View Full Version : Muslims...
ArmySGT.
06-11-2007, 03:30 PM
Ummmmmmmmm Islam (once known as the religion of peace) translates as "submission"; as in one has "submitted" to the "Will of God".
Forgottoen is "Wahabbi-ism". Wahabbi are the ultra conservative newcomers out of Saudi Arabia.
I'm gonna duck back out now. This subject pisses me off.
Lysondra
06-11-2007, 05:24 PM
England. Argentina. Monaco. Vatican City. Greece. Denmark. Costa Rica. Finland. (there are more, just do a little research. Most countries on the planet do not offer freedom of religion.)
Of course anyone can practice any religion they want, but not publicly (Just like in the middle east). Religious holidays of other disciplines are not recognized like it is here in the US. That is why integration is next to impossible in many European and South American nations. The practice of state mandated religion is driving a wedge between native peoples and immigrants in those countries.
Uhhhh... a lot of religions are overlooked in the US too. I'd like to see a single calendar that doesn't think Hannukah is the only Jewish holiday because it's around Christmas! Let's ignore any other religion that doesn't have some semblance of Jesus in it (or in it's future) as well.
Cyndi08
06-11-2007, 05:46 PM
^^ I have never seen Ramadan on a calendar in the US. Granted, it's based on the moon but an approximate would be nice to see, for a change...
*pouts*
RoseLeigh
06-11-2007, 09:01 PM
I believe it's based on the moon, the same way that Passover (and Easter) is, so it would be just as easy to mark it a million years ahead as it is to mark Easter, etc. I do however, see a lot of calendars with other Jewish holidays, Victoria Day, Bastille Day, Cinco de Mayo, various independance days and the like. It would be hard to mark ALL the days on a calendar, I'm sure, but I think Islamic holidays tend to be overlooked. Possibly on purpose. Even Chinese New Year is often marked(I mean that China is rather far from the US, nothing more sinister).
Rose Leigh
Jay Zeno
06-11-2007, 09:21 PM
Oh, another snippet I have minimal knowledge on. Ramadan is Islam's holy month, when tradition has it that the Q'uran landed on the doorstep, as it were. Fasting takes place. No food, drink, or sex from sunup to sundown. It's a prime part of the whole submission/devotion Islamic ethic. The month itself is set by the lunar cycle, but like Easter, I have no idea what the formula is.
I hear of allowances being made for things like Rosh Hashanha, Passover, Yom Kippur, and Chanukkah. I assume if someone had an practicing Islamic employee, there would be allowances for Ramadan, such as maybe rescheduling the company picnic or excusing attendance. Ramadan fasting is one of the Five Pillars. It's pretty important in that faith.
Lysondra
06-11-2007, 10:10 PM
Oh, another snippet I have minimal knowledge on. Ramadan is Islam's holy month, when tradition has it that the Q'uran landed on the doorstep, as it were. Fasting takes place. No food, drink, or sex from sunup to sundown. It's a prime part of the whole submission/devotion Islamic ethic. The month itself is set by the lunar cycle, but like Easter, I have no idea what the formula is.
I hear of allowances being made for things like Rosh Hashanha, Passover, Yom Kippur, and Chanukkah. I assume if someone had an practicing Islamic employee, there would be allowances for Ramadan, such as maybe rescheduling the company picnic or excusing attendance. Ramadan fasting is one of the Five Pillars. It's pretty important in that faith.
Oh that's what my Muslim friend was doing. I was 8 so I had no clue.. I just knew that if I gave her any snacks she couldn't eat it until sunset. She was my best friend all while growing up, her name was Ida, I remember. *sigh* Remember the days when religion didn't matter, you just had silly friends with silly parents?
Dirty Ernie
06-12-2007, 12:19 AM
The Wahabbi are a subsect of Sunni Muslims. The Saudi Kingdom has made a few concessions to the West mostly regarding women's rights in order to keep US military equipment available for purchase. While shaking our hand with the right, the left hand of the Royal Family was funneling money to the black sheep of the family, Usama. Apparently there are passages in the Quran instructing believers to live among the infidels as they do, in order to ease their ability to destroy them. Hence some of the 9/11 hijackers had shaved their beards, and visted a strip club in Vegas.
My take on Sam Harris' position is that there are no religious extremists. The extremists are really just the truly faithful believers and it is the religious moderates, who cherrypick pieces of scripture to follow and ignore others,that are the threat to society by moderating the "extremism" existing within their chosen religion. This mainstreaming of quasi-religion makes it impossible to identify, marginalize, or neutralize these true believers.
cinammonkisses
06-12-2007, 04:38 AM
^^ I have never seen Ramadan on a calendar in the US. Granted, it's based on the moon but an approximate would be nice to see, for a change...
*pouts*
I've seen them before. They even have it in my college student planner, along with other holidays as well..:)
josie
06-12-2007, 05:47 AM
This might be a controversial thread and I'm not trieng to offend anyone, so if it does I apologize ahead of time.
Me and my mom just got into an argument about Muslims. She HATES all Muslims. I keep telling her that all Muslim people are not like the ones in Iraq. There are different branches of Islam...am I right? It just pisses me off because she is the type that gives Christians a bad name for being hypocritical and hateful. She called me all pissed off because her and my grandmas husband got in a discussion about it and he was defending some of the Muslim people. I'm pro-war, I just get so annoyed with people who sit there and say they "hate" an entire group of people and wish them dead that they don't even know shit about. This is where me and my parents do NOT see eye to eye. So, she got mad at ME and hung up on me. All because I was trieng to tell her that ALL Muslim people aren't terrorists. There's nothing I can say to change her views, is there?
I'm not trieng to start any kind of argument here, just trieng to get some opinions on how to explain to my hard-headed mother that all Muslims aren't out to kill.
Tell your mother that here in America, most Muslims do not adhere to a Sunni/Shia/whatever set of beliefs. Mostly, there are moderate, "general" Muslims if that makes sense. Here in Detroit - where the largest amount of American Muslims live - you will not find a Sunni/Shia/whatever mosque. Just a mosque. (Piece of trivia: Saddam Hussain was bestowed the key to Detroit in the 80s). Customs aside, their religion differs very little from Judaism or Christianity.
You should also point out to your mother that Iraq also has a very large Christian population.
xdamage
06-12-2007, 08:09 AM
My take on Sam Harris' position is that there are no religious extremists. The extremists are really just the truly faithful believers and it is the religious moderates, who cherrypick pieces of scripture to follow and ignore others,that are the threat to society by moderating the "extremism" existing within their chosen religion. This mainstreaming of quasi-religion makes it impossible to identify, marginalize, or neutralize these true believers.
I think that's a very valid way to look at his position DE.
In practical terms though what we see is moderates believing their religion is about love, and not doing enough to speak up against the extremists among them (although as you said, the extremists see themselves as the true believers, and the moderates tend to admire their degree of faith). And the other practical problem is that it's often difficult to speak up against someone else's religious "true believers" because dong so often offends the moderates. Bottom line is that the moderates apologize for their true believers among them, and much of the rest of the world is unable to truly state their opinion for fear of offending the moderates. In other words, everyone is being very careful about saying anything negative about the "true believers" in any religion. We sit around in a state of paralysis because of the moderates who won't clean their own houses, and are offended at others who try.
twisterinAZ
06-13-2007, 02:53 AM
Nobody ever expects the Spanish Inquisition!!!
...what?
Hahaha ! I'm not even sure why I find that funny..
Dottie Rebel
06-13-2007, 03:41 AM
Islamic terrorists represent their religion in the exact same way that the Ku Klux Klan represents Christianity. The KKK claimed their actions were the will of God. Were they? No. They were/are just psycho backward fucks--some of them wealthy, powerful men of society, some of them so downtrodden and marginalized themselves that they wanted to strike back at what they percieved to be a threat. This is not a new scenario.