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nylonfeetlover
01-14-2006, 10:36 PM
My principle is: Be nice but dont be Mr. Nice Guy.

AngelEyezXYZ
01-14-2006, 11:22 PM
Quantum: that damsel in distress/shining armor thing is that co-dependency thing. I was involved in a looooong relationship like that and it was really great. It was unhealthy, but it was great, if you know what I mean. We were like joined at the hip and loved every minute of it. But it was very stifling. The break up ended with a horrible situation that HAD to happen or we'd have continued going on the way we were, because nobody felt the need to call it quits.

But it wasn't until after the break up I realized just how unhealthy it was... I didn't know what foods I really liked to eat because I always ate what she ate. I didn't know what type of music I even liked to listen to because I always just started to like what she was playing. It took me 2 years to buy my own car because she drove me everywhere and liked doing it. I'm still having a hard time figuring out what my major in college is going to be because we were both going to all the same classes. For a long time after the breakup (which was in March05) I felt so alone, like seriously my life was gone... weird. You don't want that. I mean I know it sounds really weird, and it is, but for two clingy, insecure people that relationship was paradise, but really, really damaging.

Nicolina
01-15-2006, 02:44 AM
What do I have to do to sign up for you and Jenny's group. I'll do anything!

Kat, do you have any idea how long I’ve waited to hear you utter those three little words? }:D

Of course, we do have a rather extensive initiation process…Right, Jenny?? ;) ;)

But we’d be thrilled to receive your application.

First order of business: employ our well-honed honeypot skills to infiltrate the American Enterprise Institute and the Project for a New American Century, and, through a combination of Advanced Stripper Shit, neurolinguistic programming, superior dick-sucking skills, preternaturally gorgeous asses, and other tradecraft secrets too sensitive to mention, bring the neocons around to our point of view.


Nic, your friend is brilliant, that theory makes a lot of sense. I got sick and tired of my "nice guy" friends turning on me and making me feel like a piece of shit because I wasn't fucking them (unless really drunk).

:rotfl:
Sorry, Kat. That was funny. And it’s not like I can’t relate….


Conversely, I WAS manipulating them into spending their time and attentions on me.

That’s a really brave and important admission. So often, in recounting stories of unsatisfying relationships, people cast themselves as the hero and/or the victim, while the other party becomes the unequivocal antagonist. We’re all tempted to do it, but your resistance of that temptation is admirable. We should all be so self-aware.


CaptainQuantum, I'm glad you are learning, its innovative to have a customer learn something from this site, wow!

I concur. This whole conversation is kind of amazing. CQ, I like your capacity for self-perception, even when it must be kind of painful…

Nicolina
01-15-2006, 02:49 AM
Nic, I agree with that observation of the brilliant friend of yours. It doesn't necessarily take brilliance, though - sometimes just experience. What I have found in my eight decades of life:

"I follow Jesus, and I believe in the truth. I am 100% truthful." Translated: "I'm a pathological liar."

"I'm an extremely hard worker." Translated: "Just try to get me off the phone to do an ounce of production."

"I love everybody." Translated: "I am the most judgmental asshole you'll meet. And please invite me to your next party, because no one else does."

"I want you to have your freedom." Translated: "Do everything I say, and we'll be happy."

Et cetera.

:O :O

OMG, Jay, that’s exactly right!!!! That’s also exactly the kind of thing she was talking about.
Incidentally, though, she is brilliant…and a long-time dancer, of course. :)

This just goes to show that, as I suspected, you are rather brilliant yourself...

And may I also say:

KrazyJane, you seem to be incredibly perceptive regarding this subject. I admit that some of your posts have made me squirm, and feel implicated where I didn’t particularly want to be implicated….

King
01-15-2006, 08:12 AM
I am a VERY nice guy.

When I have wifey bent over my legs, I pull her hair back gently but firmly and ask her 'is this what you want', before I give her a few playful smacks on the a$$. Of course, if she says no, i do it anyway...*wink*

Mastridonicus
01-15-2006, 09:14 AM
^^ You are just precious.

because this is so interesting, and I don't want the penny up there to derail the train....

Jay, I'm so honest that my love for everyone has a baseline of which people cannot destroy and when/if they do I normally end up hurt, but I respect their freedom and bury myself in my work to forget it.

I must be one FUCKED UP mother fucker.

Hehehe again, speaking to my personal experience. As introspective as this is, we all are drawing on our own perspectives guised as objective views anyways. ::)

Well truth is, I let my actions speak normally, which, sometimes, isn't the BEST idea. I mean, I really have no idea what I am, and if stating what I believe my "qualities" are to the person who just met me in passing convo who asked is declaring the opposite, Oh well. Hopefully they stick around to find out.

All I know is that its a per person per activity basis, I hate to disagree with you, nicolina, and her friend, <and I am not, really> but though the theory is most likely correct, anyone who puts weight in those words, and those words alone probably should know better.

All I am saying is, you may be right. In my experience with people tho, it didn't matter. Especially myself because I am not ABOUT to say that though I feel I have specific qualities, that an action has not occured that turned me into the piece of shit person I try so hard not to be. I mean who here hasn't forsaken their 'person' for a stupid reason and lost greatly? <I.E. Being an upright person who loved the bottle too much?> I've done it many times, but thats one of the many bad qualities I adobted from the evil woman who birthed me. From the loins of the demon....

::)

Mast

All Good Things
01-15-2006, 12:06 PM
First order of business: employ our well-honed honeypot skills to infiltrate the American Enterprise Institute and the Project for a New American Century, and, through a combination of Advanced Stripper Shit, neurolinguistic programming, superior dick-sucking skills, preternaturally gorgeous asses, and other tradecraft secrets too sensitive to mention, bring the neocons around to our point of view.

The superior dick-sucking skills are surely the only thing in all of Western Civilization that can rid of us of Rumsfeld's perpetual scowl. Actually, his facial expression at that very moment may defy all efforts at description. ;)


OMG, Jay, that’s exactly right!!!! That’s also exactly the kind of thing she was talking about.

Is the idea that the more insistent the claim, the more likely it is to be false? That would make sense. Alternatively, if it's true that every claimed behavior is the inverse of the truth, wouldn't that just create a huge emotional landmine for every single person? Beyond that, how could a person of good faith ever hope to describe his or her behavior accurately? Mirror back what other people say?

MsTopaz
01-17-2006, 04:50 PM
One of the reasons that women go for assholes is precisely like the scene on Bedazzled. Women get so sick and tired of being a crutch for needy males that they go towards the polar opposite. To many women, assholes are the lesser of two evils because they at least have backbones. It takes time to find an eqilibrium of asshole and nice guy, and we have to discover and become confident with ourselves as well. Also, all the guys who are a good balance are taken!


i personally don't care for trifling jackasses...i mean assholes...would never date one, or even befriend one...and i for damn sure will NEVER marry one...

but then again that's just me. i don't settle for the worst of 'mates'...and i'm about 85% lesbian anyway.

i obviously have zero tolerance for asshole personalities. have had enough experience with them to BREAK ME of that bad habit.

:peace:

SA-80
02-11-2006, 05:39 PM
Krazyjane, thanks for starting this thread and for the link.
contheboyalready, thanks for a great post, filled in a couple of missing pieces of a puzzle for me. Want a flower? :-), you earned it (not gonna date you though ;-).

Serioustly though, I say huuuuuuuuuuuuge thanks for all the "heartless bitches" or more precisely to all women rejecting nice guys! THANK YOU SOOOOOO MUCH! If it wasn't for you and for your "vote" with your body against them, I would have never became the man I'm right now.

You know, I'm not gonna blah blah blah about how not so 100% nice guy I was and I had opinions or blah blah blah, the bottom line is I wasn't man enough, wasn't strong enough, that's all.

Women are very adaptive. They don't like to lead. They enjoy being led. And no matter what they say, they don't like fighting. Never listen to what they say, "listen" to what they do. Which leaves us, guys to become leaders and get back to our masculine roots, which, frankly borders antisocial and lone-wolf life style, because you are independent and don't cling to your friends for support in fact you don't need support from anybody. You support yourself. To be a man, a true man, you have to be self-sufficient and in a way anti-soscial. You shouldn't care about sosciety, you should do what you think is best exclusively for you in every situation and put sosciety and the BS that others through on you aside. That's the challenge of sexual maturity of a male. He's a fighter, a killer. He is his own god, his own leader. Hell of a challenge, but well worth it when you live that way. Blesses every day of your life. SA-80 is a british assault rifle, btw. That's who I've become in my precision thinking, true fairyness, 0 tolerance for bull shit, and decisiveness. Worth every second of my life.

Thank you all, heartless bitches and just sexually mature women who have rejected a true assholes - nice guys.

MzGigi
02-11-2006, 06:39 PM
HAHAHAHAH! what a HILARIOUS website!!!

that was *REALLY* some great stuff!!! ;D

Widget
02-11-2006, 08:42 PM
Want to learn to not be a nice guy? Go to strip clubs with only a few bucks to buy beer for yourself and make the girls think your loaded. The girls will no longer think you are a "nice guy". :D

Deogol
02-11-2006, 10:24 PM
Krazyjane, thanks for starting this thread and for the link.
contheboyalready, thanks for a great post, filled in a couple of missing pieces of a puzzle for me. Want a flower? :-), you earned it (not gonna date you though ;-).

Serioustly though, I say huuuuuuuuuuuuge thanks for all the "heartless bitches" or more precisely to all women rejecting nice guys! THANK YOU SOOOOOO MUCH! If it wasn't for you and for your "vote" with your body against them, I would have never became the man I'm right now.

You know, I'm not gonna blah blah blah about how not so 100% nice guy I was and I had opinions or blah blah blah, the bottom line is I wasn't man enough, wasn't strong enough, that's all.

Women are very adaptive. They don't like to lead. They enjoy being led. And no matter what they say, they don't like fighting. Never listen to what they say, "listen" to what they do. Which leaves us, guys to become leaders and get back to our masculine roots, which, frankly borders antisocial and lone-wolf life style, because you are independent and don't cling to your friends for support in fact you don't need support from anybody. You support yourself. To be a man, a true man, you have to be self-sufficient and in a way anti-soscial. You shouldn't care about sosciety, you should do what you think is best exclusively for you in every situation and put sosciety and the BS that others through on you aside. That's the challenge of sexual maturity of a male. He's a fighter, a killer. He is his own god, his own leader. Hell of a challenge, but well worth it when you live that way. Blesses every day of your life. SA-80 is a british assault rifle, btw. That's who I've become in my precision thinking, true fairyness, 0 tolerance for bull shit, and decisiveness. Worth every second of my life.

Thank you all, heartless bitches and just sexually mature women who have rejected a true assholes - nice guys.

Welcome to bitter cynical middle age. Just think of what you have to look forward to for bitter cynical old age.

People still figure out how to fall in love though.

Now you can be just as suspicious, distrusting, and manipulation-aware as the next guy when dealing with women. Good to have those teen year "be the prince" bullshit behind ya - cuz most women are no where near the princess, I can tell ya that. ::)

I'm not being down on women - just saying people are people.

Besides, thank your stars you don't have to date American women (I assume you are in Britian.)

Niceguy
02-11-2006, 11:09 PM
Hey!!! By the way... you're wrong.- N.G.

SA-80
02-12-2006, 02:56 AM
I like it this way. I understand the reality much better. I didn't like living a fairytale of princesses, knights, etc - all that BS all the women in our lives from our mothers to school teachers were teaching us, that it's bad to be yourself, it's bad to let go your masculine instincts, and basically that it's bad to be a boy - talking in extremes here of course, but you get the idea. Now when you grow up and try to figure out the world you look up to adults around you and you trust them, and everything seam to work, you get good grades, sort of "respect" or whatever, and then the real life comes... And nothing works at all... Idealistic way of life or way of thinking that you practiced is a road to hell and to death really. Corporate politics came to your reality... idealisation of women, of people in general everything is a huge bucket of bullshit that you got from your past. And there are guys who believed less than you did in their childhood, who were bad boys really, who stole money drank, never studied well, etc, sort of the outlaws, and they understand it all smoothly, while you don't... Makes you think ha? I would say rethink your whole life and where did you go wrong? The answer : Everywhere :-)... At this point many men give up, they blame others for their own failures and in a way they are right, but just in a way... Basically it all sort of no big deal, until nothing or almost nothing works with women.... Now the freakshow with explosions and fireworks starts :-), because I, as a man, could accept anything, but I couldn't accept my lack of success with women, my fears and idialisation of women, as being the only "right" being on the planet and feminine roots as the only "right" way of living... And ironically enough, the women in my early years who lied and idealised the world to me - granted I did accept that so I'm still totally responsible for the situation myself - did a lot of damage to my masculine psychology, then it's the women in my adulthood who actually put me in a situation when I decided to take the full and total control of my life in my own hands, with only 1 serious change - after all the lies I don't believe what a woman says at all, so when she says : "I want a nice guy" - I go insde : Bullshit!; "I want love" = "I want great sex"; "I want sensitive guy" = "I want a guy who will accept me" or like I simply don't believe her that's all, I believe what she does. I trust myself and ask myself for the answers I normally would ask a woman. And everything starts to work out for me just fine. With more and more maturity and masculinity I get a true respect from everybody without even doing anything. I say exactly what I mean, and I people, men, with whom I work, respect me big time, I am their leader. If before I would "hover" around an "unapproachable" woman, now more and more women hover around me and I'm actually an "unapproachable" man for them. And ladies, freak, I know now how creepy it feels for you when guys do that :-) I also wonder, doesn't she get the hint that I'm not interested? What's the point of like doing that? And I know I can approach any woman and if she says anything bad to me, just laugh at her face, turn around and walk away feeling completely calm, and thinking : what a dumb bitch, thank god I'm not attractive to her, that would be a problem. Never happens though, b/c they feel who is talking to them. Keeping my fingers crossed because I actually don't attract bitches like that.

To really sum up the whole prose here:
What does a woman really want? A GUY, A MAN, A MASCULINE SEXUALLY MATURE CONFIDENT MAN. Is that really a lot to ask? It's not like she wants a rock star, a billioner, an austronaut who was on a moon or something. Don't you, guys want to be a masculine, sexually mature, confident men?
I was freaking dreaming about that all my life! Yeah, it's hard to be a man, but it's certainly a lot of fun and a lot more fulfilling to me than being stuck as a masculine exterior with feminine interior - Shit, that just sucks for me - no thanks to you, Mom (you should have had a girl not a boy)...

Deogol
02-12-2006, 09:10 AM
^^^ Well, I am glad you told the femi-nazi's NO to the demasculation that runs rampant in this western society.

Just don't go to far in the other direction or you will be just as wrong!

Sitri
02-12-2006, 09:45 AM
A question: maybe I'm still being thick-headed, and sorry if I am. But is it always a bad thing to have the fantasy of taking a woman who has had a lot of pain and hurt in her life, and being her "knight in shining armor"? Being the one who picks her up in his arms, wipes away all her tears and says "you're safe now. No one is ever going to hurt you again"? Is that always a sign of insecurity, of the guy not liking himself, so he needs that to make him feel a "sense of accomplishment"?



At the risk of being flamed. Have you seen the incredibles where Mr. Incredible saves the guy jumping off of the roof and save him The guy hurts his neck and so he sues Mr. Incredible. The reason is that he didn't want to be saved.

Some people(not putting this on any one sex) simply do not want to be "saved". Their life is a reason to feel unappreciated, unloved, used, etc. etc. Don't go messing with their perspective. Even if you did, they would not have the trust and faith in YOU. In anticipation of YOU betraying them they would sabotage the relationship or betray you first. Don't go screwing up their view of the world.

The only way this works is they have an epiphany and THEY want to change their life.

You hear women constantly complaining about Men this and Men that. Using an analogy of fish, if you only swim in the shark tank, that's all you will find. You will think all men are all sharks. First, they have to comprehend that there really is another kind of fish, second, they have to figure where these type of fish live, and third, they have to figure out how to attract them and keep them. Keeping that in mind, all men (like fish) will have some characteristics in common. It's just important to see which fish have fewer of the really bad traits. (Like not screwing all of the other fish or eating their young.)

If you want to fantasize about being a knight, watch Pretty Woman again and again. Or, even better yet, start acting, get in the local theatre. Maybe you can save the leading lady and take her home. If you want to play a Richard Gere role, go for American Gigalo.:P But stay away from First Knight, the movie sucked and Guenevere can't decide what the F. she wanted.

Sorry, for the diatribe. I'm on a diet and testy.

Oh, ladies, anyone for Sushi?

threlayer
02-12-2006, 12:46 PM
Time, exposure, and sanity will take care of that for most of us. I'm still a responsible, truthful and ethical person, but I'm not nice anymore.

Most women initially will try to take advantage of whatever they can from a man. Some eventually become cooperative and reasonable but not until they have matured. It's up to the man to watch over himself. And the games they play...it's that weird socialization thing they have. Many women would rather have a family or alternatively either gay friend or a fuck buddy than a real boyfriend. A stable bf relationship is often just a tough thing. It isn't just strippers who are like that.

Very many women on dating sites are looking for someone to take care of their prefabbed family. Most women work anymore, but some of them, in my experience, have become so hardened in their jobs that they take it home with them. Must be another angle to that socialization thing.

With all those hazards, it is exceedingly difficult to extablish a mutually great long-term relationship. If you get one, do NOT screw it up, not even for hot sex on the side.

Rip
09-05-2006, 02:27 AM
First order of business: employ our well-honed honeypot skills to infiltrate the American Enterprise Institute and the Project for a New American Century, and, through a combination of Advanced Stripper Shit, neurolinguistic programming, superior dick-sucking skills, preternaturally gorgeous asses, and other tradecraft secrets too sensitive to mention, bring the neocons around to our point of view.

-- Oho!! Now yer talkin'! Unfortunately, guys in that position have their *pick* of professional ass (usually thrown to them as freebies by lobbyists & their gangster buddies), & y'all wd be up against some world-class competition, quite possibly sharpened by some intel agency's mind-control program. You'd have a rough time.



So often, in recounting stories of unsatisfying relationships, people cast themselves as the hero and/or the victim, while the other party becomes the unequivocal antagonist. We’re all tempted to do it, but your [Kat's] resistance of that temptation is admirable. We should all be so self-aware.

-- Me 2. I admire that, Kat.


CQ, I like your capacity for self-perception, even when it must be kind of painful…

-- But acting on it is awful tough, as I know from my own experience.

CQ: Re: Knight in Shining Armor: IMO your point about you both needing a life besides ea. other is important; & also, *no-one* can do anyone else's deep work. We can support ea other, tho', & that's important too. Intimacy often means seeing someone you care about hurt him/herself, & *knowing that you can't do a damn' thing to stop them* -- that's painful. But sometimes we *can* help them learn from it. . .

Rip

PhillyDancer1982
10-23-2006, 11:34 AM
^ I've found a set of blue balls will make the nicest guy unpleasant. LOL

Dude I've found that a dose of sexual frustration will make ME turn unpleasant, too! :( If I'm dating a hot guy, I expect to get some! There were times in the past that I would be a very nice girl around guys I liked, and then when they would turn down the idea of hooking up with me(maybe I was too much of a "nice girl," or maybe I wasn't their type), I would lose the nice act and act kinda bitchy.

Krazyjane, I know I found this post months after you wrote it, but thank you. The links look like they will be very helpful for my friend M--k. He is kinda a nice guy and complains to me(his close friend) that he has trouble getting girls. He's not over-the-top, buy-anything-you-want nice, but he's nice to the point of boring, and can appear as kinda a pushover at times. Maybe these articles will help him out a bit.