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bikinigirl04
03-24-2006, 09:25 AM
i'm with OTB--you are buying into that crap that it's ok b/c he is a man. going to clubs is one thing, but when it's at this level where it is affecting your marriage and he's spending your kids college money on it?? no babes this is NOT ok!

Emily
03-24-2006, 09:27 AM
yeah, probably because she acts as if it's acceptable, then he believes it is...and then she comes on here trying to figure out why he does it and how to stop it.

hrrrrrrm, this is a tricky one.....(not)

It's your right to justify your husband's behavior. I won't judge you for that, especially since you have more to think about than yourself. I just wonder why you are on a stripper website, trying to get "to the root of the problem".

onlythebest
03-24-2006, 09:34 AM
She's her own worst enemy.

unbeleavable
03-24-2006, 09:43 AM
[
It's your right to justify your husband's behavior. I won't judge you for that, especially since you have more to think about than yourself. I just wonder why you are on a stripper website, trying to get "to the root of the problem".[/QUOTE]



This is what I could not understand.She knew what was up from the very beging of her relationship.I do not justify her husbands actions.She is the only one that can change now, not him,its not going to happen.I think she knew the answer & wanted the women that thier money go's to,to give her support.Why?

Lurker
03-24-2006, 11:44 AM
I think it's really easy to get on a message board and tell people to leave their husband. There are lots of different types of relationships in the world and telling someone to blow up their home because their husband spends too much money at SCs is dangerous.

I'm not saying Mrs. P should stay with her husband--I'm still horrified that he would suggest to her that he was justified in going to SCs because she hadn't lost her pregnancy weight. But I AM saying that I wish everyone would be constructive rather than critical (of her) in counseling Mrs P. We know very, very little about her situation and she is clearly predisposed to work things out.

I will take a lot of flak for saying this, but I would also suggest that young, single women who have a lot of disposable income and no children may not have the most realistic viewpoint on how marriages work or what Mrs P's options are. I'm not looking to get into a flamewar on the matter, but I would urge people giving advice to consider the realities of the situation (Mrs P hardly works and has two young children with this man) as well as the outrageous behaviour of Mrs P's husband.

Your sex life is one component of a marriage; finances are another; and there are several others. This guy is clearly not perfect, but he may have his good points (either as husband, father, or provider) as well.

onlythebest
03-24-2006, 11:49 AM
Lurker,I was married once and divorce didn't kill me.If this guy is that out of control and abusive,no amount of couples' therapy is going to change him.She,herself has been made into an "emotional casualty" in this marriage.I don't think they need any more.

Vyanka
03-24-2006, 11:55 AM
Those of you at Night Shift in Baltimore, all over Indiana, Rhode Island and Illinois, you are the professionals that have earned our kids' college funds; any 2 cents you can offer would be much appreciated! I apologize for coming to your community to bother you with my question, but I'm banging my head against a wall in the "we-hate- strip- clubs-and- pigs- who- go- to- stripclub" sites.
My husband says he tips the dancers on stage, he only gets a lapdance when the girl makes him feel like he has to and every time he leaves for a business trip, another couple of hundred is "missing." I know guys go for different reasons and over our 7 year marriage I've listened to every one- I went to a bachelor party and realized I loved it, I was lonely when you had the baby, I was lonely traveling, my boss made me go, my clients expect it and I didn't want to be the pussy, I think I'm addicted, look at you (5months post kid#2)-why would I want to come home to you, we don't have sex enough, you don't initiate sex enough, I don't want to go, I didn't want to get the VIP dance, but she made me...I'm sorry, I didn't mean to hurt you...why can't you just forget about it...
When you talk to the solo businessman, I know you are there for business, but is there any insight you can offer me that may help me deal/improve/understand this aspect of our marriage?
PS I have done everything short of surgery to look and act the part of a seductress at home and we do have sex every night he is not traveling, so I am trying hard on my end... :-\

omg, i wouldve kicked him in the ball sack for real. & leave his sorry ass.

onlythebest
03-24-2006, 12:03 PM
It pisses me off to no end that he tried blaming the dancer for getting the VIP dance then goes on to tell his wife she should just forget about it.I thought he was a grown man.He is responsible for all of his actions.

Yekhefah
03-24-2006, 12:08 PM
No kidding, this guy sounds like a supreme asshole. Anyone who would speak to his wife like that is a jackass not worth having. It never ceases to amaze me how many women are willing to put up with such treatment!

Vyanka
03-24-2006, 12:16 PM
Shouldve dropped him with the first red flag.....before marriage.

onlythebest
03-24-2006, 12:18 PM
This is the same type of jack*ss that'll say "the woman pursued him" as an excuse if he ever cheated.

dlabtot
03-24-2006, 12:54 PM
I will take a lot of flak for saying this, but I would also suggest that young, single women who have a lot of disposable income and no children may not have the most realistic viewpoint on how marriages work or what Mrs P's options are. I'm not looking to get into a flamewar on the matter, but I would urge people giving advice to consider the realities of the situation (Mrs P hardly works and has two young children with this man) as well as the outrageous behaviour of Mrs P's husband.

Your sex life is one component of a marriage; finances are another; and there are several others. This guy is clearly not perfect, but he may have his good points (either as husband, father, or provider) as well.

OK, Im not a "young, single woman with a lot of disposable income and no children", Im a middle-aged divorced man for whom it took four years of separation to finally decide that efforts to save my marriage were fruitless. And imho the reality of the situation is that if you are married to the wrong person, even if you love that person, you should get a divorce. You will survive, you will find new modes of living, the world won't end, you won't starve, etc.

Don't let fear hold you back.

Yekhefah
03-24-2006, 01:04 PM
^^^ Well said. People often want to stay together "for the children," but you're not doing your children any favors when you force them to live in a miserable household. When they get up every day to see their father treating their mother like dirt, they do not form a healthy view of relationships, and they don't usually go on to have happy relationships themselves. The best way to raise strong, healthy children is by being strong and healthy yourself.

hrb0
03-24-2006, 01:30 PM
I agree completely with Yekhefah. I grew up in a home where my parents stayed together for the children. Kids can feel the tension. I am very pro family, but is it really a family? Is it the kind of family you want to teach your kids about? Think about 5 or 10 years from now. If he does not change will you regret that you did not get out now? I do agree that you should have seen the signs earlier; you cannot go back in time and change anything. You cannot go back and not get married to him. You can decide now if you want to be in this situation 10 years from now.

Mrs P
03-24-2006, 01:35 PM
"I just wonder why you are on a stripper website, trying to get "to the root of the problem".


I guess I logged on initially hoping to hear someone say, "I know this type because I talk to them every night. I'm there to sell a dance, but what comes across from them is the need to fulfill---------. I do/don't think they feel this at home. They tend to be looking for -------. " If you could confirm that for most guys it is just a visual experience and a little excitement, then I can live with "it is just a guy thing". If his type suggests something more, and from what you've said it does, than I hoped maybe from a sales perspective, you'd know the customer and be able to identify it better than a wife could.

You've read what I've heard from my husband when I ask him what is going on, and when I went to other sites I heard about how strip clubs are traps and men are beasts. This is your business, so I was hoping you might have insight that is not colored by judgements about the morality of the act itself.

Yekhefah
03-24-2006, 01:39 PM
Mrs. P, no two men are alike. They're all there looking for different things. Without knowing yours, I can't say why he goes to the club, but I can definitely say he has no respect or concern for you.

The strip club isn't a problem, it's a symptom. The problem is that he treats you like shit, and he'll keep doing it as long as you let him. How long did it take him to convince you that his attitude was all your fault? Has he started hitting you yet?

xoxoGracexoxo
03-24-2006, 01:54 PM
It sounds like you're here because you'd like us to give you a little peephole into what you're husband is saying and doing at the clubs. I've had married customer who talked to me about their wives, and every situation seemed a little different -- everything from customers who still loved their wives, but whose wives wouldn't have sex with them anymore, to men who claimed to no longer be attracted to their wives, but were staying together for the sakes of their children.

Unfortunately, no one here knows what you're husband's motivations are, except for him. So if you want to know, he's the one to ask. I'm not prepared to tell a stranger on an online forum that she should leave her marriage, but it sounds like you're trying to find a way to handle it on you own, and that really is inappropriate. From the sound of the excuses you quoted to us (dancer made me buy a dance, friends made me go, you made me go by not being attractive enough) your husband is someone who has trouble taking responsibility for his actions. By trying to solve this problem on your own without asking him to confront what he's doing, you are really enabling him to go on avoiding the consequences of his actions. This is not the best thing for him, or you, or your children. I really think you should seek marriage counseling. If he won't go to counseling with you, go on your own, and get some professional help figuring out your next step. You've stayed in a situation where you're unhappy for long enough. In fact, you're asking for suggestions about how to keep lulling yourself into denial. Take some action. It's not just for your sake, but also for you husband and your kids.

Mrs P
03-24-2006, 01:57 PM
No, and with two little boys in the house we have strict rules about no :) hitting.

onlythebest
03-24-2006, 02:06 PM
Your poor excuse for a husband is teaching your boys it's OK to treat a wife/girlfriend poorly.

yoda57us
03-24-2006, 02:46 PM
I will take a lot of flak for saying this, but I would also suggest that young, single women who have a lot of disposable income and no children may not have the most realistic viewpoint on how marriages work or what Mrs P's options are. I'm not looking to get into a flamewar on the matter, but I would urge people giving advice to consider the realities of the situation (Mrs P hardly works and has two young children with this man) as well as the outrageous behaviour of Mrs P's husband.

You are making assumptions about the women who are responding here based on your stereotype of what a dancer is. Do you know anything about any of the ladies here beyond what they post?
Mrs. P. showed up here looking for advice and the members of stripperweb community have offered their opinions. Those opinions are hers to digest and ponder as she wishes. There's no reason to be taking a shot at people who willingly offered advice to try and help someone who asked for it.

Yekhefah
03-24-2006, 04:28 PM
Your poor excuse for a husband is teaching your boys it's OK to treat a wife/girlfriend poorly.

I just thought this merited repeating.

SportsWriter2
03-24-2006, 04:32 PM
Mrs. P, I would suggest reading Out of the Shadows: Understanding Sexual Addiction, by Patrick Carnes, Ph.D. It's very different than you might imagine and emotionally deeper. Everyone is lonely in some dimension, and guys tend to be good at masking depression.

You can both try to find what's missing and learn to compensate. And if you can't be everything to each other, at least understand that no one else can, either.

Marriage is a social arrangement. For most of history, it was not about love. And even when marriage is about love, it can't be about all the dimensions of love. For example, fathers provide unconditional love and caring that help daughters gain confidence in life, but sex cannot be a part of that.

I know young dancers who never want to get married because they meet "really nice guys" who cheat on their wives. When a dancer and customer connect, a lapdance can be more intense than sex for the guy, and sometimes for both. And yes, some dancers will offer sexual extras for no additional money. Even attractive dancers.

The more you and your husband can share deep feelings without attacking each other, the better chance you have. You sound more than reasonable, and I think you have a good chance to make your marriage work. People really do fall in love (again) and change behaviors. :)

threlayer
03-24-2006, 07:57 PM
Yes, that's a durned creepy thing to say to someone who loves you and is actively trying to make sure you have pleasure together. The guy needs to be slapped around for even thinking that.

I guess it's only when one doesn't have sex, that you appreciate having it most. Especially with someone who wants to be with you exclusively. Make no sense to me. Even if a woman eventually loses some of her appeal with time, there is a (supposed) stong bond that develops and a lot of (hopefully) sexual compatibility that keeps the couple together.

Optimist
03-24-2006, 08:26 PM
Please use condoms with your husband until you've worked this problem out. His friend tried (under the guise of a joke) to tell you the truth. Now you know. Please don't close your eyes to this. AIDS transmission is spreading fastest among women and teen girls because they don't want to believe their partners are not faithful.

SportsWriter2
03-25-2006, 07:51 AM
Please use condoms with your husband until you've worked this problem out. His friend tried (under the guise of a joke) to tell you the truth. Now you know. Please don't close your eyes to this. AIDS transmission is spreading fastest among women and teen girls because they don't want to believe their partners are not faithful.
Not to mention herpes, HPV and curable STDs.

kinda_normal_guy
03-25-2006, 09:07 AM
Mrs P's Husband is a jerk, mostly for saying what he said about his motivations and her appearance.

I wonder what everyone on this board would think if the post had been made without the husbands comments? In other words the married guy going to SC a lot, but still treating his wife well?

I also think Lurker has a point, every marriage is different, their are a lot more dynamics than what can be posted in a thread. And while he is making some assumptions about strippers (young, single, lots of cash), their also seems to be a lot of sterotypes being presented the other way (men who frequent SC also seek out hookers or extras). Neither assumption is true 100% of the time, but I'm willing to bet their are more women here who are single and under 30 than their are men who have frequented a hooker.

That being said, this guy is a jerk for treating his wife the way he is. I think she needs to have the gonads to directly confront him; not about going to SC's but about his attitude and comments toward her. If it turns ugly and he continues to degrade her, time to seperate and see what happens after a few months apart.

robinbanks
03-25-2006, 05:06 PM
I like Dr.Phils definiton of cheating.

Cheating Husband to Dr P: I only took thier phone numbers. I never actually called any of them to hook up. It made me feel good, wanted, like a man, ect. So you see tecnically i never cheated on her.

Dr P to cheating husband: Would you have flirted or taken a girls number if your wife was there?

Cheating husband: NO.

Dr. P: If you couldnt, wouldnt, or shouldnt do something with your wife present its as good as cheating.

Ah. the wizdom of Daytime television.

Yekhefah
03-25-2006, 05:08 PM
I always define cheating as something you wouldn't want your partner doing behind your back.

Guenevere
03-25-2006, 08:40 PM
Mrs P,
Everyone here has made an exceptional point. It sounds like you already know all of this you just don't want to admit it for fear of facing the facts. No matter what you say to yourself, no one here is going to justify staying with a man who treats you and his children with this much disrespect.

Casual Observer
03-25-2006, 09:31 PM
I have done everything short of surgery to look and act the part of a seductress at home and we do have sex every night he is not traveling, so I am trying hard on my end...

None of this matters. Your comeliness (or even the lack thereof) is not relevant to the larger issue at hand--your husband has a compulsion that is merely manifesting itself through strip clubs. Strippers are merely a mechanism for satisfying this compulsion.

Women don't like to hear it, but sex is an emotional need for men--it's a means of communicating their emotions and feelings as well as establishing self-worth. The fact that he's seeking fulfillment from sex workers is not in and of itself unusual or even unhealthy (in non-monogamous arrangements), but the fact that he seeks this fulfillment from sex workers in your stead is indeed part of the problem, though the problem lies entirely within him. Seek redress or ignore this at your own peril, as it will get worse before it gets better.

Add to this what Yoda and SW2 said.

Mastridonicus
03-25-2006, 09:41 PM
When you talk to the solo businessman, I know you are there for business, but is there any insight you can offer me that may help me deal/improve/understand this aspect of our marriage?


It's a serious issue indeed, but remember, this is about you too.

Please don't come here looking to defend him. He needs to defend himself by any means. If he can't make you feel comfortable with this, none of us can. And you do have a right to be uncomfortable.

Figure out what you WANT. Once you know what you want, go after it and make no excuses. If you want him to stop, stand by it and take whatever means necissary to get that point across.

Mrs. P. It's about you and your wants to. Don't go trying to understand him unless he's trying equally to understand you. Work on this together, not seperated. Otherwise move on.

Mast.

Mrs P
03-26-2006, 10:03 AM
I've thought about all of these perspectives, and I shared 4 solutions with my dear Mr. P last night. He listened to them and has agreed that the status quo isn't an option. I put the ball in his court to get a counselor with whom to discuss our possible solutions. I appreciate after reading all of your feedback that I cannot change him and we need to find a way to work together if anything at all is going to happen. He's still planning on being in St Louis on business in two weeks, so he can either choose to get back at me for confronting him or take a step towards seeing if our relationship can heal. I'd love for him to be the type who can go to see beautiful women with a bunch of guys and enjoy it as a lark without it having all of the elements of being extra-marital (the lying, the expense, the frequency, the compulsiveness, the going alone, the "forced" dances, hopefully not extras....). From what you've said it is possible for plenty of men to go and still love their wives, so if we can even find a compromise solution that takes the extra-marital stuff out and leaves the clean, fantasy fun, then I'd be able to find some peace. Maybe a counselor will show both of us that there is an addiction that prevents such compromises, but I am out of my league here. I will check out the book recommendation, thank you!

Emily
03-26-2006, 10:04 AM
good idea

and good luck

SecondChance
03-26-2006, 11:17 AM
Mrs P, your husband is an addict, plain and simple. To many men, and I'm one of them, sitting in a SC is like being on a drug, and like any drug, one can become addicted to it. But that is only part of it. Based on his abuse of you, it it obvious to me that he can no longer comprehend that the fantasy world he perceives within the club is not reality. In this way, he has compared his real life with you with the one he's immersed in within the club, the one where he is surrounded by many naked, slavishly dancing women who will do his bidding at the end of a buck (in his mind anyway). There is no way that your half of his life can compete with a fantasy like that. It doesn't matter how much you "dress up" or have sex. Animals have sex every night too.

The other problem is, it seems like he is a long way from admitting that he has a problem, or even knowing that he has a problem, or maybe even caring. That means he's a long way from getting help.

You need to decide if you can wait until that happens. If you cannot, then there is really only one thing you can do - give him an ultimatum. Either he gets his freakin act together or you're out. You cannot do that though unless you really mean it. It's like the old cliche, don't point a gun unless it's loaded and you're willing to use it.

That's probably not much help, but I figured you could use a little perspective from a man's point of view. I wish you the best of luck. I hesitate calling your husband a loser, but....and he's damn lucky to have you.

Deogol
03-26-2006, 01:01 PM
^^^ One man's point of view. It ain't mine.

Yekhefah
03-26-2006, 02:58 PM
Everything is an "addiction" now when people don't want to claim responsibility for themselves.

SecondChance
03-26-2006, 07:47 PM
It IS an addiction if he cannot stop, even at the expense of killing his marriage, losing his wife, and spending away the family's income!

And, exactly what is your point of view, Deogel? That he isn't addicted? That he doesn't have a problem? That he isn't being abusive? That sitting in a SC isn't like a drug to many men? Not being arguementative here, I'd just like to know.

SportsWriter2
03-26-2006, 09:13 PM
It IS an addiction if he cannot stop, even at the expense of killing his marriage, losing his wife, and spending away the family's income!
I have to agree here. Cocaine and heroin are understood as chemical addictions. But sex addiction and bulimia can have powerful chemical effects on the brain as well. :O

Yekhefah
03-26-2006, 09:37 PM
Oh, bullshit. There is no such thing as "sex addiction." He could stop if he had the desire; he just hasn't got the desire. He likes the strip clubs better than he likes his wife. That doesn't make him an addict. It just makes him an asshole.

Guenevere
03-26-2006, 11:07 PM
^^^I have to disagree, Google sex addiction.

BenderTheOffender
03-27-2006, 04:23 AM
sounds like their relationship isnt the best... but we hardly know him well enough to tell her to drop him. Sure he said some bad stuff, but maybe that was in the heat of the moment, and you dont know what she has said to him. Maybe it goes both ways, and in a weird way they actully work when not fighting. in your opinion does he treat you well? if so then i wouldnt worry too much, he sounds like just an ass. and you knew that going into the relationship.

Remember this moment in life next time a genuine nice guy shows interest in you!

Lurker
03-27-2006, 09:07 AM
You are making assumptions about the women who are responding here based on your stereotype of what a dancer is. Do you know anything about any of the ladies here beyond what they post?
Mrs. P. showed up here looking for advice and the members of stripperweb community have offered their opinions. Those opinions are hers to digest and ponder as she wishes. There's no reason to be taking a shot at people who willingly offered advice to try and help someone who asked for it.

The assumption I'm making is that some (note: SOME) of the posters on the website may be young, single women with high incomes and no children. That doesn't strike me as an unreasonable assumption. I named no names, nor am I "taking a shot" at anyone. You're welcome to continue this conversation with me by PM.

Mrs. P, good luck! It sounds like you have taken the right first step by making your desires clear and putting the ball in your husband's court to change his behaviour.

Mr Hyde
05-15-2006, 08:34 AM
Hold on here a minute...I posted and then never checked this thread again, so I'm getting beaten up here somewhat unfairly.

I re-read your original post, and I will admit I skipped over many of the quotes you attribute to your husband, and many of them ARE mean. I would never verbally abuse a woman, much less one that's my wife.

My post merely was meant to deal with the whole going to strip clubs while married thing.

I see nothing wrong with it unless-

1-it's blowing the bank at home (you did allude to depleting the kids college fund...)
2-it becomes obsessive (he's there several times a week)
3-he can't look at it for what it is....just a fun time

If he just goes to have fun and leaves the fun at the club, and it's not affecting your family financially...THAT'S what I mean when I said it's no big deal.

Mrs P
05-19-2006, 01:41 PM
Thank you for sending out a clarification; I knew where you were coming from, so please don't worry. Mr P and I never went to a counselor, but he did get checked out at one of THOSE doctors and has taken himself out of a heavy traveling position at work. These are huge steps on his part, and both tell me that he wants to try at this marriage again. Again, I appreciate all the cents and dollars volunteered from the men and professional women on this forum!