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Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Right before Christmas, I took a nasty fall and was very out of it and slurring not making sense etc. so my friend took me to the ER and I was given a morphine drip and a CT scan. At the end we were told we'd be given a bill later. OK cool . Bye whatever. Me and my concussion go home to rest.
Fast forward to Wednesday....I get a bill from Scottsdale Healthcare. I hesitate to open it because I am so broke right now after missing so much work due to illness and concussion. I wait a few days because I'm not ready for $1200 bill staring me in the face.
I decide I can handle it. THE BILL IS FOR $5500 !!!!!!!!! WTF? For a CT scan and a morphine drip? Are these people insane?? And there is not an itemized list of the charges so exactly what in the fuck am I paying for ? I was in and out in 3 hrs. And its not like they did anything to treat me. I had to beg them for painkillers that barely took the edge off. When I opened the bill I almost passed out from the shock.
I don't have 5gs to fork over to them for doing nothing. So now what ???I'm livid.>:(
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Pretty sure they also bill you for every single nurse/doctor's time that came in to see you as well.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Oh, and that bed costs $1000 an hour... and that needle for the drip was TOTALLY $7, and two pills of Tylenol? $60.
One time at a hospital I was woken up at 3am to be given SLEEPING TABLETS; which they later charged me $50 for. :(
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Sounds about normal to me. I'm sure your CT was around the 3-4k range. I feel your pain. Last time I went in, I thought I had toxic shock syndrome, they took some blood, gave me a saline drip, sent me home with motrin and said nothing was wrong, just a fever. Bill after insurance? 900 bucks. 1500 prior to that. For nothing. Fuckers.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Yeah, I forgot; CT scans do run in the thousands. M needs one and we're dreading it. Even though we have 'free' healthcare and private insurance, it'll still cost us about a grand out of pocket.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
That sounds about right. Health insurance, getz it! A catastrophic medical policy can cost less than $100/month. Add an HSA to it, and you have pre-tax savings and an extra tax deduction.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BrunetteGoddess
Pretty sure they also bill you for every single nurse/doctor's time that came in to see you as well.
Yup. And those are all seperate bills. I got my ER bill which included 2 radiology charges then a seperate radiology bill that said (this is not a double charge) and a doctors bill for her walkin into the room and saying - theyre going to give you a shot.
All in all - ER $4000 and i didnt even get a ct scan! + 2 other bills = $5000
Luckily I turned in the charity paperwork to cover the ER bill but still have to pay the other 2. I called each one and got discounts...
My guy runs a convalescent (sp?) home and he says they cash payers almost double what they charge the insurance companies. Theyll work with you. Call em and break down cryin on the phone... thats what I did...
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
I don't know how some of you guys do it. Before i was working a good job there is no way i would be able to afford health care. I even heard some of people in the US can't afford heath care:( I'm glad Canada has a good health care system
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
the people that work in the hospital ? I was just laying around there !!
I'm SO fing pissed right now! !
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
From what I saw on the drudgereport link, it appears Glenn Beck is about to nail the hospital he had to deal with.
Healthcare seems like the only friggin thing you can't get a price list for. One can barely get a quote for how much it would cost for a teeth cleaning from the dentist much less anything else.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Listen, here's the dilly-yo, hopital peeps : show me a list of costs !!!! Duh . Only an idoit gets a $5500 bill and doesn't ask questions. SHOW me why I owe 5large and then we'll talk.
Why didnt they let me know a CT was 3k? For fucks sake !!!! I didn't feel any better when I left the hospital. I would have said, "Gee thanks no CT scan for me if all you do anyway is tell me to get some advil and see my general !!!" >:(
I could go on forever witth healthcare issues and insurance. It's almost as though a person can't afford to exist. Get injured and you go bankrupt ( I realize I am embelishing but you get my point .)
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
This is why I have always refused to knuckle under to the healthcare/insurance scam. But it means you can't get sick or really injure yourself badly, of course. You have to be immortal, or it doesn't work.
Like 100$ a month health insurance?? And that's cheap? If I don't get hurt for 5 years, then get a bill like yours, it evens out.
Not, of course, that your bill is anything like fair. Just saying it works out the same. Don't get really sick or injured badly in 10-20 years, you come out way ahead.
I don't know what to tell you, except maybe contest the exact charges (good luck with that), or work out an extended payment plan.
It for sure sucks, sorry to hear about it.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
i've never received a non-itemised bill from either hospital, doctor or dentist.
this is with and without health insurance.
back in the day (80s), i had relatives with million dollar policies. at their working-class jobs. that type of policy is much rarer now.
i suppose you could do like the amish, and find enough people to be a group with you and get large cash discounts...
for all practical intents and purposes that is pretty much actual health insurance in a nutshell.
when the government's involved-- well, they are the biggest group of all.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Quote:
Originally Posted by
AudreyLeigh
My guy runs a convalescent (sp?) home and he says they cash payers almost double what they charge the insurance companies. Theyll work with you. Call em and break down cryin on the phone... thats what I did...
Doctors and hosptials have contracts with insurance companies saying they can only charge $xxx. The billing system will have a higher (usually quite a bit higher) charge amount. They are not permitted to bill the patient the for that difference, so they just write it off.
For those with insurance, the EOB (Explanation of Benefits) you get from the insurance company shows all this.
For example, the charge amount for an office visit is $150. The allowed amount according to the insurance contract is $78. The insurance company pays $54.60 and I owe 23.40. That $72 difference between the charge amount and the allowed amount is just written off by the doctor's office, as if the original charge was only $78. But if you don't have insurance, you get charged the full $150.
I don't know about hospitals, but with doctor offices (assuming the billing staff aren't complete assholes) if you at least talk to them, they'll usually be willing to work something out, whether it's discounts or a payment plan, or both. That way, they're at least getting some money, rather than waiting 6 months, a year, or whatever and not getting anything, then having to pay a collection agency to get the money from you.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
in my experience, paying cash meant they would twist and rearrange things so you got the cheapest possible. i went to a specialist at one mega-clinic (chain of everything-but-emergency-care clinics and hospitals) and they charged my 100+ specialist visit as a 'child' visit, for about half the price. i knew other people whose doctors bought their meds and charged them based on need for the visits. so poor people paid a few bucks a visit and got free meds. no medicare involved, just what the doctor chose to provide/work out.
healthcare is pretty complicated even in this country.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
I can't believe that. That is fricken ridiculous, especially when the US has the world's highest GDP.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
as Lezmaka points out in one aspect, the root of the problem is that the overall system of recovering the actual costs of providing medical care versus various gov't mandates about price caps and various private contracts with insurers results in huge amounts of cost shifting ..
- gov't mandates say that hospital ER's must provide treatment to 'indigent' people for free ... meaning that an illegal alien can walk in with the same medical condition, receive the same CT scan, and essentially walk away without ever having to pay a dollar.
- gov't mandates say that poor people on the state 'MedicAid' program will have their medical costs covered by the state - but only according to a state approved table of charges. Thus a MedicAid recipient can walk into the same hospital ER with the same symptoms, receive the same CT scan, and the hospital will be paid say $2000 per the state's official 'reimbursement' tables.
- private insurers / HMO's also reach contractual agreements with hospitals in regard to their own 'reimbursement' tables. Thus a privately insured person can walk into the hospital with the same symptoms, receive the same CT scan, receive a bill for $5000, but the hospital will only be paid a total of say $3000 between the insurance company check and the privately insured person's co-pay
- people with no private insurance, but who are not eligible for the state 'MedicAid' program and who are not considered to be 'indigent' will be billed the same $5000 as the privately insured person.
The bottom line here is that the actual cost to the hospital for this particular treatment is say $2500. Thus in order to avoid bankruptcy, the hospital must be able to get paid an AVERAGE of $2500 for all the particular treatments provided. With 'indigent' people paying zero, and with state MedicAid paying less than the actual cost, it falls to insurance companies and privately insured people to pay something more than the actual cost. But the real cost burden falls on non-insured people that have money.
Of course, countries with national health programs essentially do the same financial juggling ... but it is done through progressive tax rates on citizens rather than in the form of direct medical bills (or lack thereof). But the end result is the same in that poor people pay nothing while people with money pay a lot. In the end the only real difference is that in the US the hospital bill allows the people with money to see how much they wound up overpaying towards medical costs, whereas in a public health system country they only see a huge income tax bill where their 'overpayments' for medical costs are lumped together with every other item in the gov't budget.
Well, that's not strictly true re the only difference. Another big difference in countries with a public health system would be that 1/2 of the hospitals would not have a CT scanner available. As a cost control measure, hospitals in public health system countries would be limited in geographic coverage by CT scanners (i.e. one CT scanner per 100,000 population or whatever) such that each CT scanner that does get bought can be kept busy performing CT scans around the clock rather than sitting idle 3/4 of the time while waiting for a patient to walk into the ER needing a CT scan. If the patient is walking in the door of a major city's ER then no problem. However, if the patient is walking in the door of a hospital in a small city, odds are that that patient will face the choice of not receiving the CT scan or being scheduled to travel to a big city hospital to receive the CT scan a week / month from now.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Fucking $5000 is just ridiculous, It's insane. I would have refused treatment if I had known it was going to cost that much. I'm regretting going to the hospital.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Aside from the ridiculous amount, not giving you an explanation of the charges is just plain wrong. They need to tell you what you're paying for.
I'm so sorry about this, twister! I'd be livid too.
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
^^ Thats how I felt. I got an itemized bill from the ER (kinda)....
Ask the hospital if they have a Charity program. Mine did because I said I will not let them admit me if I have to pay. The Charity is supposed to cover my ER bill then I have to pay the 2 other bills (doctor and radiology). BUT with mine it had to be filled out and sent to them within 5 days of my release so if I were you Id get on the phone Monday and work with them.
I think most major hospitals have a sliding scale of what you pay depending on income if youre non-insured. All Im sending them is my 2006 taxes and theyll cover my bill (or at least part of it) and you can also set up payment plans. Minimum is $25/month for each of the 2 doctor bills I received. They also lowered my bills by 20%.
I was flippin pissed and crying and so damn mad and frustrated over the bill but once I started calling around and figuring out what they would do for me. I got the best responses when I was crying tho - they felt soooo bad. I was like, but - I - dont - have - money - *bawl*...........
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
Are you sure thats the only bill you got? When I had to go to the ER I ended up getting 3 separate bills: physician, hospital, and ambulance.
I agree you need an itemized bill. You can also ask them (since you probably have no insurance) if there is any financial help the hospital can offer. I got my $768 bill knocked down to $315.
Next time I go to the ER I better be dying, bleeding to death or having a baby. Screw this health care "system".
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
That sounds like a very reasonable charge to me. My friend had a CT scan 2 years ago and her bill was over $1500. I went to the ER last summer for a UTI and my bill was about $480. All I did was pee in a cup and get a script for antibiotics.
Most hospitals offer a payment plan. I know you are having trouble meeting you bills, but as long as you keep calling them (don't wait for them to call you) you should be okay.
I hope you are feeling better:hug:.
Edit to add: My bad, I read the total charge as $550. Sorry, now I see that it was actually $5,500.00 Yikes!
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Re: Healthcare in this country ! WTF ??
If you don't have insurance, going to the ER for something that is a non-emergency is a really bad idea. You are much better off going to a MedCheck or Urgent Care type of place. It is much cheaper and they pretty much do the same thing.
I have never understood people who go to the ER for problems that could easily wait until the next day. Sure, if you are having a heart attack or you've been shot, by all means, go to the ER. But for a chest cold or a UTI? It can wait.
My family doctor charges $60 for an office visit. Whatever problem I have at midnight the night before can wait until 9 a.m. so I can see her instead of incurring thousands of dollars in medical bills.