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when hustling becomes a habit
Sometimes husting simply becomes a habit for the gals. I go to the same club maybe once a month. I don't spend alot, maybe 100 or so, spread among several gals. I have over a period of time recieved several dances from a particular gal, nothing special. One day we are chatting, she takes my cell, and programs in her number to call. Now, picture this, I know nothing about her, never really chat, but I am convinced that she is so programed to hustle, she could not help herself. Well I called once, she called back and we chatted, and than she never called again. Here is my point. I had no interest in seeing anyone outside the club (and yes if on the off chance this was a winning lottery ticket, I had to call once), never asked for personal information, always saw several different gals, yet she still had to hustle. I read with some interest all the advice about not falling for a dancer, don't get attached, guys who stalk, are suckers, ect. We don't hear too much about the other side, the serial hustler who probably without realising what she is doing, has to hustle, just because we are there. My point is simple, sometimes we as customers don't do anything to open up the hustle door but some gals, out of either habit, meaness or boredom, try to "kick that sucker (the hustle door) down" Ladies, if we are willing to spend our money to be entertained with out asking anything else, if we are good boys, please don't try to hustle us. It is just tacky.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
It's her job. She's not "programed" any more than any other salesman. She took a shot. In sales terms think of it as a cold call-maybe something will come of it maybe nothing will. It didn't cost her anything to try. She didn't give you her cell number for any other reason than to maintain interest in you coming to see her at the club and spending money on her. Yeah sure it's pure hustle. Tacky? I guess you could use that word but it's really just part of the job. It's a sales technique. "Habit", sure, "Meaness", Huh?, "Boredom", nope, just doing her job. Your reading way too much into it
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by xarechow
One day we are chatting, she takes my cell, and programs in her number to call. Now, picture this, I know nothing about her, never really chat, but I am convinced that she is so programed to hustle, she could not help herself. Well I called once, she called back and we chatted, and than she never called again. Here is my point. I had no interest in seeing anyone outside the club (and yes if on the off chance this was a winning lottery ticket, I had to call once), never asked for personal information, always saw several different gals, yet she still had to hustle.
Pulling the ol' "you're special, so I'm gonna give you my number" stunt is my current ATF's one annoying flaw, (hell I haven't even gotten a phone call).
Needless to say, listening to her latest excuse why she hasn't called after she promised that she would is becoming increasing irritating. Her sales from me have gone down considerably since. I have no problem with her trying to sell me dances, I have a problem with her thinking that she has to resort to this kind of malarky in order to keep me interested.
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I read with some interest all the advice about not falling for a dancer, don't get attached, guys who stalk, are suckers, ect. We don't hear too much about the other side, the serial hustler who probably without realising what she is doing, has to hustle, just because we are there. My point is simple, sometimes we as customers don't do anything to open up the hustle door but some gals, out of either habit, meaness or boredom, try to "kick that sucker (the hustle door) down"
What these gals don't seem to understand is that some of us PL's have been around the block so many times that we know stripper shit phoninesss when we see it. I guess with a new crop of SC rookies and a plentiful supply of lonely men though, it works enough times out of a hundred to make the effort worthwhile...just like spam.
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Ladies, if we are willing to spend our money to be entertained with out asking anything else, if we are good boys, please don't try to hustle us. It is just tacky.
Just remember, no matter what she tells you, its ALWAYS a hustle, and there's nothing wrong with good clean hustling (if your viewpoint considers such a thing), but with respect to the needless manipulation, the bait and switch tactics, the "I really like you, call me sometime" crap...amen. If a gal wants my business, she's going to have to change gears a bit from robot mode.
:thumbsup:
Thanks for the thread, replying here was kind of theraputic.
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Wow hope you dont make your living in sales
You take an exsisting good client, lie to him because you want more money out of him? I own a midsized business and I know that any sales rep who tried that with me in the real world would lose my business in a hurry. The whole point is that her hustle was pointless and ultimately futile. I never tried for anything more, never ever led her to believethat I would spend more money if she was "nice" to me, and now she will not get any money from me again. I find it funny that in stripper world, she is a smart business woman and in the real world, she is an idiot. Most of us go to strip clubs to get away from the real world. There are actually some of us who enjoy the unreality inside the club and have no interest in taking the drama outside.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
Well, I said it was her job, I didn't say it was smart - I wouldn't have gone for it either.
It's a sales tactic and, in the SC industry there are many tactics that RW business people would frown upon. Your not interested but if she does that to ten guys and only one does a VIP room with her because she acted "interested" she's accomplished her goal. She could string that guy along for weeks, months , years. If she pisses you off she's lost the business of a guy who spends about $100 spread out over several girls about once a month. No offense, there are plenty of girls who are very happy with every single $20 dance they get. She was pushing for more from a guy that she was prepared to lose as a customer based on what you where spending on her. I don't honestly think she had any intention of taking anything outside of the club. Girls who do OTC for money are pretty straight forward about it.
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Re: Wow hope you dont make your living in sales
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Originally Posted by xarechow
You take an exsisting good client, lie to him because you want more money out of him? I own a midsized business and I know that any sales rep who tried that with me in the real world would lose my business in a hurry. The whole point is that her hustle was pointless and ultimately futile. I never tried for anything more, never ever led her to believethat I would spend more money if she was "nice" to me, and now she will not get any money from me again. I find it funny that in stripper world, she is a smart business woman and in the real world, she is an idiot. Most of us go to strip clubs to get away from the real world. There are actually some of us who enjoy the unreality inside the club and have no interest in taking the drama outside.
Dude - she gave you her number. She did not offer to have your babies or demand alimony. She did not call you repeatedly at 3.00 AM asking for a ride home. She did not call you and demand that you give her money for a blowjob. She chatted a while, and then didn't call back. That is not drama. That's not even a lie. I think you're getting a little too worked up over the whole thing. And you guys do this whole "she'll never see any money from me again" like it is punitive. Who cares? And dude - she is in the real world. She has a different job and a different area than you - but she hasn't done anything unethical, she hasn't lied, stolen, been mean, made you feel bad. You are just an unforseen customer who doesn't like a dancer giving them a phone number, and then like to dramatize situations. Like how about this - instead of getting all worked up about the whole thing why not just say that you are not interested in talking to her outside the club; that you don't really need to call her nor do you need her to call you back. There you go. Drama free.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
Yea I must admit, you're comments sound like you expected something more to happen, and because it either hasn't happened yet, or wont happen, you felt used.
Sorry man. Happens to the best of us.
Not all of us get used, and you wont get used all the time. Don't sweat it. Learn from this and move on.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
There's a really fine line between being a good salesperson and being a sociopath. All the characteristics of sociopathic behaviour (superficial charm, glibness, an inability to empathize with others, manipulativeness, pathological dishonesty, a grandiose sense of self, lack of remorse) are found in abundance at strip clubs--and in most sales departments. In fact, I'd guess that a tendency to view customers solely in terms of the ways they can be hustled would help you be a successful stripper. But it also makes you a fairly shitty human being.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by The Snark
There's a really fine line between being a good salesperson and being a sociopath. All the characteristics of sociopathic behaviour (superficial charm, glibness, an inability to empathize with others, manipulativeness, pathological dishonesty, a grandiose sense of self, lack of remorse) are found in abundance at strip clubs--and in most sales departments. In fact, I'd guess that a tendency to view customers solely in terms of the ways they can be hustled would help you be a successful stripper. But it also makes you a fairly shitty human being.
When you think about it that behaviour is also rampant on message boards. Oooh. Now we need all be afraid.
It's not generally that sales people or strippers lack empathy with people in general - but with certain people in certain times and circumstances. There does have to be a limit to what our responsibility to our customers is - and I'm sorry but giving out your number and then not calling back doesn't make you a shitty human being.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by xarechow
Sometimes husting simply becomes a habit for the gals. I go to the same club maybe once a month. I don't spend alot, maybe 100 or so, spread among several gals. I have over a period of time recieved several dances from a particular gal, nothing special. One day we are chatting, she takes my cell, and programs in her number to call. Now, picture this, I know nothing about her, never really chat, but I am convinced that she is so programed to hustle, she could not help herself. Well I called once, she called back and we chatted, and than she never called again. Here is my point. I had no interest in seeing anyone outside the club (and yes if on the off chance this was a winning lottery ticket, I had to call once), never asked for personal information, always saw several different gals, yet she still had to hustle. I read with some interest all the advice about not falling for a dancer, don't get attached, guys who stalk, are suckers, ect. We don't hear too much about the other side, the serial hustler who probably without realising what she is doing, has to hustle, just because we are there.
LOL...strippers giving out phone numbers to customers? oh no, they would never do such a thing. why, that would be wrong. if you listen to the lip service around here. officially, she could be arrested or fired for soliciting the customers. unofficially, strippers do give customers phone numbers, email addys, "real names" and other kinds of information without prompting from the customer. however, i would put very little stock in those actions alone. it's just a form of SS to get the customer back to the club and spend money on the stripper. so, just throw that phone number in the dumptser along with the rotting flowers and stuffed animals that strippers receive from PLs.
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Originally Posted by xarechow
My point is simple, sometimes we as customers don't do anything to open up the hustle door but some gals, out of either habit, meaness or boredom, try to "kick that sucker (the hustle door) down" Ladies, if we are willing to spend our money to be entertained with out asking anything else, if we are good boys, please don't try to hustle us. It is just tacky.
well, if you expect strippers to stop laying down the SS to customers because you find it tacky. i wouldn't hold my breath waiting on them to stop. i doubt they do it out of meanness or boredom, but it's definitely such an ingrained habit (hell, with some of these broads. it's a lifestyle..LOL) that it's difficult for them to know when to turn-off the schtick. which isn't surprising given that most customers do want a false sense of intimacy.
however, if you find it tacky or annoying and you want them to stop laying it on you. you have to be a pro-active customer. i recall first meeting this ass-tastic Czech stripper who was laying on the SS thick like chunky peanut butter mixed with fast drying concrete . although, i found her dances to be quite impressive (ie: very, very nasty). i really don't need to hear her babble on about how she would date me if i wasn't a customer. statement like that just make me think: poor child, why i would even bother? i got what i wanted. she got what she wanted. so, why complicate matters? anyway, after a few frank remarks. she quickly got the message and eased up on the SS.
IMO, i find that candor is the best policy in this situation. the fact that a customer isn't responding to the SS isn't going to click in the minds with most strippers. so, just come right out and tell them that they really don't need them to "work you" that hard. also, don't worry that you're somehow being rude or offensive by making such a statement. remember, you go there to relax and not to be annoyed. now, if she's a particularly empty-headed flake. a stronger message may be required. may i suggest that you start with heavy sighs and eye-rolling and work your way up to double takes and sneering, cackling laughter. you just have to know how to speak to these people in a language they can understand.
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Originally Posted by xarechow
You take an exsisting good client, lie to him because you want more money out of him? I own a midsized business and I know that any sales rep who tried that with me in the real world would lose my business in a hurry. The whole point is that her hustle was pointless and ultimately futile.
yes, it was pointless and an ultimately futile exercise to be effective on you. however, that doesn't negate the possibility that it's an effective tool to sell dances or generate future sales from the suckers...er...other customers.
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Originally Posted by xarechow
I find it funny that in stripper world, she is a smart business woman and in the real world, she is an idiot.
LOL...well, no one would ever accuse strippers of thinking in the long-term. it's all about the hustle in the sc. anyway, that's a very cogent point. most customers mistakenly assume that common mainstream business ethics and those in the sc are analogous. however, if you look beyond the lip service. you'll find that nothing could be further from the truth. that's not to say the sub-culture doesn't have ethics and values. quite the contrary, they do. however, it's nothing that an unaware customer would recognize based on his previous (or lack thereof within the sc) experience. caveat emptor is the name of the game in a sc.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
If you had no interest in seeing her outside the club, why did you call? Just delete the number next time. This isn't a lottery.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by xarechow
I called once, she called back and we chatted, and than she never called again.
I guess you didn't sweep her off her feet... sure you're disappointed but don't be bitter about it.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by mr_punk
however, if you find it tacky or annoying and you want them to stop laying it on you. you have to be a pro-active customer.
Wow, you missed interpreting this OP by a mile. Despite his protests of having no interest, he USED the phone number. Called it and chatted. Did you miss that fact? His complaint is that she failed to give him a second round of chatting because she didn't call back the next time. In effect, he's saying, "The bitch gave it out, but then stiffed me! Why do they hustle us this way?" That's the underlying nature of the complaint here. He doesn't want her to stop laying it on; he wants her to follow through with laying it on in the manner she indicated she would. Then it wouldn't be a hustle in his mind; it'd be customer service.
-Ev
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
The problem here is you have a lot of emotions mixed up in this situation because there is a sex involved, and in particular sex with a hot woman. What I would do is imagine the same situation, but this time imagine she is a he, he is trying to sell you something neutral (e.g., a car salesman), and he never called you back again. Once it's clear in your mind how you feel about that situation, subtract that from how you felt about this situation with the stripper. What's left over is the emotional and sexual want you have for her that's fucking your head over.
Do hustlers know that their customers confuse reality with fantasy, and play on their customers false hopes and emotions to increase their income? Would it be "mean" to do so? To me there is no point in asking these question since it has become apparent that few if any hustlers see it that way, and as the customer, it doesn't matter to you how they see it, what matters is what you choose to do in the club.
Bottom line, be a smart customer. You make your choices and buying decisions wisely and don't give a second thought to what is motivating the stripper. And if you really aren't looking for something to happen outside the club, just don't give out your number. It's that simple.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
Just some stripper bullshit. No big whoop.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by evan_essence
Wow, you missed interpreting this OP by a mile. Despite his protests of having no interest, he USED the phone number. Called it and chatted. Did you miss that fact?
no, i saw that part, but then he went on to say that he wasn't interested. fair enough....what do you want me to do, read his mind?
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Originally Posted by evan_essence
In effect, he's saying, "The bitch gave it out, but then stiffed me! Why do they hustle us this way?" That's the underlying nature of the complaint here.
that may be true. yet, even if it is true. no one took the stripper to task for hustling the guy.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by mr_punk
no, i saw that part, but then he went on to say that he wasn't interested. fair enough....what do you want me to do, read his mind?
No, his actions. Calling once and enjoying it enough to call a second time, then being upset that he didn't get a call back and coming here to complain. I mean, no big mind reading ability necessary when the actions counterindicate a position of I'm not interested.
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Originally Posted by mr_punk
that may be true. yet, even if it is true. no one took the stripper to task for hustling the guy.
Huh? That's what the OP did. You mean after that? Ya lost me on what point you're making there. Just to clarify, I'm not getting after him for complaining. I'm saying I think you're missing the point of the complaint - he wanted the hustle enough to call twice, but he was disappointed with its quality or lack thereof.
I think the answer is to find a girl who will do it better and more consistently. But it's not a big deal really, so whatevah.
-Ev
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by evan_essence
No, his actions. Calling once and enjoying it enough to call a second time, then being upset that he didn't get a call back and coming here to complain. I mean, no big mind reading ability necessary when the actions counterindicate a position of I'm not interested.
oh geez...i must say that your ball breaking skills are improving by leaps and bounds.
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Originally Posted by evan_essence
Huh? That's what the OP did. You mean after that?
exactly, no one said, "oh yeah, that biatch totally ripped you off". which i'm sure was disappointing for you.
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Originally Posted by evan_essence
I'm saying I think you're missing the point of the complaint - he wanted the hustle enough to call twice, but he was disappointed with its quality or lack thereof.
all i'm responding to is what he wrote. if he says he wasn't interested...i'll take his word for it. i don't have a problem with you not taking his word for it. so, if you have a problem with he wrote. may i suggest that you go nag him (if he ever bothers to post again) about it?
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by mr_punk
oh geez...i must say that your ball breaking skills are improving by leaps and bounds.
As are your ad hominem (dis)missives.
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Originally Posted by mr_punk
which i'm sure was disappointing for you.
And your ability to fabricate my reaction.
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Originally Posted by mr_punk
may i suggest that you go nag him (if he ever bothers to post again) about it?
Okay, never say never, but you have to know by now that I'll rarely cheat on you when it comes to nagging.
-Ev
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
What makes her the prize? Hustle her instead. Remember, women have a shelf life, men don't.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
^^^
YES!
That's it. That is the ticket. Walk into stripclubs and ask the women why THEY won't pay to watch YOU dance. We LOVE that. Love it. You'll be rolling in stripper action, and I bet one or two of them, upon consideration of that brilliant point will get a couple of twenties out of their purses. Because after all. Women have a shelf life.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by Jenny
Walk into stripclubs and ask the women why THEY won't pay to watch YOU dance.
It was slow as hell last night where I was, so I was fortunate enough to have 4 beautiful ladies at my table doing shots with me. One decided it was a good idea to give me a dance, and the person next to her decides she would cut in start playing with my chest. I slapped her hand away and said that she should have asked my rules first, and she'd have to tip me extra for that. ;)
A little lighthearted fun can make a slow evening go by much faster! ;D
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by Jenny
^^^
YES!
That's it. That is the ticket. Walk into stripclubs and ask the women why THEY won't pay to watch YOU dance. We LOVE that. Love it. You'll be rolling in stripper action, and I bet one or two of them, upon consideration of that brilliant point will get a couple of twenties out of their purses. Because after all. Women have a shelf life.
The topic here was avoiding her annoying hustle outside the club...in fact on the phone. Frankly, I'm not real interested in what you LOVE. Look how quickly you started chasing me already. You may hate it, but you eat it up.
I would never be so rude to outright tell you about how our respective gender values are inverted over time, or that simply women have a shelf life. You already know that and think about it every day. If you don't, you are in a very tiny minority of single women inching towards menopause.
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by toomuchinfo
What makes her the prize? Hustle her instead. Remember, women have a shelf life, men don't.
Any man personifying Homer Simpson will be glad to hear that.
-Ev
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Re: when hustling becomes a habit
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Originally Posted by toomuchinfo
The topic here was avoiding her annoying hustle outside the club...in fact on the phone.
Well, I think we've already established that the easiest way of avoiding her hustle outside the club would have been to NOT CALL HER. I don't think avoiding her outside the club was really the problem. The problem was that she didn't want to see him outside the club.
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Frankly, I'm not real interested in what you LOVE. Look how quickly you started chasing me already. You may hate it, but you eat it up.
So, you got the photo I sent in the PM? I think I've made it clear that I want and need you - and I've been summarily rejected by mr._punk for not allowing guys to penetrate me anally in my club, so I'm feeling really needy right now. Wait a second, let me give you my number...
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I would never be so rude to outright tell you about how our respective gender values are inverted over time, or that simply women have a shelf life. You already know that and think about it every day. If you don't, you are in a very tiny minority of single women inching towards menopause.
I don't know - I've always thought that was a myth. All the older men I know who are chronically single are miserable and pathetic, and usually not very professionally successful. The women I know who are older and chronically single are usually in demand, extremely social, professionally successful and happy. So my experience of "gender values over time" may be somewhat different than yours. Personally, I'm looking forward to writing a book, moving into a teeny little condo on the waterfront with African art and buying me a cat. One of those fancy, designer hairless cats, since I'm allergic.