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Thread: Bellydancing strippers?

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    Veteran Member Robertjordan's Avatar
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    Default Bellydancing strippers?

    I was in Southern California this past weekend and visited a restaurant in Irvine. It was a Persian restaurant which was pretty packed and they had live music and a belly dancing show. The first thing I noticed was that the girls were not Persian at all, they were American. There were 4 girls and they did several different routines on stage, changing costumes and doing different songs. At the end they split up and danced all around the restaurant, soliciting dollar bills which were placed in their waistbands or cleavage by the customers. It was really an odd scene as this was clearly a family restaurant and they even ended by pulling some young (5-7 year old) girls onto the stage with them at the end.

    The dancers were decent belly dancers and one or two of them were really good. But when they began soliciting dollar bills I could have sworn it was very strip-club'ish. The girls themselves were really comfortable with this role so I figured they were either current or former strippers. They weren't naked or even risque in the way they dressed at all. And their moves were more or less belly dancing, with a little stripper flair. I was curious if anyone has seen something like this or even participated. I wasn't offended and everyone seemed to have a good time. I was just taken by surprise as I didn't quite expect this approach but I really never go see belly dancers so who knows?

  2. #2
    Yekhefah
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    First there was bellydancing, then there were strippers. It's basically the same thing, we just take our clothes off and do it to different music. Bellydancers were soliciting money hundreds of years before Gypsy Rose Lee.

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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Tipping dancers/entertainers, whether they keep their clothes on or not, is an age-old tradition.

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    Member rileySD's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Yeah for my friend's 18th birthday we went to this little restaurant where they had a belly dancer going around letting people tip her by sticking the bills in the waistband of her skirt... and since it was a family restaurant some guys' wives did NOT look happy, lol. We tried to get my friend to go up and dance with her because she could have rocked the hell out of that, and the bellydancer knew it was her birthday and was helping us egg her on, but she was all "nooooo I'm too embarrassed nooooooo" She did tip her though

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    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh, I'll post to this when I'm feeling better and break it down. Stripping is NOT the new bellydance. Bellydance is a dance historically performed by women for other women as social ritual.

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mia M
    If a cupcake was tossed at me... well, I'd only be upset if it missed my mouth

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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    My partner is a belly dancer, and we used to run a business selling belly dance costumes, so we've talked to a lot of belly dancers in the Midwest. Around here a lot of the dancers do not take tips in their costumes. They either have the customer hand them to them, or they have a hat or jar or something. Some take the tips in the costume, and direct where the customer should place the money, but a lot do not like that because there are some grabby drunk customers.

    Regarding American strippers in a Persian restaurant, there is an Assyrian restaurant nearby, and they frequently have families and kids and women in hajib. And one of their most popular belly dancers is a blond American girl, who wears very skimpy costumes, and while she has some good belly dance moves, she also has a lot of moves that look like pole dance moves (but without the pole), and some other things like back bends all the way down to the floor, which are not generally considered belly dance moves. And she periodically goes and does gigs in the Middle East. I guess this just goes to show you that Arab men are dogs too, just like the rest of us guys.

    The origins of belly dance are complicated, because it originated all over the Middle East. Yes, it was a social dance by women for women. And in Morocco, it was a dance the prepared women for childbirth. They would gather around the woman in labor and do these moves that helped ease the baby out. Since they did this for all the other women, when it was their turn, they knew the moves. (There's an interesting article about it here: http://www.casbahdance.org/ROOTS.htm.)

    But then the Ouled Nail dancers of Algeria were dancers and prostitutes (http://www.jasminjahal.com/articles/99_06.html) and I'm told a lot of Turkish belly dancers in resorts frequented by Americans are belly dancers and strippers combined (and some are a triple-threat, being prostitutes, too.) There is a famous picture of Prenses Banu, one of the best know Turkish belly dancers of the 70's and 80's, wearing a belly dance skirt and pasties with tassels (http://www.belly-dance.org/princess-banu.html.)

    And there were periods of time when women were forbidden to dance in public, and the dancers were cross-dressed men.

    And belly dance has parts of all sorts of folk dances rolled into it (like the popular Saiidi moves, which are based on a martial arts dance shepherds did with their staffs). (And Mahmoud Reda, a well-known Egyptian dancer and choreographer, incorporated ballet moves into his dance.) And I'm told that if you go in Middle Eastern dance clubs today, both the men and women are doing something that looks like belly dance.

    It is a dance that developed over centuries, over a large and multicultural area, so to say that it was originally just a social dance for women, or just a temple dance, or just anything else, is an oversimplification.

    Belly dance is a wonderful and beautiful thing that has many roots in many cultures, but it's more of a mutt than a purebred.

    Sorry to be so long-winded.

    Lynn

    P.S. Here is an interesting Wikipedia article about possible origins of belly dance: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belly_dance.

    L

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    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    You explained it far better than I did.

    Its custom in some areas to take tips in your belt. In Egypt and other Mid-East countries, money showers are very popular. Ya know, "make it rain!"

    I did not accept money in my belt as a bellydancer, but others did. I trained with a traditionalist from the Mid-East, and she did not allow it. This was actually good, as it made me uncomfortable.

    Some girls can make any dance raunchy and un-classy.

    But Lynn is correct, the origins of today's modern cabaret-style bellydance are unclear. I would ideally like to believe that it originated as a dance for women, whereas stripping was a dance for men.

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
    "And do the cats give a shit? No, they do not. Why? Because they're cats."-from The Onion

    Quote Originally Posted by Mia M
    If a cupcake was tossed at me... well, I'd only be upset if it missed my mouth

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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    It's kind of funny. The party line from a lot of belly dancers is it has nothing to do with being sexy (You *never* tell a belly dancer that she was sexy when she danced, unless you know her well.) They worry that people won't take them seriously if they think there is any sexy involved.

    And on bhuz.com, a site where belly dancers hang out, I've heard instructors worry about what if strippers take their classes, and start using belly dance moves in their stripping, and then everybody will think that all belly dancers are strippers. (I know, it seems pretty paranoid.)

    But what is funny, is that in my town, there is a belly dance studio, run by an excellent belly dancer who has trained in Egypt, and she also has an instructor working for her that teaches burlesque classes. And there is quite a bit of overlap between the belly dance students and the burlesque students. (I don't know if there are any pro strippers in the local belly dance community, but there are several amateur burlesque girls, and a couple of pro dommes, and lots of kinky lifestyle people. Wonderful community!)

    Last night the studio owner put on a vaudeville review at a local nightclub that has a nice stage. The acts consisted of a magician/announcer, a juggler, several belly dancers, and the burlesque instructor, who did three acts, and was excellent.

    So, belly dancing isn't stripping, and stripping isn't belly dancing, but the two may be more compatible than some folks would have you believe.

    Lynn

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    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Quote Originally Posted by lgrant98001 View Post
    It's kind of funny. The party line from a lot of belly dancers is it has nothing to do with being sexy (You *never* tell a belly dancer that she was sexy when she danced, unless you know her well.) They worry that people won't take them seriously if they think there is any sexy involved.

    And on bhuz.com, a site where belly dancers hang out, I've heard instructors worry about what if strippers take their classes, and start using belly dance moves in their stripping, and then everybody will think that all belly dancers are strippers. (I know, it seems pretty paranoid.)
    Yes and yes. But you must understand:
    1. Most people think that strippers are dirty whores and bad people. That's the perception and misconception.

    2. We overly-sexualize every little thing in this culture. If something is sexy, then obviously it cannot be intelligent, creative, or have artistic merit.

    Yeah, I left bhuz after a while, the uptight biddies bored me.

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
    "And do the cats give a shit? No, they do not. Why? Because they're cats."-from The Onion

    Quote Originally Posted by Mia M
    If a cupcake was tossed at me... well, I'd only be upset if it missed my mouth

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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    hahhaha my club is five minutes away from where you were... i know what restaurant you speak of...

    i think you're only associating the bellydancers with strippers because strippers are your REFERence point... they are just like any other entertainer working for tips. Think of the guy in the coffeehouse with the guitar and a tip jar. Stripper association? No. Same thing? Yes. All entertainers need to be compensated for their services and providing visual/sensual stimulation... doesn't mean that they are anything like strippers.

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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Just an interesting note:

    When I did my classes via the La Lola Salon Burlesque School here locally there is DEFINITELY belly dance included in it. Someone with extensive belly dance training even did a Burlesque routine compromising mainly of belly dancing. So yes there is a slight overlap.

    It also incorporated a slight bit of ballet as well.

    Oh and yes, I self-taught myself some belly dance moves quite awhile ago to incorporate into my dancing (both stage and lap dances) with good effect. I still do to this day.


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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    At this vaudeville revue I went to the other night, the burlesque instructor who was performing did some killer choo-choo shimmies....to the left and right, while holding on the the back of a chair. Very hot! It showed off her derrière nicely, but looked more refined than a booty clap. And for those who have actually tried to do choo-choos for any length of time, it was an impressive demonstration of dancing skill.

    Lynn

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    Banned Katrine's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Quote Originally Posted by lgrant98001 View Post
    At this vaudeville revue I went to the other night, the burlesque instructor who was performing did some killer choo-choo shimmies....to the left and right, while holding on the the back of a chair. Very hot! It showed off her derrière nicely, but looked more refined than a booty clap. And for those who have actually tried to do choo-choos for any length of time, it was an impressive demonstration of dancing skill.

    Lynn
    I do a killer choo-choo shimmy with NO chair needed! Then again, I've studied the dance extensively and trained with some of the world's best.

    "Have you ever been to American wedding? Where is the vodka, where's marinated herring?" - GB
    "And do the cats give a shit? No, they do not. Why? Because they're cats."-from The Onion

    Quote Originally Posted by Mia M
    If a cupcake was tossed at me... well, I'd only be upset if it missed my mouth

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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    I *think* the chair was just a prop, giving her an opportunity to bend a bit at the waist and show off her ass. But I must admit, it didn't occur to me that it might be there to keep her from falling over.

    In any case, I'm glad to hear that you do killer choo-choos. I love choo-choo shimmies! (I like doing them, too, but they don't look nearly as good when I do them as when the ladies in class do. But they're fun!)

    Be well...

    Lynn

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    Featured Member exotica17's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bellydancing strippers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Katrine View Post
    Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaargh, I'll post to this when I'm feeling better and break it down. Stripping is NOT the new bellydance. Bellydance is a dance historically performed by women for other women as social ritual.
    This is exactly correct. Originally, bellydancing was never intended to seduce men. It was a social and spiritual experience for women. If I'm not mistaken, it was a danced used to celebrate fertility as well.

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