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What's going on in Ukraine?
I'm an idiot and I'm not getting why this is all even happening to begin with? I think this is a good thread because heck, who knows if this is gonna be a legit WW3 at some point and I don't wanna wake up last to the grocery store or gas station trying to stock up lol.
Hopefully the blue's on this site can chillax on their posting and keep this thread civil so it doesn't get locked.
I was watching the news where Biden said he wouldn't be having any US troops heading over there and now they are sending 7,000 troops to Europe. I'm lost with all of this and would like to be prepared in advance if things get really bad for us here lol. So sad hearing people are leaving to Poland to escape their current hell over there. I only have whatever info is posted on youtube to keep me updated.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Total disaster is happening I would say. Political games are very strong and cruel sometimes...
Personally, I read DW news:
There is a brief intake to the news
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Idk.
My 1 guy friend (TV news addict) been talking about it, but I'm dealing w/whirlerz world so.. Is there a Cliff's Notes for it?
Ya know what, I'm going to text him now, see what he says
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
I texted him, waiting, he's probably napping...
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
I don’t know a lot about geopolitics, but I know enough that innocent people are suffering just so that this strong man can engage in a prick waving contest on the world stage.
I’m not sure how I feel about America being the world police when we don’t have our own house in order, but it’s heartbreaking to do nothing. I hope the sanctions buy us time and slow down Russia.
I’m wondering about the profiteering that comes from war and how that effects Americans decision to engage in war.
“For two years before the surprise attack on Pearl Harbor brought America into World War II in December 1941, the nation had been on the edges of global conflict…”
https://www.historyextra.com/period/...bor-roosevelt/
If Russia invades a NATO country it will start world war 3, and Putin’s been cozying up with China. It definitely could be the start of world war 3.
Just when we we’re getting over the pandemic and getting back to normal. Sigh. We’ve entered a new era we can’t go back.
Im sure the blues will have some good insight.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
My friend said lots of bombing, & looks like it's going on for a while..
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Putin has been trying to annex the Ukraine for a long time.
It might be his swan song as a leader.
Say a prayer for the people who are going to pass away prematurely in this mess.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
whirlerz
Idk.
My 1 guy friend (TV news addict) been talking about it, but I'm dealing w/whirlerz world so.. Is there a Cliff's Notes for it?
Ya know what, I'm going to text him now, see what he says
Exactly how I feel about it! I need a Cliff's Notes LOLLL
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
They are moving ground forces into position in the Ukraine while they bomb Kyiv (the capital) and a bunch of other cities. They also recently occupied the Chernobyl site, which is very close to the capital.
Many analysts believe that they are trying to topple the government in order to install their own puppet government. To me this makes the most sense. It is hard to imagine that Russia could sustain a permanent occupation force large enough to actually absorb a country that size. It is the second largest country in Europe by land size with 44 million people.
Ever since the Soviet Union collapsed Russia has felt a sense of ownership of Ukraine. IMO they were just waiting for the right conditions to take even more of the country than they did when they annexed Crimea from the Ukraine in 2014. Apparently they feel that the time is right now.
We have applied sanctions, but they are mediocre ones at best. We actually could do 2 things right now that would absolutely cripple the Russian economy - place an embargo on their fossil fuel exports and kick them off of the SWIFT global banking network. This would utterly devastate them, but we won't do it because it would also hurt some of our European allies who do business with Russia and rely upon it for heating fuel, so instead we're nibbling at the edges. After all, while we care about Ukraine, we don't really care about them that much.
We are currently sending troops to other countries near the Ukraine who are part of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), including Poland, Latvia and Lithuania. We aren't sending many so it's mostly symbolic, but is designed to make a point to Russia and our allies that we will not tolerate Russian aggression in any country we are sworn to defend. Ukraine is not part of NATO, though it has been begging for 14 years to be admitted, lol.
I don't think that is going to spill much past the Ukraine. He'd have to be insane to attack a NATO country. More than anything it is something to boost his popularity and strengthen his political position with the Russian population, which overwhelmingly supports his invasion of Ukraine. Nationalist pride is strong in Russia and the collapse of the Soviet Union still stings in the hearts of many.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
I read this
For those who ask: “Why does Ukraine matter? “
This is why Ukraine matters.
It is the second largest country by area in Europe by area and has a population
of over 40 million - more than Poland.
Ukraine ranks:
1st in Europe in proven recoverable reserves of uranium ores;
2nd place in Europe and 10th place in the world in terms of titanium ore reserves;
2nd place in the world in terms of explored reserves of manganese ores (2.3 billion tons, or 12% of the world's reserves);
2nd largest iron ore reserves in the world (30 billion tons);
2nd place in Europe in terms of mercury ore reserves;
3rd place in Europe (13th place in the world) in shale gas reserves (22 trillion cubic meters)
4th in the world by the total value of natural resources;
7th place in the world in coal reserves (33.9 billion tons)
Ukraine is an important agricultural country:
1st in Europe in terms of arable land area;
3rd place in the world by the area of black soil (25% of world's volume);
1st place in the world in exports of sunflower and sunflower oil;
2nd place in the world in barley production and 4th place in barley exports;
3rd largest producer and 4th largest exporter of corn in the world;
4th largest producer of potatoes in the world;
5th largest rye producer in the world;
5th place in the world in bee production (75,000 tons);
8th place in the world in wheat exports;
9th place in the world in the production of chicken eggs;
16th place in the world in cheese exports.
Ukraine can meet the food needs of 600 million people.
Ukraine is an important industrialised country:
1st in Europe in ammonia production;
Europe's 2nd’s and the world’s 4th largest natural gas pipeline system;
3rd largest in Europe and 8th largest in the world in terms of installed capacity of nuclear power plants;
3rd place in Europe and 11th in the world in terms of rail network length (21,700 km);
3rd place in the world (after the U.S. and France) in production of locators and locating equipment;
3rd largest iron exporter in the world
4th largest exporter of turbines for nuclear power plants in the world;
4th world's largest manufacturer of rocket launchers;
4th place in the world in clay exports
4th place in the world in titanium exports
8th place in the world in exports of ores and concentrates;
9th place in the world in exports of defence industry products;
10th largest steel producer in the world (32.4 million tons).
Ukraine matters. That is why its independence is important to the rest of the world.
https://scontent-dfw5-2.xx.fbcdn.net...cw&oe=621D8290
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
^^^I think the fact they’re suffering human beings is enough to care, but we have to have to be rational about what America can do and it’s responsibility to another country.
Innocent people are suffering because of the rich and powerful. Those who declare war won’t suffer nearly as much as the people they send to do their dirty work.
Putin is acting like a crazy ex trying to get his ex wife back.
From my understanding we can expect cyberattacks, so change your passwords everyone.
I have a feeling this is going to get worse in the world before it gets better.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
moneybags
^^^I think the fact they’re suffering human beings is enough to care, but we have to be rational about his we react.
So basically Putin is acting like a crazy ex trying to get his ex wife back.
I’m done following this I have to take a break from the news. It’s heartbreaking. From my understanding we can expect cyberattacks, so change your passwords everyone.
I have a feeling this is going to get worse before it gets better.
Basically this is it.
I've been a news junkie all my life so my personal opinion is, some parts of the globe are always going to be troubled. In Putin's mind I'm sure he thinks he's doing a good thing.
To be blunt everyone in my world is whining about how the conflict is going to increase the cost of gasoline, heating fuel, maybe even food. Ahhhh Americans.
I feel tremendous sadness for the soldiers. There are better ways to resolve these differences, but governments and DICTATORS are going to do what they do.
& To be brutally honest, the United States cannot police other nations all the time. Not everyone wants our help or version of democracy.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
137 civilians & military personnel killed so far :(
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
moneybags
^^^I think the fact they’re suffering human beings is enough to care, but we have to have to be rational about what America can do and it’s responsibility to another country.
Innocent people are suffering because of the rich and powerful. Those who declare war won’t suffer nearly as much as the people they send to do their dirty work.
Putin is acting like a crazy ex trying to get his ex wife back.
From my understanding we can expect cyberattacks, so change your passwords everyone.
I have a feeling this is going to get worse in the world before it gets better.
I heard something about the cyberattacks too. It freaks me out that they could do something like hack our banks and shut them down causing everyone in the US to panic. I just don't see this going well for some reason and we'll all be back on zoom in a bunker months from now LOL. Obviously I don't know that much at all.
I am at least grateful Biden warned those in the USA in Europe to go home before this all started before they got stuck there.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
whirlerz
137 civilians & military personnel killed so far :(
Oh god! It was at like 40 people this morning. This is not good :(.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
indiegirl
I heard something about the cyberattacks too. It freaks me out that they could do something like hack our banks and shut them down causing everyone in the US to panic. I just don't see this going well for some reason and we'll all be back on zoom in a bunker months from now LOL. Obviously I don't know that much at all.
I am at least grateful Biden warned those in the USA in Europe to go home before this all started before they got stuck there.
Last year, Russian hackers shut down one of our oil pipelines.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Alexei Navalany, jailed opposition leader, spoke of what are Putin's true reasons for this conflict. Distraction from domestic issues including his trial. Russia cannot afford a new USSR
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
I'm old enough to remember hearing and reading the horror stories about what life was REALLY like for Russian citizens under Communist rule.
Putin is a holdover from the KGB, & all that implies.
To me the sickest thing is Putin already factored in how to minimize the impact of how many Russian soldiers are going to get killed, and he will obviously downplay the Ukrainian soldier and civilian deaths.
Related topic- yes the Russian troll farms on the Internet have been a phenomenon to behold. If anything shortens the duration of this military action, it'll be outcry from people with information gotten from Internet news sources. IE the young people of Russia.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rickdugan
They are moving ground forces into position in the Ukraine while they bomb Kyiv (the capital) and a bunch of other cities. They also recently occupied the Chernobyl site, which is very close to the capital.
Many analysts believe that they are trying to topple the government in order to install their own puppet government. To me this makes the most sense. It is hard to imagine that Russia could sustain a permanent occupation force large enough to actually absorb a country that size. It is the second largest country in Europe by land size with 44 million people.
Ever since the Soviet Union collapsed Russia has felt a sense of ownership of Ukraine. IMO they were just waiting for the right conditions to take even more of the country than they did when they annexed Crimea from the Ukraine in 2014. Apparently they feel that the time is right now.
We have applied sanctions, but they are mediocre ones at best. We actually could do 2 things right now that would absolutely cripple the Russian economy - place an embargo on their fossil fuel exports and kick them off of the SWIFT global banking network. This would utterly devastate them, but we won't do it because it would also hurt some of our European allies who do business with Russia and rely upon it for heating fuel, so instead we're nibbling at the edges. After all, while we care about Ukraine, we don't really care about them that much.
We are currently sending troops to other countries near the Ukraine who are part of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO), including Poland, Latvia and Lithuania. We aren't sending many so it's mostly symbolic, but is designed to make a point to Russia and our allies that we will not tolerate Russian aggression in any country we are sworn to defend. Ukraine is not part of NATO, though it has been begging for 14 years to be admitted, lol.
I don't think that is going to spill much past the Ukraine. He'd have to be insane to attack a NATO country. More than anything it is something to boost his popularity and strengthen his political position with the Russian population, which overwhelmingly supports his invasion of Ukraine. Nationalist pride is strong in Russia and the collapse of the Soviet Union still stings in the hearts of many.
I do agree with most of this...except the last part. In December there was like 9% support for war from within Russia. take a look at the protests. Perhaps it doesn't seem like much but all are risking being arrested
https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...-dont-want-it/
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Kam that December information might be dated. Here is a more recent snippet from one source, but I've seen others as well:
"Russia’s military buildup along the Ukrainian border over the last few months coincides with a steady rise in Putin’s popularity.
Approximately 69% of Russians now approve of Putin, compared to the 61% who approved of him in August 2021, according to Russian polling agency the Levada Center. And 29% of Russians disapprove of Putin, down from 37% in August 2021. The polling group is the leading independent sociological research organization in Russia and is widely respected by many scholars, including myself.
Support for Russian Prime Minister Mikhail Mishustin and his cabinet also increased moderately in the same time period.
The Russian public largely believes that the Kremlin is defending Russia by standing up to the West."
https://theconversation.com/putins-p...to-last-177302
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
rickdugan
Kam that December information might be dated. Here is a more recent snippet from one source, but I've seen others as well:
"Russia’s military buildup along the Ukrainian border over the last few months coincides with a steady rise in Putin’s popularity.
Approximately 69% of Russians now approve of Putin, compared to the 61% who approved of him in August 2021, according to Russian polling agency the Levada Center. And 29% of Russians disapprove of Putin, down from 37% in August 2021. The polling group is the leading independent sociological research organization in Russia and is widely respected by many scholars, including myself.
Support for Russian Prime Minister Mikhail Mishustin and his cabinet also increased moderately in the same time period.
The Russian public largely believes that the Kremlin is defending Russia by standing up to the West."
https://theconversation.com/putins-p...to-last-177302
I don't think poll numbers from Russia will ever be perfect, just wanted to point out there in no one "russian" opinion it is very grey. During a conflict, however, with state run media blasting the new message, with arrests being made, I give them less attention. While we are in crisis our support for leaders goes up as well. Just polling. It is better to look at trends, which often had putin at high approval during a conflict vs before and after. People of Russia seem to be shocked by his actions as well. This is a Kremlin leadership position.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Kiev is a beautiful place - I have a favorite hotel which I hope will still be standing. In some ways it is an old world city.
When I hear about wars, I always lament that these idiots are destroying priceless history and the lives of children. Even if children don't die, and their parents don't die, they have a lifetime of remembering the fear and the bombs. This is an outdated, insane strategy by Putin. Some very serious perceived or real threat must have happened to make him lose his mind like this.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Bahuba
Kiev is a beautiful place - I have a favorite hotel which I hope will still be standing. In some ways it is an old world city.
When I hear about wars, I always lament that these idiots are destroying priceless history and the lives of children. Even if children don't die, and their parents don't die, they have a lifetime of remembering the fear and the bombs. This is an outdated, insane strategy by Putin. Some very serious perceived or real threat must have happened to make him lose his mind like this.
I hear that, but I don't see this as crazy or erratic. Indeed I see this as cold and calculated timing. Russia has always wanted Ukraine back in the fold. Indeed it thinks about Ukraine almost the same way that China thinks about Taiwan.
IMO annexing Crimea in 2014 was a test run. He got away with it, but it was pretty clear at that time that the U.S. and Europe were going to consider more extreme responses (including truly severe sanctions) if he went further. So he stopped.
Since then he has continued to rebuild and modernize Russia's military while also fostering increased European dependence on Russian natural gas. Now, with it's military ready and Europe docile because it is now afraid to lose it's access to Russian fuel, all he needed was to be sure that the U.S. would not react too drastically.
Trump probably wouldn't have cared about Europe's mixed feelings if Putin tried this on his watch. He might have also sent even more serious military hardware to Ukraine on top of the javelin missiles he did send. Responses like a true fossil fuel embargo and being kicked off the SWFT banking system (which the Trump Administration did to Iran) would have been truly devastating to Russia. So Putin waited.
Now we have an Administration that prefers a multi-lateral and multi-national response to aggression. I'm not opining as to whether this is good or bad, but it means that other variables come into play. Europe does not support truly severe sanctions because of the pain it would also experience as a result and the current U.S. Administration is not inclined to bulldoze this stuff through unilaterally.
Putin has been testing the waters for weeks by building up troops on the border and engaging in meetings with various world leaders. You can be sure that he was using those moments to assess the likely extent of the potential responses to an aggressive move. Once he became certain that the combined US/EU response would be manageable, that's all she wrote.
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Re: What's going on in Ukraine?
I feel so bad for all of the innocent civilians involved, especially children and animals. I've been watching some of the live footage from Ukraine on TikTok and it's heartbreaking. I can't imagine the type of fear I'd feel if this were happening to me, on my home turf. I'll be making a point to hold on to my cash, and filling up my gas tank while prices are still low (compared to what they're going to be).