So often the doom and gloomers are jousted about what is "really" happening with the economy and repeatedly we are vindicated:
Printable View
So often the doom and gloomers are jousted about what is "really" happening with the economy and repeatedly we are vindicated:
It's good(note sarcasm) know they weren't so sure about how bad it was but I still can't complain. Michigan has suffered immensely but the bailout seriously got so many people jobs here and there are even more springing up constantly. Will it ever be as it was long ago? Probably not but who really knows for sure. Only time will tell and I am going to stay positive about it.
It's still not anywhere near as bad as Melonie makes it out to be
^^^ that depends on whether you believe the government / media reports or not ...
(snip)LiesMan on CNBS is spooging himself with "wow"s.
Well, the futures disagree. And so do I.
Real gross domestic product -- the output of goods and services produced by labor and property located in the United States -- increased at an annual rate of 2.4 percent in the second quarter of 2010, (that is, from the first quarter to the second quarter), according to the "advance" estimate released by the Bureau of Economic Analysis. In the first quarter, real GDP increased 3.7 percent.
Well, so they say. That's first estimate. Remember that BEA's average "overstatement" of late seems to be running in the 20-30% range .vs. reality when the finals are in. So if we apply that sort of discount, we're well under 2.0, which will be admitted once all is said and done (and you've forgotten about the orgasmic response of the CNBS pump monkey clowns.)
Final sales of computers added 0.04 percentage point to the second-quarter change in real GDP after adding 0.10 percentage point to the first-quarter change. Motor vehicle output subtracted 0.01 percentage point from the second-quarter change in real GDP after adding 0.74 percentage point to the first-quarter change.
And again, .vs. the spooging that CNBS is doing right now about "Cars", the report says that motor vehicle output SUBTRACTED from GDP this quarter.
The price index for gross domestic purchases, which measures prices paid by U.S. residents, increased 0.1 percent in the second quarter, compared with an increase of 2.1 percent in the first. Excluding food and energy prices, the price index for gross domestic purchases increased 0.9 percent in the second quarter, compared with an increase of 1.6 percent in the first.
Pay more, have less. That'll work out great, right?
Real personal consumption expenditures increased 1.6 percent in the second quarter, compared with an increase of 1.9 percent in the first. Durable goods increased 7.5 percent, compared with an increase of 8.8 percent. Nondurable goods increased 1.6 percent, compared with an increase of 4.2 percent. Services increased 0.8 percent, compared with an increase of 0.1 percent.
How the hell is that possible with unemployment up around 10%? Oh wait, I found it.
Real federal government consumption expenditures and gross investment increased 9.2 percent in the second quarter, compared with an increase of 1.8 percent in the first. National defense increased 7.4 percent, compared with an increase of 0.4 percent. Nondefense increased 13.0 percent, compared with an increase of 5.0 percent. Real state and local government consumption expenditures and gross investment increased 1.3 percent, in contrast to a decrease of 3.8 percent.
Ah, so the Federal Government, despite claims by the Obama Administration that "deficits will come down" and similar lies, in fact dramatically increased non-defense spending.
Further, States and local governments, even though they have no money, increased spending too. Yes, that pretty green sky is an approaching tornado, and it's labeled "state and local insolvencies."
The change in real private inventories added 1.05 percentage points to the second-quarter change in real GDP after adding 2.64 percentage points to the first-quarter change. Private businesses increased inventories $75.7 billion in the second quarter, following an increase of $44.1 billion in the first quarter and a decrease of $36.7 billion in the fourth.
Oh, so fairly close to half of the GDP "increase" was in fact due to inventory build. Guess what happens to you when you build inventories that you later can't sell? Hint: The first letter is "B".
The personal saving rate -- saving as a percentage of disposable personal income -- was 6.2 percent in the second quarter, compared with 5.5 percent in the first.
That's a load of crap. BEA calls "personal savings" the mathematical formula "Income - spending = savings." Uh huh. Paying off your credit card is "savings", according to the BEA.
Then we have revisions.
For 2006-2009, we now have a decrease net-net, as opposed to being flat.
All three years of the revision period were revised down. Again, if a mistake or inaccuracy (as opposed to intentional falsehood) is responsible for errors, one would expect them to be normally distributed - that is, some would be positive, some negative. This is obviously not the case.
Is there any good news in the report? Well, yes - there was a material uptick in non-residential fixed investment, centered around equipment and software. How much of this is a normal replacement cycle (deferred last year) and how much signifies real expansion is an open question and one not easily answered. However, I wouldn't call this particularly "robust", despite the pump monkey characterization this morning in the media.
The drops in some of the previously-published numbers were, however, simply stunning. For example, PCE (personal consumption) was previously reported for Q1/2010 as 2.13. The revision is 1.33, a thirty percent downward revision. That's not an error, it was a falsehood.
Worse was the services false report. The previous reported number for Q1/2010 was 0.69. Revised was 0.03, a downward revision of ninety-five percent.
The services revision backward was truly sickening - the entirety of 2009 was negative with the exception of the fourth quarter, where all but the first was previously reported positive, and the changes were ridiculous. First quarter was revised down from -0.13% to -0.75%, second from +0.09% to -0.79%, and so on. Again, that's not an error, it's a lie.
Needless to say when I get all my graph source data updated, it's going to look worse than it did - including my "government ponzi support" graph, one of my favorites.
The futures are diving on the report, as well they should. Not because it's bad - but because the entirety of the 2009 data set was a bald-faced lie."(snip)
from
^^^ and a bit more 'professional' analysis from Consumer Metrics ...
(snip)On July 30th the Bureau of Economic Analysis ('BEA') released its "advance" estimate of the annualized growth rate of the U.S. Gross Domestic Product ('GDP') during the 2nd quarter of 2010. Per their report, the GDP grew during the quarter at an annualized rate of 2.4%, down from 3.7% in the 1st quarter of 2010. Several points from the report merit comment:
► Readers familiar with prior GDP reports will be more surprised by the reported 1st quarter growth as by the new 2nd quarter number (which had been leaked by Mr. Bernanke last week), since only last month the Q1 of 2010 was supposedly growing at a 2.7% rate. Why did the Q1 number suddenly get altered upward by 1%? The BEA quietly revised the 1st quarter inventory adjustment up to a level that represents a 2.64% component within the revised 3.7% figure, with 1st quarter "real final sales of domestic product" now reported to be growing at a modestly improved 1.06% annualized clip, compared to the 0.9% number reported last month. In short, factories were piling on inventory at a substantially higher rate than previously thought, while the "real final sales" remained anemic.
► The 2.4% figure will garner all of the headlines, but the more important "real final sales of domestic product" continues to be weak, growing at a reported 1.3% annualized rate. The real cause for concern is that the reported inventory adjustments dropped from a 2.64% component in the revised 1st quarter to a 1.05% component during the 2nd quarter. If factories have begun to realize that end user demand remains anemic, the inventory adjustments could well go negative soon, pulling the reported total GDP down with it.
http://www.consumerindexes.com/comme...indexvsgdp.png
► The BEA revised much more than the first quarter of 2010. They revised down 2009, 2008 and 2007 as well. Apparently the "Great Recession" has been worse than our government has previously reported. And the recovery's brightest moment, Q4 2009, has been revised down from 5.6% to 5.0%. Similarly Q3 2009 dropped from 2.2% to 1.6%. And so on. The bottom of the recession was shifted back one quarter, with Q4 2008 now reported to have contracted at a -6.8% rate, revised down from the previously reported -5.4% rate. Most quarters of 2007, 2008 and 2009 have been revised down substantially, shifting the recession shown in the chart above back in time.
► The new GDP report shows that the current gap between the consumer demand that we measure and the BEA's reported number continues to grow as factories build their inventories in anticipation of a strong recovery. If factories curb their enthusiasm during the third quarter, the BEA's "advance" estimate for Q3 2010 might be brutal, just 4 days before the U.S. mid-term election.
► We understand that economists want to ultimately get the numbers right, even if it is three years after the fact. We applaud the BEA for their efforts. But we also understand people who are concerned about quiet governmental revisions to history."(snip)
Back to the real world: our Daily Growth Index has dropped to new recent lows, and it is now contracting at a -3.4% rate.
http://www.consumerindexes.com/comme...last60days.png
This contraction rate puts the trailing 'quarter' nearly into the 5th percentile among all quarters since 1947, meaning that only about 1 in 20 quarters officially recorded by the BEA since then has been worse."(snip)
from
Again a tongue in cheek question ... did those Michigan residents say 'thank you' to the federal taxpayers in other states, the fruits of whose labors are actually funding most of those Michigan bailout jobs, and whose states received far fewer stimulus / bailout dollars ?Quote:
Michigan has suffered immensely but the bailout seriously got so many people jobs here and there are even more springing up constantly
Not really meaning to be political, but in real world terms many of those jobs are not self-sustaining ... they are being paid for with (present and future) income tax money taken from workers in every state. Did you read the 'GM acquires subprime auto lender' thread ? I'm concerned that, like new auto sales and new home sales, when these gov't stimulus / bailout subsidies stop so will the jobs. But you are right that, at the moment, these jobs are available and fewer Michigan workers are unemployed.
But I'm also concerned that US federal taxpayers will still wind up having to pay for these jobs ( via principal and interest payments required to service the newly issued US Treasury Bonds sold to the Chinese in order to fund this US gov't stimulus / bailout spending ) for many years to come - after the stimulus / bailout jobs have long since disappeared.
Actually yes, they have. They say it everyday. Half the time it's all people talk about here is how much the appreciate the help they did receive. We've been in such a rut here in Michigan that something like this really lifts the spirits as well as the local economy. Our unemployment rate has dropped which for us...is amazing. I just wish there were more educated people in the area I'm in instead of high school drop outs. There are jobs here, but none for those that can't even finish high school. And they complain and complain and refuse to help themselves. While others worked hard at school and some went to secondary education and they are working. It's sad and kind of depressing. But the help the state got, believe me, never goes unappreciated. ;D
Think "it's bad" = feel bad
Think "it's good" = feel good
Is it really this simple?
= yes
actually, HockeyBobby, I have to agree with you 100% that people 'thinking' that times are good / getting better does equate to those same people 'feeling' better. However, the unfortunate truth is that no real world linkage exists between 'thinking' that times are getting better versus times ACTUALLY getting better !!!
If you and millions of others choose to view the world through 'rose colored glasses', who am I to stop you ? Well, in truth, there IS a downside. Those same millions are also capable of voting for gov't policies that 'seem' like a good idea based on their 'rose colored glasses' viewpoint, but gov't policies that are detrimental under the real world economic conditions that actually exist.
"The real world linkage" between thinking things are bad, and reality, is that the thinking part makes you feel bad....the reality doesn't. It just exists. We are not here for long. It's not sensible to choose to feel bad while we are here....and it is a choice. Whatever government policies are in effect, or will be in effect...whatever the reality...thinking it's awful constantly will physically hurt you, and make your little moment in time here miserable.
I prefer to think about consequences and their potential bad effects as well risks and how to prepare for them.
For my bad mouthing of the real estate market those years ago when it was booming - it was OBVIOUS to me when people who have had stagnant income for decades were spending half a million or more in debt for "granite counter tops" - there were going to be some effects to that.
(That style of kitchen is now referred to has "foreclosure kitchen" LOL.)
Meanwhile quite a few posters called me, frankly, an idiot for not getting into that.
And when I started knocking stocks when DOW was around 14K I could take a look around the economy and know the risk was high for staying in the market.
Again, posters told me I was an idiot. (But at least I wasn't a gold bug.)
Not to mention my recent posting about the risks of a S corp v a C corp when it comes to personal income taxes.
There are gonna be a lot of small business people who wished a bigger firewall between their business and their personal income - not against liability claims but to protect themselves from the government!
One cannot walk through the woods without looking for the downed trees and holes in the ground waiting to face plant ya.
Typical Republican spin there. All three Detroit automakers are now making profits, with Ford strongly leading they way. While auto employment is sharply down due to fall-offs in sales AND due to automation, those 2 Federal investments are now paying back principal and interest. In a couple of years if current trends continue (risky prediction) they will all be paid back with interest enough to offset the Chinese loans. But will the US pay off China then, likely no? Will they pay off the Iraq and Afghan war debts ever, not likely. Auto bailouts were not a gift, but investments, good ones so far too.
knock ... knock ... is anybody listening ?
(snip)"
On Tuesday of this week, Mr. Neil Barofsky, the Special Inspector General for TARP, testified before the Senate Finance Committee. During his testimony Mr. Barofsky addressed GM’s recent debt repayment activity, and stated that the funds GM is using to repay its TARP debt are not coming from GM earnings. Instead, GM seems to be using TARP funds from an escrow account at Treasury to make the debt repayments. The most recent quarterly report from the Office of the Special Inspector General for TARP says “The source of funds for these quarterly [debt] payments will be other TARP funds currently held in an escrow account.” See, Office of the Special Inspector General for TARP, Quarterly Report to Congress dated April 20, 2010, page 115.
Furthermore, Exhibit 99.1 of the Form 8K filed by GM with the SEC on November 16, 2009, seems to confirm that the source of funds for GM’s debt repayments was a multi-billion dollar escrow account at Treasury—not from earnings. In the 8K filing GM acknowledged:
•Of the $42.6 billion in cash and marketable securities available to GM as of September, 30, 2009, $17.4 billion came from an escrow account with Treasury,
•$6.7 billion of the escrow account available to GM was allocable to the repayment of loans to Treasury,
•$5.6 billion in cash would remain in the Treasury escrow account following the repayment by GM of their loans, and
•Upon repaying Treasury, any balance of escrow funds would be released to GM (snip)
Read more at the Washington Examiner:
So what's really happening here is that GM is using a 'new' US taxpayer funded 'credit card' to make payments on their 'old' US taxpayer funded 'credit card !!! GM is busy using its own funds to expand offshore manufacturing operations in China and Brazil, as well as to purchase subprime auto lender AmeriCredit.
And no one is concerned about this? Or is it just not true? I dunno. But the automakers are now making profits, though they may be sinking them into Chinese factories etc. I'm going to see how this plays out.
^^^ oh it's true all right per GM's 8K filing details. But it has not been publicized much, and the congressional testimony was downplayed lest US taxpayers become disillusioned that their money is actually being used to cultivate new production facilities / jobs / GM sales and profits in China, Brazil etc. GM is also being allowed to accumulate 'profits' based on the US gov't allowing GM to bypass certain major cost items, one of which is contributions to pension plans.
The 'gold foil hat' crowd will tell you that the US gov't is allowing a de-facto GM 'cooking of the books' in order to make the upcoming GM IPO look more attractive ... an upcoming IPO from which the US gov't is hoping to recover a good portion of the TARP money it has invested in GM. And in fact 'new GM' shareholders are likely to see a very respectible return on their investment ... both from higher sales and profit margins in 3rd world markets, and from US Taxpayer subsidized domestic sales to 'subprime' domestic new car buyers via newly acquired AmeriCredit. Even so, speculation has it that 10 Billion+ in US Taxpayer dollars lent / given to GM and its former subdivisions has disappeared forever, and that additional billions in US Taxpayer dollars will need to spent to honor 'offloaded' GM pension obligations via the PBGC - which again will benefit 'new GM' shareholders.
(snip)"Won't a successful IPO of new GM stock resolve the pension funding problem?
No. The actual timing of the initial public offering and the amount of money it raises will depend on market conditions. However, even if an IPO is successful the money would go to the U.S. Treasury to repay it for supporting the company through bankruptcy. In addition to direct aid of $8 billion that GM plans to repay, the government also loaned GM another $49.98 billion in exchange for a 61% stake in the automaker with the understanding the GM would do a public offering of stock as a way for the government to get repaid. The same holds true for Chrysler if and when it gets around to an IPO, which CEO Marchionne has said is unlikely before 2012.
What happens to GM and Chrysler pensioners if the PBGC takes over the funds?
The retirees could face dramatic cuts. The PBGC promises a certain level of benefits, but $35 billion of the two automakers' promised pension benefits fall beyond the PBGC guarantees. In 2010, a single 65-year old retiree is guaranteed a maximum of $54,000 per year under the PBGC guidelines, and many GM retirees have earned benefits in excess of the PBGC limits. Last summer, the PBGC did take over the salaried pension plans belonging to GM's former subsidiary, Delphi Corp. Most of Delphi's 20,000 salaried pensioners, many of whom started out working at GM, saw their pensions cut. Thus, a termination of GM's or Chrysler's pension plans could likely result in pain for both pensioners and taxpayers."(snip)
Read more:
~
Those of us who decry this forum's demise into the Dollar Den of Doom don't necessarily deny that we're in a financial nightmare.
But continually calling attention to it...is that the reason that this forum exists? I have always been under the impression that the DD is here to provide practical, everyday advice on money matters, mostly to strippers.
Instead, it's a forum for coming to put on a tinfoil hat and wallow in depression.
^^^ Arguably, as providers of a non-essential 'service', strippers are likely to be heavily affected by the economic trends behind the so-called 'Doom and Gloom' postings. On the other hand, if they are 'smart' enough to act on these economic trends it can provide 'new' economic opportunities or at least minimize the 'downside' effect. A few examples ...
DD has cited many threads showing that rich upscale customers are still spending money on 'luxury' goods, whereas middle class customers are cutting back spending on 'non-essential' items. Therefore if a dancer has the potential for moving her own personal 'assets' upscale, to the point of being able to switch to an upscale club with a customers base of rich upscale customers, she is likely to find good / better dancer earnings potential.
DD has also cited many threads discussing the risk of loss of US dollar purchasing power and/or the fallacy of attempting to measure increase / decrease in value of an investment versus the US dollars that investment is priced in. If a dancer has accumulated several years worth of dancing earnings, she may want to consider diversifying some of those accumulated earnings out of the US dollar to avoid the increasing risk that the fruits of her past efforts could be 'stolen' via US dollar inflation / devaluation.
Yet other DD threads have discussed the differences in local economics, differences in local tax rates etc. of different US states. Again, a dancer choosing to take advantage of these differences may find both better earnings potential as well as the legal ability to 'keep' an additional ~10% of the money she is earning !
Obviously DD also answers specific questions in regard to 'practical, everyday advice on money matters' ... from tax filing to local banking to squeezing savings out of a monthly budget. But to put it bluntly, your statement along these lines implies that most dancers are in a 'stereotype' position of having far more financial liabilities than assets, living from one night's dancing earnings to the next etc. All I can say in that regard is that SW readers clearly do NOT represent a typical cross section of 'strippers'
Of the current threads on the front page, 20 out of 31 were started by you, Mel, and all 21 are of the "doom and gloom variety. The bottom 5-6 threads are all of the "reason 7 that the world is coming to an end" variety. There are currently 4-5 threads of that 31 that are on practical, everyday matters.
Trying to spin tinfoil hat threads about the spiraling recession as being useful to strippers is like saying that me posting in the Body Business thread about food prices is useful. Technically, yes, that's correct...but really? This forum is basically you and a few other people going back and forth about how bad the economy is, how much worse it's going to get, and how to stuff gold under the mattress in your nuclear fallout shelter. The few brave or naive souls that do wander in here seeking real advice generally get overly-complicated answers that don't really help them all that much.
I kind of wish there was a separate sub-forum about the economy that you and Eric, Deogol, et.al could post in so this forum would become useful again.
^^^ well every single DD visitor is able to post new threads, including yourself !!! I absolutely encourage everyone to do so. In fact, my own 'weekend commentary' and 'chart of the week' postings are a direct result of an insufficient number of new threads being posted by others.
However, unlike the mainstream financial media, if content is posted in DD that relies on innacurate financial facts, gross distortions etc. that content is going to be questioned ... and that goes for both the Keynesian and Austerian viewpoints.
And again I seem to have a bit more faith than you do that DD 'strippers' are both concerned enough about their personal / business finances beyond paying this month's rent, and intelligent enough to make their own decisions in regard to saving / investing / spending if presented with the actual facts, that they do benefit from exposure to economic reports and viewpoints that don't typically appear in mainstream financial media or the nightly news.
Again I remind you that, like professional athletes, 'strippers' have a relatively short window of opportunity within which to cash in on their dancing careers - after which they must preserve the 'wealth' the relatively short career window generated. As such, both are in a relatively unique position of having to enter a 'defensive' financial mode in their 30's - as opposed to most people not having to worry about entering 'defensive' financial mode until their 50's - because unlike regular workers who may have another 20+ years of career earnings remaining to make good recent investment losses, professional athletes and professional 'strippers' do not !!! If professional athletes or professional 'strippers' in their prime earnings years enter into highly risky investments, and experience major losses, there is no way that their earnings potential at age 40+ is going to allow for those losses to be recouped ! Thus a lot of the 'conventional wisdom' in regard to financial planning simply does not apply well to their unique situation !!! This is one reason that I tend to avoid 'rose colored glasses' material in favor of 'hidden risk' material !
OK let's go at it...I like arguing so let's do it...lol...by the way, I mean nothing personal by anything I say, 99% of my rhetoric on here is basically me just having fun....that said...here are threads on the front page right now that were started by you...
foreign opinion - US trapped in depression, this really is starting to feel like 1932
Melonie
Debts and Deficits of different countries
Melonie
Go to first new post US tax money is being used to train offshore workers to
Melonie
'proof' the US Middle Class is Radically Shrinking
Melonie
(early) weekend commentary - Huh, No Inflation ?
Melonie
economic facts that can't be spun part 11 - US Businesses flush with BORROWED Cash !
Melonie
for better or worse, US congress stops at 99 weeks of unemployment checks !
Melonie
economic facts that can't be spun part 10 - Restaurant Sales / Traffic Declining
Melonie
A real 'ray of sunshine' from one of last year's most accurate prognosticators ...
Melonie
weekend commentary - the Ruling Elite's 10 Step Program for economic recovery
Melonie
weekend commentary - Americans Splurge on I-Pads while Broke in New Abnormal Economy
Melonie
Truth is stranger than fiction - GM buys Subprime Auto Lender
Melonie
Economic facts that can't be spun part 7 - Consumer Borrowing down sharply ...
Melonie
huge gov't tax rule changes hit Brits overnight ... coming to the US soon ?
Melonie
Gold Put Options ... split from another thread
Melonie
At Last ... a 2011 dancer's federal income tax calculator
Melonie
economic facts that can't be spun part 9 - corporate 'receivables' grow and lengthen
Melonie
more weekend commentary - 'Stealth' US Taxpayer bailout of FDIC begins in earnest
Melonie
Go to first new post Weekend Commentary - Jean Claude Trichet on Inflation vs Austerity
Melonie
Of those, I see two that might...maybe...be usable in an everyday context by strippers. I count 12 that are utterly useless in any sort of "everyday" context. FDIC bailout? GM buying a subprime lender? Debts and deficits of various countries?
You keep saying something along the lines of "strippers reading this information can use it to make decisions about how they handle their finances." Can you tell me how knowing the debts and deficits of various nations does this? How corporate receivables being down helps a girl at the Mons Venus manage their money better?
I am not saying strippers can't understand this stuff, so you can abandon that part of your argument. What I'm saying is, 99% of the DDoD (Dollar Den of Doom) is useless to anyone other than those that want to discuss how fucked our country is...a notion I share with you, by the way, but just don't like to wallow in.
But maybe I'm wrong. If you can demonstrate to me how half of the above threads you have posted above are really, REALLY relevant in an everyday context to strippers, I'll give in on this debate.
^^^ OK I'll play along ...
I would like to think that intelligent dancers would recognize that there is a common thread behind these topics ... i.e. that the club customer base upon whose incomes / ability to spend money in clubs the dancers depend ... a club customer base whose incomes are sufficiently high that they must actually pay income taxes ... are going to be taxed at much higher rates in the future to cover the costs of those gov't debt levels / gov't bailout spending measures. This arguably translates into an expectation of lower future dancing income potential versus present dancing income level, which is something that should be planned for.Quote:
I count 12 that are utterly useless in any sort of "everyday" context. FDIC bailout? GM buying a subprime lender? Debts and deficits of various countries?
Actually, corporate receivables are going UP as more of their customers are not making timely payments for the goods and services they have received. If you want to focus this down to the impact on a Tampa FL dancer, the take-aways are probably this. Don't think about purchasing a home or condo. Don't think about entering into a new auto loan or a new apartment lease. In other words, don't enter into any long term financial commitments that would assume your future year dancer earnings potential will be higher than they were last year, or even equal to last year. The ticking time bomb of falling business profits is likely to translate into a fall-off in dancer earnings potential during the upcoming Florida winter peak earnings season.Quote:
How corporate receivables being down helps a girl at the Mons Venus manage their money better?
Obviously several threads are future US dollar inflation 'warnings' ... which a smart dancer might connect with the gold thread as a means of hedging risk of US dollar purchasing power losses on some portion of her accumulated dancing earnings / investments.Quote:
If you can demonstrate to me how half of the above threads you have posted above are really, REALLY relevant in an everyday context to strippers,
Several other threads are warnings of impending tax increases that will affect both the dancer and her 'prime' customers. The uptake should be obvious, as previously discussed.
And the whole genre of threads involving 'economic facts that can't be spun' are essentially pointing out the discrepancy between the 'rosy' official gov't statistics plastered all over mainstream financial media and the actual economic facts that will probably affect both her own future income as well as the incomes of her 'prime' customers. One direct inference would be that dancers should consider 'upscaling' themselves as much as possible and moving from clubs that appeal to 'middle class' customers to different clubs that appeal to 'rich' customers !
The 'splurging on I-Pads while strategically defaulting on their mortgages thread' may in fact be of particular interest to Florida dancers ... because it implies that the areas of the state where real estate prices are falling the farthest will also be areas where strategically defaulting Florida homeowners may be temporarily flush with cash diverted from making any more mortgage payments !!!
Please realize that there are also constraints against giving outright financial advice ... which in turn requires that conclusions relevant to dancers be left as a matter of interpretation as opposed to making specific blunt statements.
!
OK Mel, you're smart...you know you're stretching the bounds of credibility with the claims above. Analagously, if I went on to, say...the music forum, and started flooding that board with posts about the declining quality of hearing in older americans, the fact that most audio equipment is made in Asia, and how concert hall construction is being halted..and took over 75% of the posts/threads there in this exercise...the board would suck...but I'd be technically right in doing so, since I could find some tenuous thread that tied all of my posts back to stripping.
Anyone can tie anyone to anything if they try hard enough.
Tampa just built a new art museum. How does this affect people living in the Maldives? Well, if any Maldivean tourists are thinking about travelling to the states, they might want to consider coming to Tampa to check out the museum.
But does that REALLY have relevance?
You're not presenting actual facts. All you are trying to do is present a one-sided view that everything is going to hell. It seems that you will not, under any circumstances, present anything positive about the US economy. Any time anyone does present anything positive, you try to turn it into doom and gloom.
It all depends on the dancer. There are many dancers that use dancing as a means to better themselves by going to a good college or university. Dancers who do this can end up with a high income when they're in their 50's.
If you want to get a good return on investment, you have to take some risk. Anyone who listened to your advice last year missed out on a 60% run-up in the stock market.
actually this is not the case. However, what I do try to make a diligent effort on is pointing out when '''positive''' posts are actually based on cherry picking, dubious estimates, statistical sleight of hand etc.Quote:
Any time anyone does present anything positive, you try to turn it into doom and gloom.
well, without cherry picking highs and lows, the SPDR S&P500 gained 28% last year. During the exact same period gold gained 27%. So give or take a brokerage fee, anyone who listened to my advice last year missed out on nothing !!!Quote:
Anyone who listened to your advice last year missed out on a 60% run-up in the stock market.