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How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
Let's say there was a talk show (mine for example ;) ) that wanted to have on strippers to discuss the life of being a professional stripper. And let's say that the talk show wanted the strippers for the first episode that focused on strippers to be "veteran" strippers. By "veteran" I mean ones that have done the job long enough to have enough experiences under their belt to be able to meaningfully talk about what it is like being a professional stripper. The ups, the downs. The life. What good advice they'd give to women thinking of pursuing this profession. Etc. Now let's say you're talking to the show's guest booker about wanting these types of strippers on. What would you tell the guest booker to look for? What minimum number of years should a "veteran" stripper have? What experiences should they have had? I'm assuming ones that have danced at a number of clubs, toured, and so forth, but how many clubs? How many states? Anything else? Anything that should disqualify a stripper for such a show? They would be representing all strippers so I'd like to have on ones that you would like to represent you to the public.
Oh, and how common are professional strippers with college degrees?
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I would say a veteran has worked for at least a couple of years at a couple of clubs in more than one city....has seen some variety.
What to look for....it depends on what kind of show you want to have. On a lot of talk shows with strippers, they get these annoying, dumb bimbos. I hardly ever see a stripper on TV that was shown in a positive light.
It's hard to have any strippers that represent all strippers. We're very diverse...do it for different reasons. Some do it to support kids; some do it for school; some for day to day living; some to sock away; some part-time in addition to a day job...see what I'm saying? there are also various backgrounds and reasons why she started.
As for those with college degrees, it's hard to say. Are you counting those pursuing them? If so, I'd say about 10-20%.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
I would say a veteran has worked for at least a couple of years at a couple of clubs in more than one city....has seen some variety.
Just a couple years? Hmmm. Is this due to the short career life of strippers? That seems rather short. For example, when we were lining up "veteran" stand-up comics for the first episode on comics and were talking to comics about who would be considered a "veteran" amongst them, they all said a veteran should have a minimum of fifteen years of full-time work as a comic to be able to meaningfully speak for their profession. We have since lined up three for that episode and all have been in it for at least fifteen years.
Now this doesn't mean that the only strippers I'll ever have on my show are "veterans". Not at all. It is just that I want veterans for the FIRST episode that focuses on strippers. Same is being and will be done with comics. The first episode that features comics will have on veteran comics, but later episodes will be more receptive to those comics with less experience.
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
What to look for....it depends on what kind of show you want to have. On a lot of talk shows with strippers, they get these annoying, dumb bimbos. I hardly ever see a stripper on TV that was shown in a positive light.
I'm not looking at portraying them in positive or negative light. How I will approach them will be the same way I'll approach anyone from any profession I focus an episode on. I will show them respect and value with they have to say. For I want to know what it is like doing that profession. The highs and lows. Advice they'd give to newcomers. How the profession has changed over the years. A frank and open discussion. Not a bitch session nor a fluff piece. Balanced and intelligent.
As for having on dumb bimbos, I have no interest in having those on. I do realize there are strippers who fit this model, but I have no interest in helping perpetuate that stereotype. Thus my question about how many have college degrees. By having those on and telling the audience what their degrees are in, the audience will then know the guests are not dumb bimbos and that an intelligent conversation is (hopefully) about to happen.
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
It's hard to have any strippers that represent all strippers. We're very diverse...do it for different reasons. Some do it to support kids; some do it for school; some for day to day living; some to sock away; some part-time in addition to a day job...see what I'm saying? there are also various backgrounds and reasons why she started.
Yes, I understand that. That can be said of those pursuing any profession. Some doctors become doctors because they want to be rich. Some because their parents were doctors and thus it's a family business/tradition. Some want to help the poor by working in clinics for the poor. Etc.
The show is a panel discussion show so there will be always be three guests on each episode. A nice side benefit of this is that we can have more variety represented in the guests this way.
What I was really asking for is what experiences can a stripper have that I should try to insure at least one of the three veteran strippers has done.
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
As for those with college degrees, it's hard to say. Are you counting those pursuing them? If so, I'd say about 10-20%.
What would the break-down be between full-time strippers with college degrees and strippers who are pursuing a college degree? Given a preference, I'd prefer the first episode on strippers to have those that have already received their degrees. What I'm wondering is how hard of a search this might be.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I once knew an escort who was also a chiropractor! I imagine the professional strippers with degrees would not be hard to find..getting them to go on TV and admit everything might be another story.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Pumpkin Pie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63298#msg63298 date=1074197998
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
I would say a veteran has worked for at least a couple of years at a couple of clubs in more than one city....has seen some variety.
Just a couple years? Hmmm. Is this due to the short career life of strippers? That seems rather short. For example, when we were lining up "veteran" stand-up comics for the first episode on comics and were talking to comics about who would be considered a "veteran" amongst them, they all said a veteran should have a minimum of fifteen years of full-time work as a comic to be able to meaningfully speak for their profession.
yes. 2-3 years sounds good. and yes erotic dancers have a very short carrer span compared to other profesions. comics can be funny into very old age. but how many 70 year old strippers have you seen? the majority of dancers are (IMO) 18-26 (then again some may lie about thier age). I did meet a 32 year old one once. and i have heard that you can go up to 35 or even 40. I plan to be retired by the time i have children which my husband and I have agreed should be 27 or 28. I did go to collage, but i have yet to graduate for various reasons. I started when i was 18 and I am now 22. I have not danced continuesly and prolly have a year to a year and a half total experice (broken down), and I have worked at 5 clubs or so. I consiter myself semi-experienced and somewhat middle aged for a dancer.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
On a lot of talk shows with strippers, they get these annoying, dumb bimbos. I hardly ever see a stripper on TV that was shown in a positive light.
It's hard to have any strippers that represent all strippers. We're very diverse...do it for different reasons. Some do it to support kids; some do it for school; some for day to day living; some to sock away; some part-time in addition to a day job...see what I'm saying? there are also various backgrounds and reasons why she started.
Emily brings up some very good points. I HATE the way that talk shows make us look, especially Jenny Jones. Whenever Jenny Jones has dancers on her show, they always brag about how they get cash, jewelry, cars, etc. from customers. Then they take a lie detector test, and most of the time it turns out that they are sleeping with their customers! When some of these girls talk, they sound like total airheads too. No wonder the general public has such a negative opinion of us; they think that we are all like the dancers they see on TV.
Like Emily mentioned, dancers are very diverse too. I have absolutely nothing in common with some of my co-workers other than the fact that we are exotic dancers.
What makes a dancer a "veteran" dancer? I would consider a dancer a veteran if she has been dancing two years or more, not necessarily at different clubs. I think a dancer can be a "veteran" if she has only worked in one club. :)
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by blondhottie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63436#msg63436 date=1074223035
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Originally Posted by Emily link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63270#msg63270 date=1074193318
On a lot of talk shows with strippers, they get these annoying, dumb bimbos. I hardly ever see a stripper on TV that was shown in a positive light.
Emily brings up some very good points. I HATE the way that talk shows make us look, especially Jenny Jones. Whenever Jenny Jones has dancers on her show, they always brag about how they get cash, jewelry, cars, etc. from customers. Then they take a lie detector test, and most of the time it turns out that they are sleeping with their customers! When some of these girls talk, they sound like total airheads too. No wonder the general public has such a negative opinion of us; they think that we are all like the dancers they see on TV.
There are a number of reasons why talk shows portray exotic dancers in this light. From enabling their viewing audience to feel superior ... to the shock value of the dancers failing their lie detector tests ... to casting guests that help promote the host's political and/or social agenda ... to being (as on the humorous shock jock shows) the butt of jokes ... and so forth. Even more sad is that many of those to-be-lynched/ridiculed guests not only go along with their own lynching/roasting but are fully informed about what's about to happen to them and play up their part just to get on TV.
However, I have no control over how other talk shows deal with their guests. What I do have control over is how I deal with mine. As for strippers, I plan to just treat them as any other professional. Being a libertarian and a non-believer, I see nothing wrong with what strippers do for a living.
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Originally Posted by blondhottie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63436#msg63436 date=1074223035
What makes a dancer a "veteran" dancer? I would consider a dancer a veteran if she has been dancing two years or more, not necessarily at different clubs. I think a dancer can be a "veteran" if she has only worked in one club. :)
First, beggars cannot be choosers. We've just started doing the search for veteran strippers and which three we have on the show for that episode will be determined by how big and diverse a pool of candidates we can round up. Hopefully, we'll have the same luck as we did with the veteran comics. Once we got one comic that was in the business for at least fifteen years, he knew of a number of comics that had just as much experience. He even helped us recruit those comics. He gave us a short bio on each (he knew we wanted diversity), their email addresses, how to best pitch the episode to them (namely letting us say we were referred by him), and even personally recruited one of the two for us. Maybe ... just maybe we'll have the same luck with veteran strippers. Time will tell.
Then, just as we're planning on doing with later episodes with comics, later episodes with strippers will likely take on a lighter and possibly even playful touch.
However, right now I'm just trying to get a handle on what would be considered a good "veteran" stripper for that first episode on strippers. And how hard it will be in finding ones that also have a college degree. Not to mention ones that also still look healthy and attractive. I truly appreciate the input which you, Emily, Vanilla Dog, and Ami have given me. Thanks! If anyone else would like to help, I'd appreciate hearing from you.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I would consider a veteran dancer someone who has been in the business 5 years or more, with dancing being her sole or main source of income. Girls who dance once a week occasionally for extra cash don't count, as the ups and downs of the business don't affect them in the same way.
I think if you hit the nicer establishments you will have no trouble at all finding dancers with college degrees, and will find many, many dancers who are also college students.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I agree with Mariah. I was just about to post I think a veteran stripper is one who's been at it at least 5 years. Five may seem like a small number, but the percentage of women who keep at it past 5 years is pretty low. I also agree the focus should be on those who do it full time or at least depend on it (or did for some time) as their main source of income for the same reasons already stated. I would add that, IMO, true veterans have danced in several clubs, not just one or two or five. There is so much diversity in this business due to geographic / community / political variances that women who've only danced in a few clubs, especially in limited area(s), simply can't have much real perspective compared to those who've been around the block a few times. Those who've danced for several years in limited places may very well know the business inside out in those limited areas, but their knowledge-base will be very localized. Dancing is dancing, but the system varies widely from club to club and area to area. As for actual numbers, well it's hard to put a number on how many clubs/areas a woman should have danced in before I'd call her a true veteran. Definitely more than 5, but I'm thinking maybe higher than that....10? I've known women who've danced for 5+ years in the same club/city, and I can't think of one I'd call a true veteran.
Regarding college degrees, I don't think it would be too difficult to find veteran strippers with degrees of some sort. But, I don't see that as being important if you just want women who know the biz, are sophisticated and able to hold an intelligent conversation. I know it sounds nice to be able to introduce a 'smart' stripper as having a degree, but one thing many people outside the industry think is, "if she has a degree and is so smart, why is she still stripping?" They tend to automatically write her off as being incompetent on some level for 'real-world' work, thus being relegated to stripping with that as her only viable option for making decent money. I am asked the same thing all the time, and when I explain it, even though my answer makes sense, they still seem unconvinced, as if there must be SOME other reason I 'have' to keep stripping if I have an education because I couldn't POSSIBLY have chosen this path if I were 'smart'. Not to say you shouldn't look for those with degrees, but I don't think you should focus on it necessarily. Besides, some of the smartest strippers I've known don't have formal degrees.
As for specific ones I'd like to see represent us to the public, Melonie gets my first vote as well as Leigh_Landon, and there are others here on SW but I'd have to think about it a little more. There are also some I've known who aren't on SW....
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I agree with the above. They should have danced for at least five years, in at least five different states, they should have done something with their money (a lot of girls don't the first couple years). They should be articulate. They should be skilled enough to make their money without doing extras.
Examples would be Melonie, Bridgette, and Leigh_Landon, on this board.
As for college, sure, why not. I have a degree and am working on another one, and most of the girls I work with now are in school. I would say that the percentage of strippers with degrees is around 20%, and those in college around 40%.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I think in order to be more representative of a "veteran", time in the profession needs to be coupled with club diversity and other factors. As stated, someone that has been in the business for several years, and has also worked at a few clubs with at least several months at each... and doesn't rely on some form of unusual feature characteristic.
I know several "veteran" dancers that may have worked at one club for 4-5 years but wouldn't survive three months anywhere else. They just happen to be in a high-traffic club that sees busloads of new tourists weekly, high-volume hustling, yet have zero repeat customers nor regulars. "Feature" style dancers, albeit with exceptions, should also be avoided. By "feature" meaning the contortionists, massive (EE or EEE) implant feature dancers, etc.etc. Again, these kind of strippers can be successful despite the dancer's character, abilities or skill. These generally seem to be the ones that wind up on Springer or talk shows and don't always yield the best image of the industry since their success isn't directly related to their experience or capabilities.
Women that have high repeat counts and able to maintain regulars, as well as keep a growing pool of new customers are the ones that are generally smart enough, skilled enough and social enough to give a better impression of the industry. They are also usually very successful no matter what club and what locale they wind up in, and do so by having strong character and good business judgement. They don't have to rely on working in a high-traffic environment nor yield some sort of circus-attraction type of presentation... they are successful directly associated to their prowess and knowledge of the role and nothing else. These kinds of dancers make an exceptional impression on the general public and would be the absolute best candidates for any style of public interview.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
I have to concur that, traditionally, dancers have usually received "less than objective treatment" when they have appeared on TV shows. I experienced this personally on the Jenny Jones show, when I was instructed to play the part of a semi-crazed slut and was fed lines from the producers to that effect.
In regard to what constitutes a "veteran" stripper, I would categorize the following ...
- greater than 5 years dancing experience, enough that the girl has seen the gradual business model changes which have occurred in, or more accurately which have been forced upon the industry.
- dancing experience in clubs covering several different regions of the country, i.e. northeast, southeast, southwest, midwest, and west, such that the dancer has personally experienced the different club business models and different "requirements" and different "standard operating procedures" from region to region.
- dancing experience in nude, topless and bikini clubs, as well as upscale and average clubs, large and small clubs, such that the dancer has gained a degree of perspective in regard to what's required in the different types and sizes of clubs.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
You should check out the clubs in Vegas. I dont know why but they tend to have girls that have been dancing a long time. Most of the girls I know are in their late 20's early 30's and have been dancing for atleast 5 years. I dont know about the college degree though. I think that another reason bimbos are on the talk shows is because the "nice" or smart girls wont go on tv, most of those girls are leading double lives, their parents dont know and most of their friends dont know so it would be hard to find a nice girl who would go on tv
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Mariah link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63503#msg63503 date=1074246616
I think if you hit the nicer establishments you will have no trouble at all finding dancers with college degrees, and will find many, many dancers who are also college students.
Unfortunately, the film location is Madison, Wisconsin. The only strip club here is Visions ... rated one of the worst in the nation. :( If anyone knows of a nice establishment within commuting distance of here, I'd appreciate hearing about it.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Bridgette link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63523#msg63523 date=1074255509
Regarding college degrees, I don't think it would be too difficult to find veteran strippers with degrees of some sort. But, I don't see that as being important if you just want women who know the biz, are sophisticated and able to hold an intelligent conversation.
I agree. It is just if given a choice, I'd pick the veterans with degrees over those without.
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Originally Posted by Bridgette link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63523#msg63523 date=1074255509
I know it sounds nice to be able to introduce a 'smart' stripper as having a degree, but one thing many people outside the industry think is, "if she has a degree and is so smart, why is she still stripping?" They tend to automatically write her off as being incompetent on some level for 'real-world' work, thus being relegated to stripping with that as her only viable option for making decent money. I am asked the same thing all the time, and when I explain it, even though my answer makes sense, they still seem unconvinced, as if there must be SOME other reason I 'have' to keep stripping if I have an education because I couldn't POSSIBLY have chosen this path if I were 'smart'. Not to say you shouldn't look for those with degrees, but I don't think you should focus on it necessarily. Besides, some of the smartest strippers I've known don't have formal degrees.
I understand what you're saying. I also will raise that exact same question with the veterans since it will be on the viewer's mind. It's a talk show afterall. It is just that I'd like at least the FIRST episode of strippers to have veteran strippers with college degrees to, before the conversation even starts, break the expectation of viewers that the strippers are dumb bimbos. Later episodes with strippers will have lower requirements but I'd like the first one to really blow viewers away and blatantly go against the dumb bimbo stereotype of strippers. However, again, beggars cannot be choosers so who appears on the show will be limited to who is interested in appearing on the show. The first episode that has strippers will have veteran strippers. If they also have college degrees, that's simply icing on the cake.
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Originally Posted by Bridgette link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63523#msg63523 date=1074255509
As for specific ones I'd like to see represent us to the public, Melonie gets my first vote as well as Leigh_Landon, and there are others here on SW but I'd have to think about it a little more. There are also some I've known who aren't on SW....
The show's film location is Madison, Wisconsin, USA and since it has a limited budget, we cannot fly in and house guests yet. Because of this, my guest booker is looking for locals that are within commuting distance. If a stripper wants to travel to us at their own expense, that's would be great ... but we're not holding our breath that this will happen. The point of this thread is to educate my guest booker and I as to what would qualify as a veteran stripper so when we're out looking for them, we know what to look for.
If people here in this forum know of veteran strippers within commuting distance of Madison, Wisconsin, I'd appreciate the information and ideally an introduction. I'm viewing as commuting distance being about a 250-mile radius from Madison, i.e., Chicago, Milwaukee, Dubuque, LaCrosse, and maybe Minneapolis/St. Paul. Just FYI, the show will be an international show and thus available in those areas as well as the rest of the world.
Thanks for the help!
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Lena link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63525#msg63525 date=1074258026
I agree with the above. They should have danced for at least five years, in at least five different states, they should have done something with their money (a lot of girls don't the first couple years). They should be articulate. They should be skilled enough to make their money without doing extras.
But how can we know that they have invested their money? Or made it without doing extras? These two things would appear to be very difficult to verify. Not to mention being viewed as being quite intrusive into one's personal finances.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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I also will raise that exact same question with the veterans since it will be on the viewer's mind. It's a talk show afterall. It is just that I'd like at least the FIRST episode of strippers to have veteran strippers with college degrees to, before the conversation even starts, break the expectation of viewers that the strippers are dumb bimbos. Later episodes with strippers will have lower requirements but I'd like the first one to really blow viewers away and blatantly go against the dumb bimbo stereotype of strippers
Well, that's certainly an unexpected change for the better! However, the ratings game being what it is, I'm sure that you would eventually feel the same sort of viewer share pressure that the Jenny Jones show and others have felt, that they MUST portray strippers as dumb sluts rather than the intelligent, well educated, hard working women that they might actually be, in order to avoid alienating their major audience segment - housewives !
It's unfortunate but true that "mainstream America" expects strippers to fall into a certain stereotype, and learning of the fact that strippers might actually be smarter than they are, better educated than they are, more affluent than they are, as well as being more beautiful and sexy than they are, can be an extremely threatening concept.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63588#msg63588 date=1074273018
I have to concur that, traditionally, dancers have usually received "less than objective treatment" when they have appeared on TV shows. I experienced this personally on the Jenny Jones show, when I was instructed to play the part of a semi-crazed slut and was fed lines from the producers to that effect.
Yeah, I know and been told that they do that. A lot of the trash talk shows feed their guests lines and get them to play a part. All to make a more "active" and entertaining show. That's fine for them. It is only sad if the viewers think what they're getting is reality and not just a theatrical performance
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Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63588#msg63588 date=1074273018
In regard to what constitutes a "veteran" stripper, I would categorize the following ...
- greater than 5 years dancing experience, enough that the girl has seen the gradual business model changes which have occurred in, or more accurately which have been forced upon the industry.
Yes, that's part of what I want the conversation to cover. How the industry has changed from the perspective of those inside it.
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Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63588#msg63588 date=1074273018
- dancing experience in nude, topless and bikini clubs, as well as upscale and average clubs, large and small clubs, such that the dancer has gained a degree of perspective in regard to what's required in the different types and sizes of clubs.
I can see how my guest booker could verify if the clubs were nude, topless, or bikini, but how about "upscale" and "average"?
Thanks for the help!
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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I can see how my guest booker could verify if the clubs were nude, topless, or bikini, but how about "upscale" and "average"?
that's a fairly straightforward task, since there are probably less than two dozen truly "upscale" show clubs in the entire country and they're all very well described on the strip club review websites.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by polecat link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63526#msg63526 date=1074258157
As stated, someone that has been in the business for several years, and has also worked at a few clubs with at least several months at each... and doesn't rely on some form of unusual feature characteristic.
"Feature" style dancers, albeit with exceptions, should also be avoided. By "feature" meaning the contortionists, massive (EE or EEE) implant feature dancers, etc.etc. Again, these kind of strippers can be successful despite the dancer's character, abilities or skill. These generally seem to be the ones that wind up on Springer or talk shows and don't always yield the best image of the industry since their success isn't directly related to their experience or capabilities.
Thus you'd rule out Melonie for the veteran stripper episode?
Just FYI, as I've said in other posts, I'm not planning on doing just one episode on strippers. If they turn out to be great episodes, they might even become a fairly regular staple of the show. And later episodes will have less experienced strippers on. Others will have strippers who have unique features, such as big-chested strippers, flat-chested strippers, globle-trotting strippers, "feature" dancers, etc.
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Originally Posted by polecat link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63526#msg63526 date=1074258157
Women that have high repeat counts and able to maintain regulars, as well as keep a growing pool of new customers are the ones that are generally smart enough, skilled enough and social enough to give a better impression of the industry. They are also usually very successful no matter what club and what locale they wind up in, and do so by having strong character and good business judgement. They don't have to rely on working in a high-traffic environment nor yield some sort of circus-attraction type of presentation... they are successful directly associated to their prowess and knowledge of the role and nothing else. These kinds of dancers make an exceptional impression on the general public and would be the absolute best candidates for any style of public interview.
But then there's the problem of trying to verify all this. My guest booker is only human. As far as I know, she has no super powers. Or at least none that she's willing to confide in me. :D
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by alexislv link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63600#msg63600 date=1074275750
You should check out the clubs in Vegas.
Unfortunately, the show is on a tight budget and thus cannot fly in and house guests ... yet. Thus my guest booker has to look locally for guests. And "local" is Madison, Wisconsin, USA.
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Originally Posted by alexislv link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63600#msg63600 date=1074275750
I think that another reason bimbos are on the talk shows is because the "nice" or smart girls wont go on tv, most of those girls are leading double lives, their parents dont know and most of their friends dont know so it would be hard to find a nice girl who would go on tv
And with other professions it is because they're almost all introverts that are camera shy. For example, we're having a Hell of a time trying to find accountants that have a personality and are willing to appear on camera. :P
But, yes, I understand what you're saying. I guess I'm just hoping we get lucky.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
By using terms like "professional" and "profession" in describing what you're looking for, you've probably eliminated the majority of strippers working today. In my experience as a customer I've encountered very few strippers who view themselves as professionals pursuing the stripping profession. I think most strippers have no intention of making it their profession, they're just trying to pay some bills, support their kid, raise money for college, support their drug habit, have a good time, etc. If you eliminate all of these people (few of whom who are probably represented on this web site) you are missing what's really going on in stripland today. The big glitzy clubs where the pros work probably don't represent either the majority of clubs or strippers out there, and many of the views represented on this board may not be representative of these amateurs either.
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
PP, I think most strippers who've been at it past the 5-year mark, and who've worked several clubs in several areas, generally will have learned pretty well how to do business successfully without relying on 'easy' circumstances or extras. In my experience, most girls who rely on extras and/or who don't have good skills don't last too long, and/or generally don't get around to dancing in many areas. I also say that once a dancer has been at it more than 5 years (especially if she is a true veteran and has worked a few different areas), she's most likely figured out how to do something constructive with her money other than go shopping. You won't need to ask or verify all those things. Furthermore, I really don't think those things should really factor in when you're looking for women to make an appearance - whether or not a woman is good with her finances or has ever broken a rule isn't much of a reflection on how well she knows the business. I daresay all of us have been guilty of spending unwisely and broken some rules at some point, but the true veterans generally have learned how better to manage their money and how to work within boundaries successfully.
I disagree with polecat's assessment that feature-type dancers should be excluded. Some or most of them started out as house dancers and just managed to improve their lot by becoming features. Those women may appear to be bimbos on Springer and Jenny Jones, but we all know that is an act 'encouraged' by producers and they appear on those shows to increase their marketability. IMO, that is not an indication of any lack of experience or skills, but in fact is an indication of business sense.
One problem I see for you is that, with your geographical and budgeting limitations, you may find it extremely difficult to come up with a few true veterans to make an appearance. Chicago should prove to have a better source for veterans, but I would think that you'd be hard-pressed to find many true veterans who've worked several areas in Wisconsin. I think you'd have much better luck if you managed to expand your budget a bit. I know that is easier said than done....
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63625#msg63625 date=1074280862
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I also will raise that exact same question with the veterans since it will be on the viewer's mind. It's a talk show afterall. It is just that I'd like at least the FIRST episode of strippers to have veteran strippers with college degrees to, before the conversation even starts, break the expectation of viewers that the strippers are dumb bimbos. Later episodes with strippers will have lower requirements but I'd like the first one to really blow viewers away and blatantly go against the dumb bimbo stereotype of strippers
Well, that's certainly an unexpected change for the better!
That's the idea. ;D
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Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63625#msg63625 date=1074280862
However, the ratings game being what it is, I'm sure that you would eventually feel the same sort of viewer share pressure that the Jenny Jones show and others have felt, that they MUST portray strippers as dumb sluts rather than the intelligent, well educated, hard working women that they might actually be, in order to avoid alienating their major audience segment - housewives !
That would be true IF I was trying to go after just housewives. I'm not. I'm expecting my audience to be 18-55 year olds and heavily male. The reason is simply because I'm a 40-year-old straight male. Viewers tend to want to either identify with the host or are attracted to them.
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Originally Posted by Melonie link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63625#msg63625 date=1074280862
It's unfortunate but true that "mainstream America" expects strippers to fall into a certain stereotype, and learning of the fact that strippers might actually be smarter than they are, better educated than they are, more affluent than they are, as well as being more beautiful and sexy than they are, can be an extremely threatening concept.
And I will love waking "mainstream America" up to this reality. ;)
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Re:How would you define a "veteran" dancer?
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Originally Posted by FONDL link=board=1;threadid=5840;start=msg63646#msg63646 date=1074283336
By using terms like "professional" and "profession" in describing what you're looking for, you've probably eliminated the majority of strippers working today. In my experience as a customer I've encountered very few strippers who view themselves as professionals pursuing the stripping profession. I think most strippers have no intention of making it their profession, they're just trying to pay some bills, support their kid, raise money for college, support their drug habit, have a good time, etc. If you eliminate all of these people (few of whom who are probably represented on this web site) you are missing what's really going on in stripland today. The big glitzy clubs where the pros work probably don't represent either the majority of clubs or strippers out there, and many of the views represented on this board may not be representative of these amateurs either.
Later episodes will have looser qualifications for the strippers that will appear on them. However, for the first episode, I do want veteran strippers who view themselves as professionals and stripping as a profession. I want a serious conversation with three of them and if they don't take their job seriously, I'm not going to get as serious of a conversation as I'd like. And I only need THREE for that first episode.
Again, later episodes will be looser on who gets invited and likely lighter and having a fun touch to them. The only thing I'm not interested in ever having on my show is dumb bimbos. And that's just not for strippers but for any of the guest types I have on. I want my show known for balanced intelligent discussions by mature knowledgeable adults. Fortunately, finding all those guests is my guest booker's problem. ;D