Apparently the 'War on Christmas' nonsense wasn't enough for Fox News. Now they're publicizing a 'War on Easter'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX0RzCIe-14
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Apparently the 'War on Christmas' nonsense wasn't enough for Fox News. Now they're publicizing a 'War on Easter'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX0RzCIe-14
You think that's bad, check this out:
"Never has evil battled so hard for the hearts of the youth. Whenever (low mentality/easily misled) women do religion & spirituality it is usually mixed with esoteric notions to promote another fad, book or song. Women seem to be open towards otherworldly influences for their syrupy inspiration. Only to attract an undiscerning audience that must not take much to impress or motivate them. (I am glossing over the repulsive female worship here as I am focusing my attention upon Jesus Christ)."
http://thelp72980.wordpress.com/2011...me-for-easter/
I love the way they* get bent way the fuck out of shape when someone does the slightest thing to contradict their mythology--which is precisely what it is.
They don't really know jackshit about the real, historical Jesus, Judas, Mary Magdalene...any of them. There is very little direct evidence that he even lived, other than crumbling texts in ancient languages, which have been translated into several successive different languages, embellished and distorted constantly through the ages to match ever-changing doctrine.
I don't doubt that he did exist, but whether Mary Magdalene was a whore, how and where he was crucified, whether he was actually dead when they took him down from the cross (according to the textual evidence he was taken down after a few hours, which the Romans would never, ever have allowed to happen--crucifixion was supposed to be a very long, drawn-out death that could take more than a day).
They* will scoff at any and all other religious/mythological traditions as though people were crazy to believe them--yet they have adopted wholesale these pagan fertility rituals (Christmas and Easter were both pagan fertility holidays long before Jesus walked the earth), and embraced such absurd tales as the Resurrection, Virgin Birth, turning a loaf of bread into 3,000 of them (or however many), and so forth.
I'd just as soon believe the Earth is really the back of a giant turtle.
Really, it's not a problem if people want to believe such far-fetched horseshit--so long as they allow people to believe their own special version of ancient myths.
Though it's pretty safe to say Jesus was a Jew, not a black man--as Lady Gaga supposedly sings about him being. But again, who cares? It's all mythology anyway.
*They here referring to the kind of geeks that write the virulent bit of garbage I quoted, NOT meaning Christians in general.
Good luck with a war on Easter. You can drive a car over those marshmallow peeps and they retake their original form. Unstoppable sugary death awaits all those who seek battle with Easter.
And tooth decay.
I think its much ado about nothing but say something that offends Muslims, the Left goes nuts, say something that offends gays and the left goes nuts, say something that offends immigrants and the Left goes nuts,say something that offends pro-choicers and the left goes nuts but say (or sing) something thats offensive to Christians and the Left says its the Christians that are wrong. Everyone should be entitled to the same consideration or lack thereof.
But in this case, the (radical) Christians were the first to cry 'Wrong!'
However I certainly will apologize to all practicing Christian members here for my strong reaction to the reaction of Fox News, to the reaction of Lady Gaga, to the reaction of about 1,500 years* worth of ecclesiastic theoreticians, to the real events of circa 33 AD.
There are millions of Christians who don't really care what anyone else believes, or what music videos they make. It's the ones who do care that much that scare me. And there's a lot of them. To those I would be so brutally honest with my opinion, but maybe more circumspection is due here.
:-X
*I don't think all that much has changed in the various Christian sects in the last 500 years, in terms of dogma. I'll have to think about that, though.
There certainly are a lot of Christians who are hypersensitive to criticism. But as a non-christian, I will give them credit for not chopping people's heads off as a response. They outgrew that a few centuries back. I wish I could say the same about some other religions which curiously get a pass from the same crowd that pretend to stand against dogma and religious (Christian) oppression.
As an atheist, I believe ALL religions are man-made fairy tales that should be fair game for criticism and even ridicule. For the left, however, this seems to only apply to Christianity. All the man-made horseshit in Islam and other religions must be respected at all times because people who follow them say so and they're not Christians so they must be right, even though some of them are willing to commit mass murder in response to the slightest offense.
This selectivity of the left when it comes to condemning "dogma" and "superstition" is every bit as phony to me as anything I've seen in religion.
No pass from me.
Agreed 100%, except I have found that it isn't worth pissing off friends and family because you are insulting something that means a lot to them, even if there's no way in hell you could ever buy into it yourself.
This is where you lose me. I'm a strange mix of left and right, but lean heavily to the left right now (no pun intended lol) because of the far right (largely radical Christian) efforts to shut down stripclubs, etc.
Of course this is nowhere near as bad as crashing planes into skyscrapers for Allah, but it is certainly vile and downright unAmerican.
But I really don't see any greater credibility in Islam than Christianity, come on now. They look like idiots as well, though they did manage to dispense with the Virgin Birth crap at least. Instead they cut off their women's clitorises. The Christians almost certainly burned a hell of a lot more people at the stake though.
We could go back and forth all day about which religion is inherently more contrived, vile, and evil. The Aztecs would probably win that one, except they killed way, way less people than Christians, who incidentally wiped out all of Pre-Columbian Civilization in the name of the Lord.
'Who killed more people?' isn't necessarily any less valid a criteria for judging a religion's potential and its record for harm done than 'Who killed more people from 1750-2010?' In the big picture.
In another couple hundred years it could be Christians burning people at the stake again, and Muslim leftists being accused of making excuses for them.
:D
I find it interesting that the "war" is always about Christians vs. Athiests or Agnostics and the like, and everyone is getting all up in arms about it, the Christians saying they have a right to teach their religion in schools, like the myth of Creationism. But if Muslims started trying to teach the Quran in schools, I bet the Christians would shut their mouths.
I can see it both ways. My parents are Athiests, and I was the only one in my class in elementary school who did not attend church. The other students were constantly trying to convert me, and they ridiculed me for being ignorant about their religion (I didn't even know God and Jesus are not the same person until I was like 12, and I knew nothing about the rest of their mythology). My guidance counselor was calling me into her office at lunch to give me pamphlets about Christian crap, telling me not to tell my parents, that they were already lost to hell, etc. But I told my Mom anyway, and she flipped the fuck out and went to visit the school. It IS illegal, and the reason that people don't want Christianity in schools is because it leads to this shit. My parents were never the type to make a big deal out of Christmas or Easter; we celebrate those ourselves, though it's not about religion at all--it was about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. Besides, Christmas and Easter are not originally Christian holidays; Christmas was based on Yule, which was a Pagan holiday that the church assimilated so as to get more followers, and Easter is based of a holiday celebrating the Goddess Eostre. Most of the Catholic saints were based off of Pagan deities. Most religions aren't really new and different--they all copy and paste from each other, going back to Rome and Greece. The Romans barely bothered to change the names of the Greek religion to form their own.
I'm Pagan now, because it's not really an organized religion (I HATE organized religion). I'm not a member of a coven or anything like that. It's just me. I have my own set of beliefs and customs and I have no one around telling me that I'm not worshiping properly. The Christians I encounter do enough of that. I have my eight Sabbats that I observe every year, privately, and I also participate in other holidays. Just not in the religious aspect. I can appreciate other people's religions and customs, but I despise when they tell me that mine are WRONG and then try to shove their shit down my throat. This happens everywhere, and it certainly happened in schools, and the students weren't the only ones doing it.
It's silly to get all P.C. about naming Christmas parties "Holiday Parties," but it's not quite that simple. If you cater to one group, you have to cater to all of them, because that's just what's fair. We aren't officially a "Christian Nation," though some people here disagree. Just because the majority of people identify as Christian doesn't mean the government has said that EVERYONE has to be Christian. This isn't 16th century England, people have a choice. So, no, we aren't a Christian nation. And to be fair, we should have Passover parties and Ramadan parties in addition to Christmas and Easter parties, and I think a lot of people would freak the fuck out at the idea of their precious little Christian child being exposed to Judaism or Islam. My point is, either everyone gets to do it, or no one does.
Djoser, just to clarify, my post was meant as a general observation and I wasn't including you in my reference to the hypocrites. Sorry if it came across that way.
I love Lady GaGa and everything she stands for. Aanything different and provocative gets BIG flak. They can say what they want, while she continues to break records and laugh all the way to the bank.
I'm a "lil monster" Love you GaGaa....paws up!
When I saw her concert last november, not one lip-sync either. I think that she and her team are artistic geniuses...plus she's a fellow NYC girl. Fuck FOX news.
Oh it's all good, I just wasn't sure because it was right after my strong reaction. ;D
This is a pretty interesting discussion, actually--I am just worried about offending the many cool Christians I know we must have here. I can think of one who is way cool that I think I pissed off a long time ago posting stuff like this. Probably wasn't worth whatever I posted.
Wow, very interesting post!
Easter actually has a lot of parallels in many different religions, going all the way back to the Osiris myth, and probably even further. The fertility god is killed (often in horrible ways) in early to mid-spring, and then magically resurrected, and by this means bringing life and spiritual strength to all of Mankind. Sound familiar?
You mentioned the Roman saints. Not only do they (and the Devil, and the Holy Ghost, and the Virgin Mary who is still around ready to hear prayers, etc., and all the angels, and so forth) make a mockery of the much-vaunted notion of monotheism. But the adaptability of the structure of the religion with all the patron saints--and the emphasis on sacrifice--is one of the biggest reasons the Conquistadors were able to dominate the MesoAmerican cultures, such as Aztecs, Mayans, etc., so easily. But it was a damned brutal transition.
Actually, one of the great advantages of such polytheistic (and proud of it lol) religious systems as the Romans had was the ability to easily accept foreign gods into the system, or meld them into the equivalent Greco-Roman gods.
First off, radical Christians? All they are saying is they are offended by it. They are not threatening a holy war over it.
Secondly, why is there never any criticism of other groups that actually do over-react when they are offended?
Its just weird, Don Imus lost his job at MSNBC for making an inappropriate statement about Black females. Juan Williams was fired by NPR for saying boarding a plane with Muslims heightened his nervousness. Lady Gaga sings a song with lyrics some Christians find offensive. Fox points that out and they get criticized for it? Don't Christians deserve the same consideration as Black females or Muslims? Personally, I think Lady Gaga has the right to sing whatever she wants to sing but people who find it offensive and speak out about it should be allowed to do that as well.
I hate to admit this, but I kind of agree with Bem. I have noticed a war against anyone who's Christian. For instance, I am strongly opposed to ever dating a man who's divorced with kids or a never married dad. I get attacked often for this view saying I am judgemental. However, these same people think I should accept it because it's the way of the world now. I don't care if people live like this but it's not the way I'd want to live and I don't want to support a view I am opposed to. Not to mention all Christians are portrayed as racist, sexist homophobes. Sure some are, but I've known racist and sexist people of other religions too, notably Muslims.
I don't like the radical Christians though. They are dangerous. They want to push their agenda and anytime a group wants to push an agenda it's terrifying.
Interestingly, Mary Magdalene came up the other day in conversation and there is a growing view that in fact she was Jesus' wife, not a whore. I feel this myself and I think there will be more evidence that in fact she was an apostle, which could lead to some interesting conclusions in the Catholic Church, such as women ordained. There is a growing movement of this and it could be interesting what happens.
As for pushing religion in school I don't agree with it, but it goes all ways. I wouldn't want my child being told that illegitimate children was acceptable or that multiple marriages are normal. I wouldn't want them told that they have to accept something I disapprove of. On the other hand I am tired of not allowing anything Chirstmas or Easter in schools now. Both have become secular events for kids (Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny) and I think those should stay what they are. If parents disapprove then allow all religions to have a special day. A friend of mine is pissed because her kid's school took away these holidays because of the Muslim kids in the school. I have to agree.
People call you judgmental because you refuse to recognize bastard children as viable human beings.
They are viable kids, but I don't want to support them, nor do I want to accept that having kids out of wedlock is normal. It's not and never will be for me, especially if the parents are welfare freeloaders. The parents should in most cases not had kids or got married beforehand. When I meet a man with kids out of wedlock he immediately goes into my no way in hell category.
...no I will not accept out of wedlock children as normal. I know sometimes it can't be avoided but most times it can be.
I do not have to accept things I am opposed to and it has nothing to do with karma. Just because I am opposed to paying for people who had kids they couldn't afford doesn't mean I deserve bad karma. I still think most men who had kids without marrying the mother are scum and so does many people I know.
People attack Christians because the majority of people in this country identify as Christian. You can't throw a rock without hitting one. But you kind of have to look for Jews, and especially for Muslims. Muslims aren't freaking out when a school bans them from having a Ramadan party or having prayer clubs. Jews aren't freaking out when a public building bans them from putting up a menorah. As I said, it needs to be all or nothing. Either they are all allowed to do it, or none of them are. I feel that Christians in this country are extremely pushy about their religion. I have never had a Muslim corner me and try to convert me. I have had hundreds of Christians try it.
Of course, I just don't believe in organized religion in general. I think that organized religion encourages a sense of entitlement among its followers, and discourages any type of open-mindedness or acceptance. But oddly enough, it really seems to be focused in this country. I was in St. Patrick's cathedral in Dublin the day before Easter, and I was all Gothed out (solid black, spikes, handcuffs, pentacle, intense makeup, the whole nine) and received nothing but smiling acceptance from everyone. A nun came up to me, gave me a lily, and wished me a happy Easter. If I went into a church in this country dressed like that, I'd get mobbed by people telling me I'll burn in hell unless I repent--and that's if I don't just get kicked out. Maybe Americans just no longer feel that acceptance and tolerance are important--that's probably what over a century of isolationism does. Forget that this country was founded by all different kinds of people--French, English, Spanish, American Indians, Portuguese, Irish, Italians (just to name a few). I get very angry at the hypocrisy of Christians in this country, demanding that they be accepted and celebrated, but refusing to do the same for anyone else.
The reason you see people you mentioned in this country is because this country was founded on Puritan views. I do not agree but many religions in this country are based on Puritanism. Religions like Catholic, Lutheran, Episcopalian, etc aren't.
And maybe it's where I am, but people of other religions always fight to have Christian views outlawed. For instance there is an Atheist leader here who's always fighting places to remove Christmas trees (which are Pagan), nativity scenes, etc. so yes the nuts exist everywhere. I feel that a menorah should be displayed too as well as icons from other religions.
^ Technically, "Puritanism" isn't a religion. It isn't even an official denomination. Maybe you're thinking of "Protestantism." Roman Catholicism, Protestantism, and Orthodoxy are the three major divisions of Christianity, and Lutheran, Episcopalian, Baptist, Methodist, Mormonism, and all of those are just denominations of the same religion. And only one of the original colonies founded here was founded on religious views--there were quite a few other colonies founded, and they were all founded for capitalistic purposes. The founding fathers were mostly Deists, who believed that organized religion was a terrible, terrible idea, and they wanted to ensure it would have no legal place in government. I don't know why they keep teaching in this country that the Puritans/Pilgrims (which were actually two entirely separate groups; I don't know why people think they were the same thing) came over on the Mayflower (this was the Pilgrims, not the Puritans) and founded this whole country. Probably the same reason that they continue to teach that Christopher Columbus discovered America. We KNOW it's not true, it's just habit, and it's easier to teach children something like this then to say America was founded on Mercantilism and Columbus was a slaver who committed genocide and never actually set foot in North America.
Yes, parts of this country were based on Protestant views and of course they are all different. But many of the denominations were based on the forms of Puritanism that were prevalent at that time. This was long before the founding fathers. I read awhile back what religions developed from pilgrims and the puritans and can't remember which ones did.
True, many colonies were developed for capitalistic reasons and the founding fathers were deists but my point is that many people believe what they do because their religion preaches it and many religions are certain ways, if this makes sense.
Getting more into the founding fathers they really left the door open about religion. While they never wanted an official religion I also don't think they were thinking of other non Christian religions. At that time there just wasn't people coming from many non Christian countries. Sure, the native americans had their own religions but they weren't thinking of them either. The pilgrims and puritans did come here because of religion, but at least in the puritan's case they themselves pushed their own religious views (ie witchcraft, which in reality was all about women who were independent and little about being witches).
That's because as you said above, there are a lot more Christians here than there are Muslims. That doesn't make Muslims any more tolerant.Quote:
I have never had a Muslim corner me and try to convert me. I have had hundreds of Christians try it.
And frankly, if Christians are "pushy" for wanting to celebrate Easter in schools, then we would have to invent a new word to describe the way Muslims behave in places where they enjoy similar numbers. Because just this week, there were street riots in Egypt over a Christian citizen being appointed governor!
I could cite similar examples from many other places including where I grew up, but here's a list of recent hate crimes committed by Muslims from just ONE country. Use Google to find more.
On June 5, 2006, a Pakistani Christian stonemason named Nasir Ashraf was working near Lahore when he drank water from a public facility using a glass chained to the facility. He was assaulted by Muslims for "Polluting the glass". A mob developed, who beat Ashraf, calling him a "Christian dog".Bystanders encouraged the beating, because it would be a "good" deed that would help them in heaven. Ashraf was eventually hospitalized[17][18].
On August 2006, a church and Christian homes were attacked in a village outside of Lahore, Pakistan in a land dispute. Three Christians were seriously injured and one missing after some 35 Muslims burned buildings, desecrated Bibles and attacked Christians.[19]
In July 2008, a Muslim mob stormed a Protestant church during a prayer service on the outskirts of Pakistan's largest city, Karachi, denouncing the Christians as "infidels" and injuring several, including a pastor.[20]
The 2009 Gojra riots was a series of violent pogroms[21] against Christian minorities by Muslims.
In March 2011, Shahbaz Bhatti was killed by gunmen after he spoke out against Pakistan's blasphemy laws.
Kinda puts things in perspective, doesn't it?
I have relatives in France and they are terrified the Muslims will take over. Apparently many radical Muslims live near them and are always causing trouble. Muslims are just as much trouble as Christians, probably more but we rarely talk about them.
Not really...I noticed you neglected to list all the crimes committed by Christians against Muslims in that part of the world.
Besides, did you miss the part where I stated that ALL organized religion is a bad idea? I think it all breeds intolerance and ignorance. But in THIS country, the majority of people are Christian. So in THIS country, the big problem is with Christians pushing their beliefs, not Muslims or Jews or Buddhists or whoever. I'm sure there are problems with them pushing their beliefs on government and society elsewhere, but not here. Here, it's the Christians that are doing it.
Unless you're referring to the wars in Iraq or Afghanistan, neither of which are religiously motivated, I'm afraid I don't know what you're talking about.
Compare the freedoms of Muslims in Christian-dominated Europe and America, and the way non-Muslims are treated in most Islamic countries, and it's easy to see that Islam is far more aggressive and intolerant than modern Christianity.
I see plenty of criticism of Islam from the left. Denmark is a very left country, and their newspapers published cartoons of Muhammad, which set off Muslim riots around the world. France is also a "left" country, and their government banned burkas that cover the face. In the leftist Netherlands, one of their former members of parliament, who is an ex-Muslim, was very critical of Islam when she was serving in their parliament.