View Full Version : You CAN have your way with us
yoda57us
08-02-2011, 09:32 PM
^ Good luck with that dude. Just drive to Tampa...
Optimist
08-07-2011, 12:36 PM
I hate sales pressure. Things like:
1) Getting pounced on (not the good kind) when you first walk in the door and asked for a dance.
2) When you turn someone down. getting grief about being cheap when you are a regular and they should know better. I know you are having a bad night, but it isn't my fault.
3)Having a girl sit down next to you and the bartender immediately asks if you want to buy her a drink. Meanwhile, not a word has been exchanged and I have no Idea if I want to talk to the dancer. It isn't all about looks.
4)When dancers "forget" to tell you about when a next song is when in VIP and try to get more out of you through grift.
5)When dancers work multiple customers at one time. You buy a drink and realize she is not "going to the ladies room" but is going to work the other drink she has hustled. lame.
I don't get this one. You have the ability to hear different songs so why is it "grift" if she doesn't tell you what you can plainly hear? The DJ blathering on is enough to alert you, no?
All in all your complaints sound like things you can address easily. You don't want a dance the moment you come in, just say 'no thanks'. The dancer is cranky, brush it off. You don't want to buy a drink for the girl yet, say 'no thanks'. A girl is bouncing between you and another table, move on! Say yes to the next girl instead of waiting for her like your married! :no:
Davey17
08-13-2011, 07:18 AM
The problem in Australia and it differs state to state is Legislation .
No one wants to face the problem , liquor license fees ( for the club ) are out of control , this has to be made up over the bar with ever increasing drink prices , the clubs revenue sreams ..Cover charge ..Membersip fees ..Dancers shift allowance ..Drinks , plus increased amount of clubs in a shinking market .
The LD has become far too lame ( due to legislation ) , you have overweight girls working at times , this has all combined to make things extremely difficult , but no votes in strip clubs .
From the customers point of view what is needed , is HOT , EXCITING dancers performing in incredible fashion , making great money , and growing the industry here , we have lost a lot of the very best girls , and with the legislation ( despite great numbers of dancers ) ... everyone must of course stick to the laws .
We dont enjoy the options you guys have over there .
It would be great to see an exciting viberant industry again .... there are still some incredible dancers out there , just difficult for them also .
goddesskali
08-13-2011, 03:44 PM
Dance tickets: I have never enjoyed having to go to a bartender to buy a ticket before going to the back. This practice is common in some Connecticut and Rhode Island clubs and it annoys me every single time. Now at least I do not have to buy a ticket for each dance - that would be a deal breaker - but even still...
Thanks for resurrecting this thread. I am throwing a stripper party soon and am looking for suggestions from many different sources.
Would the dance ticket system be that annoying if there were girls walking around selling them?
rickdugan
08-13-2011, 05:30 PM
Would the dance ticket system be that annoying if there were girls walking around selling them?
Probably not as much if it was only for the first dance, but I would be annoyed if I was asked to prepay each dance I do with the same girl. This is especially true in NYC - that is just not the way it is done here.
goddesskali
08-13-2011, 06:23 PM
To clarify, someone other than the dancers would be selling the tickets.
Wouldn't the obvious solution be to buy a bunch at once so you don't have to keep buying them? Or is it those clubs just don't work like that?
TakiToki
08-13-2011, 08:05 PM
From what I gather the general consensus is:
Cheaper dances, hotter girls, and less pressure.
TRANSLATED TO -
The most action for the least money possible.
.................................................. .................................................. ..
So basically the same thing any customer at any business wants. The problem with that being in our industry that the dancers are all private contractors and thusly are hurt directly by free shows and cheap dances.
I agree quite a bit with this post. A customer want the best experience (however he or she defines it) per dollar spent, while a dancer wants the most money per unit of effort expended (however she defines it). This is completely natural and is the case in virtually all transactions of any sort.
What I wish is that this relationship could be more open and accepted. While a customer's and dancer's goals are frequently going to be at odds with one another, that doesn't mean they can't like each other as humans, treat one another with respect and have a good time together.
velvet
08-13-2011, 08:50 PM
Please, oh please get the no contact law in Orlando off the books
HAHA the mouse runs Orlando, never going to happen.
rickdugan
08-14-2011, 03:52 AM
To clarify, someone other than the dancers would be selling the tickets.
Wouldn't the obvious solution be to buy a bunch at once so you don't have to keep buying them? Or is it those clubs just don't work like that?
Oh, then I change my answer: if I have to hunt down another person to buy the ticket then it is still a pain in the ass, but I would probably do it if I only had to prepay the first dance. If I have to prepay every dance then absolutely not. As a general rule I do not hand over my money before the services are rendered.
And no, most clubs almost anywhere, including NYC, do not work like that. I have seen a couple of girls on here posting about a few club that do require full pre-pay, but IME they are the exception rather than the norm.
There are a lot of guys who feel the way I do, but also plenty who really wouldn't care as much. IMHO, however, a full prepay system will probably limit the ease in which a girl can sell a string of dances.
Anyway, just my :twocents: and good luck!
yoda57us
08-14-2011, 07:48 AM
The dance ticket thing at Cheaters in RI is a pain in the ass especially on busy nights at the bar. Over the years when I was a regular in there it definitely curtailed some of my "discretionary" dance choices. Now, I haven't been there in a while but there were, at one point, some very smart dancers who used to purchase several dance tickets at a time and have them in their purse. When they found a guy who wanted an LD they would simply produce a ticket and take the money, saving him a trip to the bar...
Mario's in central Mass sells a bracelet for $5 that gets you entry into the private dance area for the entire day. This, in my opinion, is the best way to handle the situation if you are a club owner who feels you need to charge admission to the LD area.
goddesskali
08-14-2011, 11:55 AM
Oh, then I change my answer: if I have to hunt down another person to buy the ticket then it is still a pain in the ass, but I would probably do it if I only had to prepay the first dance. If I have to prepay every dance then absolutely not. As a general rule I do not hand over my money before the services are rendered.
Hopefully not derailing the thread too much but...
What I am doing is a lapdance party, so its organizational system is different from a strip club. The guys arent going there to watch the game on tv over a beer- the focus of the party are lapdances. No stage, no DJ bantering, no constant pressure, no annoying small talk (unless you enjoy that). Basically a large bachelor party where the dances and drinks cost less than the stripclub norm.
Why I am considering a ticket system for dances is because the dancers aren't paying a housefee to work, so i am taking a cut from the dances sold. Customers can buy tickets (and a string of them at a discount) from either a booth or someone walking around with them.
It would be treated just like cash. You get 3 dances, just give her 3 tickets when the dance is over.
I suppose a dancer could buy a few tickets themselves and do a direct sale as long as they purchase them at full price. However, some may try to sell them AND cash those same tickets in later- which can cause major problems.
With that said, I am considering other scenarios as well.
yoda57us
08-14-2011, 01:16 PM
Why I am considering a ticket system for dances is because the dancers aren't paying a housefee to work, so i am taking a cut from the dances sold. Customers can buy tickets (and a string of them at a discount) from either a booth or someone walking around with them.
It would be treated just like cash. You get 3 dances, just give her 3 tickets when the dance is over.
Ahhhhh....kinda like the ride tickets at the state fair! Given your set-up, that seems like the way to go.
goddesskali
08-14-2011, 02:40 PM
Ahhhhh....kinda like the ride tickets at the state fair! Given your set-up, that seems like the way to go.
Pretty much. I went a beer garden that had the ticket set up and thought it was a great idea because the bartenders' sole job was pour beer, not mess with money.
I was thinking of a similar way to centralize transactions.
So...would you rather pay higher admission ($40-$50) for unlimited drinks or pay a smaller admission ($20-30) and pay separately for drinks?
yoda57us
08-14-2011, 02:47 PM
So...would you rather pay higher admission ($40-$50) for unlimited drinks or pay a smaller admission ($20-30) and pay separately for drinks?
Do you have a liquor license? If you don't and this is a private party your best bet would be to charge a lower admission and make the event BYOB. Trust me, you don't want the liability if someone leaves drunk and gets into a car accident.
goddesskali
08-14-2011, 03:33 PM
The site does.
yoda57us
08-14-2011, 03:47 PM
The site does.
OK but, IMHO, you still don't want to be responsible for any sort of "all you can drink" situation. There is serious liability for over-serving liquor. The reality is that folks will get drunk if they want to get drunk but your system of monitoring liquor sales will come under scrutiny if anything bad happens. Is the event being held at a club? Is it a private party? The smartest thing to do is eliminate yourself from the liquor liability chain if at all possible.
SupaByoch
08-15-2011, 10:03 AM
From what I gather the general consensus is:
Cheaper dances, hotter girls, and less pressure.
TRANSLATED TO -
The most action for the least money possible.
.................................................. .................................................. ..
So basically the same thing any customer at any business wants. The problem with that being in our industry that the dancers are all private contractors and thusly are hurt directly by free shows and cheap dances.
LOL. How long has the standard price of a lapdance been the same? 15-20 years? Considering the rate of inflation in that length of time, I have to say that dance prices HAVE gotten CONSIDERABLY cheaper.
When I started dancing in 1995 the usual price of a lapdance was $20. The cumulative inflation rate from 1995 to now is roughly 48% - look it up; google is your friend. That means if lapdances were keeping up with inflation, the standard lapdance price should be about $30 now instead of $20. Actually $30 is probably still a little low, considering $20 was probably the price well before 1995, which means a higher cumulative inflation rate...
Then take into consideration that there are WAY more clubs and dancers now, competition is through the roof, average dancer earning potential is way down, mileage off the charts - I'm gona have to say the strippers are definitely getting the short end of the stick here, and customers are pretty much getting the deal of the fkn century.
So boys, stop fkn whining and pay the strippers! Maybe then the girls won't be such bloody desperate mood-killers ::)
Oh and do not try to argue that electronics get cheaper - products like that get cheaper due to increased efficiency in production. A lapdance can't get more efficient unless you're including mileage in the equation, and if so, you should be paying MORE not less.
Whiners. I swear stripclub customers are some of the biggest whining babies I've ever encountered. LOL
bem401
08-15-2011, 10:37 AM
^^^^^The problem with your logic is that inflation measures the increase in prices for the supposed staples of life, things people need to survive, things like food, clothing, and energy. Lap dances, while very enjoyable, are among the least essential things purchased and are thus among the first to go when belts get tightened. The clubs are all about entertainment and while the girls ought to be well-compensated for the service they provide, all they are doing is competing for discretionary dollars. When other places or people are willing to provide the same services for a lesser price, you can hardly blame the guy for going for the best deal. Its something all people do in their everyday life.
BouncerDude
08-15-2011, 10:38 AM
outdoor = great idea.
outdoor + pool + live music = oh yeah
Now that sounds like a party.
SupaByoch
08-15-2011, 10:43 AM
^^^^^The problem with your logic is that inflation measures the increase in prices for the supposed staples of life, things people need to survive, things like food, clothing, and energy. Lap dances, while very enjoyable, are among the least essential things purchased and are thus among the first to go when belts get tightened. The clubs are all about entertainment and while the girls ought to be well-compensated for the service they provide, all they are doing is competing for discretionary dollars. When other places or people are willing to provide the same services for a lesser price, you can hardly blame the guy for going for the best deal. Its something all people do in their everyday life.
There is no problem with my logic. Inflation is inflation. If you can get a $10 BJ, then by all means, stay out of the stripclubs and go get your $10 BJ. The strippers don't want you around anyway. Trust me on that.
bem401
08-15-2011, 11:18 AM
There is no problem with my logic. Inflation is inflation. If you can get a $10 BJ, then by all means, stay out of the stripclubs and go get your $10 BJ. The strippers don't want you around anyway. Trust me on that.
I'm not taking sides here. I'm explaining why jacking up prices doesn't apply to activities like this. For the record, I spent fairly heavily on my girls of choice for the period in which doing so worked for me. As someone who has essentially stepped back from clubs for reasons other than money, I can view things objectively and explain that clubs are fighting for the money that guys have left over after they meet their "normal" obligations.
It's strictly supply and demand. There are plenty of girls working in plenty of clubs. There are fewer customers than there were years ago and and the ones there still are seem to be unwilling to spend as much. Expecting prices to go up under these conditions when all you are actually selling is your time is not reasonable.
Several years ago, my club of choice used to charge $25 a song. Business slowed, the idiot in charge raised the price $5 (his take went to $10) and the club essentially emptied out. Both dancers and customers left. It took certain girls threatening to quit to bring the price back down, yet the club still hasn't returned to its former self. The problem is the market determines the price especially in difficult economic times.
Oh and BTW, last I heard that club now does 2 for $20 a good chunk of the time.
yoda57us
08-15-2011, 02:36 PM
Oh and BTW, last I heard that club now does 2 for $20 a good chunk of the time.
Actually it's back to 2 for $25 now as the club in question decided that they wanted their $5 cut even on discount days. I pretty much agree with what you are saying though BEM and I can't think of a better example than the one you used!
Regardless of how one wants to define the parameters of inflation the fact is that private dances are not a necessity, they are entertainment. Most of the dancers I know have had to start working several more shifts a week to even come close to earning what they once did.
bem401
08-15-2011, 03:22 PM
Actually it's back to 2 for $25 now as the club in question decided that they wanted their $5 cut even on discount days. I pretty much agree with what you are saying though BEM and I can't think of a better example than the one you used!
Regardless of how one wants to define the parameters of inflation the fact is that private dances are not a necessity, they are entertainment. Most of the dancers I know have had to start working several more shifts a week to even come close to earning what they once did.
Wow! We agreed! Now that you mention it, I think I was still visiting when 2/25 was instituted but I've only spent a couple hours there this calendar year. Your dancer friends might have decided to increase their number of shifts but mine packed it in and left, I assume for good.
Just so people don't think this applies strictly to lapdances, I give golf lessons and tutor math. In the last few years, I have had to cut the price of doing both of these to get sessions because money has become such an issue and the demand for either of those services decreased (not unlike LD's).
Hopper
08-15-2011, 08:34 PM
I'm not taking sides here. I'm explaining why jacking up prices doesn't apply to activities like this. ...
While I don't basically disagree with your logic, I think SB's point was that, whatever price the market decrees, if customers DO want good service from dancers and CAN spare the money for it, they shouldn't expect more than what they are willing to pay for. The higher pay rate is what attracts girls to stripping in the first place. If the market doesn't support that rate, hot girls will find other work or give poorer service.
One point I disagree with you on is that inflation is a direct effect on the currency and the decrease in value of the unit of currency it causes applies equally to any transaction. SB was talking about inflation of the currency, you were talking about the market price of LDs. Although the decrease in market value of LDs affects the price, the price should also be raised to compensate for inflation. Dancers use the same money as everybody else.
bem401
08-16-2011, 06:22 AM
While I don't basically disagree with your logic, I think SB's point was that, whatever price the market decrees, if customers DO want good service from dancers and CAN spare the money for it, they shouldn't expect more than what they are willing to pay for. The higher pay rate is what attracts girls to stripping in the first place. If the market doesn't support that rate, hot girls will find other work or give poorer service.
She was not saying that at all. She was pointing out the fact that the price of an LD hasn't kept pace with inflation. Obviously, the more generous the customer is, the better will be his treatment, but she didn't say that.
One point I disagree with you on is that inflation is a direct effect on the currency and the decrease in value of the unit of currency it causes applies equally to any transaction. SB was talking about inflation of the currency, you were talking about the market price of LDs. Although the decrease in market value of LDs affects the price, the price should also be raised to compensate for inflation. Dancers use the same money as everybody else.
Actually, I was saying this business is more adversely affected by a weaker dollar than most. Visiting SC's and spending money (however much) should be near the bottom of any responsible person's list of priorities. It's discretionary money that's being spent there and the less of it there is, the lower is the market value for anything it might get spent on. Its all about supply and demand. Its unfortunate for people relying on discretionary spending but it is a fact of life when doing so and one of the primary reasons several of my friends left the business.
Davey17
08-16-2011, 07:17 AM
^^^^^The problem with your logic is that inflation measures the increase in prices for the supposed staples of life, things people need to survive, things like food, clothing, and energy. Lap dances, while very enjoyable, are among the least essential things purchased and are thus among the first to go when belts get tightened. The clubs are all about entertainment and while the girls ought to be well-compensated for the service they provide, all they are doing is competing for discretionary dollars. When other places or people are willing to provide the same services for a lesser price, you can hardly blame the guy for going for the best deal. Its something all people do in their everyday life.
Very True ....with the major point being it is very much a discretionary spend , particularly in a recessionary market , Its quite natural that the best deal available be sort .
The price of a good / service will always be sorted by the market involved , you cant set a price that people wont pay . In tighter ecconomic times , you generally will have less clubs ..more dancers ..Same dollars , therefore the market price will fall .
The principles of any business transaction applies ... like it or not , this is how it is . Happens in many different areas in life ..Particularly in the USA and Europe , the overall spend will decrease .
How you work your own Micro business can be a seperate point entirely . Pretty basic ecconomic facts .
yoda57us
08-16-2011, 08:57 AM
There are always going to be multiple schools of thought on this topic but honestly, all you have to do is take a look at what is actually going on in the clubs. I can only speak for my area but something tells me things are pretty much the same all over...
1. Several years ago the club that BEM mentioned in a previous post raised their LD price from $25 to $30. In a matter of weeks customer volume dropped and within a few months dancers started to bail because they had lost so much business. Now, at the time, this club was arguably the busiest in Providence, had about 250 dancers on staff and was crowded pretty much every night and most days from mid-week on. The increase was rolled back about three years ago but by then the recession had started to hit and business never really came back. The club is now doing half price dances all day and night three days out of the week and is still empty most of the time other than Friday and Saturday nights.
2. Last year a favorite Mass club of mine that had been charging $20 for LD's decided to add a $5 dance tariff to cover expenses associated with having to make all of the dancers employees. The dancers actually asked the club to raise their house fee rather than raise the price of dances because they knew it would effect business. That didn't happen. The club added the $5 and it killed business for a while. They instituted a 2 for $35 deal three days a week and things have started to pick up a bit. My fav at that club is now working four or five shifts a week to earn what she used to make in three.
3. A small club very close to Boston was one of the first in the area to offer private dances many years ago. The price was $30 a dance with $15 going to the house. I was a regular at this club for a while and didn't even realize that they sold private dances because non of the dancers ever tried to sell me one. At $15 net profit for an air dance the girls didn't think it was worth the effort to sell privates. I was always curious as to why this particular club had the busiest stage of any of my regular clubs and this was why. The dancers made almost all of their money on stage since neither they nor the customers were interested in dealing with over-priced LD's.
I know dancers who have been dancing since before private dances even existed. most of them remember when it was just stage money and also remember how great it was when the advent of the private dance actually gave them the opportunity to sell dances and control their income to a greater degree. The funny thing is that the girls who have been selling dances at the same price for ten or fifteen years are not the ones saying that the price should go up. They understand that it's much easier to sell dances when they are priced reasonably. Like it or not, $20 has been the benchmark and will be for a long time to come. Once you go over that amount guys start thinking about exploring other options-like sitting at the bar and watching without buying dances or just staying out of the clubs all together.
It's interesting to me how extreme the reactions are of dancers to the discount dance days as well. I know some who won't go anywhere near the club on 2 fer days and others who are just happy to see their club trying to encourage business. As one of my favs says "I can't sell dances to an empty club".
bem401
08-17-2011, 06:45 AM
It's interesting to me how extreme the reactions are of dancers to the discount dance days as well. I know some who won't go anywhere near the club on 2 fer days and others who are just happy to see their club trying to encourage business. As one of my favs says "I can't sell dances to an empty club".
I found this interesting too, though somewhat short-sighted on their part. I know it was based on principle but, really, is it that big a deal to make that it would take 2 1/2 to 3 minutes longer to pocket the $20? Plus these were among the busiest times of the week in the club. Most of my friends who initially refused to work on 2 fer days eventually started working mostly those days because those were the days there was money in the club.
Davey17
08-18-2011, 02:45 AM
I found this interesting too, though somewhat short-sighted on their part. I know it was based on principle but, really, is it that big a deal to make that it would take 2 1/2 to 3 minutes longer to pocket the $20? Plus these were among the busiest times of the week in the club. Most of my friends who initially refused to work on 2 fer days eventually started working mostly those days because those were the days there was money in the club.
Agreed ..Its a ridiculous attitude ..Pure and Simple VOLUME , just go for it and make a plethora , not that hard .
Also distain towards an establishment , this is Crazy ..without a venue nothing happens , best to support the clubs you prefer as a dancer or a Patron , you need a place to do business .
Its like me selling one of my subdivisions , saying " Yep , these lots are worth double " ... I may even sell some , but because I had not met the market my project would end up not going ahead because I'd never get the volume .
Crowds and Deals create cashflow ..cashflow is king , just focus on the volume bang out the Dancers , walk out with as much as you can relevant to how many times you can perform .:D
bem401
08-18-2011, 05:41 AM
Agreed ..Its a ridiculous attitude .:D
Whoa, I never said their attitude was ridiculous. I understand totally why they'd feel that way. They were taking the fact they commanded less money at work personally, when in fact it was strictly a function of the market and was by no means a referendum on them. Once they realized that, some girls added shifts, others left the business.
yoda57us
08-18-2011, 05:46 AM
Honestly I don' think it's as black and white from a dancer's POV as you guys seem to think it is. I've heard plenty of reasoning from dancers both pro and con when it comes to discount dances.
I think the girls I know were more accepting of it when it was done one, maybe two days a week. Lately some clubs are doing it all day and night as many as three days a week. While it may bring in more guys it can also promote a "cheap-ass"mentality among those guys. Combined with the rising contact levels in many clubs it can make for an frustrating day at work for a dancer.
I know from a practical standpoint it's easy to say "Well, I'm gonna make x amount of money even if I have to do twice as many dances" but nothing is ever really that black and white when there are real people,real personalities and egos involved.
bem401
08-18-2011, 06:22 AM
From a dancer's POV, it's definitely not black-and-white, at least not initially. Many of my friends were conflicted about dancing in the first place and essentially cutting their pay didn't set well with any of them. In fact, most of them used to avoid discount days like the plague back in the day. Unfortunately, the nature of the business changed, contact went up, prices went down, and the girls either adjusted to that by working more or making less or they left the business. A few of them refused to accept the fact that they had to work all week to make what they used to make on a single weeknight and that's understandable. Unfortunately, they had very little control of the situation.
Optimist
08-18-2011, 12:19 PM
So boys, stop fkn whining and pay the strippers! Maybe then the girls won't be such bloody desperate mood-killers ::)
Whiners. I swear stripclub customers are some of the biggest whining babies I've ever encountered. LOL
Quoted for mutherfucking TRUTH! The same guys who'll get fucked by their contractor for THOUSANDS and take it will come into the club and scream bloody murder that they're being exploited. I hate them and the shit management that enables their behavior.
goddesskali
08-18-2011, 01:26 PM
Quoted for mutherfucking TRUTH! The same guys who'll get fucked by their contractor for THOUSANDS and take it will come into the club and scream bloody murder that they're being exploited. I hate them and the shit management that enables their behavior.
Well, you asked what they wanted! ;D
BTW that ipod spoof gif is FABULOUS!
Optimist
08-18-2011, 03:14 PM
Well, you asked what they wanted! ;D
BTW that ipod spoof gif is FABULOUS!
Thanks! ;D That's definitely the chance you take when you ask men what they want. There's always some who want the world for nothing.
lestat1
08-18-2011, 08:14 PM
I suspect some of the "whining" has to do with people growing up in capitalist societies when faced with impediments to the normal operation of the supply/demand curve.
Hopper
08-19-2011, 07:57 AM
So boys, stop fkn whining and pay the strippers! Maybe then the girls won't be such bloody desperate mood-killers ::)
Whiners. I swear stripclub customers are some of the biggest whining babies I've ever encountered. LOL
It's not a small thing for a girl to strip and dance naked and especially to allow contact. I have to give the dancers something for that, especially if I want it with enthusiasm a smile. The girl tells me her price and I either accept or decline according to whether it's what I'm willing to pay. No need for whining.
UtahMike
08-19-2011, 11:01 PM
ATMs dispense cash in twenties. Very few offer a different option. Therefore, guys will come in with a bunch of twenties. Let's say the guy comes in to spend two hundred dollars. He buys ten LDs, maybe all from Dancer A, maybe from several dancers. Maybe he wants variety. Anyway, before he is broke, he has spent $200. Raise the price to $25, now you have to be carrying change for the guy who will buy one dance to see how much fun he will have before committing to spend the rest, or for the guy who wants variety. Raise it to $30, you still have to carry change. And waste time making change. When he goes broke, you've still made $200. If you are charging $25, you've given 8 dances instead of ten. Is two dances less worth the hassle of making change? If you say yes, you raise the price. Of not, the price stays at $20 where everything is simpler.
But there is another way. The differentiated price.
In my favorite club, LDs are $10 for no touching dances, out in public on a couch around the edge of the club. For $15 more, dances are private, behind the DJ booth, and customers can touch anything except the three Bs. Most guys buy the private dances. If I have $5 or $10 left over, I give it as a tip, which is rare in these parts.
But I think the way they have this structured helps sell the more expensive dances. There are inexpensive dances, but there are better dances that cost more and offer better features and more privacy.
chris91
08-20-2011, 01:21 AM
UtahMike, when dances were $25, most guys would tell me to keep the extra $5 as a tip. Now that dances are $30, Most guys tip the extra $10. When the guy does want his change, it takes about 2 seconds to give it to him. I don't think anyone in their right mind would be willing to accept 20% less money AND do 2 more dances just to avoid the "hassle" of making change.
Also, what are the three Bs? Boobs, butt, and ?
Hopper
08-20-2011, 07:01 AM
For $15 more, dances are private, behind the DJ booth, and customers can touch anything except the three Bs.
What's left?
Also, what are the three Bs? Boobs, butt, and ?
Bush?
safado
08-20-2011, 07:28 AM
Also, what are the three Bs? Boobs, butt, and ?
Beaver
Hopper
08-20-2011, 07:30 AM
Very True ....with the major point being it is very much a discretionary spend , particularly in a recessionary market , Its quite natural that the best deal available be sort .
The price of a good / service will always be sorted by the market involved , you cant set a price that people wont pay . In tighter ecconomic times , you generally will have less clubs ..more dancers ..Same dollars , therefore the market price will fall .
The principles of any business transaction applies ... like it or not , this is how it is . Happens in many different areas in life ..Particularly in the USA and Europe , the overall spend will decrease .
How you work your own Micro business can be a seperate point entirely . Pretty basic ecconomic facts .
There is a price customers are willing to pay, but there is also a price dancers are willing to dance for, and if the customer's price falls below the dancer's price, the dancer finds other work. Then I guess the supply of dancers falls, pushing the customer's acceptable price up... and so on. But the point is, there is a minimum price a girl will strip for.
Hopper
08-20-2011, 07:33 AM
I know dancers who have been dancing since before private dances even existed.
And they are still dancing?
yoda57us
08-20-2011, 01:12 PM
I know dancers who have been dancing since before private dances even existed.
And they are still dancing?
Well, yes, I didn't use past tense...
Steve123
08-21-2011, 01:33 AM
I don't get this one. You have the ability to hear different songs so why is it "grift" if she doesn't tell you what you can plainly hear? The DJ blathering on is enough to alert you, no?
All in all your complaints sound like things you can address easily. You don't want a dance the moment you come in, just say 'no thanks'. The dancer is cranky, brush it off. You don't want to buy a drink for the girl yet, say 'no thanks'. A girl is bouncing between you and another table, move on! Say yes to the next girl instead of waiting for her like your married! :no:
In the first instance, I am talking about when you pay for multiple dances up front. I am distracted if a dancer is doing a good dance. Taking advantage when I don't notice that dance number 5 is starting if I only bought 4 is poor form. Perhaps grift is a strong term.
I normally to just say no. I am only indicating things that make me dislike a strip club experience per your OP.
The girl bouncing between tables is only when I have purchased a drink for the dancer. The girls drinks at the club I go to are 20- 30 dollars a piece and are for time at the bar talking. So when I buy a drink I expect exclusive one on one time. I don't go to the girls after the first time this happens, but in the meantime I am out the money I spent....
KeithDoxen
08-21-2011, 11:20 AM
This is my first post here, and I feel bad that my first post is one on the "complaints about strip clubs" thread. LOL. So I just want to start out by saying that, having been to lots of strip clubs, I have had positive experiences more often than not. Most girls who work in the industry seem to be attractive, cool, and just generally the types of girls whose company I enjoy.
But the topic of this thread is suggestions that customers have for improvement, so here are a few thoughts.
One of the things I've noticed recently, and this might be because of the bad economy, is that some dancers are getting unreasonably sneaky or aggressive about dances. They either won't tell you when the song is over in order to trick you into paying for an additional dance or more, or they will sit with you and won't take a hint that you want them to leave, hoping to monopolize your time and eventually your wallet. This can often make for a bad experience. I understand that most dancers don't act like this, but I've noticed this trend rising in the recent past, and I'm wondering if customers are getting cheaper and that's causing some girls to act this way.
The other thing I think clubs need to work on is that some clubs --- and this is usually a function of the club and not the girls --- seem to have a sort of culture where the girls basically stand around and chat with their friends instead of chatting with the guys or pursuing dances. I once went into some hole in the wall club in the middle of the afternoon and only one girl even acknowledged my existence. This doesn't make a lot of business sense for anyone involved, because I'm not spending any money, and the girls and club aren't making any money. As someone said upthread, I think these clubs tend to be managed by people who don't really understand the fundamentals of business often times.
Every now and then there is a prima donna type who basically stands around waiting for Brad Pitt to come through the door, but ignores all the other guys there. This is usually one of the hotter girls in the club. Presumably she has bills too though, so waiting for an Italian male model probably isn't the best idea.
The only other complaint I have is about the "rules" in terms of what's acceptable and what's not during dances. I realize that, as Chris Rock famously said, there's no sex in the champagne room. But sometimes I see management cringe when the dances get a little risque. As long as everything remains legal during the dances I don't see what the problem is.
UtahMike
08-21-2011, 09:52 PM
Beaver and bush were good, but the dancer who used the term to me said, "Box."
Hopper
08-21-2011, 10:16 PM
One of the things I've noticed recently, and this might be because of the bad economy, is that some dancers are getting unreasonably sneaky or aggressive about dances.
Keep an eye on your watch. There will always be dancers like this and it's up to you to make sure you get what you pay for and only pay for what you want. Have a clear and explicit understanding between you and the dancer about what you are getting and what it costs etc.
The other thing I think clubs need to work on is that some clubs --- and this is usually a function of the club and not the girls --- seem to have a sort of culture where the girls basically stand around and chat with their friends instead of chatting with the guys or pursuing dances. I once went into some hole in the wall club in the middle of the afternoon and only one girl even acknowledged my existence. This doesn't make a lot of business sense for anyone involved, because I'm not spending any money, and the girls and club aren't making any money. As someone said upthread, I think these clubs tend to be managed by people who don't really understand the fundamentals of business often times.
Walk over to the dancers yourself if you see one you like. Go and talk to all of the dancers you think you might like so you can make a judgement from up close and from chatting with them. I often walk straight over to a dancer if she looks interesting. Even if she is working the room, she might take an hour to get to me or she might disappear into the LD area for the rest of the night. Waiting around for a dancer I like to come to me can be an enormous waste of time. It's not like I've got anything else to do in the club while I'm waiting. Even most of the stage shows are uninteresting to me.
Every now and then there is a prima donna type who basically stands around waiting for Brad Pitt to come through the door, but ignores all the other guys there. This is usually one of the hotter girls in the club. Presumably she has bills too though, so waiting for an Italian male model probably isn't the best idea.
Not a Brad Pitt or a male model, a big spender. If the girl is really hot, she probably knows she doesn't have to waste time with the small spenders, during which time she might miss out on a big spender. That probably is good business. If a hot dancer wants to meet a hot guy, she will probably try to do that outside of work.
SCs are not places of hospitality, they are places of business and it is up to you to look out for your own interests.
SupaByoch
08-21-2011, 11:58 PM
I'm not taking sides here. I'm explaining why jacking up prices doesn't apply to activities like this. For the record, I spent fairly heavily on my girls of choice for the period in which doing so worked for me. As someone who has essentially stepped back from clubs for reasons other than money, I can view things objectively and explain that clubs are fighting for the money that guys have left over after they meet their "normal" obligations.
It's strictly supply and demand. There are plenty of girls working in plenty of clubs. There are fewer customers than there were years ago and and the ones there still are seem to be unwilling to spend as much. Expecting prices to go up under these conditions when all you are actually selling is your time is not reasonable.
Several years ago, my club of choice used to charge $25 a song. Business slowed, the idiot in charge raised the price $5 (his take went to $10) and the club essentially emptied out. Both dancers and customers left. It took certain girls threatening to quit to bring the price back down, yet the club still hasn't returned to its former self. The problem is the market determines the price especially in difficult economic times.
Oh and BTW, last I heard that club now does 2 for $20 a good chunk of the time.
You are still missing the point.
I know about supply and demand and discretionary spending. I also understand consumer behavior, and specifically consumer behavior as it applies to stripclub customers. The biggest problem you RI folks had with the 2004 price hike was that all the extra went to the club instead of the girls - we know this because you all say it over and over like a mantra. I will say that same price hike wouldn't have had NEARLY the negative effect on the club if the extra money had gone to the GIRLS. It might've caused some guys to slow down or go to other clubs, but you wouldn't have seen the mass exodus that occurred because the club got greedy. You might've seen some girls leave because they couldn't sell, but those who had a clue would've loved it because they'd have made MORE money.
The reason lapdance prices have largely remained the same over the last 20 years is not because customers can't afford it. If the prices fluctuated based strictly on macroeconomic factors, they would have gone up and down over the last 20 years or so, rather than pretty much staying the same. But it's NOT based on the economy.
Dance prices remain the same because stripclub owners and managers aren't the brightest bulbs in the box when it comes to running a business - oh hell let's just be honest - they're a bunch of fucking brain-dead morons. Also because most strippers aren't really all that experienced either and they often do things ass-backwards. There is also the emotional element with customers who simply dislike having to pay or even view it as a real business because it hurts their lil egos - and please don't try to claim otherwise; you all wouldn't be here if there weren't an emotional element!
Any club that does 2for1s is run by clueless idiots who don't know how to sell, and/or by number-crunching bean-counters who will step over a dollar to save a dime, because again they don't understand how to MAKE money. These idiots have no idea about the concept of product value, especially devaluing your product vs maintaining or making it MORE valuable.
Still, all of this is beside the point. Dance prices can't realistically go down on a broad level. They ARE down. $20 now is worth about half what it was 20 years ago. That means the effective price of a dance is down by about half, while the costs of doing business for strippers has gone up.
Any customers who try to demand lower prices need to check themselves. As Hopper managed to see, you get what you pay for and if you think you need to pay less, you are likely to GET less. Why do you guys think stripper quality has decreased over the years? Why do you think so many more girls show up looking like they just rolled out of bed and made little or no effort to look good? Why do you think so many have such shit attitudes??? Couldn't be because they're not making enough to make it worth their while, could it? Or just because so many guys want to treat them like blow-up dolls and pay them squat?
As I said, most strippers aren't that experienced and will do things ass-backwards, like react to lower customer spending by making less effort, but you guys are contributing to the problem by trying to demand so much for so little.
I was always the type to charge MORE, not less, because I know wtf I'm doing :P
SupaByoch
08-22-2011, 12:05 AM
While I don't basically disagree with your logic, I think SB's point was that, whatever price the market decrees, if customers DO want good service from dancers and CAN spare the money for it, they shouldn't expect more than what they are willing to pay for. The higher pay rate is what attracts girls to stripping in the first place. If the market doesn't support that rate, hot girls will find other work or give poorer service.
One point I disagree with you on is that inflation is a direct effect on the currency and the decrease in value of the unit of currency it causes applies equally to any transaction. SB was talking about inflation of the currency, you were talking about the market price of LDs. Although the decrease in market value of LDs affects the price, the price should also be raised to compensate for inflation. Dancers use the same money as everybody else.
Yay someone who gets it!