Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 26

Thread: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

  1. #1
    Member Mr.Beaver's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2008
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    My wife and I felt seriously hopeless about 3 years ago. We had credit cards maxed out, behind on rent three months, and truck payments and four-wheeler payments and school loans. I couldn't sleep. My wife and I argued whenever we saw each other. And my business was going in the tank. I was listening to this talk show on the radio and this guy described me to the T, so I listened more and more. The advice he gives is so basic you would think its common sense, because it is. But nevertheless it helped us out and there are lots of people of every income level and background calling into the show on Friday to scream " I"M DEBT FREEE!" so check it out, the worst that could happen is......He also is a very big entrepreneur. He will tell you as a person you are only going to be as successful as you want to be. He talks with great authors on his show like Dan Miller who wrote 48 Days to the Work you Love,he had Napoleon Hill's son for whom his dad wrote Think and Grow Rick a classic! on one day, Jay Levinson who wrote Guerrilla Marketing, Meg Meeker who wrote Strong Fathers Strong Daughters. Just a really inspirational web site radio show and tv show ( fox business). Ok i am done with my rant now.

  2. #2
    Veteran Member fluffypenguin's Avatar
    Joined
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    243
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 48 Times in 28 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Ok, I had a quick look. I think the only person who will solve their money problems is the dude who runs the website. Not one single snippet, not even a taste tempter of advise or even some basic crap that anyone with a brain would know (like draw up a budget, or regular savings helps) without requiring some sort of payment. Typical rip off those-who-can-least-afford-it-in-a-desperate-attemp-to-get-themself-out-of-crap scam.
    I reckon I fell for every single one of those snake oil scams. Try the local community centre for financial, career and educational advise. They actually have YOUR best interests in mind.

  3. #3
    Yekhefah
    Guest

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Dave Ramsey isn't a scammer, but he is well-known enough to command a price. I wouldn't spring for anything he was selling because most of it is just common sense, but I do like listening to his radio show every once in awhile.

  4. #4
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Your imagination
    Posts
    2,875
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 174 Times in 119 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    i've read plenty of free useful advice on dave ramsey's site. but he's pretty much about not having debt (within reason, paying off a large purchase over several years wouldn't be amiss) and not about 'optimising cashflow' or whatever. just living a simple debt-free life within one's income, whatever that income is.

    so i'd recommend him for people wanting to live debt-free rather than "get rich". i only wish his advice was common enough sense-- maybe in countries other than america.

  5. #5
    God/dess Deogol's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,493
    Thanks
    120
    Thanked 50 Times in 35 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Ramsey is the real deal.

    The scammer is Suze Orman who is paid by the people who bring you the FICO score. Hmmm. I wonder why she has so much advice about the FICO score. Hmmm.

    But seriously, Americans (and their government) are so clueless about finance anything is a bit better.

  6. #6
    Yekhefah
    Guest

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    BTW, I would also like to take the opportunity to point out that proper grammar helps a person look more intelligent, and often helps to make more money. "This helped my Wife & I" is grammatically incorrect; you wouldn't say, "This helped I with my debt problem." You would say, "This helped me." Also, "wife" is not a proper noun and doesn't need to be capitalized. So the thread title should be, "This helped my wife and me with our serious debt problem."

    Sorry for the thread jack, but usage of "I" in the predicate is a major pet peeve of mine.

  7. #7
    Veteran Member XxAmber89xX's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Calgary, AB
    Posts
    485
    Thanks
    43
    Thanked 72 Times in 40 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    ^^^English major?

    Wow, if you were to go through all of the threads here in SW to proofread I doubt you get through all the errors before you turned 99! j/k but, it really is a kind of moot point, no?

    btw- the best way to get out of debt is to pay it off. simple? not always.
    Oh Canada, we stand on cars and freeze...

  8. #8
    Yekhefah
    Guest

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Yeah, I know, that one thing just really irks me for some reason.

    Most people's advice for financial success is just, "Make more money." Dave Ramsey's is, "Don't get into debt in the first place." I have to say there's a lot to that policy.

  9. #9
    Member Mr.Beaver's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2008
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Hookd On Foniks Werkd 4 Me

  10. #10
    Featured Member vivianbear's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Southern CA
    Posts
    1,507
    Thanks
    555
    Thanked 2,238 Times in 572 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Does this guy have a podcast from his radio show or something? A link to that would be cool..
    "SS=stripper shit, in the same spectrum as CS=customer shit, which is within the spectrum of SaS=sales shit, which is all contained in the universe of BS=bullshit." -- Jay Zeno (mod)

    "Show me a hot chick and I'll show you someone who's tired of fucking her."






  11. #11
    Veteran Member XxAmber89xX's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Calgary, AB
    Posts
    485
    Thanks
    43
    Thanked 72 Times in 40 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by Yekhefah View Post
    Yeah, I know, that one thing just really irks me for some reason.
    No worries. Even though I'm not like that online, I am in real life conversations, etc.. I am always correcting people's grammar.

    I was voted most likely to become an English teacher for my h.s. graduation! they didn't know my alias... haha.

    Hey Beaver,

    can you summarize a few points of what helped you most from this site? it looks really good, but it is also very busy and heavily commecialized... some points put into this thread will do wonders to help some lurkers here that may have got themselves into debt trouble. just an idea.
    Oh Canada, we stand on cars and freeze...

  12. #12
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    4,704
    Thanks
    3
    Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    A friend of mine shoved this guy's book down my throat and I was unimpressed. But I did learn a few tricks that I used on Sunday. I called both of my credit card banks, and had my interest rates lowered and my credit limit raised. Small change, but maybe it will make a little difference. I wasn't looking for a miracle anyways.

  13. #13
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Your imagination
    Posts
    2,875
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 174 Times in 119 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by ahmeerah View Post
    I pirate download their (inc. Napolean Hill, etc) stuff for free. I refuse to buy stuff that's supposed to help me "Think and Grow Rich!"

    Now I'm adding Ramsey to my library.
    wow, how rude and entitled. just check it out from the library instead if you don't want to pay.

  14. #14
    AudreyLeigh
    Guest

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Dave Ramsey - live within your means, pay your bills, have 0 debt

    Pretty damn simple.

  15. #15
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Your imagination
    Posts
    2,875
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 174 Times in 119 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    that's why he rox0rs the sox0rs.

  16. #16
    Member Mr.Beaver's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2008
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    And dont get me wrong i dont agree with this guy 100% of the time. Its just that the stuff he teaches is so overlooked and forgotten that it makes the most sense out there.

    Main points

    1. Make a budget before the month begins even if it doesn't work perfect it will still be a great guideline for you.
    2. Act your wage. ( if you cannot pay for it , then you cant buy it)
    3. Save Save Save, once you are current with all of your bills and have a budget then you can start saving for your baby emergency fund. $1,000.
    4. For this realitive short time in your life you will need to become very intense in order to get out of debt. The goal is to be "uncommfortable" for a while throwing everything you can at this debt. Working extra shifts squeezing money from the budget. You will sleep better than you ever have in your life during this time, because you will be very tired at night.
    5. Do not make the mistake of going to extreme, do what works for you. Do not burn yourself out, you will regret it later.
    6. Knock out debts smallest to largest. This stuff is more emotional than you think. When you see start knocking off the first few or so its undescribable the feeling you get. Its like having a sumo wrestler off your chest and it starts building your confidence and momentum.
    7. If your broke friends are making fun of you, you are right on track.
    8. When you have no payments gas prices, car insurance, rent,going out with friends and a long list of other money stresses become less if not any.

    As for the website, it is loaded with free stuff. Also if you cannot afford to buy the book ( which I wouldn't, just get it for free from the library) or your library doesn't have it, you can call their offices in Tennessee and they will send one to your library. Or if you ever have a question about finances of any kind you can call 1-800-22-PEACE and they will answer it for you for FREE.

    Budget form-
    If any one wants the irregular income budget for let me know i have the pdf for them all. There are like 6 different budget forms for different types of income.

    Podcast-http://www.daveramsey.com/media/audio/podcast/podcast.xml

    hope this helps?

  17. #17
    Member Mr.Beaver's Avatar
    Joined
    May 2008
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    19
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    wow Yekhefah is gonna kill me for my grammer on that one! should have proof read lol

  18. #18
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Your imagination
    Posts
    2,875
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 174 Times in 119 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    the budget thing was super helpful by itself. not 'making a budget', but the 'account for every dollar you expect to make', which is not standard 'make a budget' talk.

    just having to plan where every single dollar goes helped massively and was worthwhile advice from his site (and totally free).

  19. #19
    Veteran Member MixedBabe88's Avatar
    Joined
    Dec 2007
    Location
    somewhere....
    Posts
    326
    Thanks
    1
    Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Quote Originally Posted by miabella View Post
    wow, how rude and entitled. just check it out from the library instead if you don't want to pay.
    Well she's not getting into debt by buying the book.


    And if you want to call almost every single person with internet access rude and entitled, so be it. Most people are pirates, Arg.

  20. #20
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Your imagination
    Posts
    2,875
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 174 Times in 119 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    well, most people who want their services/labor not to be stolen but who steal others' work product are rude and entitled. if that is most people on the internet, that is not surprising.

    checking out a book from the library is FREE, not 'going into debt'. it's also not theft.

    you can get stuff for free without stealing it is all.

  21. #21
    Veteran Member XxAmber89xX's Avatar
    Joined
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Calgary, AB
    Posts
    485
    Thanks
    43
    Thanked 72 Times in 40 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    speaking of debt, Ed McMahon and Evander Holyfield are losing their homes due to overwhelming debt!

    keep it under control, girls!
    Oh Canada, we stand on cars and freeze...

  22. #22
    God/dess
    Joined
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Your imagination
    Posts
    2,875
    Thanks
    19
    Thanked 174 Times in 119 Posts

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    i think orwell was right about the power of language. when it was called a 'second mortgage' fewer people did them than when it was rebranded as a 'Home Equity Line of Credit (HELOC)'. likewise with 'being leveraged' as a euphemism for 'being in debt up to my eyeballs but i can make the interest payments, so it's cool'.

    there are homeowners facing foreclosure who genuinely believed a HELOC was NOT a second mortgage. which is just..wow. what do you do when people can so easily be convinced to go into debt if it's just got a catchy enough name?

    for some, dave ramsey's no-debt approach is extreme, but you can have a high quality of life with no debt precisely because you aren't heavily leveraged and essentially forced into high-risk, high-return on what liquid capital you do have.

  23. #23
    Veteran Member sweetsam's Avatar
    Joined
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    493
    Thanks
    508
    Thanked 426 Times in 177 Posts
    My Mood
    Busy

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    I just discovered Dave Ramsey, so I thought I would bump up this thread. Wish I heard of him sooner, I just bought his book "Total Money Makeover."
    Looking forward to some solutions and a plan, but it's going to take me a while.




  24. #24
    Banned Melonie's Avatar
    Joined
    Jul 2002
    Location
    way south of the border
    Posts
    25,932
    Thanks
    612
    Thanked 10,563 Times in 4,646 Posts
    Blog Entries
    3
    My Mood
    Cynical

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    sharing an alternate school of thought ... from


    (snip) Perhaps when I said that “His advice on higher level personal finance topics such as investing and taxes is weak and often misinformed because his knowledge in those areas is limited” my readers thought I was exaggerating for effect. And perhaps when I criticized him for giving advice “on topics such as investing, about which he should probably just keep quiet” those readers didn’t really think I meant that his listeners would be better off if he didn’t cover those topics at all.

    Well, I really meant it. And for what it’s worth, let me share some of what I found on Ramsey’s website that led me to believe he has no business giving advice on several sub-areas of personal finance. All are from the “Ask Dave” section, wherein questions and answers from his radio show are summarized with an audio link. It’s a large database, but must still be only a tiny fraction of all the questions he has answered on his show. We can only assume that they are not a random sample and that Ramsey or his staff thoughtfully selected them as being some of his better work.

    I will cite ten examples that suggest that Ramsey has a poor command of his material. Several I have already discussed in previous posts. It did not take me long to find these. I stopped at ten because it was getting tedious.

    1. On Roth vs. Traditional: (This from my post on Step 4. Italics are his)

    Let’s say you’re 30 years old bringing home $40,000 a year. If you put 15% of that into retirement, that’s $6,000 a year – $500 a month. If you put $500 a month into good growth stock mutual funds that average 12% from 30-70 years old, then you would have almost $6 million. Over 40 years, you’ve put in $240,000 and your return is $6 million.

    If you do that in a 401K, that money is taxable. The money went in before taxes, but the money is taxable as it comes out. Your $240,000 that went in pre-tax is almost irrelevant in light of the $6 million that is going to be taxed.

    But if you put money in a Roth IRA, it grows tax-free. That means if you put the same amount into the Roth, you’ve got $6 million, none of which goes to Uncle Sam. The Roth IRA is always superior to the 401K because of this.

    That last italicized bit is unequivocally wrong. The tax savings you get from the up-front deductibility of traditional IRA (or 401k) contributions is exactly the same as the tax savings you get from the distributions of Roths not being taxed, assuming tax rates are constant. If the tax rate is higher now than in retirement, a traditional will save more money.

    2. Discussing FICO scores:

    The FICO score measures how much debt you currently have and how well you are paying it off. So if someone has no debt, there FICO score is “0″. A person could have millions in the bank and no debt at all, but have a FICO score of “0″.

    There’s no such thing as a FICO score of 0. The lowest possible score, reflecting the worst possible credit, is 300. If you pay off all your debt, you still get a score, probably a good one. If you are completely unknown to the credit reporting agencies, meaning that you have no credit lines, have not had any for many years, and do not have, for example, an AT&T cell phone account, you will have no score at all.

    3. Explaining mutual fund expense ratios:

    If it has a very low expense ratio, then it is a mutual fund that doesn’t sell very often.

    For example, you saw one expense ratio of 1.1 and that was probably an aggressive growth mutual fund. Those are sold all the time, so the expenses are higher. A growth and income mutual fund would have very low expenses because they are rarely sold.

    I’m not really sure what Ramsey is talking about here. Best I can figure, he thinks that the commissions paid by the fund to buy and sell stocks are included in the expense ratio. They aren’t. (And wouldn’t make much of a difference if they were.)

    Expense ratios are ultimately pretty arbitrary, based on what the fund company thinks the market will bear. If there is any general trend, it is that higher risk funds, which hopefully also have a higher potential return, also have higher fees.

    4. Doing Tax and Mortgage Math:

    [The caller’s aunt’s] CPA thinks that she’s better off borrowing money at 5% and investing it at 12%, but because the account is taxable, 12% ends up looking like 9.6%. The CPA will still say that she’s making 9.6%, which is still better than 5%, but he’s not thinking about the risk involved with investment.

    Except that because the 5% is tax deductible, it ends up looking like 4%. Ramsey messes these calculations up repeatedly (for example, here and see my post on Step 6) and to a remarkable extent for a guy who once made his living as a real estate developer. His conclusion, that you should pay off the mortgage rather than invest in stocks, may be sound for some people, but he never seems to be able to set up the comparison properly on an apples-to-apples basis.

    5. Apparently discussing an investment in an S&P 500 index fund:

    I recommend mutual funds because they always beat the SNP. You can own several funds that beat the SNP whether in an up-market or a down-market. It’s alright to own some SNP, but none of your retirement savings should be in that. If you do a little bit of looking you can find tax-protected Roth IRAs and 401-Ks that give much better returns than the SNP.

    For example, take a mutual fund with a 25-year track record. Over the course of those 25 years if you can see that the mutual fund almost always beats the SNP, then that mutual fund contains stocks that are winning more than the overall market is winning.

    Assuming that “SNP” is S&P 500, mutual funds don’t always beat it, in fact on average pretty regularly lag it. IRAs and 401ks are not investment alternatives to the S&P but accounts which can hold such things as mutual funds.

    6. On the income tax effects of getting married:

    The Marriage Penalty Tax was a fluke in the tax tables and has been corrected. There should be very little difference in the taxes you pay once you get married.

    A clever observer will note the existence of the “Married Filing Separately” tax schedule, as distinct from the “Single” one. Two people making $75,000 each who get married will find that they have moved from the 25% to 28% bracket. They will also find that there are many nooks and crannies in the tax code that may increase their burden now that they are married, including, for example, a smaller addition to the standard deduction if they are over 65 and the phaseout of personal exemptions at a lower income level.

    For the record, I don’t think the tax code is anti-marriage, but I wish it were simpler. And the marriage penalty was/is not a fluke, but a fully intentional tax policy.

    7. When asked to explain what a hedge fund is:

    QUESTION: Tyson wants to know what a hedge fund is, and what it is for, and how it plays into the current economic situation, in this call from September 24, 2008.

    ANSWER: The term hedge fund comes from hedging your bets or hedging risk. You do that by doing the opposite of what the market is doing, or some extra risk. An example is extremely high risk mutual funds. You can’t participate unless you are very rich, because you could lose. It’s so high risk that the government wouldn’t allow an old lady to put her life savings into it.

    They were the first people who were bundling together the subprime loans together and selling them as a bond. They can then sell it as a bond rather than individual mortgages. When you take many of these and put them together, that’s when it starts affecting the economy. They are the Petri dish from which this whole mess came from.

    That’s the entire text of the Q&A as transcribed on Ramsey’s site. I conclude from this that Ramsey does not, in fact, know what a hedge fund is. (I am also left wondering why this particular question was put on his website.) The first sentence of his answer implies hedging reduces risk and in the second that it increases it. Hedge funds were not the first people to bundle sub-prime mortgages into bonds. A firm that creates and sells bonds is called an investment bank.

    Hedge funds are like mutual funds in that they are pools of jointly owned assets, but are unregulated and typically have much higher fees, presumably to compensate for superior investment performance. One the requirements to escape regulation is that they can only take a limited number of investors and those investors must be either wealthy individuals or corporations. Although the word hedge does suggest reducing risk by going short, and some hedge funds do this, many do not.

    8. Speaking to a retired widow whose broker has suggested certificates of deposit:

    Certificate of deposits are not a secure investment. They average about 4% and that’s also the inflation rate. By the time you pay taxes, you’ll lose money. Get away from your broker if they are giving you information like this. Invest in good growth stock mutual funds that average about 12 percent.

    CDs are generally FDIC insured and therefore as guaranteed as any investment could be. So secure that they are often said to be appropriate for widows and orphans.

    9. When asked where a new retiree can get the best yield:

    QUESTION: Nigel says his father just received his retirement in a lump sum of $90,000. Where should he invest that to get the highest yield?

    ANSWER: The best place to invest is in good growth stock mutual funds – growth, growth and income, aggressive growth, and international – if you’re going to leave your money alone for at least the next five years. He’s not going to make a ton of money off of that investment in one year though.

    Yield refers to income (e.g. dividends) rather than total return. Growth stocks do not typically have much in the way of yield. “Growth and income” and “international” are not examples of growth stock fund types. Investing the entire sum in equities, never mind only growth equities, would be very risky for a retiree. Even with a five year horizon equities it would present too much risk for somebody expecting to live off the money in the near term.

    10. On an employee stock purchase plan:

    QUESTION: Jake works for a good company that has stock options. He has done a budget and is trying to get out of debt. He can take a little bit away and have $200 a month to put into the stock options. The company buys the stock once a quarter and buys it at 85% of its market value. Should he do that?

    ANSWER: All companies purchase at 85% of the value. It’s a bonus assuming the stock price is steady. In a year’s time, it has more than a 15% move up or down. I wouldn’t do it. Honestly, how much would you make off of it?

    This last one is poorly transcribed, so you really have to listen to the recording to understand what poor Jake is asking about. It is not, as he and Ramsey call it, a stock option plan but an employee stock purchase plan. The terms are such that Jake can set aside money over the course of a quarter to be used to buy his company’s stock at a 15% discount. He can then immediately sell that stock for its full market value.

    Ramsey is dismissive of this, saying that a) it is too risky and b) it is too little money to bother with. Both objections tell me that Ramsey wasn’t really listening to what the caller was saying and that he imagined for himself what the terms of the plan might be. ESPPs are strange and relatively rare beasts. I happen to have once worked for a company that had one very similar to Jake’s, so I know that the right advice is that he should max out the scheme and sell the stock immediately every quarter.

    I don’t expect the host of a radio call-in show to know that off the top of his head. I can even excuse not taking up air time to tease out of a nervous caller the necessary details. But authoritatively giving advice on a topic that is of monetary importance to your listeners as if you understood the details, when you don’t, is intolerable.

    And in this way this last item epitomizes the entire set. In no case does Ramsey give even the slightest hint that he is not intimately familiar with the subject at hand. And yet, in at least some of these cases, he must have known he was on thin ice. Why not say something like “I’m not really familiar with the details, but in general…” or “You know, that’s just the sort of question you should ask a qualified lawyer/accountant/broker/insurance agent.” Would that have been that damaging to his image? It sure would have improved the overall quality of his advice(snip)


    My only intended point here is that 'mass market' supposed financial experts such as Dave Ramsey, Suzy Orman etc. are NOT experts in any technical sense. What they actually are is media personalities. I happen to personally agree with one of Dave Ramsey's basic tenets though - that virtually all types of debt are bad.

  25. #25
    Featured Member LaurenAus's Avatar
    Joined
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,361
    Thanks
    4,892
    Thanked 1,926 Times in 738 Posts
    My Mood
    Cool

    Default Re: This helped my Wife & I with our serious debt problem.

    Hi Melonie, whose books and resources on financial advice would you recommend people read, thanks
    Quote Originally Posted by SweetJulia View Post
    everyone I've fucked who was awful in bed should be forced to have sex with each other so they can all, collectively, figure out why I never called them back.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aurora_Sunset View Post
    Nothing makes me feel like less of an adult than walking into several other people's apartments and realizing we all own the exact same lamp from K-mart.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sam38g View Post
    The fantasy sold to women through out history that a man will come along & rescue us is a lie.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 25
    Last Post: 08-12-2011, 03:05 AM
  2. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-09-2010, 01:05 AM
  3. My whoppingly huge debt/financial problem
    By AlexxaHex in forum Dollar Den
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 01-15-2007, 02:57 AM
  4. Such DEBT & it's making me depressed!!
    By Vyanka in forum Stripping (was Stripping General)
    Replies: 36
    Last Post: 08-21-2004, 03:09 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •