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Thread: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

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    Default So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/02/...ign/index.html

    Interesting, I really thought he would hang in and try to battle for a little while longer. I guess he realized it was futile, though he is right, this is good for Republicans in the long run.

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    Featured Member Lunarobverse's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Yes. Everything is always good news for Republicans.
    Visit my home on the internets:

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    Where I talk about strip clubs, atheism, computers, and whatever else I wanna.

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    stellaforstars
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    ^^Well, this actually kind of is good news for the Republicans. Romney would've been far easier to beat than McCain.

    That being said, it came as a surprise to me as well.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    . I guess he realized it was futile, though he is right, this is good for Republicans in the long run.
    i think it's a good sign for their party as a whole too but probably not for the same reasons.

    McCain is in many ways more moderate person than those who have been getting republican voter support over the past two or three decades & I think a more moderate republican party is a good thing for the nation. they have been way too "my way or the highway" for years now and it has had a very negative effect on the country. so I take all this voter support for a moderate guy like McCain is a very good sign that the republican voters getting smarter and that is great!

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    Banned Eric Stoner's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    I think it's great just for its effect on Rush; Hannity; Levin; Beck; Dobson; Ingraham and especially Ann Coulter. Can't wait to see her campaign for Hillary.

    Now it's between McCain and Huckabee. Will McCain offer Huckabee the Veep slot?

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    I think McCain can pull more of the moderates/independents, and Hillary hater Dems, than Romney could. Which is what I want in the even Hillary gets the nomination. Between McCain and Obama, I care less.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    I think it's great just for its effect on Rush; Hannity; Levin; Beck; Dobson; Ingraham and especially Ann Coulter. Can't wait to see her campaign for Hillary.

    Now it's between McCain and Huckabee. Will McCain offer Huckabee the Veep slot?
    I don't think he will, but that could be a good way to bridge the gap between him and the conservatives. Then again, Huckabee might turn away some less conservative people, and I'm not sure I think McCain really needs to bridge that gap.

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Can't wait to see her campaign for Hillary.
    You probably WILL see this happen ... as well as many conservative voters casting 'nuclear option' votes for Hilary instead of John McCain.

    The reason of course is that they all share the opinion that there will now be very little difference in domestic economic and/or social policy between Hilary or McCain. So from the standpoint of future tax increases, future increases in social welfare spending, persistent 'recession', rising unemployment among 'poor' Americans etc. it doesn't really matter whether Hilary or McCain (or for that matter Obama) becomes president.

    However, many conservative voters would much prefer that these things happen under a Democratic president than a Republican president, such that the American public will be able to clearly associate persistent economic 'malaise' in 2012 with Democrats ... potentially opening the door for a replay of 1980's presidential and congressional election results.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stoner View Post
    especially Ann Coulter. Can't wait to see her campaign for Hillary.
    Hillarious, check her out on YouTube. I never thought I'd see the day.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    I was so sad romney dropped out and i am am not happy with the whole primary sytem i never got to vote for romney cause my state has not had its primary yet. I also think if he was not morman he would be the front runner.

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    Banned Eric Stoner's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard_Head View Post
    Hillarious, check her out on YouTube. I never thought I'd see the day.
    Ann Coulter PROVES that starving yourself definitely causes profound brain damage.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    You probably WILL see this happen ... as well as many conservative voters casting 'nuclear option' votes for Hilary instead of John McCain.

    The reason of course is that they all share the opinion that there will now be very little difference in domestic economic and/or social policy between Hilary or McCain. So from the standpoint of future tax increases, future increases in social welfare spending, persistent 'recession', rising unemployment among 'poor' Americans etc. it doesn't really matter whether Hilary or McCain (or for that matter Obama) becomes president.

    However, many conservative voters would much prefer that these things happen under a Democratic president than a Republican president, such that the American public will be able to clearly associate persistent economic 'malaise' in 2012 with Democrats ... potentially opening the door for a replay of 1980's presidential and congressional election results.
    It's already started. Rush has begun his " Don't blame Conservatives for 2008 " when in fact they are precisely the ones responsible. Bush signed McCain- Feingold. Bush supported McCain-Kennedy. Tom De Lay; Ted Stevens and Young of Alaska were some of the worst earmarkers and pork-barrelers.

    There's already a huge split developing between the anti- Hillary and anti-McCain camps AND Bloomberg is now talking about running just to siphon votes off McCain and assure a Hillary victory.

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    Banned Melonie's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    There's already a huge split developing between the anti- Hillary and anti-McCain camps AND Bloomberg is now talking about running just to siphon votes off McCain and assure a Hillary victory.
    this has been their 'Ace in the Hole' all along. And pragmatically speaking, Bloomberg can easily afford to make a third party run without much worry re McCain-Feingold since a billionaire candidate can spend his personal funds any way he chooses. Like Russ Perot and Bush Sr., all Mike Bloomberg would need to do is siphon off 10% of McCain's support to swing the election in Hilary's favor.

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    Yekhefah
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Hate to say it, but I can't see McCain getting the nomination. I thought a few months ago that we'd probably wind up with President Huckabee, and I still think that's a very likely possibility (and one I REALLY dislike). I have to say that McCain is probably the most tolerable of the whole disgusting bunch on both sides, but if Bloomberg runs I will vote for him.

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    God/dess SundayMorning's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Did I miss something? I know that Obama is slightly behind as far as the current # of delegates and that both he and Hillary are way under the # they need to carry the Dem nom, but is he being written out of the picture already?


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    stellaforstars
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    ^^She's currently in the lead. That's basically the reason everyone's writing Obama off.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    ^^^ basically, the pollsters and analysts have crunched the previous primary election results and have come to the following conclusions ...

    Obama's support is primarily derived from black voters and from uber-rich white liberal voters

    Hilary's support is primarily derived from hispanic voters and from 'working class' white democratic voters.

    With the primary elections that have already taken place, Obama has already raked in wins in states that have very high percentages of black voters, as well as in states that have a high percentage of uber-rich liberal voters - and is still behind Hilary in delegate count. The remaining state primaries involve states with lower percentages of black population and lower percentages of uber-rich liberals - thus demographically speaking Obama will not get as much overall voter support from the remaining states.

    On the flip side, remaining state primaries involve states with higher percentages of hispanic population and higher percentages of 'working class' voters - thus demographically speaking Hilary will get more voter support from the remaining states.

    Obviously this is all conjecture and anything can happen. However, the scuttlebut is that if Hilary hasn't been shot down in flames by now by Barack, or if Hilary hasn't been 'pillaried' by now over any one of 100 possible scandals (remember the chinese waiters all donating the individual limit to Hilary en masse, with the subsequent bust - see ) , the conclusion is that Hilary's 'teflon pant suits' are going to render her invulnerable.


    Back to McCain on the (nominally) republican side of the aisle, the same pollsters and analysts are concluding that much of his support has actually come from independent voters and liberal republicans, with more 'hardcore' republican voters opting for Huckabee and with conservative voters supporting Romney (who has now dropped out of the race). The same analysts are also speculating that in a general presidential election McCain is far enough to the 'left' to actually draw support from some democratic voters who are either disgusted with Hilary or are not liberal enough to support Obama.

    The same analysts are also pointing out that, with the departure of Romney, conservative voters are now totally left out in the cold re the 2008 presidential election. They are therefore looking ahead to the 2012 election, knowing that McCain and Hilary and Obama all have similar enough taxation policies, gov't spending policies, and gov't meddling in free markets policies, that the US economy is going to go down and stay down no matter who is elected president. The conservatives therefore want to create a situation where the 2012 election campaigns can be a replay of Carter vs Reagan 1980 i.e. blaming a democratic president and democratic congressional majority for the persistent US economic 'malaise'.

    A possible McCain victory would make such a 2012 replay of the 1980 election impossible, so the conservatives are now prepared to HELP elect a democratic president in 2008 ... who can then be set up to take the blame 4 years from now, in hopes of electing a more conservative republican president as well as recapturing republican congressional majorities in 2012. Scuttlebut has it that the conservatives could not support Obama because of his very weak position on national defense / Al Queda, but they apparently CAN justify supporting Hilary whose positions on national defense / Al Queda are a bit less weak. Machiavelli would be proud !

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 02-09-2008 at 12:57 PM.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Yekhefah View Post
    Hate to say it, but I can't see McCain getting the nomination. I thought a few months ago that we'd probably wind up with President Huckabee, and I still think that's a very likely possibility (and one I REALLY dislike). I have to say that McCain is probably the most tolerable of the whole disgusting bunch on both sides, but if Bloomberg runs I will vote for him.
    Mark my words, McCain will get the nomination. He's too close now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    ^^^ basically, the pollsters and analysts have crunched the previous primary election results and have come to the following conclusions ...

    Obama's support is primarily derived from black voters and from uber-rich white liberal voters

    Hilary's support is primarily derived from hispanic voters and from 'working class' white democratic voters.

    With the primary elections that have already taken place, Obama has already raked in wins in states that have very high percentages of black voters, as well as in states that have a high percentage of uber-rich liberal voters - and is still behind Hilary in delegate count. The remaining state primaries involve states with lower percentages of black population and lower percentages of uber-rich liberals - thus demographically speaking Obama will not get as much overall voter support from the remaining states.

    On the flip side, remaining state primaries involve states with higher percentages of hispanic population and higher percentages of 'working class' voters - thus demographically speaking Hilary will get more voter support from the remaining states.

    Obviously this is all conjecture and anything can happen. However, the scuttlebut is that if Hilary hasn't been shot down in flames by now by Barack, or if Hilary hasn't been 'pillaried' by now over any one of 100 possible scandals (remember the chinese waiters all donating the individual limit to Hilary en masse, with the subsequent bust - see http://www.therant.us/staff/p_hollrah/10242007.htm ) , the conclusion is that Hilary's 'teflon pant suits' are going to render her invulnerable.


    Back to McCain on the (nominally) republican side of the aisle, the same pollsters and analysts are concluding that much of his support has actually come from independent voters and liberal republicans, with more 'hardcore' republican voters opting for Huckabee and with conservative voters supporting Romney (who has now dropped out of the race). The same analysts are also speculating that in a general presidential election McCain is far enough to the 'left' to actually draw support from some democratic voters who are either disgusted with Hilary or are not liberal enough to support Obama.

    The same analysts are also pointing out that, with the departure of Romney, conservative voters are now totally left out in the cold re the 2008 presidential election. They are therefore looking ahead to the 2012 election, knowing that McCain and Hilary and Obama all have similar enough taxation policies, gov't spending policies, and gov't meddling in free markets policies, that the US economy is going to go down and stay down no matter who is elected president. The conservatives therefore want to create a situation where the 2012 election campaigns can be a replay of Carter vs Reagan 1980 i.e. blaming a democratic president and democratic congressional majority for the persistent US economic 'malaise'.

    A possible McCain victory would make such a 2012 replay of the 1980 election impossible, so the conservatives are now prepared to HELP elect a democratic president in 2008 ... who can then be set up to take the blame 4 years from now, in hopes of electing a more conservative republican president as well as recapturing republican congressional majorities in 2012. Scuttlebut has it that the conservatives could not support Obama because of his very weak position on national defense / Al Queda, but they apparently CAN justify supporting Hilary whose positions on national defense / Al Queda are a bit less weak. Machiavelli would be proud !

    ~
    I get what your saying Melonie, but historically this doesn't happen, and I don't think the average conservative is going to vote for Hillary or Obama in some hope for a "well maybe it'll be like Reagan in 4 years". Besides if they think about it should be more like this "hell, if we can get a republican elected after 8 years of Bush, then we can do anything!".
    So frankly, I'll beleive your senario when I see it.

  19. #19
    Yekhefah
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    Mark my words, McCain will get the nomination. He's too close now.
    It's only February. There is a lot of time, and there are a lot more primaries. The fundies are not going to turn out for McCain and they still have a lot of clout. I hope you're right because I'd rather see McCain than Huckabee, but I think Huckabee will get it.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Yekhefah View Post
    President Huckabee
    God that's a scary thought. If anyone thought we were an international laughing stock with GeeDubya at the helm, wait till we're stuck with Huckabee. Oy!

    Quote Originally Posted by pheno View Post
    When you lead a nontraditional life don't try to measure it with traditional milestones.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Besides if they think about it should be more like this "hell, if we can get a republican elected after 8 years of Bush, then we can do anything!".
    So frankly, I'll beleive your senario when I see it.
    As I understand it, conservatives consider McCain to be a de-facto Democrat ... given his support for illegal alien 'amnesty' , given his suppression of free political speech a la McCain-Feingold, given his position of being opposed to reducing tax rates, given his apparent support of a Kyoto-like CO2 reduction mandate in the USA, and a host of other issues where McCain's position is arguably left of some Democrats ...




    If anyone thought we were an international laughing stock with GeeDubya at the helm, wait till we're stuck with Huckabee. Oy!
    Huckabee is supposedly viewed by most republicans and conservatives as a 'one trick pony' i.e. his appeal to the religious right. But the so-called evangelical republican block only amounts to about 1/3rd of republican voters. On the flip side, Huckabee's fiscal and social policies demonstrated while Governor probably scares the other 2/3rds of republican voters. Combine that with an almost total rejection by potential cross-over democrat voters in a general election BECAUSE of his association with the religious right, and you've got pollsters and analysts saying that Huckabee is totally unelectable as a presidential candidate. The RNC are not fools ... Huckabee will NOT get the republican nomination.

    However, those same pollsters and analysts point out that having Huckabee as a VP to carry southern states with high numbers of religious voters ... exactly the states where John McCain has done poorly ... might provide an electable McCain / Huckabee ticket next november. And given McCain's age and health (which haven't gotten much attention so far), there's also a real risk that VP Huckabee could become President Huckabee at some point before 2012. However, this possibility only provides more reason for conservatives to back Hilary instead of McCain.

    (snip)"If McCain, 70, runs and wins, he would be the oldest person ever inaugurated as president. As is evident from the scar on the left side of his face, he has had malignant melanoma, the most invasive and dangerous form of skin cancer. "(snip) from


    I don't think the average conservative is going to vote for Hillary
    under 'normal' circumstances, you're absolutely correct. And in terms of general election turnout, you're probably also correct. But keep in mind that this year's election is likely to be a 'squeaker' ... with neither candidate having anything to offer conservatives but disgust. Thus if even a small number of conservative voters decide to adopt the 'nuclear option', perhaps flipping only 2% of potential McCain votes into Hilary votes, that would represent a 4% swing in election results ... a margin that could be decisive in the expected close election.

    ~
    Last edited by Melonie; 02-09-2008 at 05:11 PM.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Quote Originally Posted by Melonie View Post
    As I understand it, conservatives consider McCain to be a de-facto Democrat ... given his support for illegal alien 'amnesty' , given his suppression of free political speech a la McCain-Feingold, given his position of being opposed to reducing tax rates, given his apparent support of a Kyoto-like CO2 reduction mandate in the USA, and a host of other issues where McCain's position is arguably left of some Democrats ...

    http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5h...6UejwD8UM1VV80




    Huckabee is supposedly viewed by most republicans and conservatives as a 'one trick pony' i.e. his appeal to the religious right. But the so-called evangelical republican block only amounts to about 1/3rd of republican voters. On the flip side, Huckabee's fiscal and social policies demonstrated while Governor probably scares the other 2/3rds of republican voters. Combine that with an almost total rejection by potential cross-over democrat voters in a general election BECAUSE of his association with the religious right, and you've got pollsters and analysts saying that Huckabee is totally unelectable as a presidential candidate. The RNC are not fools ... Huckabee will NOT get the republican nomination.

    However, those same pollsters and analysts point out that having Huckabee as a VP to carry southern states with high numbers of religious voters ... exactly the states where John McCain has done poorly ... might provide an electable McCain / Huckabee ticket next november. And given McCain's age and health (which haven't gotten much attention so far), there's also a real risk that VP Huckabee could become President Huckabee at some point before 2012. However, this possibility only provides more reason for conservatives to back Hilary instead of McCain.

    (snip)"If McCain, 70, runs and wins, he would be the oldest person ever inaugurated as president. As is evident from the scar on the left side of his face, he has had malignant melanoma, the most invasive and dangerous form of skin cancer. "(snip) from http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/...n2397926.shtml

    ^^^That I can see happening.


    under 'normal' circumstances, you're absolutely correct. And in terms of general election turnout, you're probably also correct. But keep in mind that this year's election is likely to be a 'squeaker' ... with neither candidate having anything to offer conservatives but disgust. Thus if even a small number of conservative voters decide to adopt the 'nuclear option', perhaps flipping only 2% of potential McCain votes into Hilary votes, that would represent a 4% swing in election results ... a margin that could be decisive in the expected close election.

    ~
    But will that make up for the liberals and independents who shy away from Hillary enough to make a run for McCain or, more likely, just stay home?

    Also, I still think Obama will take the Nom. especially now that it's being reported that Obama has a better chance of beating McCain, whereas McCain is tied with Hillary, in a battle for President.

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    God/dess SundayMorning's Avatar
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Winning Nebraska and Washington, yaaaaaaaaaay!


  24. #24
    Yekhefah
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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    Damn, Melonie, you're right as always. The more I think about it, the more a McCain/Huckabee ticket does seem likely.

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    Default Re: So Romney's out and McCain's in...

    McCain on needs 400 more delegates to lock up the nomination and there are (I think) around a 1000 delegates left. Whereas Huckabee needs something like 900 to secure the nom. So I'd say things are looking pretty good for McCain.

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