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Thread: So Confused!

  1. #1
    ruru123
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    Default So Confused!

    Hey girls,

    I've been struggling with a not knowing if i should go back to dancing. As some of you know, i moved to the states a last year and live with my hubby in Washington (where dancing is the shits, and i wouldn't even try it out here) and i haven't worked in a long time and we've been planning to start traveling, and myself dancing on the road and him doing his music promotion on the road. Here's where the problem starts...Im really scared of being at a club where there is a raid and getting arrested for doing nothing and screwing up my record which in turn will screw up my immigration and i'd probably be sent back home. which is NOT cool obviously. Im about as by the book and clean of a dancer as they get. I don't know if im being overly paranoid, or what? but i know that even if "you" are following all the rules and laws you can still get ticketed or arrested for almost anything like eye contact or having the wrong kind of thong on...ect. it's sooo awful that that can happen, it's not fair, most of us are making a innocent living and we shouldn't have to be scared to be busted for doing nothing wrong! So now i got him all worried about it, and now we're not knowing what to do, should we chance it and hope my club doesn't get raided? or not? Just advice or 2 cents...would be DEEPLY appreciated.!! thanks in advance!!

  2. #2
    God/dess Lysondra's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    I thought Washington was pretty laid-back and nice and airdancy? Maybe it's just me.


    Look like a woman
    Think like a man
    Act like a lady
    Work like a dog

    - My Great Grandmother Bessie's Recipe for Success

  3. #3
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    yes. i think you are being paranoid. majorly.

    have you ever gone to a party where even one person is doing drugs? have you ever been in ANY situation where youc ould take the fall for the actions of others? i mean, honestly, what are the chances of a club being raided? i could say ok, well i cant dance, because i'm on probation and if my club got raided it would be a violation so i'd be screwed.

    that's like saying you cant drive somewhere because you *might* get in a car accident.

  4. #4
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    In general, you're probably being overly paranoid ! However, because I used to dance extensively on the road, I can tell you that your odds of taking a (bogus) bust do increase. The reasons are pretty obvious ...

    - much of the bust risk at a particular club in a particular city has to do with a very localized LE climate between the club, city officials, local cops etc. This is usually a subject that only the 'locals' will be aware of ... or put another way this is not a subject that a clubowner will tell a travelling dancer about before she actually arrives to work !

    - as an out of town / out of state dancer, local LE takes no risk of potentially expensive backlash if they choose to bust that dancer. Busting local girls also can mean dealing with the local girl's family connections, well connected local defense attorneys, appeals being filed etc. - all of which can add up to additional costs for local cops & courts. However, when an out-of-town dancer is (bogusly) busted, local cops & judges know that the odds of her pleading innocent and going to court / filing an appeal are practically zero - because doing so would involve the busted dancer having to return to this city several times for future court dates at her own expense. Thus local LE is far more likely to attempt to press 'questionable' charges against an out of town dancer.

    - there's also the big reality issue that, where a large percentage of clubs are concerned, 'normal' levels of customer contact which take place on a nightly basis are actually illegal under local laws. Any traveling dancer is probably not going to be able to research the content of local laws independently, and thus will be reliant on the clubowner and local dancers to 'tell' her what's OK versus what's NOT OK. However, the info that the out of town dancer is 'told' may in fact be wrong from a legal standpoint. This is especially true in the case of clubowner info, because the clubowner has a financial stake in dancers 'bending' local laws to maximize sales / earnings, while at the same time the clubowner has no stake when a dancer is busted (i.e. the charges are always levelled against the dancer, while the clubowner can plead 'gee, officer, I had no idea what was going on in that private room' )

    - for a travelling dancer to minimize her bust risk, it's necessary to evolve a 'nose' for potential problems. There were many occasions when I walked into a new club for the first time, where I spent the first hour watching what was going on inside the club and 'reading' the attitude of the local dancers and club staff, and then simply packed up my s#!t and left. Admittedly this is a difficult 'sixth sense' to develop without the dancer already having a fair amount of experience in a cross section of different clubs and a cross section of different cities / states. The problem of course is that even if the traveling dancer herself chooses to offer lower levels of contact than the house dancers, if and when a bust occurs it's entirely possible that local LE will simply sweep up the traveling dancer right along with the house dancers, charge them all, and let the judge / court sort things out later. And unless the club has been making complete coverage security tapes that can provide hard proof of what the traveling dancer was or was NOT actually doing, everything eventually boils down to a 'he said, she said' issue i.e. 'stripper' credibility.

    Even if a traveling dancer exercises caution and 'instinct', if a traveling dancer keeps working in enough first time clubs in enough first time cities for a long enough period of time, a (bogus) bust WILL eventually happen. When it does, unless the travelling dancer is prepared to eat a plea bargain arrangement (i.e. a de-facto guilty plea ... which will appear on her criminal record), life can quickly get very complicated. Pleading innocent and standing up for your rights will probably involve spending several thousand dollars for local legal defense plus spending another several thousand dollars in travel and accomodation expenses (and lost income potential) to return to this city for future court appearances, and with no guarantees that you'll actually be found innocent with the charges then being dropped and your criminal record being wiped clean. The real problem of course stems from the out-of-town 'professional stripper's' total lack of credibility with a local judge and jury, versus the word of a well respected local cop (who may very well be lying, but that's beside the point !).

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 01-19-2008 at 10:16 AM.

  5. #5
    ruru123
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lysondra View Post
    I thought Washington was pretty laid-back and nice and airdancy? Maybe it's just me.
    not anymore, it's awful now, girls are getting arrested for holding eye contact for too long or over stepping a 3 foot rule. the city doesn't like strip clubs, and the public had to fight for them to stay. shitty.

    Quote Originally Posted by britt244 View Post
    yes. i think you are being paranoid. majorly.

    have you ever gone to a party where even one person is doing drugs? have you ever been in ANY situation where youc ould take the fall for the actions of others? i mean, honestly, what are the chances of a club being raided? i could say ok, well i cant dance, because i'm on probation and if my club got raided it would be a violation so i'd be screwed.

    that's like saying you cant drive somewhere because you *might* get in a car accident.
    you're right britt. i so see your point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    In general, you're probably being overly paranoid ! However, because I used to dance extensively on the road, I can tell you that your odds of taking a (bogus) bust do increase. The reasons are pretty obvious ...

    - much of the bust risk at a particular club in a particular city has to do with a very localized LE climate between the club, city officials, local cops etc. This is usually a subject that only the 'locals' will be aware of ... or put another way this is not a subject that a clubowner will tell a travelling dancer about before she actually arrives to work !

    - as an out of town / out of state dancer, local LE takes no risk of potentially expensive backlash if they choose to bust that dancer. Busting local girls also can mean dealing with the local girl's family connections, well connected local defense attorneys, appeals being filed etc. - all of which can add up to additional costs for local cops & courts. However, when an out-of-town dancer is (bogusly) busted, local cops & judges know that the odds of her pleading innocent and going to court / filing an appeal are practically zero - because doing so would involve the busted dancer having to return to this city several times for future court dates at her own expense. Thus local LE is far more likely to attempt to press 'questionable' charges against an out of town dancer.

    - there's also the big reality issue that, where a large percentage of clubs are concerned, 'normal' levels of customer contact which take place on a nightly basis are actually illegal under local laws. Any traveling dancer is probably not going to be able to research the content of local laws independently, and thus will be reliant on the clubowner and local dancers to 'tell' her what's OK versus what's NOT OK. However, the info that the out of town dancer is 'told' may in fact be wrong from a legal standpoint. This is especially true in the case of clubowner info, because the clubowner has a financial stake in dancers 'bending' local laws to maximize sales / earnings, while at the same time the clubowner has no stake when a dancer is busted (i.e. the charges are always levelled against the dancer, while the clubowner can plead 'gee, officer, I had no idea what was going on in that private room' )

    - for a travelling dancer to minimize her bust risk, it's necessary to evolve a 'nose' for potential problems. There were many occasions when I walked into a new club for the first time, where I spent the first hour watching what was going on inside the club and 'reading' the attitude of the local dancers and club staff, and then simply packed up my s#!t and left. Admittedly this is a difficult 'sixth sense' to develop without the dancer already having a fair amount of experience in a cross section of different clubs and a cross section of different cities / states. The problem of course is that even if the traveling dancer herself chooses to offer lower levels of contact than the house dancers, if and when a bust occurs it's entirely possible that local LE will simply sweep up the traveling dancer right along with the house dancers, charge them all, and let the judge / court sort things out later. And unless the club has been making complete coverage security tapes that can provide hard proof of what the traveling dancer was or was NOT actually doing, everything eventually boils down to a 'he said, she said' issue i.e. 'stripper' credibility.

    Even if a traveling dancer exercises caution and 'instinct', if a traveling dancer keeps working in enough first time clubs in enough first time cities for a long enough period of time, a (bogus) bust WILL eventually happen. When it does, unless the travelling dancer is prepared to eat a plea bargain arrangement (i.e. a de-facto guilty plea ... which will appear on her criminal record), life can quickly get very complicated. Pleading innocent and standing up for your rights will probably involve spending several thousand dollars for local legal defense plus spending another several thousand dollars in travel and accomodation expenses (and lost income potential) to return to this city for future court appearances, and with no guarantees that you'll actually be found innocent with the charges then being dropped and your criminal record being wiped clean. The real problem of course stems from the out-of-town 'professional stripper's' total lack of credibility with a local judge and jury, versus the word of a well respected local cop (who may very well be lying, but that's beside the point !).

    ~
    these are the things that SCARE ME...lol. thank you sooo much Melonie for taking the time, you really need to write a book, you are so imformative and know your stuff! and your writing skills are awesome!

  6. #6
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lysondra View Post
    I thought Washington was pretty laid-back and nice and airdancy? Maybe it's just me.
    you're confusing portland, oregon with washington state, which contains a similarly liberal town (seattle), but which is not airdancy in any way.

  7. #7
    ruru123
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    thanks for all the feed back ladies. i just over think stuff all the time and over react. i really don't wanna go back to working a "normal" job...lol...i know that Vegas and Atlanta are pretty raid free...???

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    Default Re: So Confused!

    A lot of Washingtron state girls work bookings in Montana. They don't raid the clubs there, and don't allow extras.

    That would be a better route for you to take in my opinion.

  9. #9
    ruru123
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tina View Post
    A lot of Washingtron state girls work bookings in Montana. They don't raid the clubs there, and don't allow extras.

    That would be a better route for you to take in my opinion.
    So Montana's pretty safe?

  10. #10
    Senior Member neve's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Quote Originally Posted by ruru123 View Post
    thanks for all the feed back ladies. i just over think stuff all the time and over react. i really don't wanna go back to working a "normal" job...lol...i know that Vegas and Atlanta are pretty raid free...???
    vegas is not raid free, i saw the sweetest most innocent girl on earth get a ticket
    and if vice wants you, they will go to every club in town until they find you
    a couple days ago our cards had to be checked because vice was in our club

  11. #11
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Quote Originally Posted by ruru123 View Post
    So Montana's pretty safe?
    Yes. Yes, it is. The clubs I've danced at there ran a pretty tight ship and were very pleasant. Not sure about all of them, but my experience was positive.

  12. #12
    Featured Member noelle's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Seriously, you are not being paranoid. I really don't think people grasp what the situation is like here in Seattle. You do not have to be doing something WRONG or in any way different from what constantly goes on in the club to be arrested. Vice really does come in and haul girls out pretty frequently just for giving lapdances! Unless you have some kind of magical vice cop detector, you have every right to be paranoid. Take it from me, I have been arrested. You're being smart.

    And for the amount of money you could make at a club in Washington, risking arrest and putting yourself in a state of constant paranoia isn't worth it. I saw so many girls that consistantly made nothing at my club. And I mean nothing! Not making their house fees night after night after night! That's after having paid $300 for a license!

    You've got a good head on your shoulders, dear.

  13. #13
    ruru123
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    Default Re: So Confused!

    Quote Originally Posted by noelle View Post
    Seriously, you are not being paranoid. I really don't think people grasp what the situation is like here in Seattle. You do not have to be doing something WRONG or in any way different from what constantly goes on in the club to be arrested. Vice really does come in and haul girls out pretty frequently just for giving lapdances! Unless you have some kind of magical vice cop detector, you have every right to be paranoid. Take it from me, I have been arrested. You're being smart.

    And for the amount of money you could make at a club in Washington, risking arrest and putting yourself in a state of constant paranoia isn't worth it. I saw so many girls that consistantly made nothing at my club. And I mean nothing! Not making their house fees night after night after night! That's after having paid $300 for a license!

    You've got a good head on your shoulders, dear.
    yeah i wouldn't DARE work in seattle or any club in washington for that matter, but the thing is that the whole dumb seattle thing has made me paraniod about EVERY club...lol...and i know it's not like that everywhere. but when you turn on the news or read the paper and it frequently has reports on seattle strip club raids and arrests, it makes you that way. so yeah, i've been literally begged to work out here by a couple gf's and i will not do it, even though it would be soooo PERFECT to, but it's not the risk im willing to take ya know?! it so dumb that it's like that out here now, why in the city i live in?? lol. i know alot of girls that it's just ruined there whole plans, now they can't afford their car payments, morgage ect...it's pretty sad!

    noelle - i read your moving, GOOD for you hun! i hope it works out for you!

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