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GenWar
03-07-2006, 05:17 PM
OK, so R/H asked me to post these, so I am. I want to preface this by saying that these are my PERSONAL rules that I have established to govern my own behavior and situations. I do not advocate that they are universally applicable, but I have seen that some of them do seem to apply to others in select situations. Hell, the wingman ignores probably at least half of them. But they work for me, so hey, they are what I go with. Some of them require some clarification, so I offer that as well…

GenWar’s Rules of Clubbing

1. Whatever money goes IN to the strip club STAYS in the strip club. (This is not to say that you can’t leave with money in your pocket. The message of this rule is, do NOT take money into the club if you can’t afford to spend it. This includes credit cards or any form of currency. You never know when you hit the door if you will meet that magical dancer who quite simply divests you of every penny you have. Better to not have it if you can’t live without it.)

2. Never forget it is a fantasy. Be a PL if you must, but never forget…(This is my balance on the white knight/PL thing. Rule #2 Violations are very painful. If I ever break this one, I write it on notebook paper 1000 times. I need the reinforcement.)

3. Dancer’s are there to make money. It motivates EVERYTHING they say and do. (Kind of a build on Rule #2, this rule reminds me that, no, she really doesn’t like me like that.)

4. No promises, No jealousy. (How often does this come up? This is a two way street. I neither promise nor get jealous. Neither do I bank on dancer promises nor accept dancer jealousy. Neither of these perfectly reasonable concepts belong in a club.)

5. One known compatible dancer is worth 10 gorgeous potentials. (I am all about the compatibility. The wingman often wonders why I stay with the same girl all night when he has a veritable parade of more lovely women. Rule #5 is why.)

6. Take EVERYTHING you hear with a grain of salt. (What is about strip clubs that make lies socially acceptable? I have been lied to about everything from the location of the bathroom to the amount of the cover. This is before I even get to the dancers. If you meet me in a club and you tell me something and you hear me mumble something about “six,” I probably don’t believe you J.)

7. Tips are the oil of the strip club. Apply liberally, yet intelligently. (Everyone knows this right? Everyone follows it right? Wrong. Many many customers don’t get this and many more choose to not participate. It never ceases to amaze me how much you get in the way of concessions for a simple $10 tip.)

8. Don’t be an idiot. Respect the dancers, the rules and yourself. (Every dancer knows where her line is. If it is past her bouncer’s, she knows how to get around that. I don’t believe there is a scenario in which any customer should cross that line. If it isn’t working, there are more dancers with different lines. But there is no need to be an idiot.)

9. Dancers are for the night. Wingmen (Friends/Partners/Boys) are forever. (She doesn’t REALLY like you, just your money. After tonight, you will most likely never see her again. Meanwhile, your wingman is the DD and it is a long, cold walk back to the hotel. How can you mess up these priorities?)

10. It is your money & your lap. If you are happy, nothing else is as relevant. (Actually adapted from something mr_punk once said long ago. Everyone is different, it takes all kinds. This is the only universal measuring stick. It is the only constant. It is also my way of saying, “Look out for #1; the dancer will look out for herself.”)

11. Never conduct financial transactions in front of a dancer. It is like butchering a cow in front of hungry lions. (The wingman has infinite disposable income. Sometimes there is a dancer experience that exceeds the available war-chest. Keeping #1 in mind, it is possible to work out an arrangement to solve that problem. However, don’t do it IN FRONT of the dancer. If you have to ask why, just trust me. I learned the hard way.)

12. You never, ever “Wanna dance?”, no matter how badly you actually do. (This is actually a very personal rule. Many customers, I believe, like to walk in, find a nice girl, get a couple dances and walk out. That is not the experience I seek. I am a connoisseur of high-quality SS. I want to be sold. If all you have is those two words, then we are not meant to have a dancer-customer relationship. Not with me. Just not my personal cup of tea.)

13. Unless you are spending money, you are a worthless parasite. (Not that you exist to hemorrhage cash into her waiting hands but if you have no money and don’t plan on spending any money, why go? Just makes no sense to me.)

14. Sharing is caring. (There is one club where the wingman and I share an ATF. She is…phenomenal. However, it would be very easy for one of us to monopolize her and cut the other off. Rule #14 is a reminder to myself not to do that. It is kinda like #9 but different. Do the right thing and share the wealth. Sometimes, there really ISN’T enough to go around.)

15. It isn’t a sale until she asks for the business. (Another very personal rule. I don’t ask for dances. Never do. I do believe in obligations and paying them. If a dancer can’t ask for a dance but we have good compatibility, I will buy her drinks, tip her for her time, marvel with her at how she never seems to make any money and basically hang out with her as much as her comfort and Rule #10 allow. But if she doesn’t ask for a dance, it will never happen. This is the last rule because I recognize that it is probably more a personal idiosyncraticy as opposed to an applicable principle, but it is my opinion.)

Well, that’s about it. And again, in my own defense, I’ll remind you….you (well, R/H) asked.

-gen

yoda57us
03-07-2006, 05:34 PM
Good Stuff Gen. My personal favorite is #8. Back when I took guys with me to the clubs it was a line I used a lot.

Re: #11. An old fav of mine once spent the entire night hitting on a guy for dances because she saw him break a $100 bill to buy a drink at the bar. He was a "maybe later" guy but she saw him doing dances so she kept coming around. At closing time she had three $100 bills in her garter that came from him.

doc-catfish
03-07-2006, 08:41 PM
Good list GW. :thumbsup:

Here's my 30 rules. There are probably more, but this will do for now:

1. Never under any circumstances use plastic.
2. Bring enough cash to make sure you don't have to break rule #1.
3. Pay for what you've invested your interest into. If you're not interested, go to another stage or leave. Its as much a waste of your time as it is theirs.
4. Greasing palms is a good way to get you what you want. Just make sure that you want it.
5. You're not there to please everybody. Don't worry about the people you didn't come to please. The people you DID come to please more than likely don't care about them either.
6. The best mindset to enjoy a pleasant evening is to have reasonable expectations. High expectations often result in failure.
7. Go by yourself. Wingmen will mess with your MO (sorry GW :)).
8. You don't have to be a dancer's best prospect by a mile to get her attention. A few inches will do.
9. Proper manners and/or some rapport can give you those few inches.
10. Have backups in case your fave is absent or busy. No gal is worth getting into a bidding war over.
11. If you're out of favorites or other acceptable candidates, feel free to leave. Your money is always good at another club or on another night.
12. An entertainer who is at ease is a good thing. Never do anything that would unsettle that. Follow the dancer's lead (credit to CO).
13. Phone numbers and suggestions for OTC don't mean shit.
14. Nothing is worth making a scene over. If you've gotten ripped off, feel free to leave and never come back. They can't get your money if you don't give it to them.
15. Active haggling is bad. If you don't think Dancer X is worth her asking price, just say no.
16. The club environment can be irrational longer than you can afford to be content with it. If your mood is shot beyond repair, then leave.
17. If you have to ask, the VIP/champagne room more than likely isn't worth it.
18. You are there for your own benefit, not hers. The high house fees, freeloader BF, and mountain of debt she has is not your problem.
19. If you want an apple, don't get suckered into buying an orange. Go to where you can get an apple.
20. It's only pathetic to pay for a stripper's services if you think it is. To hell with what anybody else thinks.
21. Your idea of a successful evening might be considered a failure to someone else, (and vice versa). Don't judge their expenditures by your expectations (see rule 20). This is not a competition that can be quantified.
22. You're not here to find a girlfriend. There are singles bars, social groups and dating services available for that.
23. Dancers and customers do not own one another. Everyone is and should be free to explore other options.
24. Sometimes you're the fucko and sometimes you get fuckoed.
25. A hot gal rubbing her body against yours will no emotional attachment is always a good thing.
26. Don't get emotionally attached to a dancer. She will eventually move on to greener pastures.
27. A dancer is there for the money and her choices can seem unfair or irrational. Just don't forget those times that unfairness and irrationality tend to work in your favor.
28. Never leave things to chance, if you absolutely want a dance from a gal, ASK HER.
29. If you don't have the money or time available, or the desire to go clubbing, stay home, or persue other interests. If you think you're obliged to be at the SC for whatever reason, then you're missing the point.
30. SC'ing is a vice. Your real world obligations come first. To paraphrase a saying about another vice, "never stick into a G-string what you can't afford to lose".

SportsWriter2
03-07-2006, 09:06 PM
31. Never go back to a pretty dancer who leaks white girl cum. You think you have it washed out and it comes back. You can always find an equally pretty dancer who leaks clear.

Jenny
03-07-2006, 10:01 PM
31. Never go back to a pretty dancer who leaks white girl cum. You think you have it washed out and it comes back.
No it doesn't! I swear, darlin', it's comments like that that will make everyone swear that you've never even met a girl.

stitch132
03-07-2006, 10:23 PM
There are some great rules here! I particularly like GW's 1, 2, 7 and d-c's 6, 12.

My version of d-c's 6 is to go expecting only to have fun -- nothing more (and nothing less).

I have some other basic rules -- including things that will cause me to leave, throw away my shoes, and never go back.

(OK, so I usually don't actually throw away the shoes.)

Richard_Head
03-07-2006, 11:51 PM
Thanks GW (and doc), they all seem very sensible to me.

songofthesword
03-08-2006, 01:55 AM
assume every word that comes out of the dancers mouth is a lie

stitch132
03-08-2006, 05:19 AM
assume every word that comes out of the dancers mouth is a lieWell, I differ on this one -- at least to some extent.

When I walk through the door, I flip on my "willing suspension of disbelief" switch. So when a dancer says that she really wanted to go to the VIP room with me because I'm so great to be with, I can just go with the flow without laughing out loud.

When I walk out the door, I need to flip that switch off!

It's not that different from going to a movie. I even enjoyed "Herbie: Fully Loaded". On the other hand, my wife sits in a movie making catty remarks about every unrealistic aspect, holes in the plot, etc. Her inability to effectively suspend disbelief is the real reason I don't take her to strip clubs with me. (And if you believe that then you've got the suspension of disbelief thing down perfectly!)

SportsWriter2
03-08-2006, 05:42 AM
No it doesn't! I swear, darlin', it's comments like that that will make everyone swear that you've never even met a girl.
Yeah, well that's not getting it out for me. I even presoaked the area in Xtra.


15. Active haggling is bad. If you don't think Dancer X is worth her asking price, just say no.
Passive negotiation is good when business is slow. If Miss B gets clingy and asks for a dance, say, "I'm waiting for Miss A, cuz she likes me more than you do." If B wants to know what A does, say, "I don't talk about other dancers." Then B has to guess at what kind of "more for less" offer she would have to make to take you away from A.

easy_e
03-08-2006, 06:33 AM
This thread is just what I needed. Thanks dudes.

yoda57us
03-08-2006, 07:36 AM
31. Never go back to a pretty dancer who leaks white girl cum. You think you have it washed out and it comes back. You can always find an equally pretty dancer who leaks clear.


Doc's rules where one through 30 Sporty. Don't you think it's a bit presumptuous of you to tack on your rule as one of his? Or is this your 31st rule?
More importantly, how do you know what color the girl's cum is going to be before it appears? Do you ask? I always thought it all came out clear but sometimes it dried white.
I'm actually a bit shocked you are even having this problem with cum. I thought nothing could stick permanently to those Teflon K-mart slacks that you wear to the SC's.

evan_essence
03-08-2006, 07:39 AM
assume every word that comes out of the dancers mouth is a lieThat's so true! Of course, you should assume I just told a lie.

-Ev

doc-catfish
03-08-2006, 08:55 AM
assume every word that comes out of the dancers mouth is a lie

Hmm.. :thinking:

Dancer: Would you like a dance?
Me: LIE!!

Dancer: Sweetie, that will be $20.
Me: LIE!!

Dancer: You can touch me on my back and legs.
Me: LIE!!

Dancer: Thank you!! (giving me big hug and peck on the cheek). God, I wish I had more guys like you.
Me: LIE!!

Ehh, sorry SOOS. That might mess with my rule #9. :-\

yoda57us
03-08-2006, 09:07 AM
assume every word that comes out of the dancers mouth is a lie

I don't know, I have a pretty good time for myself mining the territory between RIL and paranoid schizophrenic. I like to think of it as being an educated consumer.

Jenny
03-08-2006, 11:19 AM
^^
You are not really paranoid, man, if they really ARE out to get you.

GenWar
03-08-2006, 03:58 PM
assume every word that comes out of the dancers mouth is a lie

You know what...? Fair enough. I think you will have a better experience than if you assume everything a dancer says is truth.

But, is that any fun? For me, the point is the SS. SS is, at its most fundamental, lies. But they are fun, happy lies that I *WANT* to believe. Sure, intellectually, I have to know their lies, but the faux belief of them is what I am paying for.

Still, the up side of SOOS's rule, is that, in the unlikely but possible event that she STOPS lying and she really DOES like me like that, I still believe it to be lies. For me, that would be a bigger disaster. Lucky for me, that NEVER happens. :P


That's so true! Of course, you should assume I just told a lie.

-Ev

Ma'am, you make my head hurt. I hope to one day be worthy...

-gen

Docido
03-08-2006, 05:01 PM
Great rules for the road GW and Doc. Only one I'd disagree with is not asking for dances. If you see someone who looks like she's your type, don't hesitate, ask away. That's one nice thing about stripclubs, they always say yes!! The odds really are stacked in your favor. Besides if a club is reallly busy, this might be your only way of not getting fuckoed.

songofthesword
03-08-2006, 07:55 PM
You know what...? Fair enough. I think you will have a better experience than if you assume everything a dancer says is truth.

But, is that any fun? For me, the point is the SS. SS is, at its most fundamental, lies. But they are fun, happy lies that I *WANT* to believe. Sure, intellectually, I have to know their lies, but the faux belief of them is what I am paying for.

Still, the up side of SOOS's rule, is that, in the unlikely but possible event that she STOPS lying and she really DOES like me like that, I still believe it to be lies. For me, that would be a bigger disaster. Lucky for me, that NEVER happens. :P



Ma'am, you make my head hurt. I hope to one day be worthy...

-gen


Okay, let me rephrase..

What I ment was, understand the movtives behind everything she does or says...

" you are so cute"= I want money

"I really love your shirt"= I really would love some money

"A guy like you is single?"= Your half decent.. I still want money


In other words, when a dancer tells me I am cute, I believe her 100%, becuase I am good looking.. or at least I think so.

But, unlike in a normal setting, whearas if an attractive woman told me she though I was attractive, you have to understand that she is "greasing the wheels" to get as much as she can.. no one wants to give money to an asshole.

It doesn't make the experience less enjoyable.. like I was telling a dancer the other night, I'm not here looking to have my ego stroked and I'm not looking for a SO, I'm just looking for a good time

I know I am being hustled when I walk though the door.. but I still choose to walk though the door becuase I have a good time.

songofthesword
03-08-2006, 08:00 PM
Plus, the more I go to SC's the more I realize that most girls have what I call the "kat syndrome" .. named after a girl I talked to that was drop dead georgous (5'8, redhead, hispanic/white) but was so fucked up on the inside, that I literarly cringe when I hear her voice.

They look good on the outside, but once you go enough, about 80% of the dancers aren't anywhere near datable...

I would rather spend time and money on a dancer that is avg. looking/above avg looking that treats what she does as a job, has a good personality without the baggage (or at least visable) then the smokin hot girl that doesn't know if she wants to party or make money, is stoned and drunk half the time and when you sit her down, complains about how much shit is going on in her life.. like i honeslty give a damn

So with that said, when a dancer who is very hot is sitting with me, odds are I am not thinking about inserting _______ into ________

SportsWriter2
03-08-2006, 08:26 PM
I would rather spend time and money on a dancer that is avg. looking/above avg looking that treats what she does as a job, has a good personality without the baggage (or at least visable)...
I used to have one like that... dependable beach girl, too. Then one day I called and her mom told me she went to drug rehab for 30 days. I never saw it coming. :-\

azdd
03-09-2006, 02:40 AM
For me, the point is the SS. SS is, at its most fundamental, lies. But they are fun, happy lies that I *WANT* to believe. Sure, intellectually, I have to know their lies, but the faux belief of them is what I am paying for.


I agree completely. It's been bothering me lately that reading too much on this and the pink site has given me a cynical attitude about everything a dancer says to me, especially on first approach. I have been sucked in by really good SS, and have really enjoyed it while under its spell. If it's good enough, it has staying power between visits, which brings me back looking for the same dancer. Lately though this is becoming very rare, as I find myself breaking down their SS from the first words out of their mouth. I hate it, but this really is starting to affect the basic enjoyment of my club visits. So, dammit, let those of us who want SS, who need SS, who want to dive headfirst into SS and not come up for air until we're broke, enjoy it for what it really is, which is part of the illusion that we are so desperately grasping for.....

dayzed
05-06-2006, 11:40 PM
Great thread for us newbies. Both Doc and GenWar have written some great posts so my curiosity is a little piqued by the fact that they take opposing views (in this thread) in regard to this issue of asking for a PD vs. waiting for the stripper to proposition. I am still a bit confused as to the exact terms/etiquette for broaching the subject of the PD so any elaboration or sharing of philosophies re: this matter would be appreciated.

Richard_Head
05-07-2006, 01:10 AM
Great thread for us newbies. Both Doc and GenWar have written some great posts so my curiosity is a little piqued by the fact that they take opposing views (in this thread) in regard to this issue of asking for a PD vs. waiting for the stripper to proposition. I am still a bit confused as to the exact terms/etiquette for broaching the subject of the PD so any elaboration or sharing of philosophies re: this matter would be appreciated.You snooze you lose, go ahead and ask if that's what you want, believe me no dancer will take offense to this. I'm not big on wasting a dancers time either.

mr_punk
05-07-2006, 07:10 AM
i agree, RH. just do it, instead of wringing one's his hands about it.


I am still a bit confused as to the exact terms/etiquette for broaching the subject of the PD so any elaboration or sharing of philosophies re: this matter would be appreciated.etiquette? um....it's ain't a tea party. "Yo stripper! git yer tits out." works just as well.

GenWar
05-07-2006, 08:09 AM
Representing the dissenting view, which of course, being in the major minority, I have...I would state that I didn't come to the club to "beg" nobody for dances. I came to be sold on a fantasy, I came to see what they can do with SS and I came to relax. To that end, I do not ask for dances. Just not my thing...

Now, I do not believe this principle has anything even remotely like universal applicability. You will notice that it is NOT one of my rules...Rule 12 states that you do not respond in the affirmative to "Wanna dance?"...but no rule forbids asking for it. There are some principles, like not wearing jeans to a club...that I NEVER violate but I do not make rules because I do not believe they would necessarily be helpful to someone else who might want to use my rules as a basis for their own.

I would also add that another person's rules should, at most, be used as a basis for forming one's own. No two people are alike, so no two set of rules should be identical. Further, I would also note that, when show to dancers, the rules can be the impetious of some very fascinating conversation. (Not useful for mr_punk, who would prefer the dancers not talk.)

just some quick thoughts....

-gen

dayzed
05-07-2006, 10:11 AM
i agree, RH. just do it, instead of wringing one's his hands about it.
Ha... I partially had a more practical concern... thus far (limited exp.) the dances have been better from the women who propositioned me, as opposed to those I asked. I was just curious if vets had discerned any reliable pattern in terms of a relationship b/n the mode of proposition and the subsequent quality/hotness of the dance, possibility of extras, etc.

dayzed
05-07-2006, 10:17 AM
I came to see what they can do with SS.

-gen
Yes... this is appealing to me as well.

Thus far, I enjoy the "piercing of the veil" aspect as much as any other... the game of attempting to discern, within the facade that the stripper presents, some flickering glimpse into their true nature or expression of genuine thought or feeling... I imagine that I will probably place less of an emphasis on this over time, as the "truth," once/if discovered, is probably not all that compelling.

yoda57us
05-07-2006, 10:21 AM
Here's the sum total of my aquired knowledge regarding how to tell whether a dance will be to your liking or not: Find a lady you like, buy a dance, if it's good buy another, if it's bad don't.

Don't try and over think this, it's just tits and ass.

dayzed
05-07-2006, 11:27 AM
Don't try and over think this, it's just tits and ass.
I am trying to a) optimize the milage and b) avoid being the sap who pays y for what he could have gotten for x. Reasonable-enough aims, don't you think? (That you or another vet may not feel inclined to assist some newb pursuant to this goal is quite understandable.)

Besides, looks to me like a lot of "overthinking" went into the "rules" posts at the beginning of this thread... and I find them quite instructive and enjoyable. To each his own.

Richard_Head
05-07-2006, 12:03 PM
Ha... I partially had a more practical concern... thus far (limited exp.) the dances have been better from the women who propositioned me, as opposed to those I asked. I was just curious if vets had discerned any reliable pattern in terms of a relationship b/n the mode of proposition and the subsequent quality/hotness of the dance, possibility of extras, etc. When I was a nube I used to wait for the dancers to approach me, what I found was that it was typically not the girls that I wanted to be approached by that were doing the approaching, the girls that I wanted to be approached by were always busy (think about it, there's a reason for that), so I finally got more aggressive about it and have enjoyed my clubbing much more.

GenWar
05-07-2006, 12:09 PM
I *LIKE* to overthink things...it's fun.

Just because a dancer has a body that you would pay fingers to touch doesn't mean she will be fun. And just because you look at a dancer and deduce that you would NOT like to be approached by her doesn't mean she won't be fun.

If it is, as yoda suggests, all about T&A, then asking is the most efficient and straightforward to accomplish one's goals. If you are out for or seeking something different, then it might not be the best choice.

There are more things in heaven and earth than are dreamt of in your philosophy :)

-gen

Richard_Head
05-07-2006, 12:33 PM
And just because you look at a dancer and deduce that you would NOT like to be approached by her doesn't mean she won't be fun.True, but it's just hard for me to justify the thought of paying a girl just to be fun, I can find fun girls everywhere that don't require me to pay them for their time. Now fun hot girls that's a different story:P.

GenWar
05-07-2006, 12:52 PM
True, but it's just hard for me to justify the thought of paying a girl just to be fun, I can find fun girls everywhere that don't require me to pay them for their time. Now fun hot girls that's a different story:P.

Fair enough. That makes ONE of us. ::) I am sure I could head to the local college club and spread a little charm and a lot of drinks and meet many fun girls as well. However, I think Ms. Gen would frown on that. Hell, I KNOW it. :O

So the club is where I go...;)

-gen

Richard_Head
05-07-2006, 01:14 PM
21. Your idea of a successful evening might be considered a failure to someone else, (and vice versa). Don't judge their expenditures by your expectations (see rule 20). This is not a competition that can be quantified.It's all good GW, this is where doc's rule number 21 comes into play.

doc-catfish
05-07-2006, 02:05 PM
Representing the dissenting view, which of course, being in the major minority, I have...I would state that I didn't come to the club to "beg" nobody for dances. I came to be sold on a fantasy, I came to see what they can do with SS and I came to relax. To that end, I do not ask for dances. Just not my thing...
Personally, I'd just as soon the female take the initative and ask as well, as seeing an assertive woman come after you is one of the fun aspects of SC'ing. Back in the 90's that approach to setting up dances was SOP most anywhere I went.

Then somewhere between then and now it gradually became bad form in a lot of clubs for girls to hustle for some reason. Dancers in many locales quit asking because they seemed more concerned about their self-esteem than the bottom line. I adapted to a "first strike" policy over time on setting up dances, not because I wanted to, but because being a non-regular in most instances I had to in order to get a damned dance. With rare exception, this has become SOP anymore here in the midwest.

Its just that once I started asking, I came to realize there were significant upsides to it. I mean, why settle for whatever apple falls off the tree and conks you on the head when with a little exertion, you can get the apple you want? I came to the club to have fun after all, not run my "dancer should approach me" mantra into the ground.

The BEST benefit to asking of course, is that once you're established as a spending customer, as opposed to the majority who are often gawking (or fuckoing their ATF), other dancers tend to be more inclined to approach your table, giving you the best of both worlds.

mr_punk
05-07-2006, 03:10 PM
Ha... I partially had a more practical concern... thus far (limited exp.) the dances have been better from the women who propositioned me, as opposed to those I asked. I was just curious if vets had discerned any reliable pattern in terms of a relationship b/n the mode of proposition and the subsequent quality/hotness of the dance, possibility of extras, etc.no. i don't put much value into a customer who approaches a stripper. it's a matter of convenience more than anything else. OTOH, i place even less value in stripper who approaches a customer. it's what she's supposed to do. in the end, the most important value to me is the actual production of the stripper.

Thus far, I enjoy the "piercing of the veil" aspect as much as any other... the game of attempting to discern, within the facade that the stripper presents, some flickering glimpse into their true nature or expression of genuine thought or feeling... I imagine that I will probably place less of an emphasis on this over time, as the "truth," once/if discovered, is probably not all that compelling.yeah, you and most of the customer population place this premium on getting to "know" the person underneath the ho. thankfully, most customers also don't realize that most strippers are well aware of this perversion. which is why i end up gleefully, roasting marshmallows over their burning corpses.
I am trying to a) optimize the milage and b) avoid being the sap who pays y for what he could have gotten for x. Reasonable-enough aims, don't you think? (That you or another vet may not feel inclined to assist some newb pursuant to this goal is quite understandable.)well, if you want to optimize your mileage. the first thing you should know is that SS is no sure indication of mileage to come. SS is a distraction...an optical illusion...a magician's trick..or just plain hot air. there are plenty of strippers who can talk a good game and can't deliver the goods. what's the old saying? mileage talks..bullsh#t walks.

Then somewhere between then and now it gradually became bad form in a lot of clubs for girls to hustle for some reason. Dancers in many locales quit asking because they seemed more concerned about their self-esteem than the bottom line.or perhaps they're just plain lazy or have poor work ethics. like i said, they are a lot of girls in this biz that need to be pimped.

dayzed
05-07-2006, 04:02 PM
yeah, you and most of the customer population place this premium on getting to "know" the person underneath the ho. thankfully, most customers also don't realize that most strippers are well aware of this perversion. which is why i end up gleefully, roasting marshmallows over their burning corpses.
I don't quite get the "roasting marshmallows" analogy but I don't doubt that I'm experiencing a standard newb-ish gamut of emotions and series of impressions regarding the SC experience. I came here to gain a little perspective, and that's just what's I'm gaining.

I don't at this point have much to offer back to the forum, of course, so I'll accept your condescension as a kind of penance for the knowledge that's being gained.

dayzed
05-07-2006, 04:15 PM
well, if you want to optimize your mileage. the first thing you should know is that SS is no sure indication of mileage to come
Check. What's the second?

(Is there a "rules of mileage" thread I may have missed?) ;D

FBR
05-07-2006, 04:27 PM
I don't quite get the "roasting marshmallows" analogy but I don't doubt that I'm experiencing a standard newb-ish gamut of emotions and series of impressions regarding the SC experience. I came here to gain a little perspective, and that's just what's I'm gaining.

1) A custy tries to fly high in the air based on unrealistic stripper expectations. He usually comes crashing down in flames (like the WWII air corp flicks) Makes a nice fire although the aircraft fuel does make the marshmallows taste a little funky sometimes.

2) Punk owns stock in a lot of marshmallow companies. So not only does he get to enjoy seeing the PL's crashing down in flames, he gets to make money too ;)


I don't at this point have much to offer back to the forum, of course, so I'll accept your condescension as a kind of penance for the knowledge that's being gained.

Mr_P condescension is sort of a rite of passage. It does get better eventually though.

Welcome to the board.

FBR

Phil-W
05-07-2006, 04:32 PM
...you and most of the customer population place this premium on getting to "know" the person underneath the ho. thankfully, most customers also don't realize that most strippers are well aware of this perversion. which is why i end up gleefully, roasting marshmallows over their burning corpses.


I don't quite get the "roasting marshmallows" analogy but I don't doubt that I'm experiencing a standard newb-ish gamut of emotions and series of impressions regarding the SC experience. I came here to gain a little perspective, and that's just what's I'm gaining.

Welcome to the "blue side".

Strip venues are all smoke and mirrors, where dancers and customers try to out-manoever each other. Dancers, cos they spend their working life in venues, tend to be a little better at the mind games than customers.

Mr_punk is one of the more cynical observers of the scene and positively loves newbies with illusions...If they won't learn from Mr_p's sage advice, he breaks out the marshmallows and has supper.

Don't worry about it - in a month or so, you'll see the next newbie come along and ask the exact same question. Then it'll be your turn to smile.

BTW, my personal favourite question is "I've met this really nice dancer - how do I turn her into my girl friend?" Sit back and watch Mr_p's cynicism reach new heights.

Phil. }:D

dayzed
05-07-2006, 06:07 PM
Don't worry about it - in a month or so, you'll see the next newbie come along and ask the exact same question.
I appreciate the feedback but to which question are you referring? Regarding a connection between mode of proposition and quality of subsequent LD? Or re: methods for optimizing mileage? I don't really regret either of those questions. I'm trying to cultivate some level of calculation and better understand how this "manuevering" as you put it is best accomplished.

My comment above re: piercing the veil meant to communicate that I have been taking some initial pleasure in trying to detect inconsistencies in the stripper veneer. Inability to maintain full lie --> humanization --> more appealing object. I accept that this may be juvenile, doomed to failure, and/or misses the point of the whole experience. However I nowhere intended to imply that I wanted to "know" the strippers in a meaningful way. Yeah, that would work well -- maybe she could become pals w/ my wife.

azcustomer
05-07-2006, 07:42 PM
Thanks Gen and Doc - nice posts.

I agree wholeheartedly with Doc's #7 and #11.

It's rare to find a buddy who doesn't mess with your MoJo.

Also, if the bouncer tries to steer you towards a certain table, it's a good sign you're going to have a bad night. Dude - don't you know that this is all about us creating our own fantasy?

lopaw
05-07-2006, 07:44 PM
The BEST benefit to asking of course, is that once you're established as a spending customer, as opposed to the majority who are often gawking (or fuckoing their ATF), other dancers tend to be more inclined to approach your table, giving you the best of both worlds.




So true. In some clubs it was only after I started approaching the dancers did the others start showing some interest in me as a new money source. The only downside to this is that you can go from one extreme to the other, where you start getting alot of girls streaming up to your table (I have a problem with the "no thank you" phrase). But I think it's a risk worth taking.

mr_punk
05-07-2006, 08:19 PM
Mr_punk is one of the more cynical observers of the scene and positively loves newbies with illusions.it is what it is. i didn't create this industry nor do i have to drink the kool-aid just because some stripper with big tits offers to me. my stance is no different than Reagan's stance towards the soviets (ironically taken from a slavic proverb)...."Trust, but verify".

My comment above re: piercing the veil meant to communicate that I have been taking some initial enjoyment in trying to detect inconsistencies in the stripper veneer. I accept that this may be juvenile, doomed to failure, and/or misses the point of the whole experience. However I nowhere intended to imply that I wanted to "know" the strippers in a meaningful way.whatever the case may be....why bother? boring, billie sue needs to pretend to be courtney the stripper to make money. boring, billie sue needs courtney in order to get nasty like grinding on the cocks of strange men until they pop. so, even if you don't go to sc to try and turn a ho into a housewife or to see any meaningful aspect of boring sally sue. why not save your energy for what's really important and just let the ho be a ho.

yoda57us
05-08-2006, 05:51 AM
I am trying to a) optimize the milage and b) avoid being the sap who pays y for what he could have gotten for x. Reasonable-enough aims, don't you think? (That you or another vet may not feel inclined to assist some newb pursuant to this goal is quite understandable.)

Besides, looks to me like a lot of "overthinking" went into the "rules" posts at the beginning of this thread... and I find them quite instructive and enjoyable. To each his own.

Sorry, I was busy getting high in the band room when I should have been in math class 30 years ago....

If rules are what work for you then by all means use the rules. My response to your post was not a refusal to try and help it is the way I operate in strip clubs.

If you really want to enjoy yourself around beautiful nekkid women the first thing you are going to need is an open mind. That would include accepting the fact that there may be more than one way to get what you want. The second is a full wallet. Third would be a personality but the wallet will get you some leeway there. Gen has rules but if he didn't have a personality and a wallet the rules wouldn't mean a thing. My humble opinion is that if you sit around all night trying to figure out how much it's all going to cost you the chances of actually having a good time are non-existent.

I have a mental checklist for what kind of women I enjoy spending time with. If I see a dancer who fits the basic physical criteria I invest some time and yes, money, to see where it might go. If it goes well I continue to invest. If it doesn't go well I move on. You can't apply a mathematical formula to a living breathing woman. Why on earth would you want to?

I guess I do have one rule: I go to a strip club to have fun, not to put pressure on myself. If I'm not having fun I leave.

CarGuy
05-08-2006, 08:16 AM
I love this site. It is keeping me from completely morphing into a PL......This 20 Y.O has some serious SS going on and it is getting very interesting....

I love the "rules of engagement" posted by the veterans of the site.

The best advice I can give is tip and tip well....bouncer, girls, waitress, and the especially the guy holding the watch in the VIP.

Phil-W
05-08-2006, 10:42 AM
I appreciate the feedback...I'm trying to cultivate some level of calculation and better understand how this "manuevering" as you put it is best accomplished.

Potted version - although please note this is only a generalisation.

1) A dancers' primarly motive for going in to work is to earn.

2) Most dancers understand that their customers have a stereotypical view of a "stripper", and they know living up to that stereotype makes it easier to earn money.

3) The stereotype is:

a) They're getting personally turned on dancing for a customer.
b) They like the customer; no matter how old, unattractive or crude mouthed he is.
c) There is a possibility that they could be persuaded to meet the custy outside the club, (OTC).

4) Most of the SS, (stripper shit), is the stripper trying to convince the customer she conforms to stereotype, and much of the customer manoevering is them trying to get the dancer to meet them OTC as a result of believing the stereotype.

5) In the above the dancer generally holds the upper hand as:

a) It's her decision to meet the customer OTC.
b) She's generally got no intention of doing so.
c) She's got no intention of telling the customer she's got no intention.

6) When considering the above, remember dancers and customers are individuals, therefore can't be reduced to a formula. Most dancers are generally nice, (if motivated by a desire to earn). A few dancers are real sh*ts, and perhaps rather more are seriously nice. You could say the same for customers.

Phil.

GenWar
05-11-2006, 09:45 AM
I believe in being self aware and recognizing the limitations of your behavior. As someone who seemed to be a major minority on the issue of asking the dancer, let me tell you about the last three nights.

I am out of town on business. In this town, I have a fav at a local club. She only works Thur/fri and I am in town Mon/Tue/Wed but whatever. I head over and have a seat with a drink special, a cigar and a stack of ones. I'll have a steak, smoke a couple and have a few drinks. Because we are in the south, the AC is on full blast. But it is like 68 degrees outside so the place is FREEZING. The waitresses are wearing jackets. You can see your breath, I shit you not. It is early and the place is dead and I see a dancer across the club, sitting along on the edge of a booth. She is the tall, buxom blonde and you can tell she is a class act (mainly from outfit and style.) After some observation, I see she doesn't do the stage and she never dances downstairs ($10), only in VIP ($25). I am very interested, so I give her the smile. Nothing. I make the blatant eye contact. Nothing. I nod at her. Nothing. I even go so far as to go with the crooked finger. Nope. Nothing. I shrug. I am VERY interested but I can do no more. I left Monday night wiht a $46 dinner/drink tab, $22 spent on stage tips and ONE (1?!!!) offer which was a rule #12 violation so I *HAD* to say no. I actually considered it a good night, as I am saving for Houston. :)

Tuesday, one of the secondary wingmen, Ole' Blue Eyes, comes up from his town 2 hours away and accompanies me. We hit an alternate club with a busier happy hour but I drag him out and away from his new love because I want a steak at the same club. We hit the same club. Again, she is there, making the rounds. Again, I try all the tricks. Again, nothing. I have never been ignored by a dancer so blatantly. I mean, some girls look at me and decide they would rather not bother (Fair enough, I am very large and not attractive. If you aren't going to have the SS to have a good time, better for all that you move on.) but they will at least smile and wish me a good night. This girl doesn't give me any reaction whatsoever. Later on, I am cuddling with one of my fav girls in this club (The first one who approached me there, she is a professional football player. (Yes, they have women's professional football, who knew?)) She is, like me, black, so I feel comfortable pointing out the hot dancer and asking, "Does she not like black dudes?" This is my only explanation. The fav is shocked. "Her? She is the biggest sweetheart ever?" I describe my experiences and how, last night, the dancer would rather sit alone in an empty booth than chat with me at my table. She is dumbfounded, and, before I stop her, she goes over to the dancer (in the midst of some seriously high money fucko's) and whispers to her for about 40 seconds. The dancer nods and my fav returns. "That's fixed." she informs me. I am a bit perturbed. I read the fav the riot act about A) Asking; B) Interrupting a dancer with a customer; C) interfering with the game of some dude that is spending money. I am strongly against all three activities. She shrugs me off (I may be 6'4" but she is absolutely ripped and could kick my ass in a second) and says that ignoring me ain't right and she fixed it. Moments later, the dancer comes over and begins to prove that she is a class act. First, she takes my fav, walks her back to the high money fuckos and insists that one of them buy dances from her. He nods and moments later they are headed for VIP. Then she seats herself to me and I am begging (BEGGING, mind you) God not to have her violate Rule #12. After all, I am established as interested, natural inclination is to ask if I am interested in a dance. If she does that, I WILL say no. Luckily, the fav has read the rules and briefed her. She did not ask but instead launched into a heartfelt apology. I melt. Long story short (and in the interest of a possible TR later), we end up upstairs where she gives me the best dances I have had in a very long time. Both the ATF and Miss M pale in dance skill. And she manages to have chemistry at the same time that she has 4 fuckos in suits cooling their heels. Simply phenomenal. When I am out of time and money, I say, "Tell me you are here tomorrow night." She responds in the affirmative. I thank her and she heads back to the fuckos, who grin like puppies, as though nothing happened.

I will probably TR last night (Wednesday) cuz some interesting things happened, like my Tue waitress became a dancer on Wednesday and was amazing, I tripped on some girls shoes and literally buried my face in the floor, and this dancer had 7 girls at my table discussing the rules, convincing several customers that I am a drug dealer (see what happens when you dress nice???). It was a wild night and is worthy of TR. but that will take several hours, so probably not til sunday :(

Point is, if that first girl had not gone and asked, I would have missed out on the best dancer experience I have had in a long time. Do I regret not asking? Nope. Will I ask in the future? Nope. that is one of the benefits to idiosyncratic corollaries, you can cling to them in the face of reason. :) Still, I am glad for how it turned out and I will recant from my advocacy that no one should ask. I'll keep that little bit of idiocy for myself. Ask, my brothers, Ask away. And may you be as lucky.

-gen

jazznasty
05-11-2006, 12:25 PM
GENWAR is that you in your avatar or Suge? Because you said you were unattractive, and I'm scrolling through reading your posts cuz they're turning me on, (I'm not a stripper YET, so you can believe me) I'm very attracted to "thick" black men with confidence and usually black men in general are attracted to my "black woman" shaped booty, The pink posts talk alot about how some clubs only allow a few women of color, etc in their club and from what I've gathered don't allow hip-hop music to be played that much because of the "type" of crowd it will gather. I think I would do well dancing in this type of club and to this type of music and would enjoy the flirtations with black men. I guess I'm asking for your advice on types of clubs where black men frequent and if alot of "mileage" is expected. Are there really "Player's club" type clubs and where was the video vixen author (can't remember her name) working? Are there any classy joints that play hiphop/r&b? Perhaps you're more knowledgeable on the NY area, Thanks,
ps. if you haven't speculated, I'm white in the SF bay