Re:Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Reading your posts Vanilla_dog can be confusing to many not familiar with the difference between escorting and fetish games. These are two different worlds.
I think the women who want to become escorts want a lonely/rich man to wine and dine them go dancing and a nice walk on the beach....Home, all for $500 per hour period that's it. Done. Now another scene does happen, they then are mainly labled "sugar daddies" because they will probably see you again if the two of you hit it off, and this will progree slowly to a frienship/relationship, for pay over years, he pays bills etc.. Most cases. And SEX. Not escorting at this point.
Of course negotiate on the phone again with your customer, if you don't want to go further. Then you simply keep the "job" as an escort with no sex, but customers will move on.
The sexless escorting you are talking about, is not escorting at all. It's a form of "Domination". Just panty training, and dressing a guy up, usually for a night of "strap on up the butt." The turn on for these guys is not PAIN, but being humiliated...i,e. Femdom. And they like either men or women to do something sexual to them.
A man who wants Domination with pain, is NOT looking for sex. The pain makes him rock hard, and he is not allowed to masturbate/intercourse, he does so either before the session (alone) for his senses to be hightened, or after because he can.
And those websites....How unfortunate for many who really try. They where simply "blacklisted" by a customer.
There are many forms to take on. Look at Holidayon Stage for example she does massage with sexy clothes on for no sex! Works for her.
But if you truly want the big $$$$$ it's escorting and sex. Otherwise you have an unhappy customer who will not be a repeat.
Sissy guys are fun, pay is good, but i will not have a man shit in a diaper while i wipe his ass!
NOW.... Money slaves are a whole different game! Read up on them ladies!!
Pamela
Re:Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Yes Kid, agencys do this, or you are independent if you want NO sex. Escorts will do this! These games would be well worth money to an escort if she felt up to it, deny/tease....Intercourse.
Real Doms don't see escorts, two different worlds. They prefer a dungeon over a bed!
Pamela :)
Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Pamela,
If you follow the path I outlined in my post above you will see that domination and fetish work and so on are indeed escort jobs and in my view among the best escort jobs. Why else would lovings.com be reviewed on an escort review board? Every escort agency provides fetish work and some more than others.
Pamela.. as you are a nurse I am curious to know if you would rather wipe real shit off of a guys ass for $14-$35 an hour or change a fake shit diaper for $500 an hour?
I don't know anyone considering escort work who thinks they are going to go out to dinner and be paid thousands of dollars for their company. Nor is that what aznsf was asking. What I hear in the question is: do I have to have sex? And my answer is NO. You do not have to have sex, or provide handjobs or or blow jobs. In fact, you can do pretty much exactly what you want if you work for the right agency. And what i outlined above was how to find the right agency meaning the agency that won't fire you if you don't provide sex.
Fuckin a guy in the ass is not what Femdom is all about. Femdom is gross though. Peeing on guys, beating their ass with belts, paddles and whatever, sweaty masks, etc etc it IS work. Adult baby, role playing fucked up wierdness....it is exhausting. No wonder girls just say the hell with it and go starfish.
But the money is there and oodles of it.
Re:Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
I am not a nurse. And not ALL escorts provide these services you mention. Some ladies want to get laid for the money, and go home. I will not do ass play of any sort with a person, like these guys want I think we both know how far they go.....Ecoli.
I was just clearing up what sounds to be one job does it all. Not so. Femdoms will usually call you mistress or by your name. They like being doninated by a woman. But are very very submissive. Usually with a twist. Now to say one does not exist only for punishment would be wrong. They are sissies normally, and want to please.
I am just speaking of the nature of two different worlds. Escorting and fetsish games. They are different. Different meanings.
Hun come on escorts have sex with men for money! Thats what they are hired to do. I have yet to hit an agency who does not want the extra money and a repeat customer.
Sure you can be an "escort" and not have sex, but you will not have repeats if there is not some of sexual play. These are fantasies that people like to play. It's not fucked up to them. Or me. But again i will not get shit on my bare skin. They don't play "clean" they like it as "real" as it gets!!!
No arguments here, just two different worlds again! :) Typed fast...out the door!!!! See ya!
Pamela
Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Sorry I thought you were in nursing...and I didn't say ALL escorts provide those services.
Who needs repeats when there are plenty of new customers? (But you do get repeats anyway) Yes agenies want repeat customers but not all of them will fire you if you don't put out. Finding those agencies takes intelligence.
As I have said many times I worked for a solid year as a no-sex escort and still do outcall shows. I know the in's and out's of the trade. I don't think it's right to discourage girls from this line of work since it adds a whole new dimension to the stripping scene and frees the girls from shitty clubs and dependancy on one form of income.
I would like to clarify semantics here too...Femdom means female domination...the receiver is called a Submissive, Sub or subbie. The women is dominant ..ie the woman is the Dom.
Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
vanilla_dog-
No offense, but what you have described is what I would consider the absolute worst advice you could possibly have given the person in question, unless it is also accompanied with moving several thousand miles from where she is located.
San Francisco is the home of the $150/hr full-service, DDG escort. The city and surrounding provinces are overly saturated and most escorts are completely baffled by how easily they can fetch 2x-3x the region rates (and stay fully busy) anywhere else in the USA.
Dom/Sub or fetish recommendations are also horrible advice as this is the region of the Folsom Street Fair, a massive sweeping fetish scene, walk-in clubs like Bondage-A-Go-Go and Power Exchange and streets lined with the finest fetish shops anywhere in the USA. The fetish escort scene is literally overfilled with 5+ year veterans with custom architectured locales and equipment to fulfill this. Even 2+ year "real lifestyle" fetish escorts with massive bags-o-tricks of gear are being drowned out of this scene or unable to make rent against the tide.
The "rip-off" angle is interesting (careful, sub-context misrepresentation and failure of delivery), and as you said- probably 95 of 100 "johns" are too spineless to make mention and leave with a smile, but the other five I'd worry would put this poor girl in the emergency room, or worse yet- the obituaries, given her small size and stature. There is a large amount of violence against escorts/prostitutes in SF which is why the decriminalization doctrines of SWOP-USA are so heavily in halls of SF and Sacramento at this time. They are pulling bodies out of the bay regularly and the emergency wards are filled with beaten escorts/prostitutes with no legal recourse to file charges due to profession, and deaf ears otherwise.
Moreover, Aiko's given enough information to conclude her lack of success at MSC (a full-service/full-extras brothel) as well as Hustlers (hostess bar, low contact/bikini bar) and finally Centerfolds (nude, full-contact, low-extras). In SF, the stripclubs basically fall into four categories: brothels, strip-clubs with medium extras (hand-job farms), stripclubs with low extras (customer expections, but not required), and stripclubs with no expectation of extras (i.e. similar to nation clubs where maybe 2% of the gals work the angle, but the patrons expecting this usually favor elsewhere).
Where she's at now should be the perfect dynamic for her at CrazyHorse since it falls into the last category. It's where men seeking Asians go, with maybe 5% or less of the clientele having extras expectations, and readily used to being turned down. It's for the most part an Asian lapdance hovel, with YMMV expectations on the private booths. The city is in one of it's biggest seasonal slumps (post-holiday, mid-convention/tourist cycle) so nobody is breaking the bank Jan->Feb in SF, so if she can ride out this valley, and properly prepare her finances to deal with the ups/downs, she should find a comfortable home exactly where she is... and if she can dispell whatever concerns her boyfriend may have of the place.
Re:Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Yeah maybe leaving San Francisco would be best then.
Re:Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
I agree that the indusrty can be rather..good for many women, escorting that is. And more power to you! No sex..Great! You are a minority. I have said in my above statement that Femdoms like being being dominated by a woman. (always a twist to every game) Again the "normal" version of Femdoms is the Female being Dominate, there are many reversed roles in fetish games. A she-male will also like to be a femdom, or the dominate one as well.
PS some MEN will dress the part of a woman ( cross dressing) and play a Femdom!!!! They will then at that moment call themselves a Femdom. You are right there is alot of strange stuff. Role reversal is very common, that was my point. There are NO set limits or correct names for the gender played in fetish games! The lables given have variations.
Everyone expects a woman to be a femdom, because that is the "norm" for this typw of role. We do have role reversal! And men like to play the part....extreme, sure. Do-able..yes. And i am talking a man dressing up, becoming woman and calling himself a Femdom during a session!
It's out there. Correct terminology, perhaps for most not, But for the two playing "role reversal" yes.
Lots luck to you and your escorting with no sex invlolved! Really. I can't seem to find a guy who would agree to pay $$$$$ for an escort and not have some form of sexual contact without walking away pissed...Very.
Pamela :)
Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Quote:
Originally Posted by polecat link=board=10;threadid=4210;start=msg78707#msg7870 7 date=1077939364
...probably 95 of 100 "johns" are too spineless to make mention and leave with a smile, but the other five I'd worry would put this poor girl in the emergency room, or worse yet- the obituaries...
This is true for ANY john whether the girl has sex with him or not. Maybe more so if the woman has sex since it puts her in a more vulnerable position. It is also true for women who get married to men, women who have men as boyfriends, women serving in the military, women with men in their families etc. Men just happen to be violent.
That said, if violence against women is as huge an issue in San Francisco as you claim the solution is simple. The girl can bring a bouncer. Have him stand outside the view of of the peep hole and then when the guy opens the door both go in. The bouncer collects the money and pretty much let's the guy know not to mess around. Then he stands outside the door.
Yes, there is an element of risk but all reward has a risk element. Because of house fees I personally would not want to strip in San Francisco with prostitution being so tolerated. If I was stuck there I am sure I would go the private dancer/escort route at least long enough to get out.
You may think my advice is terrible but I am not alone in my approach. Nor will I let threats of violence deter me.
For those interested in information on no-ex escorting who would like a second opinion try this book:
http://www.escortcoach.com/become.php
Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Eeek! I'm sorry, I hit reply on the same thread (of the same spirit from Aiko on Escorting).. My comments are more tailored to the (same) advice given there given the subject to which it was given.
On the bouncer issue- I whole heartedly agree vanilla and think any woman choosing to work any form of sex-work without a driver/bouncer is in high risk. Unfortunately, at least locally, agency "drivers" are usually as spineless as most "johns" served and not always more than an illusionary form of security.
Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Bouncers: I don't use them but I'm not in San Francisco or any other big city. I tend to like bikers so I would probably swing by the Gypsy Joker clubhouse one night and find a fellow with all the honor and intestinal fortitude needed to get the job done.
Re:Re: Doing my own ESCORT/STRIP?
Ladies: When I am talking about "escorting" I am referring to all the gals with ads in various papers&
on the Internet who "date" for money. Part of the
date is having sex- it's that simple. Certainly there is
wide world of sexual experiences out there beyond
straight sex and there are women & agencies who cater to such tastes; many of which do not involve
actual sexual intercourse.
BUT from reading some of the posts on this topic a
naive, inexperienced, ill-informed young girl could
easily get the idea that she could make big money
escorting ( or "dating"; doing outcall etc.) w/o being
expected to have sex and w/o running serious risks
from pissed off customers who paid the money and got
nothing in return.
As I've said before, there IS a very narrow upper strata
of well-educated AND cultured AND beautiful AND
articulate women who do on occasion get well paid
( and I mean $1000 per hr. and up) for nothing more
than being "arm candy" and going out with wealthy
& lonely men. Sometimes guys have functions to go
to and want a "trophy" on their arm when they walk into the room. These things DO happen; they are
NOT unheard of BUT they are rare & atypical when
talking about the REAL WORLD of escorting. AND the
women called upon to fulfill this function are the creme
de la creme of escorts- only the most beautiful, elegant, educated ( college grads AT LEAST), cultured
(they KNOW which is their salad fork and when to use the finger bowl and when NOT to); well-read and
articulate need even apply.
The reason I KNOW this is because a very famous
lawyer of my acquaintance who was still practicing
in his 90's was know for hiring top-grade escorts( to
travel to Europe with him ; among other things) when
no or very little sex was involved.
I'm going back ten years at least but these gals were very well paid to simply be companions and keep a
very wealthy but lonely old guy company. I know this for a fact because I had dinner with him and one of his
"companions" and they were both fairly open about the true state of affairs. He didn't give much of a damn
back then what people thought and he's deceased now.And she certainly fit the "profile" that I've outlined above.