how to prevent getting ripped off?
I've been dancing for 9 months now and until last weekend, I have never been ripped off more than $20...and that only happened once. Once in 9 months, not bad, right?
BUT, last weekend was hell! Thursday I got ripped off by TWO guys on the same night--one of them owed me $100 for four dances; the other owed me $50 for two. The first guy told me his friend was going to lend him the money b/c he didn't have it...then when I asked the friend for it, the guy I danced for tried to say that he had already paid me! WTF?
The second guy tried the "oh I didn't know we were doing a dance" line, then tried the "oh I thought it was free" line, and then, after I threatened to kick him in the crotch so hard he wouldn't be able to sit down for a week, he said "ok, ok, I'll go to the ATM". I followed him there, and he walked right past the ATM and out the door. I grabbed a bouncer but by then it was too late.
Then it happened again Friday! Some guy who had supposedly never been in a strip club before tried to tell me he was "confused" when I asked him if he wanted another dance and--you guessed it!--"I thought the second one was free". ::)
So I got ripped off to the tune of $200 in one weekend! This will NOT keep happening. I'm going to start getting my money up front at least for the first dance.
Problem is, I'm not used to doing that, and I don't know how to ask for the money up front. I don't know why I have such a mental block about it, but when I sit down to do a dance I think "ok, I should probably get the money first", but I have no idea how to phrase it! So I don't. And I end up getting ripped off.
I need suggestions! How do you phrase it/what do you say to get your money up front?
And for those of you who do strings of dances, how do you keep from getting ripped off? I don't want to stop everything and ask for money after, say, the third dance, because if I stop the momentum and call his attention to money, he'll likely get jolted out of the utterly seduced mind-numbing daze that I worked so hard to put him in and decide he's spent enough money...and that'll be the end of that gravy train. :(
On the other hand, I don't fancy having a repeat of the other night, where I did a string of four dances and then got NO MONEY afterward because I didn't collect beforehand!
What makes it worse is that the managers say they can't force a custy to pay what he owes. The bouncers can try to intimidate him into paying, but when it comes down to it, the asshole can get off scot-free without paying. And I will have wasted my time dancing for nothing and still have to pay the house cut for the rip-off dances. >:(
So how do you ask for the first dance's $ up front? How do you phrase it? And is there any way to either get money in the middle of a string of dances without killing the mood OR at least remind a custy of how many we're at and make sure he has the money?
Help. :-\ I need some good advice, before it happens again. Because if it does, I swear I will kick the rip-off bastard's teeth down his throat, stomp on his dick until it gushes blood, and probably end up getting fired. >:( Nothing makes my blood boil like being ripped off.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
I know it's easier said than done, but it really is best to get your money up front. Drunk guys, or jerks I always get my money up front. I will not do more than 3 dances before I'm asking for my collection. I do not "run a tab" for custy's unless he's a regular of mine.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Picaresque
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And for those of you who do strings of dances, how do you keep from getting ripped off? I don't want to stop everything and ask for money after, say, the third dance, because if I stop the momentum and call his attention to money, he'll likely get jolted out of the utterly seduced mind-numbing daze that I worked so hard to put him in and decide he's spent enough money...and that'll be the end of that gravy train. :(
After the 2nd song if they tell me they want to keep going, I politely remind them how much is owed at that time. I've never had a customer "not know" how much he's supposed to owe me using this method
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
make sure you say "thats $20...it will be $40 if we continue..want to keep going?"...then "it will be $60 if we continue",etc...so they cant say they didnt know. You can also say that you hate to do it, but theres been issues lately with guys not paying and the club is making you collect up front.
From now on, if you dont get it up front..as soon as the guy balks..get a bouncer. If he needs to use the atm...have a bouncer walk him so he cant bolt( you can always say you need to use the restroom..but he can give your money to the bouncer for you). If you play the bouncer card immediately the guy is less likely to sxcrew you over and you dont waste as much time arguing with him.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
i always had them lay the a predetermined sum of money out (usually 1-3 dances worth, or an amount based on time) or show me sufficient funds 'to get started' (usually 100-200$) in their wallet. asking to lay the money on the table or something if your club is set up so that such a thing isn't inconvenient for you tends to make the guy feel that you aren't trying to scam him, in my experience. i would tell them i wanted to have some money laid out so 'you don't pay me twice accidentally'. then they felt that i was concerned about their welfare and such and prepaying went smoothly. and also, by not shoving the prepaid cash in my purse right away, i didn't come across as greedy even though i basically already had the money.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Yeah...
It is unfortunate, but guys in strip clubs do not generally expect to pay in advance. If you go to a restaurant, you expect to pay after you eat; if one asked you to do it in advance you would meet them with suspicion. The occasional diner-and-dasher doesn't really change that dynamic.
So - in a nutshell, if you do this you will LIKELY lose more money than you save trying this.
The first thing I would recommend is don't try to deal with it yourself. Do not threaten to kick them in the crotch. ALWAYS - as soon as there is a problem - go with "Well, let's go and talk to the management and I'm sure we'll come to an equitable solution." That has failed me once; but it was because the guy was telling the truth about his card not working, and there was literally nothing to be done. There have been times where I didn't get all my money; but I almost always get most of it. Tip the bouncer 10% of what he recovers for you (unless you already tip by default).
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Well about half of the time I'll ask them for their money upfront. It depends on the situation (if the song is going to start in 5 seconds or if they don't seem drunk or sketchy, i'm less likely to ask). Just $20. After the first song I'll say 'I really want to keep going, don't you, bob'. Then *about 5 seconds into the third song* I'll say 'So right now this is the third song, which is $60... that's ok right?'. After that song or after the next song there will be a break of about 30 seconds while the next girl gets onstage and the dj announces it. That's a good moment to sit down and drink some water and ask for money for those first 2 dances.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Well, I've worked at two clubs where the bouncers would not help me collect. That said, I so rarely got ripped off that I just took the dance-n-dashers as a cost of doing business (I firmly believe that money upfront makes it hard for repeat sales, at least where I've worked).
However, there are two methods I've used in the past to deal with the issue myself. The first was psychology, or pop-psychology from a book I read (I think it was Seven Habits, but it couldve been How to Win Friends..). I said "look honey, you really don't wanna leave without paying me, because then I'll have to go out there and tell everyone- all the dancers, and waitresses, and bartenders- that you don't pay up, and you'll never be able to come here again. You wanna come back, right? You should pay me then" (it was that method where you make it very clear how what you want them to do helps THEM...and I was so shocked, but it really worked).
Also, if they are not prepared to listen to the voice of reason, I have taken their shoes. (Just two guys). You just have to be quick, pull up a leg, and pop off a shoe. It's easier if they're still sitting. Then you just ransom the shoe. That has definitely worked for me. But I could see how it might be potentially dangerous.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
"Let's get business out of the way so you can start enjoying the pleasures of me..."
"You gotta pay before you play!"
It's standard OP here in Australia to have the money up-front and usually it isn't "by the dance" yet in strings of dances ie $50 for 3 songs
I honestly don't get why the US has such a problem with this method. It's worked for years and years and years here in Australia and you NEVER hear anyone whinge that they didn't get paid UNLESS it was the club that was with-holding the money or ripping a dancer off.
It is never the customers as they have to "pay before they play" as standard OP.
Just ask. If they object, be honest and say that due to some bad apples (other people not paying after the dance) you have to unfortuantely ask for the money up-front.
Try and sell a string of dances instead of just dance-by-dance.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GoldCoastGirl
It's standard OP here in Australia to have the money up-front and usually it isn't "by the dance" yet in strings of dances ie $50 for 3 songs
I honestly don't get why the US has such a problem with this method. It's worked for years and years and years here in Australia and you NEVER hear anyone whinge that they didn't get paid UNLESS it was the club that was with-holding the money or ripping a dancer off.
I think you answered your own question. In places where it is the standard business model, it will not elicit the same suspicion. When I was in Guam, they paid the club, in advance, and it never seemed to stop them from buying more. Here it would, for the simple reason that it is not how it is done. Changing a fairly universal business model - it would be met with A LOT of suspicion, and frankly, not really worth the short and mid term loss.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
I think that using threats/harsh language is not something a dancer should have to do at work. I mean it sucks to lose your cool, but the bouncers are there to help you, and you tip them, so you should take advantage of getting them to handle tough situations like nonpayment.
It really helps not to be the bad guy, because when you come off as abrasive, it just reinforces their resolve not to give you money.
Extending credit is a gamble, and it probably pays more often then not, because breaking the fantasy to deal with money will make it harder to keep most men back there.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
When I was brand new, David, the manager at the time, advised me to get my money up front, and I did. It was how I learned, and I've since unlearned it. It makes it easier to do more dances, and I'm VERY trusting of custys, I've gone up on stage in a rush and went back after to get paid.... I dunno, it works for me. They ofen end up doing more dances or tipping b/c I trusted themm....
But my club has a large enough number of custys that I pre screen them, so I only go up to the ones who look like money. If I get asked to dance for someone I feel is a rip off risk, I still get the money upfront. I just say I'm pretty sure I'll have to run off and go on stage, so lets get that out of the way, I'd get in trouble if I am late for stage.... etc.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mollyzmoon
Also, if they are not prepared to listen to the voice of reason, I have taken their shoes. (Just two guys). You just have to be quick, pull up a leg, and pop off a shoe. It's easier if they're still sitting. Then you just ransom the shoe. That has definitely worked for me. But I could see how it might be potentially dangerous.
Ok, I liked both options Molly, but this second had me dying with laughter. I can imagine some guy being freaked out by a stripper taking off his show. Do they always pay after you take the shoe? I can see how someone would want their shoe back ;D
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Well, both times I did it, it was very snowy and cold outside. So yeah, they paid. haha!
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mollyzmoon
However, there are two methods I've used in the past to deal with the issue myself. The first was psychology, or pop-psychology from a book I read (I think it was Seven Habits, but it couldve been How to Win Friends..). I said "look honey, you really don't wanna leave without paying me, because then I'll have to go out there and tell everyone- all the dancers, and waitresses, and bartenders- that you don't pay up, and you'll never be able to come here again. You wanna come back, right? You should pay me then" (it was that method where you make it very clear how what you want them to do helps THEM...and I was so shocked, but it really worked).
This was "How to win friends and influence people" by Dale Carnegie. Great book and it really works a lot of times! I usually feel the waters out, I go by my gut instinct, usually my gut tells me if a guy is going to try to stiff me or not so the ones where I get that feeling I make them pay upfront. Oh, and I always get paid upfront in VIP, because that's $300/hr versus $10 per song, a lot more to lose. I have to say, luckily, I've not been scammed that much, I got a couple fast ones pulled on me when I first started because of being unsure. The one I'll never forget is when I did 2 dances for a bachelor party in which they were all putting one's in my garter and said that was part of the money. At that time I took it as that, after what you all told me that was part of the tip, anytime a guy tries to pull that now, I tell them, that's the tip and not counted towards the dance.
One guy tried to get out of paying me for one dance saying he thought that the dances were free.::) Yeah, right buddy! I stood there with a very serious, cold hard ass look in my face, stared him down in the eye and said "you better pay me right fucking now!!!!" He coughed up the money! As for the guy that walked out the door, knowing me I probably would've gone after him ( I know bad idea but I do have a temper and no tolerance for people who steal from me!!!)
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
i think asking for the money upfront even in places where it's not the norm can work for you, depending on the nature of your hustle. it never lost me money, because i tried to dance for a small number of guys who i'd developed a rapport with. even guys who weren't used to that did it and sometimes tipped afterwards. i don't know that it would work as well if a girl's primary hustle was 2 dances each for 20 guys each night. i just always made out like getting the money upfront was to protect them, sort of like the girls who put customers on a dance budget when they said 'i went crazy last time and spent too much'. so i guess i remain pro-get your moneys upfront if you can make it sound like something that benefits the guy.
i mean, probably 15-20% of the time i didn't ask upfront and it was so harrowing if one of those times the guy was short. lots of borrowing from friends and such, which is frustrating.
Re: how to prevent getting ripped off?
i always tell the guy i need the money upfront, and i say it's club rules and i might get in trouble if i dont do it their way. sometimes with a giggle or eyeroll, like "of course i trust you, i have to follow their dumb rules"