View Full Version : I Want to Go High End! Help and Advice Please?
red.velvet
12-19-2015, 01:03 PM
@red I don't want to say it doesn't happen, just that IMHO it is not something that can happen overnight. You might be different or have skills we don't know about.
I don't know what that is supposed to mean. I have heard it from these girls firsthand. These girls always pour out their secrets to me or in front of me, its weird and I don't get it.
BombshellBelle
12-20-2015, 05:02 AM
I am not a high end escort, but I may be able to help due to my location (Central NC).
There is money to be made here, but not quite what you're hoping for. From what I understand, what few "high end" girls are here aren't really doing much right now.
My mentor charges $300 an hour and was able to quit her day job, *but* 1) She's been doing it for years, has a site, does porn, etc and 2) She's a knockout TS, so its her fetish that sells.
It was suggested that you get a day job and be a mid-range escort on the side. This is solid advice, especially in our area. Its what I do and I live happily!
Best of luck, hon!
Eric Stoner
12-21-2015, 09:28 AM
Yes, that's why I mentioned they want their bills paid. They get an allowance.
I must filter out a certain type of girl then. For example, I won't sponsor any girl that does hard drugs (coke, meth, etc.) I've certainly helped add to the amount of silicone in Miami and a bit in LA but not every girl has asked.
If you mean get other girls for threesomes, that is the norm. As for trading guys, it's not happened to me.
It could be be because I'm with a certain type of girl(s). Like I said, my girls won't be into hard drugs. Some of my SoFL friends like a very different type of girl. A group of us went out on the boat and there was a fight. Hair extensions were pulled, someone went overboard. It was hilarious but kind of ruined the day.
Eric, are you into the escort scene or sb or party girl?
The "escort" model is a flat fee for service based on time.
Sugar Babies get their bills paid with an allowance thrown in.
Party girls usually get both or a combination of the two.
I wasn't talking about drugs or anything concerning same. Like you I avoid druggies like the plague.
I was talking about BOTH recruiting friends for threesomes and parties AND swapping clients. Both are not uncommon.
I am RETIRED. From hobbying ; from partying ; from hosting ; from clubbing BUT I have a lot of friends who are still involved in the scene and they keep me very well informed plus I still belong to various sites and groups where all this and more is discussed. Yes, sometimes there are conflicts. Usually when two "crews" mix or one group comes on to another's turf. None of the ones I've seen turned violent except in Europe. Noisy yes. Violent no.
red.velvet
12-21-2015, 10:32 PM
The "escort" model is a flat fee for service based on time.
Sugar Babies get their bills paid with an allowance thrown in.
Party girls usually get both or a combination of the two.
Exactly. There's no way to be "high end" on a flat fee per hour model unless you're like a Victoria's Secret model or a A/B/C level actress. However, for those girls, IF a guy is going to pay that high of a flat fee per hour rate, I'm sure 99% would much rather do more of a sugarbaby type of arrangement unless he himself is also famous and has his time micromanaged so he can only do an hour or two. Which brings me back to the following:
"Sugarbaby" type of arrangements have been going on in Hollywood for decades. That to me is REAL high end, not this hourly bullshit. I'm obviously hourly because its a dream to make a VERY good living NOT being hourly unless you have major media exposure like 500k instagram followers or are a B level actress or something that can net you multiple 5 or 6 figures spent on you type of sugar daddies.
One or two sugar daddies aren't going to do the trick unless he's forking out major money. He has no incentive to fork out that money on you if you don't bring anything fancy to the table that the other thousands of girls can't bring. These girls are already young, fit, beautiful, cultured, and intelligent. You need something more, you need published work.
Again, there is too much supply (girls) and not enough demand (generous, wealthy men), so you have to be extremely established in major motion pictures, runway modeling, or print in order to catch multiple of these mens' attention and wallets.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 02:08 AM
I've seen so many sugardaddy type of clients post in here. I am curious, for you men:
What do you look for in a sugarbaby? How do you choose one over another since there are so many? And what is the determining factor on the money you give or don't give her? How many do you have at once? How often do you see her/them? How long do you keep each one around for?
As a leggy blonde, I have been approached for these arrangements, but I still don't see them fitting. It would only make sense for me to go through with it if he almost never wanted to meet, and planned to hand over $10,000 or more per month, which seems fair with all the strings that are required. I have not received an offer that high, but I also don't have any published work. I'd rather be an anonymous mid-range escort and live life on my own terms. Knowing when I am working and when I'm not, and not having to answer to anyone.
NoRegrets
12-22-2015, 06:36 AM
red.velvet, I think you hit on the difference between girls that are sugar babies and escorts. You said you like the freedom and lack of strings being an escort. If that's very important to you than you'd be very unhappy being sponsored. To answer your questions:
What do I look for? I look for someone that is attractive (duh) and that I'm comfortable hanging out with. She can go to events with me and fit it. She also fits in with my friends. She's dd free and does not cause any drama. I'm not looking for someone that is on a string, it should be like a regular relationship. If she has something else to do, no problem. But if she can't ever see me than whats the point.
I normally start out with 500-1000 for the first meeting to see if we "click". If we do then it's 4-6k a month to start to make sure everything works. As we see each other more the amount goes up. I had a girl that was getting 10k a month but we were seeing each other almost every day (at that point she was almost living with me).
I've had girls for just a few months if it doesn't work or for many years (my girl friday). It depends on how things develop.
If you're looking for 10k just to almost never see the guy, I don't think you'll find many takers. He could just give 10k to a stranger on the street in that case. It seems like you're doing what you like. As I said before, other girls like the lifestyle that comes along with being with a wealthy person.
On that note, to any sugar daddies/husbands/girls reading this a small piece of advice. You can get LV bags at up to 30% off. If you're in Europe (or have a friend there) go to a LV store (not the internet). They still haven't adjusted their prices for the string dollar. When you buy the bag (or anything else) keep the receipt and give it to the VAT office in the airport when you leave. You get the VAT back and you don't pay sales tax in the US. Depending on the sales tax in your state the exact same bag can be 30% less.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 06:23 PM
Okay that is definitely not high end then. 4-6k is what an escort could make in a week. So making that much in a month, for a relationship type of "arrangement" seems way too low. Someone who is stunningly beauty cannot live off that unless they are renting a room, never purchase new quality clothes, don't go to school or pay tuition, and never have any sort of cosmetic surgery.
My lip injections alone are $500, tanning is another $250, hair is $200. Those 3 little pieces of the puzzle alone total $1,000. This is generous pricing. $5,000? A tiny apartment and utilities would run $1,500 or more. A car payment and insurance is at least another $500. We have already hit $3,000 and we haven't even touched on taxes for proof of income. Food $400, cell phone $100, transportation and maitenence $200, bills in general $300, school tuition $1k, clothes (its very important to have constant new outfits in that world) $1k, quality cosmetics $200, health and dental insurance $400, etc. We have already passed the $5,000 mark by far. No high end girl could ever, ever live off that kind of "salary" and still meet up with all of the basic implied demands in order to stay hot enough to remain high end. There's just no way.
What kind of girl would work THAT hard to be that hot, have sex with older men she doesn't find attractive, and spend so much time with someone JUST for his money only to go into debt or, hopefully, at least BREAK EVEN? A pretty dumb and naive girl, that's who. Her pay will go down over time, and her expenses will go up. She will be seen as less valuable by these "sugardaddies" and will need to put in more time (time is money) to look attractive in the gym, and spend even more on cosmetic surgery. So she needs to be making a LARGE profit or it isn't worth it.
It scares me that a lot of older men take advantage of these naive women in kind of a predatory way, and keep them on this hamster wheel of breaking even so they can't really leave that lifestyle until they are thrown out and left with little to nothing. Its a temporary lifestyle, and not a smart investment unless men are investing in you BIG time ($10k+ per month with minimal time investment and you having alternate ways to make money) or working hard at escorting while you have a REAL career.
If a man was giving me only $5,000 per month and expected to have a "relationship" type of arrangement, it would be completely illogical. Why would I commit to only him, keep in constant communication through text and in person, and not be making any other sort of money? Sorry, but I have to say that if a girl took that little, she would be completely foolish and not realize her true worth. She would have to have self-esteem problems so there goes the emotional instability aspect. Or she would be a sociopath, which a lot of these girls genuinely are. 90% of those girls ARE secretly escorting on the side left and right, and the other 10% are naive and some of the least intelligent women I have come across. And if she's secretly escorting, why would she remain in that "relationship" when she's charging $500+ per hour? All she needs is 2-3 clients/hours per week to cover what you are giving her monthly for all of that time. Its illogical. $5,000 per WEEK rather than month is pretty easy to clear if you put in the effort, as an escort and are in that highest tier attractive range. $5,000 per month as an escort is easy as pie, at least the type of "sugarbaby" you would be interested in if she spent that time escorting instead.
I feel like the only girls who fall for an amount that low with such limitations (seeing no other clients, no escorting, having a "relationship" type of arrangement) are ones that are too naive to realize what they could really charge. Even if there were no limitation, it still makes no sense why she would spend so much time with someone when she could spend less time and make more money, like with actual escorting.
This is why I say "high end" escorting doesn't exist. Sugarbabies are often naive girls who are cheating themselves out of what they really could make if they escorted instead. With escorting, you often rely on regulars which is basically the same thing as a sugardaddy only with spending less time, making more money, and way fewer strings attached.
NoRegrets
12-22-2015, 07:29 PM
Why are you trying to convince everyone (including yourself) that being an escort is better than being a sugar baby? The girl I was with for a year and a half walked away with about 500k. She could have been an escort if she wanted, and maybe she could have walked away with more money in her bank account if she did. She made a choice for what she wanted to do. Is being an escort better than a stripper? Or a webcam girl? Just because you think it's not for you doesn't mean everyone feels the same way. It's clear that you have an issue with the "relationship" part. You've never actually been a sugar baby but you have an image in your mind of a controlling ugly old guy. Just stick to what you're doing. If someone else wants to be a stripper, cam girl, or sugar baby it doesn't affect your life at all. Look at it this way, maybe some women would have a problem with seeing 3 different guys each week for $500 instead of the same guy(s) for $5000 a month. To each their own.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 08:55 PM
Oh I've been a sugarbaby, but I did not feel like 8k per month was sufficient when its just more economical to make money escorting without strings. Its all a numbers game, and that is what I'm trying to point out. I will gladly go where the highest dollar is, and that just so happens to be in escorting since I don't want to expose myself now for a few years of high end money only to not be able to make money in future careers later on due to exposure. That would be pretty reckless. You are taking this the wrong way.
NoRegrets
12-22-2015, 10:14 PM
Oh I've been a sugarbaby, but I did not feel like 8k per month was sufficient when its just more economical to make money escorting without strings. Its all a numbers game, and that is what I'm trying to point out. I will gladly go where the highest dollar is, and that just so happens to be in escorting since I don't want to expose myself now for a few years of high end money only to not be able to make money in future careers later on due to exposure. That would be pretty reckless. You are taking this the wrong way.
Let's do the math. You had an arrangement for 8k a month that wasn't enough. So without fame/portfolio you're in the $300 range. If you're above the market rate that's ok, it won't help that much. So right off the bat with no expenses you need to see 27 guys (about 1 a day) to make the same amount. But you need to factor in advertising, website, photo shoots, hotel rooms, transportation, etc. You also need to factor in the amount of time you are on the phone organizing the guys. This will include the flakes and running background checks. In addition, you need to factor in the chance that one of your clients is LE and you get busted. How much would it cost to fight and remove that from your record? Of course you'll want to get regulars since that helps but that starts becoming more like an arrangement with those strings you don't like. You also are running the risks of STIs where a sd can be tested (along with you). Even if your sd doesn't get tested, it seems like having sex 4 times a month with one guy is less risky than 27 times with different guys.
If you're worried about being exposed and hurting future career opportunities, isn't your risk higher with 27 clients (and possible LE) than one wealthy guy? It seems that if you're caught it's somewhat more acceptable that you "dated" one guy than were caught by LE and charged with a crime.
Do you mind if I ask what you make monthly? Obviously if you're making 25k a month, other than being very organized and very busy, then 8k will seem like chump change to you.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 10:19 PM
Let's do the math. You had an arrangement for 8k a month that wasn't enough. So without fame/portfolio you're in the $300 range. If you're above the market rate that's ok, it won't help that much. So right off the bat with no expenses you need to see 27 guys (about 1 a day) to make the same amount. But you need to factor in advertising, website, photo shoots, hotel rooms, transportation, etc. You also need to factor in the amount of time you are on the phone organizing the guys. This will include the flakes and running background checks. In addition, you need to factor in the chance that one of your clients is LE and you get busted. How much would it cost to fight and remove that from your record? Of course you'll want to get regulars since that helps but that starts becoming more like an arrangement with those strings you don't like. You also are running the risks of STIs where a sd can be tested (along with you). Even if your sd doesn't get tested, it seems like having sex 4 times a month with one guy is less risky than 27 times with different guys.
If you're worried about being exposed and hurting future career opportunities, isn't your risk higher with 27 clients (and possible LE) than one wealthy guy? It seems that if you're caught it's somewhat more acceptable that you "dated" one guy than were caught by LE and charged with a crime.
Do you mind if I ask what you make monthly? Obviously if you're making 25k a month, other than being very organized and very busy, then 8k will seem like chump change to you.
You're overestimating the escort work and underestimating the sugardaddy work. You need to constantly text with sugardaddy, always be in character even when you're bored to tears not knowing how long you'll have to be around him, learn new things to continually pique his interest, meet him whenever hes available on his terms because he's paying you, cater to all of his needs, have BAREBACK sex, not be able to really have much of your own life because you're living under his thumb or around his life as his pet. That's reality. And it isn't worth 8k per month. Not worth it.
With escort work, you only need to shoot once or twice a year unless you drastically change your look. You should not change your look if it is making you money, that is a bad idea. You only need to advertise when you are in the market for new clients. I make the bulk of my income off regulars, which are basically less needy sugardaddies who pay per hour instead of giving me an allowance to be under their thumb. If I put up new ads, I work with a booker and give her a small cut and it saves me LOTS of time and makes me way more money in the long run. I also DO NOT have bareback sex like a sugardaddy would require, and will leave when that becomes the norm. Or, more likely, market myself really uniquely. If you get busted escorting, its a misdemeanor and you can get it reduced with the right lawyer. However, busts seem rare if you screen. I don't even know anyone who has been busted and I've been a "provider" off and on for almost a decade now. I worry about it, but in reality it won't be a big deal if it happens, and I have more worries if I were to have a sugardaddy where my 1 money egg is in 1 basket. Now that's scary.
Most of all, I can work my lucrative dayjob job in sales during the day, and essentially make a big income doing this. I could not work that job with a sugardaddy because he's basically paying for a pretty homemaker who is available when he wants her but can disappear whenever and for however long he pleases. No thanks. Even if he did "allow" me to work a full time lucrative day job (which is probably a turnoff for any wealthy man honestly), would I want to then go spend all my free time in character with this man not knowing how many hours upon hours he wants to spend with me while I'm looking at the clock? No. I'd like to be able to micromanage my time and still have a life and hobbies that I get to do whenever I please. Not around someone else's demanding schedule. As an escort, you don't have to work daily and that wouldn't even be smart. But as a sugarbaby, you are basically on call 24/7.
Unless a girl is receiving 5 figures or more monthly from a man and is still able to live her life as she pleases, I really think "sugaring" is for the naive. For the girls who lie to themselves telling themselves they aren't escorting because its only with one guy. No, it still is, only it has more strings, less money, and not on your own terms. That's reality.
Nice try.
NoRegrets
12-22-2015, 10:35 PM
So you basically had the worst possible sugar daddy from hell (controlling, time waster, bareback, treated you like a slave). How did you ever end up with this guy(s) and why didn't you run screaming after the first meeting? You screen your clients as an escort to minimize your risks. Why did you even reply to any guy that made the awesome offer: I'll text you all day, you are my slave, you need to come running 24/7, bareback sex only, you don't have a life anymore, 8k a month.
If you had met a non-insane sugar daddy, maybe you would have a different opinion. Your experience is valid, but it's a very broad brush you're painting with.
My last "girlfriend" was and is studying. She had an apartment about 15 minutes from mine (she had it before we met). Why would you think that you cannot live a normal life: studying, working, hanging with your friends? She did all those things. We only were together about 1 day a week in the evening. Other than that it was a planned event (she liked concerts and clubs). I have no clue what you're saying about a homemaker. What kinds of guys are you meeting? That's what maids and cooks are for. Aren't many sugar babies students at a university? They don't all drop out and quit their day jobs.
I'm going to bow out at this point. This is getting circular and no good information is being presented. We are not going to convince each other of anything.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 10:40 PM
So you basically had the worst possible sugar daddy from hell (controlling, time waster, bareback, treated you like a slave). How did you ever end up with this guy(s) and why didn't you run screaming after the first meeting? You screen your clients as an escort to minimize your risks. Why did you even reply to any guy that made the awesome offer: I'll text you all day, you are my slave, you need to come running 24/7, bareback sex only, you don't have a life anymore, 8k a month.
If you had met a non-insane sugar daddy, maybe you would have a different opinion. Your experience is valid, but it's a very broad brush you're painting with.
No the ones I had were nice. This is just reality. I was young, naive, and selling myself short because I didn't realize I could easily make more escorting.
Remember, if you're beautiful enough to land a moderately generous sugardaddy, you will be beautiful enough to land a dozen or two generous regulars who will all act like sugardaddies but are on a strict hourly clock AND under YOUR (the escort's) thumb. In this case, there is strength in numbers.
Sugardaddies often want it to be the 1940s all over again, only this time without a marriage contract (leaving no security for the woman) so they can trade in the girl for a new one in a year or two if she even makes it that far. The woman, the sugarbaby, she gets the short end of the stick. This is reality and I've seen it countless times. It is not a smart move for a girl unless she is making massive income that she physically could not make escorting, which is $150,000 or more because you could make that much escorting easily if you are really attractive and dedicated. Girls raise their rates after they become established, remember that.
Bottom line: you can make more money escorting, have more free time, and "job" security. Its true.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 10:55 PM
We only were together about 1 day a week in the evening. Other than that it was a planned event (she liked concerts and clubs). I have no clue what you're saying about a homemaker. What kinds of guys are you meeting? That's what maids and cooks are for.
Lets do the math. You pay her 8k per month and meet once a week. That averages out to a little less than 2k per meet. In that same meet, an escort could have made more with that multi-hour appointment, especially if it was an overnight booking. And she would be allowed to book as many of those as she wanted instead of being someone's "girlfriend" who was set at once a week or whatever his schedule could allow.
Its monetary logistics. Escorting would still make more money and its basically the same exact thing. This is exactly what GFE clients book girls for. This is exactly what my regulars do. Only we don't do bareback. I could charge even more if I did bareback, but I don't want to go there.
Aren't many sugar babies students at a university? They don't all drop out and quit their day jobs.
Yes, and its because they either have no idea how to escort, no idea how much they could make escorting, or because they don't want to admit they are escorting when they actually are. Their loss. Most are young and naive. I know I was.
DonaDiabla
12-22-2015, 11:23 PM
Red.Velvet,
Well all respect but I am going to address your statement about "Sugaring" being for the naive. Just because your experience was bad and had to be man's pet...does not mean that sugaring is for the naive. Nor everyone had the same sugaring experience. I had made tons of money with a sugar daddy this year and never had to go bareback with him. In fact, I did not have to have sex with him at all. However, I had been sugaring off and on since the age of 14.....I never had to be a man's pet nor slave. I did not have to lie to myself about my arrangement with men. They were made on my terms and if men did not follow my terms...then they were send packing. Remember just because you were naive to how the sugar baby game is play does not mean everyone else. I knew how the game was played when I was 14. So, do not used your bitterness towards your own sugar daddy experience to talk down to other girls who sugar.Now, I do not know why are trying to spread that myth about having to sex with a sugar daddy in order to get tons of money. Nor was I comparing webcamming to escorting. I was talking about my sugar baby career only. Plus, Financial domination is a totally different thing than sugaring. I did sugaring in person and I did not have to sex with a man in order to get money.You were just bitching about how your sugar daddy treated you like a slave and wanted you to go bare-backed. If that is not a bad sugaring experience...then I do not know what is. This is what you quoted "You need to constantly text with sugardaddy, always be in character even when you're bored to tears not knowing how long you'll have to be around him, learn new things to continually pique his interest, meet him whenever hes available on his terms because he's paying you, cater to all of his needs, have BAREBACK sex, not be able to really have much of your own life because you're living under his thumb or around his life as his pet. That's reality. And it isn't worth 8k per month. Not worth it." I was addressing your statements about sugaring only. I was not comparing escorting to sugaring.My point is that you can be sugar baby and not have sex with your sugar daddy in order to get money. Just because you did not get a non-sexual arrangement in person does not mean that sugar babies did not get that. That was my sugar baby experience :)
You're overestimating the escort work and underestimating the sugardaddy work. You need to constantly text with sugardaddy, always be in character even when you're bored to tears not knowing how long you'll have to be around him, learn new things to continually pique his interest, meet him whenever hes available on his terms because he's paying you, cater to all of his needs, have BAREBACK sex, not be able to really have much of your own life because you're living under his thumb or around his life as his pet. That's reality. And it isn't worth 8k per month. Not worth it.
With escort work, you only need to shoot once or twice a year unless you drastically change your look. You should not change your look if it is making you money, that is a bad idea. You only need to advertise when you are in the market for new clients. I make the bulk of my income off regulars, which are basically less needy sugardaddies who pay per hour instead of giving me an allowance to be under their thumb. If I put up new ads, I work with a booker and give her a small cut and it saves me LOTS of time and makes me way more money in the long run. I also DO NOT have bareback sex like a sugardaddy would require, and will leave when that becomes the norm. Or, more likely, market myself really uniquely. If you get busted escorting, its a misdemeanor and you can get it reduced with the right lawyer. However, busts seem rare if you screen. I don't even know anyone who has been busted and I've been a "provider" off and on for almost a decade now. I worry about it, but in reality it won't be a big deal if it happens, and I have more worries if I were to have a sugardaddy where my 1 money egg is in 1 basket. Now that's scary.
Most of all, I can work my lucrative dayjob job in sales during the day, and essentially make a big income doing this. I could not work that job with a sugardaddy because he's basically paying for a pretty homemaker who is available when he wants her but can disappear whenever and for however long he pleases. No thanks. Even if he did "allow" me to work a full time lucrative day job (which is probably a turnoff for any wealthy man honestly), would I want to then go spend all my free time in character with this man not knowing how many hours upon hours he wants to spend with me while I'm looking at the clock? No. I'd like to be able to micromanage my time and still have a life and hobbies that I get to do whenever I please. Not around someone else's demanding schedule. As an escort, you don't have to work daily and that wouldn't even be smart. But as a sugarbaby, you are basically on call 24/7.
Unless a girl is receiving 5 figures or more monthly from a man and is still able to live her life as she pleases, I really think "sugaring" is for the naive. For the girls who lie to themselves telling themselves they aren't escorting because its only with one guy. No, it still is, only it has more strings, less money, and not on your own terms. That's reality.
Nice try.
red.velvet
12-22-2015, 11:26 PM
I've never ever had a bad sugaring experience lol. I would just much rather make $700 per hour rather than try to see what I can get out of a man long term because I know its not at least $700 per hour for all the hours we communicate. You have to weed through a lot of time wasters to find "gold" in the sugar world. Time is money.
I don't know why you are commenting on my post about sugaring being naive when I follow that comment solely talking about sex with a man, and you say you have never had sex with him. That is definitely not the same thing.
Non-sexual sugaring is financial domination or a paid activity partner. That is different. That is something that would compliment a cam girl, not an escort. Sugaring without sex is extremely rare and 99.9% of sugar daddies will expect sex. And honestly, if you broke down those hours, you'd still make more escorting, but you aren't even talking about sex, so again that's like comparing webcam to escorting. It has little in common and you are being paid for something else entirely.
Sugardaddies who don't pay at least 5 figures per month are either looking for a cheaper escort or want more a girlfriend/relationship arrangement, and both of those net less than what you'd make actually escorting if you break down the hours. Its logistical. Add up all the hours communicating or interacting in person and divide it by how much you made, and you would still make more money escorting. That was my point.
DonaDiabla
12-22-2015, 11:54 PM
Actually, No Regrets, I must agree with your statements here. Personally, I had minor problems with sugar daddies in my experience as a sugar baby....either they wanted me as their wife or they ran out of money.But I never had experiences with sugar daddies asking me for barebacking or trying to place me in a weird 1940s housewife relationship.
So you basically had the worst possible sugar daddy from hell (controlling, time waster, bareback, treated you like a slave). How did you ever end up with this guy(s) and why didn't you run screaming after the first meeting? You screen your clients as an escort to minimize your risks. Why did you even reply to any guy that made the awesome offer: I'll text you all day, you are my slave, you need to come running 24/7, bareback sex only, you don't have a life anymore, 8k a month.
If you had met a non-insane sugar daddy, maybe you would have a different opinion. Your experience is valid, but it's a very broad brush you're painting with.
My last "girlfriend" was and is studying. She had an apartment about 15 minutes from mine (she had it before we met). Why would you think that you cannot live a normal life: studying, working, hanging with your friends? She did all those things. We only were together about 1 day a week in the evening. Other than that it was a planned event (she liked concerts and clubs). I have no clue what you're saying about a homemaker. What kinds of guys are you meeting? That's what maids and cooks are for. Aren't many sugar babies students at a university? They don't all drop out and quit their day jobs.
I'm going to bow out at this point. This is getting circular and no good information is being presented. We are not going to convince each other of anything.
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 12:14 AM
Lol yeah I am not getting into this with you. I have received money for no sex plenty of times. But I am talking about sex here, so you can keep ranting about your thing but I'm not referring to situations without sex.
DonaDiabla
12-23-2015, 12:38 AM
Red.velvet,
LMAO, did I hit a nerve when talking about my sugar baby career. If you did not want anyone to call you out of your bitterness towards your sugar baby career than you should not talk about it on a public forum. You were bitching and nagging about being a sugar baby and how your sugar daddies tried to control you. But when I confront you about your sugar baby career...then you get super catty.Remember your quote" I was young, naive, and selling myself short because I didn't realize I could easily make more escorting." If you do not give a damn, then do not throw it up :)
Lol yeah I am not getting into this with you. I have received money for no sex plenty of times. But I am talking about sex here, so you can keep ranting about your thing but I'm not referring to situations without sex.
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 01:29 AM
I have never had a sugar daddy try to control me or a bad experience. They come with extra strings because they want to text, they want to meet when its convenient for THEM, they want to be the ringleader. Those are extra hoops I don't need. Its not a financially smart move when you are an established escort with generous regulars who work around YOUR (my) schedule and have to either leave or pay more when they stay 1 minute longer than I allotted beforehand. Not string for me, only for him.
Yeah when I turned 18, the world was different and there wasn't information readily available about escorting and sugar daddy websites did not exist. So of course I was naive! I was meeting wealthy men out and about and from dancing, and also worked a dungeon. I am well versed in the art of financial domination and getting money for non-sexual activities from "sugardaddies" as you call them. However, that is NOT what I'm referring to here. I am solely talking about companionship INVOLVING SEX, for money and how to maximize your profit doing so.
Again, NOT what you are talking about. That is a different topic entirely I haven't even touched on. You are free to make your own thread on that separate topic (sugardaddies who don't expect sex) :). I will not be responding to your posts in this thread anymore due to that reason, since there is nothing more to add.
DonaDiabla
12-23-2015, 01:58 AM
:) Well, we talked it out and this thread can get back on track. Kisses and hugs :)
LexyLove
12-23-2015, 02:48 AM
(deleted)
Bahuba
12-23-2015, 10:09 AM
Why, why, can't I stay away from this thread??
First of all Lexy I'm sorry that happened to you. Rapists belong in jail. Red, I'm sorry you had a super douche for an SD. Actually, he wasn't a sugar daddy, he was a dickwad with a few bucks.
Every escort who has ever talked with me (not as a client to be hustled but as an acquaintance) has had several bad customers. Many of them have dealt with assaults and arrests. Almost every one has received menacing calls from would-be "pimps".
Please let's be clear: in the United States, however crazy it is, escorting is illegal. Being a sugar baby is not.
Because of the idiotic, backwards views on sex workers, many of whom are performing a kindness for elderly or disabled gentlemen, an escort may not receive the support she needs when going to the police.
Sugaring is not superior to escorting, IMHO, both have serious challenges. If you have what it takes, as Lexy seems to, you can make excellent $$$.
Further, as a man who has never escorted (no one would hire me anyway :-/ ) I can only give you an opinion. Nothing I say will hold as much weight as someone who has actually been there.
I wish you success, safety, smiles, and satisfaction. You're in the same race we all are, to make some money and be happy.
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 10:25 AM
100% agree. I don't even know why people are challenging me on this issue because I have been very deep in this scene for years, also in LA. I have seen it firsthand and heard enough stories to last a lifetime lol. Its different from a sugardaddy's view because I am hearing the truth from women and also what goes on behind the scenes, not just living the fantasy.
I actually don't even think 10k per month is high end, that would just be the absolute minimum I would ever consider. Even then, I'd probably pass on that amount. I wouldn't be able to save much given the lifestyle I would need to maintain. Its all about how much you can profit and save.
I don't necessarily think sugarbabies or high end has a lot of plastic surgery. I just think, from what I have personally witnessed over the years, that the ones making the most money (not necessarily profiting the most) at least in LA are the runway or fitness model types with beautiful faces. Often times that means passing on food and getting a lot of surgery.
Obviously men are going to try to convince everyone that sugaring is the way to go, because they aren't the ones getting the short end of the stick. But honestly, they are in complete denial that the woman probably doesn't even like them and is acting the whole time (just like an escort does) and hiding a lot of secrets from them.
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 11:56 AM
When I think back on a few of my sugar daddies, they were essentially sexual predators. They prey on young and inexperienced girls because they know they can’t get away with that shit with escorts.
+1! I cannot emphasize this ENOUGH! Sugardaddies are often purposely predatory (even if they act sweet the entire time you know them) because they sure as hell know they won't get away with the things they do with sugarbabies, with an experienced escort. They know they aren't paying her standard market rate, but she's not an "escort" right so he doesn't have to :rotfl:. Its really sad. These women are selling themselves short. Doing more for less pay, under the manipulation of the sugardaddy.
Do you ever notice how sugardaddies say "no pros! no professionals!" and its to trick girls into thinking "hey I'm so much better than an escort! I'm not an escort, I'm a high end sugarbaby :)" just so he can get away with paying her LESS than standard market rate escorting, and expect MORE than he could get with an escort. More time, extras (bareback sex, whatever he wants), and that's how he tricks her into it. He gives her gifts on top of a lower pay (than escorting) to make her think he's being generous, but its a facade. Its manipulation. These men know better, but the girls do not! Its so creepy.
Point blank, she's doing EVERYTHING an escort is doing AND MORE, for LESS pay and LESS profit. She is also working under HIS terms, and not her own. Its so sad.
LexyLove
12-23-2015, 02:08 PM
Yup yup yupp, I used to wonder why these men didn't hire escorts if money was not an issue for them. It certainly would save them a lot of wasted time and effort. I mean, just because you have money, doesn't mean its gonna be easy to pull girls... especially if the girls haven't dipped their toes into sex work yet. It's a lot of work! I still get messages from these horndogs saying that they miss me. It'd be so easy to just hire an escort to get laid. But thats not enough lol, they want it all. And with escorts, they don't get their way.
Then I would say me and red.velvet are on the same page about everything. Sure I could have made a lot of money sugaring, but the TOP sugar babies (who are outearning any kind of escort) will be super model gorgeous or have tons of plastic surgery.
Bahuba
12-23-2015, 02:25 PM
LOL at you guys labeling us predators! I don't even have an SB now. I was just sharing information. There are good and bad in every group. Anyway sorry my posts in this thread didn't help.
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 02:38 PM
Yup yup yupp, I used to wonder why these men didn't hire escorts if money was not an issue for them. It certainly would save them a lot of wasted time and effort. I mean, just because you have money, doesn't mean its gonna be easy to pull girls... especially if the girls haven't dipped their toes into sex work yet. It's a lot of work! I still get messages from these horndogs saying that they miss me. It'd be so easy to just hire an escort to get laid. But thats not enough lol, they want it all. And with escorts, they don't get their way.
Then I would say me and red.velvet are on the same page about everything. Sure I could have made a lot of money sugaring, but the TOP sugar babies (who are outearning any kind of escort) will be super model gorgeous or have tons of plastic surgery.
Exactly. They get off on the naivety of women that don't realize they can charge more. Its a dominance and power thing. Gross. They want what they don't think they are supposed to have because they are so used to using their money to buy people off in order to get what they want. Nothing is a thrill anymore after doing that for enough time. So they get off on tricking a girl into doing more for less. It must be the thrill factor. They could easily just hire an escort and get it over with, but instead they want to play games and find someone who doesn't know her own worth and value of what she could charge.
Yes, we are on the same page. Sugaring only makes sense in my mind if you make more than you could as an escort. If you are charging $500/hr as an escort, good luck getting more than that from a sugardaddy since its virtually impossible to even find one that will give you standard escort market rate value. You have to bring more to the table than the average girl. And the average girl is by no means average if she's making a good living off sexwork.
absolutelyadorable
12-23-2015, 06:29 PM
Even if your sd doesn't get tested, it seems like having sex 4 times a month with one guy is less risky than 27 times with different guys.
Sorry for the threadjack but.....no. That's not all together true.
The risk, IMO, is generally pretty equal because that one guy might be barebacking other women behind your back, while you're (again, generally) using protection with the 27 different guys. But, to give credit where it's due, I do see the point you were trying to make.
/end threadjack
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 08:37 PM
Sorry for the threadjack but.....no. That's not all together true.
The risk, IMO, is generally pretty equal because that one guy might be barebacking other women behind your back, while you're (again, generally) using protection with the 27 different guys. But, to give credit where it's due, I do see the point you were trying to make.
/end threadjack
Not only that, but it doesn't take 27 guys to make what you would make from 1 sugardaddy. Assuming the girl has ZERO regulars (which is highly unlikely), it would only take around 8 men for the established girl to reach the same amount of profit. More like 3-4 men if she had regulars. 4 men covered >>>>>> 1 man bareback. I really don't think any man should give advice on this topic because they are only seeing things from the fantasy side, and not reality.
Also, yes you're right, he probably is fucking other girls bareback behind her back. Especially if he is barely seeing her.
NoRegrets
12-23-2015, 08:40 PM
adorable, i have never and will never have unprotected sex with a girl i sponsor. My point was protected sex with one person is safer than with 27 guys. There's always a small chance the condom breaks or comes off. The talk here about bareback i find crazy. There's absolutely no upside to it and many downsides./soapbox
absolutelyadorable
12-23-2015, 09:25 PM
adorable, i have never and will never have unprotected sex with a girl i sponsor. My point was protected sex with one person is safer than with 27 guys. There's always a small chance the condom breaks or comes off. The talk here about bareback i find crazy. There's absolutely no upside to it and many downsides./soapbox
Lol @ 'soapbox.' But seriously though, you might not do it but there are plenty who do. Most guys with enough money aren't sponsoring just 1 woman, and on top of that a lot of times they're married. Married couples don't usually use condoms, and a lot of sugar babies are barebacking. Yikes.
Here's one scenario: a girlfriend of mine who worked with me back when I escorted was pretty popular with the custies, but ended up getting exposed to herpes......by her bf. Scary shit.
red.velvet
12-23-2015, 09:56 PM
Lol @ 'soapbox.' But seriously though, you might not do it but there are plenty who do. Most guys with enough money aren't sponsoring just 1 woman, and on top of that a lot of times they're married. Married couples don't usually use condoms, and a lot of sugar babies are barebacking. Yikes.
Here's one scenario: a girlfriend of mine who worked with me back when I escorted was pretty popular with the custies, but ended up getting exposed to herpes......by her bf. Scary shit.
Yes this is what I'm saying! I don't know why people are acting like we don't know what we are talking about, when we are both actively in or around that scene!
I hear girls all the time talking about how STDs aren't a big deal anymore because they are basically all curable or have treatment. Barebacking is EXTREMELY common, and the norm in the sugarbaby world. In escorting its not the norm, but bareback blowjobs and deep french kissing are the norm, so its probably only a matter of time until bareback sex becomes common in the escort world (it is with PSE), all thanks to the sugarbaby trend. That is what flooded the market and caused the overall market rate for escorting to drop. Because of the flood of "sugarbabies" not knowing their own worth and what they could charge if they just called themselves an escort instead of a sugarbaby. Its sad.
Also, yes. Men with money will definitely have more than one sugarbaby, and will definitely want bareback with their sugarbaby. IF she won't bareback, he will get rid of her soon enough and trade her in for a girl that will because there are so many who have no problem with it. Very high quality, beautiful, intelligent, young girls. Bareback is very common and is standardly the norm.
NoRegrets
12-24-2015, 06:01 AM
adorable, on one hand it's being said the sugar daddies underpay and that it's easy to make 25k a month escorting. If that's the case why would any girl accept crazy conditions to be with a low paying sugar daddy? It seems that sugar babies should have a very long list of demands for the sd to even consider an arrangement.
If an escort client asked for bareback and wanted to pay $80, you would say no. If a sugar daddy only wants to pay 10k a month for bareback you should also say NO. You are in control at all times. Don't blame stupid guys for being cheap and risky. If you don't like the offer of one sugar daddy, move on to the next one. Even if you're right and most sponsors want bareback, it's your job to search for a non-cheap/crazy ones. I'm sure girls doing extras in stripclubs have offers of bareback all the time, hopefully they don't take any of those offers.
Don't you think it would be productive for red to post a thread about how an escort can make $25k a month with only a small number of regulars that do extended appointments? That would be a useful post.
Finally, Merry Christmas! Eat lots of food and enjoy the time with your families!
Sam38g
12-24-2015, 12:08 PM
For the most part has to do with availability... To be in an area for a short period of time, no more than 3 days and then leave. It isn't about working everyday of the month, but just a week or two. It is also about investing in a great location, don't stay are some okay hotel, but an expensive one. Get more money out of guys when you stay at the St Regis than the Four points by Sheraton. Don't work past 10pm, unless it is a regular who has seen you many times.
You have to be quality & not take guys who want 1/2 hour or discount rates, to stick with your high rate no matter what.
Great pics, lots of marketing. Plus taking those customers you have currently & having a great sales pitch & fun time with them that they leave you bigger & bigger tips & just not the amount you requested.
It is more of a mind set, how much do you value yourself?
Eric Stoner
12-28-2015, 08:14 AM
Many of you have addressed the positives and negatives of escorting vs. sugaring.
There is definitely more freedom with escorting. particularly if you are an Indy.
Sugar Daddy's want an exclusive or at the least no scheduling hassles i.e. when they call you come , you meet them at a certain place at a certain time ; you be home on a particular day and time etc. If you want to call that "control" go ahead. Most Sugar Daddys would expect it . At a minimum.
The possible experiences are broad. There are SB's who do a little escorting on the side ; some have straight jobs but like living way past what they could do on their salary alone etc. etc. Same for "party girls ".
I've posted this many times in several contexts : This stuff is NOT for everybody. If you decide to do it you must set parameters and boundaries that you can live with to maintain your own comfort zone.
luvnrockets
01-20-2016, 09:47 AM
I don't always read the Other Work section, but when I do, I spend all day sifting through these disorganized threads looking for real information.
This thread kicks a lot of ass. Just want to give a big, overarching thanks to everyone for enlightening me about the current state of things, from someone who has "always kinda wanted to get into escorting but only if it could work for me within certain parameters."
hyori
01-20-2016, 11:26 AM
This thread is a fascinating read! I take most of it with a grain of salt though because the experience is different for everybody. Most girls become SB's by accident. They are approached at airports, through FB, LinkedIn, IG, etc. and other such vanilla avenues. Some are just plain, old-fashioned gold diggers, socialites and groupies who get invited to A-list parties. Some just post in forums like these and get offers. It happened to me. He straight out told me he was rich and he wanted to take care of me. I spent the summer with him living the SB life but I didn't think at the time I was an SB of course. I was also approached through my LinkedIn vanilla account that has a picture of my face only! There is a difference between getting spammed by some pervert and a true genuine offer from a rich man who wants you in his life. You need to trust your gut instinct. I don't do that anymore because I am married. I only cam model and I love my life as a cam model. With virtual reality becoming more and more affordable and realistic, I believe it is the future of sex work. As long as the experience is real enough, virtual sex will take over for awhile because there will be no physical health risks, it will be convenient and for awhile, very profitable. Fantasies once considered taboo can be done. Once the market it saturated and everyone and their mother is getting their fantasies realized, virtual sex won't be as profitable but I suspect the price of offering real time physical sexual experiences will continually go up in price as virtual reality becomes more ubiquitous.
As for being a SB, I wouldn't say it's better or worse than being an escort. The lines are pretty blurred if you think about it all, only you can define it as such according to perspective. In the end, it's what you believe it to be because others are going to judge and label on your behalf anyway.