened was hurtful to him, and I regret that I brought sex into it at all on that first night, but I am glad that I ended things immediately after that because it would have just been leading him on. Overall I wish things had turned out differently, but what can you do?
And Djoser & gocancucks... that is exactly why that phrase fucking pisses me off!
MarvelGirl
03-13-2014, 08:05 PM
I understand women don't think that way, that's why we explained it to her. Not just men but women who know better also. And of course the guy couldn't back out of it at that point, he would've got the same exact reaction you are giving me for pointing out the obvious truth. You don't go on a romantic getaway with someone you have no romantic interest in, I'm not sure what you find controversial about that.
What part of buying your own plane ticket to go to Spain with a friend is a "romantic getaway?" If my husband surprised me with a "Hey, we're going to Spain but you have to buy your own ticket." I sure as hell would not consider that romance.
cherryblossomsinspring
03-13-2014, 08:31 PM
What part of buying your own plane ticket to go to Spain with a friend is a "romantic getaway?" If my husband surprised me with a "Hey, we're going to Spain but you have to buy your own ticket." I sure as hell would not consider that romance.
You forgot "he has a crush on me" plus "he's booking the hotel room" plus " the hotel room we HAVE to share".
audrey_k
03-13-2014, 09:03 PM
You forgot "he has a crush on me" plus "he's booking the hotel room" plus " the hotel room we HAVE to share".
He never told me he had a crush on me before this trip.
We stayed in a suite and the agreement we had before the trip was that he would sleep on the pullout in the next room. That's where he slept the second night.
shasta
03-13-2014, 10:22 PM
You are in the same hemisphere as Arizona.
Djoser
03-14-2014, 02:41 AM
Sharing the hotel room is always trouble lol.
NOT to laugh at your particular situation, Audrey. And if you'd like me to clean up the thread a little or delete it now that it has run its course, I'll be happy to do so.
Sorry you had the misunderstanding (& that I posted again without reading your description on pg2). He just sounds like he really didn't know what he was doing, rather than a scheming type. Some guys are very naive & even believe their own line of slightly skewed reasoning about women. Of course that street goes both ways haha!
But hey at least Spain was cool otherwise.
;D
What part of buying your own plane ticket to go to Spain with a friend is a "romantic getaway?" If my husband surprised me with a "Hey, we're going to Spain but you have to buy your own ticket." I sure as hell would not consider that romance.
The part where you are going to Spain with a guy.
gocanucks
03-14-2014, 08:59 AM
Rather than point the finger at the guy/girl, it seems pretty clear everyone went in with their eyes open. To recap:
1. Guy had feelings for Audrey, but never acted on them before inviting her on trip to Spain. Last-minute, less than a week to go when this went down.
2. Audrey did tell him the night before she wanted this to be a friends' trip - he didn't address at that time.
3. Audrey did have some attraction to said guy.
4. Both paid their way on trip, he paid for hotel, declined her offer to pay.
5. They went on trip, got drunk, and MUTUALLY decided to hook up - until his performance issues came up.\
6. Next day, Audrey thought better of hook-up, guy was understandibly upset, because his feelings were a lot stronger and his lack of performance is NEVER the way you want to end a possible relationship (he saw it that way, even if Audrey didn't).
Yes, Audrey had plenty of signs he was interested, and this would only end one way. But, in reality, this was going to happen no matter what - it was only a matter of where/when. She had some attraction, so she decided to give it a shot. It wasn't because of the hotel being paid, she was in the moment. That happens - it's not like either was attached, so even though it wasn't her original intent, it's not like it's terrible that this happened. It didn't work out - no harm done (other than to the guy's confidence, but that's a risk every time).
As for the guy, he's not a bad guy at all - just socially awkward and shy. He didn't have the courage to make a move until he got her alone - and he needed that to build up to it. There's no need to vilify him any more than that. Sure, he was friends with a primary motivation of attraction and hopes for more. That's not unusual. He didn't force any expectations on to her the first night, and he backed down the next day when she declined. Of COURSE he would be upset - no one in their right mind wouldn't be. Audrey was someone he had a bigtime crush on, and when he had his shot, the ultimate nightmare happened. It sucks that it really dampened the rest of the trip, but I can't think of any other outcome. And again - we can be friends with women, but NOT long-term if we see them first as romantic interests. That was the case here - but it doesn't make him a bad guy.
Sure, the 2nd half of the trip sucked, and the guy's confidence is shot. But he took his shot, and it was with MUTUAL consent. Thus the whole issue with the "giving it away" comments. And, yeah, he paid for the hotel. She offered, he declined. That's on him. As a guy, I have no problem with that. It doesn't come with strings attached, and he didn't treat her that way. So it's a non-issue.
In the end, although it was disastrous how it ended, the guy is WAY better off to have tried and failed, then never having tried at all. He was a gentleman, and he didn't force himself - she consented, it didn't work out. Because he tried, he doesn't have tolook back and wonder how it would have worked had he tried. He flamed out huge - but at least he knows that chapter is closed.
If people want to say Audrey had signs and ignored them, entirely fair. But really, both parties had signs - Audrey's attempt to tell him she wasn't looking for romance was equally ignored. They were both adults. They will both be fine in the long run (even with not being able to perform, he'll be fine, since he's a successful professional - young male professionals don't stay single for long). No one acted out of bounds. This isn't like the friend who makes rape jokes by text, or the abusive SO, or one person taking advantage of another. Is it a lesson learned? For sure. But really, that's all it is - no puppies were killed, and no long-lasting harm was done. Like most types of situations, both parties assume some responsibility, and learn from it.
MarvelGirl
03-14-2014, 11:16 AM
The part where you are going to Spain with a guy.
You suck at romance if you think having a woman buy her own ticket to Spain is romantic.
Cept that wasn't part of the original plan was it?
DreamsInDigital
03-14-2014, 11:47 AM
Sometimes experience is the only real teacher, and I think this definitely holds true with respect to this particular topic.
^This is true, I can attest to it. Men & women think differently about this type of stuff, that's just how it is. And also, remember that the title of this thread was "How to make it clear I just want to be friends?" rather than, "Should I go to Spain with him or not?" I think the OP was already set on going to Spain, regardless of the outcome.
MarvelGirl
03-14-2014, 11:53 AM
Cept that wasn't part of the original plan was it?
Yes, it was. She clarified that in the third post on this thread.
gocanucks
03-14-2014, 12:18 PM
You suck at romance if you think having a woman buy her own ticket to Spain is romantic.
Cept that wasn't part of the original plan was it?
Yes, it was. She clarified that in the third post on this thread.
Do people even read the thread before answering? She paid her ticket and offered to pay for half of hotel. He declined. That was very clearly posted.
Honestly this is a side part to the story. Both parties learned something but in the end made choices with their eyes open. It didn't work out but no real damage was done. No one forced anything on anyone.
audrey_k
03-14-2014, 12:24 PM
^Yeah, not sure what you're talking about. He asked me to go on the trip and I said I would check to see how much tickets were. They were cheap and so when I talked to him again I said I the tickets were cheap and asked what flight I should pick. Originally I was going to buy flight+hotel from Expedia and the only reason I didn't was because he said he had the hotel covered in the conversation. But no, he never said he would by plane ticket.
I get where you are coming from with the whole give it up issue, and I understand why you might see that phrase as being offensive. But it doesn't have to be a one way sexist street, a guy can just as well give it up to a girl. (there are plenty of times in any guys life that a girl wants you, but you are not attracted to her, so if she finally gets the guy in bed then yes, the guy gave it up) Speaking strictly from a definition standpoint, I would say giving it up has to do with who is pursuing who and how much resistance there is from the other person. In this case the guy was pursuing Audrey and the feeling was not mutual, in fact it was clear that her stance was she did not want to be more than friends with this guy even after she booked her trip... so in this case it took a trip to spain, a nice night out and a few drinks to get her to “have a change of heart” ,, And she didn't even like the guy the next day, so it's not like that's where her heart was the whole time, which would be a different case… Now (believe it or not) I just want to be clear, that I am not trying to paint Audrey in a negative light. I think the issue was should she go to spain with a guy who liked her if she did not feel the same way ,,, and many suggested against it,,,, however since she went with an open mind about the situation then she should feel no fault for how things unfolded. Morally, I don't give a sh*t how long people wait before they have sex, but a drunk f*ck on the first night is destined for failure, because there is a great chance that it will be awkward the next day no matter how good or bad the sex was,,, The guy is obviously not a player, because if he had any game he would have gave her bread and water that night, and hedged his bet for the second and third night. But he probably wanted it sooo bad that he was incapable of turning it down and went for it limp shrimp and all. But, believe it or not it's probably for the best things turned out the way they did. So thank you to Audrey for sharing this personal story with us, I'm sure I'm not making myself popular here, I just call it like it is, but at least I tried to give you honest advice from the beginning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psFQMKcsIF8
TJSmith
03-21-2014, 12:47 AM
Having read though all this, it's his fault he didn't get laid. He should have not had "problems" when knowing he was going to try to hook up.
On another note, this would make an AMAZING short film! :) *ideas*
Darby
03-24-2014, 09:22 PM
I had a crush on my friend at one point, I mean how could I not? She was super smart, the best personality and just so fun to be with I just loved her so much. We talked about it and she cared for me also and held me and our friendship in high regard. We realized that we could have a relationship and it would be amazing but sooner or later someone would get hurt, or we could be friends forever. Well forever is a long time, but it has been about 20 years and we are still great friends & I wouldn't trade that for anything. I read this post hoping you 2 could have had a similar experience, it is rare I suppose. I don't know what's so bad about the friendzone, having goddesses on your side and there for advice is awesome. Anyways, just my $.02
Fionaver
03-26-2014, 01:57 AM
Wow, Rum... Are you f*cking kidding me?!? The love of my life and I began as a lame drunken hookup... If we hadn't screwed the next morning, everything would have stalled --- nooooo chemistry at all when lit.
Audrey went into it with a clear understanding (thru a friend) that he *might* be attracted to her because (hearsay) but other than that he was a trusted friend. It sucks for her that she tried to act on a 3 yr attraction (with no current potential b/c DISTANCE) but she's twenty-f*cking-four. Parsing out the difference between friend/family/romantic live is hard enough... 'I care, but....' has been the demise of many a good woman.
Get off your high horse.
MarvelGirl
03-26-2014, 05:30 AM
Oh, fucking on the first date always leads to failure? Be right back, I have to go end my 14 year marriage based on that fact. *eye roll*
Doc Holliday
03-26-2014, 07:41 PM
Thank you, rum. I feel violated. I could have lived the rest of my life in happiness never having seen KC's Frankenstein face sing Give It Up to me.
Doc Holliday
03-26-2014, 07:43 PM
Jesus, he should have died from a cocaine overdose on NYE 1979.
This is how I want to remember that band.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ee3C2m3OXE