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Whats the best way to get through to someone?
OK, totally non-stripping related, but my little brother is in big trouble and I don't know how to get through to him. He's 22 and has been out of a job for almost a year now, he smokes pot but says that isn't the reason he was fired (it probably is). So he lives in his van now. He gets obsessed with girls who care nothing for him and he still hasn't had a girlfriend because of being such a weirdo (he grew his hair way out and doesn't brush it). He was only self-sufficient with an apartment for about a year before his crappy car started breaking down and making him late for work, when he lost that job, he got a different one that "let him go" when they downsized.
Anyway, he's homeless and very unwilling to look at himself to make a change. He always blames people and says he "wasn't fed enough" growing up. Which is bullshit because we had tons of snack food in a huge pantry! I have determined that he must have felt EMOTIONALLY starved because our parents separated when he was like 5 years old.
My dad is willing to send him to an expensive yoga camp or spiritual retreat if would test clean first. Instead of doing that, he's just flown off the handle and nobody can find him now. We think he may be doing speed because it's popular among the down and out townie losers in my hometown.
He has already stayed with me once or twice and I got completely pulled into his confusion orbit, I started smoking with him, trying to validate his feelings and just gave him like 100 different good ideas to shoot down.
I'm going home for Christmas and I'm gonna try and find him, talk to him, and I guess beg him to stay with my dad, get some psychiatric counseling and try and make a change for the better. Both sets of parents and step-parents have been so used by him that they've stopped reaching out.
But since I'm his big sister, my question is this: How do I say the right things without sounding preachy? What I want to do is to get mad and say "what the hell is wrong with you? why are you acting so stupid??" and I know that won't be good.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
He honestly sounds like he's mentally ill and on his way to being homeless if you don't intervene and get him some serious help :(
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
ALSO- The one thing that I said to him that seemed to carry a little weight was when I told him he had become the very thing I hate. You see, he's made a habit of buying alcohol for under agers in order to keep the change for himself. I WAS ONCE ONE OF THOSE GIRLS. Age 15 and 16 hanging out with older guys who were homeless or close to it. I was taken advantage of on "the trails" by one of these guys and it was a very traumatic experience. I moved away for good almost 8 years ago and a whole new crowd of townie's has taken over. He frequently drinks with underage girls on "the trails" and it makes me sick to my stomach.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
Ever since he was a kid he would get very upset over little things. Like if he didn't catch the ball that we threw, he'd think we threw it wrong just to screw him up or something. He has very little resiliency or coping mechanism. My aunt is mentally ill, completely supported by wlefare and my dad has already said stuff like "I think he has what Carol has".
I'd like to avoid letting him think he's damaged goods though. He's already on food stamps and it would be so sad to see him just suck off the system and develop this "I deserve to be taken care of" mentality rather than working hard for something.
Maybe I should fight him! ha ha J/K but seriously...I've overcome my addictions and forgiven my abusers and I still don't know how to explain how I did it. It does have a lot to do with finding love. If he could just start to change for a girl who really believes in him...
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
I have to agree with viola. I spent a lot of time working in shelters and the fact is, mental illness and substance abuse among the homeless is staggering. There's tons of research to back this up. I don't know what area you live in but there are tons of agencies and depending on what the financial situation is there are no cost & low cost options available. I don't know what your area has but I would start by contacting your state or county department of human resources and telling them the situation, your concerns and your financial situation. They should be able to refer you somewhere that can help.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
peachplumpear
Ever since he was a kid he would get very upset over little things. Like if he didn't catch the ball that we threw, he'd think we threw it wrong just to screw him up or something. He has very little resiliency or coping mechanism. My aunt is mentally ill, completely supported by wlefare and my dad has already said stuff like "I think he has what Carol has".
Seriously, welfare and state-sponsored mental health treatment is to get people BACK to being contributing members of society. Don't look at as mooching. Some people really need help, and maybe, like your aunt, to be always taken care of. We have enough to go around to take care of the people who really need it.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
Viola Strings- Yeah I guess I never though of it that way. That the "tough love" pull yourself up by your boot straps doesn't work for everyone. It may have worked for me but I have a different genetic code than him.
I guess I thought of it as mooching because the first thing he did with his food stamp card is try and buy other people's groceries so he could have cash for weed, alcohol and cigarettes.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
He needs help. You should make some arrangements with a social worker to get him into a medical program so that he can get well. Talk with your parents about. It isn't being a sponge on the system if he gets help soon enough to become a fully participating citizen.
He is only 22 an already having this much trouble. It will only get worse.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
There's a difference between something happening to you- such as abuse- and overcoming it through pure will power and having an actual illness that is a part of you.
He has classic symptoms of severe mental illness. I work for a mental health facility, and many of our severe bipolar patients have many of the symptoms your brother has. I'm not saying he's definitely bipolar, but he definitely sounds ill.
In the case of mental illness, he can will all we wants to stop, get well, be productive...but his mind literally won't allow him. On days that aren't so bad, some patients can improve: get that job, get a shower, maintain a relationship- but they always crumble again.
He needs to see a doctor, asap. It WILL only get worse. A doctor can come up with an appropriate treatment plan, that may or may not include medication, that will make a world of a difference.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
kandie_kitten
There's a difference between something happening to you- such as abuse- and overcoming it through pure will power and having an actual illness that is a part of you.
He has classic symptoms of severe mental illness.
Bolded by me to emphasize an important distinction/point.
If he is depressed, and drinking alcohol (a depressant), it is only going to get worse.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
Well, I sent about 20 e-mails back and forth with my Dad who lives up there and could actually go find him, to say some choice words and offer him a strong support. Yet time and time again, my dad just keeps telling me, my brother needs to "find his own way in the world" and his being out of contact with the family is a GOOD sign he's learning to not blame others. Bleagh. I'm disgusted. They have a huge house, two foreign exchange students, and my dad started a non profit helping women in Pakistan learn marketable skills and such. I'm like- take care of your own damn children before you save the world!!
Yet I recently read in this article: http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-effectiveness.html
That most drug addicts and alcoholics go into remission when they are ready. That they get sick and tired of being sick and tired (like I did basically) and they change their behaviors. Treatment centers may teach valuable skills but their helpfulness is more a matter of being in the right place at the right time.
I'd hate to keep trying to force him into treatment, either psychological and drug, only to have him relapse even harder... SO I've eased off for now, but If I don't hear from him soon...I'll have to assume to worst.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
I don't mean to diminish his issues or problems, but the snap judgement in this thread that he is mentally ill does not seem to me to be a solid diagnosis, to put it mildly.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
peachplumpear
Well, I sent about 20 e-mails back and forth with my Dad who lives up there and could actually go find him, to say some choice words and offer him a strong support. Yet time and time again, my dad just keeps telling me, my brother needs to "find his own way in the world" and his being out of contact with the family is a GOOD sign he's learning to not blame others. Bleagh. I'm disgusted. They have a huge house, two foreign exchange students, and my dad started a non profit helping women in Pakistan learn marketable skills and such. I'm like- take care of your own damn children before you save the world!!
Yet I recently read in this article:
That most drug addicts and alcoholics go into remission when they are ready. That they get sick and tired of being sick and tired (like I did basically) and they change their behaviors. Treatment centers may teach valuable skills but their helpfulness is more a matter of being in the right place at the right time.
I'd hate to keep trying to force him into treatment, either psychological and drug, only to have him relapse even harder... SO I've eased off for now, but If I don't hear from him soon...I'll have to assume to worst.
If he is an addict, co-dependence is not help.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
dlabtot
I don't mean to diminish his issues or problems, but the snap judgement in this thread that he is mentally ill does not seem to me to be a solid diagnosis, to put it mildly.
Really? What's your professional opinion?
We weren't trying to diagnose him. A lot of us have personal experiences with mental illness, and maybe this situation reminds us of someone we knew who was mentally ill. Suggesting it's a possibility and that he may benefit from professional treatment isn't a snap judgment.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
About being mentally ill, I think we do tend to over-diagnose in this day and age. 50 years ago, granted we weren't facing the same social landscape, but there just weren't as many "complainers". I feel like all my brother has ever done is complain. Negativity...Is that a mental illness? Or just a habit of being lazy, not accepting blame and feeling sorry for oneself? I think he could greatly benefit from seeing a therapist who teaches life skills and techniques for changing one's thought process. I don't think it's genetic and a part of him....just learned habits.
My grandest theory is that had I not been born first (2 and a half years older) he would of "manned up" as the oldest in the family and had a much different course of life. Instead, I was the eldest, very talkative and good at school. I could intellectualize anything and argue extremely well. Maybe I damaged his fragile male ego by being a smart girl? I remember time and time again sort of "putting him in his place" and when he'd start screaming and our parents would intervene, I always escaped any sort of punishment because I stayed so cool headed. We are much harder on little boys than girls. That may have really screwed him up and be why I have so much residual guilt motivating me to keep helping him.
And then when my parents separated (Me 8, him 5) I rationalized the whole thing like "Great, they'll be happier this way. Wonderful, I'm stoked you're both found better mates, now get out of my face, I don't care" and I just remember him being very sad and lost and not understanding. They tried to send us to therapists way back then and he wouldn't even talk to them because that would mean he accepted the divorce in some way.
I don't think he ever regained his faith in love and relationships, so when he tried pot at 14, it fit like a warm glove and became his identity. Tune in to video games and drop out of the real world....ehhh, I don't know, I guess the past is pertinent but it's like ancient history now. I'd rather focus on the problem at hand NOW. thanks for listening anyway guys.
UPDATE: a girl in my town says he's fine and has been living in his van, along with some other "townfolk" trying to stay warm in there. They drink, smoke, and do a little acid (!??) She said they're waiting for something interesting to happen. I hope he gets sick of being mooched off of by people who are even bigger losers that himself. That would be the best thing to happen. He read my messages on myspace but didn't respond. I can only assume he doesn't want help and isn't ready to face any sort of challenging HONEST assesment of his life.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
Deogol
If he is an addict, co-dependence is not help.
I don't understand. Do you mean dual-dependence? As in, he's addicted to more than one thing?
Or are you implying that I am somehow co-dependent to him? We haven't even talked in forever. I don't need for him to stay screwy in order to feel like I'm "helping". I honestly do want him to get better.
I think his social group is co-dependent on each other's failures. They're homeless for chissakes, if anybody gets a job or apartment the coolest thing to do is to get fired or kicked out probably. They're like : "Who cares, you still got your buddies and your drugs right?"
Numerous times I had to escape bad social situations. It isn't easy to turn your back on friends, but I just had to remind myself that our freindship was based on addiction, and it wasn't a healthy, REAL friendship.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
peachplumpear
About being mentally ill, I think we do tend to over-diagnose in this day and age. 50 years ago, granted we weren't facing the same social landscape, but there just weren't as many "complainers". I feel like all my brother has ever done is complain. Negativity...Is that a mental illness? Or just a habit of being lazy, not accepting blame and feeling sorry for oneself? I think he could greatly benefit from seeing a therapist who teaches life skills and techniques for changing one's thought process. I don't think it's genetic and a part of him....just learned habits.
There's different kind of mental illnesses, some inherited, some acquired. They can both be debilitating.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
peachplumpear
About being mentally ill, I think we do tend to over-diagnose in this day and age. 50 years ago, granted we weren't facing the same social landscape, but there just weren't as many "complainers". I feel like all my brother has ever done is complain. Negativity...Is that a mental illness? Or just a habit of being lazy, not accepting blame and feeling sorry for oneself? I think he could greatly benefit from seeing a therapist who teaches life skills and techniques for changing one's thought process. I don't think it's genetic and a part of him....just learned habits.
My grandest theory is that had I not been born first (2 and a half years older) he would of "manned up"
I don't want to start drama or anything, but your comments above really startle me. It's just an extremely outdated view of mental illness.
50 years ago, there were plenty of "complainers", only instead of being treated and coping, they were given shock treatments, or institutionalized, or they self-medicated with liquor and illegal drugs, or they just plain killed themselves.
I am no way saying your brother is definitely ill. No one can say that, except an actual doctor. But from what you have posted, I will say he has many hallmark signs of mental illness.
And if so, that's not something he can just "man-up" from. This whole mentality of "He'll get sick of his life style, suck it up, and get better" is not just ludicrous, it's also dangerous.
At least make the attempt to get your brother help.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
kandie_kitten
At least make the attempt to get your brother help.
I have! everyone in my family has! He's stayed with with me twice in the last few years. Both sets of my parents have given and given to him only to have him sneer and tell them they aren't doing anything right.
But I guess our focus has always been more related to him getting another job, going to school, or getting his cars working etc. Maybe that shouldn't be the focus. He won't accept that his world view is flawed. I guess hearing these things from a therapist though would be the most powerful.
But then again comes my question that I originally was asking. How do you get through to someone? How do I get him into a therapy chair? Into that safe healthy environment where someone will listen and validate him but also get him to be honest with himself.
He gets SOOOOOO offended when you suggest anything is wrong with him and the last thing I want is for him to keep shutting doors on people like me who really care.
I can't really do a whole lot from here. I'm 500 miles away. He's a no-phone no-e-mail type of guy. Just have to go find him in the woods. grr.
But I guess if I really do care, the general consensus is that I should go up there and ask him pretty pretty please see a doctor? He's on medi-cal or medi-aid or whatever, it paid for the 20,000 surgery he had to have when he broke his jaw in several places skateboarding down a hill all cracked out.
How do I "sell" him on the idea? Like- what about it would be apealling to him? Is it just like in movies and TV where you lie down and they listen to you and give you "baby steps" and offer insight. Do they re-build your self esteem maybe?
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
I don't know if this counts as off topic but your brother sounds like my sister, except my family takes care of her by paying for her addictions.. I cut myself from my family cause I couldn't take watching my sister have sex, drink, and drugs when she was age ten, I'm not going to help her now that shes eighteen. My sister wanted to live with me once, I told her that I will not allow smoking, drugs, drinking, random people in my house, have to go into rehab, finish school, and get a job. Lets say she never called again for that request.
It sounds like your brother wants to live his own life and everytime someone tells him that its wrong he wants to prove hes right. I know this sounds hard but maybe you should let him do what he wants... By himself. But tell him that you will be there. It keeps the door open but with no rules.
Another way
You will not be able to sell him the idea, if you really want to help him, if hes in jail make it a court juction to madatory rehab and help. Cause he will not want to see it your way til he is dead. I may be harsh but thru it all you can make him happy by letting him hurt himself and you, or make him unhappy but helpping him.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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Originally Posted by
ViolaStrings
Really? What's your professional opinion?
Exactly my point, even though you don't seem to understand it.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
^ you are so much smarter than me omg give me your wisdom strip club forum man
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
I have no desire to get in some kind of argument, nor do I wish to trade insults or belittling comments. I already made my point, and apparently you disagree with it. For me to say that you didn't understand it was rude and I apologize for that.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
Does this sound familiar ??
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antisoc...ality_disorder
Some of his behavior may be genetic, though a lot seems affected by his upbringing. I'd say he won't want to change until he is about as far down the gutter as he can get, or finally realizes he's on his way there.
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Re: Whats the best way to get through to someone?
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....How do I "sell" him on the idea? Like- what about it would be apealling to him?....
Therapy would help rid him of the stress from the paranoic delusions he's having and help him to build a pleasant life which he is not having. I'm sure he didn't bargain for the life he is suffering now and is living out deep-seated fears he had to deal with as a kid, which he doesn't know how to overcome.