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Thread: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

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    Default the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    (snip)"NEW YORK (AP) -- A multimillionaire who sued New York City over its refusal to pay for his learning-disabled son's private-school education won his legal fight by default Wednesday when the Supreme Court couldn't agree which side was right.

    With the vote deadlocked at 4-4, the justices left intact a lower court's ruling in favor of former Viacom and MTV executive Tom Freston.

    The potential tiebreaker, Justice Anthony Kennedy, did not participate in the case. The court gave no explanation for his absence.

    On its face, the outcome means that New York City's Education Department will have to pay Freston a little less than $22,000 to cover a year's tuition at the Manhattan private school his son attended after he was diagnosed with mild learning disabilities in the late 1990s.

    But the split vote kept the court from addressing the case's key question: Do the parents of special education students have a right to demand a private school education for their kids without giving public schools a try first?

    Reacting to Wednesday's court ruling, Freston's lawyer, Paul Gardephe, said it counted as a victory for at least some families who believe their children would suffer in public schools ill-equipped to deal with them.

    The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals decision affirmed in the tie vote held that parents who can prove that their child couldn't get an appropriate education in the public schools may sue for private-school tuition reimbursement, even if they never tried the public system."(snip)


    In other words, if you happen to be a billionaire like MTV founder Mr. Freston, and can afford to hire high powered attorneys, and you can afford to hire an 'accomodating' psychologist who will diagnose your child with a 'learning disability', you are now entitled to have state taxpayers pick up the tuition tab to send your child to a PRIVATE school.


    (snip)""Parents say it's harder to get into than Harvard. It's an elite, private Manhattan school that mainly takes kids of the rich, famous and well connected. Kevin Bacon and Kyra Sedgwick's son went to the Churchill School, and a nephew attends. Artist and filmmaker Julian Schnabel's son goes there. Designer Dana Buchman wrote a memoir about her daughter's experience at the school, which caters to bright kids, grades kindergarten through 12, who've been declared learning disabled. But the thing that separates Churchill from the Daltons and Chapins is the price: It's free. Rather -- you, the taxpayer, fund private education for kids whose parents can afford the freight. Because 96 percent of Churchill's 405 students get their tuition -- $34,000 this year -- picked up by the state and city. You buy these kids state-of-the-art facilities, plus class sizes that top out at 12. Of the 16 students whose parents write a fat check this year, most will ask for a refund -- and get it. I asked Bacon to comment, but he said 'no' and hung up. Schnabel did not return a call.

    "Top political consultant Hank Sheinkopf, whose daughter attends for free, admitted it stinks rich kids primarily get a gratis private-school education. 'What's wrong … is that poor kids can't get in,' he said. 'You have to hire an expensive lawyer. I'd like to see other people have this opportunity, too.' For me, the whistle was blown on Churchill by a mom whose son is enrolled -- against her wishes. In a fight with her wealthy doctor ex-husband to get their boy into a mainstream school, she handed me the Churchill directory. It reads like a society register. For every kid on it who lives in Brooklyn, there are perhaps 20 on Park Avenue, in Greenwich Village or on Sutton Place. Since 1999, the number of parents who get kids diagnosed with a disability, then apply for a private-school refund, is up enormously. The city paid more than $57 million for 3,675 kids whose cases were contested by the Ed. Department in the '05-'06 school year."

    Now, if you put these three stories together, you find out that there's a scam going on here with more and more parents claiming their kids are disabled to get them into this school, the Churchill school. This is not the same school as the school where Tom Freston's kid goes. That's the Stephen Gaynor School on the West Side. So the disabled children of the rich and powerful and the famous and the wealthy are having the state and city of New York's taxpayers pay $34 grand a year in tuition to get 'em in. And the poor can't get in. "The city is fighting against thousands of parents who never even try public schools before demanding a private-school refund. That's the case with multimillionaire ex-Viacom chief Tom Freston, whose son attends another pricey Manhattan school. Freston is taking his case for a cash refund to the Supreme Court -- 'on principle.'" And won. "Lawyer Neal Rosenberg is the chief go-to guy for getting your kid into a pricey school gratis. He claims a '100 percent success rate' at Churchill. 'I've never had a client who presented a disability just to get the Board of Ed to pay,' he insisted. He disagrees that would-be Churchill kids should try public school first. 'Why make their child a guinea pig?' he said."

    So when you boil all this down, folks, what you have is two things. You offer something for free, and people are going to take it. I don't care what their income level is; they're going to take it. If they have to run a little bit of a scam, they'll take it. The second thing is this is happening in New York. These are the same kind of people that will not send their kids to the public schools whether they're disabled or not, will not do it, and they will fight school choice left and right so that you, who don't have the kind of money they have, do not have the same access that they do. They want to keep it limited so that your kids are not polluting theirs by being in the same classroom. "(snip) from rushlimbaugh.com


    I posted this tidbit because it serves as yet one more example that both the hypocrisy and the actual finances involved re Democrat / Liberal calls to 'tax the rich' are echoed in Democrat / Liberal calls to exclusively fund public schools. Just like the actual tax picture for the 'very rich' being far less expensive than advertised thanks to Democrat refusal to address offshore tax havens, the private school tuition picture is also apparently far less expensive for the 'very rich' as well !!!

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 10-11-2007 at 07:50 AM.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    OPM. OTHER PEOPLE's MONEY ! It's always easy to spend other people's money
    than your own.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    and for those who don't already know this, the 'very rich' certainly know how to protect their OWN money while they spend ours !

    (snip)"Back to the tax haven business: it is big, big business and big business needs all sorts of tax havens because they don't like paying taxes and they are willing to fill bags and bags of gold coins to bribe politicians in order to avoid paying taxes and Congress should be aware of this because ever since I was a teenager, back when I turned literally 13, our dear country decided to cut taxes and spend like crazy which is why the national debt was $0 when I was 13 and my 57th birthday is right around the corner, in just 3 days and the national debt is $9 trillion and rising fiendishly.


    So periodically, over this 44 year span, the US frets about collecting taxes and they make noise about this and the bags of money pour in and note that this noise making coincides with cycles for raising money for running for office: it is a ritual that ends when the mules and helicopters bearing funds rain money or carry money to or on the politicians in the rotting hell of DC and all other hiding places for these corrupt pols.


    From MSN Money Central:

    Mitt Romney and John Edwards have worked for big funds. And there are three candidates based in or near New York City -- Rudolph Giuliani, Christopher Dodd and Hillary Rodham Clinton -- all of whom are drinking deeply from the private-equity cup.

    What do the rich and powerful at hedge funds and private-equity shops like Blackstone, Fortress Investment , Bain Capital and SAC Capital Advisors hope to get for their money?

    A lower tax rate, for one.


    Go, Hillary! She and her good, corrupt buddies voted for the changes in the bankruptcy laws right on the beginning of the sudden surge in bankruptcies we are now seeing. Did the money people foresee this Alt-A tsunami back in late 2005? HAHAHA. All the talk from them that all was well and America was strong, etc, was fake. Proof of this was their rush to pass a very unpopular law. The media helped them, as usual. Stories about people using bankruptcy laws to cheat banks were rife before the passage of this very unpopular bankruptcy bill. A number of us online commentators mentioned that this law was passed because the banks knew damn well, many Americans were going to be forced into bankruptcy and of course, the banks wanted to seize the houses and the credit card companies wanted to keep people paying even if it is a little bit, no one was to escape perpetual life-time indebtedness.


    The fly in this financial ointment is gigantic and ugly: 70% of our economy is consumer-based and if more and more consumers are cut off from this because they can't go bankrupt, the economy will begin to decline, rapidly. You can get blood from a stone but you can't get a stone to buy blood.


    I will note here that the media never mentions Kucinich, the Democrat the money men fear and hate the most, and seldom mentions Ron Paul who gives the money men the willies. They only talk about the 'top condenders' who are always people backed by the powerful money interests that are destroying our nation.


    Time to discuss tax havens and hedge funds some more, I wish to begin with today and go backwards in time because looking back in this fashion lets one see how attempts at stopping this mess peter out, they fail to curb anything and even lead to worse abuses and more problems:


    From Hedge Media:

    Hedge fund capital flows positive in August, says HFR

    Hedge fund investors continued to allocate new capital to funds, with new capital inflows of USD8.86bn in August, albeit less than the USD16.8bn inflow in July, according to data from Hedge Fund Research, the provider of hedge fund industry information and performance data.


    This is 'good news'. Hedge funds are still growing. But their rate of growth has been cut in half, literally. At Hedge Media, they had a banner story that one of my favorite pirate coves that swears fealty to Queen Elizabeth II, a protector of pirates just like the previous QE, Jersey was going to reduce taxes to 0%. I went, 'Huh?' I think this great news would be of great interest to Democratic (sic) Senate Leader Reid! Did he sip champagne upon hearing this news? The taxes in tax havens are dropping. Hoorah! More donations for the Party's party!"(snip)

    from

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    and for those who don't already know this, the 'very rich' certainly know how to protect their OWN money while they spend ours !

    (snip)"Back to the tax haven business: it is big, big business and big business needs all sorts of tax havens because they don't like paying taxes and they are willing to fill bags and bags of gold coins to bribe politicians in order to avoid paying taxes and Congress should be aware of this because ever since I was a teenager, back when I turned literally 13, our dear country decided to cut taxes and spend like crazy which is why the national debt was $0 when I was 13 and my 57th birthday is right around the corner, in just 3 days and the national debt is $9 trillion and rising fiendishly.


    So periodically, over this 44 year span, the US frets about collecting taxes and they make noise about this and the bags of money pour in and note that this noise making coincides with cycles for raising money for running for office: it is a ritual that ends when the mules and helicopters bearing funds rain money or carry money to or on the politicians in the rotting hell of DC and all other hiding places for these corrupt pols.


    From MSN Money Central:

    Mitt Romney and John Edwards have worked for big funds. And there are three candidates based in or near New York City -- Rudolph Giuliani, Christopher Dodd and Hillary Rodham Clinton -- all of whom are drinking deeply from the private-equity cup.

    What do the rich and powerful at hedge funds and private-equity shops like Blackstone, Fortress Investment , Bain Capital and SAC Capital Advisors hope to get for their money?

    A lower tax rate, for one.


    Go, Hillary! She and her good, corrupt buddies voted for the changes in the bankruptcy laws right on the beginning of the sudden surge in bankruptcies we are now seeing. Did the money people foresee this Alt-A tsunami back in late 2005? HAHAHA. All the talk from them that all was well and America was strong, etc, was fake. Proof of this was their rush to pass a very unpopular law. The media helped them, as usual. Stories about people using bankruptcy laws to cheat banks were rife before the passage of this very unpopular bankruptcy bill. A number of us online commentators mentioned that this law was passed because the banks knew damn well, many Americans were going to be forced into bankruptcy and of course, the banks wanted to seize the houses and the credit card companies wanted to keep people paying even if it is a little bit, no one was to escape perpetual life-time indebtedness.


    The fly in this financial ointment is gigantic and ugly: 70% of our economy is consumer-based and if more and more consumers are cut off from this because they can't go bankrupt, the economy will begin to decline, rapidly. You can get blood from a stone but you can't get a stone to buy blood.


    I will note here that the media never mentions Kucinich, the Democrat the money men fear and hate the most, and seldom mentions Ron Paul who gives the money men the willies. They only talk about the 'top condenders' who are always people backed by the powerful money interests that are destroying our nation.


    Time to discuss tax havens and hedge funds some more, I wish to begin with today and go backwards in time because looking back in this fashion lets one see how attempts at stopping this mess peter out, they fail to curb anything and even lead to worse abuses and more problems:


    From Hedge Media:

    Hedge fund capital flows positive in August, says HFR

    Hedge fund investors continued to allocate new capital to funds, with new capital inflows of USD8.86bn in August, albeit less than the USD16.8bn inflow in July, according to data from Hedge Fund Research, the provider of hedge fund industry information and performance data.


    This is 'good news'. Hedge funds are still growing. But their rate of growth has been cut in half, literally. At Hedge Media, they had a banner story that one of my favorite pirate coves that swears fealty to Queen Elizabeth II, a protector of pirates just like the previous QE, Jersey was going to reduce taxes to 0%. I went, 'Huh?' I think this great news would be of great interest to Democratic (sic) Senate Leader Reid! Did he sip champagne upon hearing this news? The taxes in tax havens are dropping. Hoorah! More donations for the Party's party!"(snip)

    from http://elainemeinelsupkis.typepad.com/money_matters/
    Der uber-rich didn't get that way by being stupid. And they didn't stay that way by paying their fair share of taxes. They NEVER do.

    In addition to off-shore havens they sock it away in foundations and trusts;
    they buy up miilions in triple tax-free Muni bonds etc. etc. Not to mention all the nifty write-offs they get. Gourmet meals in Corporate clubs and dining rooms.
    Vacations masked as business trips- always to "fun" places like London, Paris,
    Bermuda, Palm Springs etc.etc.

    These are the folks Bill and Hil have been sucking up to for years.

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    Arrow Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    True indeed Melonie, although unfortunately, nothing new.

    However, the power of the ruling class is (supposedly) subject to the vote of the people:

    .

    Why do they get away with this? Because the downfall of our society has been that:

    People have been lead to be, and are now, less educated in issues of History Which always does repeat itself when the mistakes of our past are poorly understood, thus repeated, yet they are informed about every step Lohan/Spears/Tinkerbell make.

    People are less educated on social issues, less educated about their government and the rights and responsibilities that they are afforded by it, and in exchange have become willingful slaves to their spending habits in a desperate attempt to "overcome" the hardships their parents underwent. While sinking them into debt, this also serves to disconnect them from their societal bases while sucking them into a perpetual vortex in which they literally cannot afford to keep their heads above water long enough to inform themselves on what's really going on, much less do something about it.

    Technology has allowed people to become more and more isolated, thus creating a gap between themselves and their fellow American, breaking down the bridge of communication toward understand and building up the walls of hatred and societal entropies- FAST.

    All of this creates huge portions of the population who either:
    1) Have no idea why they are voting for the person they are voting for, but do so out of "patriotism,"
    2) Simply vote representing one agenda and allowing every other issue to go by the wayside or
    3) Vote against a specific candidate/agenda, which is not common sense at all.

    The rest relinquish their vote either because their issues are ostracized or out of an understanding that privatization has virtually opened a whole new global political sector which does not seek the approval of the American people, or any people, for that matter.

    And while I am sure that ^this^ also, is not new, it is now being done more deceptively, brazenly defiant and blatently in our faces by those who have literally "Sworn" an "Oath" before entering their offices, that they are to be held accountable to "We, The People," as we are unfortunately witnessing now in this cabinet.

    Conversely, the rich have "all the time in the world" to contemplate these issues without the pressures of living paycheck-to-paycheck as most do now in America and abroad. And so, the rich put more effort into their own agandas, naturally, actually following-up and financing said agendas making sure that they are addressed.

    It is one bloody hand washing the other bloody hand, IMHO Melonie.

    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by IsobelWren
    Well, except that it's a virus, so antibiotics wouldn't work against it in the first place.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nautilus
    i wish there was a vaccine for child sexual abusers


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    Arrow Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    You can get blood from a stone but you can't get a stone to buy blood.
    LMAO Melonie, good find.

    On a sad note, although you might be able to "get blood from a stone" but not be able to "get a stone to buy blood," how much do you think blood can buy?

    Using the war as an indication, I say A LOT; Too bad they have figured this out .

    .
    "Everything that is in Heaven and on earth is penetrated with connectedness." - Hildegard of Bingen [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Quote Originally Posted by IsobelWren
    Well, except that it's a virus, so antibiotics wouldn't work against it in the first place.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nautilus
    i wish there was a vaccine for child sexual abusers


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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    On a sad note, although you might be able to "get blood from a stone" but not be able to "get a stone to buy blood," how much do you think blood can buy?

    Using the war as an indication, I say A LOT; Too bad they have figured this out
    and just who do you suppose owns the majority of stock in companies like Boeing, General Dynamics, Northrup-Grumman, and a host of other companies whose profits are directly tied to war ? Did I hear ahem the 'very rich' along with gov't pension funds ? It isn't just Halliburton that swills from the public trough where war profits are concerned !

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    Arrow Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Agreed Mel.

    And may I add Biotech & Pharms?

    .

    Sadder still, as I mentioned earlier,

    Quote Originally Posted by Hot2Trot
    History Which always does repeat itself when the mistakes of our past are poorly understood, thus repeated...
    Although unbelievable, remains nothing new (Consider WWII).
    It is a twisted world.

    .
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    Quote Originally Posted by IsobelWren
    Well, except that it's a virus, so antibiotics wouldn't work against it in the first place.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nautilus
    i wish there was a vaccine for child sexual abusers


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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    And may I add Biotech & Pharms?
    I'm surprised that you didn't hit on the biggest Democrat / Liberal 'gift' to the 'very rich' ... alternative energy. Besides indirectly subsidizing the profits of ethanol refiners via maintaining quotas against foreign ethanol imports and charging a 56 cent per gallon tax which is 'refunded' to American ethanol producers, and besides indirectly subsidizing the profits of wind farms / solar via income tax credits to customers and mandated higher prices via 'green' electric rates, the deepest slop from the public trough is the 'production tax credits' which accrue to the owners of ethanol refineries, wind generator farms, solar energy farms etc. Besides allowing these businesses to operate essentially tax-free, these production tax credits can also be directly used to offset OTHER tax liabilities for the 'very rich' owners.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    These are the folks Bill and Hil have been sucking up to for years.
    Get over it already, Bill and Hil are hardly the only politicians who have been sucking up to these guys for years, I think it's fairly safe to say that politicians on both sides of the aisle have been doing the same.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ...'I will note here that the media never mentions Kucinich, the Democrat the money men fear and hate the most, and seldom mentions Ron Paul who gives the money men the willies. They only talk about the 'top condenders' who are always people backed by the powerful money interests that are destroying our nation'...
    I might change my mind by the time of the election next year, but right now, I think I'll vote for Ron Paul, even if it has to be a write-in vote.

    And as you've already mentioned in another thread, it seems there is a big push right now in the MSM to prepare the general public to accept a "Carbon Tax."(another deceit from the wealthy being perpetrated upon the middle class). I didn't like the idea when Bill Clinton tried to do it during his administration, and I don't like it now!

    And I also expect a really good explanation from the pols who support a carbon tax. An explanation as to how, if humans are the primary cause of global warming, they didn't really do much of anything to control the component of "carbon footprint growth" from illegal immigration. So why should any individuals, including illegal immigrants, have to pay a carbon tax?

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Get over it already, Bill and Hil are hardly the only politicians who have been sucking up to these guys for years, I think it's fairly safe to say that politicians on both sides of the aisle have been doing the same.
    Actually Richard, the "uber-rich" tend to support Dems because they do just as well, if not better with Dem. Tax Policy and definitely do MUCH better with Dem. Corporate Welfare policies with things like Alternative Energy. I know, I know, more of those annoying and boring stats you never like to look at.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    ^^^ and besides the Corporate Welfare to Alternative Energy companies, you can throw in indirect Corporate Welfare for the IT industry, the Trial Lawyers, the Hedge Funds, indirect Corporate Welfare for the health care industry etc.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ and besides the Corporate Welfare to Alternative Energy companies, you can throw in indirect Corporate Welfare for the IT industry, the Trial Lawyers, the Hedge Funds, indirect Corporate Welfare for the health care industry etc.
    Melonie PLEASE !. Go easy on those who can't handle factual information.
    Generally the Trial Lawyers do NOT belong to the "uber-rich". Not even the John Edwards types but some of the bigger white shoe DEFENSE firms do have partners who belong to the super-wealthy. And they are just as dependent on maintaining the current status quo as the Plaintiff's Bar.
    The Hedge Funders generally LOVE Democrats and vote with their wallets.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    Actually Richard, the "uber-rich" tend to support Dems because they do just as well, if not better with Dem. Tax Policy and definitely do MUCH better with Dem. Corporate Welfare policies with things like Alternative Energy. I know, I know, more of those annoying and boring stats you never like to look at.
    .....I guess I missed the statistics, oh wait there weren't any. I'm guessing this is just an opinion you picked up from some right wing ideologue.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    If you BOTHER to LOOK at WHO is contributing to Hillary and Obama you will see lots of folks like Bill Gates; Warren Buffet and the founders of BOTH Yahoo and Google.

    If you actually take the time to LOOK at the respective family wealth of Democrat Senators and Representatives compared to Republicans you'll see the Dems tend to be MUCH wealthier- Rockefeller; Kennedy; Lautenberg; Dodd; Kohl; Pelosi and many others are multi-millionaires.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    If you BOTHER to LOOK at WHO is contributing to Hillary and Obama you will see lots of folks like Bill Gates; Warren Buffet and the founders of BOTH Yahoo and Google.
    Isn't that how politics works, the front runners usually get the most money??

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    If you actually take the time to LOOK at the respective family wealth of Democrat Senators and Representatives compared to Republicans you'll see the Dems tend to be MUCH wealthier- Rockefeller; Kennedy; Lautenberg; Dodd; Kohl; Pelosi and many others are multi-millionaires.
    Why do you see it as a problem for Democratic politicians to be wealthy but not Republican politicians? That makes no sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Isn't that how politics works, the front runners usually get the most money??

    Why do you see it as a problem for Democratic politicians to be wealthy but not Republican politicians? That makes no sense.

    I have to tip my hat to you Richard. You've mastered obfuscation to the point where you deliberately misunderstand those with whom you disagree and then think you've made a meaningful point.

    I NEVER said it was a "problem" for any politician to be wealthy. I simply pointed out to you that Dem politicians tended to be wealthier than their Republican counterparts AND that the uber-rich are supporting Dems much more than Republicans. And not just this year. It's been going on since JFK ran in 1960.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    I have to tip my hat to you Richard. You've mastered obfuscation to the point where you deliberately misunderstand those with whom you disagree and then think you've made a meaningful point.

    I NEVER said it was a "problem" for any politician to be wealthy. I simply pointed out to you that Dem politicians tended to be wealthier than their Republican counterparts AND that the uber-rich are supporting Dems much more than Republicans. And not just this year. It's been going on since JFK ran in 1960.
    Perhaps those uber-rich realize that what's best for the economy (and thus themselves) is to have everybody prospering not just those at the very top. Perhaps they also realize that the best way to accomplish that is to spread the wealth via spending on needed social programs and targeted tax cuts to lower- and middle-income Americans, thus broadly stimulating the economy as opposed to the Republicans plan of dumping large sums of money into defense contractors, political friends and high-income Americans alone. But what do I know?

  20. #20
    Banned Eric Stoner's Avatar
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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Perhaps those uber-rich realize that what's best for the economy (and thus themselves) is to have everybody prospering not just those at the very top. Perhaps they also realize that the best way to accomplish that is to spread the wealth via spending on needed social programs and targeted tax cuts to lower- and middle-income Americans, thus broadly stimulating the economy as opposed to the Republicans plan of dumping large sums of money into defense contractors, political friends and high-income Americans alone. But what do I know?
    Guess what ? You have a very valid point.

    One of the real and serious problems with the current economy ( which btw Clinton did NOTHING in 8 years to address ) is the squeeze being put on the middle class. We ought to have a middle class tax cut. Clinton promised one and never delivered. Remember ?
    None, Repeat- NONE of the Dem candidates has proposed such relief. New and bigger spending ? Yes. Tax relief ? No. And none of the Republicans including our current Pres. is proposing anything either.
    And btw. None of them, from either party. has proposed a solution to the fiscal meltdown in both Social Security and Medicare. Social Security will be in negative cash flow as soon as 2017.

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    We ought to have a middle class tax cut. Clinton promised one and never delivered. Remember ?
    None, Repeat- NONE of the Dem candidates has proposed such relief. New and bigger spending ? Yes. Tax relief ? No. And none of the Republicans including our current Pres. is proposing anything either.
    well, to be factually accurate, the Republicans did attempt to get some permanent AMT relief ... which would have primarily affected 'middle class' Americans earning $75k per year and up ... but the permanent AMT relief was shot down by the Democratic majority.


    also to be factually accurate, some high profile presidential vetos have contained Democratic attempts to greatly increase gov't spending ( latest example SCHIP). However you are absolutely correct that neither the Republicans or the Democrats proposed to reduce gov't spending ... it was simply a matter of Democrats wanting huge increases in spending versus Republicans wanting smaller increases in spending.

    Based on everything I see happening with the uber-rich, with the gov't defined 'poor', and with Washington politics, the US 'middle class' is now SCREWED.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    http://www.opensecrets.org/parties/index.asp

    2006 Party Totals

    Democratic Party $599,670,996

    $707,164,475 Republican Party


    DEMOCRATIC PARTY
    (2006 election cycle)


    Sector Totals
    Sector
    Total Contributions

    Agribusiness

    $2,501,464

    Communic/Electronics

    $14,917,774

    Construction

    $3,808,016

    Defense

    $1,048,966

    Energy/Nat Resource

    $2,391,922

    Finance/Insur/RealEst

    $42,248,972

    Health

    $7,836,599

    Lawyers & Lobbyists

    $25,762,094

    Transportation

    $1,812,491

    Misc Business

    $17,442,255

    Labor

    $6,258,964

    Ideology/Single-Issue

    $52,578,919

    Other

    $37,703,888



    REPUBLICAN PARTY
    (2006 election cycle)


    Sector Totals

    Sector
    Total Contributions

    Agribusiness

    $7,216,678

    Communic/Electronics

    $8,521,813

    Construction

    $12,305,811

    Defense

    $2,015,577

    Energy/Nat Resource

    $9,740,689

    Finance/Insur/RealEst

    $51,064,486

    Health

    $16,486,745

    Lawyers & Lobbyists

    $10,903,413

    Transportation

    $6,584,646

    Misc Business

    $30,564,267

    Labor

    $671,334

    Ideology/Single-Issue

    $38,090,671

    Other

    $38,513,409
    Nature knows no indecencies; man invents them. ~ Mark Twain


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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    Both parties are corrupt. Neither really looks after the average american citzen anymore. But it is all we have for now.

    The change in bankrupty laws was lobbied hard for by the banking industry. If you look at the numbers Finance interests gave huge sums to both parties. It takes both parties to hand out this money and to create these laws. Both parties need the blame.
    Nature knows no indecencies; man invents them. ~ Mark Twain


  24. #24
    BrunetteGoddess
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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    This is all pretty damn scary.

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    Default Re: the rich indeed get to play by different rules !

    ^^^ I would also add that a LOT has changed in regard to corporate donations since the 2006 election ...



    (snip)"The fix is in. It is now official. The corporate powers-that-be have officially sanctioned the Democrats in the 2008 elections. According to The Center for Responsive Politics and their Campaign Finance website “Open Secrets”, the political gift giving program for the “own your own politician” has turned to the left. Democrats now get more of the corporate “manna” than the Republicans.

    So where does that leave the corporations? Have they finally become aware of the evil mechanizations of Darth Cheney? Have they finally decided to follow the good side of “the force”? Hardly, in reality the corporate kingmakers have seen the writing on the wall and are now doing “damage control” on their swiftly sinking ship. The ship seems to be listing so badly, that instead of trying to repair a ship that surely has a date with destiny at the bottom of the political sea, they are climbing aboard another ship that seems a bit more seaworthy.

    This will obviously be greeted with shouts of joy from diehard Democrats that can’t see the forest for the trees. They don’t seem to understand that they are just trading one type of dictatorial power for another one. The saddest part of this story is that now they will be controlled by the same forces that control the Republicans (not that they weren’t controlled by the corporate boys before). Now it is official. There is more to this than meets the eyes however, so let us get to the putrid mechanics of this political swicheroo.

    Let us gaze at the top ten donors. This might raise a few eyebrows:

    1 Act Blue $3,151,038 100% Dem 0% GOP Solidly Democratic

    2 Goldman-Sachs $1,656,954 71% DEM 29% GOP Strongly Democratic

    3 Citigroup Inc. $1,582,857 63% Dem 37% GOP Leans Democratic

    4 JP Morgan Chase & Co. $1,171,720 68% Dem 32% GOP Strongly Democratic

    5 AT&T Inc. $1,094,144 45% Dem 55% GOP On the fence

    6 UBS AG $1,068,953 62% Dem 38% GOP Leans Democratic

    7 Intl Brotherhood of Electrical Workers $947,815 98% Dem 2% GOP Solidly Democratic

    8 Laborers Union $924,500 91% Dem 9%GOP Solidly Democratic

    9 Morgan Stanley $923,850 62% Dem 38%GOP Leans Democratic

    10 Machinists/Aerospace Workers Unionv $904,000 97% Dem 3%GOP Solidly Democratic


    Take out the Unions and the Democratic Organizations and we are left with what else, the bankers. Surprised, don’t be, they were the largest donors to the Republicans for the last 16 years. As Bob Dylan sang; “You just want to be on the side that’s winning”. The fact is, Goldman Sachs has been the largest political contributor to political races in history. The rankings from 11-20 are Lehman Brothers, Merrill Lynch, General Electric, Comcast Corp, Akin, Gump et al, American Bankers Assn, Air Line Pilots Assn, Ernst & Young, American Federation of St/County/Municipal Employees, American Assn for Justice. Of these, only The American Bankers Assn, and Ernst & Young give more money to the GOP. Merrill Lynch is hedging their bet with an even number to both."(snip)


    ^^^ all of which probably guarantees that when the Democrats seize the presidency in 2008 and tax increases are enacted soon after, that the 'uber-rich' will still be able to count on their hedge fund investments through the major financial houses remaining anonymous and remaining de-facto tax exempt !!!

    This also likely guarantees that some form of subprime homeowner bailout program will be enacted for 'low income' homeowners ( remember, the people who shouldn't have ever gotten mortgages in the first place, but were able to thanks to HUD subsidies and FNM/FRE policy dictates which started under the Clinton administration) who can't afford their mortgage payments in the absence of teaser rates / negative amortization. Such a bailout will transfer the impending losses of the big financial houses to the US taxpayer.

    However, since 'low income' taxpayers really don't pay squat in taxes, and since the 'uber-rich' taxpayers will still be able to shelter a large percentage of their earnings from taxes via offshore tax havens / hedge funds etc. which Democrats refuse to legislate against, it will actually be the 'middle class' taxpayer ( translation any single American earning more than $75k per year = every full time dancer) who will be forced to bear the largest tax burden in terms of percent of their total earnings being siphoned off as taxes.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 10-20-2007 at 07:12 PM.

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