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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
OP, I'm stating a lot of what has already been said, but this is important to me, so I need to say it. Hopefully, you'll realize this isn't a good idea. Sell your vag all you want. I don't look down on women who do, and no one should. Selling vag is great. Just not in the club.
I hate the extras girl because:
1) She's disgusting. Not matter how she looks. Us dancers all use the same facilities and we should not be subject to exposure to you and your customers body fluids.
2) I hate leaving home after an 6 hour shift with $175 dollars while a girl much less attractive then me leaves with $800 after working 2 hours because she fucked 4 dudes in the back and gave another 3 BJs.
3) Because no matter how I phrase it, explain it, or list my other accomplishments, every fucking romantic partner who knows I dance also directly assumes that I sell pussy and I do it at the club. Needless to say, this has caused issues with trust and respect. Shit, the whole world doesn't respect strippers because of this stereotype. We can't JUST be women who get paid to dance around in lingerie because we're beautiful. Nope, everyone thinks we're all dirty whores because some girls like you wanna "multi-task" at work.
4) You can get someone else in trouble with the law. And that's simply not fair. When the cops come around, I guarantee they won't be spending much time trying to sort through the girls who are fucking vs. the girls who aren't.
Honey, just don't do it. To consistently plan to do extras as an additional source of income in the club is dumb, and you'll eventually run into bigger issues than which other dancers "hate" you.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
We had a rabbit like you
Totally agree w everything you said, except that extras girls I don't think have anything to do w customers raping non consenting dancers. They are rational human beings capable of knowing and understanding what "no" means very well, and thats not on any other female. Just cause Jessica down the street blows you does not mean that I will..women do not come w the same boundaries and they know that damn well. I think blaming other females takes away the blame and responsibility off the shoulders of the perpetrator..grown ass men who are fully capable of comprehending NO.
Oh god, no, you're absolutely right and I didn't mean at all to feed into the rape culture bullshit that tries to excuse consent violations by blaming women instead of the perpetrator. Ignoring boundaries and "no!" is 100% on him. I just mean-- some of the situations I've been in seemed to escalate suuuuuper quick because he had the expectation that "the other girls do this, you should to". And if I didn't, then he would still push and push and then sit there all upset and angry and suddenly I'm the bad guy because I won't whip out his dick or let him touch my pussy. And if they're regular club spenders, management says "look after him, he's a very good customer for us".
Especially as a newb to the area, even though I explained my rules at the start of the dance, customers would still find a new unexpected loophole that I hadn't specified but that still pushed past my boundaries. Lots of lessons learnt the hard way, and it's been very tempting to blame the extras girls for training the customers to expect a certain level of service that shouldn't be found in a stripclub. But you're right, other women are never to blame for men violating consent. I came from a club environment where the rules were completely uniform and strictly enforced by the club, the dancers also reinforced these boundaries amongst ourselves and "self-policed", and if a customer asked for a blowie we would literally send them down the road to a brothel owned by the same company. I experienced exactly five cunt-grabs in four years. Here, it's a good night if my pussy "only" gets grabbed once in a night.
I miss having that "structural" support of a clean club environment, and I'm super duper grateful to this forum for filling that support gap and teaching me how to be confident in defending my own boundaries. My nightly mantra now: If you give an inch, the customer will take a mile.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
PS
As an interesting sidenote to the legality aspect, on my US immigration paperwork it specifically asked:
3. Have you EVER:
a. Within the past 10 years been a prostitute or procured anyone for prostitution, or intend to engage in such
activities in the future?
TEN YEARS! Regardless of whether prostitution is legal in the immigrant's country of birth! It blows my mind. Additionally, "prostitution" is very, very vaguely defined by this state's laws. "Sexual conduct"? Wtf even is that?
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
I hate extras girls because they screw with my money. I have "Dave" come see me twice a week and get few dances or a champagne room with me but one day he comes in and I'm not there. DO he dances with "Angel". Angel gave him a blow job (no condom/nasty) for no extra money or for $a $40 tip. "Dave" never came back to see me because instead of a nice sexy 1/2 hour dance with me, he got head from her. Also, when she didn't swallow his jizz, she spit it on the side of the couch (or on the curtain, whatever). Please, just go be an escort and let us "dancers" just dance.
Also, now every guy that has gotten a hand job from "angel" will expect it from me when I take him in the back. Just NO.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
I have no problem making money where some girls are doing extras. I don't judge them at all. I'll let them do what they want to, or have to, do. Sometimes I feel it's less of an insecurity thing and can be more of a financial security thing. How do I know she doesn't have babies to feed? What if she's about to lose her house? I mean, maybe she wants to be a clean stripper but times are hard for her and she's desperate. I don't know her story, I don't judge. I make my money, I make GOOD money. So I don't care.
Also, can I let it be known that "whore" and "prostitute" are slurs? The term FSSW (full service sex worker) or escort is preferred. I'm on mobile and don't feel like going into huge detail as to why.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Anya_briel
I have no problem making money where some girls are doing extras. I don't judge them at all. I'll let them do what they want to, or have to, do. Sometimes I feel it's less of an insecurity thing and can be more of a financial security thing. How do I know she doesn't have babies to feed? What if she's about to lose her house? I mean, maybe she wants to be a clean stripper but times are hard for her and she's desperate. I don't know her story, I don't judge. I make my money, I make GOOD money. So I don't care.
Also, can I let it be known that "whore" and "prostitute" are slurs? The term FSSW (full service sex worker) or escort is preferred. I'm on mobile and don't feel like going into huge detail as to why.
This is pretty exactly what I think as well.
I have never worked anywhere where I felt like I was expected to do extras because other girls were. I understand this isn't the same everywhere though. The girls who do extras in my area are generally discrete, clean up after themselves and their customers and charge a good sum of money for their services.
I wish we could all just sit around and gossip with each other while men spent money on us just for being awesome. I wish we were all rained on every night. I wish we didn't have rent or hungry babies or dead beat partners or illnesses. But we do and people do what they feel like they have to do. Yeah backpage is a thing but I can understand why a lot of girls don't want to go that route. The fact that girls find a sense of security in clubs doing this type of work, primarily because strip clubs are regulated and legal, goes to show that all sex work should be legalized and that's what we should all be advocating for.
I'm happy to have a work place where I can go and just make money from dancing, and I would be upset if that started to change, but I don't think of extras girls as my arch enemies. I care far more about asshole management and shitty customers, who affect my earnings A LOT more than anyone doing extras.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
I just want to point out that I used "whore" in a way that summarized how people feel about us in this industry. I wasn't calling sex workers "whores." I'm well aware of how dangerous this type of language is for sex workers and for women in general. But, honestly, I'm not gonna lie.... I can't keep up with every minor, politically-correct phrasing of stuff nowadays..... But, I see your point.
And I will never judge the desperate sex worker. I think almost ALL of us have been there before. I think we can all emphathize with the woman who is willing to take a few risks to ensure that everything is taken care of at the end of the day. I admire her. I am her. That's one of the most beautiful things about this job. The ability to pick up a few shifts and be able to re-build or stabilize your life.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
LegoMoney
I just want to point out that I used "whore" in a way that summarized how people feel about us in this industry. I wasn't calling sex workers "whores." I'm well aware of how dangerous this type of language is for sex workers and for women in general. But, honestly, I'm not gonna lie.... I can't keep up with every minor, politically-correct phrasing of stuff nowadays..... But, I see your point.
And I will never judge the desperate sex worker. I think almost ALL of us have been there before. I think we can all emphathize with the woman who is willing to take a few risks to ensure that everything is taken care of at the end of the day. I admire her. I am her. That's one of the most beautiful things about this job. The ability to pick up a few shifts and be able to re-build or stabilize your life.
I have danced since I was 18. I am now 25. I am in MD/PhD program but I mention this not to brag, just to lay down the fact that I'm not stupid. With that being said it took me at least two years to learn how to jerk off a guy's wallet and not his dick. I have mentioned previously and I believe it was in this thread that the hustle everyone speaks of is a "learned" skill and I believe comes with maturity. I cannot fault anyone who doesn't have that skill or that maturity because I've been there and I just did not know any better or any different. I feel like I am at Catholic confession (and I'm not even Catholic) but I am admitting all of this in an attempt to let everyone know that every one of us has been propositioned at some point in our career. Please don't say you are so cool that that has never happened to you. I don't care if you have danced for John Kennedy, Barack Obama, Donald Trump or Wyatt Earp you have been asked to provide extras. I didn't even learn how to say no when I first started. When I meet a newbie instead of telling her that she is such a slimeball, I try to teach her how to say no but even better, never get in the position to have to say no.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Why stop sugaring and escorting if you're just going to try to do the same thing in the club? At least with those you aren't messing up other girls' money.
If you do decide to go forward with dancing at least see how you'll do first without having to resort to extras. You're on this site so I know you've been in Hustle Hut, if you study that and perfect your look, persona, etc you won't have to go with the easy way out.
These guys don't deserve that level of intimacy for $100. And if you do find a big spender that becomes a regular of yours, take the extra activities outside of the club.
P.s. interesting to see your tone change from your first post about how you'd do extras for the right price, now seeing one of your later post about extras girls being, desperate and insecure..a step in the right direction I suppose and keep that sentiment in the back of your head when/if an offer comes about. Good luck!
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Alibby-not certain if your reply was addressed to me. I'm the one who would screw a orangutan for $10 million.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Exactly how I feel! OP I wish you luck and courage in navigating how to set boundaries in the club :) we were all baby strippers once and had to learn and it was a scary lonely steep learning curve for many! :s
tHIS
I cannot fault anyone who doesn't have that skill or that maturity because I've been there and I just did not know any better or any different. I feel like I am at Catholic confession (and I'm not even Catholic) but I am admitting all of this in an attempt to let everyone know that every one of us has been propositioned at some point in our career. Please don't say you are so cool that that has never happened to you. I don't care if you have danced for John Kennedy, Barack Obama, Donald Trump or Wyatt Earp you have been asked to provide extras. I didn't even learn how to say no when I first started. When I meet a newbie instead of telling her that she is such a slimeball, I try to teach her how to say no but even better, never get in the position to have to say no.[/QUOTE]
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
thanks Mishi, Anya, and Layla for ur insights from a more different point of view!!
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Good luck, I'll be keeping my eyes out to see any updates you have on your first strip club experiences!
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
I don't know if it's what she meant but from what I read it seems the O.P wants a clubs where extras are not the norm, but she can do them for the right price without competition?
As someone who danced for 10 years, extras in the club, and strippers who go out to perform them after the club with club customers messed with both mine and my Escort friends money.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Personally I have no problem with prostitution, escorting, sugaring or anything and I've considered them all at one point or another. This being said I work in a club that tries hard to be clean and weed out extras girls. I get upset when there are extras girls for a few reasons.
1, they put me in legal jeopardy. I don't know what I'd do if I got arrested because someone else broke the law near me.
2, when girls push their boundaries near me it puts me in a difficult position. In my club it's contact, pasties and g-string. They aren't supposed to touch the privates, boobs or butt. Girls shouldn't be touching dicks at all besides from just grinding on them. When I'm talking to a group and a girl comes over and starts grabbing one guy's dick and talking about it the guy I'm talking to starts to wonder why I'm not touching him more, and if does a dance with me he'll probably expect more since we saw that done on the floor.
One thing that infuriates me is when a girl breaks the law with me in the dance with her. This happened tonight, actually. The other girl had no pasties and was moaning like crazy when he touched her breasts. I had pasties on and moved away as soon as he grabbed at my boobs. Usually I can tell a guy hes not allowed to touch me there and point to the cameras if he doesn't believe me. I like a more firm approach so I don't have to keep dodging hands all night, but I can't really say that when nothing was being done about this girl and she had no problem with it.
I just wish that clean clubs could stay that way and girls who wanted to do more could do it on their own or in a brothel. I understand we all have to make our money someway, but you don't need to endanger other people to do it.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
I think for most of us the number one concern is the safety. Sometimes LE discreetly comes in and tries to catch girls, but other times, if Club X is a known haven for illegal activity, they'll just come in and grab everyone. Obviously if you were working there, you're okay with the activities- guilt by association.
The other key problem is IF a girl is doing "extras" which are literally called "extras" she should be CHARGING EXTRA. If a room is $500 and we are both selling the room for $500 but she wants another $250 for the blow job or whatever, I'd still rather that wasn't happening, but at least it's not an obvious deal.
Part of the reason girls do extras is that stripping, but also escorting, are hard jobs. Making bigger money as a stripper, selling air dance rooms, etc, has a pretty steep learning curve. There's a skill set that many girls don't want/aren't able to learn. It's easier to just offer up additional services as part of the deal. On the escorting side, there is a ton of advertising, research, networking, and background checks, that a lot of girls don't care to do or don't realize that they should do.
I'm off on a tangent here but I worry sometimes that with the advent of the internet and stripping sort of becoming a ~cool~ job to do we end up with a lot more girls who completely lack any sort of street smarts. LE can bust you in a club just as easily as off of backpage, and they happily break all those little rules they are supposed to follow to arrest you. Lots of girls get arrested AFTER sexual services have been provided, so the old "oh he's willing to show me his dick he can't be a cop thing" isn't real.
I always write about extras as sexual services but up here it's all air dances/one way contact, so when girls get angry about 'dirty dancers" I never know if it was somebody having sex with a customer or somebody letting a guy touch their leg lol. But both will get you a huge-ass fine. A girl grabbed a liquor board undercover's crotch through his pants here a few years ago and the fine was at least $3k.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperJa
The other key problem is IF a girl is doing "extras" which are literally called "extras" she should be CHARGING EXTRA. If a room is $500 and we are both selling the room for $500 but she wants another $250 for the blow job or whatever, I'd still rather that wasn't happening, but at least it's not an obvious deal.
This. Also, even if you are charging extra, we can't see that. It needs to at least APPEAR to our customers that you are charging much more (i.e., do it in the CR at LEAST, where hopefully our customers can't see it anyway), to negate the snowballing damage to the clientele.
That is the problem at 2/3 main clubs I've worked in Phx. One literally had no champagne room at all, and the other the CR never gets sold between girls who don't know how & poor pricing setup that keeps $20 dances more profitable. The girls then do their extras deals in the $20/$25 VIP rooms, next to clean girls, and then customers start thinking that's part of the deal with $20 dances... Even if the girl did charge more, he doesn't know that.
Onto her next point... a lot of girls at my club are dumb as fuck and don't charge more anyway because they use it as a bartering chip since they have no conversational skills to sell with. Don't be like them.
Say you have 2 options that come out to the extra $100 an ITC blow job might net you. 1) Take a month of listening to some 'how to win people over' and 'sales & negotiation' type audiobooks on your way to work & reading Hustle Hut, and learn how to upsell a little bit... you don't even have to sell a CR, just keep dudes in for more dances at a time or upsell to a slightly pricier dance. 2) Put a stranger's dick in your mouth & risk STDs, arrest, getting fired, problems with other girls, & whatever psychological damage you might end up with. Which option is better? Yeah, I thought so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperJa
LE can bust you in a club just as easily as off of backpage, and they happily break all those little rules they are supposed to follow to arrest you.
Yep. He's drinking beer, he's not wearing XYZ shoes, he took out his dick... nope. Cops will break all the rules and then lie. Get a conservative judge who hates sex work, and he may not even have to lie, they won't care if the girls got any sort of fair warning. They are apparently immune to the rules the rest of us have to follow... I've sat in court while one blatantly lied on the stand while under oath, ffs. You will never get a fair shake if a cop is involved, and there really isn't any way to identify them in the club since you can't screen or check references or anything the escorts have on their side.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
My two issues with extra girls are:
1) they take away money from non-extra girls. I hate when anyone messes with my money.
2) when girls are giving extras in the club, that man and his friends will expect the same from every dancer in the club. I hate that. Can't stand that. Pisses me off to no end.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
But really it fucks our money up. I make as much as you without all that
(My bad)
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Jaylenn
Exactly why strip clubs & exotic dancers are losing its value . Why pay $1k on a room with no sexual favors when they can just get it for a couple of hundred bucks... I make good money as a dancer & regularly make around $1k a night... But from what older dancers tell me is that years ago, that would be laughable & considered a bad night to only make that much . & I can't help thinking dancers who provide extras are to blame (along with other things that has taken place throughout the years)
My issue with dancers who provide extras is that they are changing the game entirely, slowly but surely . It is no longer truly Exotic Dancing . & too many escorts are in the clubs trying to pick up business... Go to a brothel . Why make minimum as an escort trying to gather business inside of a strip club when you can go to a legal brothel & make $1k or so per session . I don't get it .
Because they are hiding behind the legal status strip clubs offer. They use the relative safety of the club staff and crowd vs being on a corner or being locked in a room alone with some random. They gaslight strippers into feeling guilty for judging them on their illegal, cutthroat, manipulative behaviors by giving us one new name--sex workers. So over the last 10 years we've gone from banding together to root out people having sex in the club to being shamed if we don't see ourselves as sister sex workers who should let a sister do her thing in peace.It's a one way street,dealing with extras girls. No one enjoys dealing with people who are using you, and destroying your livelihood but pretending they aren't.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
gummygirl
They get AIDS and Pass it on....
Jk
But really it fucks our money up. I make as much as you without all that
I have friends who are HIV positive. HIV is not AIDS.
So you're stupid and not funny.
Everyone is annoyed and offended by the extras girls no need to be hateful and dumb.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
vanessa_mtl
I have friends who are HIV positive. HIV is not AIDS.
So you're stupid and not funny.
Everyone is annoyed and offended by the extras girls no need to be hateful and dumb.
Yikes just joking...
I'm friends with the "extras girls"
Sorry about that ..
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Without the "johns" and dudes who buy extras in the club over otc/escorts as well as seedy managers/owners who collect a cut/profit of said extras then the extras would not occur. Extras girls aren't the only ones perpetuating the extras market.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
Unfortunately, in the real world where a stripclub is supposed to be all about the strip tease, it's mostly filled with extras and prostitution. The manority are the actual strippers and the majority are the actual prostitutes. Greed rules in this material world.
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Re: why does everyone hate "extras" girls?
It's counterintuitive to the purpose of stripping. Stripping is supposed to be about entertaining, teasing, and selling a fantasy of sex and being "attainable". If you're actually delivering this fantasy, why not become an escort or a sugar baby? Girls who provide extras, especially girls who provide CHEAP extras, make it harder for clean dancers to make money. You might be a gorgeous, clean dancer who is charging $500 for a half-hour champagne room, but this other girl is going to have sex in the champagne room for $200 and the beer goggles have kicked in. As crass as this saying is, "a hole is a hole" ...I'm convinced a lot of men believe that. Providing extras also hurts the strip club industry because this behavior comes to be expected. I work in Miami and full on sex in the champagne room is so commonplace that it's practically expected among locals.
Additionally, extras girls put the entire club and the clean dancers at risk. It only takes one dumb bitch to open her mouth an undercover cop, and the whole club is raided and shut down. Certainly not a situation I want to get caught up in...