Do you agree or disagree that it is racial/religious discrimination to consider ALL Islamic/Muslim persons as suspicious ?
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Do you agree or disagree that it is racial/religious discrimination to consider ALL Islamic/Muslim persons as suspicious ?
Someone will soon be along to tell us
*why it isn't discrimination, or prejudice
* why all good, honest and lawabiding American citizens should all agree that in general, discrimination based on (this time) religion or ethnic background is in fact the GOOD and RIGHT thing to do;
* and that anyone who doesn't agree should move to Iraq.
If we are lucky they might even tell us that the Muslims WANT it this way.
I am most suspicious of people telling me I have to trade liberty for "security".
No, I don't believe it is a bad thing. It's common sense...the most likely terrorist is an Arab male between the ages of 18-40. I see nothing wrong in taking a closer look at a guy like that boarding an airplane.
However, focusing solely on that profile is not a good way to combat terrorism.
Yes it is so be it ! until I am a little more comfortable with my family and my own safety that s the way its going to be . And same goes for me cruising through Compton it wont happen .Its not so much profiling to me as it is survival . That's not to be mistaken for a hate crime where you intentionally go out of your way to hurt someone just because of their race , religion or sexual preferences. Does this make sense or am I a racist now .
We certainly aren't looking for people of Icelandic or Kenyan extraction to partake in Islamist terrorism.
Profiling works in law enforcement, much as people don't want to admit it. It's much easier to sing Kumbaya and whistle through the graveyard rather than risk being called a racist.
That said, no one is suggesting all Arabs or adherents to Muslim culture or religion are terrorists. It's impractical, nevermind inaccurate.
Being that we are on guard for terrorism, and the prime suspects are Muslim/Middle Eastern, suspicion of that group is not unfounded. I am not suggesting all Muslim/Middle Eastern people are guilty by association, but that they deserve a bit more scrutiny in our security procedures than everyone else given recent history.
I hear too many people echoing the sentiment which led to Japanese internment during WW2, and led to Hitler's mass execution of what were natural Germans (when he of course was not...being Austrian)
During Korean and VietNam wars, soldiers and citizens were taught (with varying degrees of success) that "those people...those yellow reds" would do anything they can to undermine our way of life - after people who looked llike us had spent decades screwing with their political system and country for our own gains. But of course we don't want them profiling Americans/white Europeans do we?
YES...examine people who look suspicious, and sadly that means people of a certain skin color raise a question in people's minds - A QUESTION THAT MUST BE RATIONALLY EXAMINED BEFORE ACTION.
Did Tim McVeigh commit terrorism? How about members of the KKK? IRA? Mafia? The list goes on, terrorism is NOT a racial trait. We must BALANCE our paranoia, valid fears, experience, logic, reason and compassion to find the true solution
We are not putting Arabs in prison. The analogy doesn't hold true.
We profile white people all the time. When a serial killer pops up, and no one knows what the person who did it looks like, it's always assumed that he's a white male between 30-45 (or whatever age). That's me, and I see nothing wrong with it.
Political correctness is yet another nail in the coffin the of the US.
Yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Hyde
Oh, wait...yes we are, and in their own country no less (as well as here)
Wait again....it took a while before resentment toward Japanese led to interrment...and several years before Nazi pressure/persecution of their supposed enemies led to Auchwitz....the point is we must be AWARE OF THE RISKS and of human nature/history while deciding these things
Have we evolved past those things? Maybe. Ask your neighborhood Middle Eastern store owner in Manhattan what the fall of 2001 was like. Ask if they still feel the pressure.
I'm not saying it's all wrong, but it must be done in a balanced way...otherwise, we begin the process of depersonalizing a people which makes other types of abuses easier.
Sadly, you see a person of color acting " a little odd" it raises more suspicion than a white person doing the same thing....partially because of stereotypes that are sometimes based in fact. The question is where the line is between careful use of patterns and discrimination. Very gradual shades of gray
And here lays the problem IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by discretedancer
Its that line.
Doesnt matter where you draw it,you will always have someone who doesnt agree with where ya drew it.:)
Is looking at the white guys first when looking for a serial killer racial profiling??
Yes.
Do I have a problem with it as a white guy??
no.
I think a lot of the whole profiling ordeal was blown out of proportion by the media seems like it started with police and their practices of profiling and frankly it makes sense to me why they do it . A lot of profiling is based upon facts of certain age groups race( white as well ) etc all the police were doing is possibly giving themselves some added self preservation . And yes if someone doesnt fit the neiborhood or place they are cruising through by all means pull them over and check them out this would be a form of crime prevention wouldn't it or do we just pay the police to respond ,I would hope not .
The world has changed in many ways to me I use to be able to leave the keys in my car at home not anymore ( I live in the desert by the way not the big city ) I could leave the house unlocked during my trips into town , not anymore .You didnt worry about what you threw away ,not anymore and you must have a shreder now ! As a society we are much more paranoid in general because of the the changing attitudes and crimes . But I notice the laws are getting much more lax in general like just asking people what are you doing in this neiborhood cant do that anymore because you are profiling , I could care less ,if its my neiborhood and I pay the police I want them to ask .
How are people able to tell what religion a man practices by looking at him?
They cant really,so its more racial profiling then muslim profiling,but for the sake of this thread we are to ignore that part:) .Quote:
Originally Posted by Destiny
The last time I bought an airline ticket,they didnt ask me what my religion was,and i didnt ask them for a seat facing Mecca,so how could they know??
EXACTLY. Now if a guy presents an Egyptian passport as a photo ID to board the plane, they had damn well better give him more a passing glance! But that's not profiling, that's using common sense.Quote:
Originally Posted by BigGreenMnM
I was very clear to include both racial and religious in the opening post. Here is exactly what I wrote with the sections being questioned:Quote:
They cant really,so its more racial profiling then muslim profiling,but for the sake of this thread we are to ignore that part
so there is no need to ignore that part for the sake of this thread unless one CHOOSES to do soQuote:
Do you agree or disagree that it is racial/religious discrimination to consider ALL Islamic/Muslim persons as suspicious ?
common sense,we agree 100%,but thats not very PC talk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Destiny
But in the case you suggest,wouldnt that be regional discrimination,like not allowing anyone from great brittin to donate sperm to Americans??;D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Hyde
That is SOOOOO racist! >:( OMG I can't even believe you would have the gall to say such a thing. This is what is wrong with people of today. You have so much hatred in your hearts. I'm sorry, but this is the reason that the cycle of hatred continues to breed strongly.
Just like you believe "its not a bad thing..it's commen sense" Thats the same ideals that people in the <1965 era had against blacks in the south! Just because someone doesn't look the way you or your wife, your friends and neighbors look does NOT mean that they should be denied fair treatment.
The USA was created to give all people the right to worship to treat all people EQUALLY!!!! >:(
Discrimination is DISCRIMINATION PERIOD!!!
EXACTLY ...well said CinammonKisses !
It's pretty obvious I am of mixed ethnicity and I consider it a huge blessing. It helps me understand how fucked up discrimination is no matter who is doing or recieves it.
Both my parents are mixed as well so they taught me to be proud of being a good person and not to judge others based on anything other than their behavior.
The hatred of anyone not pure snow white that is expressed on this website by several members is behavior. Those who behave that way are (imho) simply not good people.... but I try to keep faith in the knowledge that people can change....if they choose to....if they prefer to continue their hate and discrimination they will but its also true that if they wish to melt their stone cold hearts they can do that too !
:peace:
Hey girl!! PM me sometime we gotta TALK!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hello~Kitty
CK, HK you got it dead on.
Destiny, you mean if my sister (red hair, 5-11 white female) present her Egyptian passport (don't ask why she has one...army brat, married once to an Egyptian) I should get scrutinized? Or is it only Egyptians that look the part? Who defines 'common" sense?
You and I disagree often about what's logical/common sense...is that the fair basis for policy?
I believe EVERYONE getting on a plane is to be checkd thouroughly, and RANDOM searches (unless background check reveals otherwise) should be computer generated by ticket number. Then it's fair. Otherwise, it's the big gray swath.
I agree, your system is "fair", to the extent that it inconveniences everyone to the same extent. While it's fair, it's not the most sensible. I posted once before on this and with thanks to Bill Gates here's my thoughts on the subject.Quote:
Originally Posted by discretedancer
If the government is going to insist on providing security for the airlines they should at least do so efficiently. I advocate a common sense approach to screening for potential threats as the best use of our resources.Quote:
Originally Posted by Destiny
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hello~Kitty
Are we not all of some kind of mixed ethnic background, everyone here ? Do people treat you different because of the way you look or your genealogy not that they would know your genealogy without possibly knowing your name . Is racism only reserved for those who think they are getting a raw deal it sounds to me that if you dont include all races it is therfore a racist frame of mind conclusion is it not ?
yes,yes it is.Quote:
Originally Posted by cinammonkisses
Im guessing your a dancer??
care to take the poll in the stripper section of SW??
It's not racist. It's smart.
Let's say we're standing in line at the airport waiting to get through the x-ray machinery, etc. Would you feel safer if they randomly searched every 5th passenger, or the most likely terrorist profile?
Calling that racist is stupid, frankly.
Does it mean that all males between 18-40 of apparent Arab descent are terrorists? No, of course not. Does than mean that this slice of the populace will get go thru some hassles when travelling? Yes, I hate to say it. But what other way would you go about it? Searching an 80 year old grandma just because she's the 5th person in the queue?
Labeling is the easiest way to dismiss something. Please don't call it racist. It'd be like me calling you a terrorist-lover.