View Full Version : If strippers who do "extras" want the big money ...
Hey, you asked for an honest guess, I gave it to you, and you accuse me of sugar coating. WTF? I'm out on this thread.
Jay Zeno
08-11-2004, 07:02 AM
[Yea OTAY!!!!!!!!!
lolololololol
If as you say(this time)that you have no idea,then how would you know if my stats were wrong???
Me tinx you know more then you want to admit to Jay.
I have seen from your post that your not a putz and have been in this industry long enough to have formed an opinion on this subject.
Just take a stab at it,just a guess.
Agreeing with me might make you look bad,but i promise it wont hurt. ;D
The point of my statement was to show the inadvisability of throwing out an unsubstantiated number (95%) and then ridiculing other people's numbers (vast majority pay <some> taxes, or "many").
If 95% is right, it's right, but I'd like to see a basis for it beyond, possibly, conversations with some dancers local to one area.
I still have no idea. I've seen the industry, but only from a consumer standpoint. I don't ask dancers how much they make or if they pay taxes. It would be impolite. If they volunteer that information to me, I don't consider it a scientific sampling.
VenusGoddess
08-11-2004, 07:20 AM
I would agree with the actual DANCERS here. I pay taxes on my dancing income. I'm not taking a chance that I'd get audited and screwed later...so I'll just pay the damn taxes. Besides, I am considered an employee...so I get a paycheck every 2 weeks...there is no way that I can get away with paying NO taxes. The girls who do that will eventually have it catch up to them. Especially now since almost all form of income is documented in some way or form (paystubs/1099).
doc-catfish
08-11-2004, 07:57 AM
Uhh, they're not exactly scientific results, but does anyone remember this poll by chance?
http://www.stripperweb.com/forum/index.php?board=27;action=display;start=0;threadid =10005;viewResults=1
BigGreenMnM
08-11-2004, 08:43 AM
Hey, you asked for an honest guess, I gave it to you, and you accuse me of sugar coating. WTF? I'm out on this thread.
Dont get miffed lena,no offense ment.
Your member #59 on this forum of over 7000+,that is almost founding father material.That leads me to belive that you have been around this and know whats up and would respond from a point of view of someone who knows.
Not only do I not belive your "guess"but i dont think YOU belive it either.
Just my opinion.
BigGreenMnM
08-11-2004, 09:03 AM
Uhh, they're not exactly scientific results, but does anyone remember this poll by chance?
This is what really sticks out on this post.
"I think the results of this survey will be slightly skewed since SW are more money savvy than the average stripper.
You know you'd get a bunch of "huhs?" if you mentioned quarterly estimated income tax payments in the dressing room."
Entertainers with web sites and mags pay taxes on what they have to,the rest dont.
Most clubs in this country,and most overseas DONT have paychecks.Its a cash and carry business in more cases then not.Thats not a guess,its a fact.
Its only been the last 10-15 years that big business has been introduced into the mix,with that brought paychecks and entertainers who have to pay taxes on the money they are paid from those checks.
Now lets look at the paychecks shall we???
Most clubs that use them only pay waitress wages,less then min wage.True???
Then the Tip portion is left up to the entertainer who usually only pays the percentage of their states tip out ratio that they MUST pay.
Show me an entertainer who says she pays all her taxes and i will show you someone who is not telling the whole truth.
Tigerlilly
08-11-2004, 10:00 PM
Sorry to burst your bubble buddy but many of us do pay our proper taxes
Tigerlilly and I can finally agree on something ! Yes, today the vast majority of dancers do pay taxes.
Awe come on now we have agreed on several industry things over the years of posting on the same websites :flower:
,your pasties must be having a toxic effect if you really belive that most entertainers file.
BigGreen you didn't answer my previous question of how you come up with your 95% ? I'm thinking it's just your opinion, that's right now isn't it ?
FYI all the managers I have ever worked for got company paychecks as did bouncers and waitstaff, doorgirls, cooks- pretty much everyone except the dancers who signed I.C forms.
So your claim that manager cheat on their taxes isn't correct from my close to 10 years of experience working in various clubs across the U.S
Are you a customer or do you work in the industry? My guess is you are a customer.
Show me an entertainer who says she pays all her taxes and i will show you someone who is not telling the whole truth.
:irked:
I paid my taxes quarterly thankyou very much. As do many of the dancers that I know
Jay Zeno
08-11-2004, 11:18 PM
Big Green, this is nothing personal. You appear to have caring and respect for the dancers in your place, and that's admirable, although it doesn't make you an expert on every dancing situation everywhere in the country.
But with that aside, you're changing the parameters of your statement. I don't blame you, but...
Show me an entertainer who says she pays all her taxes and i will show you someone who is not telling the whole truth.
Sure. People in a cash business generally don't claim all their taxes. That's one of the advantages of a tax business.
But what you said earlier was (italics mine):
Go to any city or town.Round up the first 100 entertainers you can find.
95 of them dont pay taxes,the five who SAY they do,3 are full of chit,and the two who do, dont really claim what they really make.
You can add the dj's to that same list,most dont pay taxes,or they pay the taxes on the check they get only.
thats the same with the MGRS and doorguys also.
For 95%+,this is a tax free business.
See, you said "tax free," quoting 95 (actually 98)% as a number for paying zero taxes. Now you're saying they generally "don't pay all the taxes," which I think a bunch of us would agree with, especially those of us who have ever gotten a cash payment for anything and neglected to tell Uncle about it.
You asked me for a number. I still have no idea. I suspect most in a cash business pay some taxes. I suspect most in a cash business don't pay all taxes. This would include dancers and the other people you mentioned, as well as lawn mowers, taxicab drivers, hotel bellmen, airport shuttle drivers, and so on.
Hey, you asked for an honest guess, I gave it to you, and you accuse me of sugar coating. WTF? I'm out on this thread.
Dont get miffed lena,no offense ment.
Your member #59 on this forum of over 7000+,that is almost founding father material.That leads me to belive that you have been around this and know whats up and would respond from a point of view of someone who knows.
Not only do I not belive your "guess"but i dont think YOU belive it either.
Just my opinion.
Yeah? Well, your posts lead me to believe that you're delusional.
GnBeret
08-12-2004, 06:08 AM
For 95%+, this is a tax free business. This is why the owners have the entertainers by the small hairs. Their way or the highway.
Wanna see the "flip-side" of that equation? Watch what happens with Treasures, et al. in Houston - Feds are going to use dancers to roll up the chain through management and get owners. And the way they'll do it is by putting together a decent tax case against the dancers, then making them a deal. The dancers will then tell all they know and see about how things work on a day to day basis and, Bingo! There goes management... who, in addition to tax a case, will be threatened with RICO, etc. Same old, same old and VOILA! They've got the owners cold, 'cause if there's anybody that knows where the skeletons are buried in the operation, it's the day to day managers. And just think - it's all going to be because the dancers are completely independent... and failed to pay their taxes. :o
DancerWealth
08-12-2004, 07:22 AM
My guess is that MOST strippers over the age of twenty pay taxes and that the VAST MAJORITY of strippers over age twenty five pay taxes.
cmon now,this is starting to sound like a bad episode of HBO's dancehall divas!!!
Lets not just talk about the good parts of what we do and sugar coat the bad points.
Actually, I think that Lena is probably pretty accurate in this. I'm not so sure if most dancers over 25 pay their taxes, but certainly it is a much higher percentage than those who are 21 or younger. I unfortunately know many dancers of all age groups who do not pay them. It seems that the percentage of dancers who do though increases with age and the actual amount they are dancing though. In our class I'm very clear about the importance of paying them as the IRS has been known to do audits of people based on the possessions they own. For exmaple, if you claim you only made $20,000 last year they can make you pay penalties and late fees if they go into your house and see a big-screen plasma TV, new car, new computer, etc. because the first thing they are going to make you do is document where those things came from. Nowadays though, with how many tax write-offs dancers can take, there really is no reason not to declare. The risk isn't worth it and afterall, it is an obligation to pay them just the same way I or anyone else does. It doesn't mean they can't take all the tax breaks they have coming to them though, which is the importance of finding a good book-keeper to help them with tax time.
BigGreenMnM
08-12-2004, 07:54 AM
BigGreen you didn't answer my previous question of how you come up with your 95% ? I'm thinking it's just your opinion, that's right now isn't it ?
yup,just my opinion.But its an opinion formed over 20+ years in the industry across 3 different continents and well over 100 different clubs.
FYI all the managers I have ever worked for got company paychecks as did bouncers and waitstaff, doorgirls, cooks- pretty much everyone except the dancers who signed I.C forms.
So your claim that manager cheat on their taxes isn't correct from my close to 10 years of experience working in various clubs across the U.S
I agree that most support staff are on paychecks now and not just working for beer tabs or all the drugs and kitty they can handle.Times have changed for the better.
I would even tend to agree with you that most pay taxes on the paychecks.But what about the tip out???
Do you really think they claim the tip outs they get every night??
Are you a customer or do you work in the industry? My guess is you are a customer.
sorry sweety,your wrong yet again.
If you have been doing this for 10 years,your prob somewhere around 30 years old,so basically,i been in the titty business longer then you have had titties
Show me an entertainer who says she pays all her taxes and i will show you someone who is not telling the whole truth.
:irked:
I paid my taxes quarterly thankyou very much. As do many of the dancers that I know
and im sure you claimed everything,including tips.
(cough)(cough)Bullchit(cough)(cough)
BigGreenMnM
08-12-2004, 08:11 AM
My guess is that MOST strippers over the age of twenty pay taxes and that the VAST MAJORITY of strippers over age twenty five pay taxes.
cmon now,this is starting to sound like a bad episode of HBO's dancehall divas!!!
Lets not just talk about the good parts of what we do and sugar coat the bad points.
Actually, I think that Lena is probably pretty accurate in this. I'm not so sure if most dancers over 25 pay their taxes, but certainly it is a much higher percentage than those who are 21 or younger. I unfortunately know many dancers of all age groups who do not pay them. It seems that the percentage of dancers who do though increases with age and the actual amount they are dancing though. In our class I'm very clear about the importance of paying them as the IRS has been known to do audits of people based on the possessions they own. For exmaple, if you claim you only made $20,000 last year they can make you pay penalties and late fees if they go into your house and see a big-screen plasma TV, new car, new computer, etc. because the first thing they are going to make you do is document where those things came from. Nowadays though, with how many tax write-offs dancers can take, there really is no reason not to declare. The risk isn't worth it and afterall, it is an obligation to pay them just the same way I or anyone else does. It doesn't mean they can't take all the tax breaks they have coming to them though, which is the importance of finding a good book-keeper to help them with tax time.
Would you agree with the statement that the "vast majority"of entertainers in this industry(on the club level)are UNDER the age of 25??
I sure would.
also,can you honestly tell me you know a stripper who has been audited?Not a feature entertainer,not a mag model,not a internet site owner,but just a club entertainer.
How many have you seen get called up by the IRS???
How many times have you heard of a club entertainer who has had the IRS walk into their house and asses the worth of their possesions?
Its about as rare as an entertainer who pays all the taxes she should or as rare as someone actually catching a snipe when snipe hunting.
I will agree with something you said..
Bookkeepers!!I think every entertainer should have one.Its just way to much for anyone to keep up with,the laws change to much.
BTW thats the first tip off,if an entertainer says she pays all of her taxes,and doesnt have a accountant.
Tigerlilly
08-12-2004, 09:29 AM
not just working for beer tabs or all the drugs and kitty they can handle.
Nice stereotyping.
and im sure you claimed everything,including tips.
(cough)(cough)Bullchit(cough)(cough)
And now you are calling me a liar. You do know that is very offensive right ? I guess you just don't care. Wow- what a nice guy -insert sarcasm-
Not that it's any of your business but I did report 100% of my earnings and yes I have an accountant. As a matter of fact several of the dancers I worked with all share the same accountant. And one of the dancers here on StripperWeb did get an audit this past year as well.
I don't know much about you but so far you're coming across as a jerk :-\
I'm glad I never worked for you considering all the stereotyping you have been doing here.
FYI
AMEN to that Monty ! There are so many more reasons to pay taxes than to not ;)
There is all the investing, social security reasons but also things like public programs and services like highways, fire squads and other things people really take for granted like mosquito control for example- that's a big deal here in FL.
I really don't appreciate being called a liar or being accused of tax fraud !
Pryce
08-12-2004, 09:38 AM
Points have been made, no need to keep up a back and forth.
BigGreenMnM
08-12-2004, 10:00 AM
not just working for beer tabs or all the drugs and kitty they can handle
Nice stereotyping.
not at all,read it again,the whole sentence this time.I know this to be the norm before your time,i dont think its the norm now.
and im sure you claimed everything,including tips.
(cough)(cough)Bullchit(cough)(cough)
And now you are calling me a liar. You do know that is very offensive right ? I guess you just don't care. Wow- what a nice guy -insert sarcasm-
I never said i was a nice guy,and many would disagree with your assessment.
Im also not a customer of yours,im not your boyfriend, im not your priest,and the chances of mounting you are few and far between.
If you want guys to agree with everything you say,stay at work and never come out.
I would think it refreashing for you to have a guy talk to you with nothing but what he felt was the truth,with no motives hidden.
Not that it's any of your business but I did report 100% of my earnings and yes I have an accountant. As a matter of fact several of the dancers I worked with all share the same accountant. And one of the dancers here on StripperWeb did get an audit this past year as well.
again....Bullshit.
Its none of my business,and doesnt really matter to me at all.Im sure your accountant reported every penny you reported to him,only i dont belive you reported every penny to him.
Even if the Pope told me he reported everything,i would doubt him.
As for the entertainer on the web that got audited,was she just a stage dancer or did she have outside work like internet sites or video/mag layouts?
and is that the best you can do with your 10 years of service to the industry???Just 1????
Just 1???
I will admit,thats 1 more then i know!!
I don't know much about you but so far you're coming across as a jerk :-\
scarey huh...
a guy who doesnt want anything from you but a truthful conversation without the bullshit.
Tigerlilly
08-12-2004, 03:08 PM
Im also not a customer of yours,im not your boyfriend, im not your priest,and the chances of mounting you are few and far between.
If you want guys to agree with everything you say,stay at work and never come out.
I would think it refreashing for you to have a guy talk to you with nothing but what he felt was the truth,with no motives hidden.
Not that it's any of your business but I did report 100% of my earnings and yes I have an accountant. As a matter of fact several of the dancers I worked with all share the same accountant.
again....Bullshit.
Its none of my business,and doesnt really matter to me at all.Im sure your accountant reported every penny you reported to him,only i dont belive you reported every penny to him.
For the 2nd time now you are calling me a liar and accusing me of commiting tax fraud. >:(
I mean HELLO- didn't you read Pryce's messgae.
He told you to :stop:
Jay Zeno
08-12-2004, 04:02 PM
I would think it refreashing for you to have a guy talk to you with nothing but what he felt was the truth,with no motives hidden.
I say this in the most positive way, really.
One shouldn't confuse strict honesty and immoderate arrogance. Neither one needs a motive. But people might like one and not care much for the other.