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Thread: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

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    Default Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    There have just been a series of letters to the editor in the local paper pro and con Canadian Health Care.

    One side says, yes, Canadians pay high taxes, but they get free life long health care without ever having to hassle with an insurance company or pay for a non-covered health problem.

    The other side says Canadian health care is mediocre, impersonal, you have to take whatever doctor you can get, and that there are lengthy waits to see specialists. They claim that some people have died while waiting to get an appointment with a doctor.

    So, you Canadians, how do you see it? Are you satisfied with your health care? Inquiring minds want to know.

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    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    This is an interesting time, since Chaoulli is in the process of changing the face (potentially) of Canadian health care.

    Some things you have to understand is that hospitals don't magically grow because the government pays for them. Someone who lives in the Yukon will have a harder time getting access to an MRI machine than someone in Toronto. Also, health care is allocated and managed on a provincial basis. So different provinces may have different fundings, different priorities etc. I don't personally know anyone who has died, or even suffered waiting for a doctor. But, I live in a major urban centre. There are walk in clinics who can refer you to specialists on every corner. In northern Manitoba... maybe not. However, I do know that the provincial bodies that regulate doctors will (all) find you a doctor if you require one. As in they will ORDER a doctor to take your case if you cannot find one to do so voluntarily. Keep in mind that the provincial government has some serious liability potential if someone dies waiting for a doctor; they won't likely. In some places they export care to the states when necessary.

    The other side of this, is, of course, that the best care is not (generally) as good as the best care available in the states. While everyone can afford "the operation" the operation is not done as quickly or with the same expertise and general high level of care that could potentially be available. So there is a trade off.

    There are exceptions of course - notably Sick Kids hospital.
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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    Sick Kids Hospital? Please elaborate.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    My opinion is that if the U.S. were to ever go to a universal healthcare system, we should model it after a two-tier European system rather than the Canadian system.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    Albertan here..

    We pay $88 per month for health care. We receive none of the offered assistance programs...my husband makes more than the max limit for subsidies.

    We dont pay a cent for doctor visits...not for hospital visits...not for abortions....not for xrays...not for surgeries...not for births....not for breast augmentations in some cases....not eye exams (1 per year).

    We also receive partial coverage on other medical services....chiropractors, massage therapists, dentistry(cleanings only).

    I dont mind paying...my daughter sprained her ankle...all we paid was $5 for th crutches (partial coverage) and $12 in anti inflamatories.

    versus.....

    $145 per doc visit x2 (what they charge out of province)
    $55 crutches
    $12 meds
    $125 xrays

    I prefer our system...but they need more hospitals, staff & beds.

    Everyone in Alberta receives the same.
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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    ^But do people have an incentive to stay healthy? Also, can you keep any good doctors and nurses in Canada? The USA has a lot of Canadian and British nurses seeking greener pastures.
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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    I'd like to see a health care system in the U.S. somewhat like the legal system. Can't afford an attorney but accused of a crime? No problem, you are provided one free of charge. They might not be the best attorney ever, but no matter how poor you are, you're always guaranteed an attorney. That doesn't mean better attorneys aren't available for pay, just that there is a safety net. Likewise for health care; too poor to pay for the best? Well, the taxpayers can still provide decent healthy care for everyone. Have the money for better care? It's available. I don't like that these systems give the wealthy advantage, but I do like the compromise that combines universal coverage with the option for better care. It's imperfect, but I can't think of a better system. Can anyone else think of a "best of both worlds" scenario? I know "best care possible free of charge" is better, but I mean realistically.
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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    Quote Originally Posted by lestat1 View Post
    I'd like to see a health care system in the U.S. somewhat like the legal system. Can't afford an attorney but accused of a crime? No problem, you are provided one free of charge. They might not be the best attorney ever, but no matter how poor you are, you're always guaranteed an attorney. That doesn't mean better attorneys aren't available for pay, just that there is a safety net. Likewise for health care; too poor to pay for the best? Well, the taxpayers can still provide decent healthy care for everyone. Have the money for better care? It's available. I don't like that these systems give the wealthy advantage, but I do like the compromise that combines universal coverage with the option for better care. It's imperfect, but I can't think of a better system. Can anyone else think of a "best of both worlds" scenario? I know "best care possible free of charge" is better, but I mean realistically.
    They already have a form of this, its called FreeCare here in Massachusetts, but every state has a form of it. The method is set up for hospitals only where people with n insuance can go to the hosital be seen, and then charge the state. The problem is that poeple who dont have insurance will go there for a headache and be seen while someone with a gun-shot wound it waiting in the lobby for attention. The hospital then makes a claim to the state to pay the bill.

    I hate to get class involved but I think this is what you see everywhere is that the upper class doesn't do anything becuase they can afford to pay their doctor whatever then want. The low class gets well-fare/medicaid or free-care, and the middle-class gets stuck with the bills and paying for their own insurance premiums.

    Not to sound like a democrat, I'm not, I'm a liberal; I agree with Warren Buffet, while his (us) employees pay 1/3 of their paycheck to taxes, He only pays 1/10 to taxes. He has even said that he doesn't get taxed enough. Tax equally, come-up with a good system, socialize it, yes its a word we don't like to hear; and at the same time put money back into the country.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    There were close to 20,000 people who died in the US last year because they didn't have insurance (and some places will not "help" you if you have no way to pay for it). Even with insurance, they are in business to make money, not to help people. You have to get everything approved and 9.999999 times out of 10, the thing you need will get denied.

    Insurance is only covered at some hospitals. Makayla got a really bad flu bug last year, she was lethargic, dehydrated (from vomiting/diarrhea), and pale. I took her to the NEAREST clinic and they said, "Yeah, she looks bad, but we don't accept your insurance...try this place." Fuck that. I want to know that if I take someone who is THAT sick somewhere that they're going to get help.

    There are a lot of issues that would need to be ironed out by the US to get UHC. But, I think it should be done. And, you would pay into HC based on your earnings...not based on what you claim on taxes. If you earned $5 Million this year, you pay HC based upon that amount, not based upon the $5,000 you pay on taxes because of all your tax shelters and investments. If you make $15,000, then you pay taxes based upon that.

    The rich don't want it because they feel that they deserve better care and they shouldn't have to "support" anyone else. Looking away from the fact that they pay less in taxes than poor people and get more "liberties" that they claim they deserve even though they don't pay as much in taxes (pot calling kettle black?)

    UHC could totally work in this country. We just have to make it work.

    Adrian fell and hit his head a few months ago and we took him to the ER. They did a scan and do you know how much our ER bill was? Almost $3000. You cannot tell me that those charges aren't "make up" charges from people who don't pay their bills. $1800 for a CAT scan? Get real. Bullshit.

    UHC would take the worry out of people who are sick but have no money. It would give them the ability to walk in some place and get what they need to get well. People wouldn't worry about how they're going to pay things. I know MANY people who have gone completely bankrupt due to medical bills (and most of them had insurance that ran out or wouldn't pay for certain things done...or the co-pays and premiums were just adding up). That's a lot of stress and why should someone lose everything because they got sick? Makes no sense.

    I'm all for UHC. It doesn't mean we'll turn socialist...I mean, you have free school, free access to police and fire departments (well, they're paid in your property taxes)...those are socialist based systems. Why not healthcare? Because HC is a BUSINESS who pays MILLIONS of dollars a year to stay that way.

    They're also not held accountable for the deaths they cause by denying needed medical intervention. They're in it for the money. That's it. They could care less what that brings about.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    I'm pretty happy with the healthcare here. I mean, I can't imagine having to pay for an ambulance, doctor visit, etc. Like...that seems so evil.

    However, a lot of things you do have to pay for that I'd imagined would be covered. For example, eyeglasses are not covered, whereas in England I believe they are. And you know, being able to see is pretty vital.

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    God/dess Jenny's Avatar
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    Keep in mind that the U.S. pays more per capita for what health care they have than either Canada or Britian. The problem is not that "taxes would be higher"; the problem is re-allocation of existing healthcare and, simply, structuring medical fees.

    Mike, before when I said that there was a trade off insofar as you don't generally have the best healthcare that is available in the U.S - I was indicating a couple of exceptions to that, including Sick Kids Hospital in Toronto, which is exceptionally well funded from private donors as well as the government.

    Hat- of course that is a problem. Doctors especially make more money in the U.S. than in Canada or the U.K. (That's why Chaoulli happened - the worst Supreme Court decision since... well in a couple of years at any rate). However it all comes down to the give and take. Do we want a system in which something like 5% of the population has access to the world's best possible health care, 20% have access to none at all, and the remaining 75% have access to care that is expensive, very limited and difficult? Or a system in which everyone has access to care that is pretty good to okay?
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    It seems fine to me. I had a test recently which indicated the need for a specialist appointment. I was all concerned because I knew it was potentially something pretty scary, and it sometimes takes such a long time to see a specialist. But my name got bumped ahead on the list because of the urgency, I saw the doctor in three weeks (not six months), and all was fine.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    There is no system that is perfect. My cousin is a pharmacist in London and from what I understand, it's a hell of a lot better there than here in Canada. That said, I consider myself lucky to be living here. Yes, I'm paying for health care in the form of taxes. But all that is a drop in the bucket should I ever become seriously ill or injured.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatshepsut View Post
    But do people have an incentive to stay healthy? Also, can you keep any good doctors and nurses in Canada? The USA has a lot of Canadian and British nurses seeking greener pastures.
    Because visits to GPs are at no extra charge to patients, the thinking is that people are more willing to see their doctor when they are sick. They make themselves better and the people around them are less at risk.

    As far as Canadian doctors and nurses leaving the country, yes it has been a problem. Since wages are regulated by the provincial governments, many doctors and nurses trained in Canada have moved to the US to make more money. However, what we have been seeing in recent years as they start having families is a significant number moving back to Canada for quality of life (e.g., education for their children, lower crime rates, and access to health care as they get older).

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    I have no insurance and I make a good living. Why? I have pre-existing conditions. The US healthcare system sucks major ass. Fuck this shit.

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    I always ask Canadian customers about their health care system. I am so envious!

    I am in debt due to being ill for over a year. Lucky for me, I have re-gained my health & will be able to fix my debts- I'm young, no dependents and am a motivated earner in a cash-based business.

    The United States NEEDS socialized medicine for people who DON'T have the good luck I do- families should not be made homeless and destitute because someone became ill. That is the ultimate Addition of Insult to Injury- "First you're sick, now you lose everything. See ya!"

    IMO we underestimate the American public's willingness to find solutions for the problems with medical care in this country. & Don't forget, "baby boomers" are becoming the voting bloc that wields clout. They can get this issue on the table in Congress.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    from

    (snip)"Public health expenditures in Quebec amount to 29 per cent of the provincial government budget. One-fifth of the revenues come from a wage tax of 3.22 per cent charged to employers and the rest comes from general taxes at the provincial and federal levels. It costs $1,200 per year in taxes for each Quebec citizen to have access to the public health system. This means that the average two-child family pays close to $5,000 per year in public health insurance [1989 figures ... the cost is much higher today - sic] . This is much more expensive than the most comprehensive private health insurance plan."(snip)

    (snip)" The most visible consequence of socialized medicine in Canada is in the poor quality of services. Health care has become more and more impersonal. Patients often feel they are on an assembly line. Doctors and hospitals already have more patients than they can handle and no financial incentive to provide good service. Their customers are not the ones who write the checks anyway.

    No wonder, then, that medicine in Quebec consumes only 9 per cent of gross domestic product (7 per cent if we consider only public expenditures) compared to some 11 per cent in the United States. This does not indicate that health services are delivered efficiently at low cost. It reflects the fact that prices and remunerations in this industry are arbitrarily fixed, that services are rationed, and that individuals are forbidden to spend their medical-care dollars as they wish.

    Is it Just?

    Supporters of public health insurance reply that for all its inefficiencies, their system at least is more just. But even this isn't true.

    Their conception of justice is based on the idea that certain goods like health (and education? and food? where do you stop?) should be made available to all through coercive redistribution by the state. If, on the contrary, we define justice in terms of liberty, then justice forbids coercing some (taxpayers, doctors, and nurses) into providing health services to others. Providing voluntarily for your neighbor in need may be morally good. Forcing your neighbor to help you is morally wrong.

    Even if access to health services is a desirable objective, it is by no means clear that a socialized system is the answer. Without market rationing, queues form. There are ways to jump the queue, but they are not equally available to everyone.

    In Quebec, you can be relatively sure not to wait six hours with your sick child in an emergency room if you know how to talk to the hospital director, or if one of your old classmates is a doctor, or if your children attend the same exclusive private school as your pediatrician's children. You may get good services if you deal with a medical clinic in the business district. And, of course, you will get excellent services if you fly to the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota or to some private hospital in Europe. The point is that these ways to jump the queue are pretty expensive for the typical lower middle class housewife, not to talk of the poor.

    An Enquiry Commission on Health and Social Services submitted a thick report in December 1987, after having met for 30 months and spent many millions of dollars. It complains that "important gaps persist in matters of health and welfare among different groups."3 Now, isn't this statement quite incredible after two decades of monopolistic socialized health care? Doesn't it show that equalizing conditions is an impossible task, at least when there is some individual liberty left?

    One clear effect of a socialized health system is to increase the cost of getting above-average care (while the average is dropping). Some poor people, in fact, may obtain better care under socialized medicine. But many in the middle class will lose. It isn't clear where justice is to be found in such a redistribution. "(snip)

    (snip)" ... account for much of the difference between the levels of public expenditure in Canada (47 per cent of gross domestic product) and in the U.S. (37 per cent of gross domestic product). So if you do not want a large public sector, do not nationalize health. "(snip)


    The basic points that I came away with from Mr. Lemieux' treatise are ...

    1. Canadian health care is significantly more expensive as a whole than American health care ... although the citizens don't perceive it as such since Canadian health care funding comes from embedded taxes on employers and individuals, whereas American health care costs are 'itemized' in the form of medical bills and insurance bills

    2. Canadian health care attempts to manage costs by dictating / capping the earnings levels of doctors, nurses and other health care professionals. This dissuades many Canadians from entering the health care field at all, and provides a dis-incentive for Canadian health care professionals to work harder and/or provide superior levels of care.

    3. Canadian health care also attempts to manage costs by limiting the supply of health care facilities and health care equipment (which in the absence of a for-profit system must be paid for by gov't money appropriations). This leads to few new health care facilities and few new but expensive pieces of health care equipment i.e. MRI's, surgical robots etc. This in turn leads to waiting lists for patients requiring complex diagnostics and treatment, with gov't officials then making priority decisions as to which patients should receive treatment ahead of other patients.

    4. Canadian health care also attempts to manage costs by severely limiting the supply of health care services for needs that are ALWAYS expensive. This results in cancer patients, heart patients, organ transplant patients etc. having very long waiting lists compared to their average life expectancy in the absence of prompt treatment.

    5. When faced with the need for complex diagnosis and treatment, 'rich' Canadians have the option open to them to buy a plane ticket and seek immediate treatment in US or European hospitals where the latest technology equipment and the highest skill doctors are available (and undoubtedly some of these highest skill doctors are former Canadians !). 'Poor' Canadians and 'middle class' Canadians do not have the same option, since they cannot afford the out-of-pocket costs involved.

    6. as with most tax revenue driven gov't programs, Canadian health care provides widespread basic treatment to the 'poor' essentially free of charge, but also provides basic treatment to the 'middle class' at a very high actual cost i.e. high taxes. The Canadian 'rich' are also provided basic treatment by the Canadian health care system, but often opt to pay for first class treatment outside of Canada. Thus, in the final analysis, Canadian health care provides basic treatment to the 'poor' free of charge at the expense of also providing basic treatment to the 'middle class' but charging them mercilessly in the form of high taxes.
    Last edited by Melonie; 11-18-2007 at 06:03 PM.

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    I'm cool with it. It takes awhile to see a specialist for non-emergency stuff (like a derm, or to get a non-emerg xray). But you get your appointment, and provided you show up, you get it done and it's free.

    I haven't had a 'family' (regular) doctor since I was a kid...I've tried, but they are in short supply. So I go to clinics when I need to see a doc. Usually walk-in, sometimes I have to make an appointment for the next day. There are 4-5 clinics in my area, so it's no hassle.

    If I spend over $500 (or is it $1000? dunno) a year on prescriptions, they're free. Up to that amount, they're partially covered (edon't know how much, it canges yearly depending on claimed income). I don't pay any monthly premiumsright now because I'm po' and a student, but as I understand it, I'll be paying about $35 a month when I do start having to pay.

    I had an abortion when I was 21, and showed up at the clinic with my credit card, and they laughed at me. I was like 'omg, this is covered??'. I think only your first is covered...hope so, anyways.


    When I had a semi-emergency medical situation a few months ago, the ER wait was several hours (3-5am). I was treated reasonably well, although they did a bit of a hack job on me (emergency lancing on a staph infection). Uon leaving the ER I was given a few bags of IV antibiotics and sent to an ambulatory clinic, which I then visited daily for a month. All free.

    So...with these experiences, I'm seeing mostly pros.

    On the other hand, my mum's cancer went undetected through numerous mammograms...when they back and rechecked the old xrays, the cancer is clearly visble. Just none of the technicians saw it. But that's probably less of a relection on socialized medicine than on lab tech training.

    ETA: nb, a lot of my mum's breast-cancer friends have mortgaged their homes to go to the US for treatment. I think, in some cases at least, the quality of the medical care (if you can pay for it) is superior in the US.

    Do Canadians have an incentive to stay healthy?? Not built into the medical system, I guess...would that even work? I don't see the relevance.

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    ^^
    Abortion is covered I think everywhere (some provinces just take the fine). It has actually been litigated. It is very hard to make a good faith argument that the government doesn't fund abortion based on allocation because, unlike other conditions the government doesn't treat, they cannot say "we wash our hands of this"; like they are paying for the abortion, or they are paying for a delivery. And since an abortion is cheaper, the government cannot really say "we can't afford to fund abortions".
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenny View Post
    ^^
    Abortion is covered I think everywhere (some provinces just take the fine). It has actually been litigated. It is very hard to make a good faith argument that the government doesn't fund abortion based on allocation because, unlike other conditions the government doesn't treat, they cannot say "we wash our hands of this"; like they are paying for the abortion, or they are paying for a delivery. And since an abortion is cheaper, the government cannot really say "we can't afford to fund abortions".
    Omg, never thought of that. yeah. wow. interesting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by VenusGoddess View Post
    You cannot tell me that those charges aren't "make up" charges from people who don't pay their bills. $1800 for a CAT scan? Get real. Bullshit.
    A 64-slice CT scanner costs about $1.4 million. The $1800 plays for the scanner, the CT technician who takes the CT scan, the $1.5 million dollar PACS system that the images get downloaded into, the M.D. Neuroradiologist (7 years specialized training after medical school) who reads the film. Yes, some overhead is built in for hospital profit and to cover the cost of people who can't pay. But, the money does need to go quite a ways.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    scarlett, your comments about your mum's breast cancer (condolences BTW) do illustrate a different but important view of the Canadian health care system. When viewed by young people ... people whose careers / earnings have yet to climb the ladder whose tax burden is therefore still rather low along with their earnings, young people who have extremely few serious health care needs that fall into the 'complex and expensive' category, socialized medicine can indeed appear to be a good deal.

    However, young people have essentially signed on to socialized medicine for life. As such, when their careers / earnings do take off the tax burden necessary to fund the costs of national health care will increase significantly (as high taxes are absolutely necessary to subsidize 'free' health care for the poor). Also as such, when complex and expensive health problems do develop later in life, i.e. when you really need to have some of the tax money you paid into health care all of those years spent to treat your own complex and expensive problem, it's not going to be happen ! At that point you either get to wait in line hoping that you don't die before receiving treatment, or you get to remortgage your house to pay for prompt treatment in the US or Europe.

    This is the 'dirty little secret' of socialized medicine, and it is going to become a huge problem as the ever increasing number of aging 'baby boomers' start to develop complex and expensive health problems that the Canadian gov't has neither enough facilities nor enough funding to treat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob_Loblaw View Post
    As far as Canadian doctors and nurses leaving the country, yes it has been a problem. Since wages are regulated by the provincial governments, many doctors and nurses trained in Canada have moved to the US to make more money. However, what we have been seeing in recent years as they start having families is a significant number moving back to Canada for quality of life (e.g., education for their children, lower crime rates, and access to health care as they get older).
    A large number of my colleagues are here from Canada...... but you're right in that many have moved back to Canada. Mostly because physician reimbursements in the U.S. have gone down so much in the 10 years that it doesn't make much sense anymore to work in the U.S.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FrustratedBunny View Post
    I have no insurance and I make a good living. Why? I have pre-existing conditions. The US healthcare system sucks major ass. Fuck this shit.
    I don't think the entire U.S. healthcare system is faulty. There are very good aspects. We have excellent physician training methods, we have the best medical technology and tons invested into research. The problem is that only half the money going into the healthcare system is actually spent on healthcare. There are too many middlemen taking a piece of the pie. This is mostly the insurance companies and malpractice lawyers. The system needs to be changed; it is hurting the patients and the healthcare providers. Think you guys pay a lot of healthcare? You don't even want to know how much your doctor pays for his malpractice premiums

  24. #24
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    ^^^ agreed on the malpractice insurance premiums adding significantly to the cost of US health care. This is the direct result of juries having granted immensely large settlements / awards in the past as a result of 'mistakes' made by US health care providers. Canadian socialized medicine avoids these costs by not allowing Canadian citizens to sue the gov't itself or gov't employed health care providers for the consequences of their 'mistakes' - which is the opposite extreme and arguably highly unfair to the 'victims' of health care mistakes.

    For example, if Scarlett's mum's mis-read x ray incident had happened in the USA, not only would her mum have been able to pay for the best possible treatment with the settlement money, but Scarlett would eventually be inheriting several million dollars as a result of a malpractice award. Instead, it's probable that Scarlett will NOT be inheriting her mum's house since it may have to be remortgaged to pay for her mum receiving prompt health care for her breast cancer in the USA. I agree that the correct answer lies somewhere in between.

    My plastic surgeon told me that since he does 'risky' procedures that most other plastic surgeons in my area won't attempt, his annual malpractice insurance premiums for himself and his staff exceed $350,000 per year !


    A large number of my colleagues are here from Canada...... but you're right in that many have moved back to Canada. Mostly because physician reimbursements in the U.S. have gone down so much in the 10 years that it doesn't make much sense anymore to work in the U.S.
    arguably, this is the result of the State of California's decisions to mandate socialized medicine rules for state health care providers, and decisions mandating 'free' health care benefits for the 'poor' and illegal aliens at the state level (with 'free' partially stemming from low state reimbursement rates to California health care providers - one result of which was that some 80 California hospital emergency rooms have closed due to bankruptcy). This is not typical of every US state, although the situation in my home state of New York is pretty close.


    Do Canadians have an incentive to stay healthy?? Not built into the medical system, I guess...would that even work? I don't see the relevance.
    It's relevant because of the following. The UK is now under tremendous cost pressure because of their national health care system being one of the oldest, and because of a rising percentage of 'poor' immigrants who consume large amounts of health service benefits but pay little in taxes. One new national health care policy change being heavily discussed is denying equal national health benefits to Brits who are smokers. The gov'ts national health care ministers are making the argument that, by choosing to smoke, Brit smokers are creating higher health care requirements thus higher health care costs. To equalize these higher health care costs, Brit smokers should in turn be put at the end of waiting lists or outright denied complex and expensive treatment should they develop cancer or whatever.

    If such a policy of individual 'lifestyle choices' involving elevated health risks becoming a factor in the availability of national health care funded medical treatment becomes a reality for smokers, it then potentially also opens the door for the gov't to make the same sort of decisions re providing equal levels of national health care for obese people, for gays, for people who choose to work in 'dangerous' jobs etc. Under the US private health care system, these elevated risks / costs are compensated for via higher insurance premiums. But in a national health care system, the 'insurance premium' is based on employer and individual tax rates - so the only way that different health risks / costs can be compensated for is to (partially) deny national health care benefits to individuals whose 'lifestyle choices' carry higher risks. Any country whose health care system and rules are administered by a gov't agency and funded by gov't tax revenues is potentially subject to this sort of future rule changes.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 11-18-2007 at 07:18 PM.

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    Default Re: Canadian Health Care-good or bad?

    Quote Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
    I don't think the entire U.S. healthcare system is faulty. There are very good aspects. We have excellent physician training methods, we have the best medical technology and tons invested into research. The problem is that only half the money going into the healthcare system is actually spent on healthcare. There are too many middlemen taking a piece of the pie. This is mostly the insurance companies and malpractice lawyers. The system needs to be changed; it is hurting the patients and the healthcare providers. Think you guys pay a lot of healthcare? You don't even want to know how much your doctor pays for his malpractice premiums

    Now, I do know that's true. I had a doctor who told me he himself had no health insurance because his malpractice insurance was all that he could afford.

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