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Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experiences
I am interested in getting back in the game. Possibly as a dancer. Years ago I worked at a top club where I was a waitress (and not to rub anything into anyones face who dances) as I am considering and did it once before but just for a second and didn't do well at ALL.
I was one of the top earners out of everyone. I had a system with the girls, the bouncers, and I finally got good at picking that customer who would be the top spender that night. I never expected tips out of the girls, just one hand washes the other so it worked. This club we HAD to push champagne and it was expensive as hell.
I always found my approach was less direct so I had an opportunity to talk a guy who normally might not like or admit to liking Black women.
At this club Black dancers made less and had to do more. way more! There was one girl who did really well. Another who did Ok.
So I am just wondering anyone's thoughts on what they have experienced and what they have observed.
And what types of Black girls seem to do the best.
Not to offend anyone and please be as open as you feel because I won't be offended.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
You'll find that hustling as a waitress is going to be very different to hustling as a dancer, so just be prepared for that and don't expect your successes as a waitress to translate directly into big $$$ once you start dancing.
What types of black girls do best really depends on the club and clientele, so you may have better luck getting a response if you post what club you want to work at, or even the city you're planning on dancing in.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
I completely agree that waitress hustle =/= dancer hustle. I've done both. Selling as a waitress is far easier. Like you said, waitressing is less direct. Although you're pushing alcohol, guys don't really think of waitresses as being after their money. It's super easy to build rapport as a waitress and guys will "befriend" you very quickly because you're less threatening. There's also that whole "forbidden fruit" aspect. They're far more leery of dancers.
Anyhoo, in my experience, the answer to the question is ENTIRELY dependant upon the individual, most physical factors aside. The "types" of black girls that do the best depends on each dancer's hustle. I've seen larger black girls do EXTREMELY well, while tiny ones with the stereotypical "white stripper" physique sit by broke. The only thing that the ones that all do well have in common is not being too rough around the edges (In other words, no ghetto girls). Being funny, ENTERTAINING, well spoken, and a great conversationalist does a great deal of the work for anyone, regardless of race. This is coming from a girl who works at an upscale club in the deep south where race relations can be a bit rocky.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Depends on the clientele. At the clubs I've worked at (all in Michigan, mostly Detroit/Detroit area, all top-tier for the Detroit area) the black girls who seemed to do the best were typically slender, above the average dance in terms of looks, and spoke very well. White-collar men like when a black women speaks like she's well educated. Black women with those qualities do well at upscale and even mid-tier clubs with a white-collar clientele.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
I am very well spoken and highly educated and perhaps I should have and could have taken a different route. I am working on a phd. And it takes a lot of time to get there. I have been a career student. I have the conversation. But, I have been out of the game for a minute so the whole seduce is not me anymore but, I suppose it is like riding a bike.
I tried to work in fine dining, I would rather strip and more, you have no idea how you are treated especially when that is where you are used to dining.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
It depends. When I worked in King of Prussia at Just Enuff I had buddies that were somewhat "ghetto" and the old farts ate em up like Kit Kats. On the other end 2 friends that are well educated and articulate get passed by because they are "supposedly not black enough" and act "bougie and whitewashed" according to some critics. It's a catch 22. Just tailor your approach to the club and clientele.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Not that it isn't a legitimate concern, and I totally feel where you are coming from, but at the same time you just gotta get all that shit out of your head. Because if you go in over-analyzing your type and who you think likes your type you will screw yourself out of money before anyone else can. Of course it helps to figure out your persona, but if you want to make money, you really have to get into the mindset of "I am a fierce, sexy, bad-bitch mothafucka money magnet" or "I am a sensual, gorgeous creature who men just throw their money at"....whatever feels good to you....good luck!!
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
I agree with Temp some guys want that stereotypical black girl. Hell Ive had a white guy tell me before I sound "too white" and that im probably really a white girl painted black O_O. Needless to say he spent money on a girl that was quote on quote more urban than me. Just be yourself, and remember that youre at a white club, so most white guys come in there to see white girls. Get thick skin because there will be days where no one wants the black girl and then days where everyone wants some chocolate. Occasionally, you will get the racist comments no matter how educated you are or sound. In my experience mixed clubs have been the best for me; more consistent and less rejection, but otoh ive had most of my biggest spenders at upscale clubs :) Oh and straight hair does wonders!
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Unfortunately in my opinion, because the world is brainwashed by beauty standards, it seems we black females will have to work extremely hard to get a leg up. Personally, I have two double wammys, I'm black, and I'm fat. So I wouldn't even have a chance in the average non black club. However, in my experience (non club of course) I have always been favored by white males. I don't pride myself on that fact, it's just something I find curious. Now, if I were thin and had a great body, I'm sure I'd be one of the token black females at the clubs because I'm bubbly, my tone/voice sounds professional, my tits are big and natural, I consider my face to be attractive, my skin is a bit "lighter" (no offense to anyone) and I have that "white friendly" look about me. Basically with the right weave and look, I'm safe lol. To me, that's fucked up but it's probably how it would've gone. I've also been told I act "too white" and some guys (my soon to be ex husband) prefer black women who are more "hood" than me. He was always trying to change me, my hair color, etc, and I found out that he was hitting on a few ghetto chicks on facebook. It's whatever really.
Now, there are preferences, I see that some clubs prefer dark skinned black females because it's more exotic or a light skinned female with bone straight hair, the same with commercials for skincare and hair. Finding a foundation shade is the pits for me because for some odd reason, the make up standard for black women is usually a deep dark brown or your choice of "white" hues. Matter of fact, even on television commercials the black actress is usually biracial with curly hair. I won't even get on the injustice in the music industry with "red/yellow bones with big booties or light skinned females" I rarely see a dark brown skinned video model who isn't overshadowed by her lighter sister.
Anyway, the sad truth that I hear is that black women are limited and do have to work harder to get ahead. It's unfair, but it's reality and it will be that way until beauty standards change. I think black women are beautiful. Our hues, hair textures, attitudes, strength, all that but we definitely have an unfair advantage. A lot of people hate us and it seems things will never change. I believe in order to work in a white man's world, you have to play by their rules. What I hear is that in the clubs you should cater to the most influential clientelle. If it's an all black club, you follow their standards (big asses lol) if it's a predominately white club, you have to be a bad bitch with a pretty face, perfect teeth, and thin with long bone straight hair or sexy long lose curls. Though I don't agree with forcing yourself to be anyone's standard but your own, when it comes to making money, I think it's best to do what you have to do.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
I have noticed that while there are certainly white men who simply aren't attracted to black women, there are some who have a black-woman fantasy. If they find a pretty, well spoken black woman, it's exotic to them. But it's also about supply and demand; you can't have too many black women in a club, because the demand generally isn't as high. At the first club I worked at there were four or five girls who I'd consider the top earners. I was one of them and I'm mixed but customers are always mistaking my ethnicity. Two of the top earners were dark skinned black women. They were gorgeous and educated. And the clientele was mostly white.
My mom danced in the late 80s and early 90s and was always a top earner (and a Blayboy Bunny as well). My agent even remembers her from back when she worked in Detroit. She made great money. This was also when they'd only let a couple black girls work each shift, so the demand/supply was in her favor. But she was the stereotypical top-earner black stripper; she is also mixed with Native American and a little white so her skin is a golden brown, and she was very petite. She was also extremely well-spoken so customers liked that. She has four ex-husbands, all of whom are white. Most of them were also rich (besides my dad lol) and one of them she initially met while dancing. She always had regular customers who were white and would spend big money. I feel like a lot of the rich white guys she dated felt like not only did they have a gorgeous, intelligent woman on their arm, but since she was black she was more exotic.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Thank you to everyone for sharing. I will be back. I have a paper that is due in an hour and I certainly got side tracked reading all the insightful comments.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Quote:
Originally Posted by
tempest666
It depends. When I worked in King of Prussia at Just Enuff I had buddies that were somewhat "ghetto" and the old farts ate em up like Kit Kats. On the other end 2 friends that are well educated and articulate get passed by because they are "supposedly not black enough" and act "bougie and whitewashed" according to some critics. It's a catch 22. Just tailor your approach to the club and clientele.
I've seen this time after time myself.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Quote:
Originally Posted by
PleasureVictim
I've seen this time after time myself.
That's funny, I've never come across this before in my life unless it was a black guy saying it.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
^I haven't heard about them actually saying "You need to act black" or something along those lines but I have seen less polished WOC rack up from white dudes. Looking on, it made me think about the stereotype of white men only liking black dancers/women who act white. God, I hate that term. I don't know their motivation, but I've seen it happen enough times that I don't consider it a fluke.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Quote:
Originally Posted by
kortneykay
Unfortunately in my opinion, because the world is brainwashed by beauty standards, it seems we black females will have to work extremely hard to get a leg up. Personally, I have two double wammys, I'm black, and I'm fat. So I wouldn't even have a chance in the average non black club. However, in my experience (non club of course) I have always been favored by white males. I don't pride myself on that fact, it's just something I find curious. Now, if I were thin and had a great body, I'm sure I'd be one of the token black females at the clubs because I'm bubbly, my tone/voice sounds professional, my tits are big and natural, I consider my face to be attractive, my skin is a bit "lighter" (no offense to anyone) and I have that "white friendly" look about me. Basically with the right weave and look, I'm safe lol. To me, that's fucked up but it's probably how it would've gone. I've also been told I act "too white" and some guys (my soon to be ex husband) prefer black women who are more "hood" than me. He was always trying to change me, my hair color, etc, and I found out that he was hitting on a few ghetto chicks on facebook. It's whatever really.
Now, there are preferences, I see that some clubs prefer dark skinned black females because it's more exotic or a light skinned female with bone straight hair, the same with commercials for skincare and hair. Finding a foundation shade is the pits for me because for some odd reason, the make up standard for black women is usually a deep dark brown or your choice of "white" hues. Matter of fact, even on television commercials the black actress is usually biracial with curly hair. I won't even get on the injustice in the music industry with "red/yellow bones with big booties or light skinned females" I rarely see a dark brown skinned video model who isn't overshadowed by her lighter sister.
Anyway, the sad truth that I hear is that black women are limited and do have to work harder to get ahead. It's unfair, but it's reality and it will be that way until beauty standards change. I think black women are beautiful. Our hues, hair textures, attitudes, strength, all that but we definitely have an unfair advantage. A lot of people hate us and it seems things will never change. I believe in order to work in a white man's world, you have to play by their rules. What I hear is that in the clubs you should cater to the most influential clientelle. If it's an all black club, you follow their standards (big asses lol) if it's a predominately white club, you have to be a bad bitch with a pretty face, perfect teeth, and thin with long bone straight hair or sexy long lose curls. Though I don't agree with forcing yourself to be anyone's standard but your own, when it comes to making money, I think it's best to do what you have to do.
Pretty much this, I'm going to have to agree with this post. I've worked at both urban and non-urban clubs and I've noticed that in the upscale clubs that I've worked that cater to white men, the darker ladies that get hired are typically slender, wear their hair straight or wear a wavy wig. The ones that really did well had something that made them stand out in addition to providing the "look" that the club goes for. A couple of examples I can think of are their hair color (usually a bright color/color that compliments their skin tone) or just their mannerisms or the way they carried themselves.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Quote:
Originally Posted by
PleasureVictim
^I haven't heard about them actually saying "You need to act black" or something along those lines but I have seen less polished WOC rack up from white dudes. Looking on, it made me think about the stereotype of white men only liking black dancers/women who act white. God, I hate that term. I don't know their motivation, but I've seen it happen enough times that I don't consider it a fluke.
part of it might not necessarily be a racial thing, but an energy thing. I see a lot on this forum girls talking about going after older guys, praising their own intellect and conversational skills, saying things like "these guys relate to me better than the dumb wanna dance girls" etc etc which is 100% valid, im not saying at all that they are wrong, but im sure weve all noticed really big spenders (specifically the quiet, educated, high class type) spend $$$ on the dumbest girls.
i think i can honestly say that when it comes to those types of spenders, only half of them have come from me sitting and talking, being intellectual yet sexy, etc. the other half is really stupid shit like tripping and bumping into them, doing an especially high profile bachelor dance, going up to a young (mostly) rowdy group and acting super dumb, and then these guys just grab me and off we go.
during our time together I try to match what they want as carefully as possible and usually that means staying dumb. they will say demeaning things that I understand they think im too stupid to interpret as demeaning, things like if I ask them where they work theyll tell me in finance and that its something someone like me wouldnt be interested in (even tho I studied economics so im incredibly interested), or maybe ask questions about what else I do and possibly ask if ive ever done modeling or feature danced because im "pretty enough and I would make more" (aka implying that I was limited to adult work and should cash in now before my looks go) and then of course they are always interested in if im single and imply that I am on the right track to marry rich.
this stuff on its own wouldnt be compelling but these are the same guys that always enjoy my jokes or conversation 10 times more if they make me look as dumb as possible. one time I was talking to a guy who said he had a flight to europe in a few hours and I (purposely) said something like "wow, youre out partying just hours before you have to travel all the way across the pacific ocean?....oh wait...its the atlantic ocean thats between us and europe...right?" i wish i was kidding but he bought an hr immediately after that.
anyway, what im trying to say is that i think there are some guys who get off on feeling so alpha male around some *significantly* lower class and education level than them. this includes me (as their stereotypical super dumb blonde) and I think it can include your so called "less polished woc." I also think that a lot of guys come to the sc for the ultimate break from reality and now (as opposed to the 60s) that beautiful women are educated and career focused, as well as less uptight, they need someone who is dramatically different from their wife, colleagues, etc and that usually means someone less refined.
just my .02. im not black so I dont have first hand knowledge but I definitely think that some of the experiences black girls experience are experienced by all of us and I also think that a lot of issues in the sc cant be easily described as only a racial issue. lol I think ive spent too much time on sw today...im on a solo strip trip so im trying to stay in the zone haha.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Well said! Men are certainly looking for an escape and that is often when black women come in to play as well. I saw it at the club years ago. I've seen men do some crazy things. They can be quite animalistic. That reminds me I need to read this former dancers book she sent me. Brought back memories of her having unprotected sex in one of the VIP's
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Quote:
Originally Posted by
charlotte.
anyway, what im trying to say is that i think there are some guys who get off on feeling so alpha male around some *significantly* lower class and education level than them. this includes me (as their stereotypical super dumb blonde) and I think it can include your so called "less polished woc." I also think that a lot of guys come to the sc for the ultimate break from reality and now (as opposed to the 60s) that beautiful women are educated and career focused, as well as less uptight, they need someone who is dramatically different from their wife, colleagues, etc and that usually means someone less refined.
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you are kind of brilliant! i was wondering why i wasn't earning as much money lately because i've been brushing up on economics/politics/etc to have intelligent conversations and then losing money to the drunk girl with an IQ lower than room temperature and wondering why! this is absolutely true in soo many cases! its an escape! and so many bored suburban white guys are sick of the same old white bread women and need a change, something exotic, and different..hell, if i were a guy and was into black girls, why would i want one who looked and talked like the same old white girls i've been around?
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
lol. because they are black and I think that is what makes it exciting. Think of a crazy bitch like Naomi Campbell. lol.
No, this is a good point. Hmm.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
I have not been working at my club for too long but I have noticed that the white men at my club do like the black women...including myself. I dont work at a fancy upscale place...my club is very mixed. Mainly mexican girls but plenty of black and white girls. It is Texas by all means.
There are still the ones I kind of avoid...the ones who like to hunt and drink beer...but other than that the white, mexican, and black men like me. As long as you are decent looking...you will be alright.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Me either black guys always tell me that
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
My experiences might be "utopian" because I grew up in Northern California, but- I have seen African-American dancers do well b/c their target best customers are middle aged white males with deep pockets who have strong attractions to women of color for different reasons.
Pretty much all dancers have to deal with stereotypes and typical behavior from horny men (I often was mistaken for Asian so I got a lot of those "yellow fever" guys & couldn't be offended by their silly childish views if they were spending. A strong trait of a good businessperson is separating sentiment from sales and "taking the money.") Everyone can have personal discretion about where he or she "draws the line" in this kind of scenario...but, the older I get, I realize men are very sexual and most of their views of all women are colored by their sexual/sentimental preferences.
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
this thread makes me sad, jeez
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
Why does this thread make you sad?
I think it is unfortunate society lumps people into stereotypes based on skin color.
The club I work caters more towards white customers although it's a mixed club there is this pink elephant notion that majority of the time white customers have more money.
I have been surprised by the white customers who buy dances from women of color. Either these guys love black women or they come from places where there are no black women and they can fulfill their interest or they come from racist environments where associating with black women is frowned upon so they fulfill their interest in the club.
I also think some white customers think that they don't have to pay a black dancer as much or expect more in a dance but I believe black dancers should charge prices same as white dancers and never bend personal boundaries
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Re: Black girls experiences w/ white clientele & others observations of their experie
because i've never really experienced anything like this
(im black)