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mr_punk
11-18-2005, 08:01 PM
has anyone read sixty's blog lately? i thought this was an interesting entry (http://sixtysplace.blogspot.com/2005/10/celeste-keeping-it-real.html). anyway, i can't say that i disagree with sixty's decision or reasoning at the end of the story. now, i don't know if she was being sincere or not. in any case, the question is irrelevant, IMO. frankly, when i step into a sc. it's all about me and my gratification. so, if i actually have to put forth some effort on my part. it would defeat the whole purpose of a sc. still, i know some PLs might consider it rude or offensive not to attend to a stripper's gratification (outside of the money) in any regards (Happy Ending or not). so, my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc? oh, before anyone starts blathering about how gentlemanly they are to strippers. that's a given. also, i'm going to preemptively recuse FBR from this discussion. since, he's on mistress lockdown.

Bob_Loblaw
11-18-2005, 08:17 PM
Nah, she was just hoping he wouldn't have his head back on straight fast enough to say no to another half hour. I do agree with him saying no though.

yoda57us
11-18-2005, 09:08 PM
Funny you should ask....

I don't read blogs but I will answer your question Mr. P.
I went to visit an old fav in a new club last night and spent an hour alone with her in VIP that was quite an experience. I'm not a trip report kind of guy but I will say that the set up in her new club made for some very interesting mutual gratification.

FBR
11-19-2005, 12:43 PM
"A lover always thinks of his mistress first and himself second; with a husband (or SCJunkie) it runs the other way."

Honore de Balzac

Quotation courtesy of www.brainyquote.com

FBR, finding myself preemptively :censored:

;)

Jenny
11-19-2005, 01:44 PM
Gosh I love answering questions. I think guys like it when they sexually gratify women. I don't think it is an issue of being thoughtful or gentlemanly - I think it is something that most guys actively enjoy. Thus, paying to do it or watch them do it or whatever variation is not seeing "to her needs" but the customer's own desires. If they don't want to, or are one of the guys that doesn't like it then they ought not to pay for it. The girl was just making a sales tactic - I thought it was cute, although I agree that he cannot be faulted for not further purchasing. Although I don't really see how his "principle" fits in.

Mastridonicus
11-19-2005, 03:01 PM
Mr_Punk: What if YOU WANTED to gratify women? Does that reverse the thought of a SC being all about you?

Curious.

But I think my sc visits speak for themselves.

My answer to your question is simply, 90% of All my sc visits have activly filled all my wants.

VetteKilla
11-19-2005, 03:59 PM
He did the right thing. He didnt want another dance so he didnt buy one.

Blade
11-19-2005, 08:03 PM
my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc? Fuck no...and I'm married to one.

SportsWriter2
11-19-2005, 09:17 PM
I like Sixty's blog. Celeste and Katie are the dancers to see in that club.

I like the kind of girl who can crank up higher and higher, then cum within 30 seconds when you pull her trigger. Celeste isn't there yet.

mr_punk
11-20-2005, 01:59 AM
Gosh I love answering questions.of course...sigh..why didn't i think to preemptively recuse you as well.

I think guys like it when they sexually gratify women. I don't think it is an issue of being thoughtful or gentlemanly - I think it is something that most guys actively enjoy.sure, guys like the idea of sexually gratifying women. guys do like to sexually gratify women. so, while i don't disagree with that notion. however, as sixty pointed out, there is a difference between a civilian and a sex worker. furthermore, i'm not strictly talking about gratifiying a sex worker sexually. obviously, i'm not talking about money either because that's a given. however, some customers try to gratify strippers outside of money or sex as well. for example, look at the flower and teddy bear brigade (or just check the dumpster in the back of the club) that shows up at the sc on valentine day's.

Thus, paying to do it or watch them do it or whatever variation is not seeing "to her needs" but the customer's own desires.now, that's what i'm talking about. the intent to please a sex worker not the end result. frankly, it's not that relevant, if some guy thinks a stripper came 6 times while fingering the holiest of holys and the VIP is half-submerged in her cunt juice. it's still a sex worker for crying out loud and even the most half-witted sex worker should be able to feign her way through such a performance. so, it's more of a question of whose benefit is that intent to please really for....the customer or the sex worker?

The girl was just making a sales tactic - I thought it was cute, although I agree that he cannot be faulted for not further purchasing. Although I don't really see how his "principle" fits in.i'm not faulting either party myself, but i think his point under the circumstances is that she's a sex worker. most importantly, he's paying her to get him to blow his load not hers.

Mr_Punk: What if YOU WANTED to gratify women? Does that reverse the thought of a SC being all about you?me gratify sex workers? in what way?

Richard_Head
11-20-2005, 09:06 AM
I think sixty made some valid points and I personally agree with him (within the boundaries of a SC).

At the same time, if you enjoy paying to get someone else off more power to you, go for it.

stant
11-20-2005, 10:31 AM
...does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc? ...

Great question. And some seriously clueless answers.

Anyone who has ever actually had sex in a mutual love relationship understands how such a thing is a quantum leap above the simple physical act. Its what everyone wants, although many will deny this.

The physical act alone is masturbation, regardless of the means. Degradation of a girl may play a fetish role, but the act is still essentially masturbation. You get yourself off.

Some people want the real thing. They wont find it in a strip club, but nevertheless they try. They understand that the other person should get off too when it's real, so they make an effort to do this.

It's still masturbation.

Sixty wants the real thing so bad that he imagines any indication of desire on her part as a sign of a mutual encounter. Even if true, what he doesnt know is that he will have barely begun to find it.

edit: BTW, I agree with punk.

yoda57us
11-20-2005, 12:04 PM
Stant: While I agree that a quick orgasm in a strip club is not nearly the same as making love with someone you care about I wouldn't classify it as masturbation either. I don't think anyone who goes into a strip club looking for a quickie-that may or may not involve some enjoyment on both sides-expects anything more than a quickie.

I don't really see the point in comparing the two in the context of this particular thread.

Mastridonicus
11-20-2005, 12:10 PM
me gratify sex workers? in what way?

And right there is where it gets all crazy open ended.

All I can say, My gratification comes in a mutual format.

stant
11-20-2005, 12:25 PM
Stant: While I agree that a quick orgasm in a strip club is not nearly the same as making love with someone you care about I wouldn't classify it as masturbation either. I don't think anyone who goes into a strip club looking for a quickie-that may or may not involve some enjoyment on both sides-expects anything more than a quickie.

I don't really see the point in comparing the two in the context of this particular thread.

I see your point, but take a look at sixty's "diary". He doesn't have even close to the understanding of this that you do. He's looking for love in all the wrong places. Masturbation may be a kind way of characterizing his game.

edit: punk's question was "why please the stripper?" -- based on sixty's diary, which is clearly a search for love. Hence my response.

Nevertheless, in general I personally consider purchased gratification, masturbation. Nothing wrong with jerking off. It just aint the real deal for me.

Mastridonicus
11-20-2005, 12:50 PM
Nevertheless, in general I personally consider purchased gratification, masturbation. Nothing wrong with jerking off. It just aint the real deal for me.

While I understand your thought process, I don't necissarily agree on two factors

Masterbation is self gratification through manual terms. Someone else doing it for you is no longer masterbation.

And sometimes there is that one chick, so hot, so fine, that money is truly no longer an object, fucking her is the goal and money is the path.
I wish I could say I have experience here, but thankfully it hasn't cost me $$ ever. <Yes CO, and EVEN, I said MONEY. I'm sure it cost OTHER things>

However stant, heads up, not everyone thinks like that, and the definition of "the real deal" is pretty reletive to the individual. :D

stant
11-20-2005, 12:59 PM
While I understand your thought process, I don't necissarily agree on two factors

Masterbation is self gratification through manual terms. Someone else doing it for you is no longer masterbation.

And sometimes there is that one chick, so hot, so fine, that money is truly no longer an object, fucking her is the goal and money is the path.
I wish I could say I have experience here, but thankfully it hasn't cost me $$ ever. <Yes CO, and EVEN, I said MONEY. I'm sure it cost OTHER things>

However stant, heads up, not everyone thinks like that, and the definition of "the real deal" is pretty reletive to the individual. :D
I thought it was clear I wasn't using the term literally. More along the lines of simply "self-gratification". I'm no stranger to the concept, in case you interpreted my comment as condescending.

Look at sixty's diary and you'll get a better understanding of my point. When "fucking her is the goal, and money is the path," I highly doubt the encounter will be anything close to the real deal, no matter how "hot" you may think she is from afar.

mast: If you can seriously tell me that you don't think that the experience of your ultimate dream girl being truly in love with you and passionately giving herself to you is not just a little different than her detesting you but fucking you because you paid her, go for it. You are lucky you can pay for your "real deal".

Mastridonicus
11-20-2005, 01:34 PM
I thought it was clear I wasn't using the term literally. More along the lines of simply "self-gratification". I'm no stranger to the concept, in case you interpreted my comment as condescending.

it was clear, but it enticed thought. It did seem condiscending, but I didn't look for that.



Look at sixty's diary and you'll get a better understanding of my point. When "fucking her is the goal, and money is the path," I highly doubt the encounter will be anything close to the real deal, no matter how "hot" you may think she is from afar.

I did, and you maybe right. For sixty, it doesn't seem to matter. Maybe you have to have the real deal with a hot woman to decide paying for it isn't as good.



mast: If you can seriously tell me that you don't think that the experience of your ultimate dream girl being truly in love with you and passionately giving herself to you is not just a little different than her detesting you but fucking you because you paid her, go for it. You are lucky you can pay for your "real deal".

1. I've never paid for sex. Maybe the dinner and breakfast and the room. But never the actual Lay.

2. I can only speculate but I think there is a wide spectrum between "ultimate dream girl being truly in love with you and passionately giving herself to you" "and ultimate dream girl detesting you but fucking you because you paid her". I truly believe that any woman, SW or not would not accept payment for someone they truly detest, or at least they wouldn't accept payment if they didn't know if they could rock his world.

I understand your point but what you're really saying is "If I have to pay for sex I'd rather not have it because it doesn't do it for me."
Regardless of how hot the chick is or whatever. Stant doesn't like the sex if money is involved in its presence.
I don't like it that way either. therefor. I don't pay.

stant
11-20-2005, 01:53 PM
...
I don't like it that way either. therefor. I don't pay.

Step one to finding your true holy grail.

doc-catfish
11-20-2005, 04:45 PM
i know some PLs might consider it rude or offensive not to attend to a stripper's gratification (outside of the money) in any regards (Happy Ending or not). so, my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc?
I thought the money WAS her gratification. Aside from that, the thought never crossed my mind.
/:O

Once he got enough blood back upstairs, it appears Sixty came to that conclusion too.

mr_punk
11-20-2005, 05:10 PM
I don't really see the point in comparing the two in the context of this particular thread.neither do i. other than to say that one really has nothing to do with the other. which is why i specifically used the words "stripper" (sex worker) and not "women". i thought it would have been obvious, but i guess not. so, i was had to point that out. unfortunately, some people may have gotten the impression that my initial post was applicable to women of every stripe and that isn't the case at all.

And right there is where it gets all crazy open ended.seriously, in what way? you can't mean financially. like i said, that's already a given. for example, do you mean some sort of emotional gratification? like being her friend or something along those lines?

All I can say, My gratification comes in a mutual format.ok, so a sex worker gratifies you in whatever way you prefer and you gratify her in what way? i mean, besides paying her. also, don't tell me about how nice, polite and respectful you are to her and that you treat her like a real person. that's already a given, not that it has anything to do with the subject. however, i've already assumed that everyone observes all the social niceties like a Little Lord Fauntleroy in the sc.

I see your point, but take a look at sixty's "diary". He doesn't have even close to the understanding of this that you do. He's looking for love in all the wrong places. Masturbation may be a kind way of characterizing his game.you think sixty is looking for love? i wouldn't go that far. now, i get the impression that he's a bit of a horndog...not that there's anything wrong with that. i happen to be one myself. he also might like sex workers to stroke his ego (and his willy) and eat up SS with a spoon, but that applies to the vast majority of sc customers. still, i wouldn't make the leap that he's looking for love.

what i find amusing is that customers go choose to sc go and to interact in an environment where it's all about instant self-gratification. yet, in a discussion like this one. it's not unusual for customers to think that indulging in that self-gratification seems somehow cruel, degrading or inconsiderate to strippers.

I thought the money WAS her gratificationof course, it's 1000X more powerful as a lubricant than astroglide.

stant
11-20-2005, 05:58 PM
...
you think sixty is looking for love? i wouldn't go that far. now, i get the impression that he's a bit of a horndog...not that there's anything wrong with that. i happen to be one myself. he also might like sex workers to stroke his ego (and his willy) and eat up SS with a spoon, but that applies to the vast majority of sc customers. still, i wouldn't make the leap that he's looking for love. .
Punk....that's the whole point of his diary entry. He is making the case that he has or could bridge the gap between fake pay sex and real love/desire sex (or a true emotional connection). But make no mistake; this is his goal:


This actual scenario, for me, demonstrates the line of demarcation between stripclub pseudosex and girlfriend real sex. If Celeste were my girlfriend, I know I'd act more democratically -- indeed, more chivalrously -- as regards the distribution of orgasmic ecstacy. But c'mon, it's my dime here, and time ran out. Believe me, I know the following factors weigh as incriminating evidence against my case:

I had time.
The money was not a factor.
I adore Celeste.
But still, there is a principle, is there not?

His goal is 100% to convert fake emotion to real emotion. The physical act may be identical as far as he knows. It's OK, he's been there before. Reading his diaries is like reading the Donner party story. No surprises; no Hollywood ending.

sixty
11-20-2005, 08:41 PM
Wow. Who's masturbating now? }:D

Speaking for myself, I'm not looking for love in the Champagne Room. Never have, never will. Honest.

I repeat:
I'M NOT LOOKING FOR LOVE IN THE CHAMPAGNE ROOM. As if I give a shit what anyone presumes about me.

My "problem" is that I've discovered a certain level of affection for two dancers (out of dozens in this club). Affection that has developed from a certain familiarity with them as real people, behind the stripper facade. (Don't presume to judge whether what I'm seeing is their "real" selves; you don't know my individual experience, and you don't know the dancers in question.)

People can develop feelings of affection in a myriad of contexts -- a high school sweetheart, a student, a teacher, a co-worker, a business partner, a regular fellow traveler on the commuter train. Service providers too. Have you ever sent birthday greetings to your doorman or your postal carrier, and in doing so felt genuine feelings of good will for that person? The complication in this instance, of course, is that the affection is for someone who is providing me pseudo-intimacy for money. I'm not unaware of this, I assure you. Nevertheless I think the general principle of goodwill applies here: I like Celeste, and would enjoy seeing her achieve orgasm with me, but (on that particular day at least) I didn't want to spend an additional half hour seeing her cum. That's my point of view; from her perspective, another half hour would've brought -- ABOVE ALL -- more money for her, but also, if I may be so presumptious, pleasure. This raises the age-old conundrum: Does that stripper really like me? For more than my wallet, of course. (Note that I said "like" and not "love". For God's sake one more time: let's leave love out of this, Stant.) And I have to say, defiantly and emphatically, yes. In other words, the affection is mutual.

Is this flame bait? Has a stripper never before liked being with a customer?

Mastridonicus
11-20-2005, 08:55 PM
seriously, in what way? you can't mean financially. like i said, that's already a given. for example, do you mean some sort of emotional gratification? like being her friend or something along those lines?


::) Uhm. If you want me to say "I make sure she gets off in VIP" I really cant say that and be honest. But, sometimes and this isn't all the time, she gets hers, sexually.

I'm sure you're pissed cause we're (meaning me) beating around the bush, but let me make sure I understand you. In regards to sticky's blog, you want to know if we gratify the dancer, Just not financially, politly, or friendly?

Well that leaves us with what sticky wrote, you're asking if it mattered to us to the point of which we would pay to provide her with getting off.

My answer is no.

There have been many times where I have gone to a club after a long days work and have just been in the mood to sit and talk with a dancer about something other than work. Normally the conversation becomes seriously involved and she would stay simply because we where talking. Sooner or later it would don on her that she was working and making no money and would have to leave. At this point I have paid so her convo with me was not a complete loss.

ONE dancer, I come in and pay up front so I don't have to think about it throughout the evening, and trust me, she makes me forget.



ok, so a sex worker gratifies you in whatever way you prefer and you gratify her in what way? i mean, besides paying her. also, don't tell me about how nice, polite and respectful you are to her and that you treat her like a real person. that's already a given, not that it has anything to do with the subject. however, i've already assumed that everyone observes all the social niceties like a Little Lord Fauntleroy in the sc.

Since I know this is a white hot fire poker in your balls, so I'm going to say it. She's a dancer not a sex worker. I know that lights you up. }:D

When I say my gratification is of the mutual type, thats exactly what I mean. Its not hard to use your imagination on what that means :) Think "same time"

Who said anything about making it a point to be a perfect gentleman? I just think your life is backwards. I bet you're quite the nice guy, and the club is your place to not give a shit about anyone but yourself. Nothing wrong with that. It'd be hilarious to find out you're a high school counselor, or a marriage counselor.

SOME of us, like who we are, Hell some of us don't act any differently in the club than out. I just don't get what you find so wrong about that? Why is it I can't treat a stripper with the same respect I treat the female pepsi rep if its natuaral for me to do so and not be considered a fucko by you? <really it doesn't matter but it is interesting> And don't tell me its because I can't give the pepsi rep 20 bucks to see her pussy. I already know you feel that if she's in a degrading job she should be treated like shit. I want to know why you think there is something wrong with me, cause I say please and thank you in a sc?

evan_essence
11-21-2005, 06:59 AM
I suspect this thread is going to de-evolve into a Sixty analysis, which is fine because he's practically asking for it with the affection for the postman comparison. I can't stop that but I'd also really love to hear more customer answers to the main question in the OP, which asks for analysis of one's own motives, not someone else's. To wit:

so, my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc?

-Ev

mr_punk
11-21-2005, 07:22 AM
Uhm. If you want me to say "I make sure she gets off in VIP" I really cant say that and be honest. But, sometimes and this isn't all the time, she gets hers, sexually.ok, but you do know that sex workers will make the appropriate moans, heavy breathing and even tell you that you gave her the fuck of her life...for a fee. but hey, i'm sure it's different with you, you big stud.

I'm sure you're pissed cause we're (meaning me) beating around the bush, but let me make sure I understand you. In regards to sticky's blog, you want to know if we gratify the dancer, Just not financially, politly, or friendly?
Well that leaves us with what sticky wrote, you're asking if it mattered to us to the point of which we would pay to provide her with getting off. Well that leaves us with what sticky wrote, you're asking if it mattered to us to the point of which we would pay to provide her with getting off. My answer is no.now, why would i be pissed at you? furthermore, you seem to be getting hung up on this idea of sexually gratifying a stripper. when it really isn't all that relevant for the reason stated above.

there are other ways that customers attempt to gratify strippers outside of the sexual. some of those times, it's at the expense of the customer's own gratification. for example, if a stripper mentions to a customer that her birthday is coming up and she hopes someone will get her a certain expensive gift and the customer goes out and buys it in some foolish and futile attempt to impress her. or how about a customer who wants to try out a new dancer, but decides not to because he's worried that he might hurt another dancer's feelings (not to mention the fact that she might bitch at him). neither example has anything to do with money or social niceties.

There have been many times where I have gone to a club after a long days work and have just been in the mood to sit and talk with a dancer about something other than work. Normally the conversation becomes seriously involved and she would stay simply because we where talking. Sooner or later it would don on her that she was working and making no money and would have to leave. At this point I have paid so her convo with me was not a complete loss. ONE dancer, I come in and pay up front so I don't have to think about it throughout the evening, and trust me, she makes me forget.that's nice, but what does this have to do with the subject? you talked to a stripper and paid her for her services. so, what do you want...a medal? how about a glass of warm milk and cookies? or a round of applause for something you should be doing in the first place. paying a stripper for her services and observing social niceties doesn't make a customer special.

Since I know this is a white hot fire poker in your balls, so I'm going to say it. She's a dancer not a sex worker. I know that lights you up.not really. you're the not the first PL who liken a sc to the movie "Flashdance", but more to the point. if she is a dancer and not a sex worker. why are you talking about some dancer (that you're paying, BTW) getting off sexually in a sc?

When I say my gratification is of the mutual type, thats exactly what I mean. Its not hard to use your imagination on what that means Think "same time"well, i don't feel like using my imagination, chief. so, spell it out for me. unless, you're going to tell me more tales of your studliness with a sex wor..er..dancers. in that case, there's no need. i got that part.

Who said anything about making it a point to be a perfect gentleman?oh, i did. which is why in my initial post i stated: "oh, before anyone starts blathering about how gentlemanly they are to strippers. that's a given.". you see, i knew some guys would take the subject the wrong way and immediately go into martyr-mode and start handing out justifications about how polite, nice and respectful they are to dancers. when it really has nothing to do with the subject at all. i assumed that everyone's mother taught them to chew their food with their mouths closed. so, i wanted to short-circuit that process. unfortunately, just like some people wanted to make this about a comparison between civilians and sex workers. it didn't work.

I just think your life is backwards. I bet you're quite the nice guy, and the club is your place to not give a shit about anyone but yourself. Nothing wrong with that. It'd be hilarious to find out you're a high school counselor, or a marriage counselor.

SOME of us, like who we are, Hell some of us don't act any differently in the club than out. I just don't get what you find so wrong about that? Why is it I can't treat a stripper with the same respect I treat the female pepsi rep if its natuaral for me to do so and not be considered a fucko by you? <really it doesn't matter but it is interesting> And don't tell me its because I can't give the pepsi rep 20 bucks to see her pussy. I already know you feel that if she's in a degrading job she should be treated like shit. I want to know why you think there is something wrong with me, cause I say please and thank you in a sc?LOL. absolutely amazing...why do i get the feeling that if SCJ was about any other subject concerning service workers. customers wouldn't feel this need to proclaim, justify and to a degree, seek validation about how nice they are to people. i mean, even strippers don't do it to the absurd degree of customers. a customer indulging in his own gratification doesn't necessarily imply that he's somehow being disrespectful or even degrading to the stripper.

Is this flame bait? Has a stripper never before liked being with a customer?what does it matter as long as you get what you want. next time..remember sixty, get the room after the stripper shows up and not before.

I suspect this thread is going to de-evolve into a Sixty analysis, which is fine because he's practically asking for it with the affection for the postman comparison.i know, but i'm not even trying to to go there.

I can't stop that but I'd also really love to hear more customer answers to the main question in the OP, which asks for analysis of one's own motives, not someone else's. To wit:oh, i'm sure they'll get to it eventually. right now, they're kind of busy nailing themselves to the cross.

Jenny
11-21-2005, 08:26 AM
ok, but you do know that sex workers will make the appropriate moans, heavy breathing and even tell you that you gave her the fuck of her life...for a fee. but hey, i'm sure it's different with you, you big stud.
now, why would i be pissed at you? furthermore, you seem to be getting hung up on this idea of sexually gratifying a stripper. when it really isn't all that relevant for the reason stated above.

Look hon, first I shall sound a teeny bit rational, and then I shall give you license to mock me.
The stripper "getting off" (I use quotes because I don't think it really matters in this context if she gets off or just does a reasonable enough impression to convince the customer) is relevant IF that is what the customer likes. As I said: some guys - in my experience a lot of guys - like that. The stripper breathing hard in his ear, getting flushed, biting her lip etc. is just what gets them hard (and please not that I avoid using the term "splooge." I would appreciate it if you could use the same restraint). THEY like it. Like when you say that fingering the stripper is seeing to her needs - no it isn't. It is something that the customer can do (to some) if the customer so desires - if is about what HE (I presume he) wants to do, not ever what she wants done. You either like putting your fingers in girl's vaginas or you don't - if you don't, don't bother using your paid time doing it. If you do - well, there you go. However doing it and then claiming that it is about her is beyond absurd.

I've decided not to go into the mockworthy part. Just tough.

aggieed
11-21-2005, 08:31 AM
so, my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc?

Being a selfish rat bastard, my answer is no.

Casual Observer
11-21-2005, 09:02 AM
so, my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc?

No.

In all my time of SCing, it has only ever happened with one dancer (though apparently very regularly), and it happened without my knowledge--it was only after she'd stopped dancing that I'd learned of it at all.

Otherwise, I wouldn't be so arrogant as to presume that I can provide gratification by my simply sitting there. I mean, I'm arrogant and elitist to the core and all, but not that arrogant and elitist--even I have my limits. :D

And sorry, stant, but we always pay for it. Always. The manner and means of remuneration may vary considerably, but we always pay for sex. I don't have a problem with that paradigm, myself.

Mastridonicus
11-21-2005, 09:09 AM
ok, but you do know that sex workers will make the appropriate moans, heavy breathing and even tell you that you gave her the fuck of her life...for a fee. but hey, i'm sure it's different with you, you big stud.

Hahah

Sir, you do know that some sex workers will make the appropriate moans, heavy breathing, and even tell you that you gave her the fuck of her life....for free? Hasn't happened to me. But as I told stant, just because YOU are used to paying the fee, it doesn't mean everyone does. It speaks heavily to your experience in this hobbie that you believe you cant believe you actually sexually gratified a woman regardless of whether or not money is involved. And that if she's a sex worker, and having some form of sex, all signs of pleasure must be faked. Maybe you're just not a big stud :/



now, why would i be pissed at you?

lets just leave that where it lays and move on.



furthermore, you seem to be getting hung up on this idea of sexually gratifying a stripper. when it really isn't all that relevant for the reason stated above.


The hell it isn't. You sir, are lying to yourself completely. The context of sixty's blog is paying to get her off. You asked the questions and told us not to finances or social nicities.



there are other ways that customers attempt to gratify strippers outside of the sexual. some of those times, it's at the expense of the customer's own gratification. for example, if a stripper mentions to a customer that her birthday is coming up and she hopes someone will get her a certain expensive gift and the customer goes out and buys it in some foolish and futile attempt to impress her.


well first, observing birthdays and holidays falls under the social nicities and friendliness you asked us to refrain from mentioning

second, You're right It is a PL that sacrifices their own gratification for that of dancers, but now you're asking for people to put themselves on the chopping block for you and the rest of the board to potentially destroy. Do you seriously think someone is going to say to your
"for example, if a stripper mentions to a customer that her birthday is coming up and she hopes someone will get her a certain expensive gift"
"She told me her birthday is coming up and she was hoping someone would get her an escalade.
"and the customer goes out and buys it "
"So I went out and cosigned a loan with my grandpa to get it for her
"it in some foolish and futile attempt to impress her."
"And she never even said thanks, much less lay me :/ "

c'mon. You started this thread asking if custies ever tried to make dancers happy. Basically. Then you took out the call for money and social nicities <birthdays> which left with sex. You get called on sex, and you go back to publically humiliating situations that you call attention to and look down upon vocally. Seriously. Why hasn't everyone that had something like this happen to them posted about it yet? Its a mystery. ::)



or how about a customer who wants to try out a new dancer, but decides not to because he's worried that he might hurt another dancer's feelings (not to mention the fact that she might bitch at him).

This I did not think of. But trying out another dancer has never been an issue for me. If I want to I do. and. I do.



neither example has anything to do with money or social niceties.

Buying a birthday gift isn't costing money or observing a socially impacting date?
You used "trying out another dancer" You mean Buying time with another sex worker. I.E. Buying. I.E. money.



that's nice, but what does this have to do with the subject? you talked to a stripper and paid her for her services. so, what do you want...a medal? how about a glass of warm milk and cookies? or a round of applause for something you should be doing in the first place. paying a stripper for her services and observing social niceties doesn't make a customer special.

Right right....maybe if I put the money in a birthday card....and now suddenly its all different.

I never said I was special. You asked what we do to gratify strippers. I.E. make them happy. Paying someone for a conversation that they expected no reinbursement for, I felt, fell under those circumstances.

But your reply to that shows why people aren't clammering down the door to tell you of their charades that ended in misfortune. You simply plan to open them up and prove that you are a better hobbyist for treating her like shit since, she is however, taking your money.



not really. you're the not the first PL who liken a sc to the movie "Flashdance", but more to the point. if she is a dancer and not a sex worker. why are you talking about some dancer (that you're paying, BTW) getting off sexually in a sc?

go back and read I said that to clarify your question. My next line after all that states I have not. Lets be clear here, I have never nor ever plan on having sex with a dancer in the confines of a sc.

And you're not the first PL to ask people on this board to post how they fucked up in the club by expecting more from a dancer on this board. Its just people with the stories don't want you putting them on town square. Why not start with you're own? Or are you just that damn good of a customer?



well, i don't feel like using my imagination, chief. so, spell it out for me. unless, you're going to tell me more tales of your studliness with a sex wor..er..dancers. in that case, there's no need. i got that part.

Right cause it answers the question you typed out. Just not the one you asked.



so, i wanted to short-circuit that process. unfortunately, just like some people wanted to make this about a comparison between civilians and sex workers. it didn't work.

Yea man, I know what ya mean, some people just cant take a joke at their own expense without obsessing on it. But what's weird is, I thought this was about gratifying sex workers and at the expense of your own gratification. Not gratifying strippers at the expense of your dignity so the poster can laugh :/



LOL. absolutely amazing...why do i get the feeling that if SCJ was about any other subject concerning service workers. customers wouldn't feel this need to proclaim, justify and to a degree, seek validation about how nice they are to people. i mean, even strippers don't do it to the absurd degree of customers. a customer indulging in his own gratification doesn't necessarily imply that he's somehow being disrespectful or even degrading to the stripper.

I don't seek validation. I just fail to see the difference between strippers and service workers outside of what they are willing to do for a 20.
Whats more stupid though? The guy who refuses to ackonowledge any job involving sexuality is anything other than sex for sale sexworkers? Or the person who is so obsessed with forcing that label on them in such a fashion that they blast any remote comparison out of the water?

SportsWriter2
11-21-2005, 09:31 AM
You either like putting your fingers in girl's vaginas or you don't - if you don't, don't bother using your paid time doing it. If you do - well, there you go. However doing it and then claiming that it is about her is beyond absurd.
I'm indifferent. I only do it when requested and the dancer has a reason. Then it's about her. Sorry to disappoint you and Mr P at the same time. :-\

Excellent comment, Sixty. Testing the edges and blurring the distinctions becomes a fun game in itself. Four good encounters in a month is better than most real world relationships. :)

Deogol
11-21-2005, 07:08 PM
which is why i specifically used the words "stripper" (sex worker) and not "women". i thought it would have been obvious, but i guess not. so, i was had to point that out. unfortunately, some people may have gotten the impression that my initial post was applicable to women of every stripe and that isn't the case at all.

Are you getting soft on us? :D

Jenny
11-21-2005, 07:34 PM
mock you? oh, i will do no such thing. i respect you too much....really.
Well good. I'm very respectable. Apparently.


sure, but i don't have to tell you that "absurdity" are some customer's middle name.
Okay... you obviously don't remember posting that fingering a dancer was not mileage, because it was seeing to her needs, and not the needs of the customer... or maybe you do? And you mean that "absurdity" is your middle name? Or it could be your first name: Mr. Absurdity Punk.


well, i guess we're in the same boat, amigo. i get real tired of guys wanting to be awarded the Medal of Honor for leaving the toliet seat down. the implication being: they like to go to sc and grope strippers. yet, for some strange reason. they feel this need to constantly qualify that they are a really, really, nice person. sheesh, i wonder if the mailman gets that type of treatment.
My mailman does. But I get a lot of heavy packages.

mr_punk
11-21-2005, 07:40 PM
Okay... you obviously don't remember posting that fingering a dancer was not mileage, because it was seeing to her needs, and not the needs of the customer... or maybe you do?actually i do. i also remember that i had to go back and edit that post with a sarcasm emoticon because apparently some people (like you for instance) didn't get that it was....you know, a sarcastic comment.

Jenny
11-21-2005, 07:55 PM
actually i do. i also remember that i had to go back and edit that post with a sarcasm emoticon because apparently some people (like you for instance) didn't get that it was....you know, a sarcastic comment.
Okay - frankly, I think asking me to read your posts once is quite a lot - asking me to track them for changes is way, way excessive.

xdamage
11-22-2005, 09:51 AM
so, my question is does anyone go to the sc to please a stripper or even think about a stripper's gratification while in the sc?

Not really.

The only degree to which I think about the stripper's gratification is for selfish reasons. Really not a whole lot different then any guy who behaves differently around a hot woman than he does around less attractive women. If I do something that attempts to turn the stripper on, it's ultimately because I'm getting something out of it (i.e., it is increasing my pleasure or it might increase my chances OTC). That's mostly just instinctual behavior, sex drive at play, since I don't take it OTC even when offered (and it has been offered). If it felt like work or an effort though, I wouldn't do it, not when I'm paying by the minute.

Not meaning to sound like a completely heartless bastard here, but I try to be honest about what's really motivating me, and the fact is the sex drive is the key motivator for me at the club. If the strippers weren't hot I would treat them differently (and I certainly wouldn't pay for it). I will do quite a lot for my SO just because she has earned it and deserves it. But then she is hot so who knows, maybe I only gave her the chance to get to know her because she is hot. I'd like to imagine I'm some kind of caring type of guy, who thinks about the strippers wants and needs, but honestly a lot of times it simply comes down to behaving a certain way because it's a sexual turn on, or might increase my odds of scoring.

stant
11-22-2005, 06:01 PM
And sorry, stant, but we always pay for it. Always. The manner and means of remuneration may vary considerably, but we always pay for sex. I don't have a problem with that paradigm, myself.

Boldfacing the text, repetition, changing font size or color, or even adding a few exclamation points won't make this rationalization magically come true. I don't have a problem with anyone that for whatever reason seeks out a professional encounter rather than a real relationship. And you can go right on rationalizing it ala the "risky business" paradigm if you need to. The ray bans suit you. 8)

Oh and sixty and punk, when I said "looking for love in all the wrong places" I was making an allusion to a bad c&w song. Ya'll are so literal down here sometimes, it's like dealing with a bunch of lawyers.

ricosuave312
11-23-2005, 05:51 AM
I'm with Sixty. Panty Claus is real. :bong: But where's Easter Blunt Bunny, and the Spliff Fairy when u need em. :bong: Cholo left to go to a meeting and get burritos 4 hours ago. What's this about?

threlayer
11-23-2005, 01:34 PM
I suspect this thread is going to de-evolve ... but I'd also really love to hear more customer answers to the main question in the OP, which asks for analysis of one's own motives, not someone else's.

You are about to get a short exposition of something I love to talk about.

Not withstanding all that stuff about Freud's pleasure principle, to me it is a mutually cooperative thing. I pretty much know she enjoys getting her pleasure and I enjoy helping her have at it. The more she genuinely experiences it and expresses it the more I enjoy it. That gives me pleasure. That is just how it is, probably with me and likely some other guys too.

I don't know if I can delve into my motivations* for that pleasure nor the philosophy of it, so I will very briefly discuss the experiences. (Some will probably ask how I know it really happened, but I do know the true indicators of that response - tensing, breathing rapidly, quiet moans, quick perspiration etc).

In a club I have never gotten off from a lapdance (only) nor do I ever expect to. I don't even get close to it anymore, thought she might not think so from my 'response'. And the pleasure I get isn't about those expectations for me. Nor is it about enticing her into some OTC experience, well maybe a short fantasy of same, which I haven't requested from any of those 4 dancers. I recall my experiences with 4 dancers, all of whom I had regular club encounters with including at least one where she an orgasm from just grinding, and of those 2 of those gals had several orgasmic experiences with me, 1 with multiple steamy orgasms per session. Those are some of the most memorable experiences I've had in clubs. I doubt that many would remember them now, but what the heck, it's maybe part of their many work experiences.

________
* It certainly isn't love but instead (very) short-term affection. A club is most certainly one of many wrong places to look for love.

mr_punk
11-23-2005, 03:37 PM
Boldfacing the text, repetition, changing font size or color, or even adding a few exclamation points won't make this rationalization magically come true. I don't have a problem with anyone that for whatever reason seeks out a professional encounter rather than a real relationship. And you can go right on rationalizing it ala the "risky business" paradigm if you need to. The ray bans suit you.risky business? now, i do recall that movie. anyway, this is why i'm uncomfortable comparing the two. CO is right. there are economic considerations. stant is also right. there are other considerations beyond economic ones. however, PLs usually get themselves into trouble when they start comparing the one based on the other. when, IMO, one is a totally different animal than the other. in short, when talking about the subject. i think there should be less rationalization and more compartmentalization.

Oh and sixty and punk, when I said "looking for love in all the wrong places" I was making an allusion to a bad c&w song. Ya'll are so literal down here sometimes, it's like dealing with a bunch of lawyers.oh, is that it? now, i'm glad i never listen to country music or lawyers. anyway, what difference does it make? if it isn't love. it sounds like something beyond a simple lap. now, i can see why you would make those statements, but i'm not even going to go there. so, rather than talk about sixty's blog or some of the other comments in this thread. instead, i'll just make a few general comments:
in the sc, customers tend to get caught up in issues that aren't pertinent to the service itself.
strippers can and do fulfil a whole assortment of perversions beyond the physical.
the combination of (1) & (2) can lead some guys to commit the most idiotic, moronic and retarded acts known to mankind.
as a result of (3), you can't always tell a PL that he's being a PL. it's like warning a child about the dangers of a hot stove. some kids will heed the warning and then you're going to have that group of kids that just have to stick their hands in the hot skillet...sometimes, over and over and over again.
due to (4), it is better to laugh at the PLs expense rather than try and help him. it's much like that moment in a three stooges short. when curly looks down the barrel of a loaded, sawed-off, double-barreled shotgun after it misfires. after all, no one really wants to see curly put the gun down.

toomuchinfo
11-24-2005, 12:37 AM
you can't always tell a PL that he's being a PL. it's like warning a child about the dangers of a hot stove. some kids will heed the warning and then you're going to have that group of kids that just have to stick their hands in the hot skillet...sometimes, over and over and over again.


This is such a fun mental image I must now comb rotten.com for an avatar of this. [not children, of course]

evan_essence
11-24-2005, 08:16 AM
You are about to get a short exposition of something I love to talk about.Thank you for that, hun. :)


strippers can and do fulfil a whole assortment of perversions beyond the physical.Why, that's the sweetest thing you've ever said about me. :blush: Thank you.

-Ev

mr_punk
11-25-2005, 03:48 PM
Why, that's the sweetest thing you've ever said about me. :) Thank you.no, no, no..thank you. you're absolutely correct. i don't know what i was thinking. i guess that what happens when i don't proofread my posts. i will go back immediately and rectify the situation. here's a preview of the modified version:


these biatches can and do fulfil a whole assortment of perversions. you know why? well, in addition to being total sluts. customers are paying these biatches to be nice to them.now, that looks much better. good catch.:thumbsup:

evan_essence
11-29-2005, 06:54 AM
Quote:
these biatches can and do fulfil a whole assortment of perversions. you know why? well, in addition to being total sluts. customers are paying these biatches to be nice to them. You haven't been giving writing lessons to a certain troll over at the Exotic Dancer forum, have you? /:O

-Ev

mr_punk
11-29-2005, 06:25 PM
nah, that place is like SW. except, IIRC it's mostly composed of strippers, DJ's and suitcase pimps rather than strippers and fuckoes. in any case, i treat them both the same. i leave them to their own devices.