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Lo Bok
10-09-2004, 07:32 AM
My first post -YAY! }:D
It seems that we may be confusing ATF's with Regulars- and other possible relationships.
An ATF should be what it says- All Time Favorite.
A Regular relationship indicates frequent encounters in the Club.
Once you begin meeting outside the Club, we need another name- like FOTC, for Friend Outside The Club.
For the next step, we need to distinguish between the Stripper Friend Sex (SFS), which does not involve $$-but can involve gifts,
and the Paid Escort Sex (PES), which is no longer a Stripper relationship, but just prostitution.
I suppose we could also have a category for those VIP situations in the Club where some actual sex occurs, like In Club Sex Partner (ICSP).

I still remember my ATF with love and affection.
I remember a dozen FOTC's with fondness.
I've had about 30 Regular relationships, which lasted between 2 months and 2 years.
I admit that I still have trouble with the Customer/Friend relationship, but reading these threads makes me realize more than ever that you are actually a customer if you pay for anything outside the Club.
8)

FBR
10-09-2004, 09:55 AM
There are all the above plus varying degrees in between. I do agreee that the ATF term is thrown around when often the guy is just talking about a regular he really likes.

My ATF will always be my Indy girl from several years ago. Our relationship emcompassed most of the catagories noted by Lo Bak along with a healthy (or unhealthy depending on how you look at it) dose of drama very similar to RL. I think Im saner now that its over but in the wee hours when I think back I still get a rush. As much as I "love" Miss D, theres no comparison. For those who remember Miss B, there was potential in that situation approaching the Indy ATF but it died on the vine due to Boatdude. I keep hoping she'll come back someday just so I can see if the vibes are still there.

FBR

mr_punk
10-09-2004, 11:06 AM
that's a bit too complicated for my tastes. i have a problem with using the word "friend" to describe what is in most cases, a simple commerical transaction.

SportsWriter2
10-09-2004, 01:52 PM
that's a bit too complicated for my tastes. i have a problem with using the word "friend" to describe what is in most cases, a simple commerical transaction.

I think the concept of "fun friend" or "friend with benefits" is pretty much where relationships are headed in clubs and in the real world. Friends are people who use each other but don't feel used.

Lo Bok
10-09-2004, 04:01 PM
It doesn't take long to determine if a Stripper is after your $$ or actually would like someone to talk to that isn't after her sex. We are all aware that most will tell you anything you want to hear to get more out of your pocketbook.
But, over a 30 year period, I have made some great Stripper friends that took me to dinner, gave me presents, and got to the point that I didn't have to pay for their association.
To me, that is the greatest satisfaction regarding this business- to get acquainted with young, good looking women, that are willing to spend some time with an old guy like me without asking for payment, and who seem to appreciate someone who listens to their problems without being judgemental. I can't deny that they usually are rewarded for their friendship, but it isn't like "I'll spend two hours with you for $X.XX".
I also enjoy Club occasions where I know that I am paying so much to get so much, but I much prefer those closer relationships where $ is not the primary issue. And, with experience, it is not difficult to identify the difference quite quickly.
To qualify as an ATF, a Stripper must give as much as she takes.

mr_punk
10-11-2004, 08:11 AM
I think the concept of "fun friend" or "friend with benefits" is pretty much where relationships are headed in clubs and in the real world.i disagree. first of all, i'm reluctant to even consider a sc based relationship analogous to a civilian relationship. don't get me wrong, i'm not saying that it can't happen. however, if someone really wanted that type of relationship can't that person do better than go looking for one in a stripclub? futhermore, how often does it actually happen? ultimately, the exchange of money for service is the fuel that drives the relationship in most cases in a sc. the lube isn't on your finger, but in your pocket. which is fine because that is the way it is supposed to be in a sc.


Friends are people who use each other but don't feel used.well, that type of arrangement is fine too, as long as both parties are aware of exactly what going on. however, that's a bit difficult in a sc for most PLs. which is why so many of them crash and burn when it comes to strippers. too many PLs confuse sc courtesy with genuine interest.


But, over a 30 year period, I have made some great Stripper friends that took me to dinner, gave me presents, and got to the point that I didn't have to pay for their association.that's amazing..not the friends part, but the 30 years of listening to flaky strippers part and without your brains being turned into mush. ;D c'mon, you don't really listen to them, do you? so, what's your secret...earplugs? ;D


To me, that is the greatest satisfaction regarding this business- to get acquainted with young, good looking women, that are willing to spend some time with an old guy like me without asking for payment, and who seem to appreciate someone who listens to their problems without being judgemental. I can't deny that they usually are rewarded for their friendship, but it isn't like "I'll spend two hours with you for $X.XX".sounds good to me. in fact, you sound like a proper PDOM (professional dirty old man). something we should all strive to be. :thumbsup:

Lo Bok
10-11-2004, 10:08 AM
sounds good to me. in fact, you sound like a proper PDOM (professional dirty old man). something we should all strive to be. :thumbsup:Guilty and proud of it- and I do wear a hearing aide that I can turn down when necessary.

sadbuttrue
10-15-2004, 05:02 AM
Yeah, I finally graduated to calling the one I spent so much time with and money on, "the ATF". There really is no other and I don't think that will change. Others will also come and go and I like the current fave, but I was intimately involved with most every problem the ATF had. Due to the way I had to end it, I can't trust a lot of the things that happened that could have been counted as very good friend experiences. But with any non-dancer they could have. She still permeates my thinking.

All new experiences with dancers and any limits I have set were due to the ATF. So I guess it's too bad for all dancers that come afterwards in terms of any real feelings or chances to make "other" money. I still treat any new ones well. I talk less about the ATF when I am around other dancers now, where before I was always spouting stories about her. I actually hate having to set the limits, because I don't like having to care less about whatever one I am with. But the ATF experience killed a lot of feeling inside and I don't want to go through that again.

>>>Sad<<<
:P

yoda57us
10-15-2004, 05:16 AM
My ATF is retired but still my ATF. However, she wasn't my first ATF. I firmly beleive that you can only have one current ATF but there can certainly be other women that have held and relinquished the title. Those of us who subscribe to the lures of ATFdom all seem to be of the same thinking that qualifying for ATF status requires a dancer/customer relationship that goes beyond a simple exchange of cash for dances.

Like Sad, I had my eyes opened by my first ATF. Things that were thought to be true simply were not and lies were told that really didn't need to be told....anyway, Had my second and current ATF not come along when she did and restored my faith in womankind, I may have given up on ever trusting a woman in a g-string again. Thankfuly I didn't. Then again, maybe I'm just way to trusting to be hanging out in strip clubs....

sadbuttrue
10-15-2004, 05:17 AM
P.S. the most recent experience with her about three months ago showed me that I was still capable of being in love with her, but I still managed to keep from falling deep into the trap again. Judging from not receiving any phone call from her except for a few days after that I am justified in how I handled things. But I had to see her at least once, post-accident, which I mentioned elsewhere on SCJ.

You gotta believe I was glad to see her, though, alive and quite well, considering. But it does suck wanting to scoop her up and take care of her in the new situation and knowing that my life would start to go down the tubes again.

>>>Sad<<<
:(

yoda57us
10-15-2004, 09:56 AM
When my first ATF returned to work after a 13 month absence and no contact I was releived to see her and happy that she was doing well-she had left over, among other things, some health issues. However, I felt absolutely no desire to see things return to their previous state of drama and my current favs all figured out fairly quickly that they were not going to lose any dances to her. As they say, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice....