Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
DEVASTATING- No he is not!
1. The women who pose for and work for Playboy
are fairly paid.
2. No one is forced to work for him.
3. The women are always free to leave and go on to
something else - most do.
4. Playboy today is mainstream, middle-class.
5. A very few ex-Playmates and ex-models do
escort work but Hef does not get a cut.
BTW- Why don't YOU explain how you or anyone else
would equate Hugh Hefner with a pimp?
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
I consider a pimp a businessman. Not an ethical one but a businessman nonetheless.
I agree with you Divyne, I think Hugh is one hell of a smart, rich pimp.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Well shit, he lives with like 5 bunnies at once and sleeps with them all (cribs, MTV) THAT seems like a "pimp" to me... but he's also definately a business man.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
I don't think so. I still see "pimp" as a man who buys sex. I mean pays for a actual sex act. I don't think Hef pays any of the ladies to have sex with him, he does not have to! And if we call him a Pimp because they live there free (pretty much) and get cars etc. Well what about the man who takes care of his Gf, or a female friend who needs help with a place to live? Or sells her pictures on eBay for example.
I mean the guy has a magazine, pretty tame, and a mansion where ladies come and go. I don't think that throws him in the "pimp" world.
We can break all this down to a man who takes a woman out for a great dinner and theater after. Then they sleep together. Some will say he just bought her.
No i disagree. Hugh Hefner, A business man.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Quote:
I still see "pimp" as a man who buys sex. I mean pays for a actual sex act. I don't think Hef pays any of the ladies to have sex with him, he does not have to!
Actually Pam, a man who buys sex is a "John." A pimp provides the lady who provides the sex to the "John". The pimp "protects" her clothes her feeds her pays her bills blah blah blah all that good shit. The pimp collects the money. So in a distorted sense we could say that while Hugh provides healthy compensation for his playmates, he is the one making the REAL $$$$$$$ through his magazine sales, videos, whatever else. That's my opinion anyway.
And while I"m sure Hugh NEVER pays a woman to have sex with him, I'll bet he can be quite generous with salaries, gifts, perks!
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Ok forget the first sentence. That throws in alot of guys who are are taking care of women. Seemingly harmless, but some may look at this as a "pimp" then. They can buy them dinner or a car etc.
But do these guys helping these ladies out pimp them, i don't see it that way. Or are they "johns"
Hugh Hefner makes money off these women for posing nude, and making appearances, but the ladies get paid very well.
Look at strip clubs. The owner makes money off of every dancer!
Some would call working in a strip club being a whore, and the owner/manager is nothing more than a pimp.
I see lots of examples. But i don't believe this is "pimping." It's business.
Anything sex related, and a man/ women recieves money could be called a "pimp' i think thats too far fetched.
Am i pimping myself out to the owner of the webcam site, i am nude and "johns" pay to see me, but the "pimp gets his big cut ?
And phone sex, when a guy send me a present for my services ?
There are way too many examples of may/maynot be Pimping.
I still see this as business. Not Pimping.
I understand what you say, i started going on a different path there! Lol
We have our opinions, i don't see it. Too many people in this world need a place to stay at one time or another, and a man will take care of a women. Clothes, food a home. She may even let him take pictures if he is a photographer, but thats not a pimp. To me.
Thanks Sapphire, for the heads up on my Pimp/john mess up! *goofy me*
PS shit Hugh sleeps with them and pays them after all, gifts, a home, cars, furs money for shopping etc. Sounds like a Pimp. But i don't see it that way, again. Too many kind people give to others and let them into their homes, they end up in bed because they are attracted to one another. Hugh aside, he makes fantastic money offthe ladies. Other people make their share too, be it gifts or money.
Does he provide the women for sex ? No. Not a pimp in my book. And his mansion is not a whore house.
Again hun, my opinion!
Pamela :)
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
It takes a very loose definition of "pimp" to include
Hefner, Guccione and strip-club owners. Of the three,
the most exploitative are probably SOME club-owners
and yet to me they are not pimps. I haven't heard of
any where girls are forced to dance; where they are
physically threatened and/or where they are not free
to leave. BTW- it is possible that such places exist; I
just haven't heard or read about them.
The ONLY Playboy Playmate with anything negative to
say about Playboy is Teri Weigel ( Miss March '86)
because they supposedly would not help her after
she was in a car accident and unable to work for
about a year. She SAYS that's why she turned to
porn.
Same thing for Guccione AFAIK.
Club owners range from genuinely caring gentlemen
who treat the dancers fairly to total a-holes who
don't give a rat's dropping.
All three benefit from naked women on display.
So do Hollywood film producers. So do owners of
Vegas hotels. It's far less of a one-way street than
your typical pimp. The pimp is supposed to provide
"protection" yet sex workers are raped, beaten up
and even killed every day.So they 're not doing a very
good job.Some are supposed to provide housing and/or the place to "do business". I don't know about elsewhere but in NY it almost always means a rathole apt. with mattresses on the floor. Who can seriously compare that to the Playboy Mansion?
Hefner is a businessman with a lifestyle that suits him.
(I'd like to try it for a month but eventually I'd get
bored.) Show me how he UNFAIRLY takes advantage
of and exploits women and I'll rethink whether or not
he's a pimp.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Gotta agree with Kid here. Sure he could be a pimp in that the corporation pays women to be nude in pics, travel, and many stick around to be "girlfriends". But my definition of a pimp - either high class or low class - cornor or penthouse - is where there is an exploitation not an agreement where both benefit.
He's a capitalist not a pimp. Pimps promise and don't deliver on it. Sure, does he "use" the women....no doubt....but they are being enriched here too. The women, and especially the many "girlfriends" use him for the mansion, the parties, the roles, the contacts, the future husbands, the money, the stuff, etc.....of course. That's business not "pimping".
If it's just an "understanding" like many wives and girlfriends have long had with either committed partners or otherwise, it's not the same as pimping as much as some may want to stretch it.
A pimp hustles, he leeches, he doesn't invest a thing in the business itself. He's a liar, a thief and still takes a cut. I don't see the various men in the porn industry's top layer this way necessarily.
PS: this must be in the collective consciousness right now cause the same concepts were being tossed around Hef in law school last week.
Peace,
Tiana
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Quote:
DEVASTATING- No he is not!
1. The women who pose for and work for Playboy
are fairly paid.
If all the women received was the $10,000 one time posing fee nobody would stay. I'm sure it has something to do with the extras that they get for the job. The fame, publicity and chance to boost an otherwise unsuccessful stint at being famous. It also does not hurt to b/c the girlfriend or sextoy of the owner or his friend. A la the Playboy grotto which is filled with Hugh's celeb friends and others. Does anybody think if these people weren't knocking the Playmates off that others would continue to clamor over one another to get there. The Playboy Mansion isn't the place to be just b/c pretty girls run around and play topless volleyball. There's a little more to it.
I didn't bring up clubowners b/c thats a whole different topic. The definitions of pimp given as an exploiter of wayward girls, in it only to make a profit, ultimately out for self all are true in a sense of speaking. I'm not saying Playboy exploits wayward girls, but its a fact that wayward girls often fall into the sex industry even though many do not. Playboy is a business which, like any other business, has profit as the bottom line and this profit is reached by convincing women to appear nude.
I myself like Playboy and don't think there is anything wrong with it b/c adults make their own decisions. However, I don't think its right to give a spade a different name b/c its "mainstream and middle-class". Mainstream and middle-class does not make something socially acceptable. Eminem, strictly from a demographic standpoint , is purchased by the child of the mainstream and middle-class more so than any other group and that doesn't make him any less controversial or socially acceptable. Just b/c Playboy brought the Naked Broads to the Masses doesn't mean its not still a spade.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
DEVASTATING- To me the distinctions DO have real
differences. Yes, the Playboy Mansion is an adult
playground. So what? The girls are not getting raped.
Whatever happens there is consensual.
Over time Playboy has become socially acceptable
and Hefner has become a cultural icon for many.
An argument can and has been made that Playboy
helped "liberate" women sexually by helping to show
that "nice girls" like sex too.
Bill Buckley has written for it and Rush Limbaugh was
interviewed in Playboy so it certainly IS a mainstream
publication.
To me the key factors are CHOICE and mutual benefit.
Women choose to appear in Playboy and they are
fairly compensated for doing so. A long list of women
have used it as a springboard to successful careers.
Hefner is a businessman and his overall influence
has been a positive one.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
The subject can go on forever. Anything sex related someone could call "pimping" i talked to a guy friend about his friend (lady) staying there for a time, he fed her, put clothes on her back etc. As her Bf threw her out of his home. He said she posed nude for him a few times, and he paid her. He said but to be called a pimp for putting someone up in their home, and paying to put a few nude shots on a website is strange for somone to think he's a pimp.
Then he said, if i (me) let someone pay me money to take my TV to their home and watch a Pay per view porno, that makes me a pimp. We laughed!
Sooo many examples, people and objects included.
No way, Hugh is not a pimp. First pimps don't treat the girls right. And he does not sell them out to other men. Thats a pimp.
A magazine is a little far fetched for me. Sure he makes money off their mag. shoots. Thats business.
He does not fit the profile of a "pimp." he is a business man, and loves the ladies! Gosh pimps "hate" women, don't they ? just want the $$$$.
Pamela :) :)
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
This thread brings up an interesting topic... I think most club owners are pimps too. Sure, not all pay the girl but I'm sure that some do. They have a high status in the club and as I've learned, chicks dig guys with power. Although the self-respecting ones out there wouldn't give it up, I know MANY that do. That reminds me of a scene from Showgirls... when Nomi had just finished her big show and the black guy (i forgot his name) was out there waiting for her and the creepy guy with all the hair shows up in his farrai... the black guy was like... "that's what I said, a pimp" after Nomi said "he's the ____" whatever it was he did? Director of something??
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
BELLA- if club owners are pimps- what does that make
you and your fellow dancers?????
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
The_Kid, please don't go there you will be opening up the whore argument again and destroy the thread.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
well shit, I didn't mean to ruin the thread by saying don't talk about something. Don't listen to me! Talk about whatever you want!!! ;D
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
I had a friend who posed for playboy and spent time at the mansion. She was told anytime guests were coming and to "accomodate" and "entertain" them. My opinion? Hef is a pimp.
Playboy recruits hundreds of girls every week at LA hotspots. They are invited to a brunch at the mansion and are introduced to the system. Employees choose their favorites and they get a call back. If a girl is choosen as centerfold they are required to stay at the mansion for a month (? could be longer) and only get paid a few thousand dollars. During that time they become "cultured" into the mansion system - living with the other ladies, partying with business men and celebrities, and actually own very little. That puts people in a very controlled group-think environment. If you know how a whorehouse is ran or how pimps keep control over their women it is strikingly similar. I won't break it all down, but creating and maintaining that environment is key to Hef's scene and success.
Don't get me wrong...I don't hate on him for what he does - everyone still chooses that route - but it's not innocent from any side. I don't envy the man or his work.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Thanks for the info. I was not aware that all this took place. Does not sound like much fun to me.
Pamela
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Rush Limbaugh's a heroin addict and Huey is a pimp. [shocked] That's my opinion!
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
I never said the guy was a saint BUT if the Mansion is
really a cat-house, SO WHAT? Unless someone can
show me that force or coercion is being used, Who
cares?
BTW- my understanding is that Playmates get paid
$25,000 and they live at a luxurious mansion and
get waited on hand and foot for a month! The poor
dears!
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
The_Kid, why do you feel that force or coercion is necessary in order to label someone a pimp?
And you're right, if the mansion is a cat-house I don't think any of us really CARE. It would just give strength to the opinion that Hugh is a pimp.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
What i did not know was that the ladies live in a 'controlled' environment while being part of the mansion. That is what seemed to change my opinion about Hef. Hell he probably expects them to party with men, and be part of anything that takes place in the mansion.
And yes (my guess) i would think if a lady a man hit it off well at a party, don't you think he just may leave her a generous tip. (money)
Hmmm it's all about "behind the doors sex anyway" once you are there i would guess.
I did not look at him myself as a pimp, but when you control ones life, well that changes my opinion.
Pamela
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
yes and I'm sure nobody is FORCED to stay, but with such prestige and glamour associated with being a bunny at the mansion, I wonder where would a girl go should she decide to leave. Or even be told to leave. I wonder if girls are ever told to leave...hmmm...
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
My understanding is that there are a few "rules" at the
Mansion by which the residents are expected to abide.
I'm sure some have been told to leave.Hefner is
reportedly strict about "NO DRUGS" or anything else that would create an excuse to bust him ( he had some
bad experiences in the 60's and 70's).
There is a difference between voluntary choices and
wise ones. Some women handle total independence
well and others probably benefit from a structured
envirionment. The women who live at the Mansion
are there voluntarily. The only ones who I can't
figure out are the half-dozen " dumb blonde"
girlfriends. Now before a lot of panties bunch up, I'm
NOT saying that they are stupid, just that they
"appear" to be little more than concubines without
any serious future prospects. I question the wisdom
of being one of Hef's girlfriends although I'm sure it's
a fairly easy life. If they want to sleep with a 75 yr.
old guy, that's their business.
Re: Is Hugh Hefner a Pimp?
Quote:
The only ones who I can't
figure out are the half-dozen " dumb blonde"
girlfriends. Now before a lot of panties bunch up, I'm
NOT saying that they are stupid, just that they
"appear" to be little more than concubines without
any serious future prospects.
LOL that was funny although I have met girls before where their "dumb" act was exactly that...an act. Sometimes it's a wise decision for an intelligent girl to act dumb as dirt.