Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
After reading the post on Dancer Co-op's, and seeing various posts on dancers wanting to buy strip clubs, I decided to put up a serious post on this subject to get most of you guys thinking.
This industry will not change if the ownership of the vast majority of the clubs has no dancing experience, and cannot sympathize with the average dancer.
But for at least 30-40% of clubs to be owned and operated by "business savvy" dancers, a business model of generating capital and fighting the foes against the business is key.
Girls, how would you go about trying to set up a stripper owned version of Deja Vu, but dancer friendly, and all with full bars?
If you guys wanted to buy clubs of all sizes in all sizes of cities that have a chance of being in the top 20% businesswise, what would you do first?
Let's do a SW model.
What strip clubs are for sale in the US today? Are they in cities with enough contact in there dances to be profitable for the dancers? Do they not have sex going on in the club? Is sex happening in the competitors clubs?
How much are the asking prices?
How popular are these clubs in their markets?
Where would you go right now to get funding for buying viable clubs? How hard are you willing to work to get this funding?
Can you qualify for a liquor license?
How much volume does a club you buy need to turn to make it profitable?
What do you need to do to make these clubs more fun without offering extras?
How do you pay off city officials to not bother your operations?
How many SW members are willing to learn what it takes to start a chain of dancer ownerd clubs which attempts to eventually control the market?
I'm talking about owning clubs as large as Treasures, in Houston and Vegas, the Christies chain, as well as medium sized and even small clubs scattered around the country.
I'd just like to see some intelligent ideas and some research of how a couple of "smart" and resourceful strippers could start and build through franchise or whatever a strip club dynasty that is profitable and stripper friendly.
Find a bunch of clubs for sale, get the info on them, do the math, study their markets, see if they are worth buying, if they have potential, and find a pool of investment capital to make it happen.
Who can get the ball rolling? ;)
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
I think that the key to success and longevity is 1) being located in a city where there's not a lot of pressure on the clubs by citizens or local government and 2) being consistent--your prices, hours, practices are predictable.
However, the thing I would be most afraid of would be employee theft at the bar and at the door; it's oh-so-common in bars and restaurants of all kinds and you would need to either watch like a hawk or have quite a bit of security in place.
I think it's an excellent idea, but I would think you'd need to treat your potential investors (other dancers/former dancers) as any others and vet them thouroughly.
There's some for sale between $385,000 and $2.5 million on this site but there's not enough info without joining to really decide if they're worth buying. To be honest if they are for sale business is probably hurting and they would need improving.
And look, Deja Vu has a site with clubs for sale: http://www.stripclubproperties.com/
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
I have always liked the idea, and would think it could only improve a rough business to have more sympathetic ownership.
There is a medium sized club not too far away which seems to be doing pretty well with female (not ex-dancers, though) ownership. I considered working there as the owner was very cool, but was already where I am working now, and they also require the DJs to clean up the place after the shift is over. been there, done that, and never again, lol...
There was also a female owner who went under a while back in daytona, who treated her dancers very well, but had no idea how to finance her business properly, and pissed a lot of people off in the process (not that this trait is gender-specific!).
I have worked with two female managers, one of whom was as good as they come, and the other--well, as bad as the some of the worst guys, lol--including hitting on the dancers! It was my idea to get Katrina, who has 15 years radio experience, to start DJing--and she seems to be doing very well indeed. More women in traditionally male positions, especially ownership, might be what it takes to improve an industry which seems to be getting rougher by the year.
I think it's a great idea, though--why don't you do it, Tina? I think you've got what it takes, if anyone does...
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Susan Wayward
I think it's an excellent idea, but I would think you'd need to treat your potential investors (other dancers/former dancers) as any others and vet them thouroughly.
There's some for sale between $385,000 and $2.5 million on but there's not enough info without joining to really decide if they're worth buying. To be honest if they are for sale business is probably hurting and they would need improving.
And look, Deja Vu has a site with clubs for sale:
With all those clubs for sale, you'd think those "sleezy" owners don't want to be in the business either.
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
All owners are not sleazy. I'm sure there are some bad ones, but there are also some good ones out there.
The average owner takes on quite a bit of risk to open a club. There is the cost of the building, the furnishings, the stock, the insurances, the licensing, and the advertising that need to be taken care of before the club can even open it's doors. Then there are employee salaries for management, kitchen staff, bar staff and waitstaff that must be met. Add to that the cost utilities and further advertisement, and then the cost of re-stocking the liquor and food. All the while being responsible for hiring management and workers, and dealing with local politicians and cops that are hell-bent on closing your doors because residents constantly complain about the club because they are a bunch of prudes. Don't forget overnight security costs because there are people that will burn the club to the ground if given a chance.
A ballpark idea of the costs:
Building: $1 Million
Furnishings: $100,000
Parking lot: $50,000
Licensing: $50,000 (lots of greasing)
Initial stocking: $50,000
Advertising: $100,000
Operating capital: $100,000 (need to pay bills while club gets going)
Monthly expenses for salaries, property taxes, insurances, utilities, ect..: $20,000
It takes about $1.5 Million to open a club. My partner and I each have to use our homes as collateral so the bank will finance us. If our club goes under, we lose everything. We are accepting a large amount of risk to do this.
We also have to deal with the books and all the day-to-day financial issues and overseeing the management of the club. We have to train our staff and we have to make sure that managers and other employees aren't doing anything illegal, permitting anything illegal, or ripping us off. Anything that they do wrong can cost us our license or our club.
And if anyone has ever run any type of business, you know that dealing with the public can be a challenge. Not everyone who comes through the door is easy going and just looking for a good time. And then there are always employee complaints to deal with. You can't keep everyone happy as much as you try. I can tell you from when we ran our restaurant. Try working out a schedule - half the employees will complain about their shifts, and there are plenty of times when they will pout and just blow off work completely.
If everything is run correctly there is big money to be made, and there are worse places to work than at a place where you get to look at beautiful women all day. But there is also a lot of assumed risk and headaches that go along with it. There wouldn't be a place to work if someone didn't take on the risks. Think about that before you lump all owners together as "sleaze".
And just out of curiousity, how many of you have had a run-in with an owner that caused you to think they were sleazy? What exactly did they do? If it was harrasment, you can and should do something about it.
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Susan Wayward
And look, Deja Vu has a site with clubs for sale:
I didnt read the whole post (cant concentrate on long posts!) so if this was said... sorry!
What first comes to my mind is that wouldnt a DejaVu club be a bad investment? I mean considering they make so much money - why would they sell a club? Unless it was in a crappy area and wasnt making much $$ to be worth keeping?
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrpClbOwnr
All owners are not sleazy. I'm sure there are some bad ones, but there are also some good ones out there.
...just out of curiousity, how many of you have had a run-in with an owner that caused you to think they were sleazy? What exactly did they do? If it was harrasment, you can and should do something about it.
I have! Though the guys who own the club I work in now are great. CrazyBob is a member here whom I would work for in a heartbeat, if I was in Missouri, lol. And you seem very knowledgable and reasonable, as well.
But I have dealt with some real scumbags who were owners and managers. There are so many who demand sexual favors, or find insidious ways to obtain them. Not to mention short-sightedness when it comes to merchandising specials, greed and corruption in varying degrees too numerous to describe in what little time I have before going to work tonight, and a tendency towards arrogance which is distressing.
Thankfully, there are exceptions...
In this area, any case brought to trial by an exotic dancer concerning sexual harassment would be laughed out of court.
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
To quote 'Larry the Liquidator' ... "the last place you want to be invested in is a company with a rising share of a declining industry" !
Ultimately it comes down to up-front investment plus potential risk, versus probable long term rate of return. In an environment where your long term rate of return can be put underwater by the passage of a new local lap dance ordinance at any time, and your ability to resell can be obilterated by the passage of a new zoning ordinance at any time, there are WAY better options for investing a million dollars these days than in a strip club !
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Unless you are a business genius I would not recommend opening a strip club today. Taking over a failing club would be about as smart as taking over a failing airline. Maybe an expeirenced business person could turn things around, but there aren't too many Lee Iococa's that are interested in jumping into the sex industry.
Personally, if I owned a bar today, I would try to offer a variety of entertainmnet options. DJ'ed dancing some nights, bands other nights, maybe bring in male strippers regularly as well as offering female strippers on occasion.
But taking on a full time strip club? No way.
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrpClbOwnr
And just out of curiousity, how many of you have had a run-in with an owner that caused you to think they were sleazy? What exactly did they do? If it was harrasment, you can and should do something about it.
More than once. I have been told that I needed to "take care" of the owner's friends after hours at a hotel, in order to keep my job.
Owners have lied to me, extorted me, and basically just ripped me off. I have been literally kicked out of clubs for loudly refusing to perform extras.
I have never completely trusted anyone, so I always have a "plan b" in place. As much as stripclub owners have tried to pin me down, I have an escape plan. I do not leave my dancer license with the club ever. I always provide my own transportation and housing.
Many dancers trust the club owners/ managers, and get stuck in a strange city w/o any money or any options to get out. The owner lies to the dancer to get her there, and then forces her to do things that she would never do in a work situation if she had any other choice. Check out some of the threads about Guam or Puerto Rico from last year, to see what I mean.
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
I posted this just to get some of you business savvy people a chance to get your juices flowing. I don't know all that it takes to make this happen, but I do know one should never gamble all of their personal resources for any business.
But maaaybe if we collectively thought this out, did some research, talked to willing and open minded club owners who will tell us some of the ropes, and see what is out there for the money, we might surprise ourselves.
Every club for sale obviously is not a wise purchase, but some are, and once we learn the ropes of opening one or two clubs and are successful, we might make some connections and gain enough knowledge to take this farther.
What do you say that we as SW members buy a club "on paper", just to learn what is involved?
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Why do I see solely male interest on SW when it comes to opening a club? Hasn't anyone here (female) considered or looked into being a clubowner, and possibly once successful with a few locations starting a "franchise" of clubs?
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
I have looked into it, crunched the numbers, looked at the long term possibilities of owning a static location, and it just doesn't make financial sense.
I have instead decided to organinze a group of dancers (male and female) to do revue shows at a variety of locations, playing to a co-ed audience, with much reduced contact and no lap dancing. The clubs pay the dancers to dance (like $200 per shift), plus they get tips on top of the club income.
The down side of this kind of show is that the dancers must be able to perform on stage and be able to hold the audience's attention. Not any beauitful body could accomplish this. Stage presence and bigger than life personality are requirements to do this kind of work... But I just went off on a tangent :O .
Well, Jenna Jamison has her club in AZ, and then there is a club in Peoria, IL that was opened a couple of years ago by a feature dancer, too.
I think you will find that women in general are not interested in getting into the sex industry on the whole. Whether it is in club ownership, adult video stores, video or magazine production, adult websites or even racy lingerie shops are more often owned by men then women.
Re: Dancer Ownership and Control of the Stripping Industry
Quote:
Why do I see solely male interest on SW when it comes to opening a club? Hasn't anyone here (female) considered or looked into being a clubowner, and possibly once successful with a few locations starting a "franchise" of clubs?
Yes I have. However, in the 'real world', a female clubowner is at a major disadvantage. While most SW members are familiar with the clubowners' role inside of the club, the most important aspects actually occur outside the club. Issues such as remaining in the good graces of local politicians (who hold the future fate of the club in the tip of their pens), keeping police, gangs, bible-thumpers etc. at bay (who can all make enough trouble to put the club's cash flow into the red), maintaining ties with shall we say 'private security forces' with Sicilian training etc. are all more important to the continued exisitance of a club and to the profitability of a club than anything achieveable via business management.
In all of these areas, in the 'real world' women are not accepted as equals. This makes them much less effective in achieving all of the necessary 'outside the club' objectives - or at the very least requires a significantly higher reliance upon money versus 'leverage' to achieve those necessary 'outside the club' objectives. Yes there are certain specific locations, and yes there are certain specific club business models, where a woman clubowner can deal just as effectively as a man with the 'outside the club' factors, or where the 'outside the club' factors aren't nearly as important to the continued existance and profitability of the club. However, in the vast majority of locations, and with the vast majority of club business models, a real disadvantage exists.
The previous issue aside, it is also a simple fact that the vast majority of club business models today classify clubs as a 'declining' industry. The two business models which are NOT in decline, super-upscale show clubs and very high mileage clubs, both pose their own barriers. In the case of the super-upscale show club business model, the buy-in is incredibly expensive (I think PEC spent 7 million dollars on the club building and furnishings alone). In the case of the very high mileage clubs, a female club owner (ant particularly a female clubowner who was a former dancer) cannot get away with a 'plausible deniability' defense when the club is busted.