Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Hey ladies....
I was reading the other thread of seeking arrangement and I don't mean to go off-topic here, but I was wondering if any of you happened to catch the Dr. Phil show on Friday. It featured seekingarrangement.com and the show was called "Sugar Baby Students."
I watched the whole show in its entirety. There were 4 women on there. I think 2 were in their 20s, on was almost 40 and one was in her 30s. They also had the owner of the website, Brandon, as well as a former federal prosecutor, along with a angry father whose daughter is on the website and he doesn't want her there. The girls basically talked about their monthly allowances and put out their lifestyles about what they do to a certain point. However, I don't think they got to put out the WHOLE side of their stories, which I thought was a crock of shit. The prosecutor seemed to be a bitch when she said that they were basically prostitutes and he was a digital pimp and the law just hadn't caught up to this day and age of technology yet. They also were going to have a sugar daddy on the show, but when it came down for his segment, the guy left the studio in a hurry. They laughed it off and basically called him a John.....
I read through the posts in the other thread about seeking arrangement and I wanted to know your thoughts about the show if you guys saw it. The one girl, the blonde, said that she has this gucci or coach bag, whatever designer bag it was, when she met up with her guy, he would put money in her bag and if the bag didn't have enough money in it she would tell the guy that the bag was still hungry or something to the sort. Now forgive me for saying this, but those girls weren't that attractive to me and I like women. Even though I am picky, I know that sugar daddies are about attraction and some girls don't give sex but really? The one girl, who says she's going to be an attorney, called the whole audience jealous, ugly, and everything under the sun. I feel that she really made the rest of our workforce look worse than we already do since we are already frowned upon FOR what we do if that makes any sense. At the same time, I feel that much of what the girls said DID make sense and stood for what we say here on SW, and as a adult community and workforce, go as far as saying most of it is accurate.
Dr. Phil kept saying those girls were misguided and that the girls didn't have any self-esteem where as the site owner, Brandon says all the girls did have it. Personally, I heard every single one of those girls say that they barely had sex with any of their daddies. I think the most any of them had sex with their daddies was like 5 times, maybe 10. (I have the show recorded on my DVR and I plan on watching it again.)
If any of you that did not watch it or need to know what I am talking about, I dug up some links - here ya go.... keep in mind, some might be repeats because some have updated comments or what not on them.
**If you have Comcast, you can most likely watch it on their OnDemand thing or even with any other provider you should be able to...***
This is the main link....
This are some videos I found...
I haven't been able to find the episode YET - I am sure it will be uploaded eventually so I will keep an eye out for it. If anyone finds it, please post the link.
I am asking for personal opinions here. Did you see the show? What did you think about what the girls said and how did they present themselves? Is the information that was said accurate? What do you think?
Let's have a civil debate about this....:) Seriously! This is a good opportunity. Maybe someone should ship THIS to DR. Phil so he can see that he is possibly wrong about this industry and he is the one that is misguided in his stance!
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Prostitution is the exchange of sex for money. Period. What is so hard to understand about that. God damn. I've had enough with the media already. You can't change the definition of prositution. Stop trying ffs!
If there are (and there are) SB's who do not have sex with their SD it cannot be synonymous with prostitution! Hello!
To me this is nothing more than propaganda. It would be bad news for men if all of a sudden more women decided to profit from their romantic relationships. Women keep falling for it. Their loss. I don't give a shit.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
But Kalypso, those women don't see it that way....
Many of those girls have said that they had sex with them because they wanted to, not for money. In fact, the girls said, on the show, they had sex with their daddies and were not paid for it. They said the two times were different times they got paid for. So, that can't be prostitution then, can it? If money is given to a woman, and there isn't anything sexual occurring, then it would considered a gift, right? There's no criminal act taking place there.
I don't think that Sugar Daddy/Sugar Baby relationship is a romantic relationship at all. It's a mutual beneficial arrangement....what gave you the idea it was romantic? Sure there may be some roleplaying ideas of romanticism in there but it's surely not 100%...
Women fall for what? Women hold the card in favor 99% of the time.
My view is that I have to agree with the one woman who said it's a good thing for the married men. Most married men don't want the hassle of having the get a divorce with splitting the money, the house, the cars, all that crap...and then having a girlfriend to have to spend time with and do that and this with, when he can get a sugar baby, that is just in title really, that he fucks, gives her a credit card, they hang out, she does her thing and he does is....it's happy. HOW many women and men do that every day and did that BEFORE the sugar baby / sugar daddy relationship even came about? Come on.... So many men have that and even WOMEN do it now. So what's wrong with having a boyfriend or girlfriend that you fuck and spoil and you BOTH are conscenting adults doing an adult dirty?
So then escorts, are just prostitutes then...they can't have a proper name like escort...just prostitute?
If that's the case, what's a stripper then? It's not an exotic dancer because there's nothing really exotic about it. Entertainer won't work because it just gives guys wood to pay your bills so...we would have to figure that one out.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
I'm not surprised the SD bailed. Have we ever seen a talk show about escorting, stripping, or porn where there is an actual customer there to defend his interests? Nah. It is usually a woman-bashing session. Customers generally can't deal with the stigma their workers deal with. Theyll talk about it for hours online and get props for it - but shine a light in their face and they'll scatter.
"Now forgive me for saying this, but those girls weren't that attractive to me and I like women. Even though I am picky, I know that sugar daddies are about attraction and some girls don't give sex but really?"
OK I hear you, but to be brutally honest - take your average everyday person. I mean go to the supermarket now and select 5 people. That is what your average American looks like. The sugar babies selected are definitely above average attractive. Compared to what counts as average - I'd definitely say they are? I think being in the sex industry and even worse being online alot skews our understanding of what most people look like, haha you know what I mean?
But, I think the mainstream doesn't get (or doesn't want to swallow, lol swallow) that men pay for a very wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide spectrum of attractiveness in adult entertainment. Mostly b/c the object isn't getting them to pay once (which is where being hot is a godsend) but getting them to pay over and over and over again (where you need to be a salesperson). If you have both you're good to go, but if you only have one - you can only be successful in a sustainable way with the latter. Sexual sales is more of an aesthetic freeforall than it seems.
"The one girl, who says she's going to be an attorney, called the whole audience jealous, ugly, and everything under the sun. "
Maybe she is an actor hired to rile up the audience? Talk shows are reality TV. Because if you want to make yourself look stupid - retorting with "ur juz jellis" is a great way to start.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Quote:
Originally Posted by
roast
I'm not surprised the SD bailed. Have we ever seen a talk show about escorting, stripping, or porn where there is an actual customer there to defend his interests? Nah. It is usually a woman-bashing session. Customers generally can't deal with the stigma their workers deal with. Theyll talk about it for hours online and get props for it - but shine a light in their face and they'll scatter.
"Now forgive me for saying this, but those girls weren't that attractive to me and I like women. Even though I am picky, I know that sugar daddies are about attraction and some girls don't give sex but really?"
OK I hear you, but to be brutally honest - take your average everyday person. I mean go to the supermarket now and select 5 people. That is what your average American looks like. The sugar babies selected are definitely above average attractive. Compared to what counts as average - I'd definitely say they are? I think being in the sex industry and even worse being online alot skews our understanding of what most people look like, haha you know what I mean?
But, I think the mainstream doesn't get (or doesn't want to swallow, lol swallow) that men pay for a very wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiide spectrum of attractiveness in adult entertainment. Mostly b/c the object isn't getting them to pay once (which is where being hot is a godsend) but getting them to pay over and over and over again (where you need to be a strategist). If you have both you're good to go, but if you only have one - you can only be successful in a sustainable way with the latter. Sexual sales is more of an aesthetic freeforall than it seems.
"The one girl, who says she's going to be an attorney, called the whole audience jealous, ugly, and everything under the sun. "
Maybe she is an actor hired to rile up the audience? Talk shows are reality TV. Because if you want to make yourself look stupid - retorting with "ur juz jellis" is a great way to start.
Oh no no, I meant when I said forgive me for saying this - I meant they aren't my type I'd fuck if I was a dude...LOL I think the site owner picked them to go. Maybe Dr. Phil picked them because of how they acted - Lord knows I wouldn't have picked those women to represent me if I were that site owner. That blonde was the ONLY one who did a pseudo good job of representing it to my liking. She spoke candidly and kept on point to a professional level and said THIS IS BUSINESS!
I totally was hoping the SD didn't bail Roast. Even though I knew he was going to, I didn't want him to. It would have been refreshing to hear his side of things. Before the break, Dr. Phil was like "We have a sugar daddy here who has no problem with this and loves the lifestyle!" and then commercial break and POOF gone he was...LOL
Mainstream can kiss my ass. Anything adult industry is becoming the next tattoo. You see it everywhere you go and it's no longer a taboo thing.
The girl who called everyone names - I highly doubt she was an actor. The way these girls acted - I was looking out for that. I was looking for certain things they would say and drop for that. I am going to have to see if there is ANY way I can get that off my DVR LOL. They weren't actors because they knew the jargon and the terminology we speak and they were advanced with it because they had to explain some of it to Dr. Phil even. I am talking about the terminology that even the noobs here don't pick up on until at least 6 months into SW. She said that everyone was jealous and ugly because they couldn't do what SHE was doing. LOL.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Can I throw out that the porn industry has been falling over itself to capitalize on adult dating profiles so theyve been conflating NSA with sugar culture? SeekingArrangement's marketing and affiliate ads has a lot to do with "never pay for sex again!" "find a hot young woman TODAY!" vs "Attractive college girls - want to have ALL of your bills paid?!"
C'mon. Who are you attracting with that? SA knows who and what they're marketing to and for. SBs aren't NSA free sex opportunities. SD-hunting is not a freakin' work at home opportunity.
Which in turn creates more and more women signing up for these sites in the hopes of having a non-sexual sugar daddy. Which dilutes the pool of those who are authentic SDs, and also dilutes the pool of SB who know how to play the game. It results in a lot of cheap grumpy wannabe-hobbyists and wide-eyed Bambis compromising their boundaries for $.
Guys probably look for naive girls (who won't screen them) to convince to have sex with them, not pay, guilt trip, or haggle.
Which is why I see so many sugar daddy ads that say "no pros! no hookers! no flakes! so tired of rip offs!" - which to me always always translates as "I am ashamed of paying for adult entertainment! I'd also fail any basic escort screening & am probably on at least one DDNS list somewhere! Which also means I may not pay you or Ill haggle or Ill call you names for expecting payment more than once. If youre the least bit assertive with me, Ill call you a RIP OFF or a PRO (gasp). If I am so creepy that you decide to sever contact with me then you are a FLAKE. I will make our first meeting in a motel, my office, my car, a back alley - BBBJCIM is mandatory within the first 10minutes of meeting me or you're a RIP OFF"
IDK - basically, the SB world shouldve stayed underground. All this publicity is diluting the pool and making girls less safe.
Can I emphasize that SD-hunting is a time investment. Every hour spent chatting, flirtting, is unpaid labor. Finding a SD by accident or developing one out of someone you like (it happens) isn't very intentional but it is more reliable.
But I think SBs who genuinely do not have sex (of any kind) with their SD and are still in that kind of relationship after 3months do exist but are in the minority and didn't meet the guys on these sites (my speculation + experiential learning). The rest? meh, whatever. All this mincing words over prostitute/escort/SB just seems like a waste. Sex work means a lot of things - let's just call it that. The measure of it making sense is if she ensures she's still getting paid for it.
But i want to throw out for the naysayers if men weren't willing to pay to either be teased, watch, or just simply be in the presence of wom(e)n they find attractive - damn near 75% of sex work just would not exist. Sorry.
Also - I'd love for someday on one of these talk shows after a panelist says: "you're just a prostitute!" :audience applause/hooting: and the woman goes: "yea, so?" :silence: "you must hate yourself!" "ehh not really, you have to be pretty confident to do this and accept it and deal with the hate, don't you think?" "....prostitute!" "Like I said, I know?" Kinda like Sasha Grey's epic appearance on the Tyra Banks show.
I really really really want Dr Phil to get caught in some embarrassing sex scandal for all of his slut shaming.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
I'm confused. My post was Pro-SB.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
LOL....I know it was Kalypso!
Roast you effin' crack me the fuck up! LOL
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
hey, you're right, the adult industry is getting more and more mainstream but the mainstream just won't admit it (despite feeding us and making us grow).
but KB if you didn't want to have sex with her ur jus jelliz.
SB who can hustle get my salute. SDs and money slaves who are into it also get my salute. The rest either I have some vague worries about (girls who sign up with pipe dreams not knowing how to navigate) or can suck my toe. What did someone say (was it Kalypso?) this is "sugar daddy" not "budget" daddy.
Just, someone - come forward with some Dr Phil counter-shaming scandal. Dig up something with teeth. Sex tape? Secret child? Wide stances in airports? Anything with evidence. Naked myspace-angles cellphone pics would suffice. Hey even a topless pic of him making duckfacelips. If he's pinching his nipple that'd be even better - but not required.
lol Im not contributing meaningfully anymore - but thanks for the links. Did you see the True Life episode about Sugar Babies? The male SB was hilarious.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Ohhhhhemmmmmmgeeeeeeeeeeee Uz rtttttttt Roast. Iz jelliz. I haz no bootay. no bewbs. I fail! LOL
Sb or not. I give it to ANY girl who can hustle some cash. I know quite a few girls who go on a few sites and they are just social networking sites and are just HOT and rake in the dough...and I used to the same thing before I did the cams. Get it girl. :) Anyone who has a problem with it can get a quick cunt punt and GTFO.
I like Dr. Phil. I do. I just wish he would keep his realism on ALL ends of the board and not just on the issues. He does has the tendency to stick on the morality level. I guarantee you if that prosecutor was not there he would be have been GAME ON with it. I have seriously considered writing him a letter explaining that he has it all wrong and explaining it's not about self-esteem...it's about business and doing the right thing to protect yourself, etc. I am REALLY considering it..
Because he has it fucked up.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Quote:
Originally Posted by
roast
. What did someone say (was it Kalypso?) this is "sugar daddy" not "budget" daddy.
Nopes not kalypso was def me in the seeking post page 3 haha . I believe i said "I most def got very irritated with how cheap some of these sugardaddies were trying to be, um hello the name is SUGAR daddy for a reason not budget daddy."
}:D
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
I posted about the show in the lounge on Friday I think when it was on. Honestly I think it's stupid that the prosecutor said there should be a law for this. As long as you are of age and there are consenting adults, who fucking cares. If people called there sugar daddies boyfriends, it wouldn't be illegal. Because we are allowed to have sex with our boyfriends and get gifts from our boyfriends are we not? Is it not the same exact thing? Just another term to use?!
The only thing the law needs to do is prosecute murderers, rapists, child sex offenders, people who do hit and runs, and kidnappers. There are probably a little more than that, but those should be the people we focus on. Oh and wife beaters, and anyone who kills really. Child prostitution should be illegal, and so should sex trafficking. (well it is illegal, but you get my point)
Two 25 year olds or 35 years olds having sex or not having sex, and getting money and gifts should NOT be illegal.
I think it's a HUGE waste of time and I am not even a sugar baby or anything, just a web cam model, but I don't think being a sugar baby is worth being criminally prosecuted, unless you are under 18 years old.
If they start cracking down on adults who do this kind of behavior I think they would be wasting our tax dollars. Let's focus on what matters in the country. The war, poverty, natural disasters, missing persons, the economy. I mean so many things we SHOULD be focusing on, yet we care more about the petty bull.
sad really...
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
roast, everything you post is great.
something that really annoys me about this (and i see posts on this site by the men who are here for reasons beyond me) is that everyone seems to be in denial that men will pay for EVERYTHING in exchange for attention. this is, after all, a site for stripping, so it is obvious that men are very willing to pay for not-sex. and given all the oprah shows about emotional affairs and office spouses and relationships in which men invest themselves that do not end in sex, you would think it would be obvious to EVERYONE that many men are happy to give their money to a woman in exchange for her affections (not necessarily intimate).
sd sites are inefficient to me, mostly because too many of the men don't understand what an arrangement is or are looking for a professional who they can underpay. but every time i see a "come on, no man is going to give you _______ unless you fuck", i think this is the most absurd sentiment.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Quote:
Originally Posted by
camille27
something that really annoys me about this (and i see posts on this site by the men who are here for reasons beyond me) is that everyone seems to be in denial that men will pay for EVERYTHING in exchange for attention. this is, after all, a site for stripping, so it is obvious that men are very willing to pay for not-sex. and given all the oprah shows about emotional affairs and office spouses and relationships in which men invest themselves that do not end in sex, you would think it would be obvious to EVERYONE that many men are happy to give their money to a woman in exchange for her affections (not necessarily intimate).
but every time i see a "come on, no man is going to give you _______ unless you fuck", i think this is the most absurd sentiment.
Pfft I tried bolding the parts I loved about this and it ended up being basically the whole thing, so:
http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-conte...ry/yes/421.gif
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
I agree with almost everything said. I've never been an escort but years ago had a pseudo sugar daddy relationship. By that I mean he paid me to escort him to various events and even to just chill with him but we never had sex. Sex was never discussed at all nor would it be. We both knew it was short term and he was at the time going through a divorce so it would only be a rebound thing. Once it was over and he moved on I was fine with this.
One thing that always bothered me are the women who would call sugar baby whores. I mentioned this in another thread, but what's really the difference between a woman who sleeps with men for money versus the women who sleep with a guy because he bought dinner? Perhaps it's far fetched, but in both cases money transaction took place. The only difference is sometimes the women who slept with the guys buying dinner really liked him and he liked her. However, how often do we see on sites (including this one)stories of women who slept with a guy on a first date, then never heard from him again? Not much difference between the two examples except in the escort/customer case both got what they wanted (money for her, sex for him). In the other case there is often hurt feelings.
If a guy had offered me a luxury apartment and all the money I wanted, I would seriously consider it. I think most women would. Would it make me an escort? Perhaps technically, but like I said anything that involves sex for money could be technically prostitution, including sleeping with a man who bought dinner.
I didn't catch this episode, but yes many of these talk shows do hire actors. I know people who were paid to go on various talk shows to pretend. Years ago the Jerry Springer Show asked me to go on to pretend to be an escort.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
Camille you are so on point. When I was 18, sadly, I was an escort because I allowed myself to fall into that trap. "No one's gonna pay that." or "You're cute but you're not THAT pretty" Ugh I was so naive. I'm glad I know better now. Now, I feel like no amount is enough for me to ever feel like I owe a man ANYTHING. Now, I know that I'm worth the amounts I'm asking with plus more. Fuck that.
Re: Seeking Arrangement & Dr. Phil
to be honest with you, i used to be a big fan of dr. phil and always watched his show after i would get out of school. but now his show is getting more and more rediculous and he is capiltalizing on these types of shows for the boost in ratings. sorry but the the heartwarming tear jurker shows just don't get those top notch ratings but the sex scandals, sex worker bashing, and poligamist shows do get those high ratings and he is heading down the path of where maury and jerry springer have ended up. just look at the snazzy suits he is wearing now! those shows bring in shits loads of money and his show will just keep getting trashier by the minute. i don't take those shows too seriously anymore or really get too offended by them anymore cuz the stripper bashing does get way too old to hear anymore and they're opinions are just fogged by the $$$ in they're eyes. so in reality, they are no different than us...they are just a bunch of ratings whores themselves.