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Widget
07-02-2006, 07:08 PM
That doesn't mean (necessarily) that the amicability is faked or that I don't enjoy his company, just that our relationship was molded by certain context - for example, none of my guy friends would dream of telling me to take off my clothes and rub myself on them, much less in exchange for money and I don't expect them to buy my drinks or pay for my company (either directly or indirectly).

But, since the relationship is based on money, and not on friendship, I don't think the friendship can ever really be trusted. I mean, you pay a psychologist and they can still be your friend (and probably wouldn't accept expensive gifts), but, ideally, a psychologist isn't trying to hustle you, whereas the 'hustle' is integral to the dancers job, and deceit is usually integral to the job...although arguably a welcomed deceit, it cannot really be trusted.


I don't think any customer would believe that his money is going to a charity, but we don't here tend to think of giving money to dancers as a bad thing.

But neither is it unselfish generosity, so I can't glorify it, it's neither good nor bad, it's amoral, and of questionable soundness.

Jenny
07-02-2006, 07:45 PM
So you're saying that you don't see the difference between bringing cookies to the office and bringing let's say flowers to a dancer?
I'm saying that I understand the impulse and enjoyment of generosity, and the gratification of making other people happy. But a chief difference in the above example is that people in the office LIKE cookies.

Jenny
07-02-2006, 07:52 PM
But, since the relationship is based on money, and not on friendship, I don't think the friendship can ever really be trusted. I mean, you pay a psychologist and they can still be your friend (and probably wouldn't accept expensive gifts), but, ideally, a psychologist isn't trying to hustle you, whereas the 'hustle' is integral to the dancers job, and deceit is usually integral to the job...although arguably a welcomed deceit, it cannot really be trusted.
Well, I don't understand "trust" in this context - like I wouldn't recommend that you give a dancer the pin to your ATM, or loan sums of money you expect to see back, but I don't see what "trust" in involved in giving a gift for the purposes that I outlined.


But neither is it unselfish generosity, so I can't glorify it, it's neither good nor bad, it's amoral, and of questionable soundness.
While I might agree that it is amoral, I don't see why it is of questionable soundness unless it is intended as a manipulative act as opposed to an act of gratification in generosity

Widget
07-02-2006, 10:58 PM
Well, I don't understand "trust" in this context - like I wouldn't recommend that you give a dancer the pin to your ATM, or loan sums of money you expect to see back, but I don't see what "trust" in involved in giving a gift for the purposes that I outlined.


While I might agree that it is amoral, I don't see why it is of questionable soundness unless it is intended as a manipulative act as opposed to an act of gratification in generosity


Basically, the answer to both of the points you don't understand, is that if the person thinks they are giving the gift to a friend when in fact they are being hustled and/or deceived, than the gift is being given on a false assumption, and, therefore, unsound, if the intention was to give the gift to a friend. If they give the gift knowing full well that they are giving it to someone who, it is possible, may be hustling them, then that's their own PL problem. I doubt most people would want to do the same for them; and why are they giving it to a dancer rather than a trusted friend? My guess...because they want you to like them, because it feels good to be liked by a beautiful dancer, and they think if they give you gifts you'll like them more. I think buying people things so they'll like you isn't a very sound practice.

fancygirl
07-02-2006, 11:25 PM
Okay, I think it's time I say it again. No gifts required. They're not you're girlfriends. Are they giving you gifts BTW?

I've given gifts to clients before, normally books that I know they'd appreciate. Oftentimes, even in regular life, I give gifts to people who don't necessarily give me gifts back. I don't do it all the time, but I'm not going to stop myself if it's something I truly want to give.

EyesWideShut
07-02-2006, 11:27 PM
I find it better to give something that is pertinent to the dancer or more personal rather than just a random tolken or expensive thing that they may not even relate to.
example...
I had a fav dancer years back, and in conversation she said that the other dancers where suggesting that customers are more turned on by natural, foul, body odor on a dancer. I strongly disagreed.
The next time I came back to the club I brought her a vial of some perfume oil that I really thing is great. I gave it to her and reminded her of the comment she made. She put some on and went backstage for awhile.
When she came back she was all excited, and said all the girls were complementing her on her new scent and that she really liked it. Then she gave me a big kiss on the cheek and said thankyou.

So you see... I'm not a complete asshole that I am on this site.