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Thread: Expelled from "Expelled"

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    Featured Member Lunarobverse's Avatar
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    Default Expelled from "Expelled"

    Saw this story elsewhere and thought I'd share it. Has a great punchline and makes great metaphorical use of the word "sabot".

    It'll be funnier if you're pro-science. Not that others might not also find it funny but, y'know...

    Expelled!
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  2. #2
    zxcire
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"



    WTF Richard Dawkins!!! Um, is this for real? Cause if it is, I love it, and if it isn't I still love it!!

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    Veteran Member alessandra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Thanks for posting that

    My favorite quote in the comments so far is: "Should give you bragging rights over that Dawkins chap. "Oh Richard - who did they recognise [sic] trying to see eXpelled? The 'famous' Richard Dawkins or the instantly recognizable PZ? Huh Huh."

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    Featured Member Lunarobverse's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    It's for true, zxcire. I trust the guy who posted that immensely through his reputation.

    That's a great science blog to read on a regular basis, also.
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    God/dess Paris's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Bwahahahahahahahahaha! That is awesome!

    ETA: I went and watched the trailer for the movie, and it looks really fascinating. It brings to light issues that have plagued humankind sine the dawn on man (whatever that means).

    All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
    This seems to be the perfect quote to sum up what this movie is addressing. I'm not saying that the movie is "truth" per se, but that this is the case of the violent opposition to conventional wisdom in regards to the thinking on evolutionary processes.

    Who knows? They intelligent design camp might be right. And so what if they are? That tells us nothing aside from the fact that something more intelligent than ourselves created this universe and everything in it. The concept does not speak at all to the possibility that the creator of the universe is omnipotent or immortal, only that it is intelligent.
    Last edited by Paris; 03-21-2008 at 12:26 PM.


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    God/dess xdamage's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Haha, cool...

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    God/dess scarlett_vancouver's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Awesomeness!

    I've never even heard of this movie- they have security for it? Wtf?

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    God/dess xdamage's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Maybe I am mis-remembering, but the Evolution vs Creation in schools was a more charged issue when I was a kid. It really wasn't that long ago that teaching Evolution in my school was contentious and the Creationist side enjoyed the benefit of majority opinion.

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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by xdamage View Post
    Maybe I am mis-remembering, but the Evolution vs Creation in schools was a more charged issue when I was a kid. It really wasn't that long ago that teaching Evolution in my school was contentious and the Creationist side enjoyed the benefit of majority opinion.
    Things have changed even in the South... I know my niece was just talking about this in her biology class. They had a general discussion about Creationism vs. Evoloution and everything in between, but that was all that was said about the issue... The issue is so screwy everywhere... What doesn't make sense to me is if non religous kids shouldn't have to hear the religous idea, why should religous kids have to hear the science idea??

    Someone needs to come up with a good way of presenting both.

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    God/dess scarlett_vancouver's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Weeeiiird.

    I still don't understand why on earth creationism would even be touched upon in science class. How about in religion class, or social studies, or whatever? You don't teach non-scientific things in science class!

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  11. #11
    cameron_keys
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    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    What doesn't make sense to me is if non religous kids shouldn't have to hear the religous idea, why should religous kids have to hear the science idea??

    .
    Because it is a SCIENCE class. They can hear all about Creationism in church...religious theories have no place in a science class in a public school.

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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by cameron_keys View Post
    Because it is a SCIENCE class. They can hear all about Creationism in church...religious theories have no place in a science class in a public school.
    In most cases I would agree with you, but in a case where they are standing up there and telling you what you might have been hearing your whole life is totally wrong?? Can we teach religous history in a world history class? I doubt it... But hey, it's History.

  13. #13
    cameron_keys
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    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    In most cases I would agree with you, but in a case where they are standing up there and telling you what you might have been hearing your whole life is totally wrong?? Can we teach religous history in a world history class? I doubt it... But hey, it's History.
    That could happen in a lot of classes if we take every religion into consideration.

    Scientific theories belong in a science class.

    Religious theories belong in a church.

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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by cameron_keys View Post
    That could happen in a lot of classes if we take every religion into consideration.

    Scientific theories belong in a science class.

    Religious theories belong in a church.
    I don't see why you can't have some of both in each place... Maybe if there was the two sides would get along a little better...

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    Featured Member Lunarobverse's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    I'm sorry but debating Science vs. Religion just confuses the issue. They address two completely different needs and desires in people. There's no basis for comparison, nor should they be discussed in the same breath.

    Fundamental religious folk want a debate between the two because it elevates their religious views to be co-equal, when they're not.
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by Lunarobverse View Post
    I'm sorry but debating Science vs. Religion just confuses the issue. They address two completely different needs and desires in people. There's no basis for comparison, nor should they be discussed in the same breath.

    Fundamental religious folk want a debate between the two because it elevates their religious views to be co-equal, when they're not.
    Normally I really respect what you say Lunar, but that is total shit... The typical "mine is right and that's it" debate of a science only/religous extremist... And you've called me down for being black and white on an issue...

    When you put Science and Religion together things are almost perfect, especially if you except that a big dose of religion is allegorical, but no, the relgious can except anything other than what they see written in black, and the science only crowd just ignores the things that can't be explained by science as "oh we'll get it later".... find some fucking middleground people you'll live longer.

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    Featured Member Lunarobverse's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    Normally I really respect what you say Lunar, but that is total shit... The typical "mine is right and that's it" debate of a science only/religous extremist... And you've called me down for being black and white on an issue...

    When you put Science and Religion together things are almost perfect, especially if you except that a big dose of religion is allegorical, but no, the relgious can except anything other than what they see written in black, and the science only crowd just ignores the things that can't be explained by science as "oh we'll get it later".... find some fucking middleground people you'll live longer.
    They deal with different things entirely, jester214. That's what I said. How is that not finding "middle ground"?

    The rest of what you wrote doesn't parse for me. What is it you're trying to say?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lunarobverse View Post
    They deal with different things entirely, jester214. That's what I said. How is that not finding "middle ground"?

    The rest of what you wrote doesn't parse for me. What is it you're trying to say?
    How can you say the two aren't equal and that religion is the lesser, and say you're taking a middleground?

    The rest is partially me ranting about the people who sit on the far ends of their respective beleif and refuse to consider any points by the other side. Especially when if you combine the two a lot of problems are solved that one alone can't... Hell a lot of the early scientists were religous as hell.

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    God/dess xdamage's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    I have read some Creationists theories that are aligned with known science, though the one's I have read basically come down to the same old argument, that being -

    Such and such a structure is too complex to have occurred through random chance and evolution, so is evidence of Intelligent Design. Long ago I read that about the Human Eye, but it has been been shown that it evolved. Last I read it was with a simpler structure, but anyway my feeling is that again and again those theories will be proved wrong, but that will occur naturally over many years.

    As a total aside, I think it's kind of ?ironic? that minds that have started with the premise that they believe based on "Faith" often are the most wanting of absolute irrefutable proof when it comes to Evolution theory. Expelled? Hmm.. What if we said instead, Creationism should be taught in Science classes when we have absolute irrefutable proof that it is fact. I'm guessing that wouldn't go over so well.

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    Veteran Member alessandra's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    When you put Science and Religion together things are almost perfect, especially if you except that a big dose of religion is allegorical, but no, the relgious can except anything other than what they see written in black, and the science only crowd just ignores the things that can't be explained by science as "oh we'll get it later"
    Could you elaborate on what you mean by this? Do you mean to say that by combining religion and science we can determine the origin of the world? I'm just trying to follow what your thoughts are, thanks!

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    Quote Originally Posted by alessandra View Post
    Could you elaborate on what you mean by this? Do you mean to say that by combining religion and science we can determine the origin of the world? I'm just trying to follow what your thoughts are, thanks!
    Origins of the universe and earth, science has an answer of how it probably passed, but not what would have caused it, also few explanations why most planets are so different in composition and such. The precision of unguided evoloution and under some of that reasoning there should be more than one species of humans still existing. Gaps in the scientific timeline... Things that happen that are for the lack of a better word "miracles"...

    Although if we run into true intelligent life on another planet, I'll probably have to reevaluate some...

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    Featured Member Lunarobverse's Avatar
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    Default Re: Expelled from "Expelled"

    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    How can you say the two aren't equal and that religion is the lesser, and say you're taking a middleground?

    The rest is partially me ranting about the people who sit on the far ends of their respective beleif and refuse to consider any points by the other side. Especially when if you combine the two a lot of problems are solved that one alone can't... Hell a lot of the early scientists were religous as hell.
    I say religion is subordinate to science but I don't doubt that religion has its uses and values. I don't dismiss the power that religion holds over immature minds, minds not ready to face some hard realizations. I know that religion is a huge influence over humanity's history and will continue to be for a long time. I think I'm being quite fair, actually.

    What problems are solved by religion, jester214? Morality? Morality and ethics have a human and rational component that can be defined by science and logic, not revealed "truths" in a Bronze Age book.

    Early scientists were religious because they had no other options until Wallace and Darwin gave them a basis for scientific belief in origins through the theory of natural selection.
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    Ok Lunar... Tell yourself you're being fair, whatever....

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    Quote Originally Posted by jester214 View Post
    The precision of unguided evoloution and under some of that reasoning there should be more than one species of humans still existing.
    Elaborate?

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  25. #25
    cameron_keys
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    There are far more theories then just evolution and creationism...should we just halt science class all year in order to give them ALL fair time?? Come on...we teach science and scientific theories in a science class...religious theories can be taught in church or a theology class. Pretty simple.

    Religion does NOT belong in a public school.Period.

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