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fishielicious
10-02-2014, 02:53 PM
Two words regarding best job opportunities ... Langley, Virginia !!!
Do you know anything about what the CIA would think about hiring strippers? I mean, I'd be great the Jennifer Garner Alias-style spy posing as stripper thing... lol

Melonie
10-02-2014, 02:54 PM
^^^ Mata Hari was the archtype for female spies !!! I would think that a stripping background would be a 'resume enhancer' for this sort of work !!!

nick73
10-02-2014, 04:04 PM
Two words regarding best job opportunities ... Langley, Virginia !!!

ummm ...

... pharmacists are now the specific 'target' of major automation efforts ! Hospitals, drugstore chains, etc. are seriously investigating the possibility of replacing 2-3, 4-6, 6-9 human pharmacists with 1-2-3 pharmacy robots, keeping one human pharmacist on the payroll to 'reload' the machines once a day, to order 'replacement' drug supplies, etc. A few large hospitals have already done so. Also, much of a pharmacist's past 'value' in regard to checking for potential drug interactions, etc. is increasingly being handled automatically by 'smart' systems working in conjunction with electronic medical records.

Please don't 'shoot the messenger'.


Thanks for the info Melonie. I was not aware of these new developments.

I guess the doctor could just enter the type of medicine and quantity on his iPad and the information would be send to the dispensing machine where the patient will just insert his ID and Credit Card.

There will still be need for pharmacists to mix some types of medicines but there would be fewer positions I guess :-(

nick73
10-02-2014, 05:20 PM
"Yeah I'm afraid I have too many skeletons in my closet to qualify for a government job."

Did you slay a lot of customers with your killer looks? :-)

"And I do hope to study Czech! I grew up in an area with heavy Czech influence. But right now pretty much all I know is "jak se mas!" "

I though a lot of people know that expression after Borat came out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7vWi8sosg4
( One of the funniest skits - "How to date American Women" )

"Do you know anything about what the CIA would think about hiring strippers?"
I recently read somewhere that social engineering is still the most effective intelligence technique.
With all the incredible technological changes we are experiencing - one thing doesn't change:
Man lose their common sense around beautiful women that know how to flirt.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/modern-mata-hari-leaves-kremlin-critics-exposed-20100428-tsem.html
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/04/28/ekaterina-gerasimova-aka_n_555360.html

By the way - I tried translating "How are you?" in around 10 Slavic languages and the similarities are quite apparent even though half are using Latin and the rest Cyrillic:

Jak se máš?
Jak się masz?
Kako si?
Как дела?
Како си?
Как си?

fishielicious
10-02-2014, 05:34 PM
Did you slay a lot of customers with your killer looks? :-)
Well, let's just say that if a customer experiences a "little death" on me... he will soon be experiencing a much bigger one in the parking lot, courtesy of a piece of rebar.

I've never seen Borat, though, so I wouldn't know. ::) But if I could get that clip to load on my slow connection, I'm sure I'd understand.

Thank you for the links. I think I'd rather be a girl who seduces and exposes prominent people within the government, though, rather than detractors of the government. ;) Don't tell the CIA!

nick73
10-02-2014, 05:51 PM
Borat - the movie - is very disgusting in my opinion.

However some of the clips on YouTube that they cut from the movie are very funny.
All the clips start with:

"Jak se máš?"

...

"My name Borat. If you want date american woman you can't just go to her father and swap her for 15 kg of insecticide ..."
"You have to go through process called dating ..."

GlamourRouge
10-03-2014, 12:14 AM
Its scary because so many jobs are going overseas for pennies or are being replaced by machines. And we have no idea which ones will be next.

Omegaphallic
10-04-2014, 05:33 AM
Yep, even jobs you'd never think would go to machines end up going that way, like cashiers. Seriously, a home depot went for a bunch of cashiers to 2, one a regular cashier and the other handling the self cashier machines. I've even heard thier is a robotic nurse in the works.

You have robots that can clean your carpets and cut your lawn. You have raising rates of people with degrees in places like China and India, people who will work cheaply, so jobs end up either exported to those countries or they end up importing these workers via the temporary forgien workers program into Canada, not even a citizens, but as a disposable work force they can abuse and mistreat.

And things are bad that the NDP wants legislation to stop companies from exploiting desperate people who are working unpaid internships in the hopes it will lead to paying employment.

What a fucking mess, this is what happens when one lets capitalism go unrestrained.

I know college graduates that are holding signs in pouring rain for money, on behalf of a closing furtinture store.

The leader of the official opposition, Tom Mulcair says this will be the first generation that will be worse off then the last.

Oh and to top that off rising life expectacy amoung boomers means they'll keep the best jobs for themselves longer instead of passing those on to the next generation.

Oh and Tuition just keeps on rising.

I'm glad I don't have kids.

nick73
10-04-2014, 02:06 PM
"Oh and Tuition just keeps on rising."

When I posted the original question - I hoped the discussion to focus specifically on the cost / financial benefit part.
I personally think higher education is great - if you don't have to get deep into debt to get it.

Here is a very interesting article by Belle Knox:

‘Duke Porn Star': I Lost My Financial Aid:
http://time.com/author/miriam-weeks/

"But my porn work pays the exorbitant tab for one simple reason: Demand for porn actresses, especially extremely young ones like myself, far exceeds supply. How interesting that the same basic principle explains why my tuition bill is so high in the first place."

"Demand for education, kind of like demand for porn, is pretty inelastic. Kids like me have been told our whole lives that higher education is the only way to be successful in America. President Obama made it clear he wants to keep that demand high in a speech in Austin, Texas."

Good Interview with her:

Screwed: Porn Actress Belle Knox Blows Hard Earned Money on College Tuition:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-JIK5_xE5E

"Would you have become adult actress if you didn't face $50,000 / year tuition at Duke?"

"No!"

Sophia_Starina
10-04-2014, 04:55 PM
http://youtu.be/t_N7MAr98CI

Omegaphallic
10-05-2014, 05:12 AM
Just for perpective in Canada the cheapest average university tuition is 2,631$, in Newfoundland, the most expensive is in my home province of Ontario at 7,529$ per year.

Belle Knox on the other hand is looking at over 60,000$ in tuition, I almost crapped myself at that figure.

This what happens when you let private universities spring up and then fail to regulate them properly on top of that.

Canada has a very fine education system, could use improvement, but there is always room for improvement in every counties education system.

Btw I got my figures from a Global News article I found.

nick73
10-05-2014, 08:15 AM
It is my understanding that engineering student pay around $15,000/year tuition in Ontario.
I am sure law and medical students pay more.
Could the average be only $7.5k / year? It looks low but could be correct.

Just to compare - here is an article about higher education costs in Europe.
( Scroll to the end to see the table with the data. )

http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/features/germanys-great-tuition-fees-u-turn/2011168.fullarticle

rusdancer
10-05-2014, 09:53 PM
Excellent thread! All I can say is that my diploma from a long time ago that I got from a very high end linguistic university in Moscow was not too valued in the US. Some time ago they were not even accepted. But my two business degrees including an almost finished MBA (2 months left) with a concentration in global business management that I have worked on in the US are very much valued overseas, at least in my case. This makes me sad because I have had tremendous trouble finding even an entry level job regular job, especially in NYC. I know of many other people with same problems. Even those who live in other cities (DC, Chicago, etc), who have never even worked in the adult biz.

rusdancer
10-05-2014, 09:54 PM
... So, I say that a degree is very much worth it, but it all depends on how you will use it later!

lemiwinks31
10-14-2014, 03:03 PM
http://youtu.be/t_N7MAr98CI

Well his math is a little suspect....(taking 140K that you dont spend on college now and equating it to $1.75 per hr. for 50 years of work is way too simplified and doesnt take into account that the 140K would be in worth a whole hell of alot more in 50 years)

But his point is absolutely spot on. You cant put a price on the intangibles of 4 years of high level thinking and learning and the benefits it will give you for the rest of your life.

I have to keep telling myself that because my daughter is a HS senior...and all of the schools she is looking at are over 60K per year....although that is just the 'sticker price'

Kellydancer
10-14-2014, 10:07 PM
Is it worth it? it depends but honestly a degree is pretty much worthless now. It used to be that if you got a degree you would find a job but not so true now. In fact I know a lot of graduates working minimum wage jobs and the economy is so bad they can hire a grad. That brings me up this sad fact and that is a degree does't guarantee a job but not having a degree pretty much guarantees you won't work a vanilla job. Many years ago neither of my parents went to college yet both found good paying jobs. I'm sure the job my mom did now requires a degree and experience but she got it right out of school. They trained her on the job, which isn't as likely now. I have a BA and a MA and to be honest it's not worth it. I've mostly gotten jobs based on my experience or who I knew. I wanted to be a professor but found out that most schools only hire adjunct anymore and many hire visa workers. It goes without saying many jobs are going overseas or to visa workers and we are becoming more and more service based.

Melonie
10-15-2014, 02:57 AM
^^^ the joker in the deck regarding the high cost of college tuition in the USA is that this cost only matters if the graduate actually has to pay this money back. In point of fact there are a growing number of gov't backed student loan repayment plans where the total out-of-pocket cost of tuition winds up only being a small fraction of the apparent cost. Or put another way, Canadian taxpayers subsidize tuition costs on the 'front end', while US taxpayers subsidize tuition costs on the 'back end'.

charlie61
10-15-2014, 08:09 AM
There aren't a lot of alternatives to going to college for the majority of people who want to attain some level of success in their lives. I hear a lot about how degrees aren't worth anything anymore because the economy is fucked and jobs are going overseas and there aren't any jobs anymore and you need at least an advanced degree to be considered for anything. But what's the alternative? Not everyone has the business acumen to start their own company, and not everyone can do sex work for 10+ years to the level needed to put away enough money to justify the downsides.

These days, if you don't have a degree, your options are quite limited. Even if you have a certification from a trade school, you'll be making above minimum wage, but usually not by a significant amount. We can hem and haw over how 'useless' certain degrees are, but the truth of the matter is that hiring standards are being raised in my generation to unrealistic levels, and there's not a whole lot we can do about it. Furthermore, lives are not equations based solely on money. Happiness and quality of life need to be considered. To say that any degree is "worthless" is unbelievably myopic.

I like the variety of opinions in this thread. And I agree that it isn't a good decision to go into debt by $100k to get a degree in something about which you aren't passionate and have no plans to use in any form.

Kellydancer
10-15-2014, 09:32 AM
Honestly I don't know what the alternative is except to stop outsourcing and visa, along with offering more scholarships. There aren't any "safe" jobs anymore. Back when I was going to college many were getting teaching certificates to fall back on. Now the economy is so bad many certified teachers are working as teacher's aide (generally an unskilled job requiring just a high school diploma)or many other low paying jobs, like daycare worker. There are way too many lawyers as well and some lawyers are working jobs like bank tellers. I went to a job fair a few years ago and everyone there was someone educated, like scientists, lawyers, etc. Not many just had a Bachelor's and most had advanced degrees, including Ph.D. Yes, there are many unemployed scientists and the research labs are being picky for $14.00 an hour. There are two labs about an hour from me and one decided to go mostly unpaid "internships" and part time.

I have a friend who owns a business and he has been talking to me about starting my own, which I am doing. In his case, he has no other option as he is in his 50's, no degree (got training from the army though), and has been arrested twice for DUI. If he lost his business he knows he would never work again. However, the fact is not everyone can start a business. Most businesses fail and with things like outsourcing it often means not being able to compete.

dpacrkk
10-16-2014, 06:54 AM
I don't think it's that degrees are worthless, it's that people have the perception that university is to teach you job skills, when it's to teach you how to think. The problem is many people never got used to learning outside of elementary and high school, and will certainly not begin to do so in university. I've seen this having interviewed new grads for entry level engineering positions, who can mindlessly regurgitate knowledge, but not apply it when the same interview/puzzle question is varied very slightly.

Openwallet
10-17-2014, 03:24 AM
A degree in anything can be a huge help when you are traveling and applying for Visa's. Being qualified to do something, even if it's not on that countries skill shortage list is usually worth a few points in a points based Visa system, and if it is on the countries skill shortage list it might mean that no other criteria need to be bought into play. North American Graduates often have a huge advantage in that their degrees are well thought of in nearly all corners of the world.

Melonie
10-20-2014, 03:38 PM
Honestly I don't know what the alternative is except to stop outsourcing and visa, along with offering more scholarships. There aren't any "safe" jobs anymore.

Actually, the visa / work permit situation is about to be made much worse. From

(snip)"An online draft proposal from U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services says it will look for a vendor to supply the blank cards
At least 4 million per year for five years, including a possible 9 million in the early going
Document says the move is 'to support possible future immigration reform initiative requirements'(snip)

If this comes to pass, it will essentially guarantee zero economic 'leverage' for unskilled and semi-skilled workers for years to come.

Arguably, the increases in scholarships, grants and low interest loans over the past couple of decades is largely responsible for the 'surplus' of college graduates which now exists. Adding yet more future college graduates in the absence of sufficient jobs will only exacerbate the 'underemployment' problem.

On the topic of automation, the added 'intelligence' of today's so-called 'mechatronics', in combination with the falling 'price' ( both purchase price and ultra low cost of borrowed money ), now makes it possible for automation to tackle a number of relatively highly paid job categories. Besides pharmacists vs pharmacy 'robots', truck drivers will soon face 'follow the leader' self-driving trucks ( i.e. 1 human driver can potentially control several semi trucks following behind automatically). See for a list of the 100 jobs which are most and least likely to become targets for automation in the near future.

In terms of overall changes, a few talking heads are already discussing 'neo-feudalism'. This is based on an assumption that, with certain exceptions, a good chunk of remaining 'middle class' jobs will increasingly fall victim to automation and/or downward wage pressure. This in turn will leave the modern equivalent of feudal 'lords' earning big money via their ownership of mostly automated means of production ( as well as passive earnings on real estate and other investments ), and the modern equivalent of feudal 'serfs' earning just enough money to cover food, clothing, shelter, cableTV, cheap beer etc. The same talking heads also speculate that the feudal role of the Clergy ... with a standard of living somewhere in between the two extremes ... will be taken by engineers, technicians, financial types, gov't workers etc. who are necessary to keep the 'neo-feudal' system operating.

Kellydancer
10-20-2014, 03:54 PM
I don't know if I believe more scholarships means more students but could be. I do know a disturbing trend is to take away scholarships from the smartest kids and give them to the neediest (who may or may not be the smartest). That is allowing those kids who shouldn't be in school.

Unfortunately the visa issue is going to get worse with the clowns in power. Neither party is for the people. We both know which party though is pushing illegals to become citizens to create new voters (and why said party wants to increase welfare for them). Illinois has several ballot measures which mention helping illegals and increasing bilingual education and all of that. No coincidence (guess which party is in power?).

lynn2009
10-20-2014, 04:03 PM
my vanilla work is on the list of least likely to be replaced by a robot :)

choose wisely....

Melonie
10-20-2014, 04:14 PM
^^^ 60 years ago, when a family had to come up with tuition money out of their own pockets ... and without gov't subsidies ... far fewer people attended thus graduated from college. Thus college educated professionals were in 'short' supply ... with resulting high wages and strong job security. Arguably beginning with the WW2 era GI bill, the subsequent massive gov't spending on state colleges / community colleges, and the subsequent taxpayer funded 'discount' tuition rates at state colleges / community colleges, the apparent affordability thus supply of college graduates increased massively. However, generally speaking, the need for additional college graduates stagnated at the same time the number of college graduates continued to increase. The more recent trend of student loans, grants and scholarships arguably brought even more college graduates into an economy which, with few exceptions ( i.e. engineering, health care ), did not NEED more college graduates. Thus today there is both an abundance of college graduates, as well as a huge question mark in regard to the ability of those college graduates to actually 'perform' in the real world.

I'll steer clear of political comments, but will agree that ( soon ) having a majority of modern day 'serfs' who are ( partially ) dependent on ongoing 'gov't subsidies' to sustain their standard of living arguably provides the modern day 'lords' with an equally effective means of controlling the 'serfs' that flogging used to !!!

Kellydancer
10-20-2014, 04:24 PM
I agree. It is both parties, which was my point (and that is response to those who believe one of the parties is for the people and one is not, by which I respond neither party is for Americans). That was their intention, which is why both parties also support outsourcing.

BIGJosh
11-05-2014, 10:22 AM
"It's worth it! I have a BA and am grad school and I fucking love my day job (I work in a hospital as a clinical intern part time)!"

I am very glad to hear that. Congratulations on sticking with your game plan.

Hopefully you don't have to much debt in student loans.

LOL! funny you're claiming to be "in grad school", yet you don't even know how to spell a 3rd grade word properly( It's "too", not "to", not "two")

dpacrkk
11-05-2014, 11:16 AM
LOL! funny you're claiming to be "in grad school", yet you don't even know how to spell a 3rd grade word properly( It's "too", not "to", not "two")
Funny that you correct the homonym but do not use comma in the quotation marks correctly multiple times. This isn't defending anybody, just pointing out the irony and double standard.

Nikki_Fox
11-05-2014, 11:28 AM
LOL! funny you're claiming to be "in grad school", yet you don't even know how to spell a 3rd grade word properly( It's "too", not "to", not "two")

The members are engaging in an intelligent discussion and you hi-jack the thread with your unnecessary comments. If you don't have anything meaningful to contribute then why are you????

Kellydancer
11-05-2014, 10:36 PM
Not to mention that outside of two posts today his last postings were two years ago.

SnuffleUffleGrass
11-06-2014, 10:45 AM
Ok I want to inject some good news into this thread so here are some fields that will always be hiring/produce a stable income for many, many of whom don't need to go beyond earning a 4 year degree-

* Corrections, Law Enforcement and Security services- face it, prisons aren't going away and the world is not going to get safer

* Cleaning Services- Rich people never want to do their own cleaning

* Sales- part of capitalism is always competing with everyone else- sales jobs are hard but someone has to do the footwork to promote a company's interests

SweetJulia
11-06-2014, 12:35 PM
LOL! funny you're claiming to be "in grad school", yet you don't even know how to spell a 3rd grade word properly( It's "too", not "to", not "two")

To be fair, your didn't capitalize your F in first.

Back to the thread-unfortunately, many fields in my area are oversaturated. I became a nurse in 2008 and had no problem finding a job. Now, there's countless, hopeful new grads who have to put out resumes for six months to a year to find work. I'm working on a social services degree, a lot of people in my program get jobs before graduating, so I guess that field isn't suffering. Despite technology becoming bigger and bigger, I know many people who are unemployed with IT degrees, as they all chose to jump on that bandwagon at the same time. I'd say, if it's been a year and you haven't found work in your chosen field, it's time to re-evaluate things.

charlie61
11-06-2014, 12:41 PM
This thread is so fucking depressing. >_<

dpacrkk
11-06-2014, 01:03 PM
Despite technology becoming bigger and bigger, I know many people who are unemployed with IT degrees, as they all chose to jump on that bandwagon at the same time.
IT is a pretty broad field, but contrary to what many people claim, there is a huge dearth of software engineers, developers, analysts, etc. For many though, it's just the perception that a degree is enough to get a job when one still has to pass a phone screen, a technical interview, and be a cultural fit. Having interviewed candidates (spectrum of new grads to veterans) for openings with my previous and current employers, it's that the candidates are generally lacking and we don't have the time to mentor and catch new hires up to speed, so we pass on the majority of applicants.

charlie61
11-06-2014, 01:10 PM
IT is a pretty broad field, but contrary to what many people claim, there is a huge dearth of software engineers, developers, analysts, etc. For many though, it's just the perception that a degree is enough to get a job when one still has to pass a phone screen, a technical interview, and be a cultural fit. Having interviewed candidates (spectrum of new grads to veterans) for openings with my previous and current employers, it's that the candidates are generally lacking and we don't have the time to mentor and catch new hires up to speed, so we pass on the majority of applicants.

That's what my SO says about CS degrees, too. Whenever he comes across a recently graduated CS major, he's stunned by how little they know about programming from a practical standpoint!

Kellydancer
11-06-2014, 10:18 PM
I know a lot of unemployed IT people along with teachers, scientists, pretty much any job. Even nurses, which used to be a safe field are over saturated. I did go to yoga class with a few physical therapist students who were offered jobs after graduating but that is a field that requires many years of school. My brother is one in the army and is a Dr.

Hopper
11-07-2014, 05:17 AM
In terms of overall changes, a few talking heads are already discussing 'neo-feudalism'. This is based on an assumption that, with certain exceptions, a good chunk of remaining 'middle class' jobs will increasingly fall victim to automation and/or downward wage pressure. This in turn will leave the modern equivalent of feudal 'lords' earning big money via their ownership of mostly automated means of production ( as well as passive earnings on real estate and other investments ), and the modern equivalent of feudal 'serfs' earning just enough money to cover food, clothing, shelter, cableTV, cheap beer etc. The same talking heads also speculate that the feudal role of the Clergy ... with a standard of living somewhere in between the two extremes ... will be taken by engineers, technicians, financial types, gov't workers etc. who are necessary to keep the 'neo-feudal' system operating.

Sounds like what Saint-Simon, an early pioneer of modern socialism, originally advocated: industrialists organize society for productive labor and science takes the place of religion for the spiritual direction of the masses. Later he replaced this idea with "the cause of the poor", which his disciple, Auguste Comte, founder of the field of sociology, utterly disagreed with. Marx made "the cause of the poor" the basis of the socialist ideology, in place of elitism, though no poor people ever actually led the socialist movement (being too busy working or looking for food, uneducated and sick).

The real aim of socialism and sociology is plutocracy. It doesn't arise from free-market capitalism, as Marx claimed.

Warped
11-15-2014, 04:17 PM
I have a masters degree and still strip. I can't seem to give up the money and the flexible hours. However, I like the security of knowing I have a fallback if I ever want to quit. The peace of mind in knowing that I won't be one of those trapped older dancers was well worth the money.

charlie61
11-16-2014, 01:10 PM
I have a masters degree and still strip. I can't seem to give up the money and the flexible hours. However, I like the security of knowing I have a fallback if I ever want to quit. The peace of mind in knowing that I won't be one of those trapped older dancers was well worth the money.

Very cool! What is your master's degree in? Do you do anything (volunteering, interning) in the field to keep your resume up-to-date? I'm totally just curious since I think this is an interesting option (getting an advanced degree, dancing until that's no longer the best option, and then using your degree to get a salaried job). :)

Warped
11-17-2014, 01:38 AM
My degree is in the mental health field and I volunteered for about a year at a facility but don't anymore. I always figured I could volunteer somewhere for a year again before I choose to leave dancing to have something to put on my resume.

nick73
11-17-2014, 05:01 PM
7 countries where Americans can study at universities, in English, for free (or almost free)


http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/10/29/7-countries-where-americans-can-study-at-universities-in-english-for-free-or-almost-free/


"Since 1985, U.S. college costs have surged by about 500 percent, and tuition fees keep rising. In Germany, they've done the opposite.

The country's universities have been tuition-free since the beginning of October, when Lower Saxony became the last state to scrap the fees. Tuition rates were always low in Germany, but now the German government fully funds the education of its citizens -- and even of foreigners."

"Germany's higher education landscape primarily consists of internationally well-ranked public universities, some of which receive special funding because the government deems them "excellent institutions." What's more, Americans can earn a German undergraduate or graduate degree without speaking a word of German and without having to pay a single dollar of tuition fees: About 900 undergraduate or graduate degrees are offered exclusively in English, with courses ranging from engineering to social sciences. For some German degrees, you don't even have to formally apply."