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Richard_Head
04-02-2005, 02:21 PM
This poll may have been done before but I can't recall, so I'll post it.

NVJosh
04-02-2005, 04:32 PM
Where's the "I'm a cheap bastard, and don't go to clubs for extras, but won't turn them down if they are offered as part of the standard fee" choice? :D

Element
04-02-2005, 05:37 PM
I guess I'm one of the few who do expect extras but usually know ahead of time if the club offers them.
Keep in mind extras where I am from means a none air dance.

The_Oceans
04-02-2005, 05:59 PM
I'm one of those custys who lets the dancer set the tone...I may start with hands at the side but if encouraged I will go with the flow. Some of my most memorable dances have been with dancers who may appear to have "cold fish" attitudes, but maybe just weren't approached the right way.

Nicolina
04-03-2005, 01:30 AM
Yes, I vote for all getting on the same page about the definition of extras before continuing.

Someone recently tried to set me straight about this. "Extras" include HJ's, BJ's, DATY, and any kind of penetration (including digital)?

I think it's important to define these things, lest the discussions become hopelessly mired in ambiguity (and then the pinkies start saying bad things about you, and I have to go over there and regulate.)

SportsWriter2
04-03-2005, 02:01 AM
Yes, I vote for all getting on the same page about the definition of extras before continuing.
Nic, this is the SCJ extras list updated from Sep 2004. The order can vary according to local preferences. For example, I've been to a CT club where #8 was done openly, even more than grinding. When in Rome...

The first set is for normal dancers (ND).

1. "accidental" boob touching
2. nipple not-a-munch (The nipple passes over the lips and the compression is not enough to alter the intended movement of the nipple. A guys's lips can sense compression before a dancer's nipple can, so for her it doesn't really happen.)
3. GF kissing, lips closed (this can be all over the rankings)
4. rubbing face on cock outside pants (chin, forehead, nose and mouth in that order of progression)
5. nipple munching (dry and wet)
6. cookie kissing with thong on
7. cock rub outside pants
8. cock grabbing outside pants
9. forced orgasm
10. cookie touching over thong
11. deliberate boob fondling
12. mouthing cock through pants (biting and sucking)
13. touching cookie inside of thong
14. pulling on labia
15. cookie licking with thong off/aside
16. hand job
17. boob fucking
18. fingering (anything deeper than the first knuckle)
19. DFK, but I've seen it at 1-3 (no thanks at that level)
20. BJ (covered and bare)
21. FS (anything else)

Separate list for submissive dancers (SD). Once you start pulling hair, the rest generaly falls under 3.

1. pulling dancer's hair
2. slapping, usually on the butt
3. pinching/biting nipples
4. finger on butthole
5. choking

Separate list for submissive customers (SC). Some dancers love this; others won't have anything to do with it.

1. pulling customer's hair
2. face slapping
3. spitting on customer with verbal abuse
4. pinching/biting nipples
5. customer sucks dancer's toes/feet
6. customer buys dancer's pee in a cup/beer can

Separate list for lesbian 2on1 dancers (2D):

1. boob fondling
2. kissing
3. nipple sucking
4. cookie touching
5. oral sex to orgasm

I can think of other stuff that's uncommon. For example, some dancers want to deep throat fingers after being fingered, but it's not common enough to make my list. For all references to cookie touching, licking and fingering, you can substiitute anal according to preference.

Nicolina
04-03-2005, 03:46 AM
Wow, Sporty, my head is spinning. That's a very comprehensive list.

IMHO, There's such a vast divide between #1 and, say, #20 on the ND list that I feel they should be considered categorically different, rather than all falling under the umbrella definition of "extras." Anyone agree?

A few questions:
#9 = Whose forced orgasm? (& forced how?)
#19 = ???
FS = ??

yoda57us
04-03-2005, 04:54 AM
I think the definition of all extras should be the same-regardless of how common some low-level stuff may be in some areas and some clubs. Extras are anything beyond the rules of the the club-which are determined by local civic regulations. No club has a rule that allows boob fondling, weather it happens all of the time or not. I would venture a guess that no club actualy has a rule that allows lap dancing either, which means they can stop it any time they want. 20 years ago in Providence their where no lap dances. The city council didn't sit down and write a new ordinance allowing grinding, clubs and dancers just started pushing the envelope and everyone arrived at a level of contact that they could live with. I'm sure, when this happened, there where girls who freaked, refused to get near a guy, and thought it was disgusting to put their boobs in the same time zone as a customers mouth...look where we are now.

SportsWriter2
04-03-2005, 07:59 AM
IMHO, There's such a vast divide between #1 and, say, #20 on the ND list that I feel they should be considered categorically different, rather than all falling under the umbrella definition of "extras." Anyone agree?

In my experience, dancers tend to give it up in the list order in high contact clubs. They're all extras. I'd categorize them by level of safety, but that's just me. If I were a dancer, #11 would be closer to #2. :)

#9 = Dancer forces herself to orgasm by grinding hard (or fakes it so well that you can't tell the difference)
#19 = Deep French Kissing
FS = Full Service (anything you want) :O

doc-catfish
04-03-2005, 09:19 AM
Good poll RH. I voted for the third option, although in all honesty I was stuck between that one and the second. Extras kind of add a nice "icing on the cake" surprise when they occur unexpectedly, but if I came to a club expecting them to happen they just wouldn't be as appealing.


Wow, Sporty, my head is spinning. That's a very comprehensive list.

IMHO, There's such a vast divide between #1 and, say, #20 on the ND list that I feel they should be considered categorically different, rather than all falling under the umbrella definition of "extras." Anyone agree?

I classify extras kind of like hockey penalties. There are "majors" and there are "minors" (or if you prefer soccer "red card" and "yellow card").

A "major" extra is some sort of intentional sexual contact, illegal pretty much everywhere. Defining the far more common "minor" ones is a bit trickier because whether such things are against the law or club policy varies from place to place.

Lurker_001
04-03-2005, 12:29 PM
I voted "what's an extra"? I voted that because i don't believe anything the dancer does on her own during her show is an "Extra".I haven't been around too much.The high contact club i go to is pretty safe because it's a open room/no private booths.So... anything she does i consider part of her show.I think an "Extra" is something you ask for and get.Most things that happen during her show would fall under "Your milage may vary".If you ask to finger fuck her and she says yes then you're gonna get an "Extra".

mr_punk
04-03-2005, 02:33 PM
Yes, I vote for all getting on the same page about the definition of extras before continuing.

I think it's important to define these things, lest the discussions become hopelessly mired in ambiguityi voted for "what is an extra?" for the same reason as well. i think there is a lot of confusion over the topic.

Someone recently tried to set me straight about this. "Extras" include HJ's, BJ's, DATY, and any kind of penetration (including digital)?works for me.


Nic, this is the SCJ extras list updated from Sep 2004. The order can vary according to local preferencesthat's much too complicated and unwieldy for my tastes. it looks like a scorecard.


I think the definition of all extras should be the same-regardless of how common some low-level stuff may be in some areas and some clubs. Extras are anything beyond the rules of the the club-which are determined by local civic regulations.well, it's easy enough to determine the local civic regulations by looking at the penal codes. generally speaking, any act where willy is freed would universally fall into the category of extras. however, depending on how vauge or how specific local codes are written. many other kinds of sexual stimulation by strippers would fall into that category as well. since, we all know local laws vary. it's better to keep this discussion in the general sense by keeping things simple by distinguishing mileage from extras. otherwise, you run the risk of running into a quagmire due to the various local laws.


No club has a rule that allows boob fondling, weather it happens all of the time or not. I would venture a guess that no club actualy has a rule that allows lap dancing either, which means they can stop it any time they want. 20 years ago in Providence their where no lap dances. The city council didn't sit down and write a new ordinance allowing grinding, clubs and dancers just started pushing the envelope and everyone arrived at a level of contact that they could live with.sure, the level of contact in a sc isn't determined by the clubs, but by local goverments. any local goverment can write an ordinance banning lap dances if it chooses to do so. lap dancing (which isn't the same as nude dancing) has never been constitutionally protected. still, whether or not those ordinances will withstand a legal challenge or actually be enforced is a different story. conversely, a local goverment doesn't need to create a law allowing lap dancing either. in fact, many cities do not have laws directly addressing the issue because it would be an superfluous act if it already has laws on the books that covers acts such as prostitution.


A "major" extra is some sort of intentional sexual contact, illegal pretty much everywhere. Defining the far more common "minor" ones is a bit trickier because whether such things are against the law or club policy varies from place to place.
i would go along with that notion. i can think of lot of minor acts that don't involve freeing willy which strippers commonly perform which aren't exactly kosher in the eyes of the law. any customer that's had his crotch grabbed by a stripper can see that.

yoda57us
04-03-2005, 03:57 PM
it's better to keep this discussion in the general sense by keeping things simple by distinguishing mileage from extras. otherwise, you run the risk of running into a quagmire due to the various local laws.

I might agree but, by doing that, we would simpl be openning the discussion up to everyones version of what constitutes mileage vs. what constitutes extras. My feeling is that extras are a part of mileage-a general term to indicate LD quality levels. Extras will always be part of over-all mileage but mileage won't always contain extras.



sure, the level of contact in a sc isn't determined by the clubs, but by local goverments. any local goverment can write an ordinance banning lap dances if it chooses to do so. lap dancing (which isn't the same as nude dancing) has never been constitutionally protected. still, whether or not those ordinances will withstand a legal challenge or actually be enforced is a different story. conversely, a local goverment doesn't need to create a law allowing lap dancing either. in fact, many cities do not have laws directly addressing the issue because it would be an superfluous act if it already has laws on the books that covers acts such as prostitution.



Local laws draw a black and white line between nude dancing and prostitution. Prostitution is generaly described as any act of genital stimulation-in exchange for cash. Your right, the laws are on the books already to stop any club from allowing laps. What we get is what the clubs are allowed to get away with when they push the envelope. A very popular club was shut down in RI a few years ago when, after trying to force the owner out by banning nudity, the city finaly pulled the clubs entertainment license, effectively putting the dancers in a position where, since dancing was entertainment, and entertainment was not allowed, any girl who showed up for work and performed a lap dance-in bottoms and pasties-was acting lasciviously and commiting an act of prostitution. Unless you've got deep pockets, the constitution doesn't matter. Dancers won't hang around and make no money until the lawyers work things out.

Casual Observer
04-03-2005, 04:58 PM
that's much too complicated and unwieldy for my tastes. it looks like a scorecard.

Agreed. However, this is working from my own definition which is generally based on what separates high-mileage/contact girls from extras girls--basically, sex acts. Trying to delineate it further seems counterproductive to addressing the actual question at hand.

mr_punk
04-03-2005, 05:03 PM
I might agree but, by doing that, we would simpl be openning the discussion up to everyones version of what constitutes mileage vs. what constitutes extras.it's simple. define extras first and anything else is mileage. defining extras is a whole lot easier and less confusing than mileage.


My feeling is that extras are a part of mileage-a general term to indicate LD quality levels. Extras will always be part of over-all mileage but mileage won't always contain extras.yeah, but mileage isn't necessarily universally illegal. a LD isn't necessarily illegal depending on the locale. as for extras? i can't think of a state in the U.S. where they don't have laws specifically addressing illegal sexual acts (like a BJ, HJ, etc) in exchange for money.


Local laws draw a black and white line between nude dancing and prostitution. Prostitution is generaly described as any act of genital stimulation-in exchange for cash. Your right, the laws are on the books already to stop any club from allowing laps.no, that wasn't quite my point. i probably didn't make myself clear. my point was that if local goverment didn't have any laws specifically addressing contact in a sc. it doesn't mean that lap dancing is illegal even if it's unprotected by the constitution. so, you can perform lap dancing. it just means that powers that be aren't too concerned with a sit-n-grind lap, but more concerned with a stripper setting willy free and that issue is currently being addressed with prostitution laws. it only becomes illegal when a local goverment chooses to address the issue by creating new legislation.


What we get is what the clubs are allowed to get away with when they push the envelope. A very popular club was shut down in RI a few years ago when, after trying to force the owner out by banning nudity, the city finaly pulled the clubs entertainment license, effectively putting the dancers in a position where, since dancing was entertainment, and entertainment was not allowed, any girl who showed up for work and performed a lap dance-in bottoms and pasties-was acting lasciviously and commiting an act of prostitution.sure, any local goverment can shut down any club using the means of subversive tactics. from reading your story, it's looks like they shut that club down by going in the backdoor rather than the front. it's not uncommon, a local goverment can still temprorarily shut down a club if a dancer doesn't have enough latex on her nipples. if a club sells alcohol. it can discover some administrative problem with it's liquor license, etc.

KC Joe
04-03-2005, 05:08 PM
I voted #2. Anyone going to a SC expecting extras, whatever they might be, is going to be disappointed 95% of the time. At least in my neighborhood.

GenWar
04-03-2005, 08:47 PM
I am the sap that voted for #4.

I don't get it. Maybe it is because I have a marriage with a sex life that I am comfortable with. Maybe because somewhere deep down, I am still that young boy in the 4 hour services in the small rural Mississippi Southern Baptist Church. Maybe because the places I have been where extras can be procured have been VERY VERY scary*, as opposed to the places where I really enjoy, where it would be an insult to even mention it (to MOST ladies, there are always exceptions.) *shrug* It could be ANY number of things, but I just don't FEEL anything positive about extras. I think they hurt the club and the industry as a whole, and I LOVE the industry. Anything that threatens the night I had last night will not be welcome to me and I think the proliferation of extras might have the potential to do that.

I have really, honestly, no BS, separated the strip club experience from sex in my mind. The two do not intersect for me mentally. Don't bother to tell me I am delusional, I have heard it many times. Maybe I am delusional. Maybe I need that delusion to enjoy the club the way I do whilst still enjoying my wife the way I do. But, for me, extras blur that line (delusional or not) and I just can't sit comfortably in a neutral position on them. I am all for legalized prostitution and for the sex trade in general. But don't hide it in the strip clubs...I like all the things they have going for them and I don't believe they need extras to be worth the experience.

As I said, I am a sap. But I am the sap who voted for #4. and I stick by that opinion.

GenWar
04-03-2005, 08:50 PM
Forgot to explain the * in the first paragraph..it is a footnote:

* Except for Vegas. But Vegas is in an whole other plane of SC existance. It cannot be reasonably and logically compared to the rest of the SC universe.

Richard_Head
04-03-2005, 08:54 PM
You're not a sap at all GenWar, I personally don't think there's a wrong answer to the question, just personal preferences, it's all good.

NVJosh
04-04-2005, 02:17 PM
As I read responses, I think my feeling belongs in that "What's an Extra" camp. I joke about "I'll take what's given as long as there's no extra charge", so if something is given, is it an extra? No matter whether its a 1 or a 20? Frankly, I go for whatever level of enjoyment works for both me and the dancer...physically and financially.

Sh0t
04-04-2005, 02:21 PM
Anything beyond a lap dance I would consider extra. So a handjob, a blowjob, her washing your car, etc. Those would all be extras

yoda57us
04-04-2005, 02:28 PM
Good point NVJ. Is it an "Extra" if you don't pay extra for it? I've never paid a dime above posted prices for lap dance and, though I don't consider myself an extras hound, I've had my share, including a lady who currently does FS for a negotiated discounted booth price.

My assumption has always been that the ladies who choose to market themselves this way are banking on my return business. That or my charm, wit, personality, middle aged paunch and balding grey hair are completely irresistible to women.

Nicolina
04-04-2005, 09:21 PM
Yikes! Are dancers really doing high-level extras without even charging extra? That's rather disheartening news....

doc-catfish
04-04-2005, 09:41 PM
Damn. 36 responses thus far and only four admitted raincoaters. And more than half of the remaining 32 are content with no extras at all. Based on those numbers, I'm not even sure we come up to average in our mileage expectations. Hell, we're practically gentlemen.

C'mon fellas, whatever happened to us (or even most of us) being disgusting, loser, dropout, swine rapists?

Should I bookmark this thread for reference the next time some malcontent upstairs screams about how extreme and perverse we all are over here?

Nicolina
04-04-2005, 09:51 PM
Hell, we're practically gentlemen.



My point exactly.

yoda57us
04-05-2005, 05:39 AM
Yikes! Are dancers really doing high-level extras without even charging extra? That's rather disheartening news....

It puzzles me as well. Back in Boston's Combat Zone days any extras where OTC. Often, the dancer was actualy a hooker who was only dancing to find OTC customers. Come-ons and price quotes where common as you sipped overpriced champagne and she squeezed your leg telling you how cute you where and how she "doesn't do this with every customer" (yeah, only the ones that will pay her...).

Nowadays, with the invention of the "private room" or even a well concealed dark corner, ITC extras are obviously more common. Nevertheless, I get very few come-ons from ladies offering specific extra services to convince me to buy a dance. The VIP come-ons are very common but usually consist of a promise that we will "have more privacy and more fun". Thats about it.

I'm not looking for high-fives from my fellow blue men here but, in the past year, I've had FS from two different dancers in the same club, 3 BJ's in 3 other clubs and DATY, HJ and an offer to come back to my hotel room from a dancer in Oxnard CA when I was there on business. None of these extras where solicited in advance, none of these ladies asked for additional funds (I tip well, but they have no way of knowing that when they reach for little yoda) and only the offer to come back to my room was accompanied by any sort of price quote.

I'm appreciative but puzzled. BTW, all of the women in the above story where hot. The Oxnard girl was SO hot that I've thought about booking a flight just to go see her for a return engagement.

NVJosh
04-05-2005, 03:25 PM
Hey...Oxnard's not that far from LV...do you have her number? :P

NVJosh
04-05-2005, 03:32 PM
Yikes! Are dancers really doing high-level extras without even charging extra? That's rather disheartening news....

I don't think it should be totally disheartening. First off, I don't think its all dancers, and I don't think its with all customers. And, of course, it gets back to the whole "What's an extra?" question. There are probably dancers who will whip out a customer's dick because they feel its the only way to make money or it will obligate the guy to tip more or whatever and do it on a regular basis, and there are dancers who may do it with a regular after they have established a rapport or there are dancers who only do it at the beginning or end of the month or dancers who only do it when they are drunk or high, or whatever.

Once I came into a club and found a dancer who said "It's your lucky day. I'm drunk and horny." She wasn't normally my type, and how could I resist that line. And, for the record, she was both.

slcdon
04-05-2005, 05:17 PM
Someone stop this poll before it completely destroys our SCJ reputation! I thought sure I saw a hint of pink when I logged on today...

And, we are probably even more "gentlemanly" than the pole shows. I voted #2 when, in fact, I turn down extras more often than I take advantage of them. I take it from the comments that there are plenty of others that fall into the same category.

Just FYI, I don't get extras offered on a routine basis, albeit not unusual, and they are always (well almost) the dancer's idea.

slcdon8)

SportsWriter2
04-06-2005, 03:23 AM
Someone stop this poll before it completely destroys our SCJ reputation! I thought sure I saw a hint of pink when I logged on today...

And, we are probably even more "gentlemanly" than the pole shows. I voted #2 when, in fact, I turn down extras more often than I take advantage of them. I take it from the comments that there are plenty of others that fall into the same category.

Just FYI, I don't get extras offered on a routine basis, albeit not unusual, and they are always (well almost) the dancer's idea.

slcdon8)

That pretty much summarizes it for me, too. :-\

yoda57us
04-06-2005, 05:52 AM
I'd have to say that, in spite of the factoids I quoted in my last post, over-all, extras occur in a relatively small percentage of my SC visits. The reality is, I spend most of my time these days in low or no contact clubs wit zero extras potential.

NVJ: Drive to Oxnard, go to the Spearment Rhino, look for a Brazilian dancer named Amanda. Be nice to her, spend some cash and don't grab at anything until she offers.

evan_essence
04-12-2005, 09:28 AM
Someone stop this poll before it completely destroys our SCJ reputation! I thought sure I saw a hint of pink when I logged on today... And, we are probably even more "gentlemanly" than the pole shows. I voted #2 when, in fact, I turn down extras more often than I take advantage of them.I realize you're being somewhat tongue-in-cheek, but you've sparked my curiousity. I'm not sure I'd identify being gentlemanly as the driving force in turning down unsolicited extras one visit and accepting them on the next. Must be another motivation behind that decision-making process. Out of curiousity: What prompts any of you to turn down stripper-offered extras on some occasions and accept them on others?

-Ev

SportsWriter2
04-12-2005, 10:03 AM
Out of curiousity: What prompts any of you to turn down stripper-offered extras on some occasions and accept them on others?


If I really like a dancer and we click, I'm completely satisfied with selected single-digit extras (from the SCJ list). I'll turn down anyone in that club who offers more to lure me away. :(

In other clubs, I might find my kind of hottie who just wants to get into it with me (or her top three regulars, whatever). If it's safe and fun, I'm interested. After that, I might see her every other month.

I hardly ever even look at the known sluts in a club. If it's too easy, I'm not interested. :-\

yoda57us
04-13-2005, 05:28 AM
While I consider myself a gentleman I agree that weather I accept or reject an offer for extras has nothing to do with that. I turn down offers from dancers that I am not attracted to. If I wouldn't buy a lap dance from a woman in the first place, I'm not gonna change my mind because she offers to throw in a hand job at no additional charge. Also, though it's never happened to me, I would probably say no if the offer where accompanied by an exhorbitant additional fee, though I may ask about an OTC encounter at that point.

I know that some guys would also probably consider safety and STD's an issue.

mr_punk
04-17-2005, 08:20 AM
I'm not sure I'd identify being gentlemanly as the driving force in turning down unsolicited extras one visit and accepting them on the next.you're right. it has nothing to do with being gentlemanly. besides, chivalry is for saps in a sc.

Must be another motivation behind that decision-making process.
physical attraction is the key. as yoda pointed out, if i find the stripper unattractive. she's just not going to show up on my radar. i don't care what she offers.

What prompts any of you to turn down stripper-offered extras on some occasions and accept them on others?if a stripper believes that i'm going to blow the POP index all to bits over an unknown piece of ass. for example, i've dealt with more than a few strippers of the slavic extraction. they are willing to get very nasty, but they have the much deserved reputation of trying to take advantage of a customer whenever possible at every turn. it's not uncommon for them to throw out some ridiculous offer to see if the suckers will bite. it's just the russian mentality. the only thing they fear is their own. so, a customer has to act as if he owns them like an old-time commissar in order to cut through the BS and get them to sit down at the negotiating table. otherwise, if they think a customer is weak. they will smell blood and clean out his wallet for little or nothing in return. having said that, as long as a customer can keep his wits about him. there is nothing wrong with dealing with them.

Katrine
04-17-2005, 05:26 PM
for example, i've dealt with more than a few strippers of the slavic extraction. they are willing to get very nasty, but they have the much deserved reputation of trying to take advantage of a customer whenever possible at every turn. it's not uncommon for them to throw out some ridiculous offer to see if the suckers will bite. it's just the russian mentality. the only thing they fear is their own. so, a customer has to act as if he owns them like an old-time commissar in order to cut through the BS and get them to sit down at the negotiating table. otherwise, if they think a customer is weak. they will smell blood and clean out his wallet for little or nothing in return. having said that, as long as a customer can keep his wits about him. there is nothing wrong with dealing with them.

Yes, we rule. You American man-bitches are easy prey for our superior Soviet designed olfactory, and errrr, assfactory senses..... }:D ::)

slcdon
04-17-2005, 06:33 PM
Ev,

I am glad you picked up on the tongue-in-cheek response; I was concerned that some wouldn't. I wasn't trying to suggest that I was being gentlemanly by turning down extras. It is always selfish - that's what going to a GC is about. Mr. Punk, Yoda, and Sportswriter have hit most of the reasons. For me, most often it is either
a) the dancer is clearly going from guy to guy with the same offer - for some reason, being the 15th guy of the night, likely without any cleanup in between, just isn't very appealing;
b) the price is unreasonable -I don't keep close tabs on the POP index as Mr. Punk put it, but I don't negotiate. If it's going to happen, I want the dancer to be happy about the price; yet, I am not going to pay an absurd price when there are other options available. I just don't get that much pleasure from getting blown or screwed over the course of 2-3 songs. It's just not that intimate.

The few times that I accepted "extras", I had spent a considerable amount of time with a girl, we were clearly enjoying each others company, and she offered it as an act of "thanks." (It's SS, but it's good SS!) I am sure by then, she knew that I would tip her nicely, so it wasn't entirely altruistic. But, there was no mention of $ up front and I didn't feel any obligation to reward her beyond the value of the songs. Also, in almost every case, it was early in their shift and I was the only person they had danced for up to that point.

My favorite dancers are those that make you want them so bad you can taste it, but simply have too much class and self esteem to accept any offers of extracurricular activities. They are the ones I go back to see.

slcdon 8)

SportsWriter2
04-17-2005, 06:45 PM
Also, in almost every case, it was early in their shift and I was the only person they had danced for up to that point.

Dancer to me about my ATF: "You think she's clean because you get her first, but her boyfriend cums all over her before she leaves for work." Not true, but body lotion has scared me ever since. :O

mr_punk
04-17-2005, 08:32 PM
My favorite dancers are those that make you want them so bad you can taste it, but simply have too much class and self esteem to accept any offers of extracurricular activities. They are the ones I go back to see.where did you get that idea? their press release. class and self-esteem or a lack thereof isn't necessarily the driving force behind a dancer refusal/acceptance of an offer. no more than being gentlemanly would be the basis for a customer for turning down an offer. in the end, you'll never really know whether or not she does accept those offers. besides, a customer's perception of a dancer's class and self-esteem is mostly a figment of his own creation.

Moneywise
04-17-2005, 08:53 PM
a customer's perception of a dancer's class and self-esteem is mostly a figment of his own creation.

This deserved to be quoted.

yoda57us
04-18-2005, 02:21 AM
Ev,
My favorite dancers are those that make you want them so bad you can taste it, but simply have too much class and self esteem to accept any offers of extracurricular activities. They are the ones I go back to see.
slcdon 8)

Well, I was right with you until up until now....

Connecting a woman's performance limits with her level of self esteem is ludicrous. Dancers dance to make money-to support themselves, their kids, their families, their education, and yes, in some cases, the monkey on their back. To imply that a woman who does extras somehow has less class or self-esteem than a woman who doesn't is to suggest that you know something about this woman beyond her stage name and what she just did or didn't do to you during a dance. You don't. You are suggesting that you know something about the way this woman conducts herself in the RW. You don't. All you know is what she told you. Every dancer plays a role in a SC, it's part of how they survive. It's part of their sales pitch. You don't know anymore about her RW than she does about yours.

SportsWriter2
04-18-2005, 06:42 AM
My favorite dancers are those that make you want them so bad you can taste it, but simply have too much class and self esteem to accept any offers of extracurricular activities.

My favorite dancers are the ones who smile and say "only for you" or "I don't even do this with my boyfriend." That's my kind of class. :)

Sh0t
04-18-2005, 07:46 AM
Why is class equated with not doing sexual favors for money?

I've never understood that.

evan_essence
04-18-2005, 09:03 AM
class and self-esteem or a lack thereof isn't necessarily the driving force behind a dancer refusal/acceptance of an offer. no more than being gentlemanly would be the basis for a customer for turning down an offer. in the end, you'll never really know whether or not she does accept those offers. besides, a customer's perception of a dancer's class and self-esteem is mostly a figment of his own creation.I'm trying real hard not to be overly argumentative here because I am absorbing your answers. (Yeah, for once, I know.) But I think you're overlooking something. if that's his fantasy, so be it. Maybe he gets a thrill from that perception. (I think it's sweet, so sue me, but what I think isn't my point.) Likewise, he may get off on thinking all the others are crack whores. That wouldn't be realistic either, but he's not paying for realism, and somehow I doubt y'all would be so quick to point it out if it were a generalization in the other extreme.

-Ev

evan_essence
04-18-2005, 09:10 AM
Why is class equated with not doing sexual favors for money?

I've never understood that.Aw, come on now. You wouldn't feel a bit more positive about me if I lusted after your penis instead of your bankroll?

-Ev

Sh0t
04-18-2005, 09:33 AM
I would feel sexier personally, but that doesn't really effect how "classy" you would be or not.

I would only pay you for sex if you let me drill my own hole :)

mr_punk
04-22-2005, 10:37 PM
I'm trying real hard not to be overly argumentative here because I am absorbing your answers. you don't have to refrain from being overly argumentative on my account. i don't mind. besides, you and jenny are rank amateurs when it come to being argumentative and don't scare me one bit. OTOH, my ex-wives are world-class champions in the art. now, they scare me.

But I think you're overlooking something. if that's his fantasy, so be it.no, i'm not overlooking that point. which is why i stated that the perception is a figment of his own creation rather than any basis in actual reality.

That wouldn't be realistic either, but he's not paying for realism, and somehow I doubt y'all would be so quick to point it out if it were a generalization in the other extreme.what you're overlooking is that i'm not here to indulge the fantasy of an individual who tries to substitute fantasy for actual knowledge. if he wants that type of response. he can go to a sc and pay a stripper to sit on his balls and be his yes woman. of course, feel free to indugle his fantasy if you wish. although, i have no idea why a stripper or a customer would want to indulge the fantasy of a someone else on their own lesiure time and for free.

evan_essence
04-24-2005, 03:50 AM
you and jenny are rank amateurs when it come to being argumentative and don't scare me one bit. OTOH, my ex-wives are world-class champions in the art. now, they scare me. Do they give lessons? Would they accept an invitation to join SCJ? I love watching a good fireworks display.


no, i'm not overlooking that point. which is why i stated that the perception is a figment of his own creation rather than any basis in actual reality.Yeah, okay, not overlooking the point. Expressing disdain for the point.


what you're overlooking is that i'm not here to indulge the fantasy of an individual who tries to substitute fantasy for actual knowledge.We'll work up to indulgence later. At this point, I was hoping for simple acknowledgement that someone might gain enjoyment from the situation in a different fashion than you.


if he wants that type of response. he can go to a sc and pay a stripper to sit on his balls and be his yes woman.Wha?!? You're indulging a customer's enjoyment of SS? That's so unlike you to condone a customer's potential satisfaction from the sizzle. There may be hope for you yet.


of course, feel free to indugle his fantasy if you wish. although, i have no idea why a stripper or a customer would want to indulge the fantasy of a someone else on their own lesiure time and for free. Support or criticism, the pay's all the same here.

-Ev

mr_punk
04-24-2005, 04:31 PM
Would they accept an invitation to join SCJ? I love watching a good fireworks display.oh, you wouldn't enjoy it. they usually mop up the floor with me. you would get bored watching me get nagged to death until my sack just drops off and rolls down my pants leg. no thanks, i really don't want to go back to the good old days.

Yeah, okay, not overlooking the point. Expressing disdain for the point.disdain for his fantasy? no. disdain because he's substituting fantasy as actual knowledge...yes. i'm sure customers fantasize about you all the time but how many of them really know you well enough as a person to make an assessment on your class and self esteem?

At this point, I was hoping for simple acknowledgement that someone might gain enjoyment from the situation in a different fashion than you.if he had said, "i'd like to think" or "i often fantasize" or something along those lines. it would have been no problem. for example, i often fantasize that strippers are really an amazon tribe from an hidden, all-female island located in the bermuda triangle named Fellatrix. they travel to civilization to work in sc using customers to resupply their cache of "man gravy" back home to propagate their species by using their specialized method of..er..extraction...and i'm next on the list. however, if you meet a customer and he whips out his willy and says, "take me to your amazon leader". remember, it's not me.

You're indulging a customer's enjoyment of SS? That's so unlike you to condone a customer's potential satisfaction from the sizzle. There may be hope for you yet.why are you so surprised? plenty of PL enjoy SS as SS. some of them even believe it's true as well. which is fine. however, if he's going to post that on a PMB. it doesn't mean i have to accept his fantasy as reality as well.

Support or criticism, the pay's all the same here.well, there you go.

Fudpucker
04-28-2005, 01:41 PM
I voted I dont care. Its not why I go.